Audience Videos From Music Cares Event Tell A Story

[WatchChain]

As evidenced by prior posts, I've never been one to blindly defend Stevie Nicks. However, there are several amateur shot audience videos from Music Cares that show the entire band making fun of Stevie behind her back as she gives a never-ending acceptance speech (even in the minutes leading up to the "Mick and Chris Waltz").

For example, fast foward this video to the 4:25 minute mark and watch for about 20 seconds. It clearly shows the entire band laughing at Stevie, even Christine McVie begins checking her watch. These actions lead up to Mick and Chris waltzing to lampoon Stevie's speech. All of this behavior is carried on in front of an audience of thousands--including the national press.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WM_Wonk4CNM

My problem with this is that:

1) Lindsey does not appear to be the ONLY one smirking at Stevie's behavior behind her back--why should ONLY HE be chastised?

2) The truth is, these people obviously have very little respect for Stevie. Sure, I know the woman can talk forever, but they could at least cut out their s**t for a national audience. What a clown outfit. I'm supposed to shell out $600 a tour for this crap? No thanks. #toxicbehavior

As for smirking, “The irony is that we have this standing joke that Stevie, when she talks, goes on a long time,” Buckingham says. “I may or may not have smirked (you did). But I look over and Christine and Mick are doing the waltz behind her as a joke.” --Lindsey Buckingham/Rolling Stone

[HomerMcvie]

As evidenced by prior posts, I've never been one to blindly defend Stevie Nicks. However, there are several amateur shot audience videos from Music Cares that show the entire band making fun of Stevie behind her back as she gives a never-ending acceptance speech (even in the minutes leading up to the "Mick and Chris Waltz").

For example, fast foward this video to the 4:25 minute mark and watch for about 20 seconds. It clearly shows the entire band laughing at Stevie, even Christine McVie begins checking her watch. These actions lead up to Mick and Chris waltzing to lampoon Stevie's speech. All of this behavior is carried on in front of an audience of thousands--including the national press.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WM_Wonk4CNM

My problem with this is that:

1) Lindsey does not appear to be the ONLY one smirking at Stevie's behavior behind her back--why should ONLY HE be chastised?

2) The truth is, these people obviously have very little respect for Stevie. Sure, I know the woman can talk forever, but they could at least cut out their s**t for a national audience. What a clown outfit. I'm supposed to shell out $600 a tour for this crap? No thanks. #toxicbehavior

As for smirking, “The irony is that we have this standing joke that Stevie, when she talks, goes on a long time,” Buckingham says. “I may or may not have smirked (you did). But I look over and Christine and Mick are doing the waltz behind her as a joke.” --Lindsey Buckingham/Rolling Stone

Because he's the only one $he HATE$.

[ryan4136]

Bill Clinton reunited them, and was there at the moment of the break up. Damn you Bill

[Angel75]

As evidenced by prior posts, I've never been one to blindly defend Stevie Nicks. However, there are several amateur shot audience videos from Music Cares that show the entire band making fun of Stevie behind her back as she gives a never-ending acceptance speech (even in the minutes leading up to the "Mick and Chris Waltz").

For example, fast foward this video to the 4:25 minute mark and watch for about 20 seconds. It clearly shows the entire band laughing at Stevie, even Christine McVie begins checking her watch. These actions lead up to Mick and Chris waltzing to lampoon Stevie's speech. All of this behavior is carried on in front of an audience of thousands--including the national press.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WM_Wonk4CNM

My problem with this is that:

1) Lindsey does not appear to be the ONLY one smirking at Stevie's behavior behind her back--why should ONLY HE be chastised?

2) The truth is, these people obviously have very little respect for Stevie. Sure, I know the woman can talk forever, but they could at least cut out their s**t for a national audience. What a clown outfit. I'm supposed to shell out $600 a tour for this crap? No thanks. #toxicbehavior

As for smirking, “The irony is that we have this standing joke that Stevie, when she talks, goes on a long time,” Buckingham says. “I may or may not have smirked (you did). But I look over and Christine and Mick are doing the waltz behind her as a joke.” --Lindsey Buckingham/Rolling Stone

Thanks for posting this and highlighting the pettiness.

If you are splitting hairs, Chris and Mick are clearly more guilty of 'smirking' with their dance if thats how you pathetic you choose to look at all...but Lindsey gets the blame for that and thinking playing a song (Rhiannon) before you go out on stage is a bad idea

[Aussie W/Heart]

LOL i knew it!, i posted my take on LB's firing months ago re: musicares event and what went on behind Stevie's back while making her long winded speech mainly about Tom & the Heartbreakers.. My post was ignored, bar one who said it was just silly FAN FICTION..

[sasja]

:rolleyes:

I really still maintain my belief that, had the woman gone ahead and had that baby, and by necessity had to have grown up in the process by the mere fact of having to put someone before her own darn spoiled self from then on, she might have turned out a tolerable human being.
Now, Oh my word. What a sad caricature of a creature in every sense of the word. It just goes to show one about choices.

MOO

Sas

[jbrownsjr]

:rolleyes:

I really still maintain my belief that, had the woman gone ahead and had that baby, and by necessity had to have grown up in the process by the mere fact of having to put someone before her own darn spoiled self from then on, she might have turned out a tolerable human being.
Now, Oh my word. What a sad caricature of a creature in every sense of the word. It just goes to show one about choices.

MOO

Sas

Wow, I actually agree with this. $he has no family AND $he's insufferable. And because $he has no other purpose than to gather fame and stay relevant, $he's become worse. And $he feeds a lot of mouths with her touring and FM $$. They must run her pathetic life for her.

