Mick admits FM lied & Lindsey was telling the truth all along (Mojo)

[elle]

i think May 2019 Mojo thread is way too long and too convoluted. what's in that article needs a new discussion thread now when we actually got to read the whole thing.

some things i enjoyed about the article and interviews;


Mick finally admitting he / the band lied in CBS interview and all their PR, and that it was Stevie who pulled the trigger as Lindsey was saying from the start :nod: :thumbsup:
Christine saying that the issue was between Stevie and Lindsey, not the rest of the band
Billboard article came out the same day where their managers (Sheryl Lewis and Carl Stubner) stick with the original April 2018 script they sent to all outlets. it looked completely ridiculous having 2 completely different version coming out from the band members and from their management on the same day
some of the song descriptions
Rick Vito saying he's watching "with interest" what's going on with the band now
Mick basically saying "screw you" to all the fans being unhappy with the band and their lies on social media :]:]



there are more but these are what i can remember right now.

[button-lip]

i think May 2019 Mojo thread is way too long and too convoluted. what's in that article needs a new discussion thread now when we actually got to read the whole thing.

some things i enjoyed about the article and interviews;


Mick finally admitting he / the band lied in CBS interview and all their PR, and that it was Stevie who pulled the trigger as Lindsey was saying from the start :nod: :thumbsup:
Christine saying that the issue was between Stevie and Lindsey, not the rest of the band
Billboard article came out the same day where their managers (Sheryl Lewis and Carl Stubner) stick with the original April 2018 script they sent to all outlets. it looked completely ridiculous having 2 completely different version coming out from the band members and from their management on the same day
some of the song descriptions
Rick Vito saying he's watching "with interest" what's going on with the band now
Mick basically saying "screw you" to all the fans being unhappy with the band and their lies on social media :]:]



there are more but these are what i can remember right now.

I hope a couple of years from now Lindsey can watch them "with interest" from afar, just like Rick is doing now. And smile. :thumbsup:

[elle]

Ooh la la. Thanks for posting.

This confirms what we thought. Not all members of the band were mad at him. There's no secret heinous conduct by Lindsey that they have been concealing for the world's sake, which would justify his ouster. No magic elixir which will prove that Stevie, as always, is absolved of all guilt and responsibility.

It was the age old feud between Lindsey and Stevie and they backed the money horse, no matter how much Lindsey had given to them from the seventies to the present. Christine's comment that they either had to kick him out or disband says it all. Well, gee how could you possibly disband when all that money was lying on the table. Better to stab Lindsey in the back (well, um, heart actually) and go on with the show.

yup. there are tons of little quotes dispersed all over the article making it crystal clear that they went with protecting the corporation over protecting the band and the legacy. for example this little nugget:

"Which means, of course, that Christine McVie was put in the awkward position of having to make a choice - to take one for the team, as is said - and essentially take the side not of her most worthy artistic collaborator, but of ensuring that Fleetwood Mac, the corporate entity, might continue as deserved. It was not an easy spot to be in."

[rhiannondontgo]

yup. there are tons of little quotes dispersed all over the article making it crystal clear that they went with protecting the corporation over protecting the band and the legacy. for example this little nugget:

"Which means, of course, that Christine McVie was put in the awkward position of having to make a choice - to take one for the team, as is said - and essentially take the side not of her most worthy artistic collaborator, but of ensuring that Fleetwood Mac, the corporate entity, might continue as deserved. It was not an easy spot to be in."

Has anyone posted the whole article yet? I’ve only seen bits & pieces so far (maybe i’m just out of the loop :sorry:)

[elle]

another excerpt (Mojo May 2019) - starting from a part of Mick's interview (and no Mick, not everyone knows that. you are trying to ensure people don't know that):

"And so it's been fun," Fleetwood says. "And this is no deference in any way to Lindsey. Lindsey is totally unique, and he always has that, and he will always have full kudos of being a major, major part of the history of this band. We know that. You know that. But it's about once you've made a decision to go forward..."

Exactly why that decision was made isn't something anyone's eager to talk about, least of all the musicians involved in the settlement. But all signs point to Stevie Nicks being miffed at Buckingham's on-stage behaviour at the MusiCares benefit to honour the band in New York early last year.

Two days after that event, "[Band manager] Irving Azoff called me up and he was basically screaming at me," Buckingham told CBS News in early December. "He was screaming at me on the phone saying, "You've really done it this time." And I had no idea what he was talking about. He said, "Stevie never wants to be on stage with you again," and I'm going, Why?"
According to Azoff, Buckingham said, Nicks had complained that the guitarist had smirked behind her that night when she gave her acceptance speech.
"Irving told me a couple of days later she'd given the band an ultimatum, and either I had to go or she was going to go," Buckingham said.

love how they now admit it was all Stevie, yet they still don't want to address why was decision made.

[elle]

Has anyone posted the whole article yet? I’ve only seen bits & pieces so far (maybe i’m just out of the loop :sorry:)

no, it's behind the paywall. i bought an online instant download on Mojo app. i have the article, and there are people on fb that have been sharing more of the interviews, including screenshots.

i'm transcribing little excerpts here, but i definitely have no time or inclination to transcribe the whole thing. i don't know what the policy is here of posting the screenshots of the whole interview?

[wayner]

Hi Elle

I've been sitting on the edge of the ledge for a long time hoping against hope that all would be OK but i've had it with
mr meet and $$$$$..... Stev$$ and ChrisT$$$ and Joh$ too

in Atlantic City 2009 this group opened my eyes and ears (Unleashed june 13)to music in general and made me feel young again , for that i must thank them ,I now am a dedicated follower of most 'classic rock' groups : The Mac and Lindsey and stev$$ solo have always been our # 1 choice but the MAC always included Lindsey, and i never really realized how the whole must be comprised of ALL its parts to work . we saw them again at the same venue almost 10 years later and it was not the same ... and having followed all the drama etc 'on line' for almost a year i have now reluctantly realized/ accepted that it was a collective decision to self-destruct and there was one person who pulled the pin from the grenade

RIP Fleetwood Mac

[elle]

more excerpts:

And there you have it, the proverbial rock and hard place, complicated by the fact that the last batch of new Fleetwood Mac product, if you will, was the Lindsey Buckingham Christine McVie album, released in 2017 and probably the finest bit of Fleetwood-related product since Tango In The Night, 30 years and many dollars ago. On it was every member of the "Rumopurs Five" but Nicks, who apparently had other commitments. A smallish, low-key tour featuring Buckingham and McVie followed, but it was emphatically not Fleetwood Mac - especially for those keeping box-office score.

i find this bit so telling - it's the crux of why the band - and even more, managers - went with Stevie. and it's also why she gave an ultimatum in the first place, at this time - she just finished arena tour, they just finished smaller shed tour. in reality "smallish" is such interesting term to use, considering their tour probably had more dates than Stevie's tour that was spread over 2 years. so while it might be implied smallish may mean not many dates, what it really clearly means is what i highlighted in red at the end of that sentence - :nod:

[elle]

Hi Elle

I've been sitting on the edge of the ledge for a long time hoping against hope that all would be OK but i've had it with
mr meet and $$$$$..... Stev$$ and ChrisT$$$ and Joh$ too

in Atlantic City 2009 this group opened my eyes and ears (Unleashed june 13)to music in general and made me feel young again , for that i must thank them ,I now am a dedicated follower of most 'classic rock' groups : The Mac and Lindsey and stev$$ solo have always been our # 1 choice but the MAC always included Lindsey, and i never really realized how the whole must be comprised of ALL its parts to work . we saw them again at the same venue almost 10 years later and it was not the same ... and having followed all the drama etc 'on line' for almost a year i have now reluctantly realized/ accepted that it was a collective decision to self-destruct and there was one person who pulled the pin from the grenade

RIP Fleetwood Mac

i saw on fb you guys went last week. thanks for sharing your impressions! :wavey:

[SteveMacD]

"Which means, of course, that Christine McVie was put in the awkward position of having to make a choice - to take one for the team, as is said - and essentially take the side not of her most worthy artistic collaborator, but of ensuring that Fleetwood Mac, the corporate entity, might continue as deserved. It was not an easy spot to be in."

Of course Christine would pick Fleetwood Mac, the corporate entity, over her most worthy artistic collaborator. Her fortunes had been tied to that corporate entity for fifty years by that point, first as John’s wife and then as a bandmate.

[BombaySapphire3]

I have been a fan since the 1970s and have purchased everything since then (minus the Time album.) I have not spent a cent on this band since Lindsey was fired.I will support any future work he does .

[SteveMacD]

Rick Vito saying he's watching "with interest" what's going on with the band now


That doesn’t surprise me at all. I mean, look at the setlist. If there was a sudden parting of ways Mike for whatever reason (not to suggest there’s trouble in paradise), Rick’s probably the only guitarist who could come in and hit the ground running, and he knows that.

[bombaysaffires]

"And so it's been fun," Fleetwood says. "And this is no deference in any way to Lindsey. Lindsey is totally unique, and he always has that, and he will always have full kudos of being a major, major part of the history of this band. We know that. You know that. But it's about once you've made a decision to go forward..."

ok well in addition to looking up the definition of "democracy" for Chris, ole Mick needs to look up the meaning of the word "deference". Showing deference means showing respect or regard for someone, either because you personally respect them or because of their position (ex., showing deference to the Queen of England).

So....."this is no deference in any way to Lindsey" is a weird sentence based on the words he used and what they actually mean vs what he *thinks* they mean in his usual word salad. Using lots of word doesn't make you sound any smarter, Mick.

[Storms123]

yup. there are tons of little quotes dispersed all over the article making it crystal clear that they went with protecting the corporation over protecting the band and the legacy. for example this little nugget:

"Which means, of course, that Christine McVie was put in the awkward position of having to make a choice - to take one for the team, as is said - and essentially take the side not of her most worthy artistic collaborator, but of ensuring that Fleetwood Mac, the corporate entity, might continue as deserved. It was not an easy spot to be in."

This is disgusting---truly disgusting. Who is that quoting?

[SteveMacD]

Using lots of word doesn't make you sound any smarter, Mick.

Lindsey and Mick both use a lot of words to say very little.

[BLY]

I still love this band and always will. I did not see this line up in concert on this tour but I would have considered it if they were promoting a new album. I would buy a new album by this lineup for sure. I will continue to support Lindsey’s solo work and pray that he recovers from his surgery. It sucks what went down but this band is the soundtrack of my life and “ I Can’t Go Back”. 😎

[elle]

all quotes from Christine in the article:

"Well, truthfully," she tells me, again a few days prior to Buckingham's heart surgery, "I suppose that in the end we had to make a choice. Lindsey, you know... I really don't want to harp on this very much, because what's done is done. And for whatever reasons, a lot being personal, it was the only route we could take, because there was just too much animosity between certain members of the band at that point, and there was just no way it could've gone on as a five-piece, a group with Lindsey in the band. So it was either just completely break up the band, or try and make the best of it."

McVie's take seems a mix between looking on the bright side - an admirably positive approach - and genuine regret at how things turned out. But she gives Mick Fleetwood full credit for carrying on.

"Mick is the granddaddy of the band," "And he lives to make it survive. And he has a way of finding the right people at the right time. And it was Mike Campbell and Neil Finn - they fit the bill absolutely perfectly.

"But it was a really hard time. I had really no bones to pick with Lindsey, I loved working with him, but i did see the point, and i did see what the problem was. And you know, we're a democracy, and we had to kind of make the best of a bad job, really. As it turns out, what we have now is better than what we ever had before, I believe."



several points here:

this make Christine look really bad - a spineless, horrible and ignorant person.
it's not really clear in several of the places what exactly is she talking about, and which timeframe - before or after Lindsey was thrown out by Mick and Stevie? like - "it was a really hard time" - when? when she found out Lindsey was out and had to make a decision whether to stay in the band?
"Lindsey, you know...." what do we know? that they screwed him? but she doesn't want to say it because it's a done deal now? "I really don't want to harp on this very much, because what's done is done." well Christine, even though it's a done deal, you can make it better or worse by saying hurtful stuff. and you are definitely making it worse.
did Mick tell her they'll disband if she says she's out if Lindsey is out - since apparently Mick told her Lindsey has to be out, there's no discussion about that, because there will be no FM 5 if they try to call Lindsey back because in that case Stevie will leave? "just too much animosity between certain members of the band"
the writer seems to describe Christine as being sad about the whole situation - "genuine regret at how things turned out" - yet other than that "really hard time" she doesn't say anywhere that she's sad about it so was there more that she said and they didn't quote? if so, why?
Christine obviously has no clue what democracy means. it's almost like Mick threw around the term and told her to use it and now she's using it.


talking about Mick, man we have to get to his ridiculous nonsensical logic. :laugh::] i just don't even feel like re-reading his blabbering-fool wording. one of these days.

[elle]

[/B]

This is disgusting---truly disgusting. Who is that quoting?

the article writer.

[bombaysaffires]

what really annoys me in all the reporting on this is how simplistic the writers/so-called reporters are--- all any of them have to do is watch the snippet of the awards where Stevie gives her speech to see Mick and Chris waltzing away...and call them out on that, like, why wasn't THAT more of a problem? But they don't. All the articles say "Lindsey re-ignited his ongoing feud with Stevie" WTF??

[elle]

what really annoys me in all the reporting on this is how simplistic the writers/so-called reporters are--- all any of them have to do is watch the snippet of the awards where Stevie gives her speech to see Mick and Chris waltzing away...and call them out on that, like, why wasn't THAT more of a problem? But they don't. All the articles say "Lindsey re-ignited his ongoing feud with Stevie" WTF??

all the articles that are spin off the Mojo original article talk about "re-igniting the feud" not the Mojo article.

and yes - putting it on Lindsey for smirking, which makes zero sense. Stevie was the one re-igniting the feud. for whatever stupid bitter reason she may had. (a power play seems the most probable to me - she WINS. with 2 of them it was always a completely idiotic and childish competition.) but yes, as i was transcribing that part from Mojo, i was thinking exact same thing - what about Mick and Christine waltzing? why are they not thrown out for "igniting the feud"? :shrug:

[bombaysaffires]

all the articles that are spin off the Mojo original article talk about "re-igniting the feud" not the Mojo article.

and yes - putting it on Lindsey for smirking, which makes zero sense. Stevie was the one re-igniting the feud. for whatever stupid bitter reason she may had. (a power play seems the most probable to me - she WINS. with 2 of them it was always a completely idiotic and childish competition.) but yes, as i was transcribing that part from Mojo, i was thinking exact same thing - what about Mick and Christine waltzing? why are they not thrown out for "igniting the feud"? :shrug:

wonder if they got a chewing-out from her? Then her telling Mick he owes it to her to kick LB out after he (Mick) contributed to mocking her. :shrug:

[SteveMacD]

all any of them have to do is watch the snippet of the awards where Stevie gives her speech to see Mick and Chris waltzing away...and call them out on that, like, why wasn't THAT more of a problem?

For all we know, it might have been a problem. Who’s to say Mick and Christine didn’t get an earful, too? However, Stevie has a very different relationship with them, which might be the difference between getting a terse phone call vs. being on the wrong end of an ultimatum.

What I want to know is timeline, but I wouldn’t trust them on a good day to be accurate about that. Any of them, including Lindsey.

[BombaySapphire3]

My guess is that Stevie wanted him out for quite awhile she just had to wait until her own stock was high enough. She had recently sold out arenas in a solo tour and has been able to up her brand in pop culture in recent years. She just lay in wait for an excuse no matter how petty to demand his ouster from Fleetwood Mac.

[button-lip]

My guess is that Stevie wanted him out for quite awhile she just had to wait until her own stock was high enough. She had recently sold out arenas in a solo tour and has been able to up her brand in pop culture in recent years. She just lay in wait for an excuse no matter how petty to demand his ouster from Fleetwood Mac.

Unfortunately, I agree. She has been waiting for the perfect opportunity for years. They don't need him anymore. Doesn't have to deal with him anymore. A very business-like decision. Because that's all this people care.

And please, spare me the "they're all friends with each other but Lindsey" speech. Christine is friends with Jenny Boyd, not with Stevie Nicks. She just tolerates her. Same goes with John, and Mick. Brits may be friends with each other but not with Stevie.

[bombaysaffires]

My guess is that Stevie wanted him out for quite awhile she just had to wait until her own stock was high enough. She had recently sold out arenas in a solo tour and has been able to up her brand in pop culture in recent years. She just lay in wait for an excuse no matter how petty to demand his ouster from Fleetwood Mac.

Unfortunately, I agree. She has been waiting for the perfect opportunity for years. They don't need him anymore. Doesn't have to deal with him anymore. A very business-like decision. Because that's all this people care.

And please, spare me the "they're all friends with each other but Lindsey" speech. Christine is friends with Jenny Boyd, not with Stevie Nicks. She just tolerates her. Same goes with John, and Mick. Brits may be friends with each other but not with Stevie.


yes, this was my first comment on here when all this broke.... "revenge is a dish best served cold". She's been waiting for a long time. Who knows, this might have even been part of her strategy in refusing to record. Nothing would surprise me with this toxic bunch.

[BigAl84]

My guess is that Stevie wanted him out for quite awhile she just had to wait until her own stock was high enough. She had recently sold out arenas in a solo tour and has been able to up her brand in pop culture in recent years. She just lay in wait for an excuse no matter how petty to demand his ouster from Fleetwood Mac.

Not to get into semantics, but she has not sold out arenas on her own in a very long time. She's only filling arenas by being part of a double bill.

[jmn3]

yes, this was my first comment on here when all this broke.... "revenge is a dish best served cold". She's been waiting for a long time. Who knows, this might have even been part of her strategy in refusing to record. Nothing would surprise me with this toxic bunch.

I'm telling you, this goes back to the SYW recording and that friggin Bob Dylan comment. She was so positively offended by that - it's like a jagged line can be drawn from 2002 to her mother dying, Christine coming back, and Tom Petty dying...to Lindsey getting the boot. All of those things had to happen in order for her to pounce and kick him out. She's a petty little narcissist with an uncanny ability to hold ridiculously stupid grudges.

[jmn3]

Not to get into semantics, but she has not sold out arenas on her own in a very long time. She's only filling arenas by being part of a double bill.

Exactly. It wasn't that long ago that she was opening for Rod Stewart. This idea that she's equal to FM with respect to her ability to draw a crowd solo is ridiculous.

[SteveMacD]

Not to get into semantics, but she has not sold out arenas on her own in a very long time. She's only filling arenas by being part of a double bill.

True. However, she’s still at least an arena act as a solo artist. LBCM weren’t able to fill mid-sized amphitheaters. Don’t think that went unnoticed.

I personally believe LBCM could have been an arena act as part of a double bill if Mick and John had toured with them and it had been called Fleetwood Mac. But, that would have been risky to the long term viability of Fleetwood Mac.

The sad reality is that Fleetwood Mac isn’t a $100 million band without her, and I can’t fault them for picking sides when that kind of money was involved. There are a lot of people on that payroll.

