San Jose 11/21

[elle]

https://twitter.com/jimthecritic/status/1065528211457499141

https://www.mercurynews.com/2018/11/22/review-how-did-fleetwood-mac-fare-without-lindsey-buckingham/

Review: Fleetwood Mac flops without Lindsey Buckingham on board

By JIM HARRINGTON | [email protected] | Bay Area News Group
PUBLISHED: November 22, 2018 at 12:45 am | UPDATED: November 22, 2018 at 1:04 am
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Fleetwood Mac showed up and played music at the SAP Center in San Jose on Nov. 21.

The band’s performance was professional, well organized and started in a timely fashion.

It wasn’t an entirely bad way to spend a Wednesday night.

Honest.

But you’ll have to excuse me if I’m not sounding too enthusiastic about the concert. It’s just that, for the entire evening, it was nearly impossible to shake the feeling that something — or, more accurately, someone — was missing.

And that someone was, of course, Lindsey Buckingham.

The group dismissed its incredibly talented singer-songwriter-guitarist back in April, sending shock waves through the classic rock world and resulting in a big lawsuit between Buckingham and the band. Of course, Fleetwood Mac has long been one of rock’s all-time great soap operas, but few, if any, outside the band saw this coming.

The split seemingly had something to do with the band’s touring schedule, with the big sticking point reportedly being when the trek was to begin. Although, Buckingham told Rolling Stone that his former band mate — and former love interest — Stevie Nicks wanted him out of the band, going so far as to have Fleetwood Mac manager Irving Azoff deliver the message that “Stevie never wants to be on a stage with you again.”

So, the band quickly enlisted not just one, but two replacement guitarists — Neil Finn of Crowded House fame and Mike Campbell of Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers — and announced a major tour.

t stop the public from snatching up ducats. The San Jose show was dubbed a sell out, while big crowds are expected for the band’s two upcoming shows in Northern California — Nov. 23 at Golden 1 Center in Sacramento and Nov. 25 at Oracle Arena in Oakland. (Tickets, priced $69.50-$299.50, are still available for those two shows at www.ticketmaster.com. Shows start at 8 p.m.)

The fans seemed pretty excited about the evening as they entered the SAP Center, forming long lines at the merchandise booths to purchase $15 Fleetwood Mac bottle openers, $20 Fleetwood Mac mugs, $15 Fleetwood Mac shot glasses and an assortment of $40 Fleetwood Mac T-shirts. There was, however, no truth to the rumor that the band might be selling “Lindsey Buckingham is a big jerk” hoodies.

The fans were still going strong as the group — featuring vocalist Nicks, drummer Mick Fleetwood, bassist John McVie, vocalist-keyboardist Christine McVie and new members Campbell and Finn — took the stage and kicked off
You see, it’s not always enough to simply try and replace talent with talent. If it was just pure guitar chops then the new Fleetwood Mac — with Campbell on board — wouldn’t miss Buckingham all that much. If it was just a fine singing voice then the new Fleetwood Mac — with Finn signed on — would be just fine.

But Buckingham also brought those hard-to-quantify intangibles to the band. He delivered the passion and power, brought the heart and soul, and was able to lift the entire show to a higher level. He also shared unbelievable love/hate chemistry with Nicks – a dynamic that helped make Fleetwood Mac more than just a tired nostalgia act.

Yet, the group was sounding pretty tired on this night, as it delivered clean, capable and barely compelling versions of such fan favorites as “Dreams,” “Second Hand News” and “Say You Love Me.”

The two newcomers did help out quite a bit, though.

Campbell’s leads were typically on point throughout the night and he did an admirable job on the microphone during “Oh Well,” a 1969 single from what’s commonly referred to as the Peter Green-era of Fleetwood Mac. He’d also heavily factor in during the encore, as the band covered Tom Petty’s “Free Fallin'” with Nicks on vocals.

Finn was part of the best moment of the night, as he sang a lovely duet with Nicks on the Crowded House nugget “Don’t Dream It’s Over.”

“It’s in the top five best-written songs in the history of songs,” Nicks commented at its conclusion.

Overall, Nicks didn’t have a great night. The former Bay Area resident, who attended nearby San Jose State University, kept saying how nervous she was to be back home — and she’d prove it by forgetting the lyrics and losing the key on “Landslide.”

“I think that has never happened before – ever,” she said.

One thing that hasn’t changed in Buckingham’s absence is that Mick Fleetwood’s lengthy, obnoxious drum solo is still a complete waste of time and space. It goes nowhere. But it still takes forever to get there.

As the band wrapped the main set up with the dependable crowd pleaser “Go Your Own Way,” I couldn’t help but linger on the feeling that the whole thing would’ve been so much better with Buckingham in the mix.

Sure, without Buckingham, the group has proven that it can still be popular, still sell out an arena, still get people to spend $15 on a bottle opener.

But, without Buckingham, the group might never be truly great again.

[Steviegirl]

Thank you for posting. I was very curious about how this show was going to go without Lindsey. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liVoJ_17knU

[kak125]

Looks like All Over Again was played last night. Nice!

[mitzo]

Knew we could count on you, Elle. thanks a million for this.

[MikeInNV]

Knew we could count on you, Elle. thanks a million for this.

Eh, it just highlights how positive most of other reviews have been of this tour. Besides, the actual review doesn't even support the sensationalistic headline.

[gldstwmn]

Oh look! Elle just couldnt wait (help herself) to post the only negative review of the tour. Thanks Elle! Happy Thanksgiving!
Here's 37 minutes from Periscope:
https://www.pscp.tv/JShawsTidbits/1MnxnNAnaLExO?t=

[gldstwmn]

Knew we could count on you, Elle. thanks a million for this.

An old friend of mine used to say "What do you expect from a hog but a grunt?"

[gldstwmn]

Gypsy:
https://youtu.be/dJ22ieXmCow

Everywhere:
https://youtu.be/I_Yi0pNmHgg

Don't Dream It's Over
https://youtu.be/VPq9hkLm-x4

[gldstwmn]

Looks like All Over Again was played last night. Nice!
Hooray! :woohoo:

[golden braid]

Well I was at the concert and agree 100% with the reviewer. The band sounded fine but generic. Neil's voice is bland and lacks the fire and passion that we're used to, especially on Lindsey's songs. Mike is an accomplished guitar player but his tone and style are very different from Lindsey's. Mike sounds good and shines on the Peter Green, bluesy songs but otherwise his guitar playing does not seem to elevate the songs like Lindsey's playing does.

I enjoyed hearing the Peter Green era songs since I think Mike is a better fit for these songs. I was also happy to finally hear Isn't It Midnight live. I was disappointed not to hear Storms especially since it has been replaced with Gypsy which Stevie sings so monotonously and now doesn't even have Lindsey's solo at the end as a saving grace. I also enjoyed hearing Free Falling because at least Stevie is passionate about singing this song.

[button-lip]

Well I was at the concert and agree 100% with the reviewer. The band sounded fine but generic. Neil's voice is bland and lacks the fire and passion that we're used to, especially on Lindsey's songs. Mike is an accomplished guitar player but his tone and style are very different from Lindsey's. Mike sounds good and shines on the Peter Green, bluesy songs but otherwise his guitar playing does not seem to elevate the songs like Lindsey's playing does.

