The Dance tour, Thrown Down, and Fall From Grace...
 

Seeing as how both of these songs were written during the Dance tour, it's really interesting when you listen to them together. Play Thrown Down and then Fall From Grace; it's VERY interesting:

"He fell for her again
She watched it happen
Every day, day by day
But more important, night by night
She's watched it all come in to play
He held her hand
She listened to what he had to say

THEN

You say your sorry
Now you should walk away
But it's so overwhelming you have nothing left to say
You can sit outside his door and wait
Well, you can dedicate your pain to him"

Quickly follow it with FFG:

"I choose to be his confidant
And to keep him from the fire
I choose to be quietly discreet
If that is his desire
I touch with gossamer wings to be quiet around him
There is so much going on
You could easily wake up with a stranger
It's not something that you plan...

....not all the kings horses
Not all the kings men could put it back together

And now alone in my room as it all begins again
Was I so wrong why am I always so intense
In this same place I sit
The same place as before
Well, I came all the way here just to watch you walk out that door

I didn't ask when you shook your head
I always accepted what you said as the truth
And the truth only
It's not enough that you depend on me
And it's not enough that you say you love me
It's not enough to just save face"

Anyone else thinking what I'm thinking? ;) :eek: :distress: :nod: :D

Well, the demo of Fall From Grace has some of those lyrics in different places which I think alters the meaning somewhat.

In any event, I think the line "its not enough that you 'SAY that you love me" is an oblique but nice slam on Chris for leaving. I base this on my sense that when she sings "Say You Love that you Love ME" it reminds me of the way she sings on the song by that title. Also, the line "Well, I came all the way here just to watch you walk out that door" and "its not enough that you depend on me" could also very much apply to Chris.

These are just my thoughts, albeit unsubstantiated. I would LOVE to know the story there though!!!!

You know, I thought the same thing as you; that it might be about Chris. But then I figured that the song was just too intense and angry to be about her, y'know? I think it's Lindsey.

Unless it's about one of her Yorkies and we're both wrong. :laugh:

I thought the "SAY YOU LOVE ME" line from "Fall From Grace" was play on the song "Say You Love Me," meant as a "slap" at Lindsey, thinking about all the times they had to sing backing vocals on Chris's song. I didn't think she was singing about Chris directly... I'm saying Lindsey.

Jen: I totally agree, on burnish i saw recently that she wrote Fall From Grace on the Dance Tour in her hotel room [in Nash?], and she has said that basically it's about touring and being on stage with FM, because "that would always be about [her] and Lindsey" but we all know there's more to that story ;) I love that song~

oh and Thrown Down is definitely about Lindsey and how things were between them in 1997, she's admitted that.

oh the DRAMA!!! to be a fly on the wall during that tour~ :lol:

Yeah Meredith! :wavey: (there's no cheer smiley, so this will have to do)

She's definitely being sarcastic with the phrase "it's not enough that you SAY YOU LOVE ME!"

I would like to be a fly with the ability to be many places at once...Lindsey's house, Stevie's house, etc. ;)

Or I could have been an insider, like Judy Wong, had I been born 40 years earlier! :distress:

I think it's obvious Thrown Down is about Lindsey. But I didn't know she admitted it. Where did you get that from, please? I'd like to read that article!:nod:

Maria

At http://www.nicksfix.com/stevies_journal.htm - from the Nicksfix (kudos to John!!!!) in the September 23, 2001 entry, Stevie mentions this.

Hmmm, very interesting! I love her journals--she really is talking to US :nod:

The line from FFG where Stevie sings "you wouldn't do this for very long, the applause from it all was so defining" - I think this is about Christine, and how she only toured for a fe months for the Dance when everybody else wanted to keep going.

-Evan

Hmmmmm...interesting...makes me wonder if Christine is the "high preistess...keeper of the peace in this..." could make sense...:shrug:

I think Stevie is referring to herself as the "high priestess," the "keeper of the peace in this." She's mentioned a couple times, most memorable to me in the Behind the Music, that "[she] tried to keep the peace." Plus, she refers to herself a lot as a princess, priestess, etc.

I think the "this for very long" thing could also be about Stevie and how she repeatedly said in interviews in the late 70's and early 80's that she did not plan to be doing this in her 40's or that it could be taken away due to lack of popularity. But, they both seem to fit.

I choose to be his confidant
And to keep him from the fire
I choose to be quietly discreet
If that is his desire
I touch with gossamer wings
To be quiet around you
There is so much going on
You could easily
Wake up with a stranger

It's not something that you plan
One night in a world of pain
And you finally understand
Not all the king's horses, not all the king's men
Could put it back together

You say you wouldn't do this for very long
The applause from it all is so defining
Well it bounces off the wall at you
When the miracle is happening
High priestess...she's the keeper of the peace in this
Twice as much, intensified
What people will do
To get...this...high

It's not something that you plan
One night in a world of pain
And you finally understand
Not all the king's horses, not all the king's men
Could put it back together

And now alone in my room
As it all begins again
Was I so wrong
Why am I always so intense?
In this same place I sit
The same place as before
Well I came all the way here
Just to watch you walk out that door

