Say you will

[sue]

My late husband used to say..” I’m having a Bob morning”…meaning the whole day would be nothing but Dylan.

Well I had a Mac morning today..and played The White album, Tango in the night and Say you will.
Now I like Say you will …always have..but it’s just grown and grown on me.
In fact it’s right up there with Rumours for me…

I like most tracks on Say you will, there’s only maybe two I’m not keen on.
And some tracks are very good.

I honestly don’t understand why people don’t like it.
What is the problem with Say you will ??
Why is it people don’t like it ??

[HomerMcvie]

No Christine=no Fleetwood Mac.

(It's too dark without her)

[sue]

No Christine=no Fleetwood Mac.

(It's too dark without her)

I agree it is dark, without Christine .without her light melodies and hooks …..but over the years I’ve accepted that.

It is what it is.
It took me ages to get over this isn’t really Fleetwood Mac.

(It was the same for me when Peter left…they just weren’t the same …until
Lindsey and Stevie ..)

[Macfan4life]

This is the only message board about a band where people hate the music from the band:lol:
Of course Say You Will is missing Christine. But that was not an option and an unfair criticism. Its like hating Rumours because Bob Weston did not play on it.
Say You Will is very Tusk like in its approach. Its insanely creative with songs like Illume and Come. Everyone hates them but seem to love The Ledge or I Know I'm Not Wrong. Stevie's songs kick ass on the album. I always find it odd that Say You Will suffers the same criticism as Tusk. Its too long, its too dark, its too cold, its not commercial enough and the band blamed Lindsey after both releases. But who cares if you dont like it. What I wish people acknowledge is Fleetwood Mac never played music like this before. Its packed with guitar, thumping bass, banging drums and insane grooves and melodies. Strip all the singing and its an insanely musical album. Everybody Finds Out is a masterpiece.

[sue]

This is the only message board about a band where people hate the music from the band:lol:
Of course Say You Will is missing Christine. But that was not an option and an unfair criticism. Its like hating Rumours because Bob Weston did not play on it.
Say You Will is very Tusk like in its approach. Its insanely creative with songs like Illume and Come. Everyone hates them but seem to love The Ledge or I Know I'm Not Wrong. Stevie's songs kick ass on the album. I always find it odd that Say You Will suffers the same criticism as Tusk. Its too long, its too dark, its too cold, its not commercial enough and the band blamed Lindsey after both releases. But who cares if you dont like it. What I wish people acknowledge is Fleetwood Mac never played music like this before. Its packed with guitar, thumping bass, banging drums and insane grooves and melodies. Strip all the singing and its an insanely musical album. Everybody Finds Out is a masterpiece.

I bought it in a Charity shop so the cd cost me a couple of pounds and to begin with I didn’t like it, only a couple of the more commercial tracks I liked…
But there was something about it and I persevered…..it took me a good two years to appreciate it.
Yes it is a bit Tusk like, and both writers give up some great songs.
Some really artistic material, and deep too.
Especially as you say, Stevie.

I actually consider it the last Mac Album….
Not Buckingham Mcvie….(which is nowhere near as good..gonna get slated for that)

[HomerMcvie]

My deluxe version was GIVEN to me by my cousin's roommate. She bought it and HATED it.

[WalkAThinLine.]

My late husband used to say..” I’m having a Bob morning”…meaning the whole day would be nothing but Dylan.

Well I had a Mac morning today..and played The White album, Tango in the night and Say you will.
Now I like Say you will …always have..but it’s just grown and grown on me.
In fact it’s right up there with Rumours for me…

I like most tracks on Say you will, there’s only maybe two I’m not keen on.
And some tracks are very good.

I honestly don’t understand why people don’t like it.
What is the problem with Say you will ??
Why is it people don’t like it ??

Similar to Tusk, there's not a great deal of integration between Stevie's and Lindsey's work. The absence of Christine could have delivered a closer writing partnership between Lindsey and Stevie that was more akin to the Buckingham Nicks, but this did not occur. Most of Lindsey's songs were mostly complete by the time Stevie came in, and her vocals were tacked onto his songs near the end of production as demonstrated in the Destiny Rules documentary. It's as if she was an afterthought to his songs.

In terms of the songs themselves, I find them to be generally very good. Stevie's songs on this album are incredibly diverse and are in my opinion her best set of compositions since the Tusk album. "Illume", which I initially found to be excessively long and monotonous, is a rather unique song in that their catalog in that it's essentially built around a guitar riff, drum loop, and a single chord. There are lots of interesting layers that were carefully overdubbed, as is the case for several other songs on the album. Lindsey's batch of songs largely came from the 1990s, which was amongst his best creative periods as an artist. "Red Rover" builds upon his guitar-oriented composition approach with multi-tracked vocals and some unique percussion. Based on observations I've seen, even people who are lukewarm on Say You Will have praised the musicianship of John and Mick, who provide a very musical rhythm section on this album. I'm certainly pleased that they released this album, which was a far better note to end on than Time. I just wish that they continued in this direction for another Fleetwood Mac release, but we did get several solo releases soon after as a minor consolation. They could have easily done something in either the late 2000s or the 2010s though.

[Macfan4life]

I bought it in a Charity shop so the cd cost me a couple of pounds and to begin with I didn’t like it, only a couple of the more commercial tracks I liked…
But there was something about it and I persevered…..it took me a good two years to appreciate it.
Yes it is a bit Tusk like, and both writers give up some great songs.
Some really artistic material, and deep too.
Especially as you say, Stevie.

I actually consider it the last Mac Album….
Not Buckingham Mcvie….(which is nowhere near as good..gonna get slated for that)
It would have been killer if Christine took part in it. I sort of wish they recorded an album before The Dance tour. Those vintage band cash grab tours threw creativity out the window which I am sure Lindsey would agree. In the old days a hit album with singles could make a band rich. Touring ever since the late 90s yielded tons of cash and things were never the same. As long as the band toured every 2 years and played the hits no one wanted or cared for new music especially since radio would probably not play it. Its an extremely frustrating last decades for this band. But we did get Say You Will, In The Meantime and BuckVie.
Like you I was not wowed by SYW the first few weeks I had it. When I started to work out and run with it every night is when I started to love it. Listen to it with headphones and you really appreciate the music.

[Villavic]

Dark is a good definition. But I’m not sure why I don’t like the SYW album enough. My first thought was that it’s because it doesn't sound enough like Fleetwood Mac, and that’s why I usually don’t listen Murrow Turning over in His Grave, Illume, Miranda, and Come. I skip those songs. But in fact I do enjoy the others songs, though none is within my top list. I feel those songs I like aren’t Fleetwood Mac enough. It’s more like listening solo songs.

Of course Christine absence is one reason. But I fell something else is missing. Probably Richard Dashut’s touch, or Dashut+Caillat. Or because their voices, especially Lindsey's, are not the same as on previous studio albums. I like BuckVie more than SYW, so it would seem the main reason is obvious. But I think it’s the sum of everything I have mentioned.

[Macfan4life]

Dark is a good definition. But I’m not sure why I don’t like the SYW album enough. My first thought was that it’s because it doesn't sound enough like Fleetwood Mac, and that’s why I usually don’t listen Murrow Turning over in His Grave, Illume, Miranda, and Come. I skip those songs. But in fact I do enjoy the others songs, though none is within my top list. I feel those songs I like aren’t Fleetwood Mac enough. It’s more like listening solo songs.

Of course Christine absence is one reason. But I fell something else is missing. Probably Richard Dashut’s touch, or Dashut+Caillat. Or because their voices, especially Lindsey's, are not the same as on previous studio albums. I like BuckVie more than SYW, so it would seem the main reason is obvious. But I think it’s the sum of everything I have mentioned.
Its a catch 22. Without Chris they dont sound like Fleetwood Mac. If they tried to duplicate that sound people would have missed Chris even more. People said the same thing about Tusk including the band members. Most of Tusk did not sound like Fleetwood Mac and many times Lindsey is playing most of the instruments and even Chris disappears for 7 songs in a row or something.
There will was never going to be a Rumours 2 especially without Chris. I am thankful they did not go the adult contemporary and super pop just to sell albums and please people.
We all like different kinds of music. Thats wonderful. This board would be so boring if we all liked the same stuff. What makes me mental when discussing this album on this board over the years. I remember someone posted that they hated Illume because you cant sing along to it. Its a very solemn poem that Lindsey decided not to go the solemn route and did it very angry. Its not supposed to be a sing along song like Seven Wonders. Its like when some look at paintings of The Scream or Mona Lisa and say "I don't get it." Music is like painting as Lindsey often says. It can be art. Then people say the songs sound nothing like Fleetwood Mac while one of their favorite songs is Caroline which pretty much was lifted directly from a Lindsey solo album and sounds nothing like Fleetwood Mac. In fact very little of Tango sounds like Fleetwood Mac but that criticism is only given to SYW. Dear Lord, Come has too much guitar in it. But what about all the fake programmed stuff on Tango that had almost zero guitar.

[bwboy]

I honestly don’t understand why people don’t like it.
What is the problem with Say you will ??
Why is it people don’t like it ??

I’m glad you like it so much, Sue, and as a fan, I wanted to like it when it was released, but it just never really captured me. I feel the same way about Buck/Vie, too. I think because I was a fan of all three singer/songwriters, when one is missing, it throws the experience off for me. Just having Lindsey and Stevie or Christine and Lindsey, without a third voice in the mix, somehow loses my interest. I dislike Say You Will more than Buck/Vie, but I suppose that’s because there’s more material to dislike- 18 songs vs 10. The only songs I love on SYW are Peacekeeper, Thrown Down, Say You Will, What’s the World Coming To, and Goodbye Baby- the rest I can’t even listen to.

Out of curiosity, what were the two songs you mentioned you don’t care for?

[aleuzzi]

When I first bought SYW I hated it. There was something I found cold and impersonal about the production. By this time, Stevie’s voice more noticeably nasal and some of Buckingham’s songs seemed dry and self-important. But about a month after it was released, I loved it. Illume, Throw Down, Red Rover, Say Goodbye, and Everybody Fins Out were and are my favorites. But also the title track is pleasant and Miranda is cool.

It feels like a substantial album. Meaty. Muscular. John and Mick come off really well.

But…the middle section sags. Dull, dull, dull. Peacekeeper is not a convincing single and Silver Girl is yawn-inducing.

I remember reading an interview at the time where it was revealed that Christine would have worked on it had she been allowed. That pissed me off. I understand touring an album where her songs might turn out to be the highlights could prove difficult without her on stage. But still.

When ITM came out a year later, I found the bulk of it more FM than anything on SYW. I challenge anyone who doesn’t think Giving It Back isn’t a quintessentially FM song. It is, much like Trouble was for Lindsey in 1981.

[Street_Dreamer]

Interestingly, Christine didn't write that song. Billy Burnette and George Hawkins did.

I challenge anyone who doesn’t think Giving It Back isn’t a quintessentially FM song. It is, much like Trouble was for Lindsey in 1981.

[sue]

I’m glad you like it so much, Sue, and as a fan, I wanted to like it when it was released, but it just never really captured me. I feel the same way about Buck/Vie, too. I think because I was a fan of all three singer/songwriters, when one is missing, it throws the experience off for me. Just having Lindsey and Stevie or Christine and Lindsey, without a third voice in the mix, somehow loses my interest. I dislike Say You Will more than Buck/Vie, but I suppose that’s because there’s more material to dislike- 18 songs vs 10. The only songs I love on SYW are Peacekeeper, Thrown Down, Say You Will, What’s the World Coming To, and Goodbye Baby- the rest I can’t even listen to.

Out of curiosity, what were the two songs you mentioned you don’t care for?

The two I like the least are Come, never have liked that song.
And Everybody finds out…I don’t like Stevie’s voice on that one.

[aleuzzi]

Interestingly, Christine didn't write that song. Billy Burnette and George Hawkins did.

No, she wrote the song with them. On the album and elsewhere, she is listed first in the songwriting credits.

Since Mirage, Christine co-wrote many of her songs. But she still retained her style and invited others into her unique process.

[Villavic]

And Everybody finds out…I don’t like Stevie’s voice on that one.

I forgot that's another song I usually skip.

[cbBen]

I like the album, and especially like the production.

Crazy that Lindsey pushed so hard for MORE songs on the album, because the 18 on there is way too many as it is. In addition to being shorter, the album should have included "Wait For You" (I can hear where Stevie's vocal would go) and "Down On Rodeo," both of which would have been highlights.

In the title track and "Peacekeeper," they really chose safe and relatively weak songs with which to promote the album.

It would be nice to hear from Lindsey what additional songs he would have put on the album if it had beed the double-disc he wanted. That Stevie Nicks song on the deluxe edition is bad.

Had I been Mick ad the other band members, instead of arguing for a shorter album on the basis of sales and such, I would have taken on Lindsey on his home turf, so to speak. I would have said that, artistically, the album would be weaker as a 2-CD.

[WalkAThinLine.]

I like the album, and especially like the production.

Crazy that Lindsey pushed so hard for MORE songs on the album, because the 18 on there is way too many as it is. In addition to being shorter, the album should have included "Wait For You" (I can hear where Stevie's vocal would go) and "Down On Rodeo," both of which would have been highlights.

In the title track and "Peacekeeper," they really chose safe and relatively weak songs with which to promote the album.

It would be nice to hear from Lindsey what additional songs he would have put on the album if it had beed the double-disc he wanted. That Stevie Nicks song on the deluxe edition is bad.

Had I been Mick ad the other band members, instead of arguing for a shorter album on the basis of sales and such, I would have taken on Lindsey on his home turf, so to speak. I would have said that, artistically, the album would be weaker as a 2-CD.

I thought that "Peacekeeper" and the title track were fine singles. The only songs that would have been better selections in my opinion would have been "Steal Your Heart Away", "Thrown Down", and maybe "Bleed to Love Her".

In terms of scrapped songs, a bunch of the songs you mentioned were contenders. "Down on Rodeo", "Someone's Gotta Change Your Mind", "I Am Waiting", "Wait For You", "Right Place to Fade", and "Gift of Screws" were all holdovers from the 1990s that later appeared on Lindsey's solo albums, as was "Try For the Sun". Of Stevie's songs, "Not Make Believe" was in the running at some point. She submitted roughly 18 or 19 songs for the sessions initially and added four more to my understanding, so there were a lot of leftovers that failed to make the cut. They probably could have recorded another album if they wanted to with their surplus of material.

[Macfan4life]

I like the album, and especially like the production.

Crazy that Lindsey pushed so hard for MORE songs on the album, because the 18 on there is way too many as it is. In addition to being shorter, the album should have included "Wait For You" (I can hear where Stevie's vocal would go) and "Down On Rodeo," both of which would have been highlights.

In the title track and "Peacekeeper," they really chose safe and relatively weak songs with which to promote the album.

It would be nice to hear from Lindsey what additional songs he would have put on the album if it had beed the double-disc he wanted. That Stevie Nicks song on the deluxe edition is bad.

Had I been Mick ad the other band members, instead of arguing for a shorter album on the basis of sales and such, I would have taken on Lindsey on his home turf, so to speak. I would have said that, artistically, the album would be weaker as a 2-CD.
This is debated in the documentary. Stevie and Mick insisted on a basic 12 song album for fear people would be lost in the music (Tusk hangover). Lindsey wanted a huge album. I think he felt and knew how well the band was playing and they had some great songs. Stevie had some good new ones and a classic or two. No Welcome To the room Sara, When I see You again, Second Time, Affairs of the Heart on this album for sure. In the end my memory is that Mick caved to Lindsey and they worked out a compromise although Stevie was still upset about it. There is a premonition from Mick when he says, if the album only sells 500k copies Lindsey is going to be crushed. Well the album only sold 500k copies. I am in camp Lindsey. Who cares the album has extra songs. Like Tusk the album has a little bit of everything for everybody. While I think Peacekeeper is a decent song I think Thrown Down should have been the lead single. That's the record executive in me though. Everybody Finds Out is the best song on the album and should have been the first single.
I never could understand why people wanted to shorten the album just for commercial sake. Music is not about pop charts and sales. The artist wants to share all the colors sometimes. Like you I believe the album has the strongest production value since Rumours. The music is incredible. Its almost like they are playing extra hard and extra creative trying to make up for Chris's absence.

[Villavic]

The only songs that would have been better selections in my opinion would have been "Steal Your Heart Away", "Thrown Down", and maybe "Bleed to Love Her".


I agree. Actually I like Steal and Thrown more than the two singles. I love Bleed, but since it was already included in The Dance, I'm not sure if it would have been a good move.

I always understood the discussion about the double album was mainly commercial reasons. I think Stevie explained in that moment that people who bought Mac records were adults, parents, etc. with other priorities and would not spend on an expensive record. That's a good point, from a commercial point of view of course. Fans like us who priorize the music, buy the record anyway. But remember there is always a record company behind the releases. If Lindsey wanted to keep recording albums, I think releasing a single album was the best move. Unfortunately, they never released another one.

[jbrownsjr]

Interestingly, Christine didn't write that song. Billy Burnette and George Hawkins did.

She also wrote it. It's a co-write. And I'm so glad those two are on it. Honorary Christine McVie Band members.

[Ulpian]

I remember SYW’s release very well.

I knew I’d struggle with it. Christine was always the magnet that pulled me in to FM and without her I simply wasn’t keen.

I listened to it and all I could wonder was which tracks she was on. At the time I recall people speculating that she was on “Murrow” and clearly she played a part in the two tracks which predated, or were contemporaneous with, the Dance.

I didn’t love it. I still don’t. That said, I like several tracks on it. Beyond the “Christine ones”, “Destiny Rules” and “Thrown Down” are favourites, as is “Murrow”. I like “Goodbye Baby” and I don’t mind “Peacekeeper” or “Say You Will” at all.

To be blunt, I listen to “Sad Angel” and “Miss Fantasy” more than any SYW track thesedays. That, I suspect, makes me an outlier…

[FuzzyPlum]

Though I don’t love Say You Will, I do think it had a cool (and still) contemporary sound. As a barometer, I’ve always felt a tad embarrassed to play Tusk in public to non Mac fans. But Say You Will is edgy in a cooler way. I can imagine it playing as background music at some sort of artsy corporate event.

[DownOnRodeo]

Now I like Say you will …always have..but it’s just grown and grown on me.
In fact it’s right up there with Rumours for me…

I like most tracks on Say you will, there’s only maybe two I’m not keen on.
And some tracks are very good.

I honestly don’t understand why people don’t like it.
What is the problem with Say you will ??
Why is it people don’t like it ??

Me too, Sue.

On recent cross-country car-trip it was very late at night with spooky mists on the road. I felt in the mood for Tango so I played that album on my MP3 player. When that finished, the Say You Will album started playing. I thought "I'll just listen to the first song and leave it at that." But as each song played I wanted to hear them as well. I did stop halfway through just because it's such a long album and I'd already listened to Tango all the way through.

I do have issues with the album -- mainly that something with the mixing is very sharp and grating to my ears -- but it has lots of standout tracks and is always a blast of fresh raw creative air.

And the political theme is holding up so strongly 20 years later -- tracks like WTWCT, Murrow, Illume, Peacekeeper, Red Rover. They could have been written yesterday.

I would prefer that Lindsey's "Wait For You" and "Down On Rodeo" were on it instead of "Bleed To Love Her" and "Steal Your Heart Away." Or, even better, that it was a regular length album and they had released a couple more in the 2000s.

On my MP3 player I sub out the album versino of Peacekeeper for Lindsey's solo version, which I prefer. And I have separate compilations of "SYW - Stevie" and "SYW - Lindsey", comprising their respective songs. Those are a much more coherent listening experience than listening to the combined track list on the album. (And I believe Lindsey's original double album idea involved having one disc Lindsey material and one disc Stevie material, or am I making that up?)

[FuzzyPlum]

Me too, Sue.

On recent cross-country car-trip it was very late at night with spooky mists on the road. I felt in the mood for Tango so I played that album on my MP3 player. When that finished, the Say You Will album started playing. I thought "I'll just listen to the first song and leave it at that." But as each song played I wanted to hear them as well. I did stop halfway through just because it's such a long album and I'd already listened to Tango all the way through.

I do have issues with the album -- mainly that something with the mixing is very sharp and grating to my ears -- but it has lots of standout tracks and is always a blast of fresh raw creative air.

And the political theme is holding up so strongly 20 years later -- tracks like WTWCT, Murrow, Illume, Peacekeeper, Red Rover. They could have been written yesterday.

I would prefer that Lindsey's "Wait For You" and "Down On Rodeo" were on it instead of "Bleed To Love Her" and "Steal Your Heart Away." Or, even better, that it was a regular length album and they had released a couple more in the 2000s.

On my MP3 player I sub out the album versino of Peacekeeper for Lindsey's solo version, which I prefer. And I have separate compilations of "SYW - Stevie" and "SYW - Lindsey", comprising their respective songs. Those are a much more coherent listening experience than listening to the combined track list on the album. (And I believe Lindsey's original double album idea involved having one disc Lindsey material and one disc Stevie material, or am I making that up?)

Great post- food for thought.
I can’t remember my timelines- probably a bit later but I remember OutKast’s: the love below/speakerboxxx being a similar double album concept. That one was massive.
Alternatively, could they have done a ‘use your illusions’ I/II type of thing and release them separately?

[Tusky]

Do you guys see this as the start of final breaking point of the L&S relationship?

Watching DR - I see the what had always have bonded them (their musical compatibility) had gone. I don't think Stevie liked the album and never trusted him in the same way.

[cbBen]

Do you guys see this as the start of final breaking point of the L&S relationship?

Watching DR - I see the what had always have bonded them (their musical compatibility) had gone. I don't think Stevie liked the album and never trusted him in the same way.

Yes, but not just because of musical differences – though those are there (Lindsey more off-kilter, Stevie more conventional).

The failure of the prior two FM studio albums, perhaps among other things, causes Lindsey to miscalculate his value relative to Stevie's.

He seems to lack recognition that Stevie is the star. He talks and acts as though he is doing her (and the others) a favor, but in the case of Stevie it's the other way around.

At the time he could not get his music released without FM, which means without Stevie (see quote below where he comes to see as much). Stevie had just released a solo album so the same was not true in the other direction.

Also Lindsey uses so much emotional manipulation in pursuit of getting his way. I could easily see Stevie thinking, "Never again. I have no need to take a backseat position to this guy in the studio* (and when she became big enough for that to hold true on stage as well, she ended things there too). *(Note that when Lindsey next talks of FM making an album, he says it will be with an outside producer.)

And finally, they have different goals. He prioritizes art over money. The others including Stevie simply don't in the same way. (Note his and Stevie's respective output since music stopped selling.)

"I would be completely happy to continue with this, never to pursue anything solo again. Because it's a hell of a lot easier."–Lindsey Buckingham, after finally getting his music out via Say You Will: https://www.fleetwoodmac-uk.com/articles/FMart115.html

[jbrownsjr]

Do you guys see this as the start of final breaking point of the L&S relationship?

Watching DR - I see the what had always have bonded them (their musical compatibility) had gone. I don't think Stevie liked the album and never trusted him in the same way.

I agree with her, the album is all over the place with no cohesive thread of any kind. She didn't care for the production either. (It's her career, too)

You're right, B/N is a true collaboration where they had a romantic and musical bond. Even Twisted, I didn't see any of that bond. Quite the snooze, like most of SYW. Good songs, yes. Any real chemistry that's electric or compelling?, naw.

[cbBen]

I agree with her, the album is all over the place with no cohesive thread of any kind. She didn't care for the production either. (It's her career, too)

You're right, B/N is a true collaboration where they had a romantic and musical bond. Even Twisted, I didn't see any of that bond. Quite the snooze, like most of SYW. Good songs, yes. Any real chemistry that's electric or compelling?, naw.

They recorded a majority of her songs without her there (she was on tour) and, after the fact, she added her vocals. Perhaps the production would have been more to her liking had she been there to provide input during the recording of those songs.

As it happened she may have arrived, heard what Lindsey did with her songs, and thought "He made them weird."

[jbrownsjr]

They recorded a majority of her songs without her there (she was on tour) and, after the fact, she added her vocals. Perhaps the production would have been more to her liking had she been there to provide input during the recording of those songs.

As it happened she may have arrived, heard what Lindsey did with her songs, and thought "He made them weird."

And Miss Thing has always had problems with producers. Even the ones that she's chosen. :wavey:

[Tusky]

Yes, but not just because of musical differences – though those are there (Lindsey more off-kilter, Stevie more conventional).

The failure of the prior two FM studio albums, perhaps among other things, causes Lindsey to miscalculate his value relative to Stevie's.


You're right. There's definitely an emotional detachment from both of them after the Tusk era. I wonder if Stevie would have rather not make another album and just toured again after Christine left in '98.

[jbrownsjr]

You're right. There's definitely an emotional detachment from both of them after the Tusk era. I wonder if Stevie would have rather not make another album and just toured again after Christine left in '98.

I think that's what she wanted. Especially since they couldn't get her to come in again. (sans the EP). Which was basically almost nothing.