[button-lip]

Bashing Lindsey on every opportunity they have is part of their charity plan too? :rolleyes:

[bwboy]

LBCM weren’t able to fill mid-sized amphitheaters. Don’t think that went unnoticed.

The sad reality is that Fleetwood Mac isn’t a $100 million band without her, and I can’t fault them for picking sides when that kind of money was involved. There are a lot of people on that payroll.

This. When Lindsey and Christine toured together, they hired a band they could afford, leaving Mick and John out. So even though Buck/Vie was really a FM album, there was no money to be made for the band if they toured as FM. And touring is how Mick and John make their money. Touring is how Mick and John always made their income. They may be wealthy, but they still have bills to pay. It's funny that some people here think FM should have retired when they fired Lindsey, in order to "keep their legacy intact." Legacies don't pay the bills, and mansions and yachts and college educations for the kids and grandkids don't come cheap. Plus, they really like touring, not just Mick and John, but everyone else, too.

[elle]

^^^^^ alternative facts. you can't just make stuff up and state it as truth without being called on it.

it was Mick and John's (well let's face it - i have no doubt it was Mick's! :lol:) decision not to tour with them. so it would not be Fleetwood Mac. they could have toured with them, and even as Fleetwood Mac. Mick wanted to make sure his cash cow is intact.

[elle]

True. However, she’s still at least an arena act as a solo artist. LBCM weren’t able to fill mid-sized amphitheaters. Don’t think that went unnoticed.

I personally believe LBCM could have been an arena act as part of a double bill if Mick and John had toured with them and it had been called Fleetwood Mac. But, that would have been risky to the long term viability of Fleetwood Mac.

The sad reality is that Fleetwood Mac isn’t a $100 million band without her, and I can’t fault them for picking sides when that kind of money was involved. There are a lot of people on that payroll.

are you?

talking about "little people" on FM payroll that you are so worried about, there are plenty of stories how much Lindsey was protecting people from Stevie / Karen random rage decisions. gotta wonder what's been happening now when that protection is gone.

remember Jana's post about it, relatively recently?

[cbBen]

I've wondered about Brett Tuggle. I found it odd how he want from Stevie's band ($), to Lindsey's band (less $? and less touring), to leaving FM altogether (unlike Neale Heywood) when Lindsey left.

Also, I know he was on the first leg, but was Neale on the second leg of the Buckingham-McVie tour?

[aleuzzi]

several points here:

this make Christine look really bad - a spineless, horrible and ignorant person.
it's not really clear in several of the places what exactly is she talking about, and which timeframe - before or after Lindsey was thrown out by Mick and Stevie? like - "it was a really hard time" - when? when she found out Lindsey was out and had to make a decision whether to stay in the band?
"Lindsey, you know...." what do we know? that they screwed him? but she doesn't want to say it because it's a done deal now? "I really don't want to harp on this very much, because what's done is done." well Christine, even though it's a done deal, you can make it better or worse by saying hurtful stuff. and you are definitely making it worse.
did Mick tell her they'll disband if she says she's out if Lindsey is out - since apparently Mick told her Lindsey has to be out, there's no discussion about that, because there will be no FM 5 if they try to call Lindsey back because in that case Stevie will leave? "just too much animosity between certain members of the band"
the writer seems to describe Christine as being sad about the whole situation - "genuine regret at how things turned out" - yet other than that "really hard time" she doesn't say anywhere that she's sad about it so was there more that she said and they didn't quote? if so, why?
Christine obviously has no clue what democracy means. it's almost like Mick threw around the term and told her to use it and now she's using it.


talking about Mick, man we have to get to his ridiculous nonsensical logic. :laugh::] i just don't even feel like re-reading his blabbering-fool wording. one of these days.

I understand your anger and share much of it, but I'll refrain from judging Christine since, after a 16-yrear break, she stepped into a minefield. It's clear she has more musical respect for Lindsey than anyone else. He is her true collaborator. It's also true that Christine's sense of loyalty is to a band that she has loved and joined long before he was a part of that. That she sought out Mick to help her over her fear of flying says how close she is with him. Yes, all of the Brits chose the corporate entity over the creative surge of new music--but they clearly had to choose! THAT is not their fault. THAT fault belongs to the two who couldn't abide one another and made life miserable for everyone else.

Do I wish the band chose Lindsey over Stevie? You bet. The possibilities would have been so rich! But it simply wasn't going to happen. Greed, fear, and an entity called Management made sure of that. I don't think Christine had much of a choice if she wanted to stay involved--and she wants to stay involved.

[sasja]

This all came as a surprise to...? :]:]:]

These vapid, shallow, sad caricatures.
Did they forget you can't take it with you?

Odd to me that they chose dollars over respect and reputation.
This is what, in the end, they'll be remembered for.

Greed's karma is a bitch.

[Nicks Fan]

Exactly. It wasn't that long ago that she was opening for Rod Stewart. This idea that she's equal to FM with respect to her ability to draw a crowd solo is ridiculous.

100 percent agree. The last tour she did was successful because it was a double bill of classic rock acts. If she toured solo again with zero opening act she wouldn't get the numbers she had for 24karat gold She would likely get the same or slightly better then Buckvie got on their tour.

Tina Tuner last toured at aged 68-69 11 years ago with no support act and she sold out on her name alone. She didn't need an opener to sell tickets.

The fans who blindly worship her won't ever concede that though.

When I saw the Rod Stewart tour in MTL I was the ONLY SN fan there. Everyone else was there for him hands down. As soon as he hit the stage the went wild. When she performed her set they sat down and while they were respectful and clapped etc they were not dancing in the aisles either.

[Nicks Fan]

On Facebook there is a real crazed SN worshiper. Back when Lindsey was fired last year he attacked me on my wall and Lindsey a Bastard. Then he tried to say that the Buckingham McVie album was titled just that as a kiss off to SN referencing the Buckingham Nicks album. Later on in the year he rambles on about Lindsey's boring solo's and how he has to do them to try and compete with her talent. Yesterday he and I got into it and I just have to laugh at his stupid comments. All year long he was saying we don't know what happened or that Lindsey wasn't a team player etc and when I pointed out that the band has had three stories going about why he was fired and can't seem to stick to one he responds by saying that there are lots of stories going around and I cherry picking ones. Really??? Quoting what the band and PR people put out is cherry picking???

It gets better

He and another SN worshiper attack a friend of mine calling her out for being a Trump supporter and that that explains why she would support Lindsey vs supporting a strong intelligent women. Then go on and on about republicans don't have any strong intelligent women in their party etc. Not sure how being a Trump supporter has anything to do with supporting Lindsey.

I swear I can't make this **** up.

[jbrownsjr]

100 percent agree. The last tour she did was successful because it was a double bill of classic rock acts. If she toured solo again with zero opening act she wouldn't get the numbers she had for 24karat gold She would likely get the same or slightly better then Buckvie got on their tour.

Tina Tuner last toured at aged 68-69 11 years ago with no support act and she sold out on her name alone. She didn't need an opener to sell tickets.

The fans who blindly worship her won't ever concede that though.

When I saw the Rod Stewart tour in MTL I was the ONLY SN fan there. Everyone else was there for him hands down. As soon as he hit the stage the went wild. When she performed her set they sat down and while they were respectful and clapped etc they were not dancing in the aisles either.

Plus, it was the first time BuckVie ever toured. And they extended the tour. It was fantastic as far as I'm concerned. To compare it to SN/Pretenders tour is a bit ignorant of the circumstances. BuckVie made it's artistic imprint for the year and I'm quite impressed. What a summer of fun.

[bombaysaffires]

Mick wanted to make sure his cash cow is intact.



talking about "little people" on FM payroll that you are so worried about, there are plenty of stories how much Lindsey was protecting people from Stevie / Karen random rage decisions. gotta wonder what's been happening now when that protection is gone.

remember Jana's post about it, relatively recently?

Well, Mick wanted to make sure his cow was intact, we all know his cash rarely is.

Can you point to the Jana post? I recall one about Lindsey spending a couple hours on a flight discussing her music and having learned one of her songs to give her feedback etc. but not anything re: shielding people from rage decisions.:eek:

[jeets2000]

I understand your anger and share much of it, but I'll refrain from judging Christine since, after a 16-year break, she stepped into a minefield. It's clear she has more musical respect for Lindsey than anyone else. He is her true collaborator. It's also true that Christine's sense of loyalty is to a band that she has loved and joined long before he was a part of that. That she sought out Mick to help her over her fear of flying says how close she is with him. Yes, all of the Brits chose the corporate entity over the creative surge of new music--but they clearly had to choose! THAT is not their fault. THAT fault belongs to the two who couldn't abide one another and made life miserable for everyone else.

Do I wish the band chose Lindsey over Stevie? You bet. The possibilities would have been so rich! But it simply wasn't going to happen. Greed, fear, and an entity called Management made sure of that. I don't think Christine had much of a choice if she wanted to stay involved--and she wants to stay involved.

This is pretty much how I feel, too. And it appears to be the way the writer of the Mojo article was trying to describe Christine as well: stuck between a rock and a hard place. All that being said, I do think her "better than what we ever had before" is deeply regrettable. It's just so unnecessary in this context.

[TheWILDheart]

Sorry, I’m lost with this one.

Isn’t this article just a miss-mash of the comments that Lindsey has already made and the band being very vague and not actually admitting anything? Not Lindsey or Stevie bashing, just wanting to know if this is fans jumping to conclusions or if they’ve actually openly talked about what happened and ultimatums made by Stevie?

[bombaysaffires]

This is pretty much how I feel, too. And it appears to be the way the writer of the Mojo article was trying to describe Christine as well: stuck between a rock and a hard place. All that being said, I do think her "better than what we ever had before" is deeply regrettable. It's just so unnecessary in this context.

that almost sounds like a line written by the band's management/PR. It's sort of the typical album/tour/project promotion bs "best we've/I've ever done" "we/I had the most fun of anything we/I have ever worked on" etc etc.. Until promotion for the next thing happens and then they say how awful or difficult or whatever the previous ("best thing we've done") project/tour was. So maybe once they're off the road we could hear even more of the dirt.... Kinda surprising they are even saying what they're saying now... But I suspect it's because they've just been consistently called out as liars for so long now. Plus, they've realized it won't hurt ticket sales so what the hell, why not admit it. Although you'll never hear SN admit it, because while it won't necessarily affect her ticket sales it will affect her ego and her obsession with her "legacy".

Really, though, legacy lives on through your music. If your music is really that impactful people will be singing it forever and it becomes "classic". Other than Landslide, her songs aren't covered very much. I think of the Beatles, and everyone from other rockers to crooners like Sinatra covered their stuff. Stevie's songs can be hard to sing if you aren't Stevie because they are sooooo specifically written for her range and style; when other people sing them them their monotony becomes way too apparent. Her *stage* performances and her *visual* image have been far more impactful to how other female performers present themselves. She used to want to go down as a great songwriter; I'm afraid that's not going to be her biggest legacy, in part because she blew it off.

[bombaysaffires]

“Stevie is just unbelievable,” says McVie. “The more I see her perform on stage the better I think she is. She holds the fort. She’s a brand. We’re quite different in that way - I have an outside life. I live in London not the States. I like going shopping on my own. I have more of a normal life than her and that keeps me grounded. I have other friends and I do other things. I enjoy going sailing. Stevie is devoted to her career and boy, does she do it well.”


https://www.harpersbazaar.com/uk/cul..._medium=social

[jeets2000]

“Stevie is just unbelievable,” says McVie. “The more I see her perform on stage the better I think she is. She holds the fort. She’s a brand. We’re quite different in that way - I have an outside life. I live in London not the States. I like going shopping on my own. I have more of a normal life than her and that keeps me grounded. I have other friends and I do other things. I enjoy going sailing. Stevie is devoted to her career and boy, does she do it well.”


https://www.harpersbazaar.com/uk/cul..._medium=social

Well that is an eye-popping little quote, isn't it? Here's the full article

Christine McVie: inside the world of Fleetwood Mac, then and now
As the band prepares for its UK return in June, Christine McVie talks Glastonbury, rock 'n' roll and retirement
By Ella Alexander
March 21, 2019
https://www.harpersbazaar.com/uk/culture/a26892962/christine-mcvie-inside-the-world-of-fleetwood-mac/

June 2019 will be a big month for music fans for two reasons – an under-the-radar, little-known festival called Glastonbury and the return of Fleetwood Mac, the band’s first UK dates in six years. Sadly, this year at least, the two aren’t linked, but lead vocalist and songwriter Christine McVie says any decision to perform at Glastonbury isn’t down to the band itself.

“It isn’t up to me, it’s up to the management,” said McVie. “It’s their decision and down to logistics. I can’t say yes or no to Glastonbury, but I’d like to – so long as I don’t have to wear wellington boots on stage. Or maybe I’d just have to roll with it – wellie boots with mud.”

For now, fans will have to make do with two UK gigs at Wembley (the first time that McVie has performed in the UK with the group since officially rejoining), one of which sold out so fast that the band added a further date. Over 50 years after the band were first formed, appetite for Fleetwood Mac shows no signs of waning.

“Maybe people are just wondering when the first one of us is going to pop off because we’re not youngsters anymore,” laughs McVie. “Maybe people want to see us because they think it’s the last chance. We’re a young band at heart; you’d never think we are the age we are. We’re never static. It’s going to be fantastic.”

Any self-respecting rock ‘n’ roll band has encountered its fair share of drama, and Fleetwood Mac is no anomaly. There have been marriage, divorces and fall-outs, most recently the replacement of guitarist and vocalist Lindsey Buckingham after he was unceremoniously fired – a situation McVie described as “untenable”. The new line-up comprises Mick Fleetwood, John McVie, Stevie Nicks, and McVie along with newcomers Mike Campbell and Neil Finn.

“In the 70s, we were gods and goddesses,” says McVie. “Rumours was huge. We were a lot of younger and for a time it was a brilliant. It’s definitely more sober now. I think we’ve got better as I’ve grown older. We’re the best band we’ve ever been.”

For McVie, music was always her one true love. She dabbled with the idea of becoming an art teacher, but let that fall by the wayside (“I obviously didn’t fancy doing my last year of teacher training”) and started working as a window dresser in a department store. In 1967, she joined Chicken Shack where she first came across Fleetwood Mac on tour.

“I’ve never wanted to do anything else,” she says. “The band are like my family. I started writing songs when I was very young, but I wasn’t very good. In fact, I was quite paranoid about it. Then I joined Fleetwood Mac and Mick encouraged me to keep trying. I wrote all the time during that time and my pop developed into more of a blues style. It was Mick who told me to persevere and eventually I wrote a few good songs.”

A few good songs such as Don’t Stop, which chronicled how she felt after her separation from John McVie after eight years of marriage; You Make Lovin' Fun, about an affair she had with the band’s lighting director while she was still married to McVie (she told her husband that it was about her dog); and, of course, the perennial Songbird, which she wrote in just 30 minutes.

Fleetwood had a sound that was pivotal not only to the generation they were first born into, but for generations to come. But it wasn’t and still isn’t just the music that fans gravitate towards; it’s also to do with the chemistry shared between band members. McVie and Stevie Nicks shared a particularly close bond – Nicks calls her a mentor, sister and best friend. They shared and experienced a lot together – bad break-ups and affairs that probably shouldn’t have happened but did – all on a diet of drugs, alcohol and zero sleep. McVie says it was and still is their differences that make them close.

“Stevie is just unbelievable,” says McVie. “The more I see her perform on stage the better I think she is. She holds the fort. She’s a brand. We’re quite different in that way - I have an outside life. I live in London not the States. I like going shopping on my own. I have more of a normal life than her and that keeps me grounded. I have other friends and I do other things. I enjoy going sailing. Stevie is devoted to her career and boy, does she do it well.”

McVie says that, although they were on the road for a lot of the time in a male-dominated industry, she never came across any sexism or misconduct. “But maybe that’s just because we were surrounded by terrific guys,” she muses. “The guys in the band were all gentleman, as were the crew.”

It would be bitterly disappointing if such a legendary band hadn’t indulged in a rock ‘n’ roll lifestyle – and Fleetwood live up to expectations. McVie says her relationship with co-founder of The Beach Boys Dennis Wilson was her “craziest time”.

“We all drank a lot and did a lot of cocaine, we partied a lot, I don’t think I did anything terribly outrageous,” she says. “Except I once threw a cake out the window which landed on top of taxi. I was kind of the good girl in the group. That’s who I was. Stevie used to call me Mother Earth because I was always pretty grounded.”

However, being on the road took its toll on McVie and in 1998 – the same years she was inducted into Rock and Roll Hall of Fame - she quit the band and went into retirement for 15 years. She moved to Kent where she restored a Tudor house and kept a low profile. A fear of flying stopped her from going too far. But Mick Fleetwood has a knack of bringing people together, and he reached out to McVie at the right time.

She had started seeing a therapist to deal with her flying phobia, who – after a few sessions – asked her where in the world she’d most to be if she could fly anywhere.

“I said Maui because that’s where Mick was living at the time,” she said. “So, the therapist said, ‘why don’t you just a buy a ticket. You don’t have to get on the plane, just buy the ticket.’ Then as irony would have it, Mick called me just after and said ‘Look, I’m coming to London, are you around?’ I told him that I’d just bought a ticket to see him and he said, ‘well I’ll meet you in London then and we’ll fly back together.’ So that’s what I did.”

McVie rejoined the band not long after, and, as she says herself, the band has never sounded better – and, thankfully, retirement couldn’t be further away. “Mick Fleetwood is the granddaddy of the band and he will do anything to keep it together.

“Not many bands have had the same longevity; there is life in the old girl yet. It’s about finding new inspiration and enjoyment for each other. As long as we have that we’ll keep going.”

[moon]

"Mick admits FM lied"??
No, Mr. Fleetwood. YOU lied.
I don't see Christine or John saying that Lindsey was not telling the truth. Even Chris said that the thing involved Lindsey and Stevie, not the rest of the band. So please don't put the name of the entire band!

[michelej1]

“Stevie is just unbelievable,” says McVie. “The more I see her perform on stage the better I think she is. She holds the fort. She’s a brand. We’re quite different in that way - I have an outside life. I live in London not the States. I like going shopping on my own. I have more of a normal life than her and that keeps me grounded. I have other friends and I do other things. I enjoy going sailing. Stevie is devoted to her career and boy, does she do it well.”


https://www.harpersbazaar.com/uk/cul..._medium=social

It's good that Chris has a life, sailing, gardening, friends.

I really don't think that Stevie is still a good stage performer, if you're not in love with her. I always remember her past energy. Maybe it was fueled by cocaine, but I think it was just youth and exuberance. It was natural, like she couldn't contain herself. I remember video where she would jump and she wouldn't even have to bend her knees. It was almost as if she just levitated off the ground for a few seconds in platform heels. It was so effortless.

Now, it's not effortless and instead of changing her performance, like she changes the key to adapt to her current capabilities, she tries to give a nod to the old spins, kicks and physical stunts and they usually strike me as silly, rather than sensational, as in days of yore. More attempt than achievement.

But I still like the songs, so the concerts would still be worth it for those, if I hadn't written her off.

[lovethemac1]

It's good that Chris has a life, sailing, gardening, friends.

I really don't think that Stevie is still a good stage performer, if you're not in love with her. I always remember her past energy. Maybe it was fueled by cocaine, but I think it was just youth and exuberance. It was natural, like she couldn't contain herself. I remember video where she would jump and she wouldn't even have to bend her knees. It was almost as if she just levitated off the ground for a few seconds in platform heels. It was so effortless.

Now, it's not effortless and instead of changing her performance, like she changes the key to adapt to her current capabilities, she tries to give a nod to the old spins, kicks and physical stunts and they usually strike me as silly, rather than sensational, as in days of yore. More attempt than achievement.

But I still like the songs, so the concerts would still be worth it for those, if I hadn't written her off.

I find her crackhead dance completely embarrassing for her. As in I cringe for her and how it must look to see right now in person.

Never bothered me before because I loved (note the past tense?) her so much. Now she just looks like an idiot.

[singertobe]

My mom is trying to suggest that Lindsey may have been mocking Stevie for a while and musicares was the straw that broke the camel's back. She asked me if Lindsey had a history of being mean to her and I basically rattled off all I could remember from Carol's book. After I was done she said it was possible he was still like that. But I have my doubts. I don't think Kristen would've put up with what Carol and Stevie went through.

[button-lip]

are you?

talking about "little people" on FM payroll that you are so worried about, there are plenty of stories how much Lindsey was protecting people from Stevie / Karen random rage decisions. gotta wonder what's been happening now when that protection is gone.

remember Jana's post about it, relatively recently?

Honestly. Seeing some people here so worried about FM's payroll and citing that as the reason why they choose to continue touring and firing Lindsey instead of disbanding, when we all know Stevie is the one with the tantrums about people is so funny!

And yes, Mick and John and Christine and Stevie needs the money to survive, :shocked::shocked::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

[HomerMcvie]

And yes, Mick and John and Christine and Stevie needs the money to survive, :shocked::shocked::laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:

Well, in his defense, idiot Mick probably does!:lol:

[button-lip]

"Mick admits FM lied"??
No, Mr. Fleetwood. YOU lied.
I don't see Christine or John saying that Lindsey was not telling the truth. Even Chris said that the thing involved Lindsey and Stevie, not the rest of the band. So please don't put the name of the entire band!

Christine said they decision was based on democracy. Hence, she supports Mick's decision. And Stevie.

[bombaysaffires]

Well that is an eye-popping little quote, isn't it? Here's the full article

Christine McVie: inside the world of Fleetwood Mac, then and now
As the band prepares for its UK return in June, Christine McVie talks Glastonbury, rock 'n' roll and retirement
By Ella Alexander
March 21, 2019
https://www.harpersbazaar.com/uk/culture/a26892962/christine-mcvie-inside-the-world-of-fleetwood-mac/


thanks for putting the whole article up!

[elle]

Christine said they decision was based on democracy. Hence, she supports Mick's decision. And Stevie.

it sounded to me more like she doesn't know what the word democracy means.

[bombaysaffires]

It's good that Chris has a life, sailing, gardening, friends.

I really don't think that Stevie is still a good stage performer, if you're not in love with her. I always remember her past energy. Maybe it was fueled by cocaine, but I think it was just youth and exuberance. It was natural, like she couldn't contain herself. I remember video where she would jump and she wouldn't even have to bend her knees. It was almost as if she just levitated off the ground for a few seconds in platform heels. It was so effortless.

Now, it's not effortless and instead of changing her performance, like she changes the key to adapt to her current capabilities, she tries to give a nod to the old spins, kicks and physical stunts and they usually strike me as silly, rather than sensational, as in days of yore. More attempt than achievement.

But I still like the songs, so the concerts would still be worth it for those, if I hadn't written her off.


What I love about this quote from Christine is that it is such a passive-aggressive swipe at Stevie...disguised as a compliment about her strength but really a dig at how limited her life is. She's all over the map on where she stands on Stevie, Lindsey, and everything. She has no bones to pick with Lindsey, but she'll agree to fire him. Stevie is a great brand holding the fort down, but she's a spoiled star living not in the real world.

[Storms123]

[QUOTE=elle;1250925]it sounded to me more like she doesn't know what the word democracy means.[/QUOTT


THIS!! Chris is struggling with the English language right now. Actually, she's just struggling. Period.

[HomerMcvie]

What I love about this quote from Christine is that it is such a passive-aggressive swipe at Stevie...disguised as a compliment about her strength but really a dig at how limited her life is. She's all over the map on where she stands on Stevie, Lindsey, and everything. She has no bones to pick with Lindsey, but she'll agree to fire him. Stevie is a great brand holding the fort down, but she's a spoiled star living not in the real world.

I agree with this, 100%.

While it was a ......"compliment"(cough), it was a total DIG at $tevie not having ANY kind of life, outside of stardom, and surrounded by her yes people.

And yet I still don't give Chris a pass for the firing of Lindsey. I never will. Sucking up after the fact just isn't enough. Nice try, though. Too bad you didn't save the day. Superwoman, indeed. Too little, too late. :mad: Her legacy is being a wuss!

[TrueFaith77]

I agree with this, 100%.

While it was a ......"compliment"(cough), it was a total DIG at $tevie not having ANY kind of life, outside of stardom, and surrounded by her yes people.

And yet I still don't give Chris a pass for the firing of Lindsey. I never will. Sucking up after the fact just isn't enough. Nice try, though. Too bad you didn't save the day. Superwoman, indeed. Too little, too late. :mad: Her legacy is being a wuss!

Exactly! “Nobody gives me ultimatums. I’m Christine motherf’ing McVie”

Instead, it was: “oh, y’all fired Lindsey without even giving me a head’s up? Democracy is cool!!”

[michelej1]

What I love about this quote from Christine is that it is such a passive-aggressive swipe at Stevie...disguised as a compliment about her strength but really a dig at how limited her life is. She's all over the map on where she stands on Stevie, Lindsey, and everything. She has no bones to pick with Lindsey, but she'll agree to fire him. Stevie is a great brand holding the fort down, but she's a spoiled star living not in the real world.

I think it was around the IYD publicity, not sure, but remember when Stevie said she couldn’t date this guy because if they went out in public she wouldn’t want to be seen with him because she’s ... Stevie Nicks. She doesn’t even have other friends any longer, unless you count celebrity fan girls like Vanessa.

[HomerMcvie]

I think it was around the IYD publicity, not sure, but remember when Stevie said she couldn’t date this guy because if they went out in public she wouldn’t want to be seen with him because she’s ... Stevie Nicks. She doesn’t even have other friends any longer, unless you count celebrity fan girls like Vanessa.

What a f**king PATHETIC life she lives. She has no idea what it is to just be a real person. She's earned this sad life she has. I hope she realizes it at some point before she dies. But she won't. Because $he's $tevie Nicks.

[David]

I think it was around the IYD publicity, not sure, but remember when Stevie said she couldn’t date this guy because if they went out in public she wouldn’t want to be seen with him because she’s ... Stevie Nicks. She doesn’t even have other friends any longer, unless you count celebrity fan girls like Vanessa.
Am I imagining it or have many of Stevie's old, old friends kind of dropped out of her life? Christie Alsbury (Thomason), Dennis Dunstan (who once said, "I talk to Mick and Christine every week—with Stevie, she is surrounded by her entourage so it's very, very hard"), Sara Fleetwood, Rebecca Alvarez, Rhonda Messersmith, Tom Moncrieff, just dozens of people who weren't necessarily just "hires" (although they may have had a job with the org).

[bombaysaffires]

Am I imagining it or have many of Stevie's old, old friends kind of dropped out of her life? Christie Alsbury (Thomason), Dennis Dunstan (who once said, "I talk to Mick and Christine every week—with Stevie, she is surrounded by her entourage so it's very, very hard"), Sara Fleetwood, Rebecca Alvarez, Rhonda Messersmith, Tom Moncrieff, just dozens of people who weren't necessarily just "hires" (although they may have had a job with the org).

Trivia: Christie is now Christie Lindsey, married to Ray Lindsey.

[button-lip]

What a f**king PATHETIC life she lives. She has no idea what it is to just be a real person. She's earned this sad life she has. I hope she realizes it at some point before she dies. But she won't. Because $he's $tevie Nicks.

Hey, she has the undying love of her fans. Those that fill arenas every night. And don't you forget it. :lol::lol::lol:

[nicepace]

"And so it's been fun," Fleetwood says. "And this is no deference in any way to Lindsey.

Mick finally tells the truth. That sentence means, literally: "this is no respect in any way to Lindsey."

Mick shouldn't be using vocabulary he doesn't understand. It just makes him look even worse than he already does.

[guillamene]

Mick finally tells the truth. That sentence means, literally: "this is no respect in any way to Lindsey."

Mick shouldn't be using vocabulary he doesn't understand. It just makes him look even worse than he already does.

Yes! This struck me too when I read the article!

[button-lip]

Mick finally tells the truth. That sentence means, literally: "this is no respect in any way to Lindsey."

Mick shouldn't be using vocabulary he doesn't understand. It just makes him look even worse than he already does.

I doubt he doesn't know what he's saying. Same with Christine.

They want to stay "loyal" to Stevie, and at the same time try to repair what's left of their relationship with Lindsey.
Unfortunately you can't have both.

[bombaysaffires]

hmmm.... I'm gonna go with this being more of Mick's word salad... just pick random words and toss them together without really knowing what they mean. Classic Mick.

[singertobe]

I just read the first chapter of Mick's autobiography and its all about how he struggled in school. So I'm not surprised that he's using words incorrectly. We all have our faults :shrug:

[Netter75]

Mick finally tells the truth. That sentence means, literally: "this is no respect in any way to Lindsey."

Mick shouldn't be using vocabulary he doesn't understand. It just makes him look even worse than he already does.

Lol he's definitely not using that right. I think he meant "This is not in respect to Lindsey" as "this is nothing relating to Lindsey" by using the word like ""the government's record in this respect is a mixed one"", but my understanding is that deference is not a synonym for respect in that definition.

Like someone else said, that man uses a lot of words to not say much at all.

[button-lip]

I just read the first chapter of Mick's autobiography and its all about how he struggled in school. So I'm not surprised that he's using words incorrectly. We all have our faults :shrug:

Yeah... too bad he didn’t struggle when it came to firing Lindsey....

We don’t use the word “fired”.

[aleuzzi]

And yet I still don't give Chris a pass for the firing of Lindsey. I never will. Sucking up after the fact just isn't enough. Nice try, though. Too bad you didn't save the day. Superwoman, indeed. Too little, too late. :mad: Her legacy is being a wuss!

I get your position but I don't think Christine haters realize the extent of the power she lost in the sixteen years she was absent. She rejoined a legacy corporation that enables her to play and sing her old songs with old friends. Those friends are really Mick and John and, to some extent, Stevie.

Even during the making of BuckVie and the press interviews that followed, she made a distinction between his being her musical collaborator and not someone she socializes with. She wants her cake and to eat it, too: creativity and friendship, but when push comes to shove one trumps the other...and that is loyalty to Mick.

Do I wish she had returned from England and said "Hell no." Absolutely. But, in reality, what would that have accomplished? She wanted to tour. Had she said "Not without Lindsey" the likelihood is that the whole engine would have crapped out. The decision between Stevie and Lindsey was Mick's to make and he made it for all-too obvious reasons. Yes, Christine went along with it out of fear and greed, but really, what would her resistance have accomplished? She is not networked with management the same way Stevie is, and she's still rambling on about how happy she was to return after 16 years. She simply doesn't have that "guiding hand" Stevie once said she had. That to me is sad. But I don't hate her and I don't think she's a wuss. I think she simply hitched her wagon to a trainwreck.

[michelej1]

I think Mick simply meant, “with all deference to Lindsey” meaning he bows down to him for his contributions to the band, BUT ...

Christine did not just choose to side with her “friends”, she wasn’t even civil to Lindsey. That’s the thing. Whether he was your best buddy or not, when you’ve known someone that long and they are pushed out of a group that they dedicated their life to, you can reach out to them. Your lawyer may tell you not to, but he’s not going to kill you if you do.

When a person you know and have just toured with has just had emergency open heart surgery, you call them. You wish them well when you are on stage singing songs he produced.

She could have made a business decision while still acting like a flesh and blood human being.

[HomerMcvie]

I think Mick simply meant, “with all deference to Lindsey” meaning he bows down to him for his contributions to the band, BUT ...

Christine did not just choose to side with her “friends”, she wasn’t even civil to Lindsey. That’s the thing. Whether he was your best buddy or not, when you’ve known someone that long and they are pushed out of a group that they dedicated their life to, you can reach out to them. Your lawyer may tell you not to, but he’s not going to kill you if you do.

When a person you know and have just toured with has just had emergency open heart surgery, you call them. You wish them well when you are on stage singing songs he produced.

She could have made a business decision while still acting like a flesh and blood human being.

They just want to sell tickets, and have decided that ignoring the issueS is the best way.

Even if it makes them look like callous, heartless, ass faces. Which it does!

[elle]

Do I wish she had returned from England and said "Hell no." Absolutely. But, in reality, what would that have accomplished? She wanted to tour. Had she said "Not without Lindsey" the likelihood is that the whole engine would have crapped out. The decision between Stevie and Lindsey was Mick's to make and he made it for all-too obvious reasons. Yes, Christine went along with it out of fear and greed, but really, what would her resistance have accomplished? She is not networked with management the same way Stevie is, and she's still rambling on about how happy she was to return after 16 years. She simply doesn't have that "guiding hand" Stevie once said she had. That to me is sad. But I don't hate her and I don't think she's a wuss. I think she simply hitched her wagon to a trainwreck.

it would have accomplished a few things:

band would have needed to rethink Lindsey's firing.
band would have to go back to managers and say - Christine is out if Lindsey is out (John should have done the same and say he's out) , and managers would have to reassess the strategy when 2 out of 3 singer-songwriters are out.
they may have ended up disbanding. which would be better than what they did now. Christine could have toured with Lindsey just like they planned to do in between FM dates. so the reasoning that she wouldn't be able to play music is bogus.


or they may have ended up having to do some group therapy to get everyone on the same page.


Stevie may have bluffed, or maybe she was really ready to leave the band:

if she bluffed she would come back.
if she didn't, they could have toured as 4, wouldn't have had to hire anyone new, and could have added some fresh BuckVie music. we could have had another BuckVie album almost done by now. they would have been selling out sheds instead of arenas.


possibilities are endless, if Christine (and John) had some spine. friendship to Mick? what about Mick's friendship to Christine and John? it's a 2-way street.

Christine presented it in Mojo interview as the only possibility presented to her after they told her that they fired Lindsey was either disband or she needs to come back. she cannot be that stupid to really believe that. but maybe she is. :shrug:

[button-lip]

I think Mick simply meant, “with all deference to Lindsey” meaning he bows down to him for his contributions to the band, BUT ...

Christine did not just choose to side with her “friends”, she wasn’t even civil to Lindsey. That’s the thing. Whether he was your best buddy or not, when you’ve known someone that long and they are pushed out of a group that they dedicated their life to, you can reach out to them. Your lawyer may tell you not to, but he’s not going to kill you if you do.

When a person you know and have just toured with has just had emergency open heart surgery, you call them. You wish them well when you are on stage singing songs he produced.

She could have made a business decision while still acting like a flesh and blood human being.


THIS! Only God knows how many hours of their lives this 5 people shared. Good and bad, I don't care. On a certain level, they bonded. Lawyers and corporate decisions shouldn't matter when the life of someone you have known for so long is in danger.

But it was silence…. or awkward and politically correct messages to him. Nothing else. And that's why they're all dead to me. And it should be the same to Lindsey. :nod::nod::nod:

[elle]

THIS! Only God knows how many hours of their lives this 5 people shared. Good and bad, I don't care. On a certain level, they bonded. Lawyers and corporate decisions shouldn't matter when the life of someone you have known for so long is in danger.

But it was silence…. or awkward and politically correct messages to him. Nothing else. And that's why they're all dead to me. And it should be the same to Lindsey. :nod::nod::nod:

publicly. and more spitting all over him.

but we don't know whether they reached out privately. which i agree would not nearly be enough, but just want to be fair.

[Storms123]

[QUOTE=elle;1251000]it would have accomplished a few things:

band would have needed to rethink Lindsey's firing.
band would have to go back to managers and say - Christine is out if Lindsey is out (John should have done the same and say he's out) , and managers would have to reassess the strategy when 2 out of 3 singer-songwriters are out.
they may have ended up disbanding. which would be better than what they did now. Christine could have toured with Lindsey just like they planned to do in between FM dates. so the reasoning that she wouldn't be able to play music is bogus.


or they may have ended up having to do some group therapy to get everyone on the same page.


Stevie may have bluffed, or maybe she was really ready to leave the band:

if she bluffed she would come back.
if she didn't, they could have toured as 4, wouldn't have had to hire anyone new, and could have added some fresh BuckVie music. we could have had another BuckVie album almost done by now. they would have been selling out sheds instead of arenas.


____________________________________________________________________________________________________ _________________________________________________________
They should have called her bluff. She wouldn't have walked. Her RRHOF induction is in the middle of the FM tour--they are conveniently on the East Coast at the time. Yes I know Irving Azoff is "magical" and part of the coven but this all seems soooo fortuitously planned. I doubt it was a case of "Lets make sure we are on the east coast in March 2019 just "in case she gets in". She was in period and it was probably known by people long before she was "actually in" She's getting more publicity around the induction because of the tour. They should have called her bluff!
She and Mick are really good about getting the media to pay attention to them. Stevie moreso than Mick, just because she's actually more relevant than he is. She makes everything about her. That's why is SOOOO curious they have really shut her up on the publicity front for this tour. It's a completely extreme from last tours. She makes everything about her---and she will make "The great reconciliation" about her too. Whether there is one or not---she will tell the tale there was one. And Mick (Mr. Sloppy Datey) will jump on the bandwagon. It will tie into the narrative she's told for years too well.

[button-lip]

publicly. and more spitting all over him.

but we don't know whether they reached out privately. which i agree would not nearly be enough, but just want to be fair.

Well, as far as March 10th, this "nice people" haven't reached out to him, according to his wife. I mean, if he still didn't know why he was fired, it's safe to assume none of them took some time out of their tight schedule to call someone they have known for more than 40 years to know how he is.

[aleuzzi]

I think Mick simply meant, “with all deference to Lindsey” meaning he bows down to him for his contributions to the band, BUT ...

Christine did not just choose to side with her “friends”, she wasn’t even civil to Lindsey. That’s the thing. Whether he was your best buddy or not, when you’ve known someone that long and they are pushed out of a group that they dedicated their life to, you can reach out to them. Your lawyer may tell you not to, but he’s not going to kill you if you do.

When a person you know and have just toured with has just had emergency open heart surgery, you call them. You wish them well when you are on stage singing songs he produced.

She could have made a business decision while still acting like a flesh and blood human being.


Yeah, you're right. It is disappointing. Beyond.