I didn't ask when you shook your head
I always accepted what you said
As the truth and the truth only
Well, it's not enough that you depend on me
And it's not enough that you say you love me
It's not enough to just save face
Because sometimes
You just fall from grace

Sometimes
You just fall from grace

Maybe I am calmer now
Maybe things are fine
Maybe I made the whole thing up
Maybe it isn't a lie
Maybe the reason I say these things
Is to bring you back alive
Maybe I fought this long and this hard
Just to make sure you survive
Just to make sure you survive

You say you wouldn't do this for very long
The applause from it all is so defining. The song, hands down, is about Lindsey. He was apprehensive about joining Fleetwood Mac again and Stevie had to call him and hear it from him in order to believe that it was going to happen. They reunited, the fans loved it, they applauded...that was a defining moment for him...he knew he should be there...he knew it's where he belonged.

Now, I have pleanty of other interpretations of the song but since this is THE LEDGE and we don't discuss it, i'll just grab my cotton ball and quietly sit back down :rolleyes: :D

Hey Maria :wavey:

Here ya go~ I got this from the Stevie Nicks Underground.

[On the line 'You're not like other people/You do what you want to do']:

'That line sums Lindsey [Buckingham] up,' says [Stevie] Nicks with a laugh. ''But he loves it. He loves the fact that I write about him. It makes him happy.''
~The Boston Globe, 4-18-03

"'Thrown Down' is about Lindsey [Buckingham] ," [Stevie] Nicks admits, "but I wrote that around the time of the Dance tour in 1997. Let's just say he continues to be a well of inspiration, which is terrific."
~The Independent, 4-18-03


xx Meredith

Marissa...I don't get it. Why don't we discuss "it"? I haven't been around here long enough...:confused:

Cause, if you discuss it too much, you get flamed. :D

Love the quotes, btw. Thanks, Meredith. Wonder what the "'let's just say' he continues to be a well...." means? ;) :D Let's just say...what, Stevie?

But yeah, TD and FFG are definitely about the same story...and they're definitely about Lindsey, IMO.

~Angela~

Jen, let's just say it's as taboo as going to an AA meeting and taking a swig of Jack Daniels in front of everyone....lol...

Much like Stevie's "walls;" when someone discusses that particular topic, these boards and flamin'.... :laugh:

Marissa, all i gotta say is :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

go on save yourself, leave the key here.... :nod: :laugh:


xx Meredith

I think I get what "it" is...crap, now I can't lead my discussion of "Goodbye Baby" because if I'm thinking what you are referring to...I could get MYSELF in a lot of trouble...

DAMMIT :distress:

Marissa, I love your AA meeting analogy, because that is SO true!
haha!!
Yep......

There's a big, fat, pink elephant sitting in the middle of the room.


But everybody ignores it.
Shhhhhh...... don't talk about it!


Bit it's still there whether you ignore it or not.
-Sharon

"She spends every day...waiting for the day...when EVERYBODY FINDS OUT!!!!! Don't you know...don't you KNOOOOOOW!!!!!!"

Wednesday's reference to "Goodbye Baby" had me concerned that she's misconstruing the "it". The "it" in this case (I'm pretty sure) is that Stevie and Lindsey continue to be, or at least were recently, involved romantically.

Please correct me if I'm wrong...because God knows there's another "it" in "Goodbye Baby" that people are hesitant to talk about.

Just trying to help. :wavey:

Oh, and I'll have some comments on FFG later...gotta wait 'til I get home

Thanks Sugar! I got some PM's--one said the "it" might be Kristen, another said "it" might be the matter of whether or not SN/LB were involved recently...

What I thought it was, no one referred to...and I was told by a higher power that the way I handled it in my lyric interpretation was fine.

I think the "it" you are talking about (the one that people are hesitant to talk about) is the one I'm talking about!!! LOL

It's all a crazy circle...
:D

There's just so much drama it's easy to get confused! :laugh:

Back to FFG...
 

If it is about Lindsey, I'm thinking that Stevie felt a bit duped by all the emotion he was showing on The Dance.

"There is so much going on/You could easily/Wake up with a stranger"

She thought something was going on, but Lindsey basically said it wasn't what she thought...leading nicely into...

"You say you wouldn't do this for very long
The applause from it all is so defining
Well it bounces off the wall at you
When the miracle is happening
High priestess...she's the keeper of the peace in this
Twice as much, intensified
What people will do
To get...this...high"

Sounds like he was playing up the whole "Silver Springs" thing
while on stage for the crowd, that the moment was too much for him to resist, and she believed it, but to him it was a show.

"And now alone in my room
As it all begins again
Was I so wrong
Why am I always so intense?
In this same place I sit
The same place as before
Well I came all the way here
Just to watch you walk out that door"

She can't believe it was all nothing; she took the effort to reinvest herself in him and she ended up "in the same place as before" watching him "walk out that door".

"I didn't ask when you shook your head
I always accepted what you said
As the truth and the truth only"

Again, he was acting the part, and she bought it...

"Well, it's not enough that you depend on me
And it's not enough that you say you love me
It's not enough to just save face"

...somebody wasn't following through on his words...