[jmn3]

Wow, I actually agree with this. $he has no family AND $he's insufferable. And because $he has no other purpose than to gather fame and stay relevant, $he's become worse. And $he feeds a lot of mouths with her touring and FM $$. They must run her pathetic life for her.

This is so spot on. She’s totally insufferable and lacks any anchor in life other than holding on to her fame. That Lindsey has these things and doesn’t need to carry grudges about a relationship that ended over forty years ago must kill her.

[HomerMcvie]

Wow, I actually agree with this. $he has no family AND $he's insufferable. And because $he has no other purpose than to gather fame and stay relevant, $he's become worse. And $he feeds a lot of mouths with her touring and FM $$. They must run her pathetic life for her.
While I'm sure we'd all love to have her bank account,...

Would you trade places with her? Having her pathetic LITTLE life? I wouldn't. Poor old thing truly must be miserable.

[dreamsunwind]

Didn't Lindsey say himself in that interview it's just a joke amongst them when she rambles? On the last tour during her self-indulgent speeches, Christine had an actual whistle, John would literally walk offstage, Mick and Lindsey would fiddle around with his drum kit etc etc. I don't think it's "toxic behavior" or a sign of disrespect or anything, it's clearly something they all just do with some humor because she literally talks for 50 years and what are they supposed to do-- stand there while she rambles for ages about herself and how amazing she is? I can understand if she got a bit annoyed at it at the MusiCares event because it was a different context but to get picky with one particular person when he wasn't even the worst offender is just childish. But then again Stevie seems to be a very childish person.

[button-lip]

While I'm sure we'd all love to have her bank account,...

Would you trade places with her? Having her pathetic LITTLE life? I wouldn't. Poor old thing truly must be miserable.

At this point is clear she should buy a permanent residence in the loony bin closest to her home, and bring along those 3 fans she still has here. :]:]:]

[secondhandchain]

Wow, I actually agree with this. $he has no family AND $he's insufferable. And because $he has no other purpose than to gather fame and stay relevant, $he's become worse. And $he feeds a lot of mouths with her touring and FM $$. They must run her pathetic life for her.

SO SPOT ON!!! Her only purpose in her little pathetic life is gobbling up as much fame as she can, even if she has to take Lindsey's as well. UGH

[HomerMcvie]

At this point is clear she should buy a permanent residence in the loony bin closest to her home, and bring along those 3 fans she still has here. :]:]:]

Well I think we know who her most compatible roommate would likely be. :]

[DownOnRodeo]

Well I think we know who her most compatible roommate would likely be. :]

Can I buy a vowel?
Oh wait, all consonants.

[HomerMcvie]

Can I buy a vowel?
Oh wait, all consonants.

Last time I checked, G was a consonant.

[Buster]

FFS, now the argument is Stevie is a horrible person because she never had a baby which would have changed her. What misogynistic crap. Would never be said about a man.

Also, I maintain that there is more to the story/firing than smirking and Rhiannon. People are just gobbling up Lindsey’s comments as complete truth. Has anyone here been fired? I have, once. Unfairly, but I did have some responsibility. But I refused to look at my contribution to the problem for several months. When I talked about it, I claimed 100% innocence and never told the entire story.

Finally, the band was very rude to make fun of her in front of an audience. She can talk as long as she goddamn wants. They don’t like it - tell her directly. What a bunch of obnoxious children. These people stopped liking and respecting each other a long time ago.

[turquoise5]

FFS, now the argument is Stevie is a horrible person because she never had a baby which would have changed her. What misogynistic crap. Would never be said about a man.

Also, I maintain that there is more to the story/firing than smirking and Rhiannon. People are just gobbling up Lindsey’s comments as complete truth. Has anyone here been fired? I have, once. Unfairly, but I did have some responsibility. But I refused to look at my contribution to the problem for several months. When I talked about it, I claimed 100% innocence and never told the entire story.

Finally, the band was very rude to make fun of her in front of an audience. She can talk as long as she goddamn wants. They don’t like it - tell her directly. What a bunch of obnoxious children. These people stopped liking and respecting each other a long time ago.


So what if Stevie and Christine never had kids? Does not diminish them one whit. Childfree people are full humans in their own right. And you're spot on about the mysoginism - no one says anything of the kind about men!! What if Stevie and/or Chris had kids, and left them at home with their husbands while the ladies went on tour...they'd be called 'bad moms.' But when Mick, John, and Lindsey leave their kids at home with their wives, it's considered perfectly normal.

[jeets2000]

Also, I maintain that there is more to the story/firing than smirking and Rhiannon. People are just gobbling up Lindsey’s comments as complete truth. Has anyone here been fired? I have, once. Unfairly, but I did have some responsibility. But I refused to look at my contribution to the problem for several months. When I talked about it, I claimed 100% innocence and never told the entire story.

Finally, the band was very rude to make fun of her in front of an audience. She can talk as long as she goddamn wants. They don’t like it - tell her directly. What a bunch of obnoxious children. These people stopped liking and respecting each other a long time ago.

I want to start this post by genuinely and honestly conveying that I'm interested in hearing your thoughts on this question. It's not a trap! :laugh:

Initially, the band said LB's firing was the result of a scheduling conflict, which morphed over time into them saying they, collectively, had been unhappy for years. (I think it's important that Mick has never singled anyone out when he describes the band's position.)

For months we've been waiting for Lindsey to give his side of the story. Yesterday he finally did, via Rolling Stone. You are cautioning people not to believe Lindsey's side of the story completely because there are two sides to this conflict. Fair.

My question is: which parts of Lindsey's story do you not believe and why?

The reason I ask is that LB's versions of events, to those of us who have been discussing it (ad nauseum, haha) for the past few months seems to more closely align with other information we knew to be true (i.e., some sort of argument at MusiCares, this plan in motion beforehand given when Mike joined, etc.) On the other hand, scheduling conflicts and deep-seeded unhappiness among the band, strains credulity (i.e., a scheduling conflict is no reason to fire a 43-year member of the band, and everyone outside of Stevie seemed to be getting along swimmingly for LB/CM last year).

So anyway, in the spirit of understanding where everyone is coming from, I'm just curious how much of LB's version of events you're willing to buy and what your reasoning is. And if you don't want to respond, that's fine, too. Just wanted to ask! :D

[HomerMcvie]

So what if Stevie and Christine never had kids? Does not diminish them one whit. Childfree people are full humans in their own right. And you're spot on about the mysoginism - no one says anything of the kind about men!! What if Stevie and/or Chris had kids, and left them at home with their husbands while the ladies went on tour...they'd be called 'bad moms.' But when Mick, John, and Lindsey leave their kids at home with their wives, it's considered perfectly normal.

Know what? I'm a MAN. A fairly selfish, self centered man. I live my life making MYSELF happy. It's all about ME.

Is it not plausible to say that if I'd had children, I probably wouldn't be the selfish person I am today? That I'd have a different outlook on life?

But I guess since I have a penis, it's okay to say that about me. But if I had a vagina, it's forbidden? Do I have that right?

[AncientQueen]

:rolleyes:

I really still maintain my belief that, had the woman gone ahead and had that baby, and by necessity had to have grown up in the process by the mere fact of having to put someone before her own darn spoiled self from then on, she might have turned out a tolerable human being.
Now, Oh my word. What a sad caricature of a creature in every sense of the word. It just goes to show one about choices.

MOO

SasReally? Can you try any harder on the misogyny? I don't think so.

Stevie made her choices and why would she regret them? The fact that she did something you don't agree with does not make her whole life miserable. Also, the fact that you have children does obviously not make you any less petty.

[AncientQueen]

FFS, now the argument is Stevie is a horrible person because she never had a baby which would have changed her. What misogynistic crap. Would never be said about a man.

Also, I maintain that there is more to the story/firing than smirking and Rhiannon. People are just gobbling up Lindsey’s comments as complete truth. Has anyone here been fired? I have, once. Unfairly, but I did have some responsibility. But I refused to look at my contribution to the problem for several months. When I talked about it, I claimed 100% innocence and never told the entire story.

Finally, the band was very rude to make fun of her in front of an audience. She can talk as long as she goddamn wants. They don’t like it - tell her directly. What a bunch of obnoxious children. These people stopped liking and respecting each other a long time ago.
While I fully agree with your first two paragraphs. Lindsey does sound a little too innocent, given what we know about his personality. I took the situation during Musicares as a friendly banter between friends, I would have laughed if my bandmates would make gimmicks behind my back because they find my ramblings a bit annoying, all in good fun (Mick, John and Chris ARE brits after all, let them have their scurile humour). I'm sure ever member of the band told her again and again to keep it short, before they settled for making fun of her ramblings. I think that Stevie was angry when Lindsey did not want one of her most famous songs playing when FM entered the stage, because that would have made everything even more about her and not the band, something she liked and he did not. And that was the big bang.

[DownOnRodeo]

Even Bill Clinton is getting up to leave during Stevie's talk--and he loves endless talking!

[jmn3]

Why is she so proud of the "I talked for 46 minutes and sang for 2 hours?" Who the hell wants to go to a concert and hear rambling for a third of it?

Her whole MusicCares speech is ridiculous and they should have rolled their eyes. 90 year olds today played Fleetwood Mac in their cribs for their babies? Lady, I'm 37 and my parents are in their early 60's. No 90 year olds in 2018 were playing Landslide for their babies you weirdo.

"Are you nervous? And I said, no, he didn't even say are you nervous, he just looked at my face and said are you okay?" SHUT UP

[WatchChain]

Even Bill Clinton is getting up to leave during Stevie's talk--and he loves endless talking!

Bill Clinton was returning to his seat after having been onstage announcing the Music Cares award and introducing the band.

[DownOnRodeo]

Bill Clinton was returning to his seat after having been onstage announcing the Music Cares award and introducing the band.

Ok, I stand corrected.
I couldn't bear to actually watch the whole clip or listen to an awkward monologue, so I just skipped to the eye-rolling/waltzing part as recommended.

[mitzo]

Why is she so proud of the "I talked for 46 minutes and sang for 2 hours?" Who the hell wants to go to a concert and hear rambling for a third of it?

Full arenas of people for months, apparently.

Her whole MusicCares speech is ridiculous and they should have rolled their eyes. 90 year olds today played Fleetwood Mac in their cribs for their babies? Lady, I'm 37 and my parents are in their early 60's. No 90 year olds in 2018 were playing Landslide for their babies you weirdo.

FM got famous in the mid 70s. Some fans from that time who had kids are likely pushing 90 today.:shrug:

"Are you nervous? And I said, no, he didn't even say are you nervous, he just looked at my face and said are you okay?" SHUT UP


Too bad Lindsey didn't get to perform a hymn to his penis at the event like "My Little Demon" or "Come." People would have liked that!

[bombaysaffires]

From the article in Variety:

So why did Buckingham get forced out? Loeb & Loeb evidently decided the lawsuit was not the place to go there, even as they attempt to methodically knock down all the official explanations that Nicks, Fleetwood and the two McVies have offered up in interviews.


So the real reasons are still not known; the suit focuses on the method of his ousting and the aftermath.

[mitzo]

From the article in Variety:

So why did Buckingham get forced out? Loeb & Loeb evidently decided the lawsuit was not the place to go there, even as they attempt to methodically knock down all the official explanations that Nicks, Fleetwood and the two McVies have offered up in interviews.


So the real reasons are still not known; the suit focuses on the method of his ousting and the aftermath.

Likely because WHY he was booted would reflect poorly on him.

[AncientQueen]

Too bad Lindsey didn't get to perform a hymn to his penis at the event like "My Little Demon" or "Come." People would have liked that!Well, with Stevies "my walls are flaming" and Christines "slip your hands inside of my glove", you should be careful what euphemisms you are condemning in a FM forum. Yust saying.:laugh:

[sodascouts]

And now Stevie is singing about breaking off a guy's magic stick! Yikes!

[mitzo]

Well, with Stevies "my walls are flaming" and Christines "slip your hands inside of my glove", you should be careful what euphemisms you are condemning in a FM forum. Yust saying.:laugh:
I don't think the flaming walls are vaginal nor are they the theme of the song, and Chris's slippery glove is not the focus of her song either.

[AncientQueen]

I don't think the flaming walls are vaginal nor are they the theme of the song, and Chris's slippery glove is not the focus of her song either.
Orrrrr, the :laugh: could have been a hint.

[DownOnRodeo]

I don't think the flaming walls are vaginal nor are they the theme of the song, and Chris's slippery glove is not the focus of her song either.

My Little Demon as a hymn to his penis?
Projecting much?

All of my friends, all telling me
That I just ain't the man I used to be

An ode to personality issues, perhaps, but not a penis hymn.
(Edit: And I may not have the broadest command of the rock and roll lexicon, but what man would write a "hymn to his penis" and insist on calling it "Little"?)


Come clearly has its allusions, and when I saw him and the boys rock it live it was a welcome breath of masculinity amidst all the glittering chiffon.

As the band's musical director (apparently), he knew how to help put together a set list, which is why he never would have insisted on doing Come at a three-song gig or at that particular occasion.

[BlanketMan]

Didn't Lindsey say himself in that interview it's just a joke amongst them when she rambles? On the last tour during her self-indulgent speeches, Christine had an actual whistle, John would literally walk offstage, Mick and Lindsey would fiddle around with his drum kit etc etc. I don't think it's "toxic behavior" or a sign of disrespect or anything, it's clearly something they all just do with some humor because she literally talks for 50 years and what are they supposed to do-- stand there while she rambles for ages about herself and how amazing she is? I can understand if she got a bit annoyed at it at the MusiCares event because it was a different context but to get picky with one particular person when he wasn't even the worst offender is just childish. But then again Stevie seems to be a very childish person.

Had I been in the audience, I would've also assumed that their behavior was fairly scripted, like just about every other interaction between FM band members on stage has been the last 20 years. "When Stevie hits the five-minute mark, Chris will look at her watch, I'll start smirking, you and Mick do a disinterested waltz...! It'll be hilarious!"

I can't imagine anyone watching that speech and NOT giving an occasional eye-roll toward Stevie. "Rambling" is too kind. I won free tickets to one of her 24-Karat solo shows and... I don't think I've ever heard a musician spend SO much time talking during a concert. She may have actually spent more time talking than singing. It's exhausting as a concert-goer! I'd go nuts if I was one of the poor souls on stage behind her!

[SteveMacD]

I think the smirk is a bit of a red herring.

[HomerMcvie]

My Little Demon as a hymn to his penis?


I know quite a few Ledgies who have seen My Little Demon's penis.

Now who knows what I'm talking about? :laugh:

[sasja]

I mentioned my personal belief that she should have had that baby way back when as a clear path to a different personal development for Stevie Nicks, mainly because it was an actual fork in the road of her life that I had knowledge of, it being public. And I do believe taking the other fork would have altered her. Probably for the much better.

Sorry if that comes across as mysogynistic, but I still maintain that ANY human who is forced to step out of her or himself for the reason of putting another first, is the better for it. MUCH better. Of course every human has a different starting point when they embark on such. Some are less prone to self-absorbtion already :D


I did not feel like calling her deceased mom to task on raising a spoiled princess, even if her mom wrote such herself to her sister in that old letter that's floating around. But never mind all that. Water under the bridge and no parent is perfect.:wavey:

[DownOnRodeo]

my personal belief that she should have had that baby way back when as a clear path to a different personal development for Stevie Nicks

Maybe, but maybe not.
Sadly, there is no shortage of highly narcissistic parents.
And even if she had a good run during the kid's early years, there was always the chance of future fallings out, estrangement, or even acrimony (think "Mommie Dearest") due to the child's dissatisfaction with being the child of a big star (and one of the loopier and addiction-prone ones at that).

I do certainly feel sorry for Stevie for any reduced options that may have been available to her in terms of starting a family in the 90s or 00s compared to Lindsey, due to the male/female physiological differences. Yet in the mid-80s while Lindsey was writing about being a family man deep down, she was busy doubling down on her narrative of "stardom first" and not being beholden to any one man. So it seems that their respective trajectories were pretty much set in their early 30s.

Thank you for sharing that phrase "spoiled princess." Combined with her being the eldest child, that is a lethal combination.

[DownOnRodeo]

I know quite a few Ledgies who have seen My Little Demon's penis.

I certainly had to read that one twice.

[HomerMcvie]

I certainly had to read that one twice.

It's a fact, Jack. Er, Joe.

[HomerMcvie]

On an alternate Fleetwood Mac board, it was once used as somebody's Avatar.

[Feather Blade]

On an alternate Fleetwood Mac board, it was once used as somebody's Avatar.

