Rolling Stone: McVie comments on FM and Songbird

[In Your Dreams]

I debated dropping this here vs Christine’s board but thought this was appropriate:

Christine McVie On Her New Solo Collection ‘Songbird,’ Uncertain Future of Fleetwood Mac
Listen to her new version of the 1976 Fleetwood Mac classic “Songbird” where the original vocal track has been paired with a new string arrangement


Christine McVie has spent the vast majority of her professional career in Fleetwood Mac, but she did take a brief break in 1984 to record Christine McVie and followed it up 20 years later with In the Meantime. This solo material is largely unknown to the general public — especially in America — but she hopes to change that on June 24 with the release of Songbird (A Solo Collection). It’s a mixture of songs from her two solo albums plus a handful of unreleased songs, including “All You Gotta Do,” a duet with George Hawkins originally cut for In the Meantime.

Stevie Nicks and Lindsey Buckingham maintained active solo careers during their time in Fleetwood Mac, but McVie says she never really had that desire. “I’ve never felt like I was a solo artist,” McVie tells Rolling Stone from her London home. “I always liked to be part of a group. I also felt a little ill at ease doing a solo tour for that material. It just made me uneasy.”

For the new collection, McVie “went for my favorite songs that weren’t on Fleetwood Mac records,” working with producer Glyn Johns and redoing the tracks with extra instrumentation.

“The Challenge” from McVie’s self-titled 1984 album features backing vocals by Buckingham and guitar by Eric Clapton. “I clearly remember asking Eric to play on it,” McVie says. “And to my delight, he agreed. Like all of my songs, it’s about life and remorse and rejection.”

A majority of the Songbird (A Solo Collection) songs come from 2004’s In the Meantime. She released the album a few years after parting ways with Fleetwood Mac and retreating to her home in the English countryside. It peaked at #133 in the UK and didn’t even ding the U.S. charts. “I really like that record,” says McVie. “I think it wasn’t advertised as well as it could have been.”

The lone Fleetwood Mac song on the record is her 1976 ballad “Songbird,” and it’s a new rendition that pairs her original vocal track with a new string arrangement by composer and arranger Vince Mendoza.

Fleetwood Mac have been completely inactive since the conclusion of their 2018/19 world tour. It was their first outing since their bitter split with Buckingham, when he was replaced by Crowded House frontman Neil Finn and Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers guitarist Mike Campbell. “Those guys were great,” McVie says. “We have a great time with them, but we’ve kind of broke up now, so I hardly ever see them.”

“I don’t communicate with Stevie [Nicks] very much either,” she says. “When we were on the last tour, we did a lot. We always sat next to each other on the plane and we got on really well. But since the band broke up, I’ve not been speaking to her at all.”

Does she mean to say that Fleetwood Mac no longer exists? “Well, not as we know it,” McVie says. “I don’t know. It’s impossible to say. We might get back together, but I just couldn’t say for sure.”

Mick Fleetwood has been open about his hopes to see the Rumours-lineup come back together for a grand farewell tour, but McVie is highly dubious. “I don’t feel physically up for it,” she says. “I’m in quite bad health. I’ve got a chronic back problem which debilitates me. I stand up to play the piano, so I don’t know if I could actually physically do it. What’s that saying? The mind is willing, but the flesh is weak.”

In theory, McVie could sit at the keyboard to make it easier for her to get through a show, but she says that wouldn’t work in practice. “I couldn’t sit at the rig I play,” she says. “You have to stand up to play the piano and the Hammond Organ is beneath that, so it’s a bit difficult to think about sitting down and doing it. Anyway, I wouldn’t want to do that.”

According to McVie, bassist John McVie is in a similar predicament. “I don’t think John’s up for another tour,” she says. “He’s got health issues, so I don’t know if he would be up for it. You’d have to ask him.”



If a tour does somehow happen, McVie hopes that they’ll find a way to bring Buckingham back into the fold. “I’d always want Lindsey back,” she says. “He’s the best. Neil and Mike were such a cheerful couple, but Lindsey was missed.”

“But I’m getting a bit long in the teeth here,” she continues. “I’m quite happy being at home. I don’t know if I ever want to tour again. It’s bloody hard work.”

This may disappoint Fleetwood Mac’s legions of fans, not to mention some of her own bandmates, but they’ll be relieved to know she’s not closing the door on a tour completely. “I really can’t say for sure,” she says, “because I could be wrong. So I’ll just leave it open and say that we might.”

[DownOnRodeo]

Good on ya, Chris. Always one to shoot straight.
Perhaps we could post this as the final thread in the "Present Band" forum instead and officially call an end to that travesty?

I'm glad at least she's giving In The Meantime some credit, near twenty years on.

[aleuzzi]

Good on ya, Chris. Always one to shoot straight.
Perhaps we could post this as the final thread in the "Present Band" forum instead and officially call an end to that travesty?

I'm glad at least she's giving In The Meantime some credit, near twenty years on.

Yeah, she really spoke openly, without regard for a possible Mick or Stevie wrist slap. I suspect she’ll never tour again. I can only hope she’ll do one more record.

[BigAl84]

I had no idea she had a back issue. I'm not surprised given her age.

They really fumbled the ball in 2018. That was their last shot for a proper farewell and instead, we got Tom Petty and Crowded House covers.

[jmn3]

I had no idea she had a back issue. I'm not surprised given her age.

They really fumbled the ball in 2018. That was their last shot for a proper farewell and instead, we got Tom Petty and Crowded House covers.

I really found it gross when so many reviews literally called out "Don't Dream It's Over" and "Free Fallin'" as highlights of those shows. Meanwhile the band dropped interesting songs like "Hypnotized" which I thought actually worked with Neil's voice quite well.

[jbrownsjr]

I had no idea she had a back issue. I'm not surprised given her age.

They really fumbled the ball in 2018. That was their last shot for a proper farewell and instead, we got Tom Petty and Crowded House covers.

I'm betting for a NY LA Chicago London reunion

[sleepless child]

Thank you Chris for being honest. I just wish they hadn't let Stevie steamroll them over Lindsey. They should have told her quit or shut up.

I feel Stevie ruined the last chance for the Mac to do a farewell tour. It sounds like she and John just aren't up for it to tour anymore.

[sue]

I'm betting for a NY LA Chicago London reunion

Yes..I see 4 maybe 5 huge venues..next year and that’s that.
As Stevie would say….”We’re done, done”.

[UnwindedDreams]

Yeah, she really spoke openly, without regard for a possible Mick or Stevie wrist slap. I suspect she’ll never tour again. I can only hope she’ll do one more record.

You know the only wrist slap would be from Stevie and her associates. Lindsey wasn't lying when he said Stevie is the only one who doesn't want him to rejoin.
Mick said he hoped Lindsey could (with Neil and Mike because "we don't do that"... right Rick and Billy?)
And Chris says in this interview "Lindsey's the best"

But Stevie won't forgive Lindsey and just doesn't like him.

[vivfox]

Thank you Chris for being honest. They should have told her(Stevie)quit or shut up.

But then who would be paying for Christine's new house and eternal back issues?

[David]

With an obvious unwillingness to mount another tour because of health problems and hatred and what-not, no better time for four of them to record another semi-Fleetwood Mac album. This time, call it Fleetwood Mac and stop bloody worrying about band politics. All these nebulous, timid concerns about “We shouldn’t do this” or “We can’t say that” are so silly at this advanced stage.

Of course, an album couldn’t happen until next year because Lindsey is still touring solo.

Other than that, go ahead and retire. It’s been a long-lived band, and the living room library and fireplace are calling.

[Macfan4life]

Thanks for posting. Great interview. At least she is honest. She appears not to be friends with Stevie but work mates within the band. I dont know how Mick does it at his age since playing drums is the most physically challenging. Chris lost her ability to play piano live on stage years ago. Many of us were wondering if she even plays. I am sorry to hear about her back but good grief she did play for many years. I am so thankful she did come back to the band and give us one last real Mac tour with Lindsey. Its sad this is the ending of this band because of Stevie and Mick. Just imagine if they had recorded one last album in 2018 and went on tour to promote it. Instead we get this as the ending. The clock ran out. I hope John is ok. They are getting really far up there in age. She gave her all to this band and probably too much.

[BigAl84]

Yes..I see 4 maybe 5 huge venues..next year and that’s that.
As Stevie would say….”We’re done, done”.

I just don’t see Stevie agreeing to save face to even do a small amount of shows.

[jbrownsjr]

I just don’t see Stevie agreeing to save face to even do a small amount of shows.

Yea, there is that. But the $$ would possibly talk in that regard.

[bwboy]

I really found it gross when so many reviews literally called out "Don't Dream It's Over" and "Free Fallin'" as highlights of those shows. Meanwhile the band dropped interesting songs like "Hypnotized" which I thought actually worked with Neil's voice quite well.

What can I say- those two songs were highlights for me. Neil and Stevie were so good on Don’t Dream It’s Over, and Free Fallin’ was beautifully done. I agree it sucked they had dropped Hypnotized and Storms by the time I saw them, but thank goodness I got to hear Isn’t It Midnight before it was dropped. For me, their set list was fantastic.

That’s why I’m not excited about a final tour, even if Lindsey were to rejoin them for it. It would be the same show we’ve gotten from them the last few tours. I would rather have deep cuts than new songs. The new songs were ok but sounded like previous FM songs to me, and I shiver at the thought of a FM show that would perform In My World and drop Second Hand News, for example.

[UnwindedDreams]

I had no idea she had a back issue. I'm not surprised given her age.

They really fumbled the ball in 2018. That was their last shot for a proper farewell and instead, we got Tom Petty and Crowded House covers.
A Split Enz song too.
A reunion with Lindsey will never happen, but if Stevie let it so many deep cuts like Paper Doll, Angel, Welcome to the Room, Beautiful Child, No Questions Asked, Not Make Believe, Crystal, and Fireflies could be done instead of the pre-Nicks material that they did in 2018. That's what I'd love instead of Dreams, Rhiannon, Landslide, Gold Dust, and Gypsy from Stevie every tour.

[elle]

“I don’t communicate with Stevie [Nicks] very much either,” she says. “When we were on the last tour, we did a lot. We always sat next to each other on the plane and we got on really well. But since the band broke up, I’ve not been speaking to her at all.”

Does she mean to say that Fleetwood Mac no longer exists? “Well, not as we know it,” McVie says. “I don’t know. It’s impossible to say. We might get back together, but I just couldn’t say for sure.”

Mick Fleetwood has been open about his hopes to see the Rumours-lineup come back together for a grand farewell tour, but McVie is highly dubious. “I don’t feel physically up for it,” she says. “I’m in quite bad health. I’ve got a chronic back problem which debilitates me. I stand up to play the piano, so I don’t know if I could actually physically do it. What’s that saying? The mind is willing, but the flesh is weak.”