"Maybe I am calmer now
Maybe things are fine
Maybe I made the whole thing up
Maybe it isn't a lie"

...after she got the "Look, Stevie, things are never gonna be the same" speech. Maybe it was all in her head, but she doesn't really think so...

This post is much too long...but this is what I'm getting out of it...

Just one reporter's opinion...

I like your take on things Sugar!

Possibly this is why she is holding back right now?

She's determined not to get duped again?

That makes LB look like a total ass.

I hope it's not really that way, I mean....... I hope he wouldn't be that cruel to her.

That's sorta mean, don'tcha think?

-Sharon

Nice job Sugar! I also like your way of thinking!

If this is so...
 

It would explain a lot of her behavior as of late (i.e. holding back)!

I really can't imagine Lindsey doing any of this at this point to be cruel or to intentionally dupe her. I'm guessing that he really was wrapped up in the moment, but for him it only was the moment...and when the moment was over it was over. But not for her.

Or maybe he thought they were on the same page. Tapping into those old feelings for the drama (and I'm sure it was really enjoyable for both of them) but then getting back to "real life" afterwards. Like two actors doing a love scene in a play, and one of them falls for the other. The one who's not in love probably isn't thinking that the other one is vulnerable. It's just a show afterall, right?

Or maybe it really did go a little too far, and Lindsey woke up one morning like "Whoa! I can't do this again!" Maybe she got all "Stevie" on him one night ("One night in a world of pain/ and you finally understand"?) and knew in that moment that "not all the king's horses and all the kings men could put it back together". And in that moment he blamed it on "Silver Springs" like moments on stage...I REALLY think there's some aspect of the concerts in here ("What people will do to get this high"). Didn't she once say this song was about touring with FM?

Regardless, I can't imagine it was about cruelty or even disregard. Just emotional misunderstanding.

And hey, thanks! Glad you liked my interp! :wavey:

Good job again, Sugar!

And yeah, she did say that FFG was about being in FM.

I think whatever happened (if something did happen) was all a big misunderstanding...Blame it on misreading of signs and signals, which happens to ALL of us. Boy, I can most definitely identify with Stevie there! While she can laugh at the silly things he does on stage, I'm sure that it hurts because it's like "you want to play around but you don't love me like THAT anymore"--kinda how she described how Lindsey felt about Stevie's treatment of him during Rumours--"you don't love me or want to be my girlfriend or my wife, but you want me to work on your songs that are about us breaking up? Is there anything else you'd like, you know, in my spare time?" (Paraphrasing, but it was in the RS article when the Dance was beginning).

Maybe I'm Crazy But...
 

what about "Thrown Down?" Judging from the lyrics to that song it seems to me that it was Lindsey who got that speech not Stevie. He seemed to be pursing her and TD was her way of letting him down easy.

Re: Maybe I'm Crazy But...
 

I do agree that it seems from TD that Lindsey was the one doing the pursuing, but I don't think in the song she is "letting him down easy," it just seems she is describing everything that happened at that time. Perhaps I am interpreting it incorrectly?

"I've shaken your faith in me."
"No, you've shaken my faith in everything else."

Who said what line? Anyone have any guesses? I really have no clue. :laugh:

xx Meredith

First off, far be it from me to say that I know Stevie enough to be able to put all of her songs into some logical, linear timeline...:laugh: (Did I just put "logical" and "Stevie" in the same sentence? :eek: )

But, if my read on FFG is accurate, maybe TD was put down while she thought he was pursuing her and maybe SHE was having doubts! I know I was once in a relationship where I had doubts about the guy and I wasn't sure if it could work out...and then he broke it off with ME! I was livid as well as heartbroken.

Of course putting it all in this light makes the lyric, "You say you're sorry/ now you should walk away/ but it's so overwhelming/ you have nothing left to say" quite interesting!

Actually (and I'm forming this as I'm typing this) I always wondered about "You can sit outside his door and wait/ well you can dedicate your pain to him". If the song is about him chasing her, why is it HER pain outside HIS door? MAYBE this song is her reflecting on this whole thing (after the anger of FFG) saying to herself, "Stevie, what were you thinking?"

The "He fell for her" bit and the "barricade" bits were real enough at the time (and she thought SHE held the cards), but it isn't how it was. Am I making sense? :laugh:

Then there's the new lyrics, the ones NOT written during The Dance: they've shaken their faith in each other (too many harsh words no doubt), and now he's going home. "Faith is a hard thing to hold on to/ something inside you says I don't have to...you do what you want to"...oh yeah, that's about Lindsey all right, but it's got nothing to do with his music!

ONCE AGAIN I've gone on too long. And of course this is all just interpretation and I can't prove a lick of it, but one thing I'm sure we can all agree on is that there are no doubt a million little pieces of SnL's long relationship that have affected the course of their relationship that we may never know about! :nod:

Re: Re: Maybe I'm Crazy But...
 

To me this is Stevie, "Oh sure, you can't come back to me because of how I am, but your misleading me makes me doubt how I perceive everything BUT me! I KNOW what I'm feeling".

Or maybe the first line is him and the second is her, with essentially the same result...

Ah hell...I don't know!:laugh: