Why does everyone say Lindsey Buckingham IS Fleetwood Mac?
 

Why, oh why does everyone seem to think that Lindsey Buckingham IS Fleetwood Mac? I can't even go to amazon.com and read one stupid review without someone saying how he steals the show and he is the best.

Am I the only one who likes the women in this band more then Lindsey? I like Stevie so much better then Lindsey.... and I like Christine so much better then Lindsey. Not that he is not great, but I am so sick of everyone thinking that he is the best, or he is the star of fleetwood mac.

Does anyone want to debate this topic? Please, I am very bored!

"Why oh why does everyone seem to think Lindsey Buckingham IS Fleetwood Mac."

* Not everyone thinks Lindsey Buckingham IS Fleetwood Mac.

* Why, oh why? For the same reasons you prefer Stevie and Christine.

Stevie and Lindsey both have different strengths and weaknesses. I find it impossible to declare one ultimately "better" than the other (and I'm not just trying to be diplomatic!) No offense, but the truth is a topic like this goes nowhere and invites trouble. The reason is that there will always be those who love one or the other more and, as an unfortunate result, often use such an opportunity to build one up by cutting the other one down. I'm afraid you'll find that's what this thread will soon degenerate into (although I hope I'm wrong).

I am going to presume that people are talking about the recent tour for Say You Will. If you have been to a show or two or more, it is hard not to take note of the fact that Lindsey really does stand out considerably compared to Stevie. Stevie doesn't do a lot of fan interaction these days on stage while Lindsey...well Lindsey is out of his mind! I love Stevie to pieces and she certainly has her strong points to say the least, but Lindsey interacts constantly with the audience and is by far the craziest up there on the stage. He completely lets loose for all to see every night. If I am not mistaken, he mentioned something about how being able to hide behind his guitar and make a fool out of himself helps him to be more comfortable on stage. I am pretty sure he said that quite awhile ago, but something tells me it still holds true today. Also, since Chris isn't there, the show is most definitely more guitar-driven and Lindsey takes complete advantage of that. GYOW, ISA, and Come all have very strong guitar solos attached to them...especially Come and ISA. He also does some crazy lead stuff for a lot of other songs too. People say he steals the show because...well...at least this time around, he does seem to steal the show every night.

Just my .02

Tomara

Mick Defintely gives him a run for his money for sure. And especially on the Second leg so does Stevie. Actually as far as energy levels go I'd rate them: Mick, Lindsey, then Stevie RIGHT behind Lindsey. And John is just this great anchor leveling them all out.

LB
 

I think that Lindsey has been "unleashed" a bit on this tour. He's getting the press push because he's the most exciting element of the show. I've seen them twice on this tour, and Stevie was boring. Voice was great, her persona was blah. Lindsey is also the most talented member of the band, arguably. And to top it all off, he's a brilliant guitarist who is just now getting some of the recognition he's always deserved. Finally, a personal opinion here, but all the Mac albums without Lindsey haved sucked.

Oh mercy!!
 

This thread COULD stay civil and SHOULD stay civil...and I hope it does. OPINION, PEOPLE OPINION. :nod:

Some people (myself included) believe Lindsey IS FM because he does alot of stuff. He writes, sings, plays guitar, engineers, produces, etc. I think the fact Rumours is this huge phenomenon making Rumours-era FM a classic, huge band in music history and the fact Lindsey had a huge say in Rumours as to the sound, etc, he's looked at by his fans as being the IT of FM. I also believe he is the most talented member of FM because of the fact I stated above, all that he does. I'm not saying the others ARE NOT talented, they are. Also, the fact that the band let him do Tusk kinda says to ME that they were like "You are the leader, g'head."

Now, I'm not even including PRE-Rumours in this argument because first of all, it doesn't apply and secondly, I am a fan and VERY thankful to EVERYONE...Peter Green, Danny Kirwan, Jeremy Spencer, Bob Welch, etc. for keeping the dream alive as FM became the Fireflies FM which exploded.