In theory, McVie could sit at the keyboard to make it easier for her to get through a show, but she says that wouldn’t work in practice. “I couldn’t sit at the rig I play,” she says. “You have to stand up to play the piano and the Hammond Organ is beneath that, so it’s a bit difficult to think about sitting down and doing it. Anyway, I wouldn’t want to do that.”

According to McVie, bassist John McVie is in a similar predicament. “I don’t think John’s up for another tour,” she says. “He’s got health issues, so I don’t know if he would be up for it. You’d have to ask him.”

If a tour does somehow happen, McVie hopes that they’ll find a way to bring Buckingham back into the fold. “I’d always want Lindsey back,” she says. “He’s the best. Neil and Mike were such a cheerful couple, but Lindsey was missed.”


but but but but but................ the whole band wanted Lindsey out, no? it was not Stevie, it was them, the whole band, no? :lol:

how is it possible that Mick and Christine keep saying they miss him and want him back, and that Lindsey is "the best"? :wavey:

[elle]

With an obvious unwillingness to mount another tour because of health problems and hatred and what-not, no better time for four of them to record another semi-Fleetwood Mac album. This time, call it Fleetwood Mac and stop bloody worrying about band politics. All these nebulous, timid concerns about “We shouldn’t do this” or “We can’t say that” are so silly at this advanced stage.

they should do it.

Stevie and managers would be fuming, but she'd have no legal right to sue since she doesn't own the name and band doesn't contractually exist between stints of tours or records. so sounds like a win-win!

[HomerMcvie]

they should do it.

Stevie and managers would be fuming, but she'd have no legal right to sue since she doesn't own the name and band doesn't contractually exist between stints of tours or records. so sounds like a win-win!

Yeah, but she threatens to quit, and there goes their ass filler.

I mean seat filler.

Same thing...

[John Run]

My opinion - those stadium dates happen next year - LA Chicago Dallas - Atlanta or Nashville - New York. Then London. So 6 cities. 12 dates. Massive payday for short work. Stevie will talk about how Fleetwood Mac is like the Army and the Army needed her, Lindsey will say the reconciliation of the five was an organic thing and Mick will run to spend as much of that cash windfall as he can …

[bombaysaffires]

I debated dropping this here vs Christine’s board but thought this was appropriate:

Christine McVie On Her New Solo Collection ‘Songbird,’ Uncertain Future of Fleetwood Mac
Listen to her new version of the 1976 Fleetwood Mac classic “Songbird” where the original vocal track has been paired with a new string arrangement


Christine McVie has spent the vast majority of her professional career in Fleetwood Mac, but she did take a brief break in 1984 to record Christine McVie and followed it up 20 years later with In the Meantime. This solo material is largely unknown to the general public — especially in America — but she hopes to change that on June 24 with the release of Songbird (A Solo Collection). It’s a mixture of songs from her two solo albums plus a handful of unreleased songs, including “All You Gotta Do,” a duet with George Hawkins originally cut for In the Meantime.

Stevie Nicks and Lindsey Buckingham maintained active solo careers during their time in Fleetwood Mac, but McVie says she never really had that desire. “I’ve never felt like I was a solo artist,” McVie tells Rolling Stone from her London home. “I always liked to be part of a group. I also felt a little ill at ease doing a solo tour for that material. It just made me uneasy.”

For the new collection, McVie “went for my favorite songs that weren’t on Fleetwood Mac records,” working with producer Glyn Johns and redoing the tracks with extra instrumentation.

“The Challenge” from McVie’s self-titled 1984 album features backing vocals by Buckingham and guitar by Eric Clapton. “I clearly remember asking Eric to play on it,” McVie says. “And to my delight, he agreed. Like all of my songs, it’s about life and remorse and rejection.”

A majority of the Songbird (A Solo Collection) songs come from 2004’s In the Meantime. She released the album a few years after parting ways with Fleetwood Mac and retreating to her home in the English countryside. It peaked at #133 in the UK and didn’t even ding the U.S. charts. “I really like that record,” says McVie. “I think it wasn’t advertised as well as it could have been.”

The lone Fleetwood Mac song on the record is her 1976 ballad “Songbird,” and it’s a new rendition that pairs her original vocal track with a new string arrangement by composer and arranger Vince Mendoza.

Fleetwood Mac have been completely inactive since the conclusion of their 2018/19 world tour. It was their first outing since their bitter split with Buckingham, when he was replaced by Crowded House frontman Neil Finn and Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers guitarist Mike Campbell. “Those guys were great,” McVie says. “We have a great time with them, but we’ve kind of broke up now, so I hardly ever see them.”

“I don’t communicate with Stevie [Nicks] very much either,” she says. “When we were on the last tour, we did a lot. We always sat next to each other on the plane and we got on really well. But since the band broke up, I’ve not been speaking to her at all.”

Does she mean to say that Fleetwood Mac no longer exists? “Well, not as we know it,” McVie says. “I don’t know. It’s impossible to say. We might get back together, but I just couldn’t say for sure.”

Mick Fleetwood has been open about his hopes to see the Rumours-lineup come back together for a grand farewell tour, but McVie is highly dubious. “I don’t feel physically up for it,” she says. “I’m in quite bad health. I’ve got a chronic back problem which debilitates me. I stand up to play the piano, so I don’t know if I could actually physically do it. What’s that saying? The mind is willing, but the flesh is weak.”

In theory, McVie could sit at the keyboard to make it easier for her to get through a show, but she says that wouldn’t work in practice. “I couldn’t sit at the rig I play,” she says. “You have to stand up to play the piano and the Hammond Organ is beneath that, so it’s a bit difficult to think about sitting down and doing it. Anyway, I wouldn’t want to do that.”

According to McVie, bassist John McVie is in a similar predicament. “I don’t think John’s up for another tour,” she says. “He’s got health issues, so I don’t know if he would be up for it. You’d have to ask him.”



If a tour does somehow happen, McVie hopes that they’ll find a way to bring Buckingham back into the fold. “I’d always want Lindsey back,” she says. “He’s the best. Neil and Mike were such a cheerful couple, but Lindsey was missed.”

“But I’m getting a bit long in the teeth here,” she continues. “I’m quite happy being at home. I don’t know if I ever want to tour again. It’s bloody hard work.”

This may disappoint Fleetwood Mac’s legions of fans, not to mention some of her own bandmates, but they’ll be relieved to know she’s not closing the door on a tour completely. “I really can’t say for sure,” she says, “because I could be wrong. So I’ll just leave it open and say that we might.”

Interesting to hear her say she likes In the Meantime, she's seemingly kinda disparaged it in the past.

This sounds like typical Stevie politics-- she likes to have an ally within the band. Coming in it was Lindsey, then it was Mick, for while during Tusk she was awfully tactile with John. I can see her buddying up with Chris during the last tour for company (you know, she has to pal with other rock stars) and for band politics, to have someone who will be on her side in any emergent disputes. (Face it Chris, you were just her road f**k).:)

She's said before John's health would likely make him not tour again, but this is the first time she's said the same about herself. She doesn't just say I have a bad back, she uses the word "debilitating". Not good. Perhaps explains why she didn't actually seem to play that much on the last tour, and possibly why she didn't play everything on the BuckVie tour).

So funny and yet so Christine to hear her say she's quite happy to just stay at home. It feels like such a full-circle moment. It's exactly how she felt when she left after The Dance. She just wanted to stay home in England. Seems like over time she forgot how hard the road was, and romanticized going back. Then she went back for what, 8 years or so? And is now back to "yep, I prefer staying at home". LOL.

If they did do another album as a 4 piece, there would inevitably be pressure to tour for it.... LB would want to tour it, Mick also.... managers etc. But clearly John and Chris are at best up for one-offs.

[HomerMcvie]

My opinion - those stadium dates happen next year - LA Chicago Dallas - Atlanta or Nashville - New York. Then London. So 6 cities. 12 dates. Massive payday for short work. Stevie will talk about how Fleetwood Mac is like the Army and the Army needed her, Lindsey will say the reconciliation of the five was an organic thing and Mick will run to spend as much of that cash windfall as he can …

Mick will finally be financially solvent.









When he's dead.

[SteveMacD]

Interesting to hear her say she likes In the Meantime, she's seemingly kinda disparaged it in the past.


Well, she IS doing promo for a weird compilation made up largely of songs from that album, so there’s that.

[aleuzzi]

Well, she IS doing promo for a weird compilation made up largely of songs from that album, so there’s that.

That’s totally it. And the whole line about her collecting her favorite songs from those two solo records probably isn’t true, either. Likely, the song list has been cobbled together with songs that haven’t been sold off to. Otherwise, she’d have certainly included the two hits, plus “You Are,” and “Smile.”

[Macfan4life]

That’s totally it. And the whole line about her collecting her favorite songs from those two solo records probably isn’t true, either. Likely, the song list has been cobbled together with songs that haven’t been sold off to. Otherwise, she’d have certainly included the two hits, plus “You Are,” and “Smile.”
That's it. You cracked the Da Vinci code. It all makes sense now.

If she could turn the page in time and rearrange a day or two, an album like this would have come out BEFORE she sold her catalog. Then the fans would get all those gems that are missing from this collection.

[blinker12]

^ Oh wow, that does make sense Re: the rights. So… does that mean that Stevie, for example, could not release another best-of that includes her most famous hits, because she sold off the rights?

But one other question, I thought these deals were for the writers’ entire catalogs?

[jbrownsjr]

That’s totally it. And the whole line about her collecting her favorite songs from those two solo records probably isn’t true, either. Likely, the song list has been cobbled together with songs that haven’t been sold off to. Otherwise, she’d have certainly included the two hits, plus “You Are,” and “Smile.”

This is my conclusion. This seems so forced. Another "Bingo!" for you, Tony!

[DownOnRodeo]

But then why release this album at all?

Seems unlikely that she has been under some sort of contract in the past decade.

So let me one-up Tony: the whole thing is a Producers-like loss-making tax scheme! This theory is only strengthened when you listen to the new "arrangement" of Songbird.:laugh:

[jbrownsjr]

but but but but but................ the whole band wanted Lindsey out, no? it was not Stevie, it was them, the whole band, no? :lol:

how is it possible that Mick and Christine keep saying they miss him and want him back, and that Lindsey is "the best"? :wavey:

We don't disagree often, and this is another one of those times we were in complete agreement of the "who" "what" and "why". :laugh:

but but... she fired herself!! She even said she fired herself!!! Why are you guys saying she fired Lindsey???
Or, "This shows how much love they still have for each other!! See we told you!!"

[UnwindedDreams]

We don't disagree often, and this is another one of those times we were in complete agreement of the "who" "what" and "why". :laugh:

but but... she fired herself!! She even said she fired herself!!! Why are you guys saying she fired Lindsey???
Or, "This shows how much love they still have for each other!! See we told you!!"
Christine is probably getting a call from Sheryl Louis or Irving today.

Next week she'll say "What I meant was I miss the Lindsey from the 70s, not the current Lindsey... he was very mean":laugh:

[SteveMacD]

Next week she'll say "What I meant was I miss the Lindsey from the 70s, not the current Lindsey

Don’t we all? Well, except maybe Elle.

[jbrownsjr]

Christine is probably getting a call from Sheryl Louis or Irving today.

Next week she'll say "What I meant was I miss the Lindsey from the 70s, not the current Lindsey... he was very mean":laugh:

What I meant to say was, "Lindsey was very toxic on the BuckVie tour, and he hit me and the other bandmembers and then I threw another drink at him!!"

"Sorry I mis-spoke before. ":laugh:

[UnwindedDreams]

What I meant to say was, "Lindsey was very toxic on the BuckVie tour, and he hit me and the other bandmembers and then I threw another drink at him!!"

"Sorry I mis-spoke before. ":laugh:
I think Lindsey spoke the truth when he said Chris emailed him after the suit got settled saying that she had nothing to do with him being fired.
I get the sense from her and Mick they wish Lindsey never had to be fired. But I'm sure they had fun with Mike and Neil, and no drama backstage.

So after 2 years of lockdown, no grand return of FM but instead Stevie's out there doing the jukebox tour. How artistic.

[SteveMacD]

What I meant to say was, "Lindsey was very toxic on the BuckVie tour, and he hit me and the other bandmembers and then I threw another drink at him!!"

"Sorry I mis-spoke before. ":laugh:

There’s a reason Brett didn’t rejoin the tour.

[DownOnRodeo]

Don’t we all? Well, except maybe Elle.

Current Lindsey (who like a fine wine has only improved over the years) has TWELVE fans, not just the amazing Elle, thank you very much.

[jbrownsjr]

Current Lindsey (who like a fine wine has only improved over the years) has TWELVE fans, not just the amazing Elle, thank you very much.

I love Elle more than current Lindsey... :laugh: (Somehow, she'll privately give me sh** about it) But she's near and dear to me. :xoxo:

[aleuzzi]

^ Oh wow, that does make sense Re: the rights. So… does that mean that Stevie, for example, could not release another best-of that includes her most famous hits, because she sold off the rights?

But one other question, I thought these deals were for the writers’ entire catalogs?

Not always. In Christine’s case, two separate publishing houses bought the bulk of her work: Sony got first grab on her huge Mac hits; then Hipgnosis (sp?) bought the bulk of the remaining catalog, but still not all of it. And given the album’s focus on ITM, this compilation is probably tied to an outstanding contractual obligation she made with Sanctuary back in 2004. Whatever the case, SONGBIRD makes for an odd, B-grade compilation. Hardly the stuff of a swan song.

[aleuzzi]

Christine is probably getting a call from Sheryl Louis or Irving today.

Next week she'll say "What I meant was I miss the Lindsey from the 70s, not the current Lindsey... he was very mean":laugh:

Omg—he was the worst. He was even saying terrible things about Bob Dylan :D

[aleuzzi]

I love Elle more than current Lindsey... :laugh: (Somehow, she'll privately give me sh** about it) But she's near and dear to me. :xoxo:

We love Elle! She believes no one falls under a certain set of labels and she fights for the power of positive choice.

[jbrownsjr]

We love Elle! She believes no one falls under a certain set of labels and she fights for the power of positive choice.

Elle believes in cycles and demons, and facing those demons with circular profound chemistry.

[bombaysaffires]

I debated dropping this here vs Christine’s board but thought this was appropriate:

Christine McVie On Her New Solo Collection ‘Songbird,’ Uncertain Future of Fleetwood Mac
Listen to her new version of the 1976 Fleetwood Mac classic “Songbird” where the original vocal track has been paired with a new string arrangement


Christine McVie has spent the vast majority of her professional career in Fleetwood Mac, but she did take a brief break in 1984 to record Christine McVie and followed it up 20 years later with In the Meantime. This solo material is largely unknown to the general public — especially in America — but she hopes to change that on June 24 with the release of Songbird (A Solo Collection). It’s a mixture of songs from her two solo albums plus a handful of unreleased songs, including “All You Gotta Do,” a duet with George Hawkins originally cut for In the Meantime.

Stevie Nicks and Lindsey Buckingham maintained active solo careers during their time in Fleetwood Mac, but McVie says she never really had that desire. “I’ve never felt like I was a solo artist,” McVie tells Rolling Stone from her London home. “I always liked to be part of a group. I also felt a little ill at ease doing a solo tour for that material. It just made me uneasy.”

For the new collection, McVie “went for my favorite songs that weren’t on Fleetwood Mac records,” working with producer Glyn Johns and redoing the tracks with extra instrumentation.

“The Challenge” from McVie’s self-titled 1984 album features backing vocals by Buckingham and guitar by Eric Clapton. “I clearly remember asking Eric to play on it,” McVie says. “And to my delight, he agreed. Like all of my songs, it’s about life and remorse and rejection.”

A majority of the Songbird (A Solo Collection) songs come from 2004’s In the Meantime. She released the album a few years after parting ways with Fleetwood Mac and retreating to her home in the English countryside. It peaked at #133 in the UK and didn’t even ding the U.S. charts. “I really like that record,” says McVie. “I think it wasn’t advertised as well as it could have been.”

The lone Fleetwood Mac song on the record is her 1976 ballad “Songbird,” and it’s a new rendition that pairs her original vocal track with a new string arrangement by composer and arranger Vince Mendoza.

Fleetwood Mac have been completely inactive since the conclusion of their 2018/19 world tour. It was their first outing since their bitter split with Buckingham, when he was replaced by Crowded House frontman Neil Finn and Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers guitarist Mike Campbell. “Those guys were great,” McVie says. “We have a great time with them, but we’ve kind of broke up now, so I hardly ever see them.”

“I don’t communicate with Stevie [Nicks] very much either,” she says. “When we were on the last tour, we did a lot. We always sat next to each other on the plane and we got on really well. But since the band broke up, I’ve not been speaking to her at all.”

Does she mean to say that Fleetwood Mac no longer exists? “Well, not as we know it,” McVie says. “I don’t know. It’s impossible to say. We might get back together, but I just couldn’t say for sure.”

Mick Fleetwood has been open about his hopes to see the Rumours-lineup come back together for a grand farewell tour, but McVie is highly dubious. “I don’t feel physically up for it,” she says. “I’m in quite bad health. I’ve got a chronic back problem which debilitates me. I stand up to play the piano, so I don’t know if I could actually physically do it. What’s that saying? The mind is willing, but the flesh is weak.”

In theory, McVie could sit at the keyboard to make it easier for her to get through a show, but she says that wouldn’t work in practice. “I couldn’t sit at the rig I play,” she says. “You have to stand up to play the piano and the Hammond Organ is beneath that, so it’s a bit difficult to think about sitting down and doing it. Anyway, I wouldn’t want to do that.”

According to McVie, bassist John McVie is in a similar predicament. “I don’t think John’s up for another tour,” she says. “He’s got health issues, so I don’t know if he would be up for it. You’d have to ask him.”



If a tour does somehow happen, McVie hopes that they’ll find a way to bring Buckingham back into the fold. “I’d always want Lindsey back,” she says. “He’s the best. Neil and Mike were such a cheerful couple, but Lindsey was missed.”

“But I’m getting a bit long in the teeth here,” she continues. “I’m quite happy being at home. I don’t know if I ever want to tour again. It’s bloody hard work.”

This may disappoint Fleetwood Mac’s legions of fans, not to mention some of her own bandmates, but they’ll be relieved to know she’s not closing the door on a tour completely. “I really can’t say for sure,” she says, “because I could be wrong. So I’ll just leave it open and say that we might.”

^ Oh wow, that does make sense Re: the rights. So… does that mean that Stevie, for example, could not release another best-of that includes her most famous hits, because she sold off the rights?

But one other question, I thought these deals were for the writers’ entire catalogs?

Stevie didn't sell 100% of her publishing rights (covering how songs can be used and by whom etc). She sold I believe it's 80% but has retained 20% stake.

IIRC the others all sold 100%.

Publishers rights are different to songwriter royalties... the writer still gets paid royalties anytime the song is used by anyone.

And either Warner's or the band (Warners I think??) owns the rights to the actual recordings (the masters) made by the band and thus how those can be used, repackaged, remastered, resold, etc.

Maybe Michelle or someone else with better legal knowledge can clarify publishing rights vs owning the masters/rights to the original recordings. My understanding is publishing rights covers how a song can be used (ie re recorded) for commercial use or by another artist etc. Not the rights to the already recorded versions by the band. Warners/FM (not sure who nowadays) owns those. I welcome more info.....

[John Run]

Artists / Writers still have access to their own songs when they sell the rights. What they lose is future royalty earnings and refusal rights. Every time the song is played on the radio, used in a movie, a commercial - those fees and royalties go to the new rights holder. Refusal - An example - a politician wants to use Don't Stop in a campaign ad, the artist / writer can't stop it. Same thing if Don't Stop is used in a porn film.

FYI - Lindsey did sell 100% of his publishing and writers rights to his catalog and 50% of his unreleased catalog. However, he kept 100% of his artist and producer rights and royalties. Not a bad deal for $90 million.

[aleuzzi]

Artists / Writers still have access to their own songs when they sell the rights. What they lose is future royalty earnings and refusal rights. Every time the song is played on the radio, used in a movie, a commercial - those fees and royalties go to the new rights holder. Refusal - An example - a politician wants to use Don't Stop in a campaign ad, the artist / writer can't stop it. Same thing if Don't Stop is used in a porn film.

FYI - Lindsey did sell 100% of his publishing and writers rights to his catalog and 50% of his unreleased catalog. However, he kept 100% of his artist and producer rights and royalties. Not a bad deal for $90 million.

Thank you for this information. Knowing this only makes Christine’s song selection on SONGBIRD seem even more baffling.

[John Run]

My guess is the Meantime songs are still 100% Christine's, so she gets maximum return there. Songbird was probably a concession to need to have Christine signature song on the album, but they wanted to stay away from the big hits that get big download / stream numbers still in their original versions, such as Don't Stop, Everywhere and Little Lies.

[Macfan4life]

My guess is the Meantime songs are still 100% Christine's, so she gets maximum return there. Songbird was probably a concession to need to have Christine signature song on the album, but they wanted to stay away from the big hits that get big download / stream numbers still in their original versions, such as Don't Stop, Everywhere and Little Lies.
And maybe they own the music to Songbird which gives the reason for this odd elevator music backing track :lol:
They only let her use the vocal part otherwise she would have to pay or give royalties :lol:

The orchestra track to Beauty and the Beast would have worked better than this oddity.

[moon]

Amazing one, thanks for share!!

Definitely Chris has her feet on earth and can speak to you without doubts about what happened and what's happening. I'm so sad to read about her health issues, and of course I respect them as an obstacle to tour again, if it was possible. And I'm sad for John as well!

If Fleetwood still has the idea of perform with the Rumours line up, or with every single FM singer/songwriter still with us, as he said one day, I know the Rumours line up would be for real, but only for a few performances, not for an entire tour. A few dates with them would be great, and a great way to finally break the Chain. I see it possible, but only for a short moment.

But back with Christine, I see that even her was not so convinced about the press In The Meantime had at the moment of its release. It's such a great album, I listened to it a few weeks ago and I liked it, but it's bad to know the work has not enough recognizement even today!

[bombaysaffires]

Artists / Writers still have access to their own songs when they sell the rights. What they lose is future royalty earnings and refusal rights. Every time the song is played on the radio, used in a movie, a commercial - those fees and royalties go to the new rights holder. Refusal - An example - a politician wants to use Don't Stop in a campaign ad, the artist / writer can't stop it. Same thing if Don't Stop is used in a porn film.

FYI - Lindsey did sell 100% of his publishing and writers rights to his catalog and 50% of his unreleased catalog. However, he kept 100% of his artist and producer rights and royalties. Not a bad deal for $90 million.

thank you for this clarification!

[justcrazylove]

Artists / Writers still have access to their own songs when they sell the rights. What they lose is future royalty earnings and refusal rights. Every time the song is played on the radio, used in a movie, a commercial - those fees and royalties go to the new rights holder. Refusal - An example - a politician wants to use Don't Stop in a campaign ad, the artist / writer can't stop it. Same thing if Don't Stop is used in a porn film.

FYI - Lindsey did sell 100% of his publishing and writers rights to his catalog and 50% of his unreleased catalog. However, he kept 100% of his artist and producer rights and royalties. Not a bad deal for $90 million.

So I'm getting a crystal clear picture; Lindsey would still be paid on every Tusk, Mirage, Tango, The Dance, SYW track as a producer. In addition to then being paid as a member of Fleetwood Mac as a producer on The White Album and Rumours?

He also continues to own his 'Artist' royalties, so that would be a payment anytime the original recording (master) is used/played?

[michelej1]

They were such a "cheerful couple" but we prefer are own troublesome bloke, thank you very much.

[michelej1]

^ Oh wow, that does make sense Re: the rights. So… does that mean that Stevie, for example, could not release another best-of that includes her most famous hits, because she sold off the rights?

But one other question, I thought these deals were for the writers’ entire catalogs?

Well, they could release it as long as they had permission to use the songs and there is no reason that the buyer would not want to let them use it. They want to make money too. That was the reason they purchased the catalog.

[SteveMacD]

So after 2 years of lockdown, no grand return of FM but instead Stevie's out there doing the jukebox tour. How artistic.
How artistic is a largely karaoke tour in support of a five year old "new" album?

[michelej1]

What I meant to say was, "Lindsey was very toxic on the BuckVie tour, and he hit me and the other bandmembers and then I threw another drink at him!!"

"Sorry I mis-spoke before. ":laugh:

Lindsey is the best -- demonic person I know.

[jbrownsjr]

Lindsey is the best -- demonic person I know.

And yet, there she was hanging on with him for 40 some years. Christine came back to him he was so bad!! :distress:

[michelej1]

And yet, there she was hanging on with him for 40 some years. Christine came back to him he was so bad!! :distress:

I'm glad she feels far enough removed from Stevie (and Mick) that she doesn't mind saying that.

But she's not alone in knowing substitutes don't work. even though the seventies and eighties were the most volatile years Stevie and Lindsey endured, she was begging him to come back herself in the 1990s (beginning at a BTM show). So, I don't know how bad it could have been.

[SteveMacD]

So, I don't know how bad it could have been.
None of us know.

For all her glowing praise of Lindsey, Christine also said something along the lines that the Stevie-Lindsey dynamic had deteriorated to its worst and had become unworkable.

[HomerMcvie]

None of us know.

For all her glowing praise of Lindsey, Christine also said something along the lines that the Stevie-Lindsey dynamic had deteriorated to its worst and had become unworkable.

So they should have fired STEVIE, since she was the one that no longer wanted to make music. I'm glad you said it.:p

[SteveMacD]

So they should have fired STEVIE, since she was the one that no longer wanted to make music. I'm glad you said it.:p

After 25 albums in 57 years and being the bassist of record for legendary players making their breakthroughs, I think John has earned the right to go out as part of an arena rock band.

They made the right call.

[UnwindedDreams]

None of us know.

For all her glowing praise of Lindsey, Christine also said something along the lines that the Stevie-Lindsey dynamic had deteriorated to its worst and had become unworkable.
That was said in 2019. So the glowing praise is 3 years after that.

This interview she gave is very upsetting for the Lindsey haters, especially Irving.

[UnwindedDreams]

How artistic is a largely karaoke tour in support of a five year old "new" album?
Oh you're mentioning Lindsey. Is Lindsey a member of Fleetwood Mac?

Five years? The album was released September 17, 2021. Crowded House is touring now for an album that was released in June of 2021.

Stevie's last album from 7 years ago was of songs that were 20 years or more old and heard before by her fans during those years. Her current setlist has no new songs in it and not even one song from 24 Karat Gold. The most recent songs in it are 11 years old and they've been performed a hundred times. There are no live debuts of her songs in the set. It's a nostalgia show.

As for sampling, Lindsey's on the stage doing new songs so as long as it's not a hologram, I don't care.

[SteveMacD]

That was said in 2019. So the glowing praise is 3 years after that.

Except, she was still still singing Lindsey’s praises after he was fired. She made it known when they were doing press with Neil and Mike that she enjoyed working with Lindsey and that she was not involved in the decision.

[SteveMacD]

Oh you're mentioning Lindsey. Is Lindsey a member of Fleetwood Mac?
This is the “Rumours” forum and he was a member of that lineup last I checked. I’m just comparing the tours of the two members from that lineup that are on the road.

Five years? The album was released September 17, 2021.
It was finished in 2017, before LBCM. It kept getting delayed, namely due to his bypass and subsequent vocal damage and the pandemic.

Crowded House is touring now for an album that was released in June of 2021.
The recording sessions started the day after the last Fleetwood Mac show in November, 2019, three years after Lindsey started working on his “new” album.

Stevie's last album from 7 years ago was of songs that were 20 years or more old and heard before by her fans during those years.
She’s not trying to shove the “creative visionary” narrative down our throats. She freely admits that she doesn’t write much anymore.

As for sampling, Lindsey's on the stage doing new songs so as long as it's not a hologram, I don't care.
I think it’s the goofiest, cheesiest, most washed up disgraceful display I’ve ever witnessed. I guess I expect more out of “creative visionaries.” How anybody is okay seeing a “Broadway show” instead of a rock show baffles me.

[UnwindedDreams]

This is the “Rumours” forum and he was a member of that lineup last I checked. I’m just comparing the tours of the two members from that lineup that are on the road. So is the point that they're both nostalgia shows? Or do the songs that are performed not count because one's fully live and one isn't?


It was finished in 2017, before LBCM. It kept getting delayed, namely due to his bypass and subsequent vocal damage and the pandemic. Were In Your Dreams and 24 Karat Gold new albums at their release? IYD had a number of tunes that were written and demo'd years before 2011. In the liner notes for 24 Karat Gold, Stevie writes "these songs are not new"


The recording sessions started the day after the last Fleetwood Mac show in November, 2019, three years after Lindsey started working on his “new” album. And? The album is over one year old. It's not "new." Campbell's definitely the most artistic out of all the FM members.


She’s not trying to shove the “creative visionary” narrative down our throats. She freely admits that she doesn’t write much anymore.When did she freely admit that she doesn't write much? She said that before IYD when she was told not to make a new album.
She said she was writing music during lockdown and she gave an interview this year where she says she just wrote one of her best songs.
Watch her 24 Karat Gold Concert video, she says it's not the same Stevie show. 5 years later in 2022, she's doing the predictable Stevie set again, but with an extra cover.



I think it’s the goofiest, cheesiest, most washed up disgraceful display I’ve ever witnessed. I guess I expect more out of “creative visionaries.” How anybody is okay seeing a “Broadway show” instead of a rock show baffles me. Did you go to one of the 2021 or 2022 shows? It didn't feel that way at the ones I saw. The audience didn't seem that way either.

[SteveMacD]

So is the point that they're both nostalgia shows? Or do the songs that are performed not count because one's fully live and one isn't?
I mean, is a fully live oldies rock concert more or less artistic than a show with five whole new songs that gives the verisimilitude of being a live show, but is largely karaoke? I think it’s kind of moot, TBH.

Is it art when someone has to leave the tour for health issues and his absence is completely unnoticeable?

Either way, I’m not going to either show.
Were In Your Dreams and 24 Karat Gold new albums at their release? IYD had a number of tunes that were written and demo'd years before 2011. In the liner notes for 24 Karat Gold, Stevie writes "these songs are not new"

When did she freely admit that she doesn't write much? She said that before IYD when she was told not to make a new album.
She said she was writing music during lockdown and she gave an interview this year where she says she just wrote one of her best songs.

Watch her 24 Karat Gold Concert video, she says it's not the same Stevie show. 5 years later in 2022, she's doing the predictable Stevie set again, but with an extra cover.
Stevie hasn’t been the one pushing the “creative visionary” narrative for over 40 years. She’s not had that level of pretension.

And? The album is over one year old. It's not "new."
Crowded House have played 39 shows and have 29 scheduled and they have been working on new music. Lindsey has played like 47 shows and has ten more scheduled. So, his album is three years older and he’s doing fewer live engagements.

Campbell's definitely the most artistic out of all the FM members.
I completely agree and I think he’s been making the best albums of the lot.

Then again, I listen to a lot of Outlaw Country on SiriusXM and they’ve been playing a lot of Dirty Knobs.

But, then again, Fleetwood Mac is just a blip in the careers of Mike and Neil.

Did you go to one of the 2021 or 2022 shows? It didn't feel that way at the ones I saw. The audience didn't seem that way either.
No. I saw him in 2018 and was put off by the prerecords (“Surrender the Rain” was especially cringeworthy). Furthermore, when I saw jbrownsjr John’s comment about the show, I decided to skip it.

[UnwindedDreams]

I mean, is a fully live oldies rock concert more or less artistic than a show with five whole new songs that gives the verisimilitude of being a live show, but is largely karaoke? I think it’s kind of moot, TBH. It's not moot. You "compared" the tours. I was speaking about how after almost three years of inactivity, there's no FM return but instead Stevie doing a jukebox tour. Prerecorded or not, I think a diverse setlist with new songs is artistic and not everything is prerecorded.

I wish he had postponed the tour so Brett could do it. But did Brett quit for good?



Stevie hasn’t been the one pushing the “creative visionary” narrative for over 40 years. She’s not had that level of pretension. But Stevie on her In Your Dreams and 24KG tours, said she's not doing the same songs again; she lied. This tour has same old songs. Same capes. Same video material. Same crackhead dance and spins. It makes her money but is there integrity with that? Do you ever critique Stevie?


Crowded House have played 39 shows and have 29 scheduled and they have been working on new music. Lindsey has played like 47 shows and has ten more scheduled. So, his album is three years older and he’s doing fewer live engagements. When should Lindsey have released this album? He worked on LBCM in 2016. In 2016, I'm guessing they were hoping for Stevie to join them; she didn't decided to tour until late August of 2016. 2017 was dedicated to LBCM.

[michelej1]

None of us know.

For all her glowing praise of Lindsey, Christine also said something along the lines that the Stevie-Lindsey dynamic had deteriorated to its worst and had become unworkable.

So what? You don’t really have to interact with each other much on tour, once the set list is nailed down and rehearsed. All you have to do is go out there for two hours and then retire to your separate corners, separate limos, separate hotels, even separate planes. You are not Siamese twins. You are not riding together in a car with your instruments like you were in 1975.

Who cares if they don’t like each other. They never got along, yet Stevie was begging for Lindsey to return when she thought he could still boost her star.

[SteveMacD]

So what? You don’t really have to interact with each other much on tour, once the set list is nailed down and rehearsed. All you have to do is go out there for two hours and then retire to your separate corners, separate limos, separate hotels, even separate planes. You are not Siamese twins. You are not riding together in a car with your instruments like you were in 1975.
They couldn’t agree even as to what that tour should look like. Again, none of us were there.

And, touring, even at that level, still requires more interaction than just stage time. They might not directly communicate with each other, instead talking through assistants and managers, but there’s always a line of communication.

Who cares if they don’t like each other. They never got along, yet Stevie was begging for Lindsey to return when she thought he could still boost her star.

A comment made in 1990 was hardly relevant in 2018. Feelings and attitudes change in 28 years. Furthermore, she made a cameo for his solo DVD, so whatever debt of gratitude you’re implying she should have had was long paid off.

[elle]

Christine is probably getting a call from Sheryl Louis or Irving today.

Next week she'll say "What I meant was I miss the Lindsey from the 70s, not the current Lindsey... he was very mean":laugh:

riiiight........ because coked out of his mind mean drunk a**holish 70s Lindsey was somehow ok. but down to earth sober nice now-Lindsey is not ok.

guess there's a sad and wrong lesson in there, somewhere. lately we are seeing too many a**holes win, and nice guys lose.

[HomerMcvie]

riiiight........ because coked out of his mind mean drunk a**holish 70s Lindsey was somehow ok. but down to earth sober nice now-Lindsey is not ok.

guess there's a sad and wrong lesson in there, somewhere. lately we are seeing too many a**holes win, and nice guys lose.

$he wasn't the bo$$ then. $he was lucky to have the gig, since most bands weren't hiring goats. Now that $he's the bo$$, all grudges will be dealt with. $he's a bitter old $hrew.:wavey:

[michelej1]

A comment made in 1990 was hardly relevant in 2018. Feelings and attitudes change in 28 years. Furthermore, she made a cameo for his solo DVD, so whatever debt of gratitude you’re implying she should have had was long paid off.

It wasn’t just a comment made in 1990. After Christine left Stevie was the one that wanted to accelerate Fleetwood Mac touring. Lindsey was still trying to see if he could get a deal for his solo record. So he was dragging his feet and Stevie was frustrated by that. She wanted to work with him.

And I’m not talking about a debt of gratitude. I’m talking about the common decency of not getting someone fired rather than just walking away yourself, if you find the situation is no longer to your liking. Just leave. I’m talking about not deciding that a situation is intolerable UNTIL you!ve sucked the other person dry. If you’re going to kick them out, why not kick them out when they are still useful to you, if they’re awful. When you wait till you’ve taken all you can get before disposing of them that tells me you kicked them out because the time was finally convenient for you to do it, not because their horrible nature had escalated. ‘Waiter! This soup is bitter. It’s making me sick. it’s entirely inedible, but I drank the last drop of it. Now that there’s no more left, I want my money back. Take this plate away.”


Steve you keep saying we don’t know what happened, but you know good and well that 1977 Lindsey was harder to deal with than 2017 Lindsay. You’re just being coy and contrary, for kicks.

[SteveMacD]

But Stevie on her In Your Dreams and 24KG tours, said she's not doing the same songs again; she lied. This tour has same old songs. Same capes. Same video material. Same crackhead dance and spins. It makes her money but is there integrity with that? Do you ever critique Stevie?
I took those comments being specific to that tour, not in perpetuity. And, let’s be honest, the band was moving on from that strategy by the end of the last tour.

Again, I’ve dogged Stevie a lot over the years. I have zero expectations from her. She’s an entertainer first and foremost.
When should Lindsey have released this album? He worked on LBCM in 2016. In 2016, I'm guessing they were hoping for Stevie to join them; she didn't decided to tour until late August of 2016. 2017 was dedicated to LBCM.
He was fired in late January, 2018.

I would have released the new album in April, 2018 and enjoyed the free publicity from the band’s media blitz with Finn and Campbell. I mean, he was publicly getting thrown under the bus AND there was a #TeamLindsey movement behind him. He should have used all of it to his advantage.

Get a webcam, do a weekly acoustic song on YouTube/Facebook/IG/Twitter and promote the upcoming album. Then hit the road in late May/early June and stay on the road until the end of the year, still releasing the comp in October.

A golden opportunity that no amount of promotion could ever top just landed in his lap and in classic Lindsey fashion, he blew it.

I mean, wasn’t the fact he wanted to tour this album on Fleetwood Mac’s off nights one of the points of contention during the tour negotiations?

[SteveMacD]

riiiight........ because coked out of his mind mean drunk a**holish 70s Lindsey was somehow ok. but down to earth sober nice now-Lindsey is not ok.

A-hole Lindsey wrote Monday Morning, I’m So Afraid, Second Hand News, and Go Your Own Way. He actually knew how to rock.

[elle]

if the reason to oust Lindsey was that he's such an ahole, then he should have been ousted when he in fact was an ahole.

or that was not the reason, and someone else is a huge self-important diva ahole these days, powerful enough to push their agenda against what everyone else in the band wanted.


current Lindsey wrote On The Wrong Side, Rock Away Blind, That's The Way Love Goes and Love Is Here To Stay. he doesn't need to be an ahole, young, drunk or high in order to write a great song.

[jmn3]

I think it’s the goofiest, cheesiest, most washed up disgraceful display I’ve ever witnessed. I guess I expect more out of “creative visionaries.” How anybody is okay seeing a “Broadway show” instead of a rock show baffles me.

Ah well, here's Steve the contrarian again. So, look, I agree that one of the things that bothers me the most about Lindsey's approach to live playing is this obsession with recreating the studio sound and filling in the gaps with technology instead of recreating the songs to work on stage and having actual humans doing the backing vocals and all of that. BUT, your description of Lindsey's show is really ridiculous and over the top. If that's the goofiest, cheesiest, most washed up disgraceful display you've ever witnessed, you should get out more. I saw his show in September 2021 and I didn't feel cheated nor did I feel like I was watching a Broadway musical at any point in the show. Even in those parts where it was clear as friggin day that a computer was enhancing the sound(s). It was a rock show and I walked away feeling like I paid for a great night and my ears were ringing.

[jmn3]

if the reason to oust Lindsey was that he's such an ahole, then he should have been ousted when he in fact was an ahole.

or that was not the reason, and someone else is a huge self-important diva ahole these days, powerful enough to push their agenda against what everyone else in the band wanted.


current Lindsey wrote On The Wrong Side, Rock Away Blind, That's The Way Love Goes and Love Is Here To Stay. he doesn't need to be an ahole, young, drunk or high in order to write a great song.

If he has always been an abusive ahole, why did she rejoin FM for The Dance or afterward? Why was there the foursome for nearly 15 years? He was clearly a giant jerk during the entire SYW process...so why did she go back in 2009? Why in 2013 or immediately again in 2014? Oh that's right, because she needed him to make money.

[SteveMacD]

Ah well, here's Steve the contrarian again.
Heaven forbid I have opinions that don’t line up with others.

So, look, I agree that one of the things that bothers me the most about Lindsey's approach to live playing is this obsession with recreating the studio sound and filling in the gaps with technology instead of recreating the songs to work on stage and having actual humans doing the backing vocals and all of that. BUT, your description of Lindsey's show is really ridiculous and over the top. If that's the goofiest, cheesiest, most washed up disgraceful display you've ever witnessed, you should get out more.
After seeing Guided by Voices, Pearl Jam, Richard Thompson, Bob Mould, Clapton, Steve Wiwood, The Byrds, the Rolling Stones, McCartney, CSNY, Heart, and and countless other artists across many genres, I stand by that comment.

I saw his show in September 2021 and I didn't feel cheated nor did I feel like I was watching a Broadway musical at any point in the show. Even in those parts where it was clear as friggin day that a computer was enhancing the sound(s). It was a rock show and I walked away feeling like I paid for a great night and my ears were ringing.
The Broadway comment was something he told a fan, someone on here. I believe, at a M&G. His approach is off putting to me. I was done in 2006 with the stipulation unless Christine miraculously came back.

[bombaysaffires]

Heaven forbid I have opinions that don’t line up with others.


After seeing Guided by Voices, Pearl Jam, Richard Thompson, Bob Mould, Clapton, Steve Wiwood, The Byrds, the Rolling Stones, McCartney, CSNY, Heart, and and countless other artists across many genres, I stand by that comment.


The Broadway comment was something he told a fan, someone on here. I believe, at a M&G. His approach is off putting to me. I was done in 2006 with the stipulation unless Christine miraculously came back.

IIRC, the "Broadway show" comment was part of him talking about FM shows, not his solo shows, in particular the "playing a role" the fans expect stuff with Stevie, ie the hand-holding, the gazing at each other, etc.... You know, the stuff both Stevie and Mick were/are all about to sell tickets... give the shippers what they want. It was part of a larger conversation in which he also mentioned that his wife wasn't bothered by it because she and all of his family understood it was a show and he was playing a role onstage. I'd be most interested to see where he's referred to his solo stuff as a Broadway show.

[SteveMacD]

IIRC, the "Broadway show" comment was part of him talking about FM shows, not his solo shows, in particular the "playing a role" the fans expect stuff with Stevie, ie the hand-holding, the gazing at each other, etc.... You know, the stuff both Stevie and Mick were/are all about to sell tickets... give the shippers what they want. It was part of a larger conversation in which he also mentioned that his wife wasn't bothered by it because she and all of his family understood it was a show and he was playing a role onstage. I'd be most interested to see where he's referred to his solo stuff as a Broadway show.

The way I read it was specifically in the context of the prerecords.

[justcrazylove]

Heaven forbid I have opinions that donÂ’t line up with others.


After seeing Guided by Voices, Pearl Jam, Richard Thompson, Bob Mould, Clapton, Steve Wiwood, The Byrds, the Rolling Stones, McCartney, CSNY, Heart, and and countless other artists across many genres, I stand by that comment.


The Broadway comment was something he told a fan, someone on here. I believe, at a M&G. His approach is off putting to me. I was done in 2006 with the stipulation unless Christine miraculously came back.

There it is everyone, a reference no one asked for, a reference no one cares about. Steve your being a contrarian has nothing to do with a difference of opinion, it is your complete refusal to reason, or hold a debate based on logic and/or stay on point. It's ****ing exhausting and every time you bring up some F-grade musician that no one on this board cares about as a means to somehow strengthen your argument. But ok, you know Broadway, you know what constitutes music and art.

I think I've finally settled my opinion after nearly 20 years of reading your crap. You're right, we're all wrong. Lindsey is trash, Stevie is the reason Fleetwood Mac is successful blah blah blah....

I have never disagreed with you more, Brett has passed away I booked flights from Broken Hill Australia, in the middle of the outback to Paris to see the European tour. Our band is dying and you bring up Richard Thompson...... **** off. and frankly after 20 years on this board and as one of the most respectful posters god I'm sick of you. Imagine if the young impressionable fan I was in 2002 listened to your opinion over ChilliD.... what a warped view of the history of the band I would have.

[justcrazylove]

I'm sorry to jam all these 'pre-programed' samples/patches/not real music down your throat. Just wanted to point out the staggering hypocrisy of an ideological conversation with Steve.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aghn0df0M5s

[SteveMacD]

Steve your being a contrarian has nothing to do with a difference of opinion, it is your complete refusal to reason, or hold a debate based on logic and/or stay on point.
What point? That I don’t dig the prerecords? Enough has come out that the band didn’t dig them, either. It’s goofy, especially for someone who claims to be an artistic genius. Just rearrange the songs, i.e. “Over My Head” 75-77. There are plenty of artists who do actual art out there. Also, Clapton, Winwood, Pearl Jam, and CSNY are going to be pissed at being called F-List celebrities.

It's ****ing exhausting and every time you bring up some F-grade musician that no one on this board cares about as a means to somehow strengthen your argument.
Lindsey is claiming to be something he’s not and there are countless examples of artists who prove it every single day. Sorry you’re too lazy to figure out that point.

But ok, you know Broadway, you know what constitutes music and art.
“Broadway” was Lindsey’s comment, not mine. Broadway, to me, isn’t rock.

For the record, I wrote off Fleetwood Mac in 2006 unless Christine ever came back. I was and am kind of sick with both Stevie and Lindsey.

I think I've finally settled my opinion after nearly 20 years of reading your crap. You're right, we're all wrong. Lindsey is trash, Stevie is the reason Fleetwood Mac is successful blah blah blah....
If you’ve paid any attention to my posts over the past 20 years, I typically give credit to Mick, John, and Christine for that, but go on…

I have never disagreed with you more, Brett has passed away I booked flights from Broken Hill Australia, in the middle of the outback to Paris to see the European tour. Our band is dying and you bring up Richard Thompson...... **** off.
This discussion predates Brett’s passing and has nothing to do with him. The first time I ever saw Brett and actually met him was at a Mick Fleetwood’s Zoo show in 1992, five years before he was part of Fleetwood Mac’s entourage. I was thrilled for him that he got to be part of it.

and frankly after 20 years on this board and as one of the most respectful posters god I'm sick of you. Imagine if the young impressionable fan I was in 2002 listened to your opinion over ChilliD.... what a warped view of the history of the band I would have.
Hate to tell you, but SteveD agreed with me on Lindsey. We were both posting on FM News on FB about being okay with Finn and Campbell. He was thrilled Lindsey was out of the band. In fact, we agreed on almost all of the band’s history.

[justcrazylove]

What point? That I don’t dig the prerecords? Enough has come out that the band didn’t dig them, either. It’s goofy, especially for someone who claims to be an artistic genius. Just rearrange the songs, i.e. “Over My Head” 75-77. There are plenty of artists who do actual art out there. Also, Clapton, Winwood, Pearl Jam, and CSNY are going to be pissed at being called F-List celebrities.


Lindsey is claiming to be something he’s not and there are countless examples of artists who prove it every single day. Sorry you’re too lazy to figure out that point.


“Broadway” was Lindsey’s comment, not mine. Broadway, to me, isn’t rock.

For the record, I wrote off Fleetwood Mac in 2006 unless Christine ever came back. I was and am kind of sick with both Stevie and Lindsey.


If you’ve paid any attention to my posts over the past 20 years, I typically give credit to Mick, John, and Christine for that, but go on…


This discussion predates Brett’s passing and has nothing to do with him. The first time I ever saw Brett and actually met him was at a Mick Fleetwood’s Zoo show in 1992, five years before he was part of Fleetwood Mac’s entourage. I was thrilled for him that he got to be part of it.


Hate to tell you, but SteveD agreed with me on Lindsey. We were both posting on FM News on FB about being okay with Finn and Campbell. He was thrilled Lindsey was out of the band. In fact, we agreed on almost all of the band’s history.

You insufferable egotist.

[SteveMacD]

You insufferable egotist.

That’s how we referred to each other since 1995. I was SteveMacD and he was SteveD. Sorry our shorthand offends you.

[SteveMacD]

For the record…
Ok, by special request, I'm here.


"Cover band"?? So what?

Tom Petty & The Heartbreakers were pretty much a cover band....look how many tunes they played in concert from artists like the Yardbirds, the Kinks, the Animals, Them, Cbuck Berry, the Rolling Stones, Thunderclap Newman, John Lee Hooker, Booker T & The MG's, the Traveling Wilburys...and, Fleetwood Mac (among dozens & dozens of others)...and all those bands did covers as well.

Stevie's covered at least TWO Tom Petty tunes (not counting "Stop Draggin'....") in concert and on album. So, with Mike Campbell in the band now, of COURSE they're going to play a Tom Petty tune or two...my guess is the obvious ones, "I Need To Know" & "Free Fallin'"

EVERY band covers other people...it's a NORMAL thing. Especially, bands who have many personnel changes, the next in line play songs by previous personnel.

And, again, Fleetwood Mac has had 18 members (11 guitarists) and your world is ending because ONE of them isn't in the band anymore?

JEZZZZUSSSSS people pull your heads out, take a valium, smoke a joint, whatever your vice is & get it together.

There's new blood in Fleetwood Mac...not like it hasn't happened before. When Lindsey & Stevie joined they were incarnation #10, TEN!! Personnel changes are a Fleetwood Mac fact of life! The aboration is that they've gone as long as they have without one.

Buckingham is a musician, he was planning a solo tour & album and guess what? He'll keep making music. Just not with Fleetwood Mac. NOT THE END OF THE WORLD. In fact, he'll probably be MORE prolific now that he doesn't have to compromise with the rest of the band.

As SteveMacD pointed out...even Lindsey & Stevie had to "pay their dues" by doing songs by previous Fleetwood Mac members...I don't recall people slashing their wrists or going on verbal tirades because of it. Grow TF UP!!!

Fleetwood Mac is dead....LONG LIVE FLEETWOOD MAC!!!

[John Run]

Every thread becomes the same circular discussion. It is such a joyless place here now. Each thread, every subsequent reply, a race to see who can be degraded next, who can be made to feel worse.

Smile some folks, being nice to one another brings so much more joy than spending every waking minute trying to win an argument, where there is no winner, because opinion and taste are subjective.

[UnwindedDreams]

For the recordÂ…
Was 2018 Fleetwood Mac the first lineup debut that didn't perform new songs?
Billy and Rick performed the new Tango songs. Lindsey and Stevie did songs in 1975 that went on The White Album.

Edit: I hope you have a fantastic birthday.

[bwboy]

Was 2018 Fleetwood Mac the first lineup debut that didn't perform new songs?
Billy and Rick performed the new Tango songs. Lindsey and Stevie did songs in 1975 that went on The White Album.

FM toured twice in the 2000s without performing new music that I remember- the Unleashed Tour, aka their greatest hits, and the tour where Christine rejoined. As for the 2018 tour not having new music, I understand you meant new recorded music, but for them to sing Black Magic Woman, All Over Again, Don’t Dream It’s Over, Free Falling, and I Got You, well that was all new music to me. I only wish Neil had performed Man of the World in the US. I have always loved that song and wished SOMEONE in FM would have sang it live in the last 25 years!

[justcrazylove]

Every thread becomes the same circular discussion. It is such a joyless place here now. Each thread, every subsequent reply, a race to see who can be degraded next, who can be made to feel worse.

Smile some folks, being nice to one another brings so much more joy than spending every waking minute trying to win an argument, where there is no winner, because opinion and taste are subjective.

I agree, even if in this instance I was both the instigator and the culprit.

I asked a question earlier this week in one of the seldom times I've posted, it was a question relevant to this thread and was totally ignored.

We are losing people within this community who hold a wealth of information and expertise regarding this band. What is left is conversations about samples, Richard Thompson, how Stevie is *insert horrible name tinged in misogyny* and how Lindsey is a monster. BORING

[justcrazylove]

FM toured twice in the 2000s without performing new music that I remember- the Unleashed Tour, aka their greatest hits, and the tour where Christine rejoined. As for the 2018 tour not having new music, I understand you meant new recorded music, but for them to sing Black Magic Woman, All Over Again, Don’t Dream It’s Over, Free Falling, and I Got You, well that was all new music to me. I only wish Neil had performed Man of the World in the US. I have always loved that song and wished SOMEONE in FM would have sang it live in the last 25 years!

Unleashed was the first-time IKINW (sorry in 2004 it made a late appearance), Storms and the full band GI was performed; in addition, to the terrible SYLM cover. These are not new songs but were vital to keeping FM as a touring act interesting.

[bwboy]

Unleashed was the first-time IKINW (sorry in 2004 it made a late appearance), Storms and the full band GI was performed; in addition, to the terrible SYLM cover. These are not new songs but were vital to keeping FM as a touring act interesting.

Good points. That 2004 tour is where I fell in love with IKINW- for some reason that song didn’t do anything for me on Tusk, but when FM played it live, the song blew me away! So damn catchy! I think it may have taken a while to grow on me because the chorus doesn’t kick in until well into the song. And Storms has always been a favorite of mine, and I was bummed they dropped it in 2018 before I got to see them.

I really wish FM would have toured when they rereleased their Deluxe Editions- how I would have loved a tour where they played Tusk, but also Sara, IKINW, Storms, Think About Me, Brown Eyes, and some more. Or imagine a tour with Mirage songs- not just Gypsy, but also Hold Me, Love in Store, Eyes of the World, Wish You Were Here, That’s Alright, and Book of Love. Lost opportunities, but honestly I would have rather heard those deep cuts instead of new material like the EP or Say You Will.

I’m curious how you feel about deep cuts versus new material- do you think more deep cuts would have kept FM tours more interesting?

[UnwindedDreams]

FM toured twice in the 2000s without performing new music that I remember- the Unleashed Tour, aka their greatest hits, and the tour where Christine rejoined. As for the 2018 tour not having new music, I understand you meant new recorded music, but for them to sing Black Magic Woman, All Over Again, Don’t Dream It’s Over, Free Falling, and I Got You, well that was all new music to me. I only wish Neil had performed Man of the World in the US. I have always loved that song and wished SOMEONE in FM would have sang it live in the last 25 years!
Hi bwboy, I wrote lineup debut. Unleashed was not a lineup debut. And I don't mean recorded music either, on the Time Tour they sang new songs that were not released yet.

Interesting about those 2018 performances being new music to you! If they had performed "Baby Got Back" in 2018, would that have been new music?

[SteveMacD]

I agree, even if in this instance I was both the instigator and the culprit.

I asked a question earlier this week in one of the seldom times I've posted, it was a question relevant to this thread and was totally ignored.

We are losing people within this community who hold a wealth of information and expertise regarding this band. What is left is conversations about samples, Richard Thompson, how Stevie is *insert horrible name tinged in misogyny* and how Lindsey is a monster. BORING

Do you know how I even landed on Richard Thompson’s music? Lindsey and Richard are/were consistently compared to one another in way too many guitar magazines because they’re both brilliant acoustic and electric lead guitarists. Curiosity got the better of me, and only about a decade ago. It’s not some out of nowhere reference.

[bwboy]

Hi bwboy, I wrote lineup debut. Unleashed was not a lineup debut. And I don't mean recorded music either, on the Time Tour they sang new songs that were not released yet.

Interesting about those 2018 performances being new music to you! If they had performed "Baby Got Back" in 2018, would that have been new music?

I had to look up who sang Baby Got Back- well, I have a hard time picturing Lindsey singing it, but I do think Christine could pull it off LOL! But I guess since FM had written Black Magic Woman, and since Neil had written DDIO and IGY, and since Christine had written AOA, I don’t see those as covers. Free Falling, I see that as a cover, but I don’t mind, I appreciated the sentiment behind it. And Blue Letter is one of my favorite FM songs. I just don’t care who wrote a particular song or who recorded it first, ultimately. I’d never heard FM perform those songs before, so to me, it was like new music.

I would love to hear your thoughts about deep cuts versus new material.

[UnwindedDreams]

I had to look up who sang Baby Got Back- well, I have a hard time picturing Lindsey singing it, but I do think Christine could pull it off LOL! But I guess since FM had written Black Magic Woman, and since Neil had written DDIO and IGY, and since Christine had written AOA, I don’t see those as covers. Free Falling, I see that as a cover, but I don’t mind, I appreciated the sentiment behind it. And Blue Letter is one of my favorite FM songs. I just don’t care who wrote a particular song or who recorded it first, ultimately. I’d never heard FM perform those songs before, so to me, it was like new music.

I would love to hear your thoughts about deep cuts versus new material.
Black Magic Woman, Man of the World, Tell Me, Oh Well, Hypnotized aren't covers to me because it's a Fleetwood Mac concert and those are FM songs. But I don't want to hear them, HA!
I like deep cuts but I'm a Stevie fan so the 2018 set was disappointing for me. I did see four shows.
The only Stevie deep cut was Storms and it wasn't a surprise because she did it 80 times on Unleashed. I buy a ticket for a FM show with Stevie in the lineup to hear songs from albums that Stevie was on. I don't want to hear Stevie sing Black Magic Woman, Don't Dream It's Over, I Got You, and Free Fallin, I want to hear Crystal, Love is Dangerous, Angel and I Don't Want To Know. But I know there's an audience for pre-Nicks material so I know 2018 was perfect for them, though it was still a pretty hits heavy set which I get the band has to please people.

[DownOnRodeo]

I booked flights from Broken Hill Australia, in the middle of the outback to Paris to see the European tour.

That's amazing! It will be such a memorable trip. The British band members are getting very frail. But Lindsey keeps healthy and is at the top of his game. You won't regret your trek to see him in concert on the other side of the world.

[SteveMacD]

Free Falling, I see that as a cover,
Even then, Mike co-produced and played guitar on the original as well as Stevie’s solo version, so it’s not a total cover anymore than the Peter Green stuff was a cover.

[bwboy]

Black Magic Woman, Man of the World, Tell Me, Oh Well, Hypnotized aren't covers to me because it's a Fleetwood Mac concert and those are FM songs. But I don't want to hear them, HA!
I like deep cuts but I'm a Stevie fan so the 2018 set was disappointing for me. I did see four shows.
The only Stevie deep cut was Storms and it wasn't a surprise because she did it 80 times on Unleashed. I buy a ticket for a FM show with Stevie in the lineup to hear songs from albums that Stevie was on. I don't want to hear Stevie sing Black Magic Woman, Don't Dream It's Over, I Got You, and Free Fallin, I want to hear Crystal, Love is Dangerous, Angel and I Don't Want To Know. But I know there's an audience for pre-Nicks material so I know 2018 was perfect for them, though it was still a pretty hits heavy set which I get the band has to please people.

Thanks, UnwindedDreams! I see your point about how some of those songs you don’t consider covers, but you still didn’t want to hear them live. Crystal and I Don’t Want to Know are two of my absolute favorite FM songs, and I really was hoping Stevie and Neil would have performed them on that tour. I think Neil would have done a great job on both of them. I hated when Stevie redid Crystal- ugh. But if she had just sang the chorus and let Neil sing the rest, I would have loved it to heard it live. And Angel and Love is Dangerous would have been nice, too. I would have even taken Freedom, considering she wrote it with Mike Campbell- that would have been pretty ballsy of them to perform.

[SteveMacD]

if the reason to oust Lindsey was that he's such an ahole, then he should have been ousted when he in fact was an ahole.
That’s a strawman. Nobody said he was fired for being an a-hole.

current Lindsey wrote On The Wrong Side, Rock Away Blind, That's The Way Love Goes and Love Is Here To Stay.
Not helping your argument.

[SteveMacD]

Was 2018 Fleetwood Mac the first lineup debut that didn't perform new songs?
Technically the 1987 tour didn’t have any new to them songs in the setlist. Yeah, TITN was new and they played new songs from it, but it wasn’t recorded by that particular lineup. It’s really not too different from the 2018 playing “All Over Again” in 2018.

I hope you have a fantastic birthday.
Thanks! It was alright (except for the old lady getting into a fender bender).

[UnwindedDreams]

It’s really not too different from the 2018 playing “All Over Again” in 2018.
But 23 years after All Over Again was released? Maybe 2018-2019 should have been called the Time Tour:laugh:

[Mr Scarrott]

But 23 years after All Over Again was released? Maybe 2018-2019 should have been called the Time Tour:laugh:

Or perhaps they should have "called time" on the whole endeavour. Having said that there were some left-field and welcome additions to the set,particularly early on. It's a pity that they would have sailed over the heads of the vast majority of the crowds as they headed to the loos or bar.

I suspect that will be the end of things, Christine's been telegraphing that fairly clearly. A closing EP and a couple of gigs from the five would be nice but I doubt that there's much chance of that.

An end without a proper ending, I think.

[jmn3]

I really wish FM would have toured when they rereleased their Deluxe Editions- how I would have loved a tour where they played Tusk, but also Sara, IKINW, Storms, Think About Me, Brown Eyes, and some more. Or imagine a tour with Mirage songs- not just Gypsy, but also Hold Me, Love in Store, Eyes of the World, Wish You Were Here, That’s Alright, and Book of Love. Lost opportunities, but honestly I would have rather heard those deep cuts instead of new material like the EP or Say You Will.

Once it became clear that she wasn't going to record with Lindsey anymore, this is exactly how I would have wanted them to handle some of the tours. 2009 was the perfect opportunity. It was the 30th anniversary of Tusk. THAT should have been when they released the Deluxe Tusk and that should have been the tour, instead of Unleashed (since that was a stupid way of just saying "a tour for the sake of touring). I know Fleetwood Mac is too conservative and just generally dumb to actually play the whole album (in particular Tusk, especially without Christine)...but I would have rather seen a 2009 Tour that did a big Tusk set within the setlist. Same in 2012 (instead of 2013) with Mirage. When Chris came back - the obvious choice would have been to play all of Rumours live similar to what Eagles have been doing with Hotel California.

Something like the below for Tusk in 2009. But there isn't even any chance they would have done this out of fear that the audience would have been all :distress: for the first half.

Tusk
Angel
I Know I'm Not Wrong
Sara
Save Me a Place
Storms
Beautiful Child
Not That Funny
What Makes You Think You're The One
Sisters of the Moon
Big Love
Landslide
The Chain
Dreams
Go Insane
Rhiannon
Oh Well
Gold Dust Woman
I'm So Afraid
Stand Back
Go Your Own Way
World Turning
Don't Stop
Silver Springs

[bwboy]

Once it became clear that she wasn't going to record with Lindsey anymore, this is exactly how I would have wanted them to handle some of the tours. 2009 was the perfect opportunity. It was the 30th anniversary of Tusk. THAT should have been when they released the Deluxe Tusk and that should have been the tour, instead of Unleashed (since that was a stupid way of just saying "a tour for the sake of touring). I know Fleetwood Mac is too conservative and just generally dumb to actually play the whole album (in particular Tusk, especially without Christine)...but I would have rather seen a 2009 Tour that did a big Tusk set within the setlist. Same in 2012 (instead of 2013) with Mirage. When Chris came back - the obvious choice would have been to play all of Rumours live similar to what Eagles have been doing with Hotel California.

Something like the below for Tusk in 2009. But there isn't even any chance they would have done this out of fear that the audience would have been all :distress: for the first half.