I enjoyed hearing the Peter Green era songs since I think Mike is a better fit for these songs. I was also happy to finally hear Isn't It Midnight live. I was disappointed not to hear Storms especially since it has been replaced with Gypsy which Stevie sings so monotonously and now doesn't even have Lindsey's solo at the end as a saving grace. I also enjoyed hearing Free Falling because at least Stevie is passionate about singing this song.

Are you sure you're not Elle under a false indentity? Because apparently she's the worst person on the planet because she posted a review of no other place that Lindsey's hometown (not Nicks') where he's of course missed because guess what?, he was born there, so naturally he's gonna be missed (not Nicks').

Thanks for using the word 'monotonous' and 'generic'. They're ok and they don't mean the band sucked, but I guess not all of us can take a neutral review the same way. :thumbsup:

[mitzo]

An old friend of mine used to say "What do you expect from a hog but a grunt?"

Thanks for this, I now have to clean the coffee off my keyboard and screen...

[mitzo]

Are you sure you're not Elle under a false indentity? Because apparently she's the worst person on the planet because she posted a review of no other place that Lindsey's hometown (not Nicks') where he's of course missed because guess what?, he was born there, so naturally he's gonna be missed (not Nicks').

Thanks for using the word 'monotonous' and 'generic'. They're ok and they don't mean the band sucked, but I guess not all of us can take a neutral review the same way. :thumbsup:

We are reacting to the fact that it is one of the only negative reviews so far and it was posted here by Elle, whose attitudes to the band and the ousted one are well known here. It is more comical than anything.

[button-lip]

We are reacting to the fact that it is one of the only negative reviews so far and it was posted here by Elle, whose attitudes to the band and the ousted one are well known here. It is more comical than anything.

Many fans’ attitudes here are predictable and well-known, so I guess we can all laugh together.

[ali101]

Gypsy:
https://youtu.be/dJ22ieXmCow

Everywhere:
https://youtu.be/I_Yi0pNmHgg

Don't Dream It's Over
https://youtu.be/VPq9hkLm-x4

Say You Love me
https://youtu.be/unormOXevgE

Gold Dust Woman
https://youtu.be/FialkfDjr1s

[Fiver]

https://datebook.sfchronicle.com/music/revamped-fleetwood-mac-highlights-its-history-in-hit-studded-san-jose-concert

A second opinion with a clip of the Landslide snafu. IMO she handles it well. :o

[bombaysaffires]

Maybe it was being in Lindsey's home town that made her so nervous...

This bit
The fans seemed pretty excited about the evening as they entered the SAP Center, forming long lines at the merchandise booths to purchase $15 Fleetwood Mac bottle openers, $20 Fleetwood Mac mugs, $15 Fleetwood Mac shot glasses and an assortment of $40 Fleetwood Mac T-shirts.
They're starting to sound more like Fleetwood Kiss.........

And even the SF review commented that -
McVie’s collaboration with Buckingham last year on an album of new material was such a pleasant surprise that it’s disappointing to know that Fleetwood Mac has no intentions of recording new songs again

[bombaysaffires]

Oh look! Elle just couldnt wait (help herself) to post the only nasty review of the tour. Thanks Elle! Happy Thanksgiving!
Here's 37 minutes from Periscope:
https://www.pscp.tv/JShawsTidbits/1MnxnNAnaLExO?t=

oh look! gldstwmn just couldn't wait (help herself) to post a comment! and her opinion was such a surprise! grunt, grunt.

[jbrownsjr]

Many fans’ attitudes here are predictable and well-known, so I guess we can all laugh together.

LOL... Now that I've met you.. I read your posts so differently!!

Love you...

It's a good point. There's very few people I can't predict on this board.

I get surprised once or twice a year. Sometimes by myself.

[jbrownsjr]

https://datebook.sfchronicle.com/music/revamped-fleetwood-mac-highlights-its-history-in-hit-studded-san-jose-concert

A second opinion with a clip of the Landslide snafu. IMO she handles it well. :o

Thanks for posting. Maybe, they were or are just tired. It happens on tour.

I heard the BTM tour diminished greatly toward the end. It was an amazing show for me that year and I was surprised to hear it peter'd out.

As for the generic, well the 5 are just magic together. Drama helps.

[Buster]

I couldn’t care less who posted the review.

I appreciate the review. He clearly knows the band and nothing he said is unfair. Some reviewers are going to be ok with the new FM. Others are going to be a harder sell.

Thank you goldenbraid for giving us your take as someone who was at the show.

The best part of the review is the slam on the drum solo. I laughed and laughed and laughed.

[jbrownsjr]

I couldn’t care less who posted the review.

I appreciate the review. He clearly knows the band and nothing he said is unfair. Some reviewers are going to be ok with the new FM. Others are going to be a harder sell.

Thank you goldenbraid for giving us your take as someone who was at the show.

The best part of the review is the slam on the drum solo. I laughed and laughed and laughed.

I've enjoyed both good and bad review, too. I don't think there was anything unfair.

[sands of time]

An old friend of mine used to say "What do you expect from a hog but a grunt?"

That is the most disgusting, sexist thing you've ever posted. And that's saying a lot.

I've seen at least 5 or 6 nasty reviews in the past few weeks, and I haven't been looking very hard.

[button-lip]

LOL... Now that I've met you.. I read your posts so differently!!

Love you...

It's a good point. There's very few people I can't predict on this board.

I get surprised once or twice a year. Sometimes by myself.

So glad we have finally met, and love you too. ;)

Funny how they're accusing Elle of practically the same thing they do all the time. It was a honest review and it agrees with people that actually were at the show, like goldenbraid. Hard to refute that. :nod:

[ali101]

https://datebook.sfchronicle.com/music/revamped-fleetwood-mac-highlights-its-history-in-hit-studded-san-jose-concert

A second opinion with a clip of the Landslide snafu. IMO she handles it well. :o


And the remainder of the song after the lapse..
https://youtu.be/SHL-Z2Xq40k

Rewind to 2013, with LB at her side and no nerves. The Buckingham Nicks haunts and the illness break would I’m sure have ramped up the pressure of nerves.
https://youtu.be/liVoJ_17knU

[Hawkeye]

Actually after watching the full landslide start to finish, I vastly prefer the vocals of Landslide in the beginning where Stevie is lost and can’t find the key. Her just singing spontaneously is so much better then whatever she considers
To be her “polished, never had a bad night vocally since her vocal coach” voice!

[gldstwmn]

oh look! gldstwmn just couldn't wait (help herself) to post a comment! and her opinion was such a surprise! grunt, grunt.

Actually I was going to post that very review. But she beat me to it and at 5 AM no less. It's the only review of FM she's posted from this tour. That's an opinion. I wont be bothered to repeat the old cliche about that.

[gldstwmn]

That is the most disgusting, sexist thing you've ever posted. And that's saying a lot.

I've seen at least 5 or 6 nasty reviews in the past few weeks, and I haven't been looking very hard.

Really? By journalists? Where?
I'm actually posting this from my hospital bed so I'm thrilled that I still have the strength and wit to piss all of you off with a metaphor that has nothing to do with gender. :laugh: I'm sure a few posts down someone will call me a misogynist again. :laugh: :o

[gldstwmn]

So glad we have finally met, and love you too. ;)

Funny how they're accusing Elle of practically the same thing they do all the time. It was a honest review and it agrees with people that actually were at the show, like goldenbraid. Hard to refute that. :nod:
They? They who? What are we? A gang?

[mitzo]

They? They who? What are we? A gang?

Do the same thing? Post negative reviews of Lindsey's shows? In the Lindsey forum? i don't see anyone do that.

[Macfan4life]

I don't know why so many are making a big deal Stevie flubbed lyrics. It would not be a Stevie concert unless she did this. My first Stevie concert in 1983 had her sing the second verse of Dreams first and improvise so many other lyrics. Its part of how she performs. My all time favorite Stevie flub was her Concord, CA Timespace show where she sung the last verse of Outside the Rain over and over for the first and second verse. Then in the end she launces into her first verse. I don't know how but her band kept up with her. Blame it on the klonopin haze or not.

[Keith]

We are all getting older, too. I love this for whatever weird reason.

Even though I enjoy watching the videos of the present band, I also really miss Lindsey so I kinda get this review.

[gldstwmn]

Do the same thing? Post negative reviews of Lindsey's shows? In the Lindsey forum? i don't see anyone do that.

Exactly. I rarely even go there.

[Hawkeye]

I don't know why so many are making a big deal Stevie flubbed lyrics. It would not be a Stevie concert unless she did this. My first Stevie concert in 1983 had her sing the second verse of Dreams first and improvise so many other lyrics. Its part of how she performs. My all time favorite Stevie flub was her Concord, CA Timespace show where she sung the last verse of Outside the Rain over and over for the first and second verse. Then in the end she launces into her first verse. I don't know how but her band kept up with her. Blame it on the klonopin haze or not.


Agreed, it’s very common for her to mess up lyrics but I think this was a first. Her stopping the song in the middle basically and explaining why she’s lost. Not saying it’s a bad thing, it’s just a first, unless one of you can a pull a clip of it happening before out of your ass (and I’m not ruling that out)

[bwboy]

Agreed, it’s very common for her to mess up lyrics but I think this was a first. Her stopping the song in the middle basically and explaining why she’s lost. Not saying it’s a bad thing, it’s just a first, unless one of you can a pull a clip of it happening before out of your ass (and I’m not ruling that out)

During the first night of the taping of the Dance MTV special, Stevie messed up during Dreams and had to start over, and she said in an interview later that it was due to nerves because of all the celebrities in the audience.

[kak125]

Fleetwood Mac paid tribute to its varied incarnations at San Jose’s SAP Center on Wednesday, Nov. 21, and despite a few surprising flubs, the storied rockers commanded the crowd as if they never broke the chain.


The band, which has survived decades of shifts in sound, personnel and personalities, performed an almost 2½-hour set rich in the soft-rock standards that defined its commercial peak in the 1970s and ’80s, as well as blues tunes from its formative years and a few obscurities, during its 50th anniversary tour stop.

It was a set that, regardless of which Fleetwood Mac era fans came to see, hit every note. The show may not have won over those who miss singer-guitarist Lindsey Buckingham, recently replaced in a move that divided classic rock lovers, but the tour that is likely to please longtime followers planning to catch Fleetwood Mac when the band plays Sacramento’s Golden 1 Center on Friday, Nov. 23, and Oakland’s Oracle Arena on Sunday, Nov. 25.

The San Jose concert was particularly special for singer Stevie Nicks, who turned 70 this year but hasn’t ditched her shawls or heels. A homecoming of sorts, Nicks took several moments to give the South Bay city a proper shout-out. Born in Phoenix, she attended San Jose State University and made some of her first recordings in the Bay Area.

“It’s pretty darn good to be back in my own specific and very special hood,” she said. “This is where it all started, and I had to take a minute to let you know that.”


Nicks, who has done decades of shows worldwide with the band as well as solo, said she was a bit nervous to be back in the Bay Area and even forgot the lyrics at one point to “Landslide.” Whether it was nerves or overfamiliarity with one of her most popular songs with the band, it was an odd moment from a normally polished singer.

“What’s happening? … I’ve lost the key,” Nicks admitted in the midst the song, which she dedicated to longtime friends (including one who used to drive her to the College of San Mateo for “two solid years, back and forth”).

“This is my home, so I can do this,” she laughed off. “Seriously, I’m so nervous I’m never coming back here!

“I’m kidding. I will always come back,” she assured the crowd. “This is when you know, after 70 years, that you still get this nervous when you sing a song for people that you love.”

With longtime singer-guitarist Buckingham fired amid reports of major bad blood with Nicks, his former lover he met when the two attended Menlo-Atherton High School, the band has been touring with Neil Finn of Crowded House and Mike Campbell of Tom Petty’s band, the Heartbreakers. Though neither had the manic magic that made Buckingham unstoppable onstage, they provided competent interpretations of Buckingham’s standards, with Finn handling the lead vocal in “Second Hand News” and “Monday Morning,” and Campbell tackling the frenetic guitar leads on “The Chain” and “Go Your Own Way
Neil Finn sings lead on songs popularized by Lindsey Buckingham during Fleetwood Mac’s show at the SAP Center.

The image
The band did a deep dive into its blues catalog, with Nicks providing a feminist spin singing “Black Magic Woman,” a haunting psychedelic gem later popularized by Santana; Finn dusting off “Tell Me All the Things You Do,” a melodic nugget from Danny Kirwan, a Fleetwood Mac member from 1968 to 1972 who died this year; and Campbell taking the spotlight on “Oh Well,” a powerful hard rock hybrid.

Nicks, even more of a focal point for the band with Buckingham out of the picture, gave the crowd what it wanted with “Dreams,” “Rhiannon” and “Gypsy.” She paid tribute to Petty, her frequent collaborator who died last year, with a spirited version of “Free Fallin’ ” featuring projected images of the two together and Petty with the Heartbreakers over the years.

Finn, whose solo career hasn’t received the attention it deserves after he created moody, melodic pop with Crowded House and Split Enz, took a deserved spotlight with a cover of “Don’t Dream It’s Over.” It was an unusual choice for a Fleetwood Mac concert, but it was well received — especially when Nicks joined in on the chorus.

Drummer Mick Fleetwood, still a solid player at 71 and probably the member who’s worked harder than anyone else to keep Fleetwood Mac together over the years, did his standard wild-man solo. Bassist John McVie kept his usual low profile but provided a solid foundation for the band. And keyboardist Christine McVie, who rejoined the band in 2014 after a lengthy semi-retirement, proved to be a grounding force with her smoky vocals on the mid-tempo staples “Little Lies,” “Isn’t It Midnight” and ”Everywhere.” She closed the evening with a duet with Nicks for the band’s third encore song, “All Over Again.” The deep cut is off the band’s poorly received 1995 “Time” album and is a song that only Fleetwood Mac’s die-hard fans remember — if at all.

McVie’s collaboration with Buckingham last year on an album of new material was such a pleasant surprise that it’s disappointing to know that Fleetwood Mac has no intentions of recording new songs again. New material could have taken away the sting for Buckingham fans who resent hearing the new guys covering songs he made famous. But as long as some form of Fleetwood Mac remains intact revisiting the band’s classic catalog, this incarnation passes the test.

https://datebook.sfchronicle.com/music/revamped-fleetwood-mac-highlights-its-history-in-hit-studded-san-jose-concert/amp

[bombaysaffires]

At the risk of feeding the troll.....I love that it somehow is wrong or surprising that people are fans of both the band AND some or all of the individual members. I hadn't realized that people weren't "supposed" to come into one forum or another if they'd expressed an opinion in a different forum.

I also am saddened but not surprised that the stans have taken over and we're in major snowflake territory-- anything that actually reports what happened at a concert-- in this case Stevie flubbed a few lines of a song -- is considered a negative review and therefore treasonous and should never have been mentioned because omg it shows our idol in a 'bad' light. Most people found the flub somewhat endearing. But sycophants think it's fake news and should never be mentioned because they're too fragile to handle reality. (btw, where's the outrage at the negative review of Mick's 'obnoxious' drum solo? Hmmm....) No one gives a sh*t if you posted a legit review from a legit newspaper in any forum. This whole site is meant to be a resource so people can use it to see articles and reviews or videos or whatever that they might have missed. Grow up.

[MikeInNV]

At the risk of feeding the troll.....I love that it somehow is wrong or surprising that people are fans of both the band AND some or all of the individual members. I hadn't realized that people weren't "supposed" to come into one forum or another if they'd expressed an opinion in a different forum.

I also am saddened but not surprised that the stans have taken over and we're in major snowflake territory-- anything that actually reports what happened at a concert-- in this case Stevie flubbed a few lines of a song -- is considered a negative review and therefore treasonous and should never have been mentioned because omg it shows our idol in a 'bad' light. Most people found the flub somewhat endearing. But sycophants think it's fake news and should never be mentioned because they're too fragile to handle reality. (btw, where's the outrage at the negative review of Mick's 'obnoxious' drum solo? Hmmm....) No one gives a sh*t if you posted a legit review from a legit newspaper in any forum. This whole site is meant to be a resource so people can use it to see articles and reviews or videos or whatever that they might have missed. Grow up.

I didn't get the sense this had anything to do with somebody writing about Stevie's flubbed lyrics in their review. It would be odd not to mention it, even in a positive review. I'm definitely one of those people who finds moments like that endearing, or at least interesting. Having seen so many shows, and so many performances of certain songs, it's actually kind of cool to have something make it memorable.

I agree that the site is meant to be a resource. All reviews should get posted, and the vast majority of them do. Kudos to the Ledgies who keep up with all the news and post it for the rest who don't have the time. But if you haven't regularly been posting reviews, but the one headlined "FM flops with LB" is posted less than 6 hours after the show's end, it's going to be perceived as selective posting and will probably be called out as a way to push people's buttons. I would expect no less if I did that in the Lindsey forum.

It's a band, fans are going to have their likes and dislikes, and all of this is magnified 100x in a band like FM with multiple singer/songwriters, not to mention a drummer with his own unique personality. I can't believe it's this hard to just read and post the things that interest you and ignore the things that don't. No one changes their mind because they're antagonized on the internet; if anything, they just dig their heels in deeper. See any discussion of politics as an example.

[gldstwmn]

It's about the ugliness of rooting for someone to fail. I'm not hoping that Lindsey fails. Quite the opposite in fact. And not everyone who posts here is a fan of every person in the band or the band overall. That has been made abundantly clear. I was probably one of the first to call out the sexism and misogyny and now I'm being called those very things which just underscores to me that people either have no idea what those things mean or have been so conditioned to ignore it they don't know what it is when it's standing right in front of them. :shrug: People including the reviewer were thrilled about the non issue with Lanslide. Elle was thrilled to post a negative review. But none of you want to see Lindsey back in Fleetwood Mac either. There is no happy ending here for you. I never said who could or couldn't post somewhere, just that they were posting that review here for a specific reason. Are they going to post other show reviews here? Only if they're bad or if Kristen Buckingham wants them to. :cool:

[gldstwmn]

I didn't get the sense this had anything to do with somebody writing about Stevie's flubbed lyrics in their review. It would be odd not to mention it, even in a positive review. I'm definitely one of those people who finds moments like that endearing, or at least interesting. Having seen so many shows, and so many performances of certain songs, it's actually kind of cool to have something make it memorable.

I agree that the site is meant to be a resource. All reviews should get posted, and the vast majority of them do. Kudos to the Ledgies who keep up with all the news and post it for the rest who don't have the time. But if you haven't regularly been posting reviews, but the one headlined "FM flops with LB" is posted less than 6 hours after the show's end, it's going to be perceived as selective posting and will probably be called out as a way to push people's buttons. I would expect no less if I did that in the Lindsey forum.

It's a band, fans are going to have their likes and dislikes, and all of this is magnified 100x in a band like FM with multiple singer/songwriters, not to mention a drummer with his own unique personality. I can't believe it's this hard to just read and post the things that interest you and ignore the things that don't. No one changes their mind because they're antagonized on the internet; if anything, they just dig their heels in deeper. See any discussion of politics as an example.

Exactly. I'm never going to think Lindsey didn't have a hand in his own demise with Fleetwood Mac. On the other side of that I don't think the people who hate Stevie are going to change their minds about anything. Its just the way it is. When you start calling people troll, stans or snowflake no one will be interested in the point you're trying to make either if that's really your goal. Not talking about you Mike.

[Buster]

It's about the ugliness of rooting for someone to fail. I'm not hoping that Lindsey fails. Quite the opposite in fact. And not everyone who posts here is a fan of every person in the band or the band overall. That has been made abundantly clear. I was probably one of the first to call out the sexism and misogyny and now I'm being called those very things which just underscores to me that people either have no idea what those things mean or have been so conditioned to ignore it they don't know what it is when it's standing right in front of them. :shrug: People including the reviewer were thrilled about the non issue with Lanslide. Elle was thrilled to post a negative review. But none of you want to see Lindsey back in Fleetwood Mac either. There is no happy ending here for you. I never said who could or couldn't post somewhere, just that they were posting that review here for a specific reason. Are they going to post other show reviews here? Only if they're bad or if Kristen Buckingham wants them to. :cool:

Where do you get that the reviewer was thrilled about what happened during Landslide? He merely reported on it, which is fair, and said Stevie didn’t have a good night. Also fair - he’s a reviewer. Another review posted in this thread has a different, more positive take.

[gldstwmn]

Where do you get that the reviewer was thrilled about what happened during Landslide? He merely reported on it, which is fair, and said Stevie didn’t have a good night. Also fair - he’s a reviewer. Another review posted in this thread has a different, more positive take.

He wrote the headline. :shrug: I don't have a problem with the review or the reviewer anyway. Like I said I was going to post it. Between Viv, Kak and I, we've managed to post all the reviews. Done talking about it now. Anyway they're in Oakland tonight and hopefully lots of good things to talk about with that.
Oh and to this guy:
https://youtu.be/-yVXI_AC5Xs
If you want to keep using bits and pieces of my posts from here on The Ledge the least you could do is credit me or write your own copy.
Rhiannon:
https://youtu.be/2qNVgVzglrA

DDIO:
https://youtu.be/ZP4t_4cNnN4

The Chain:
https://youtu.be/Pna8t_WpFiU

Dreams:
https://youtu.be/4VZ8WblEhys

Second Hand News/Say You Love Me:
https://youtu.be/7usiNqH_9Z0

[elle]

Knew we could count on you, Elle. thanks a million for this.
you're welcome. and that's right. if i stumble on something that i think is informative to the fandom, i try to post it even if it's in forums i have no interest in (like SN forum). i posted once the info about some Stevie event and many thanked me. then those same people turned around in another thread and started yelling at me to never dare show up in SN forum again. i was like - dude - decide: you want the info that i shared with you, or you want me to stay outta here? :lol:

Besides, the actual review doesn't even support the sensationalistic headline.
exactly. it's a very neutral review. people going stir-crazy about it all over social media makes no sense. but then again when did this fandom make any sense?

guess people are too used to revitalized / reinvigorated / better without LB PR nonesense.

you know, coming into the fandom late i had no reason not to believe when people insisted SN is just as good now as she always was. then i watched and listened to some of her perforamnces from 70s. and man did that woman have a charisma! people are selling her short insisting that she's just as fantastic now as she was then.

An old friend of mine used to say "What do you expect from a hog but a grunt?"
Thanks for this, I now have to clean the coffee off my keyboard and screen...
this is so very sad. :( :eek:

so now i'm gonna be like all others complaining about the current state of these forums.:angel: in the old times calling fellow posters pigs, hogs, or whatever nasty names some who obviously are trying to bully people away can come up with while some others cheer them on would not be tolerated. and no this cannot be justified as a joke or j/k or so funny. the fact that i see these people still on here posting today and trying to somehow make themseles victims - because i dare to post reviews on The Ledge :laugh: - and no, it is not the first time i posted a review in this forum - i posted at least 1 other that i can remember but i don't keep track of my posts as closely as some apparently!:rolleyes: (and then Gldstwmn inexplicably posted exact same one 3 posts down i guess because she sees red when my posts appear in her view :confused:) just signifies sad state of these boards.

[bombaysaffires]

Exactly. I'm never going to think Lindsey didn't have a hand in his own demise with Fleetwood Mac. On the other side of that I don't think the people who hate Stevie are going to change their minds about anything. Its just the way it is. When you start calling people troll, stans or snowflake no one will be interested in the point you're trying to make either if that's really your goal. Not talking about you Mike.

When you start calling people hogs no one will be interested in the point you're trying to make either if that's really your goal. :shrug:

[gldstwmn]

When you start calling people hogs no one will be interested in the point you're trying to make either if that's really your goal. :shrug:

I didn't call anyone a hog. That was a metaphor. You can Google it. Do you have any original thoughts? You know, ones that you express using your own words? No? Perhaps you're a parrot? And yes I'm suggesting that you may be a parrot. See the difference?

[bombaysaffires]

I didn't call anyone a hog. That was a metaphor. You can Google it. Do you have any original thoughts? You know, ones that you express using your own words? No? Perhaps you're a parrot? And yes I'm suggesting that you may be a parrot. See the difference?

see, they sound lame even when repeated back to you.

[gldstwmn]

this is so very sad. :( :eek:


You know what's sad? Losing your sh×t because your song wasn't chosen for a 30 second intro at a charity event in which you are set to receive an award for Person of the Year. It's also egotistical, selfish, narcissistic, embarrassing to your fellow band members and highly ironic. The coup de grace of the whole thing is when you get your comeuppance for that stunt and many like it in the past you convince your sycophantic, terrorist group like and small in number legion of fans to attack the person who you feel is at fault. And this is the best part - you let your wife lead the mission. She then proceeds to try and spin the situation by calling you a pr×ck in a national media publication and call people names across several social media platforms. It's a three act Shakespearean tragi-comedy.
Your motive for posting that particular review is crystal clear. But do keep trying to convince us differently in another 15 paragraph post that damns the four remaining and two new members with faint praise. Maybe someone will buy it. :shrug: You know, hearts and minds and all that.

[gldstwmn]

see, they sound lame even when repeated back to you.

At least they're mine. ;)

[gldstwmn]

you're welcome. and that's right. if i stumble on something that i think is informative to the fandom, i try to post it even if it's in forums i have no interest in (like SN forum). i posted once the info about some Stevie event and many thanked me. then those same people turned around in another thread and started yelling at me to never dare show up in SN forum again. i was like - dude - decide: you want the info that i shared with you, or you want me to stay outta here? :lol:


exactly. it's a very neutral review. people going stir-crazy about it all over social media makes no sense. but then again when did this fandom make any sense?

guess people are too used to revitalized / reinvigorated / better without LB PR nonesense.

you know, coming into the fandom late i had no reason not to believe when people insisted SN is just as good now as she always was. then i watched and listened to some of her perforamnces from 70s. and man did that woman have a charisma! people are selling her short insisting that she's just as fantastic now as she was then.



this is so very sad. :( :eek:

so now i'm gonna be like all others complaining about the current state of these forums.:angel: in the old times calling fellow posters pigs, hogs, or whatever nasty names some who obviously are trying to bully people away can come up with while some others cheer them on would not be tolerated. and no this cannot be justified as a joke or j/k or so funny. the fact that i see these people still on here posting today and trying to somehow make themseles victims - because i dare to post reviews on The Ledge :laugh: - and no, it is not the first time i posted a review in this forum - i posted at least 1 other that i can remember but i don't keep track of my posts as closely as some apparently!:rolleyes: (and then Gldstwmn inexplicably posted exact same one 3 posts down i guess because she sees red when my posts appear in her view :confused:) just signifies sad state of these boards.
I don't usually read your posts but you started this thread so... I didn't even read all of this one. :o

[bombaysaffires]

At least they're mine. ;)

sure they're not Karen's?

[Macfan4life]

Agreed, it’s very common for her to mess up lyrics but I think this was a first. Her stopping the song in the middle basically and explaining why she’s lost. Not saying it’s a bad thing, it’s just a first, unless one of you can a pull a clip of it happening before out of your ass (and I’m not ruling that out)
Yes people mess up and forget all the time. I think she did not want to get caught standing there struggling to remember the lyrics so just cut the song. Its easy to do that during an acoustic song. A full band its much harder. Hardly anything significant IMHO. IMHO its a refreshing reminder that these classic bands are not lip syncers.
I once heard Ann Wilson of Heart say that during a 70's tour the band opened with Barracuda. Ann just froze and forgot the first verse. It must have been terrifying.

Here are some Oooops moments I have witnessed:
I saw Christine perform solo in Pittsburgh in 1984. She came out and said "Detroit, how are you doing?" After Say You Love Me she apologized and made fun of herself and said she knew she was going to get it mixed up somewhere.

In 2013 during the first leg of On With The Show, Mick was introducing the band before Don't Stop. Mick forgot to introduce John McVie and the band started playing Don't Stop. Mick realized what he did and suddenly stopped playing. He stood up and apologized profusely. He said in his entire life at every concert he has never forgotten his wing man John. Christine was making fun of him and said "Now can we start?

Same concert Stevie got the order of songs mixed up. Gypsy came after Over My Head. Well Stevie started telling the audience she wanted to talk about the next song and the inspiration for it. Christine was like...oh really? Then Stevie caught herself and said, oh no, I don't know the inspiration for the next song but it would be wonderful to know.

[mitzo]

you're welcome. and that's right. if i stumble on something that i think is informative to the fandom, i try to post it even if it's in forums i have no interest in (like SN forum). i posted once the info about some Stevie event and many thanked me. then those same people turned around in another thread and started yelling at me to never dare show up in SN forum again. i was like - dude - decide: you want the info that i shared with you, or you want me to stay outta here? :lol:


exactly. it's a very neutral review. people going stir-crazy about it all over social media makes no sense. but then again when did this fandom make any sense?

guess people are too used to revitalized / reinvigorated / better without LB PR nonesense.

you know, coming into the fandom late i had no reason not to believe when people insisted SN is just as good now as she always was. then i watched and listened to some of her perforamnces from 70s. and man did that woman have a charisma! people are selling her short insisting that she's just as fantastic now as she was then.



this is so very sad. :( :eek:

so now i'm gonna be like all others complaining about the current state of these forums.:angel: in the old times calling fellow posters pigs, hogs, or whatever nasty names some who obviously are trying to bully people away can come up with while some others cheer them on would not be tolerated. and no this cannot be justified as a joke or j/k or so funny. the fact that i see these people still on here posting today and trying to somehow make themseles victims - because i dare to post reviews on The Ledge :laugh: - and no, it is not the first time i posted a review in this forum - i posted at least 1 other that i can remember but i don't keep track of my posts as closely as some apparently!:rolleyes: (and then Gldstwmn inexplicably posted exact same one 3 posts down i guess because she sees red when my posts appear in her view :confused:) just signifies sad state of these boards.

I wonder what all those words mean? It was obvious to me you grabbed a negative FM review and stuck it here in a weird act of loyalty to Lindsey. If your intentions are noble, please show me the threads where you post positive reviews of the new lineup.

We are far beyond any serious talk of stopping bullying on these boards, it has been the Black Hole of Calcutta since Lindsey Almighty got dumped from the band. So any such talk now, bemoaning "the sad state of these boards", coming from his fans, is sanctimonious self serving hypocritical horse manure.

[elle]

any such talk now, bemoaning "the sad state of these boards", coming from his fans, is sanctimonious self serving hypocritical horse manure.

calling fellow posters hogs and terrorists?

show me the posts where you were called similar names.

[Feather Blade]

calling fellow posters hogs and terrorists?

show me the posts where you were called similar names.

I seem to recall "The Children of Stevie" being used as a term around here. As if the folks who weren't completely hysterical at Lindsey's departure were some kind of weird cult.

[Feather Blade]

I wonder what all those words mean? It was obvious to me you grabbed a negative FM review and stuck it here in a weird act of loyalty to Lindsey. If your intentions are noble, please show me the threads where you post positive reviews of the new lineup.

We are far beyond any serious talk of stopping bullying on these boards, it has been the Black Hole of Calcutta since Lindsey Almighty got dumped from the band. So any such talk now, bemoaning "the sad state of these boards", coming from his fans, is sanctimonious self serving hypocritical horse manure.

Agreed. Despite calling it a "completely neutral" review in the "who are you rooting for in the lawsuit" thread it was obvious from the person's past posts that this was just more cherry picking the rare negative review and putting it up. If it had been completely neutral it wouldn't have been bothered with. As someone else said, can you imagine the uproar if someone put that kind of work into looking for only negative reviews to post in the Lindsey forum.

[MikeInNV]

I seem to recall "The Children of Stevie" being used as a term around here. As if the folks who weren't completely hysterical at Lindsey's departure were some kind of weird cult.

While not much shocks me around this place anymore, I was completely floored a couple months ago when one long-time Ledgie called another a twat. To my knowledge there were no repercussions either, as unbelievable as that seems.

[gldstwmn]

calling fellow posters hogs and terrorists?

show me the posts where you were called similar names.

I've been called a whole litany of things. No one called you a hog. I used a metaphor to illustrate your actions.

[SteveMacD]

I’m sure Elle would have been as quick to post the review if the headline was “Fleetwood Mac Triumphs Without Buckingham”

[Storms123]

I’m sure Elle would have been as quick to post the review if the headline was “Fleetwood Mac Triumphs Without Buckingham”

I whole heartedly agree with you Steve. I think what all "factions" of this fandom are missing is there will be both positive and negative reviews about this collective group. The FM supporters should be ready for it and Lindsey's supporters should be ready for it. And should expect it. The reviews for the present band have been largely positive. And that's great. The reviewer in San Jose disagreed--and that's okay too. It's FACT--Stevie flubbed a song. That's not negative against Stevie--her life's work hasn't been diminished. She flubbed the song. Hell--she owned it in fact.

[lovethemac1]

sure they're not Karen's?

Right????? I've been thinking this for a few months now.

[mitzo]

calling fellow posters hogs and terrorists?

show me the posts where you were called similar names.

I am sorry your feelings have been hurt by people alluding to hogs and terrorists in turns of phrase while referring to your posts. Nobody called me those names (and in fact you were not called them either, as Gldstwmn says, they are metaphors). I am simply lumped in with the chiffon heads who worship the evil goat breath's every fart.

Nobody is calling Lindsey's fans anything like that. Nor is anybody calling him shockingly vulgar names in every post. And nobody wished him ill on his tour. In fact, most of us are not worshipping Stevie, we are just indifferent to Lindsey and his firing from the band.

[button-lip]

They? They who? What are we? A gang?

Basically.

Do the same thing? Post negative reviews of Lindsey's shows? In the Lindsey forum? i don't see anyone do that.

Where's the negativereview? You're seeing it as negative. No one else does. :shrug:

[button-lip]

You know what's sad? Losing your sh×t because your song wasn't chosen for a 30 second intro at a charity event in which you are set to receive an award for Person of the Year. It's also egotistical, selfish, narcissistic, embarrassing to your fellow band members and highly ironic.

It's sadder to wait for your bandmate to receive that award holding on to his arm knowing that you will get him fired the next day.

Because you won't make anyone believe this decision was based on a tantrum over a song.

[button-lip]

I seem to recall "The Children of Stevie" being used as a term around here. As if the folks who weren't completely hysterical at Lindsey's departure were some kind of weird cult.

Yeah, that was me, but it wasn't exactly directed towards fans who wouldn't believe Lindsey was fired.

But hey, it was a methapor. That's how you call it these days.

[DownOnRodeo]

You know what's sad? Losing your sh×t because your song wasn't chosen for a 30 second intro at a charity event in which you are set to receive an award for Person of the Year. It's also egotistical, selfish, narcissistic, embarrassing to your fellow band members and highly ironic.

Srsly gldstwmn--don't tell me you honestly believe that Lindsey's problem with "Rhiannon" being played was that it was a Stevie-penned song, and not simply about playing any intro music at all (or, possibly (although less likely IMO), a more recent song instead).

[gldstwmn]

Srsly gldstwmn--don't tell me you honestly believe that Lindsey's problem with "Rhiannon" being played was that it was a Stevie-penned song, and not simply about playing any intro music at all (or, possibly (although less likely IMO), a more recent song instead).

That's what his lawsuit says. Or is that multi layered and I'm supposed to be reading various things into that too? I honestly can't keep up.

[gldstwmn]

But hey, it was a methapor. That's how you call it these days.

That's what it's been called since the inception of language - all of them. :shocked:

[gldstwmn]

Where's the negativereview? You're seeing it as negative. No one else does. :shrug:

Well the headline doesn't exactly reflect the thinking of Norman Vincent Peale.

[DownOnRodeo]

That's what his lawsuit says.

It most certainly does not!
I assume you're referring to his Rolling Stone interview.

I honestly can't keep up.

Might I then kindly suggest that you don't go around broadcasting to the internet that something that Lindsey didn't do was an "egotistical, selfish, narcissistic, embarrassing to your fellow band members and highly ironic" "stunt" in which he "lost [his] sh×t" and deserves "comeuppance"?

Otherwise you're being as "false and misleading" as Stevie and Mick (and that's something that does appear in the Complaint).

[gldstwmn]

It most certainly does not!
I assume you're referring to his Rolling Stone interview.



Might I then kindly suggest that you don't go around broadcasting to the internet that something that Lindsey didn't do was an "egotistical, selfish, narcissistic, embarrassing to your fellow band members and highly ironic" "stunt" in which he "lost [his] sh×t" and deserves "comeuppance"?

Otherwise you're being as "false and misleading" as Stevie and Mick (and that's something that does appear in the Complaint).
By his own account that is what happened and that is my takeaway. You don't have to like it or agree with it. Also he is alleging that Mick and Stevie were false and misleading.

[DownOnRodeo]

By his own account that is what happened and that is my takeaway. You don't have to like it or agree with it. Also he is alleging that Mick and Stevie were false and misleading.

(begins pulling out hair)

He did NOT say that he wanted "his own song" to be played instead of Rhiannon. Only the mind and post of gldstwmn did.

If you express your own opinions as your own, that's fine.

[gldstwmn]

(begins pulling out hair)

He did NOT say that he wanted "his own song" to be played instead of Rhiannon. Only the mind and post of gldstwmn did.

If you express your own opinions as your own, that's fine.

What song did he want then? I think we can all figure out he wanted Go Your Own Way. I'd bet on that. All or almost all of the things I said about Lindsey have been said about Stevie and some of the other band members mostly unchallenged and without merit. Yet you only have an issue that I said them about Lindsey.
Also fake news is a propagandist term. That guy that likes to talk about fake news is likely to be charged with perjury and obstruction of justice here soon. That's real news.
As far as false and misleading those things in and of themselves aren't necessarily criminal. There has to be intent. I don't think there was any. I think the band was legitimately trying to figue out what to do and that included carrying on without Stevie. They were advised not to communicate with Lindsey. They were perfectly within their rights under the law.
I don't see anywhere in my post where I purported to express anything other than an opininion. There's really no need for you to rip your hair out. I would like to thank you for a cogent and thoughtful response to my post though. It motivated me to think a little bit more about the situation and consider your side. I don't really feel differently about the situation but at least I was able to consider it.

[AncientQueen]

^^^The Chain?
I mean, that is the logical choice, since they all wrote it together.

[DownOnRodeo]

All or almost all of the things I said about Lindsey have been said about Stevie and some of the other band members mostly unchallenged and without merit. Yet you only have an issue that I said them about Lindsey.

I feel for Team Stevie (it must be like being the defense attorney for a losing case), but that's totally irrelevant to the point I was talking about. I can't spend my time defending the promulgation of inaccurate reporting and unwarranted character aspersions about both of them--good luck to anybody who can (Steve Hopkins perhaps?).

As far as false and misleading those things in and of themselves aren't necessarily criminal. There has to be intent

Criminal??

I give up. I can't share the same stage with you ever again! :laugh:


As to the topic of what song Lindsey might have preferred for the walk-in music, the thoughts of me and others on this have been detailed in the "Lindsey discusses his firing (Rolling Stone)" thread in the Rumours forum. All things considered (including, in particular, Stevie's known penchant for warm-up music to get her in the zone and AV razzamatazz showwomanship, and Lindsey's penchant for a stripped-down bare-bones presentation to let the music stand on its own):
- it seems highly likely that he meant that NO elevator music clip should be played for their entrance as it would be tacky and is not something normally done for their concerts, and from his perspective as musical director there would have been a flow issue in terms of an abortive burst of Rhiannon followed by the opening strands of The Chain; and
- even if he did mean that a DIFFERENT song clip should have been played, the idea that he would want one that HE wrote instead of one she wrote is laughable, particularly in the case of Rhiannon, which from an instrumental perspective would in his mind be as much his creation as hers; however, the notion that he may have preferred a song that was more recent (regardless of who wrote it) does sound like something we could expect Lindsey to argue for--but based on the wording of his comment in the interview and the other considerations listed above, it seems much more likely that he simply wanted NO song played (from a musical direction perspective) and wanted their performance to stand on its own without the cheap use of a "preconceived label".

[Buster]

Where's the negativereview? You're seeing it as negative. No one else does. :shrug:

It’s a negative review. I just don’t agree that it’s nasty. The headline is harsh, but that’s what is done to get noticed. I doubt the reviewer wrote it.

[gldstwmn]

It doesn't really matter what song he wanted. The fact is he behaved badly enough to be fired. It doesn't change anything. Also I'm not really interested in wading through 8000 posts, the majority of which contain some nasty comment about the other band memebers or me or other posters who don't toe the party line to figure out what a bunch Lindsey fans speculate he might have wanted to play. :shrug: :sorry:

[kak125]

Actually after watching the full landslide start to finish, I vastly prefer the vocals of Landslide in the beginning where Stevie is lost and can’t find the key. Her just singing spontaneously is so much better then whatever she considers
To be her “polished, never had a bad night vocally since her vocal coach” voice!

OMG, I totally agree with you! I just watched this full video now and wish she would sing like that more often. So freaking good!

[lovethemac1]

It doesn't really matter what song he wanted. The fact is he behaved badly enough to be fired. It doesn't change anything. Also I'm not really interested in wading through 8000 posts, the majority of which contain some nasty comment about the other band memebers or me or other posters who don't toe the party line to figure out what a bunch Lindsey fans speculate he might have wanted to play. :shrug: :sorry:

How about "It doesn't really matter what song he wanted. The fact is SHE behaved badly AND IMMATURELY and fired him. Blah, blah, blah.......

[gldstwmn]

Criminal??

.

I'm sure the same standard applies in civil court.

[gldstwmn]

How about "It doesn't really matter what song he wanted. The fact is SHE behaved badly AND IMMATURELY and fired him. Blah, blah, blah.......

I think that point of view has been documented here in every single forum ad nauseum.

[gldstwmn]

Photos: Rock Legends Fleetwood Mac Play Hits In San Jose
https://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/photo-galleries/2018/11/25/photos-rock-legends-fleetwood-mac-play-hits-in-san-jose/

[bombaysaffires]

I think that point of view has been documented here in every single forum ad nauseum.

doesn't make it any less valid.

[bombaysaffires]

It doesn't really matter what song he wanted. The fact is he behaved badly enough to be fired. It doesn't change anything. Also I'm not really interested in wading through 8000 posts, the majority of which contain some nasty comment about the other band memebers or me or other posters who don't toe the party line to figure out what a bunch Lindsey fans speculate he might have wanted to play. :shrug: :sorry:

Doesn't matter to who? You?

He behaved badly enough to be fired? You know this for a fact? If so please cite your documentation, not opinion.

You may not be interested in wading through other people's opinions, but you sure seem confident everyone else is interested in wading though endless comments on what a sycophantic Stevie fan has to speculate on what happened.

[button-lip]

That's what it's been called since the inception of language - all of them. :shocked:

Not in Spanish, in case that's what you're trying to tell me. It wouldn't be the first time you're doing this.

[button-lip]

Doesn't matter to who? You?

He behaved badly enough to be fired? You know this for a fact? If so please cite your documentation, not opinion.

You may not be interested in wading through other people's opinions, but you sure seem confident everyone else is interested in wading though endless comments on what a sycophantic Stevie fan has to speculate on what happened.

Opinions. That's all you will read from this particular poster. :nod::nod:

[gldstwmn]

REVIEW: Fleetwood Mac with Neil Finn live in California

Fleetwood Mac with its new lineup, which includes our very own Neil Finn, is halfway through a 52-date US tour. RNZ Music’s Melody Thomas (and her US-based ex-pat mum and sister) were lucky enough to see them perform in San Jose, California.

No captionPhoto: 2018 Getty Images
Fleetwood Mac walked onstage to the deafening roar of a crowd who were incredibly excited to be there.

Over two hours and a whopping 22 songs; men grooved and played air guitar; women waved arms draped in fringe and chiffon; and the smell of pot (legal here) filled the air.

Through it all Stevie Nicks led the charge, her voice instantly identifiable and still going strong at - yes I did google it during the show - 70 years old.

And right by Stevie’s side, there was our Neil, looking every bit a part of the furniture.

Somewhere near the front were me, my big sister and my Mum, reunited for the first time in ages. All around us were groups the same as us: parents who’d loved Fleetwood Mac since they were teenagers, joined by the kids they’d forced their music on, who’d grown up to realise the songs were part of their DNA.

A friend once asked if I liked Fleetwood Mac. “I don’t really know them,” I said. She put on Rumours and within a minute I realised I knew every single song and almost every lyric.

Melody Thomas (right), her sister and mumMelody Thomas (right), her sister and mum Photo: Melody Thomas
Even now when I hear ‘Dreams’, I feel the warm glow of childhood, before divorce and puberty and the dispersal of our family to different continents. Look up the Youtube video for ‘Dreams’ and the top comment reads, “This song brings back memories I never had.” Me too - and they all include my Mum.

Like any long-term expat, Mum was absolutely beside herself with pride at seeing our Neil on stage. Every time there was a lull in applause she took the opportunity to yell “Go kiwi!” or “Kia ora Neil!”

While faintly mortifying, I didn’t really care: hearing the soundtrack to your childhood performed live is special enough, add Neil Finn’s voice - so familiar it feels like home - and it’s all a bit overwhelming.

Neil Finn performing with the Auckland Philhamonia Orchestra in MarchNeil Finn performing with the Auckland Philhamonia Orchestra in March Photo: Ivan Karczewski
Despite the band’s original guitarist Lindsey Buckingham being missed by many, some of the best moments of the night belonged to Neil.

One was Neil and Stevie performing ‘Don’t Dream It’s Over’, which Stevie called “one of the top five songs ever written”, as the crowd sang along and waved their lit-up phones.

Another was during a beautiful rendition of ‘Landslide’, when Stevie lost the key and Neil crossed the stage to sing her own song quietly in her ear, guiding her back to the right place.

While Stevie apologised for the mistake, reassuring the crowd that it’d never happened before, for us it was one of the nicest moments. Fleetwood Mac is such a well-oiled machine, each part and player so well rehearsed, that flashes of vulnerability are incredibly moving.


Other honourable mentions include a 10-minute drum solo from Mick Fleetwood that some have called self-indulgent, but which a friend pointed out was likely an opportunity for the rest of the band to take a quick breather... and an entertaining one at that.

Another was the recently recruited guitarist Mike Campbell (of Tom Petty fame) continuously lighting up old classics with his energetic playing, including a cover of ‘Free Falling’, which the band performed as old photographs of Tom and Stevie played onscreen and the crowd intermittently cried and swooned.

Christine McVie reminded us all what a great songwriter she is with songs like ‘Little Lies’, ‘Don’t Stop’ and ‘You Make Loving Fun’ (a song inspired by an affair with the band’s lighting designer, while Christine was still married to bassist John McVie, which - to this day - is still performed with John on stage).

The final song of the night was a duet of ‘All Over Again’ performed by just Stevie and Christine, the two women who - despite all the break-ups, rumours and excesses - have never failed to be there for each other.

As the band took their final bow to roaring applause, Mick stepped forward and delivered a final message into the mic: “Take care of yourselves. In this strange, strange world we seem to be living in, remember to be so very kind to each other. We love you.”

The applause that follows is unanimous: We love you too.

Who: Fleetwood Mac with their new lineup, which includes Neil Finn

What: Date 22 of their 52-date US tour

Where: SAP Centre, San Jose, CA

When: Wednesday, November 21 (local time)
https://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/nat-music/audio/2018672978/review-fleetwood-mac-with-neil-finn-live-in-california

[DownOnRodeo]

REVIEW: Fleetwood Mac with Neil Finn live in California

It's not my intention to be trolling here for trolling's sake, but let me just say (as someone who definitely knew of Neil Finn before he joined this tour), the branding "Fleetwood Mac with Neil Finn" from this article title is far more appropriate, honest, and befitting of their respective legacies than the current branding of "An Evening with Fleetwood Mac". (Obviously in that case they would need to add more of his songs in, rather than remove them like they're currently doing.)
Fleetwood Mac featuring Billy Burnette as Lindsey Buckingham? Fine.
But Fleetwood Mac featuring Neil Finn as Lindsey Buckingham? It's a strange conceit that I still can't get used to, and other than Sugar Mouse I wonder what the many Neil Finn fans around the world really think about it.

"In this strange, strange world we seem to be living in, remember to be so very kind to each other."

No words. :(