The last Song from Rumors......

[BLY]

What was your least favorite song from Rumors when it was released/or first time you listened to it?

It was Oh Daddy for me. I like it but it was at the bottom of the list. Over the years it has become one of my favorites. After hearing the alternative version with more of Stevie’s vocals prominent gave me even more appreciation for the track. The song is another masterpiece.

[SteveMacD]

I’m weird. “Rumours” was the last studio album by that lineup I bought (late 87-early 88). I was also familiar with “Mystery..,” “Law & Order,” and some Peter Green era stuff before “Rumours.”

NGBA was probably my least favorite, but I loved the whole album from the start. Obviously I knew the hits, and I had heard “The Chain” from the Mirage tour on VH-1’s Fleetwood Mac Weekend (which is why I bought the cassette). But, I liked that song.

[vivfox]

I never cared for Songbird. There have been a few live versions over the years that were good. I would have gladly traded that song for Silver Springs though.

[HomerMcvie]

I've never been a big fan of Oh Daddy. It's snoozeville.

[aleuzzi]

I loved (and love) everything on it, but love NGBA less than the others. Pretty tune. But not one that feels as essential as the others.

But then I also love “Oh Daddy” more than most songs on the album...

[tabruns]

What was your least favorite song from Rumors when it was released/or first time you listened to it?

It was Oh Daddy for me. I like it but it was at the bottom of the list. Over the years it has become one of my favorites. After hearing the alternative version with more of Stevie’s vocals prominent gave me even more appreciation for the track. The song is another masterpiece.

I like all of them, but "I Don't Want To Know" was the least consequential IMO. Caillat talks about album length side and how important it was to keep each side under 22 minutes, but "Silver Springs" could have fit in place of this song, and I think it would have been the better choice.

[FuzzyPlum]

For a long time I considered Oh Daddy and I Don't Want to Know as the least essential songs. However, I've come to appreciate them much more.
Don't Stop is now probably the one I can live without hearing.

[button-lip]

Definitely “Oh, Daddy”. Never liked it and probably never will.

[cbBen]

"Oh Daddy"

[HomerMcvie]

For a long time I considered Oh Daddy and I Don't Want to Know as the least essential songs. However, I've come to appreciate them much more.
Don't Stop is now probably the one I can live without hearing.

I LOVE Idwtk. Always have. It's the first guitar solo I ever learned to play!

[BLY]

I LOVE Idwtk. Always have. It's the first guitar solo I ever learned to play!


IDWTK is the song that got me hooked. It’s my number #1.

[Macfan4life]

Oh Daddy is one of the most beautiful tracks the Mac has ever recorded. I admit when I first got Rumours I was young and did not understand music so much. However, Oh Daddy is pure brilliance.

I would still axe Never Going Back again and I Don't Want To Know for Silver Springs

[mitzo]

Oh Daddy is one of the most beautiful tracks the Mac has ever recorded. I admit when I first got Rumours I was young and did not understand music so much. However, Oh Daddy is pure brilliance.

I would still axe Never Going Back again and I Don't Want To Know for Silver Springs
Fully agreed on Oh Daddy. I am always amazed to realize that anything ballad-like or slow gets ignored or disliked by so many people.

My last song on Rumours is I Don't Want to Know. But I would not replace it with the original Silver Springs which, in demo form, sounds too thin to fit into the Rumours album.

[Macfan4life]

Fully agreed on Oh Daddy. I am always amazed to realize that anything ballad-like or slow gets ignored or disliked by so many people.

My last song on Rumours is I Don't Want to Know. But I would not replace it with the original Silver Springs which, in demo form, sounds too thin to fit into the Rumours album.
Not that Christine's singing ruins the song but has anyone listened to the track without singing. It covers all the bases what made the Mac a super group. Lindsey's guitar is incredible. Christine's playing is so mystical. Micks percussion is so good. IMHO, the track is more Lindsey but its the perfect creation of Lindsey and Christine playing around each other. Take a listen. Its pure magic. There is not a bigger example of Christine and Lindsey's interwoven talents than this song.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfc3y0G511Y

[jbrownsjr]

Never Going Back Again was my least favorite. (Love it now)

Oh Daddy is one of the best tunes FM has ever written. The Stevie backing vocal demo is so beautiful.

I'm glad SS wasn't added to the album. The Dance version of that song blows away any Rumors version. That moment when they brought back SS during The Dance is huge. The piano intro and nuance, the sweet guitar, the harmonies, the performance, and the behavior of B/N completely blew us away.

[ViscountViktor]

Don't Stop is my least favourite. Can't think of why I would listen to. Plus the vocals are so compressed.

[jmn3]

Count another vote for Don't Stop. I really just don't like it at all. From a live perspective it gets livened up and I enjoy it, but on the album, it's blah.

I've long felt IDWTK was the better choice for the album over Silver Springs. It just fits in much better and I can't believe they never did it live. And The Dance Silver Springs is far superior. It IS a great old song, and after 20 years, they absolutely perfected it on that stage.

[ViscountViktor]

Count another vote for Don't Stop. I really just don't like it at all. From a live perspective it gets livened up and I enjoy it, but on the album, it's blah.

I've long felt IDWTK was the better choice for the album over Silver Springs. It just fits in much better and I can't believe they never did it live. And The Dance Silver Springs is far superior. It IS a great old song, and after 20 years, they absolutely perfected it on that stage.

Especially after Chris left, IDWTK would've been a perfect live duet for Lindsey and Stevie.

[David]

To me, everything fits on the album, even if a particular song is kind of a throw-away. But Songbird doesn’t fit the way that it should have. If I could back to 1976 and give Fleetwood Mac one piece of advice, I’d tell them to put that Zellerbach Auditorium take of Songbird on a B-side or an album of outtakes, and instead record the song in the studio. The auralness—the field—of it is all wrong and really sort of ugly, with all that empty-concert-hall reverb and seiching, not to mention one of the worst examples of mic’d piano I’ve ever heard on a pop album by a band with millions to spend. (Really, the piano sounds like an RMI Electra Piano or a cheap Italian knockoff that’s been sitting in someone’s moldy, cluttered basement.) But you take that song into the studio and record it and mic it properly (like The Way I Feel) with a compressed, close vocal when the singer’s throat wasn’t so tight, and you get a real watermelon tourmaline of a song.

[michelej1]

But the band didn’t have millions to spend at that point. Not yet.

[HomerMcvie]

But the band didn’t have millions to spend at that point. Not yet.

Didn't they spend 400K on Rumours? Which was a fortune back then. Da Google says that 400K then is 1.8M now.

[Macfan4life]

They were all millionaires in 1976. Their album was #1 and they had 3 hit singles and a year of solid touring. Being a millionaire in 1976 was a HUGE deal. Today that would be like being worth around 5 million?
The band seldom talks about how much money they make. But I remember an interview with Stevie that said when 1976 came along all their hard work of promoting the album before it came out and then touring afterwards all made them millionaires. 2 years prior she was waiting tables and cleaning so it was a rags to riches story. Warner Brothers was thrilled and of course it made sense to spend time and money on the follow up.

[blinker12]

Don’t Stop

[SteveMacD]

They were all millionaires in 1976.

They were, but they were so busy with the band that none of them really got what that was, yet. I always think of this time as something like “Life’s Been Good” (I have a mansion/forget the price/Ain’t ever been there/they tell me it’s nice).


As for all the “Don’t Stop” hate, I always thought it was the ‘70s “Hey Jude.” It’s easily the most Beatle-esq original Fleetwood Mac song.

[jbrownsjr]

They were, but they were so busy with the band that none of them really got what that was, yet. I always think of this time as something like “Life’s Been Good” (I have a mansion/forget the price/Ain’t ever been there/they tell me it’s nice).


As for all the “Don’t Stop” hate, I always thought it was the ‘70s “Hey Jude.” It’s easily the most Beatle-esq original Fleetwood Mac song.

Great analogy. You know what brought my love back to Don't Stop? I have felt in the past that it was so boring and over played.

When Christine came back, I could hear her style in the piano and the vocal harmony was back. vs. the SYW and later live versions. She makes it better better better better!!!! nah, nah nah .. nah nah nah.. Hey Jude...

[Macfan4life]

Great analogy. You know what brought my love back to Don't Stop? I have felt in the past that it was so boring and over played.

When Christine came back, I could hear her style in the piano and the vocal harmony was back. vs. the SYW and later live versions. She makes it better better better better!!!! nah, nah nah .. nah nah nah.. Hey Jude...
Not sure how much she was playing though. On With The Show they did a close up on the monitor of her playing parts of it. As the years went on, not sure she played that much. It was sad when she could not play songbird anymore.

I have always liked Don't Stop. It just gels so well together. Lindsey and Christine's voice merge together so well its hard to tell they take different parts. The shuffle is so catchy and its such an uplifting song. I guess I am in the minority because this song and Go Your Own Way and You Make Loving Fun are probably the only songs I listen to on the radio when they come on these days.
Its been an anthem for me all of my life so I will never turn my back on the song like you traitors :eek:
The Mac used to play it early in the set. Once Lindsey left is when it became a closer and sing along anthem which I have no problem with.

[SteveMacD]

https://www.youtube.com/embed/IKXhOTpd1Ws

Sounded okay in 2017

[jbrownsjr]

Not sure how much she was playing though. On With The Show they did a close up on the monitor of her playing parts of it. As the years went on, not sure she played that much. It was sad when she could not play songbird anymore.

I have always liked Don't Stop. It just gels so well together. Lindsey and Christine's voice merge together so well its hard to tell they take different parts. The shuffle is so catchy and its such an uplifting song. I guess I am in the minority because this song and Go Your Own Way and You Make Loving Fun are probably the only songs I listen to on the radio when they come on these days.
Its been an anthem for me all of my life so I will never turn my back on the song like you traitors :eek:
The Mac used to play it early in the set. Once Lindsey left is when it became a closer and sing along anthem which I have no problem with.

I was standing right behind her side of stage and watched her play it in 2014. If she was faking it, she did a damn good job. Especially, the solo.

[Macfan4life]

I was standing right behind her side of stage and watched her play it in 2014. If she was faking it, she did a damn good job. Especially, the solo.
Yes I believe she definitely played in 2014. Once songbird disappeared, her playing is not as obvious as it used to be. For Buck/Vie I would not be surprised if her keyboards were even plugged in.

[HomerMcvie]

Yes I believe she definitely played in 2014. Once songbird disappeared, her playing is not as obvious as it used to be. For Buck/Vie I would not be surprised if her keyboards were even plugged in.

She was playing some. In Nashville, they started the wrong song or something, and her keyboard had the wrong sound. She apparently didn't know how to change it, because her tech had to come out and push the buttons, then they restarted the song.

That said, I do believe that she was mostly just holding chords, most of the night. Not sure if it's her fingers or her brain that won't allow her to really play now, or a combination of both.

[moon]

Oh Daddy and I Don't Want To Know. God, please. I simply skip them. Rumours is not my favourite FM, but I really dislike these songs from the rest...

[jbrownsjr]

Yes I believe she definitely played in 2014. Once songbird disappeared, her playing is not as obvious as it used to be. For Buck/Vie I would not be surprised if her keyboards were even plugged in.

My point on Don't Stop was... Especially, when she made her grand one-off in London at the 02. She made me miss the song. Couldn't wait to hear more from her.

But, yea. They all have worn out tools. When any of them say they are playing better than ever (including LB) I just roll my eyes.

He used to cover so much ground on his guitar. Now he samples, and has another guitarist do a lot of the nuance that I used to love from him.

[jmn3]

My point on Don't Stop was... Especially, when she made her grand one-off in London at the 02. She made me miss the song. Couldn't wait to hear more from her.

But, yea. They all have worn out tools. When any of them say they are playing better than ever (including LB) I just roll my eyes.

He used to cover so much ground on his guitar. Now he samples, and has another guitarist do a lot of the nuance that I used to love from him.

