MirageTango/Rumors2?

[BLY]

Big Love
Seven Wonders
Everywhere
Gypsy
Eyes of the World
Little Lies

Love in Store
Book of Love
That’s Alright
Tango in the Night
Hold Me
Wish You Were Here

[SteveMacD]

https://pisces.bbystatic.com/image2/BestBuy_US/images/products/2998/29989171_sa.jpg;maxHeight=640;maxWidth=550

[bwboy]

Big Love
Seven Wonders
Everywhere
Gypsy
Eyes of the World
Little Lies

Love in Store
Book of Love
That’s Alright
Tango in the Night
Hold Me
Wish You Were Here

Isn’t It Midnight and Straight Back would have to be on this to be perfect! Put Straight Back after Eyes of the World and Isn’t It Midnight after That’s Alright.

[Macfan4life]

I dont like the mixing of these albums. However they both have something in common, chasing commercial success. Mirage however holds up because its a group effort with everyone playing real instruments. There are a few good songs on Tango like the title track and Isn't It Midnight.
What made Rumours so successful was their creativity playing as a group. The post Tusk world of the band had them chasing radio play. I say this all the time but even though I like Tusk, it sort of ruined the band because everything post Tusk was (i.e. being anti commercial and completely creative) anti-Tusk.

[bwboy]

What made Rumours so successful was their creativity playing as a group. The post Tusk world of the band had them chasing radio play. I say this all the time but even though I like Tusk, it sort of ruined the band because everything post Tusk was (i.e. being anti commercial and completely creative) anti-Tusk.

FM and Rumours are incredible because there is a real group feeling on them. You can hear the three singers on most of the songs. Tusk pretty much destroyed that concept, unfortunately. They tried to bring it back with Mirage and Tango, but they didn’t try hard enough- both albums still have songs that sound like solo songs rather than group songs. The best songs mostly have all three singers on them. Tango is better only because of Christine, delivering her best songs in years, if not ever. Behind the Mask returned to that group mentality, which was great but didn’t last. Say You Will and Buck/Vie, more than ever, sound like solo songs.

[Macfan4life]

On another note....Nicks has incredible songs on Mirage. Gypsy and Straight Back are some of her best work. That's Alright is fantastic but Smile At You should have made the album. All of her songs are gems. Christine also had fantastic songs on Mirage and Tango.

[BLY]

I know this has been discussed to death but if “ The Group” after Tusk ..had no solo stuff and “The Band” let Lindsey lead in his vision we would still have FLEETWOOD MAC albums today. This is what I wanted from the start. No solo stuff.

[bwboy]

I know this has been discussed to death but if “ The Group” after Tusk ..had no solo stuff and “The Band” let Lindsey lead in his vision we would still have FLEETWOOD MAC albums today. This is what I wanted from the start. No solo stuff.

Could be true, we’ll never know for sure. But many of Lindsey’s songs didn’t include the band performing on them, and it shows. With Fleetwood Mac, I want songs that utilize the whole band.

[Villavic]

Hard to mix those albums, but my selection would be this, the order is not definitive:

Love in Store
You and I, Part II
That's Alright
Hold Me
Tango in the Night
Straight Back

Gypsy
Eyes of the World
Little Lies
Big Love
Isn't it Midnight
Seven Wonders
Everywhere

[aleuzzi]

Each of FM’s albums from 1975-1987 has its own unique personality and reflects a decisive approach to a specific aesthetic. They cannot be collapsed and combined. This is one of the reasons why, to date, there has not been a wholly satisfactory (as opposed to financially successful) compilation: the hits need to be sequenced alongside the non-hits in their original context. Groups like The Eagles and Doobie Brothers benefit from a greatest hits format because their individual albums are not as compelling as FM’s—and I would be ready to debate this with anyone.

Another note: I read a lot of blogs and posts saying that Tusk marked the beginning of the group fragmentation, the absence of all three principal singers on each of the songs, not to mention the instrumentalists. To some extent this is true, but there are A LOT of songs on Tusk that show off the full band and all three singers. And when this happens it’s magical. Same for Mirage. Tango’s another story...

[On Ice]

A lot of what if's around combining these two albums- I don't think they fit together- they're two completely different recordings of different eras. Eras seemed so much shorter in those days. Mirage, like the White Album, needed at least one more Nicks song- she was on fire at the time and Smile at You, with a little more work, would've been the show stopper of the album. Tango, essentially a Lindsey solo album that Christine came along and stoled the show- her songs are all career highs meanwhile Stevie completely implodes. Solo wise, I would've actually preferred Bella Donna and maybe the Wild Heart to be one offs and she return to the band fully engaged and committed. With more band work, I believe Christine and Lindsey would've abandoned the solo idea altogether. We may have had so many other albums by now. Alas, it's all now ancient history and we have albums and songs that some of us love, others hate, but a catalogue of great music nonetheless.

[HomerMcvie]

What if Bella Donna had been a flop? A BIG FLOP?

How would that have changed their future?

[Macfan4life]

What if Bella Donna had been a flop? A BIG FLOP?

How would that have changed their future?
OR
What if Mirage was released in 1981 postponing Bella Donna another year. Her drug abuse escalated during this time and maybe SDMHA would not be available. Robin would not have been around for Bella Donna. After her death her life started to spiral out of control. However we would have gotten a much longer White Winged Dove tour but it would not have been as good as 1981.

[aleuzzi]

The “what if” I often imagine is Lindsey actually fulfilling his tour commitment for TANGO. Just think of how exciting and cool that would have been, instead of the slick, wholly functional yet underwhelming experience it actually was.

[bwboy]

The “what if” I often imagine is Lindsey actually fulfilling his tour commitment for TANGO. Just think of how exciting and cool that would have been, instead of the slick, wholly functional yet underwhelming experience it actually was.

I didn’t see that tour, but I read some really positive reviews of it. Not that I disagree with your premise that Lindsey doing the tour wouldn’t have been great, but I don’t recall the words slick or underwhelming being used to describe it.

[Macfan4life]

I didn’t see that tour, but I read some really positive reviews of it. Not that I disagree with your premise that Lindsey doing the tour wouldn’t have been great, but I don’t recall the words slick or underwhelming being used to describe it.
I saw the tour and it was actually really good. My only complaint was the classic Mac songs were a bit conservative for a live performance. But that's understandable since there were 2 new guys. IMHO they did clever ways to spruce up the set in the absence of Lindsey:
Has Anyone Ever Written Anything For You (Christine on grand piano was........grand)
Stand Back - a surprise and a first time novelty
Don't Let Me Down Again - Buckingham/Nicks returns to the Mac
Brown Eyes - Their only song from Tusk
Blue Letter - Great encore
Isn't It Midnight

They did Sara in Europe and sadly there are no recordings of this floating around. I never cared for their version of the chain. It lacked intensity IMHO. I believe Lindsey's parts were sung by both Rick and Billy which made it sound cheezy IMHO. I could be wrong but I think the BTM tour, Lindsey's parts were only sung by Billy. Big improvement IMHO.
Having said all this, both tours without Lindsey never got great reviews. There was the constant "it takes 2 guitarists to replace Lindsey." Even in 1990 when they added a few more licks to their playing I remember the Pittsburgh Press making fun of Billy and Rick's bad Italian haircuts. It just was brutal. I love Lindsey and prefer him in the band but the farewell concert in late 1990 was one of my favorite Mac concerts of all time. So much energy and Chris and Stevie in their mini skirts. They were all having fun on stage. That was the last time to maybe On With the Show tour were they were having fun on stage. The Dance Christine was miserable and even Lindsey did not seem happy and going through the motions. When you watch some of those BTM shows on youtube, it truly was the last time everyone was having fun and the last of the arena rock days. By the time the late 90s came along, technology took over and everyone wanted to play live and sound like the record.

[blinker12]

Big Love
Seven Wonders
Everywhere
Gypsy
Eyes of the World
Little Lies

Love in Store
Book of Love
That’s Alright
Tango in the Night
Hold Me
Wish You Were Here

I love that you included “Book of Love,” that’s such an under appreciated gem IMO. Not sure how well all this would hang together as an album though. I think it’d feel more like just highlights of Mirage and Tango mooshed together. Pulling from the solo albums to add to Mirage would probably sound more cohesive.

[BLY]

I love that you included “Book of Love,” that’s such an under appreciated gem IMO. Not sure how well all this would hang together as an album though. I think it’d feel more like just highlights of Mirage and Tango mooshed together. Pulling from the solo albums to add to Mirage would probably sound more cohesive.


I really like the Book of Love version on the alt box set with Stevie’s voice more prominent …..kind like I feel about the Oh Daddy and I know I’m not Wrong alt versions.

[aleuzzi]

I didn’t see that tour, but I read some really positive reviews of it. Not that I disagree with your premise that Lindsey doing the tour wouldn’t have been great, but I don’t recall the words slick or underwhelming being used to describe it.

I’ve seen the video special of it and heard several songs from the tour. Slick and underwhelming are my words. And I stand by them.

[SteveMacD]

I didn’t see that tour, but I read some really positive reviews of it. Not that I disagree with your premise that Lindsey doing the tour wouldn’t have been great, but I don’t recall the words slick or underwhelming being used to describe it.

What if there had been a cure for schizophrenia in the ‘70s and the band decided to fire Lindsey during the Tusk tour?

[jbrownsjr]

The “what if” I often imagine is Lindsey actually fulfilling his tour commitment for TANGO. Just think of how exciting and cool that would have been, instead of the slick, wholly functional yet underwhelming experience it actually was.

I love the album Tango in the Night. I too wish he would have toured it. I might have changed the history of the band.

[Villavic]

What if there had been a cure for schizophrenia in the ‘70s and the band decided to fire Lindsey during the Tusk tour?

Not related with this post but when I read the word "schizophrenia" reminded me something I read in Mick's book. It was during the Rumours tour:

After twenty-three shows with only a day off here and there, traveling the length and breadth of the land, we were almost spent. Lindsey was so exhausted from fronting the band that he passed out in the shower in his Philadelphia hotel suite and was later diagnosed as having a mild form of epilepsy.

I'm not a doctor but does that exist? "mild epilepsy"? Can that appear when somebody is already an adult? It sounds to me more like a heavy stress. Is he still suffering that "mild" epilepsy?

[bwboy]

Not related with this post but when I read the word "schizophrenia" reminded me something I read in Mick's book. It was during the Rumours tour:

After twenty-three shows with only a day off here and there, traveling the length and breadth of the land, we were almost spent. Lindsey was so exhausted from fronting the band that he passed out in the shower in his Philadelphia hotel suite and was later diagnosed as having a mild form of epilepsy.

I'm not a doctor but does that exist? "mild epilepsy"? Can that appear when somebody is already an adult? It sounds to me more like a heavy stress. Is he still suffering that "mild" epilepsy?

I think seizure was the word SteveMacD meant to use in his post, but schizophrenia came up instead. And I love the way Mick phrased the incident, but he also could have added “Lindsey was so exhausted from fronting the band (and abusing drugs) that he passed out in the shower…” Just to be clear, it’s very possible that the seizure was solely medically related, but rampant drug use alongside all that could have also caused the seizure, especially if Lindsey had quit using for a bit and then started up again. Also, I think the incident occurred during the Tusk tour.

[Villavic]

. Also, I think the incident occurred during the Tusk tour.

I thought it, too. But when I looked for that episode in the book, the following paragraph says:

We finished the American leg of the Rumours tour and took a few days off in October, during which time Jenny moved us from rustic-but-removed Topanga to a New England colonial white clapboard home on Bellagio Drive in Bel Air.

[David]

Rolling Stone mag ran a Random Note about it (remember the Random Notes column?). I think they called it an epileptic seizure. It was at the Philadelphia stop on the 1978 tour. Fleetwood postponed a couple of big stadium shows.

There’s very little in Mick’s 1990 book that isn’t lifted from old magazines.

[Macfan4life]

Rolling Stone mag ran a Random Note about it (remember the Random Notes column?). I think they called it an epileptic seizure. It was at the Philadelphia stop on the 1978 tour. Fleetwood postponed a couple of big stadium shows.

There’s very little in Mick’s 1990 book that isn’t lifted from old magazines.
One of the most interesting parts of his 1990 book was his stalker who eventually catches him :lol: The Gatorade inspections in Australia was entertaining too :)

[HomerMcvie]

One of the most interesting parts of his 1990 book was his stalker who eventually catches him :lol: The Gatorade inspections in Australia was entertaining too :)

MF is an extra tall bag of lying sh*t. Stupid drama queen.

[Macfan4life]

MF is an extra tall bag of lying sh*t. Stupid drama queen.
You're just jealous Oh Daddy was written about him

[Villavic]

MF is an extra tall bag of lying sh*t. Stupid drama queen.

Probably. With everything now we know, it's hard to trust in Mick, to say the least. However those episodes Macfan4life mentions are not that uncommon in rock guys or famous people. They may be true.

[jbrownsjr]

Probably. With everything now we know, it's hard to trust in Mick, to say the least. However those episodes Macfan4life mentions are not that uncommon in rock guys or famous people. They may be true.

A lot of his book was true. Quite a bit of it was not or at least embellished. I need to read his 2nd book, at some point. Maybe I'll read two books at once and knock it out. But, there are so many other fruitful things to read.

[aleuzzi]

A lot of his book was true. Quite a bit of it was not or at least embellished. I need to read his 2nd book, at some point. Maybe I'll read two books at once and knock it out. But, there are so many other fruitful things to read.

A lot of his book dealt with the official line the band takes. But there were some glaring omissions: no mention of Christine’s affair with Martin Birch; Bob Welch’s heroin use; or Stevie’s abortion. Unlike Bob Brunning’s mess of a book, there aren’t as many outright errors, but some revisionist lies exist, such as attributing “Station Man” to Christine and saying “Oh Daddy” was about him. And then there was the whole “and nobody missed Lindsey” bit when discussing the Tango tour.

[jbrownsjr]

A lot of his book dealt with the official line the band takes. But there were some glaring omissions: no mention of Christine’s affair with Martin Birch; Bob Welch’s heroin use; or Stevie’s abortion. Unlike Bob Brunning’s mess of a book, there aren’t as many outright errors, but some revisionist lies exist, such as attributing “Station Man” to Christine and saying “Oh Daddy” was about him. And then there was the whole “and nobody missed Lindsey” bit when discussing the Tango tour.

Is this the newer publication? Or the "My Life...blah blah blah"?

[bwboy]

A lot of his book dealt with the official line the band takes. But there were some glaring omissions: no mention of Christine’s affair with Martin Birch; Bob Welch’s heroin use; or Stevie’s abortion. Unlike Bob Brunning’s mess of a book, there aren’t as many outright errors, but some revisionist lies exist, such as attributing “Station Man” to Christine and saying “Oh Daddy” was about him. And then there was the whole “and nobody missed Lindsey” bit when discussing the Tango tour.

The glaring omissions you mention, Mick probably felt they weren’t his stories to tell, since they didn’t involve him specifically. As for the band not missing Lindsey during the Tango tour, that doesn’t sound hard to believe at all. They were ticked because Lindsey didn’t tour and probably worried about the future of the band. From all accounts, the tour did well and it sounded like a lot of fun for them, personally. It’s completely possible that if Lindsey had toured with them, it would have gone very well too, but we’ll never know. Billy Burnette wrote in his book about how all of them would continue to play music together after a show in their hotel room, just jamming, which is something I’m quite certain had never happened before. I think that was a reflection more on Billy and Rick, and their genuine excitement about being in FM, than on Lindsey. Billy and Rick brought fun back for them at that time.

[UnwindedDreams]

The guy who cowrote My Life and Adventures with Mick is an unqualified author. His biography of Stevie was a smoking pile of crap. I was embarassed for Davis when I read that book. I believe the only reason it was published was because it had Stevie's name on it. The fact they charged people $20-$30 for that book was an act of evil.

[HomerMcvie]

A lot of his book was true. Quite a bit of it was not or at least embellished. I need to read his 2nd book, at some point. Maybe I'll read two books at once and knock it out. But, there are so many other fruitful things to read.

Can you believe I've never read the second book(I've read the first one at least 30 times)? I bought the second one probably 5 years ago, and have never cracked it. I love the first one, but now that I know he's a lying sack of sh*t, I'm just not that interested in reading his little lies.

[HomerMcvie]

You're just jealous Oh Daddy was written about him

Christine wrote Oh Daddy about me, since she and I equally loathe children.

[Macfan4life]

Can you believe I've never read the second book(I've read the first one at least 30 times)? I bought the second one probably 5 years ago, and have never cracked it. I love the first one, but now that I know he's a lying sack of sh*t, I'm just not that interested in reading his little lies.
The second book is not worth reading. I have the hard cover and even tried to sell it on Ebay. No takers. Unlike the first book, it contains no gossip or scandal. I think its written as an apology to his first wife and clearing his conscience about Bob Welch. He praises everyone. He never even mentions things Stevie has mentioned i.e. touring with Stevie and the klonopin years, etc.
It was a struggle to even finish it was so boring and glossed over. The way he praises Bob Welch in the second book disturbed be because how Mick treated him in 1997. Besides being snubbed at the RRHOF, Bob was completely edited out of the band's Behind The Music segment released the same year. He is not mentioned in the band's history but actually cut off the album back cover of Heroes are Hard to Find. Its almost as bad as when the Van Halen brothers edited Michael Anthony off the Van Halen website.

I loved the first book and the funny stories about his stalker. When Stevie dropped acid in Hawaii and could not find her way to the airport to pick him up. How the band found the roses Don Henley gave to Stevie and the band wrote on the card "Tonight is the night". Loved it when he wrote how Lindsey confronted him seeing Stevie, etc.

[Villavic]

Stevie's abortion was a very delicate topic to include it. A right thing not to mention it.

[jbrownsjr]

Stevie's abortion was a very delicate topic to include it. A right thing not to mention it.

Yea, that's definitely her story to tell if she wants to or doesn't want to. I wouldn't want to make that public against someone's wishes. Having said that, he sure went to town with a lot of other issues. :shrug:

[Macfan4life]

Stevie's abortion was a very delicate topic to include it. A right thing not to mention it.
Exactly. I love Don Henley as an artist but what an incredibly horrible person to out a woman for having an abortion. There was a klonopin era interview with Stevie where she sounded very hurt saying "I guess I can talk about this now since I did not have a choice and Don told the world" or something like that. I just don't understand why anyone would do that let alone someone who is an ex lover and current friend. Don also supposedly hung up the phone on Stevie when she called him and told him she was marrying Kim Anderson. Strange relationship those 2 have.

[UnwindedDreams]

Exactly. I love Don Henley as an artist but what an incredibly horrible person to out a woman for having an abortion.
Didn't he have a minor prostitute visit him once and she had an overdose?
I remember when Stevie really went in depth about the abortion in 2014 because someone asked her if Don was right about Sara being about the conception of a child. Stevie said had she had the child it wouldve been named Sara.

Don is an amazing singer. Far better than Lindsey, Billy, Rick, and to me, even Glenn Frey.

[bombaysaffires]

Exactly. I love Don Henley as an artist but what an incredibly horrible person to out a woman for having an abortion. There was a klonopin era interview with Stevie where she sounded very hurt saying "I guess I can talk about this now since I did not have a choice and Don told the world" or something like that. I just don't understand why anyone would do that let alone someone who is an ex lover and current friend. Don also supposedly hung up the phone on Stevie when she called him and told him she was marrying Kim Anderson. Strange relationship those 2 have.

he's a flaming dick and it's so ridiculous how she tolerated his **** because he was Mr Famous. She talked back in the late 70s/early80s about how impressed she was at how famous the Eagles were (she always knows how to find the people in a crowd who can be useful to her "I wanna be a star, I don't wanna be a cleaning lady"). She also said that it was Don who "taught" her "how to be a rock star".... so we can thank him for that. :eek: "I get the Presidential suite because I demand it" and all that happy claptrap. She talked about how she would be all quiet and not talk about her career and Fleetwood Mac around him/the Eagles and, in her words, "trick them to death". That's why I find her "feminist" claims laughable. She is so totally a product of the era she grew up in (50s) and women need to flatter men and bat their eyelashes and pretend they don't have any ambition etc. That was her approach with Don... and he being of the same era was all white, male privilege...treating everyone like dirt. I guess if you wanna become an a$$hole diva, learn from the best.

[aleuzzi]

The glaring omissions you mention, Mick probably felt they weren’t his stories to tell, since they didn’t involve him specifically. As for the band not missing Lindsey during the Tango tour, that doesn’t sound hard to believe at all. They were ticked because Lindsey didn’t tour and probably worried about the future of the band. From all accounts, the tour did well and it sounded like a lot of fun for them, personally. It’s completely possible that if Lindsey had toured with them, it would have gone very well too, but we’ll never know. Billy Burnette wrote in his book about how all of them would continue to play music together after a show in their hotel room, just jamming, which is something I’m quite certain had never happened before. I think that was a reflection more on Billy and Rick, and their genuine excitement about being in FM, than on Lindsey. Billy and Rick brought fun back for them at that time.

They certainly were not his stories to tell, but neither was Christine’s affair with Curry Grant and he told that. So where is the line drawn? If Christine’s having an affair with the band’s erstwhile engineer (Birch), that’s pretty darn significant to the band. I’m betting Christine said he could tell one story but not the other. But who knows? Maybe it was selective memory. The interesting thing is that, with time, most of the stories have come out anyway, either through personal confession or from someone else spilling the beans.

[aleuzzi]

Is this the newer publication? Or the "My Life...blah blah blah"?

The older one, the My Life blah...

[aleuzzi]

Stevie's abortion was a very delicate topic to include it. A right thing not to mention it.

I totally agree.

But Mick elsewhere lets a lot come out that wasn’t his to tell. So he appears to have restricted himself to what the band would permit, the “official line” at the time, which was really my point.

[bwboy]

They certainly were not his stories to tell, but neither was Christine’s affair with Curry Grant and he told that. So where is the line drawn? If Christine’s having an affair with the band’s erstwhile engineer (Birch), that’s pretty darn significant to the band. I’m betting Christine said he could tell one story but not the other. But who knows? Maybe it was selective memory. The interesting thing is that, with time, most of the stories have come out anyway, either through personal confession or from someone else spilling the beans.

Have you read Billy Burnette’s book? It’s so much more interesting than Mick’s book. Not because he gives more dirt, because he doesn’t, but because he gives more interesting stories about the band, such as gigs they played, behind the scenes tour info, etc. I think you would like it. But as to your post, I would say it was selective memory as to why Mick mentioned certain things but not others- Billy said in his book that the day Mick’s autobiography was released, John, Christine, and Stevie were irritated and the tour became awkward. That’s why I don’t think it was something like Christine telling Mick he could write about one affair but not the other, for example. Maybe Mick wrote only about one because that particular affair lasted longer, or upset John more, or was more awkward for the band, etc.

[HomerMcvie]

Exactly. I love Don Henley as an artist but what an incredibly horrible person to out a woman for having an abortion. There was a klonopin era interview with Stevie where she sounded very hurt saying "I guess I can talk about this now since I did not have a choice and Don told the world" or something like that. I just don't understand why anyone would do that let alone someone who is an ex lover and current friend. Don also supposedly hung up the phone on Stevie when she called him and told him she was marrying Kim Anderson. Strange relationship those 2 have.

While I LOVE The Eagles, he and Glenn were both MAJOR ASSH*LES, IMO. Glenn more so, but "Don's a malcontent. He's always been a malcontent, and that's just life" - David Geffin

[UnwindedDreams]

he's a flaming dick and it's so ridiculous how she tolerated his **** because he was Mr Famous. She talked back in the late 70s/early80s about how impressed she was at how famous the Eagles were (she always knows how to find the people in a crowd who can be useful to her "I wanna be a star, I don't wanna be a cleaning lady"). She also said that it was Don who "taught" her "how to be a rock star".... so we can thank him for that. :eek: "I get the Presidential suite because I demand it" and all that happy claptrap. She talked about how she would be all quiet and not talk about her career and Fleetwood Mac around him/the Eagles and, in her words, "trick them to death". That's why I find her "feminist" claims laughable. She is so totally a product of the era she grew up in (50s) and women need to flatter men and bat their eyelashes and pretend they don't have any ambition etc. That was her approach with Don... and he being of the same era was all white, male privilege...treating everyone like dirt. I guess if you wanna become an a$$hole diva, learn from the best.
The Holy Spirit is speaking through you...Amen!
She is totally a product of the 50s. I.E. She said Harry wearing a dress on VOGUE was crazy but he had to so he could get on the cover. WTF! Jagger wore dresses in the 70s. Rod wore dresses.