Tusk
Angel
I Know I'm Not Wrong
Sara
Save Me a Place
Storms
Beautiful Child
Not That Funny
What Makes You Think You're The One
Sisters of the Moon
Big Love
Landslide
The Chain
Dreams
Go Insane
Rhiannon
Oh Well
Gold Dust Woman
I'm So Afraid
Stand Back
Go Your Own Way
World Turning
Don't Stop
Silver Springs

Wow! That is a kick ass setlist! You’re right about the audience not being able to handle it though, but in all fairness, Tusk took years to be appreciated by most folks, including fans like me, so I can see how a casual fan would actually be turned off by that first half of the setlist. FM has a plethora of fantastic material, but spent too many tours sticking to most of the same songs, until recently, anyway. And now it’s too late. But your setlist would make for an unbelievable show.

[jmn3]

Wow! That is a kick ass setlist! You’re right about the audience not being able to handle it though, but in all fairness, Tusk took years to be appreciated by most folks, including fans like me, so I can see how a casual fan would actually be turned off by that first half of the setlist. FM has a plethora of fantastic material, but spent too many tours sticking to most of the same songs, until recently, anyway. And now it’s too late. But your setlist would make for an unbelievable show.

I think they had the opportunity to put on a great show with much more diversity that challenged the audience. I attended some Springsteen shows where he played full albums and not every Bruce album is full of singles (a la Born in the USA). I'm not nearly as into him as I am Fleetwood Mac and you know what, I still found myself able to enjoy the show. I think if it was billed as a Tusk show where we're going to play a partial Tusk set, it's okay. In that example, you still get most of the hit parade that people expect.

Mirage sans Christine is a bit harder. There isn't enough songs to do where you could devote/open half the show with a Mirage set unless you're going to have S&L doing Christine's songs. I could see them try it with Hold Me and get results that wouldn't be any worse than what actually happened in 2009 with Say You Love Me. I still think a 2012 Tour with a Mirage-focused mini-set would have been highly preferably to another tour with mostly the same set.

[UnwindedDreams]

He was fired in late January, 2018.

I would have released the new album in April, 2018 and enjoyed the free publicity from the band’s media blitz with Finn and Campbell. I mean, he was publicly getting thrown under the bus AND there was a #TeamLindsey movement behind him. He should have used all of it to his advantage.

Get a webcam, do a weekly acoustic song on YouTube/Facebook/IG/Twitter and promote the upcoming album. Then hit the road in late May/early June and stay on the road until the end of the year, still releasing the comp in October.

A golden opportunity that no amount of promotion could ever top just landed in his lap and in classic Lindsey fashion, he blew it.

I mean, wasn’t the fact he wanted to tour this album on Fleetwood Mac’s off nights one of the points of contention during the tour negotiations?
I would have loved if the self titled album was released in April of 2018 or even February. IIRC, in the months after Irving called him, Lindsey was trying to get back into the band. I disagree with that because I think he should have just accepted going solo and focused on shopping his album to a label. Mick and John were the only ones who responded to him and said they needed time to reflect or they're not supposed to speak to him(LB). I'm guessing during that time he was also meeting with attorney and getting his stuff together to file suit.
I wonder if Warner Music, Reprise, Rhino or whoever his record contract is with told him not to release new music but do a compliation instead. If they did, they were right because that sold more than his self-titled album.

And I never understood why Sheryl Louis or Stubner had a problem with Lindsey playing on off nights. As if he was taking ticket buyers away from an FM show!

[bwboy]

I wonder if Warner Music, Reprise, Rhino or whoever his record contract is with told him not to release new music but do a compliation instead. If they did, they were right because that sold more than his self-titled album.

And I never understood why Sheryl Louis or Stubner had a problem with Lindsey playing on off nights. As if he was taking ticket buyers away from an FM show!

I would almost definitively say that most artists have 0 control over when a product is released, so posts saying Lindsey should have released his album on so and so date kind of makes me chuckle. Like you, I’m certain the record company makes that decision.

I also COMPLETELY understand why not just the folks you mention (whom I have no idea who they are) but also the other members of FM would have a problem with Lindsey performing solo concerts on their nights off. I believe 100% that ticket sales for FM would have been impacted. Lindsey fans would not only be able to see him perform FM songs, but at a lower price in a smaller venue- why wouldn’t Lindsey fans do that? Just imagine if Stevie asked to do the same thing- they would have said no, and for the same reasons. But even beyond ticket sales being impacted, I believe Lindsey’s performances with FM would not be at peak performance, certainly not at the same level as his solo concerts would be. I would say that about absolutely anyone- Lindsey, Stevie, you name ‘em. We caught a glimpse of that with the 2 big shows that occurred. A solo tour with music he loves, much of which he hadn’t performed live often, and then with FM singing some of the same songs? Just my opinion.

[UnwindedDreams]

I would almost definitively say that most artists have 0 control over when a product is released, so posts saying Lindsey should have released his album on so and so date kind of makes me chuckle. Like you, I’m certain the record company makes that decision.

I also COMPLETELY understand why not just the folks you mention (whom I have no idea who they are) but also the other members of FM would have a problem with Lindsey performing solo concerts on their nights off. I believe 100% that ticket sales for FM would have been impacted. Lindsey fans would not only be able to see him perform FM songs, but at a lower price in a smaller venue- why wouldn’t Lindsey fans do that? Just imagine if Stevie asked to do the same thing- they would have said no, and for the same reasons. But even beyond ticket sales being impacted, I believe Lindsey’s performances with FM would not be at peak performance, certainly not at the same level as his solo concerts would be. I would say that about absolutely anyone- Lindsey, Stevie, you name ‘em. We caught a glimpse of that with the 2 big shows that occurred. A solo tour with music he loves, much of which he hadn’t performed live often, and then with FM singing some of the same songs? Just my opinion.
I'll buy your opinion about him not having the same energy at FM shows.
But I don't think Lindsey performing on off nights would have affected FM ticket sales. I believe the 800-1,000 people who see Lindsey would probably be going to an FM show as well or are just Lindsey fans and wouldn't go see FM with him in it or not in it.
I'm the person who'd go to both shows.

[elle]

And I never understood why Sheryl Louis or Stubner had a problem with Lindsey playing on off nights. As if he was taking ticket buyers away from an FM show!

they did not. nobody in the band or among managers had a problem with that. the only problem was Stevie trying to find an excuse to push Lindsey out after BuckVie happened. and she found a willing co-conspirator in Azoff.

[vivfox]

I also COMPLETELY understand why the other members of FM would have a problem with Lindsey performing solo concerts on their nights off. I believe 100% that ticket sales for FM would have been impacted. Lindsey fans would not only be able to see him perform FM songs, but at a lower price in a smaller venue- why wouldn’t Lindsey fans do that? Just imagine if Stevie asked to do the same thing- they would have said no, and for the same reasons.

I'm not sure you fully understand the power Stevie holds over the rest of FM. Stevie doesn't need their permission for anything. She tells them what she's going to do and they follow suit. Before BuckVie was a duet album it was a FM album and there was Stevie at the exact same time recording a solo album in Nashville. And then during a FM tour she did a Rolling stone interview and magazine cover to promote her solo record.

[UnwindedDreams]

I'm not sure you fully understand the power Stevie holds over the rest of FM. Stevie doesn't need their permission for anything. She tells them what she's going to do and they follow suit. Before BuckVie was a duet album it was a FM album and there was Stevie at the exact same time recording a solo album in Nashville. And then during a FM tour she did a Rolling stone interview and magazine cover to promote her solo record.
I don't remember that 2015 RS piece with her even discussing her album. I think it was mostly about her and Lindsey:laugh:

[bwboy]

I'll buy your opinion about him not having the same energy at FM shows.
But I don't think Lindsey performing on off nights would have affected FM ticket sales. I believe the 800-1,000 people who see Lindsey would probably be going to an FM show as well or are just Lindsey fans and wouldn't go see FM with him in it or not in it.
I'm the person who'd go to both shows.

Maybe you’re right and 800-1,000 people wouldn’t have much of an impact on FM ticket sales. I guess it just seems counter productive to the band’s interest to me. I really can’t imagine anyone wouldn’t have a fit if Stevie had asked to do the same thing, or if Glen Frey asked the Eagles if he could do solo dates in between their tour dates.

I saw FM and LB in November 2018, and it was phenomenal. Two fabulous shows! And thanks to Hawkeye, I had a 2nd row seat for Lindsey, as well as the good fortune of sitting next to a really nice guy who was a big fan of both LB and FM. He was really knowledgeable about both and knew every song, which was so cool to be around someone like that. And seeing Christine front and center a couple of times with FM, instead of staying in her usual corner, was so refreshing and a highlight for me. Seeing her so much more confident made that the best FM tour I’d ever seen out of 5 tours.

[SteveMacD]

If they did, they were right because that sold more than his self-titled album
To be fair, a best of retrospective for an artist like Linsey solo is going to sell more anyway. An album of new material released in the midst of a scandal benefits from the publicity.

For example, I doubt anyone would put “Heroes Are Hard To Find” above “Mystery To Me” or “Bare Trees,” but that’s the one that cracked the Top 40.

“Fleetwood Mac” was selling at the same pace as the previous albums initially. Then “Over My Head” came out, however, it wasn’t until news came out that the McVies were divorcing and Stevie and Lindsey were having problems that the album skyrocketed.

And I never understood why Sheryl Louis or Stubner had a problem with Lindsey playing on off nights. As if he was taking ticket buyers away from an FM show!

I think it was probably Irving.

[SteveMacD]

I would almost definitively say that most artists have 0 control over when a product is released, so posts saying Lindsey should have released his album on so and so date kind of makes me chuckle. Like you, I’m certain the record company makes that decision.

Not entirely true.

Anyway, Fleetwood Mac went into the studio in July, 1974 to record HAHTF and it was released in September. Granted, it was rushed because of the lawsuit, but the band and label were able to protect the band and capitalize on the scandal, giving the band its first Top 40 album.

[UnwindedDreams]

And seeing Christine front and center a couple of times with FM, instead of staying in her usual corner, was so refreshing and a highlight for me. Seeing her so much more confident made that the best FM tour I’d ever seen out of 5 tours.
By Front and Center, do you mean that she played a solo during Black Magic Woman?
Because she was front and center during On With The Show for Everywhere and Songbird. And then for some songs on the LBCM tour.

[Macfan4life]

To be fair, a best of retrospective for an artist like Linsey solo is going to sell more anyway. An album of new material released in the midst of a scandal benefits from the publicity.

For example, I doubt anyone would put “Heroes Are Hard To Find” above “Mystery To Me” or “Bare Trees,” but that’s the one that cracked the Top 40.

“Fleetwood Mac” was selling at the same pace as the previous albums initially. Then “Over My Head” came out, however, it wasn’t until news came out that the McVies were divorcing and Stevie and Lindsey were having problems that the album skyrocketed.



I think it was probably Irving.
Well I am that person. I would put Heroes over Bare Trees. Both are great albums but I think its better than Bare Trees. Chart history has nothing to do with it. I would give Mystery To Me the top notch of albums pre-Buck Nicks. But Heroes is definitely not far behind.