[StreetAngel86]

Mick finally admitting he / the band lied in CBS interview and all their PR, and that it was Stevie who pulled the trigger as Lindsey was saying from the start :nod: :thumbsup:
Christine saying that the issue was between Stevie and Lindsey, not the rest of the band
Mick basically saying "screw you" to all the fans being unhappy with the band and their lies on social media :]:]



Stevie needs to grow some (Mick) balls and take ownership of this.
Mick needs to stop talking. Hardly surprising they give no #*%ts about the FANS
that this was because of SnL issues ... surprise surprise.
More Stevie issues than SnL but ...
KB saying all was good with them in Jan just tells me there was stuff she didn't know. Because nothing was right about that event or the pics even before we knew anything was going on.

[Storms123]

Stevie needs to grow some (Mick) balls and take ownership of this.
Mick needs to stop talking. Hardly surprising they give no #*%ts about the FANS
that this was because of SnL issues ... surprise surprise.
More Stevie issues than SnL but ...
KB saying all was good with them in Jan just tells me there was stuff she didn't know. Because nothing was right about that event or the pics even before we knew anything was going on.

TRUE! I need this tour to end. Just end.

[SteveMacD]

are you?
That’s rich coming from someone who moderates at least one Facebook group and hunts down the social media of anyone remotely connected to the band.

There’s only one band I’ve ever worked for.

talking about "little people" on FM payroll that you are so worried about, there are plenty of stories how much Lindsey was protecting people from Stevie / Karen random rage decisions. gotta wonder what's been happening now when that protection is gone.
I don’t care about how bitchy Stevie or Karen are, or any intervention that Jesus Buckingham might have made. The payroll for a Fleetwood Mac is significantly higher, which means more people get work, when Stevie is in the band.

remember Jana's post about it, relatively recently?
No, because I don’t have the time, energy, or desire to follow someone who’s been out of the loop for a decade and a half.

[FM77]

Exactly. It wasn't that long ago that she was opening for Rod Stewart. This idea that she's equal to FM with respect to her ability to draw a crowd solo is ridiculous.

But it is still 10 and 20x what LB draws as a solo act. Stevie is the only member who can tour solo and pull in what she does touring with FM.

[michelej1]

Stevie doesn't pull in solo what she pulls in with FM, period. Then, when you count in what she has to pay her singers and musicians, she makes even less.

But if your point is that she can make solo more than the other 4 could combined, that's certainly true.

[button-lip]

Stevie doesn't pull in solo what she pulls in with FM, period. Then, when you count in what she has to pay her singers and musicians, she makes even less.

But if your point is that she can make solo more than the other 4 could combined, that's certainly true.

If her solo career were more profitable than FM, she would have left the band a long time ago.
And she can't feel an arena alone. no matter what her old fans and her new fans say. :nod::nod::laugh:

[elle]

That’s rich coming from someone who moderates at least one Facebook group and hunts down the social media of anyone remotely connected to the band.
:laugh: talk about reading comprehension problems. i didn't suddenly change from hating LB to liking him. i was always here as a LB fan. you on the other hand went from "FM better without Stevie" to defending her up and down every social media outlet you can find. it's a weird turnaround. :shrug:

I don’t care about how bitchy Stevie or Karen are, or any intervention that Jesus Buckingham might have made. The payroll for a Fleetwood Mac is significantly higher, which means more people get work, when Stevie is in the band.
you are concerned about people's jobs, supposedly. and about people not being fired on a whim. well, maybe it's not just LB who gets fired on a whim with those people.

No, because I don’t have the time, energy, or desire to follow someone who’s been out of the loop for a decade and a half.
and yet you are here all day every day. and you either have notifications set up for my posts, or you are on facebook all day every day too, because whatever group or page i post in, 5 minutes later i get a notification someone replied to my post and guess who that is? you certainly seem to have all the time in the world to hunt down what i post about FM. very weird. or i guess i should be flattered since apparently i'm worth your time more than members or ex members of FM and their backing band.:rolleyes::lol: :shrug:

[elle]

some spinoff articles, not sure whether they were posted somewhere or not. it's funny how every article spins the info in a different way sometimes completely contradicting. guess that's what Mick was going for with his wordvomit. :shrug:

https://metro.co.uk/2019/03/19/fleetwood-mac-confirm-lindsey-buckingham-ditched-stevie-nicks-feud-8941083/?ito=article.desktop.share.top.facebook

Fleetwood Mac confirm Lindsey Buckingham was ditched over Stevie Nicks feud
Emma KellyTuesday 19 Mar 2019 11:16 am Share this article via facebook

Lindsey and Stevie had a massive falling out (Picture: Steven Ferdman/Getty Images)

Mick Fleetwood and Christine McVie have confirmed that they chose to ditch Lindsey Buckingham from Fleetwood Mac due to his feud with ex Stevie Nicks. Guitarist Lindsey left the band last year under acrimonious circumstances, later claiming that he had been fired by Stevie. It was reported that Stevie – who had a long-running romantic relationship with Buckingham while in the band – was furious about his ‘smirking’ behaviour at a MusiCares benefit gig, and refused to share a stage with him ever again. Initially, Mick Fleetwood said that Buckingham left the band because he would not sign off on a tour they were planning – but he has now admitted his deteriorating relationship with Stevie was to blame.

Mike Campbell and Neil Finn have replaced Lindsey (Picture: JB Lacroix/WireImage)

Speaking to Mojo, the 71-year-old said: ‘Support really could not be given to ask the situation to continue. It was too challenging. ‘The truth is, call it what you want, a parting of company took place, and it had to take place, and it was supported by the remaining band members around something that for sure was a major problem to two people – Lindsey and Stevie.’ Christine, 75, added: ‘It was the only route we could take, because there was too much animosity between certain members of the band at that point, there was just no way it could’ve gone on as a five-piece, a group with Lindsey in the band. So it was either just completely break up the band or make the best of it.’

MORE: FLEETWOOD MAC Fleetwood Mac's Lindsey Buckingham undergoes open heart surgery

Buckingham was replaced by Mike Campbell, formerly of Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers, and Neil Finn of Split Enz and Crowded House. He went on to sue his former bandmates in October 2018, claiming breach of fiduciary duty, lost earnings and breach of oral contract. However, a settlement was reached at the end of the year. Buckingham underwent open heart surgery in February, and suffered damage to his vocal cords in the process.


Read more: https://metro.co.uk/2019/03/19/fleetwood-mac-confirm-lindsey-buckingham-ditched-stevie-nicks-feud-8941083/?ito=article.desktop.share.top.facebook?ito=cbshare

Twitter: https://twitter.com/MetroUK | Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MetroUK/

[elle]

and another one...

https://www.wonderwall.com/news/fleetwood-mac-members-dish-lindsey-buckinghams-2018-firing-3018872.article?fbclid=IwAR0IwOsHX8-rQr425PCDO5jBRe00XemoEEJZO7S8tTiLk4c0PHHD1-Dm18A


FIRING SQUAD
FLEETWOOD MAC MEMBERS DISH ON LINDSEY BUCKINGHAM'S 2018 'FIRING'
By Mark Gray Wonderwall 10:15am PDT, Mar 20, 2019

For Fleetwood Mac to continue being the legendary band that they are, the group had no choice but to part ways with Lindsey Buckingham, which they did last year.

In a chat with Mojo, Mick Fleetwood said it was "too challenging" to have former lovers Stevie Nicks and Lindsey in the group, admitting that a "parting of company" was the only choice.

Matt Baron/REX/Shutterstock

"We were not happy. It is no secret that Lindsey and Stevie are in a continuum Liz Taylor/ Richard Burton type of life, and it went in and out of valleys and mountaintops and God knows what through the years - that support really could not be given to ask the situation to continue. It was too challenging," he said. "Someone in some interview said, 'What'd you do, fire him?' You can say that if you want but I think that's an ugly word, knowing what this man has done in the ranks of Fleetwood Mac…"

Stephen Lovekin/REX/Shutterstock

Last year, Lindsey was kicked out of Fleetwood Mac. He eventually sued the the band and reached a settlement. Afterward, Lindsey was eventually replaced by Mike Campbell and Neil Finn.

"The truth is, call it what you want, a parting of company took place, and it had to take place, and it was supported by the remaining band members around something that for sure was a major problem to two people - Lindsey and Stevie," Mick said.

Dave Allocca/Starpix/REX/Shutterstock
Keyboardist Christine McVie feared the band would have to "completely break up" if Lindsey wasn't shown his walking papers.

"For whatever reasons, a lot being personal, it was the only route we could take, because there was too much animosity between certain members of the band at that point, there was just no way it could've gone on as a five-piece, a group with Lindsey in the band," she said. "So it was either just completely break up the band or make the best of it."

Still, Christine says is was a "really bad time" for the group and for her personally, as she had no problem with the guitarist.

"I loved working with him but I did see the point and I did see what the problem was," she said. "And you know, we're a democracy and we have to kind of make the best of a bad job. As it turns out, what we have now is better than what we ever had before."

[SteveMacD]

:laugh: talk about reading comprehension problems. i didn't suddenly change from hating LB to liking him.
Yeah, but your views on Christine and Fleetwood Mac sure took a sharp turn. I’ve been very consistent. I’ve never claimed that Mick, John, and Christine weren’t my favorites. They are the band in my eyes, and ability to read liner notes.

But, I never hated Lindsey. He annoys and disappoints me and I didn’t appreciate his passive aggressive comments about the 87-96 lineups, but he was still one of my heroes.