The backing band has continued to take a highly increased role in every aspect of their live performance. I thought I’m So Afraid and Tusk on the last few tours made it very apparent how much less Lindsey is doing on his guitar. Christine from The Dance vs. anything since 2014 is jarring. And Stevie....same.

Age has everything to do with this and I can just appreciate their performances still but I have to agree when they proclaim they sound better than ever I too roll my damn eyes. Not even close folks.

[HomerMcvie]

I refuse to believe that Lindsey still can't play as well as he used to. NONE of them have any voices left. But playing, I think Lindsey can still cut the mustard.
Christine is slipping away, and $tevie is delusional, BUT....

[Macfan4life]

I refuse to believe that Lindsey still can't play as well as he used to. NONE of them have any voices left. But playing, I think Lindsey can still cut the mustard.
Christine is slipping away, and $tevie is delusional, BUT....
Oh come on now. Stevie can play a taped tambourine just as good as the old days. She never misses a beat.

[jmn3]

I refuse to believe that Lindsey still can't play as well as he used to. NONE of them have any voices left. But playing, I think Lindsey can still cut the mustard.
Christine is slipping away, and $tevie is delusional, BUT....

Oh I think Lindsey absolutely could play at or near the same level that he used to. My point was just that they continued to increase their reliance on the backing band to carry a lot of the weight. As for singing, totally agree. Not even close to what they once had for voices.

[jbrownsjr]

I refuse to believe that Lindsey still can't play as well as he used to. NONE of them have any voices left. But playing, I think Lindsey can still cut the mustard.
Christine is slipping away, and $tevie is delusional, BUT....

He's either become very lazy or can't do it. Either way, it's very sad for me to go watch another guitarist do the work I'm used to from him.

[jmn3]

Oh come on now. Stevie can play a taped tambourine just as good as the old days. She never misses a beat.

It takes a special kind of artist to shake a taped tambourine completely out of time.

[HomerMcvie]

It takes a special kind of artist to shake a taped tambourine completely out of time.

Yeah. $he's $pecial. Very very $pecial. :lol:

[HomerMcvie]

He's either become very lazy or can't do it. Either way, it's very sad for me to go watch another guitarist do the work I'm used to from him.

I think it's just laziness. BECAUSE of now playing with tracks. Why play your ass off when you can just "hit play"?

[Macfan4life]

It takes a special kind of artist to shake a taped tambourine completely out of time.
America's Got Talent material
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCdIN-02jYI

[jcalzaretta]

I agree that the demo of Oh Daddy, with Stevie's background is so haunting. For me, my least favorite is Don't Stop.

IDWTK is incredible. How many songs do two people sing start to finish - together. This is a masterpiece.

[BLY]

I agree that the demo of Oh Daddy, with Stevie's background is so haunting. For me, my least favorite is Don't Stop.

IDWTK is incredible. How many songs do two people sing start to finish - together. This is a masterpiece.

Yes! I agree 100%!

[HomerMcvie]

IDWTK is incredible. How many songs do two people sing start to finish - together. This is a masterpiece.

It's too bad Stevie has always hated it. It's a great song. And Rumours wouldn't be Rumours without it!

[johnnystorms]

It's too bad Stevie has always hated it. It's a great song. And Rumours wouldn't be Rumours without it!
Why do you say she hated it? I'd love to know more.

[HomerMcvie]

Why do you say she hated it? I'd love to know more.

Because she wanted Silver Springs to be on the record. It was too long for the running order, and was replaced with IDWTK. And she's never wanted to do it live, afaik.

[John Run]

There was an intresting thread on the Rumours forum a while back. It was essentially that I Don't Want to Know was a Buckingham ghost write. The premise being they needed a short feel good uptempo song to make the flow of the album and Stevie needed another credited song on Rumours. From the lyrics being very Lindsey esque including reusing the Lindsey favorite crutch lyric of "down the line" to the demo / early versions being a Lindsey lead vocal.

[BLY]

There was an intresting thread on the Rumours forum a while back. It was essentially that I Don't Want to Know was a Buckingham ghost write. The premise being they needed a short feel good uptempo song to make the flow of the album and Stevie needed another credited song on Rumours. From the lyrics being very Lindsey esque including reusing the Lindsey favorite crutch lyric of "down the line" to the demo / early versions being a Lindsey lead vocal.

Yes I do remember that. It was written back in the Buckingham Nicks days and I’m sure it was co written by both but to the point made above Stevie was given all the credit for the Rumours release.

[jcalzaretta]

I don't believe LB wrote IDWTK. That is pure Stevie. My dream concert would have been them open with that song. Start off with a bang. Don't get me wrong. I LOVE the Chain. BUT I would have loved a concert opener with this. SN and LB singing together start to finish.

[jmn3]

A 1-2 punch of Second Hand News and I Don’t Want to Know would’ve been great on one of the 2003-13 tours.

[michelej1]

Yes, it is a BN song that was credited to Stevie long before Rumours.

[elle]

Yes, it is a BN song that was credited to Stevie long before Rumours.

you just had to swoop in and burst our conspiracy theory bubble?! :lol::wavey:

[secret love]

Oh Daddy and I Don't Want To Know. God, please. I simply skip them. Rumours is not my favourite FM, but I really dislike these songs from the rest...

I despise Never Going Back Again. I hate that they wasted space in their 2015 Sydney, Australia set by playing that song. Anything else would have been better... but Oh Daddy is just as bad. Love I Don't Want To Know though.

[David]

Stevie wrote it but didn't? Someone made her write lyrics in a style she had never used before and hasn't used since.

Now you tell me that I'm crazy
It's nothing that I didn't know

I think someone was standing over her (like a Don Henley svengali) and pushing that self-effacing kiss-off tone into her lyrics. That just is not her by herself, wrapped in her own prismatic world. That's not how she talks about herself and that's not how she talks about other people. I also doubt that "You got me rockin' and reelin' " came out of her little faerie brain, either.

The song is very rhythmic. The way the words nestle into the groove is un-Stevielike. I bet the music kind of came first (from her or whoever) and then someone worked with her to "fit" wry, self-effacing lyrics about a rough patch in love into the musical structure. Stevie didn't just sit down by herself and hatch this thing as is.

I also think that, whatever was happening to get the song on paper, it's very obviously a lyrical backseat - to the rhythm and the two-part harmony, which must have been worked out (much the way we hear it on the Rumours demo with Lindsey doing a scat vocal) with the two singers in a room together. The whole thing was built with the vocal harmony in mind, not just presented in finished state to a production person, with someone present suddenly having the bright idea to add a harmony.

[BLY]

Stevie wrote it but didn't? Someone made her write lyrics in a style she had never used before and hasn't used since.

Now you tell me that I'm crazy
It's nothing that I didn't know

I think someone was standing over her (like a Don Henley svengali) and pushing that self-effacing kiss-off tone into her lyrics. That just is not her by herself, wrapped in her own prismatic world. That's not how she talks about herself and that's not how she talks about other people. I also doubt that "You got me rockin' and reelin' " came out of her little faerie brain, either.

The song is very rhythmic. The way the words nestle into the groove is un-Stevielike. I bet the music kind of came first (from her or whoever) and then someone worked with her to "fit" wry, self-effacing lyrics about a rough patch in love into the musical structure. Stevie didn't just sit down by herself and hatch this thing as is.

I also think that, whatever was happening to get the song on paper, it's very obviously a lyrical backseat - to the rhythm and the two-part harmony, which must have been worked out (much the way we hear it on the Rumours demo with Lindsey doing a scat vocal) with the two singers in a room together. The whole thing was built with the vocal harmony in mind, not just presented in finished state to a production person, with someone present suddenly having the bright idea to add a harmony.


WOW! I never gave it that much thought but....ok. All I know is I heard I Don’t Want to Know on the radio back in February 1976 and the feast is history. The song got me hooked!

[michelej1]

you just had to swoop in and burst our conspiracy theory bubble?! :lol::wavey:

I live to swoop.