*These are MY opinions, I'm not saying ANYONE that is or was in FM are not talented. I love em ALL for various reasons. This band NEVER ceases to amaze me with the amount of sheer talent, charisma, charm and strength they have. Everyone who's been part of its history should get the dang recognition they frickin deserve!!

I started this thread and asked this question. Yes, I have been to the Say You Will concert this year. Even though, obviously Lindsey is the most "show-offy" (not that that is a bad thing), I still say Stevie is just as important. She is subtle and classy and sings wonderully without having to get up there and be insane. I guess I just really love how she can be so wonderful without it seeming like she is trying to show off, does that make any sense?

Not to start anything, but I almost cringed when Mick did his drum solo. I also didn't find Lindsey's doggy style guitar playing that thrilling.

I just love how Stevie is so great and it is so easily acheived. She is not up there straining her voice or telling people "I can't hear you" like Mick, to the audience.

While she may not be bouncing off the walls at the concerts, she still shows class and talent, without making a fool out of herself. (And I am not saying any members of Fleetwood Mac do make a fool of themselves, I am just using that as an example)

Does anyone understand what I am trying to say? I know I am not making the most sense...

You make sense Chris
 

We all connect with these members differently. Some people love Lindsey's craziness, some love Stevie's whispy, mysterious persona, others like Christine's classiness, etc. It's different for all of us.

Personally, overall, I like male singers better than female, but I do like a few female singers.

There are most definitely lots of people who don't like Lindsey's pawing action and his over-the-top antics he's doin' this go-round, but hey, ya can't please everyone all the time. :shrug:

One more thing, in response to Lindsey going crazy and Stevie not having to go insane, back in the day, when Miss Stevie was in her altered state, she would be very wild onstage, sans any instrument excecpt a tambo, she would be indecipherable at times and kinda scary too. Of course, like I said, she was altered, but still, nonetheless, she was very crazy...i.e. Red Rocks. She was insane like he is today, only in a different way.

Today, she's off drugs and YAY to that, although, we get a more subdued Stevie, but would you rather have an unhealthy Stevie giving a wild, crazy show or a healthy, more subdued Stevie giving a good show? I pick the latter. I wish she still had that crazy fire in her, but I understand why she's not that way anymore.

I think Christy is right on the money with this one. Lindsey crafts the whole album in the end. He wears the most hats, and I believe he invests the most time. If Lindsey IS Fleetwood Mac, it's because he is the guy with the big vision. Stevie does her thing and does it well. I suspect she would never want the responsibility Lindsey takes on (Tusk anyone?).

As far as the concerts, Lindsey IS stealing the show. He's really performing, while Stevie isn't nearly so animated. I don't fault her for this. And I don't think any of this makes her "less important". Stevie is an important part of Fleetwood Mac. How could anyone say she's not? She has her thing and she does it like no other (although I've recently decided I think it's time for Stevie to hang up the witch clothes) and that is what makes Stevie great...her inherent Stevieness.

You obviously feel closer to Stevie, and no doubt Stevie is used to getting the biggest piece of cake, but we must make room for all of them...:)

I think the band is very much aware of the difficulties Stevie is having with menopause, and Lindsey is helping to compensate for that by being more interactive with the audience, etc.

I imagine Stevie is also happy to let him have his time in the spotlight, since Lindsey has been away from the public eye since 1997, and she has toured twice since then.

She's not taking a backseat to him on the current tour... she's just giving him room to move and shine.
And I think it says a lot about both of them, that they're able to play off each other this way, and to balance one another. They're not trying to show each other up anymore.

As for the question... "Is Lindsey Fleetwood Mac?"
The answer is, no.

Pretty much since the day she first set foot on stage with the band, people have also been saying that Stevie IS Fleetwood Mac, and that's not true either.

No one person is "Fleetwood Mac."
They each play very important and unique roles, and each is just as integral to the band's appeal as the others. :)

Since 1975, Stevie has been the STAR of the group. Now Lindsey's getting some credit. He deserves it, and, looking at Stevie's behaviour on stage and in interviews, she agrees on that one....

Well, I'll admit (and duck as I say this :laugh: ) I was never a big fan of Lindsey's...Stevie is what drew me to Fleetwood Mac and what keeps me interested...HOWEVER, I appreciate and respect what he does for this band...let's face it...look at how far Fleetwood Mac got WITHOUT him....nowhere!!!

There were what?? 2 Albums w/out Lindsey right....Behind The Mask (which did include Stevie...and her material IMO was less than stellar) and Time (which was w/out Stevie and Lindsey and does anybody even own it LOL)....Clearly Lindsey IS the creative force for Fleetwood Mac...without him...they are basically lost sheep IMO.

As far as this tour goes...I haven't had the privilege to see a show..(I haven't even had the privilege to see the outside world since I broke my leg...but that's another rant!! :D ) but Lindsey seems to be having THE TIME OF HIS LIFE...Imagine for how many years has he "played second fiddle" to Stevie and her whirling and twirling and powerful performances of old...this guy is FINALLY getting his own recognition as an integral part of Fleetwood Mac....Not to mention more stage time....and ya know what...He seems happier than I've ever seen him on stage....so in that respect...YES...this time around Lindsey Buckingham IS what is making Fleetwood Mac a top draw again...I commend him!!

Fleetwood Mac is like your hand....hold up your hand and take the thumb away...(say the thumb is Christine) you have four fingers still able to stand tall...now say Lindsey is the middle finger (or Stevie if you prefer)...fold the middle finger down...your ring finger while still standing....it's a little crooked...the ring finger being Stevie...can stand on her own but something ain't quite right....Clearly Mick and John are "pointer and pinky" 'cause really what else are they gonna do??

I know it's a stupid analogy, but i've only had one cup of coffee this morning:eek:

All in all it all boils down to personal opinion and preference....but we can all agree that ALL of them...TOGETHER...is what makes magic happen:nod:

Lindsey Buckingham is a tremendous guitarist, no doubt. His songs are far from being my favorites though. Songwriting is his (admittedly) weak department, and although he came up with some great stuff for Rumours the rest of the stuff he did with the Mac is hit or miss, especially with Tusk and Mirage. It's his strengths as an arranger, instrumentalist, and producer that I respect more than his songs.

As far as songs go, the stuff they did with Bob Welch can be spotty at times too but overall I like Bob's great songs better than Lindseys great songs. I'll take Silver Heels or Night Watch over Eyes Of The World or Go Your Own Way any day. There's good stuff in their entire catalog, Lindsey just happened to be one of the many other musicians that passed through the band. Although he deserves his due in certain areas when it comes to songs Christine, Bob, and Stevie are the ones that really deliver.

Ducking as i say this......

I think Stevie IS Fleetwood Mac. Regardless of Lindsey's on stage antics on this tour, let's face it, his solo albums have flopped. I know the albums without Lindsey didn't do that great, but people DID show up for the concerts (Tango/BTM/Best Of) with Billy Burnett and Rick Vito because they were coming to see STEVIE.

When Stevie did not tour and Bekka took her place (not that anyone can take Stevie's place) fans did not show up for that tour and sales for the Time album were horrible. Hmmm...

Fleetwood Mac concert without Lindsey = ticket sales
Fleetwood Mac concert without Stevie= Zilch

My opinion: I think if Fleetwood Mac had Lindsey but no Stevie, ticket and CD sales would flop.

Her solo albums sell, his flop. Fact.

Mac albums without Lindsey and WITH Stevie= bad sales
Mainstream pop rock albums by a recognizable star = good sales
Experimental works of art by a less out-there figure = bad sales

:)

I wouldn't go as far as to say that Lindsey IS Fleetwood Mac, but he invests the most time and effort and blood and sweat and tears into the albums. Without Lindsey, I doubt many of us would be fans of Fleetwood Mac. However, without Stevie, none of us would be fans either. It's not so much that everyone thinks Lindsey is the band, they just think that he's been given the fuzzy end of the lollipop when it comes to getting his dues. He perfected the FM sound that we all love and he is one of the best guitarists out there, IMO. I don't think anyone compares to him; he's genius. Also, out of all of the members, I think he is the most creative. Yeah, Stevie writes beautiful lyrics and melodies, but he does everything and everything very well. Everyone will jump down my throat if I say that he is the best producer for Stevie because he turns some of her rambling bullsh*t into GREAT songs, but I think it's true. Ever heard the pino demo for Gypsy? Lindsey worked wonders on that song. While the melody and tune was all Stevie, Lindsey turned it into something phenomenal. Just listen to the Bella Donna outtake of Gypsy and you'll understand.

So, while every member is integral and make up FM, I think Lindsey is the most creative and talented. That's not to say that Stevie and Chris aren't, they are immensely talented and I love Stevie especially, but Lindsey is an amazement.

And at the SYW concert, I don't think it's so much Stevie being classy and laying low. I think it was more of a case of her not feeling well enough to do all her spinning and schtick. If she felt well, she would've, which she is doing on the second leg. And I don't believe for a minute that she would willingly give up being the spotlight for Lindsey. Sorry, but that's too far-fetched; she adores being the star, she gave up everything to be the star and I don't think she'd give that up for anyone. But Lindsey is just so remarkable that you can't take your eyes off of him. :D

Well, after seeing the Philly show, it is no contest that Lindsey is my favourite Mac member... of this lineup ;).

Well, my favourite FM member is Christine McVie. That is because I just love her voice, and how she plays the piano. I will admit that Stevie's my favourite songwriter, but I like Chris's songwriting skills as well, probably because I write kind of like she does.

I used to think that Lindsey was egotistical and kind of self-important. *ducks* But that was only because of the interviews I read and I kind of got a bad impression of him. After seeing the Pittsburgh show and the Philly show I completely forgave him. lol. I do think that FM kind of needs him this time around, because A) He has SO much energy, and he interacts with the audience, and B) IMO, I don't think that some of Stevie's songs would have that perfect "sound", you know? This again is in my opinion, but I really don't like the sound of the Mac songs she does on solo concerts. Mainly because of the way the instrumental parts sound, same goes for the Christine solo concerts. I have both of their concert videos, I like them, but I just prefer the way the Mac songs soun WITH Lindsey, John and Mick.

Just my 2 cents :rolleyes:

If they didn't have him around, they'd be up ****s creek without any means of locomotion. :laugh:

you're probably right about the fact that more people show up to see Stevie than Lindsey. However, without Lindsey, Stevie is not at her best in Fleetwood Mac (see BTM and Time) so her performance/material suffers. Neither Stevie nor Lindsey ARE Fleetwood Mac, it takes both of them IMO. I'm really not interested in seeing Fleetwood Mac without both of them, they're a packaged deal, it's either both or none for me.

However, I WILL, and love to see Stevie a gazillion times solo and I don't really have a huge interest in seeing Lindsey solo, (notice I said huge, I have a moderate interest in his solo stuff). But those two together in Fleetwood Mac is just magic, I love Christine too but if one of the fabulous trio had to go I guess it would have to be her~sigh~...... I hate picking favorites~!

" . . . and we fight for the northern star" - which I have always interpreted as the spotlight :cool:

I think LB is great and very good a producing his and other peoples' usually already good if not great work. I do, however, think SN, CM, MF, and JM all had major input in that creative process so it was not all LB. In other words, SN and CM did not drop off the demos and then go one a six month vacation and then come back to record the vocals and vocie no opinion on the music. In the end, its all about balance and the sum of the group effort, which IMO is greater than the individuality of the parts.

This post was created for no other reason than to create the absurd, polarizing statements that are being written within this thread.

Fact is the band named for its drummer and bass player is currently fronted by its Female Lead Singer/Songwriter and its Male Guitarist/Lead Singer/Songwriter/Producer. Each of them offers important elements to the groups sophisticated musical mix and interpersonal dynamic.

Stevie is without a doubt more commerically successful, Lindsey has enjoyed great critical acclaim previously and on this tour. As has been said many times about this band, it is the sum total of all the parts added together that make them great not the indviduals themselves.

I think ppl who are saying lindsey is fleetwood mac, are referring to this tour imparticular. He is always great but he is over the top on this tour. he is getting the chance to make up for there being no piano and using the guitar every chance he gets, i dont blame him, thats what he does and he is being a little bit of an actor, or shall i say comedien, more playful, ie. the victory dance, the boxing. he seems happier and not so serious, which i love seeing him this way! Stevie as well has her moments on stage. But ppl seem to compare what she used to do on stage, with how she is performing today, and thats not fair. she puts on a great show, whether she's twirling or not! this time around lindsey tho is doing things on stage that hes never done , i dont mean his playing, i just mean he is being more playful, his guard is down. when i have seen this tour, i feel as tho i am at a buckingham nicks concert, Christine did help round out fleetwood mac and she is missed. but i am definately enjoying stevie and lindsey having more stage time, i love it.

only mick and john ARE fleetwood mac.:cool:

altho john and mick are very talented, without stevie and lindsey, there is no fleetwood mac!

I love lindsey to death, and i do think he is the most underated guitarist. i know that he is an asset to fleetwood mac, but you also have to admit ,if he didnt have fleetwood mac he wouldnt be able to be having the time of his life on stage and touring, dont get me wrong, i m sure he could go out of tour but i dont think it would be on the same level as with the mac, i think its sad that the record label wouldnt let lindsey put out this cd as a solo piece of work, but because its called fleetwood mac its ok, which i heard lindsey say himself in an interview.
i think today without stevie and lindsey there is no fleetwood mac. i think john and mick are lucky that stevie and lindsey are in such a good place with each other that they can pull off this incredible show. i think all members of fleetwood mac need each other. stevie has a solo career on her own, lindsey if he continues with material from out of the cradle and say you will, i think he can do a successful solo career, but with out both of them there is no fleetwood mac.

Because he is=:-)

I know I am exaggerating because I love Lindsey, but with the exception of the Peter Green incarnation, thay have never been so good as a band as when they have Lindsey, in my humble opinion. He makes 'em come alive, sparks them-I can't explain it, just know it's true.

ITA with all of this (though I would pay to see the Mac with just Stevie).
(Minor correction: I don't think you meant to put that Stevie was in the Time band or album.)

- JAKE

I have nothing against Lindsey, but I really don't find his Say You Will tour antics entertaining. The whole I'm gonna swing my guitar around and stomp my feet thing isn't believable on him. He isn't a member of KISS or Bon Jovi.

I, too, am not wild about his swinging the guitar during Come, ISA, and GYOW as it is the same "over the top" performance every night. Having said that, I would put up with just about anything to hear that man play his many guitars, many, many people like it, and, unlike my rabid-like fan nature, most people see it only once . . . :cool:

And then there is the whole druggie like possessed stomping during the "Stand Back" intro - but if people put up with La Nicks' craziness then . . . :laugh:

I don't mind the guitar swinging so much, but I do roll my eyes at the Stand Back guitar-humping and the doggie-paddling. I don't know why he thinks that's cool, especially the Stand Back stuff. I think he might think we gals find the SB humping sexy but far from it. Why would we like it when we know we're not necessary for that kind of "self-love"? lol! But everything else is fine with me. I love it when he lifts his guitar over his head and we see skin. ;)

As does he!

Re: You make sense Chris
 

I'm gonna plead the Fifth here. . . .

I'm a fan & I showed up back then to see & hear Christine &, of course, my fave rhythm section, beside whom other rock rhythm sections just seem to have no infectiousness. I had tired of Stevie's doughy, enervated shtick by then.

Her solo albums are greeted by the rock press & by other musicians thus: "How can someone so hip also be so incredibly stupid?" His solo albums are showered with praise & comparisons are drawn to Brian Wilson. Fact.

This whole thing is really silly. Stevie has strengths as a singer & performer & weaknesses as an arranger, producer & instrumentalist. Lindsey also has various strengths & weaknesses, as do Christine, John, Mick, Peter, Danny, Bob, etc. Fleetwood Mac was always about the group, not the individual star-czar. Peter saw that truth way back in the beginning.

You're right, I meant to write something else there and forgot to delete it all!

-Tracye

I think you are not reading enough articles/reviews. :laugh:

Although they may call her stuff a fairy tale, I do not remember any of Stevie's solo recording a being totally dissed in any major periodical and I cannot recall anyone calling her stupid. In fact, the TISL reviews were calling her an icon and a survivor in a tough music world. Also, the Timespace reviews from the major sources showered her with praise and some even said she was finally proving she was substantial within her fairy tale :laugh: Even Street Angel got okay reviews by Rolling Stone and other magazines. :cool:

obviously, you're a newer fan....David's right. I've been a fan since 1981 and back then (and even before that) she wasn't NOT getting praise all around as an icon. She definately was viewed as airy fairy and ditzy. It wasn't until the 90's that she was getting more of the praise. I think when she first started her solo career she was still considered relatively new and they type of persona she adopted was not really the norm so a lot of people didn't know what to do with her except roll their eyes and chuckle. When you're a little off center that's the kind of reaction you're going to get. The public has to have enough time to really adapt and then appreciate you. It also helps that she was in a legendary band like FM.

Re: Re: You make sense Chris
 

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

David...you kill me!!! hahahaha....cause you know i think i'm going to do the same!

Actually, I have been a fan since 1975 - so I remember the really bad reviews with FM in the early days :cool:

But, when Bella Donna came out, it got good and some great reviews. Yes, "they" (mostly men who had no clue what she was talking about and/or her delivery of it) were calling her music a fairy tale, but Rolling Stone and other main stream periodicals did not 100% slam her for Bella Donna. To wit - "Bella Donna proves that Fleetwood Mac's blond priestess of the occult can stand on her own as a solo act." See http://www.rollingstone.com/reviews/....asp?aid=49138 Granted the article slams her writing as airy fairy, but concludes it has a place in the world and it works - they gave it three stars out of five, which is a good review. In fact, that review is where the phrase "how can anyone so hip also be so incredibly silly," not "stupid," came from. Also, it is important to remember the times were changing about then from rock and roll being basically male dominated in every aspect (producer on down) to stronger women asserting themselves and demanding respect a la Pat Benatar which made the road easier for the women in rock today. All in all, I think that for as dizzy as Stevie's lyrics can be, the critics (again mostly male) were somewhat nice to her solo stuff and her longevity and popularity even in the 1989-94 years certainly proved her critics wrong as many of them have admitted.

My $0.02

Also, to be fair, Rolling Stone slammed her next three records and then Street Angel :laugh: Yet, even in the slamming, the reviewers always complimented her. It was all a little schizo to me. It was like they were saying "Well, if I don't slam her I am out of the boys club, but I will put enough in there so that I do not betray the fact that I really like her stuff even though it is not considered cool by my peers to do so" :laugh:

Actually, my favorite quote is from the Rolling Stone review of "The Other Side of the Mirror" - "Though she's a performer whose reputation is tightly entwined with her personality, Stevie Nicks is usually only as good as the collaborators with whom she chooses to make music" and then "Like her previous records, The Other Side of the Mirror shows Nicks can stand tall with the top rank of contemporary rockers, but she's not nearly consistent enough to sustain a whole album."

Interestingly, Stevie has pretty much always admitted she is only as good as her producers.

You know what they say...
 

Hindsight is 20/20...in regards to Stevie's solo albums. Belladonna may have been looked at as airy fairy, but today, it's a classic album, IMO. It's her best and my fave. :)

Look at everyone's take on Tusk...back then, it was "You screwed up, Lindsey." Today, it's "WOW, that album frickin rocks. Good job, Lindsey."

To the original question: Because he is.