As for Fleetwood Mac, I’m still indifferent if Stevie and Lindsey are in the band. I was happy with Billy Burnette and Bekka Bramlett. I’d love nothing more than a club-theater tour where they would just cut loose, but its not my livelihood on the line. Or the livelihoods of others.

i was always here as a LB fan. you on the other hand went from "FM better without Stevie" to defending her up and down every social media outlet you can find. it's a weird turnaround. :shrug:
My world doesn’t revolve around Stevie-Lindsey/White Spy-Black Spy thing. Are Mick, John, and Christine playing together? I’m in.

I’m neutral about Stevie, but the numbers don’t lie, no matter what I think. Stevie worked at stardom, Lindsey worked at artistry, and Mick, John, and Christine worked at keeping the band going. Stevie is the star, Lindsey is the artist, and the others still have a band. The genius in their latest move is that they still have their artistic credentials with Neil Finn, who has ten more studio albums than Lindsey.

And, while I thought the band should have parted with Stevie, I never thought she owed everything to Lindsey. I always acknowledged that she worked hard at developing her own brand, largely by doing duets that had her working with people outside of Fleetwood Mac and becoming a viable entity outside of the band.

The biggest thing I have always maintained that Stevie and Lindsey walked into an amazing opportunity. Fleetwood Mac was well established, had regular radio play, had been on TV, had been in the music press throughout 1974, were managed in-house, and were on a major label that liked them. Lindsey didn’t hit a home run, the band was already on third.

you are concerned about people's jobs, supposedly. and about people not being fired on a whim. well, maybe it's not just LB who gets fired on a whim with those people.
I was a roadie and studio assistant for six years. Not a professional roadie like Fleetwood Mac have, as could be expected in indie rock, but I still had to work with management, promoters, workers at the venues, sound guys, lighting guys, and the band itself. That said, management should clearly explain what the expectations are upfront in situations like Fleetwood Mac.

Still doesn’t change the fact that more people have jobs with this tour than if Stevie wasn’t there.

and yet you are here all day every day. and you either have notifications set up for my posts, or you are on facebook all day every day too, because whatever group or page i post in, 5 minutes later i get a notification someone replied to my post and guess who that is? you certainly seem to have all the time in the world to hunt down what i post about FM. very weird. or i guess i should be flattered since apparently i'm worth your time more than members or ex members of FM and their backing band.:rolleyes::lol: :shrug:

Well, there’s a lot of dead time dealing illness and being a caregiver…Don’t humor yourself, I only reply to what comes up on Facebook. That said, still rich coming from someone who runs at least one Facebook group and who stalks anyone remotely connected to Fleetwood Mac. I only post here and on the Fleetwood Mac News group, and very occasionally the Mike Campbell Fans group.

[sodascouts]

"Someone in some interview said, 'What'd you do, fire him?' You can say that if you want but I think that's an ugly thing to do, knowing what this man has done in the ranks of Fleetwood Mac…"


Fixed that for ya, Mick.

[elle]

Well, there’s a lot of dead time dealing illness and being a caregiver…Don’t humor yourself, I only reply to what comes up on Facebook. That said, still rich coming from someone who runs at least one Facebook group and who stalks anyone remotely connected to Fleetwood Mac. I only post here and on the Fleetwood Mac News group, and very occasionally the Mike Campbell Fans group.
i wish i didn't have to. how does everything i post on facebook come up for you, i wonder? maybe you should stop stalking me. :rolleyes:

and yes, i moderate a LB facebook group - i like to discuss LB's music and what's happening around it, to state the obvious. :laugh: it's a nice place for people to share and congregate, including people connected to the band. it's public and everyone can see what people are talking about there, unlike all the private and secret "FM" and SN groups that sow hate and discord, and "get over it" bs. no, i do not "stalk" everything connected to FM - i unfollowed everything and everyone who has to do anything with fakewood. if you show up on my timeline or in my LB search, means you mentioned either me or LB. simple as that.

you've been gushing about Stevie. that's the weird part. not your supposed favorites Mick and McVies. and not about music but about what's commercial. and for some weird reason you seem to love kicking people when they are down.

[bombaysaffires]

some spinoff articles, not sure whether they were posted somewhere or not. it's funny how every article spins the info in a different way sometimes completely contradicting. guess that's what Mick was going for with his wordvomit. :shrug:

https://metro.co.uk/2019/03/19/fleetwood-mac-confirm-lindsey-buckingham-ditched-stevie-nicks-feud-8941083/?ito=article.desktop.share.top.facebook

Fleetwood Mac confirm Lindsey Buckingham was ditched over Stevie Nicks feud
Emma KellyTuesday 19 Mar 2019 11:16 am Share this article via facebook

Lindsey and Stevie had a massive falling out (Picture: Steven Ferdman/Getty Images)

Mick Fleetwood and Christine McVie have confirmed that they chose to ditch Lindsey Buckingham from Fleetwood Mac due to his feud with ex Stevie Nicks. Guitarist Lindsey left the band last year under acrimonious circumstances, later claiming that he had been fired by Stevie. It was reported that Stevie – who had a long-running romantic relationship with Buckingham while in the band – was furious about his ‘smirking’ behaviour at a MusiCares benefit gig, and refused to share a stage with him ever again. Initially, Mick Fleetwood said that Buckingham left the band because he would not sign off on a tour they were planning – but he has now admitted his deteriorating relationship with Stevie was to blame.

Mike Campbell and Neil Finn have replaced Lindsey (Picture: JB Lacroix/WireImage)

Speaking to Mojo, the 71-year-old said: ‘Support really could not be given to ask the situation to continue. It was too challenging. ‘The truth is, call it what you want, a parting of company took place, and it had to take place, and it was supported by the remaining band members around something that for sure was a major problem to two people – Lindsey and Stevie.’ Christine, 75, added: ‘It was the only route we could take, because there was too much animosity between certain members of the band at that point, there was just no way it could’ve gone on as a five-piece, a group with Lindsey in the band. So it was either just completely break up the band or make the best of it.’

MORE: FLEETWOOD MAC Fleetwood Mac's Lindsey Buckingham undergoes open heart surgery

Buckingham was replaced by Mike Campbell, formerly of Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers, and Neil Finn of Split Enz and Crowded House. He went on to sue his former bandmates in October 2018, claiming breach of fiduciary duty, lost earnings and breach of oral contract. However, a settlement was reached at the end of the year. Buckingham underwent open heart surgery in February, and suffered damage to his vocal cords in the process.


Read more: https://metro.co.uk/2019/03/19/fleetwood-mac-confirm-lindsey-buckingham-ditched-stevie-nicks-feud-8941083/?ito=article.desktop.share.top.facebook?ito=cbshare

Twitter: https://twitter.com/MetroUK | Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/MetroUK/


it's really bs how they are framing the issue in all these articles (based on whatever the band is telling them) that *He* had an issue with Stevie, that *HE* had an ongoing feud with Stevie that re-ignited and therefore forced the band's hand in firing him.

SHE had a feud going with HIM, and SHE re-ignited it and then gave the band an ultimatum.

I really, really, really want someone to ask her, and if not her (because the armored PR guards around her likely won't ever allow it) ask the others why oh why did she not threaten to leave ALL of them given their behavior at Musicares, you know, when MICK and CHRIS were waltzing away during her speech? Hmmmm???? Is there a *scale* to rate things on... like, a waltz is worth 5 points, but a smirk, well now that's 10 points and that crosses the line!

[SteveMacD]

i wish i didn't have to. how does everything i post on facebook come up for you, i wonder? maybe you should stop stalking me. :rolleyes:

Seriously, WTF are you talking about? Unless you’re secretly Allan B, I hardly ever reply to you on Facebook.

unlike all the private and secret "FM" and SN groups that sow hate and discord, and "get over it" bs.
No clue about those, and they sound about as interesting as a secret papier-mâché group. But what’s the difference between what they apparently do and what Team Lindsey does?

you've been gushing about Stevie. that's the weird part.
Not really. Most of what I say is in response to people overdoing it on how much credit they give Lindsey for their success, just like I do with Stevie fans who get a little carried away. I never actually give my opinion on the quality of her work. However, I never thought she owed Lindsey anything and acknowledge that she worked hard at making a name for herself outside the band.

not your supposed favorites Mick and McVies. and not about music but about what's commercial. and for some weird reason you seem to love kicking people when they are down.
With all of my replies to all of your Facebook posts, I don’t see how you could have missed that one of the reasons I like this change is because I got to hear Christine get a few extended solos, which wouldn’t have happened with Lindsey Karaoke.

[button-lip]

it's really bs how they are framing the issue in all these articles (based on whatever the band is telling them) that *He* had an issue with Stevie, that *HE* had an ongoing feud with Stevie that re-ignited and therefore forced the band's hand in firing him.

SHE had a feud going with HIM, and SHE re-ignited it and then gave the band an ultimatum.

I really, really, really want someone to ask her, and if not her (because the armored PR guards around her likely won't ever allow it) ask the others why oh why did she not threaten to leave ALL of them given their behavior at Musicares, you know, when MICK and CHRIS were waltzing away during her speech? Hmmmm???? Is there a *scale* to rate things on... like, a waltz is worth 5 points, but a smirk, well now that's 10 points and that crosses the line!

THIS! Since when HE was the one having issues with her?! He haven’t been paying attention to her for a looooong time, and that was probably her issue with him. I have videos from Classic East where you can see her trying to get her attention and him totally ignoring her. She didn’t want to be near him during bows.

But of course Virgin Mary Stevie can do no wrong! If she HAS to fire him is because HE must have done something wrong. Like smirking.

Then why is she so silent during this tour if she has nothing to hide? I’d just LOVE for her old and new fans to explain this to me. She has been the voice of the band since FOREVER, and now what? :shocked::shocked: