Hold Me from the Live album Deluxe Edition

[Wdm6789]

So if they have the Hold Me audio from the Los Angeles show from the Mirage tour, do they also have the audio of the other live songs that were not included in the Mirage Deluxe Edition? Do they have the video of the songs that were cut from the Mirage tour video thing? I feel like the complete Mirage tour video (and audio) is a highly coveted thing in the Fleetwood Mac fandom community. When the Deluxe Edition of Mirage was coming out, I was really hoping they were going to include the full live set from the Mirage tour, like they did on the Deluxe Tusk and Deluxe Rumours. Also, I was checking out the Live Deluxe Edition on iTunes, and Hold Me is one of the most downloaded songs from that album on iTunes.

[Macfan4life]

So if they have the Hold Me audio from the Los Angeles show from the Mirage tour, do they also have the audio of the other live songs that were not included in the Mirage Deluxe Edition? Do they have the video of the songs that were cut from the Mirage tour video thing? I feel like the complete Mirage tour video (and audio) is a highly coveted thing in the Fleetwood Mac fandom community. When the Deluxe Edition of Mirage was coming out, I was really hoping they were going to include the full live set from the Mirage tour, like they did on the Deluxe Tusk and Deluxe Rumours. Also, I was checking out the Live Deluxe Edition on iTunes, and Hold Me is one of the most downloaded songs from that album on iTunes.
You are preaching to the choir. No one here is going to disagree with you. This has been discussed here for years. We can only speculate. Hold Me was the biggest hit from Mirage yet was axed for the HBO concert. It also was not included in the extended VHS/laser disc show. Even when they released the Mirage deluxe live CD, it was missing.
Everyone's speculation could be different. Hold Me is a hard song to do live because its studio track has tough elements to pull off live. I think the band or someone thought they would be flamed for its different sound? They thought people would flame them for allegedly butchering it? It was not done on the Tango, BTM, Dance, OWTH tour either which tells you the band did not like the live sound.
That is only speculation because why else would a band ignore one of their biggest hits in concert? IMHO I thought Chris's solo band and the Buck/Vie versions in concert are really good.
Its a mystery to me.

[Wdm6789]

You are preaching to the choir. No one here is going to disagree with you. This has been discussed here for years. We can only speculate. Hold Me was the biggest hit from Mirage yet was axed for the HBO concert. It also was not included in the extended VHS/laser disc show. Even when they released the Mirage deluxe live CD, it was missing.
Everyone's speculation could be different. Hold Me is a hard song to do live because its studio track has tough elements to pull off live. I think the band or someone thought they would be flamed for its different sound? They thought people would flame them for allegedly butchering it? It was not done on the Tango, BTM, Dance, OWTH tour either which tells you the band did not like the live sound.
That is only speculation because why else would a band ignore one of their biggest hits in concert? IMHO I thought Chris's solo band and the Buck/Vie versions in concert are really good.
Its a mystery to me.

I thought Hold Me sounded good on all the tours they did it on. I was just not a fan of the added “yeaahhh” when they sang it on the Mirage tour. It was unnecessary. Hold me.. hold meeeeEEEE sounded much better. It sounded good on the Buckingham McVie tour and it sounded good on the 2018-2019 tour, but it’s a shame Lindsey was not there for that one. It’s also a shame Lindsey was not there for the Tango tour because they probably would have had Hold Me on the set for that tour if he was there.

[Macfan4life]

I thought Hold Me sounded good on all the tours they did it on. I was just not a fan of the added “yeaahhh” when they sang it on the Mirage tour. It was unnecessary. Hold me.. hold meeeeEEEE sounded much better. It sounded good on the Buckingham McVie tour and it sounded good on the 2018-2019 tour, but it’s a shame Lindsey was not there for that one. It’s also a shame Lindsey was not there for the Tango tour because they probably would have had Hold Me on the set for that tour if he was there.
I agree too. Although they used piped in pre-recorded vocals on the Buck/Vie tour. The "come on and" was pre-recorded or looked like from my seat. I did not see the 2018 tour so I cant comment. They only did it for a few days though, right?

[Wdm6789]

I agree too. Although they used piped in pre-recorded vocals on the Buck/Vie tour. The "come on and" was pre-recorded or looked like from my seat. I did not see the 2018 tour so I cant comment. They only did it for a few days though, right?

I also did not see them on the 2018-2019 tour, but I’m pretty sure they did Isn’t It Midnight for the first several shows and then replaced it with Hold Me for the rest of the tour.

[HomerMcvie]

I also did not see them on the 2018-2019 tour, but I’m pretty sure they did Isn’t It Midnight for the first several shows and then replaced it with Hold Me for the rest of the tour.

I was front row for show #2(Nashville), and they did Hold Me. The key was dropped from D to B. Christine WAS NOT playing the piano part. I'm 95% certain that Brett wasn't, either. Karenoke!

[BLY]

I agree too. Although they used piped in pre-recorded vocals on the Buck/Vie tour. The "come on and" was pre-recorded or looked like from my seat. I did not see the 2018 tour so I cant comment. They only did it for a few days though, right?


The live version came on my music playlist right after I read this post. In my opinion it was the chorus that never worked live. To me that’s what probably killed it on the 82 tour. However, with that said Blue Letter live never worked for me on any tour either. Christine shouldn’t be singing on Blue Letter on the chorus as Stevie shouldn’t be singing on Hold Me’s chorus on the live versions. The studio versions are blended with all the “MAC MAGIC” which works.

[Wdm6789]

I was front row for show #2(Nashville), and they did Hold Me. The key was dropped from D to B. Christine WAS NOT playing the piano part. I'm 95% certain that Brett wasn't, either. Karenoke!

I think she was playing on the 2014-2015 tour, but I’m sure she had plenty of supplementation from Brett and/or pre recorded music being phoned in.

I was fine with it though. It was amazing to see her back with the band, regardless. But by 2018, I’m sure she was just pretending to play the keyboards, which again, I would be fine with. Just to have her still there singing and pretending to play the keyboards was good enough for me.

[HomerMcvie]

The live version came on my music playlist right after I read this post. In my opinion it was the chorus that never worked live. To me that’s what probably killed it on the 82 tour. However, with that said Blue Letter live never worked for me on any tour either. Christine shouldn’t be singing on Blue Letter on the chorus as Stevie shouldn’t be singing on Hold Me’s chorus on the live versions. The studio versions are blended with all the “MAC MAGIC” which works.
They did Hold Me on the Indy tour stop in 1982. I was in heaven.

[HomerMcvie]

I think she was playing on the 2014-2015 tour, but I’m sure she had plenty of supplementation from Brett and/or pre recorded music being phoned in.

I was fine with it though. It was amazing to see her back with the band, regardless. But by 2018, I’m sure she was just pretending to play the keyboards, which again, I would be fine with. Just to have her still there singing and pretending to play the keyboards was good enough for me.

I find it weird, though. Guitar is SO MUCH more physically demanding than keyboards. Bob Dylan(yes, I'd say that to him) switched from guitars to keyboards a few years back, and everyone assumes that that's the reason. I also play both instruments, and I'm beginning to have hand issues... it affects certain things I play on guitar, but nothing on keyboards.

I'm just curious if it was just arthritis, or something more debilitating...

[aleuzzi]

I find it weird, though. Guitar is SO MUCH more physically demanding than keyboards. Bob Dylan(yes, I'd say that to him) switched from guitars to keyboards a few years back, and everyone assumes that that's the reason. I also play both instruments, and I'm beginning to have hand issues... it affects certain things I play on guitar, but nothing on keyboards.

I'm just curious if it was just arthritis, or something more debilitating...

In her case, it may have been a mix of things: she appears to have lost dexterity in her hand, which reduced her to chords during live performances; but that may also have been because Brett had been playing the keyboard parts for a long time. The band had already gotten into a comfortable place with LB/SN's songs, so she might have just said "Ok, you keep doing what you're doing and I'll play some basic things."

Weird thing, though is watching her practice with the "new" 2018 band. She was moving her fingers pretty fast in that clip. So who knows?

[vivfox]

I was just not a fan of the added “yeaahhh” when they sang it on the Mirage tour. It was unnecessary. Hold me.. hold meeeeEEEE sounded much better.

You always say that and I always disagree. I loved the "yeaahhh," especially enjoyable hearing Stevie sing it. I feel so blessed I was born at the right time and still remember seeing this performed in concert.

[BigAl84]

In her case, it may have been a mix of things: she appears to have lost dexterity in her hand, which reduced her to chords during live performances; but that may also have been because Brett had been playing the keyboard parts for a long time. The band had already gotten into a comfortable place with LB/SN's songs, so she might have just said "Ok, you keep doing what you're doing and I'll play some basic things."

Weird thing, though is watching her practice with the "new" 2018 band. She was moving her fingers pretty fast in that clip. So who knows?

Didn't some sort of hand injury occur during the 2014/2015 tour that caused songbird to be removed from the set? Perhaps she either never quite recovered back to normal or she developed arthritis as a result of the injury?

I never thought of it in this way, but it's possible that certain songs had parts that she can play just fine, but not repeatedly night after night while on tour for months at a time. Maybe Brett took on those more physically demanding keyboard parts.

I bet David would know which keyboard parts were a workout compared to others.

[HomerMcvie]

Didn't some sort of hand injury occur during the 2014/2015 tour that caused songbird to be removed from the set? Perhaps she either never quite recovered back to normal or she developed arthritis as a result of the injury?

I never thought of it in this way, but it's possible that certain songs had parts that she can play just fine, but not repeatedly night after night while on tour for months at a time. Maybe Brett took on those more physically demanding keyboard parts.

I bet David would know which keyboard parts were a workout compared to others.
Get Like You Used To Be is a workout, but this ain't 1975.

[jbrownsjr]

Get Like You Used To Be is a workout, but this ain't 1975.

you're lovin too many people, EVERYONE YA SEE!

[David]

So if they have the Hold Me audio from the Los Angeles show from the Mirage tour, do they also have the audio of the other live songs that were not included in the Mirage Deluxe Edition? You bet they do. The question is, Who are “they”? There’s a lot of audio of all Fleetwood tours but probably nobody knows where. It takes people to get permission to look for it, the way Rhino staff got permission to dig for goodies for release. Paperwork and approval stand between us fans and lots more goodies, and it’s never been a priority with Fleetwood Mac or their business networks.

Do they have the video of the songs that were cut from the Mirage tour video thing?You bet they do. When cameras film a show, they film a show. Cameras roll from start to finish. Everything that gets cut for release is cut later, just like in the movies.

I feel like the complete Mirage tour video (and audio) is a highly coveted thing in the Fleetwood Mac fandom community. With expert hindsight, I always thought the wrong show was filmed for release. St. Louis was the wrong show in 1979, LA was the wrong show in 1982, San Fran was the wrong show in 1987, and Boston was the wrong show in 2003. For 1982, I’d much rather have full audio or video of the Meadowlands or Joe Louis Arena or Irvine Meadows.

But beggars can’t be choosers, so when we got “Hold Me” and “Second Hand News” and “Brown Eyes” from LA, I did say a quiet “Yay, Lord.”

When the Deluxe Edition of Mirage was coming out, I was really hoping they were going to include the full live set from the Mirage tour, like they did on the Deluxe Tusk and Deluxe Rumours. You can almost hear the planning meetings: “We’ll naturally have to remaster the two existing CDs, but we can release a third CD of goodies.” I wonder whether anyone in the room said, “Why don’t we release an extra FOUR CDs and deluge those fans with a degree of pleasure they have never experienced with the lights on?”

[David]

Get Like You Used To Be is a workout, but this ain't 1975.
Yep, that one and a few others from the old days, especially if the band speeded them up in concert. But I hadn’t heard Christine play anything difficult (for her) since the Dance Don’t Stop. I guess she was taking a well-earned keyboard rest for 20 years.

[HomerMcvie]

Yep, that one and a few others from the old days, especially if the band speeded them up in concert. But I hadn’t heard Christine play anything difficult (for her) since the Dance Don’t Stop. I guess she was taking a well-earned keyboard rest for 20 years.

Exactly. I'd think the Songbird intro would be the most difficult thing of the past 25 years(it's always been a slight challenge for me- jumping down and into the third bar of the intro... especially if I've had a few drinks).

[bombaysaffires]

I find it weird, though. Guitar is SO MUCH more physically demanding than keyboards. Bob Dylan(yes, I'd say that to him) switched from guitars to keyboards a few years back, and everyone assumes that that's the reason. I also play both instruments, and I'm beginning to have hand issues... it affects certain things I play on guitar, but nothing on keyboards.

I'm just curious if it was just arthritis, or something more debilitating...

You know, Lindsey's "Christine is fragile" comments, which seemed kinda douchey at the time, seem to maybe have had more substance to them than we knew at the time...:shrug: (and yes, he can be douchey AND accurate at the same time)

[HomerMcvie]

You know, Lindsey's "Christine is fragile" comments, which seemed kinda douchey at the time, seem to maybe have had more substance to them than we knew at the time...:shrug: (and yes, he can be douchey AND accurate at the same time)

I know of someone who met her circa 2018, and also said the same.

She always seemed so timeless, isn't it weird how everyone ages differently?

[Wdm6789]

You know, Lindsey's "Christine is fragile" comments, which seemed kinda douchey at the time, seem to maybe have had more substance to them than we knew at the time...:shrug: (and yes, he can be douchey AND accurate at the same time)

I know of someone who met her circa 2018, and also said the same.

She always seemed so timeless, isn't it weird how everyone ages differently?

It was always a little odd to me the difference in Christine from 2014/15 to 2017 to 2018/19.

She sounded really good on the 2014/2015 tour. Her vocals and her performance were in top form, given her age at the time and her 16 year absence. But she looked a lot better, superficially, in 2017-2019. Her face looked better, her hair looked better. I assumed maybe she was getting some anti-aging treatments at some point between 2015 and 2017 or maybe she was just wearing heavier makeup. It also looked like she was wearing a wig or had hair extensions put in. But on the 2018 tour, her vocals were getting weaker. I didn’t see them in 2018-2019, so she might have sounded good in person at a concert because it’s all loud and amplified, but the difference is very clear when you watch videos on YouTube of her performances in 2014/15 vs. 2018/19. She still sounded pretty good in 2017 though. Fleetwood Mac headlined two festivals in 2017 and she did the Buckingham McVie tour.

[HomerMcvie]

I was front row for show #2(Nashville), and they did Hold Me. The key was dropped from D to B. Christine WAS NOT playing the piano part. I'm 95% certain that Brett wasn't, either. Karenoke!

So I was just going through some Youtube videos, and here's the actual video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=00GZm-4uM6c

Notice how she's adjusting her hair WHILE the piano intro is playing...

Also how she looks at her tiny teleprompter before almost every verse line.

It's VERY weird for me to think that I was that close to her(I was standing a couple feet to the left of this camera angle), and that she's gone now.

[Mr Scarrott]

So I was just going through some Youtube videos, and here's the actual video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=00GZm-4uM6c

Notice how she's adjusting her hair WHILE the piano intro is playing...

Also how she looks at her tiny teleprompter before almost every verse line.

It's VERY weird for me to think that I was that close to her(I was standing a couple feet to the left of this camera angle), and that she's gone now.

Homer is correct, I think. I'm no great piano player, but the lower piano notes we can hear would have to be played by the left hand (which she was using to adjust her hair) given the higher notes that were supposed to be being played by the right hand.

She wasn't the only one though- check out "Love is here to stay" - again I'm no great guitarist and Lindsey will use unusual string tunings but he's miming here- you can see clearly at about the minute mark. He's only using his thumb and two fingers to "pick" as well, which given the musical pattern of the accompaniment gives me further suspicion. Perhaps better guitarists than me might have an opinion

Kind of disappointing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L4jo1H5uej8