Ahh, so it was a board member...:lol:

[HomerMcvie]

Ahh, so it was a board member...:lol:

I almost went there! Friends, send your penis pics to people on the board, and it will haunt you forever!

[AncientQueen]

I mentioned my personal belief that she should have had that baby way back when as a clear path to a different personal development for Stevie Nicks, mainly because it was an actual fork in the road of her life that I had knowledge of, it being public. And I do believe taking the other fork would have altered her. Probably for the much better.

Sorry if that comes across as mysogynistic, but I still maintain that ANY human who is forced to step out of her or himself for the reason of putting another first, is the better for it. MUCH better. Of course every human has a different starting point when they embark on such. Some are less prone to self-absorbtion already :D

I did not feel like calling her deceased mom to task on raising a spoiled princess, even if her mom wrote such herself to her sister in that old letter that's floating around. But never mind all that. Water under the bridge and no parent is perfect.:wavey:
Oh my! I like that you try to explain your first post, but it does not really work, at least not for me.
FORCING someone to step out of herself is your take on motherhood. Well, I strongly disagree with that.
Also, I will defend Stevies right to have an abortion as much as I defend that right for anyone. It is not our place to judge a woman in that situation. Stevie had her reasons, no matter if you, I or anyone else on this planet understands them, they made sense to her. Yes, I know that she had 4, but that does not change my take on that.
And calling her deceased mother out for raising a princess? Her mother was a woman and of course some woman must be responsible. How is that not misogynist?
I think that we should just agree to disagree about this.

[StevieandChris]

Ahh, so it was a board member...:lol:

ROFL. :laugh:

[singertobe]

Wow, I actually agree with this. $he has no family AND $he's insufferable. And because $he has no other purpose than to gather fame and stay relevant, $he's become worse. And $he feeds a lot of mouths with her touring and FM $$. They must run her pathetic life for her.

Well Christine doesn't have a family either...

[singertobe]

So what if Stevie and Christine never had kids? Does not diminish them one whit. Childfree people are full humans in their own right. And you're spot on about the mysoginism - no one says anything of the kind about men!! What if Stevie and/or Chris had kids, and left them at home with their husbands while the ladies went on tour...they'd be called 'bad moms.' But when Mick, John, and Lindsey leave their kids at home with their wives, it's considered perfectly normal.

I think its because the mom is the one who carried the child inside her so its expected that she would have a deeper bond.

[mitzo]

My Little Demon as a hymn to his penis?
Projecting much?

All of my friends, all telling me
That I just ain't the man I used to be

An ode to personality issues, perhaps, but not a penis hymn.
(Edit: And I may not have the broadest command of the rock and roll lexicon, but what man would write a "hymn to his penis" and insist on calling it "Little"?)


Come clearly has its allusions, and when I saw him and the boys rock it live it was a welcome breath of masculinity amidst all the glittering chiffon.

As the band's musical director (apparently), he knew how to help put together a set list, which is why he never would have insisted on doing Come at a three-song gig or at that particular occasion.

OK a frank reflection on his erectile disfunction, then.

[Buster]

Going back to the video. I just watched for the first time as the link was posted on the Mick meet and greet thread on Present Band thread. I think the whole band acts disrespectfully, but people don’t seem to agree with me that at 4:34, Linsey makes the masturbation motion that people make when someone goes on too long or too arrogantly. Does no one else see this motion? Not fireable offense but not just a smirk either.

Regardless, Stevie should be able to speak for 6 minutes without her teammates openly mocking her behind her back in front of an audience.

[mitzo]

Going back to the video. I just watched for the first time as the link was posted on the Mick meet and greet thread on Present Band thread. I think the whole band acts disrespectfully, but people don’t seem to agree with me that at 4:34, Linsey makes the masturbation motion that people make when someone goes on too long or too arrogantly. Does no one else see this motion? Not fireable offense but not just a smirk either.

Regardless, Stevie should be able to speak for 6 minutes without her teammates openly mocking her behind her back in front of an audience.
I see the gesture. He and Chris exchange a few words and look up to the right when he makes that gesture. Really unclear what really was going on or what he meant.

[DeepBlueDee]

I see the gesture. He and Chris exchange a few words and look up to the right when he makes that gesture. Really unclear what really was going on or what he meant.
He points to something (or someone) stage right or in the audience first.(The Clintons being shown, maybe?) Not sure what exactly is going on there either. :shrug: It doesn't look like a "masturbation gesture" to me, though, his hand is pretty high for that. :laugh:
They are clearly mocking her, though. All of them. That's not cool no matter who it is. It's an award presentation, not a concert diatribe they're trying to get her to wrap up.

[SteveMacD]

I’m willing to bet they all got an earful about that.

[rhiannondontgo]

He points to something (or someone) stage right or in the audience first.(The Clintons being shown, maybe?) Not sure what exactly is going on there either. :shrug: It doesn't look like a "masturbation gesture" to me, though, his hand is pretty high for that. :laugh:
They are clearly mocking her, though. All of them. That's not cool no matter who it is. It's an award presentation, not a concert diatribe they're trying to get her to wrap up.

As usual, she is rambling, messing up dates, and moving around to all kinds of barely-related topics. But it’s her time to make a speech. And she is talking about some pretty serious and sad sh*t at times, I mean her close friend just died a few months prior and she’s talking about him and later on about her late parents and stuff. The other band members could’ve just hung in there and showed her at least a little respect.
It’s not a fireable offense, and i’m sure it isn’t the only reason he was canned. But I can definitely see her being annoyed by it.

[lennonfan]

something I saw in this that really saddens me. Stevie is in a deep state of grief that is really haunting her, if you just look at the serious drug abuse of the past you can see it's self medication to block out a serious hurt or depression inside. That has not gone away.
So, in a constant state of hurt, at this point she sees mortality coming and just simply doesn't care. In spite of Lindsey having a family, in spite of her solo success and friends etc. there is still something between them or this never would have happened.

I think Lindsey has coped with it better over the years but Stevie really has personal issues with it. Doesn't it seem like, if they were truly over each other, this would be totally a non issue? Loss of perspective is putting it too mildly.

[Buster]

As usual, she is rambling, messing up dates, and moving around to all kinds of barely-related topics. But it’s her time to make a speech. And she is talking about some pretty serious and sad sh*t at times, I mean her close friend just died a few months prior and she’s talking about him and later on about her late parents and stuff. The other band members could’ve just hung in there and showed her at least a little respect.
It’s not a fireable offense, and i’m sure it isn’t the only reason he was canned. But I can definitely see her being annoyed by it.


I agree with all of this. It bothers me to watch this video. I think those who criticize Stevie for this speech are missing the context. This is not her typical endless self-absorbed speech (which I always love because she never used to talk much). She’s in an emotional state. She is never a good public speaker and she’s struggling, resulting in rambling. I am quite certain of this. And to see her friends and longtime teammates poking fun of her, causing the audience to laugh without her knowing why, is disturbing. Lindsey is not the only one at fault.

[DownOnRodeo]

She is never a good public speaker


Really?

Depends on one's definitions of "good" and "public" I suppose, but if "prolific" and "in front of people" count, then she should get a Tony.

Wasn't her college major Communications?

Now Christine on the other hand, no one would suggest that she is a natural at public speaking (I mean extended speaking, not just emcee one-liners here and there). Christine never even looks like she's enjoying the attention. Stevie at least comes across as enjoying--even feeding off--the attention and the platform, and hence she seems like a natural public speaker to me. Needless to say though, I wouldn't like her chances of managing to do, say, a TED talk, reading off the script (like Mick seems to be doing in some of his speech here) and within the allotted 20 mins.

(Edit) Which is a shame (re Christine), since she has such an awesome sultry speaking voice. She could woo me until the sun comes up reading the Yellow Pages.

[gldstwmn]

My Little Demon as a hymn to his penis?
Projecting much?

All of my friends, all telling me
That I just ain't the man I used to be



Hard as a rock
Dry as a bone
Big dog little dog
I will take you home

Yeah that's G rated.

[mitzo]

Hard as a rock
Dry as a bone
Big dog little dog
I will take you home

Yeah that's G rated.

Sublime, isn't it? Especially when delivered in a nasal yelp while squirming.

[DownOnRodeo]

Hard as a rock
Dry as a bone
Big dog little dog
I will take you home

Yeah that's G rated.

I fear that those are not the lyrics.

Hard as a rock,dry as a bone...
Big or little, know that I will take you home.

http://www.fleetwoodmac.net/penguin/interpretations/m/mylittledemon.htm

This is what Lindsey said the song is about:
You know I think all of us have some inner demons that we struggle with. We all have them, and there's been times when we let them get the best of us probably as well. I think its just important to remember that no one falls into a simple set of labels, and its even more important, I think, to learn from your mistakes and to fight for the positive choice. That's what this song is about."

And this is how a team of Ledge contributors interpreted that stanza back in the day:
This demon can be his negative feelings or his past use of drugs...but whatever it is, it is very overwhelming and he knows that no matter if it's big or little, he will take it inside of himself.

Beware of the subtitles on The Dance DVD--they're often hilariously wrong and make little sense (like "big dog little dog").
There's one during Stevie's furious climax to "Silver Springs" that says "Words are fool" or something instead of "Was I such a fool." :laugh:

[gldstwmn]

Sublime, isn't it? Especially when delivered in a nasal yelp while squirming.

Damn you're funny. :laugh::laugh::laugh:

[gldstwmn]

I fear that those are not the lyrics.



http://www.fleetwoodmac.net/penguin/interpretations/m/mylittledemon.htm

This is what Lindsey said the song is about:


And this is how a team of Ledge contributors interpreted that stanza back in the day:


Beware of the subtitles on The Dance DVD--they're often hilariously wrong and make little sense (like "big dog little dog").
There's one during Stevie's furious climax to "Silver Springs" that says "Words are fool" or something instead of "Was I such a fool." :laugh:

What he's saying is he'll hit anything when his demon isn't little. :laugh: :o
I hear big dog little dog. :shrug:
Some of those interpretations are hilariously bad.

[David]

I agree with all of this. It bothers me to watch this video. I think those who criticize Stevie for this speech are missing the context. This is not her typical endless self-absorbed speech (which I always love because she never used to talk much). She’s in an emotional state. She is never a good public speaker and she’s struggling, resulting in rambling. I am quite certain of this.I find Stevie's six-minute speech very endearing and engaging. But then I usually do. She's a born charmer, and she visibly charms the audience. You can see their delight.

And to see her friends and longtime teammates poking fun of her, causing the audience to laugh without her knowing why, is disturbing. Lindsey is not the only one at fault.I'm also charmed—always have been—by the other four when they're grouped together at an event like this. I find their cavorting and the subtle Brit antics very funny. That discrepancy between Stevie's earnest, heartfelt words and the Ritz Brothers response from the other four is, to me, at the heart of Fleetwood Mac's crowd appeal, onstage or off.

[mitzo]

Damn you're funny. :laugh::laugh::laugh:
That's MY Lindsey! I may actually miss him...:o

[bombaysaffires]

I find Stevie's six-minute speech very endearing and engaging. But then I usually do. She's a born charmer, and she visibly charms the audience. You can see their delight.

I'm also charmed—always have been—by the other four when they're grouped together at an event like this. I find their cavorting and the subtle Brit antics very funny. That discrepancy between Stevie's earnest, heartfelt words and the Ritz Brothers response from the other four is, to me, at the heart of Fleetwood Mac's crowd appeal, onstage or off.

the Ritz Brothers? I hear they're crackers. :eek:

[Buster]

Really?

Depends on one's definitions of "good" and "public" I suppose, but if "prolific" and "in front of people" count, then she should get a Tony.

Wasn't her college major Communications?

Now Christine on the other hand, no one would suggest that she is a natural at public speaking (I mean extended speaking, not just emcee one-liners here and there). Christine never even looks like she's enjoying the attention. Stevie at least comes across as enjoying--even feeding off--the attention and the platform, and hence she seems like a natural public speaker to me. Needless to say though, I wouldn't like her chances of managing to do, say, a TED talk, reading off the script (like Mick seems to be doing in some of his speech here) and within the allotted 20 mins.

(Edit) Which is a shame (re Christine), since she has such an awesome sultry speaking voice. She could woo me until the sun comes up reading the Yellow Pages.

No doubt she is prolific. But she learned little in college as she is never concise, relies too much on memorized/rehearsed pieces, and her nervousness comes across when she starts to ramble. I remember her Beauty and the Beast story during Wild Heart tour - “I um, just want to take a few minutes to talk about this song” then proceeded to tell a nearly incoherent story.

I think she has, over time, come to enjoy speaking even though she isn’t very good at it. The Gypsy story, which I think I’m the person who enjoyed it, and the 24K touris evidence of that.

I think she should have been cut a break with her MusiCares speech. She was dealing with a major loss, who knows what kind of tensions FM were having, Bill Clinton was in the audience, and the point of the award was really unclear. She tried, she failed, and her teammates openly mocked her behind her back in front of an audience. Should she have been more graceful and talked more about FM? Yes. Did she deserve to be treated poorly by the band? No.

[Jondalar]

No doubt she is prolific. But she learned little in college as she is never concise, relies too much on memorized/rehearsed pieces, and her nervousness comes across when she starts to ramble. I remember her Beauty and the Beast story during Wild Heart tour - “I um, just want to take a few minutes to talk about this song” then proceeded to tell a nearly incoherent story.

I think she has, over time, come to enjoy speaking even though she isn’t very good at it. The Gypsy story, which I think I’m the person who enjoyed it, and the 24K touris evidence of that.

I think she should have been cut a break with her MusiCares speech. She was dealing with a major loss, who knows what kind of tensions FM were having, Bill Clinton was in the audience, and the point of the award was really unclear. She tried, she failed, and her teammates openly mocked her behind her back in front of an audience. Should she have been more graceful and talked more about FM? Yes. Did she deserve to be treated poorly by the band? No.

I'm not buying the major loss stuff.

[cbBen]

I will defend Stevies right to have an abortion as much as I defend that right for anyone. It is not our place to judge a woman in that situation. Stevie had her reasons, no matter if you, I or anyone else on this planet understands them, they made sense to her. Yes, I know that she had 4, but that does not change my take on that..

I'm sorry. Let me get this straight. Stevie had FOUR abortions?! Is that public record?

Leaving the aside the morality and politics of the issue (please), almost no woman can have four abortions and not be deeply traumatized. Even one is traumatic.

[HomerMcvie]

I'm sorry. Let me get this straight. Stevie had FOUR abortions?! Is that public record?

Leaving the aside the morality and politics of the issue (please), almost no woman can have four abortions and not be deeply traumatized. Even one is traumatic.

We're not supposed to talk about that here.

I mean, it's allowed, but Chiffonheads become UNGLUED when you bring it up.

But apparently, yeah, it looks like $he had four abortions.:shocked:

[AnthonyMI]

:rolleyes:

I really still maintain my belief that, had the woman gone ahead and had that baby, and by necessity had to have grown up in the process by the mere fact of having to put someone before her own darn spoiled self from then on, she might have turned out a tolerable human being.
Now, Oh my word. What a sad caricature of a creature in every sense of the word. It just goes to show one about choices.

MOO

Sas


Wait. Which baby?! There were multiple. Sadly, they would have been born Cocaine addicted Babies. Or Fetal Alchohol Syndrome Babies. Sadly. A cat is a better mother.

But I agree. She mist be insane with jelousy that LBs gonads didnt dry up at 50 years old and he had a family, while hers turned slowly to (gold?) dust

[cbBen]

people don’t seem to agree with me that at 4:34, Linsey makes the masturbation motion that people make when someone goes on too long or too arrogantly. Does no one else see this motion? Not fireable offense but not just a smirk either.

Maybe (just maybe), he spots someone in the audience making such a gesture and points it out to Christine. I don't think so, however. His arm is too high.

[gldstwmn]

This is interesting to watch:
<iframe allowfullscreen frameborder="0" width="698" height="573" scrolling="no" id="molvideoplayer" title="MailOnline Embed Player" src="https://www.dailymail.co.uk/embed/video/1787174.html"></iframe>

[David]

This is interesting to watch:

Dayum! Lindsey looks really bored-slash-mad.

[michelej1]

I would like to know what question Stevie asked, to which Lindsey shook his head.

[David]

I would like to know what question Stevie asked, to which Lindsey shook his head. Possibly "Would you mind smiling a bit so that everyone thinks you're somewhat happy to be here?"

[bombaysaffires]

Dayum! Lindsey looks really bored-slash-mad.

yeah but that's often his approach to photo shoots. If you watch, there are definitely a few moments where he breaks a little smile, but when he's "ON" for the cameras, he's doing his "serious artiste" face.....

[michelej1]

yeah but that's often his approach to photo shoots. If you watch, there are definitely a few moments where he breaks a little smile, but when he's "ON" for the cameras, he's doing his "serious artiste" face.....

Guess it worked a lot better when his face was younger.

[bombaysaffires]

Guess it worked a lot better when his face was younger.

not for me. I didn't like it then, either.

I especially didn't like it for the cover of the BuckVie album, I thought he looked rather twerpy not smiling. :distress:

[elle]

not for me. I didn't like it then, either.

I especially didn't like it for the cover of the BuckVie album, I thought he looked rather twerpy not smiling. :distress:

lol did you all see any of the m&g pics fans are posting all over twitter, FB and IG? he is pulling that stupid serious face on almost every single one of them. he laughs and have that adorable crinkly smile while talking to fans right before photo is taken and then he quickly makes that serious face for the actual pic taking. :laugh:

[bombaysaffires]

lol did you all see any of the m&g pics fans are posting all over twitter, FB and IG? he is pulling that stupid serious face on almost every single one of them. he laughs and have that adorable crinkly smile while talking to fans right before photo is taken and then he quickly makes that serious face for the actual pic taking. :laugh:

WTF??? why why why?

[elle]

WTF??? why why why?

not sure? maybe he thinks he looks better with a serious face? doesn't like his smile in photos? idk.

i told him pics look bad and he should smile. he said nope. :xoxo::laugh:

[bombaysaffires]

not sure? maybe he thinks he looks better with a serious face? doesn't like his smile in photos? idk.

i told him pics look bad and he should smile. he said nope. :xoxo::laugh:

wow. good on you for saying it!

how odd though.... to NEVER smile. I mean, there are different ways of smiling, for instance one can smile with their eyes even if they don't make a big wide smile with their mouth....... If he at least had that kind of twinkle in his eye, he would come off as less surly in pics. Come on Kristen, Will, Leelee and Stella, work on him to show the more rounded person he is! :laugh:

[elle]

wow. good on you for saying it!

how odd though.... to NEVER smile. I mean, there are different ways of smiling, for instance one can smile with their eyes even if they don't make a big wide smile with their mouth....... If he at least had that kind of twinkle in his eye, he would come off as less surly in pics. Come on Kristen, Will, Leelee and Stella, work on him to show the more rounded person he is! :laugh:

well, here are some of the faces he pulled at recent m&gs. on the left - sometimes he can't help himself or doesn't pull serious face just in time for pic. on the right - regular serious face.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">LB faces from meet &amp; greets <a href="https://t.co/uWyidc4nPf">pic.twitter.com/uWyidc4nPf</a></p>&mdash; elle (@ellellew) <a href="https://twitter.com/ellellew/status/1058747548041646082?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 3, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[sands of time]

He really has a lot of nerve, making his face look the way he wants it to look. Very inconsiderate.

[bombaysaffires]

He really has a lot of nerve, making his face look the way he wants it to look. Very inconsiderate.

LOL.

But that's the thing-- his face is very animated most of the time. So the fact that he puts on a face for photos that is so devoid of movement or even really any emotion is curious.

Clearly he doesn't give a sh&t and that's fine, but it doesn't mean we can't talk about it....:sorry:

[elle]

He really has a lot of nerve, making his face look the way he wants it to look. Very inconsiderate.

:xoxo::xoxo::thumbsup: :nod::cool::]

love this so much! and what you said can be applied to so many other things people like to accuse him off too.

[bombaysaffires]

:xoxo::xoxo::thumbsup: :nod::cool::]

love this so much! and what you said can be applied to so many other things people like to accuse him off too.

well pooh on you, too!! :eek: :laugh:

[jwd]

Same here. Oh Lindsey!

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/rtdyYQ9XGq0" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

New Chapters?! If he only knew then!!

[elle]

well pooh on you, too!! :eek: :laugh:
:xoxo:
But that's the thing-- his face is very animated most of the time. So the fact that he puts on a face for photos that is so devoid of movement or even really any emotion is curious.

Clearly he doesn't give a sh&t and that's fine, but it doesn't mean we can't talk about it....:sorry:
:laugh: well duh! still loved what sands said though. it was hilarious and so true! :]

and yeah about his face pulling all these expressions and interacting all the time except when posing. i find it the funniest in that Pattie video day after musicares, when he talks to fans and is all animated, then someone asks him to pose for the photo, he stops, pulls serious face for the photo, and then goes right back to being all animated talking. representing so well exactly what his does all the time.

[elle]

Same here. Oh Lindsey!

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/rtdyYQ9XGq0" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>

New Chapters?! If he only knew then!!

oh man this was something else on so many levels. the way especially Lindsey was so all over the place interacting with everyone and making sure everything's working when off camera while some others were all bit**y and complainy, and then they switched for when the cameras were rolling.

yeah re new chapter. he was so hopefully for FM and pushing so hard since 1997. and got stalled over and over. and then Chris came back, she wanted to work on new music with him and the rest of the band, and he was hoping it will all resolve, finally. :distress:

[gldstwmn]

Dayum! Lindsey looks really bored-slash-mad.

He is glowering.

[dreamsunwind]

yeah but that's often his approach to photo shoots. If you watch, there are definitely a few moments where he breaks a little smile, but when he's "ON" for the cameras, he's doing his "serious artiste" face.....

I think it's more just that he's kinda awkward. I remember Ken Caillait or others saying he's just not really a people person and is just naturally serious. So he's probably just not super comfortable on a red carpet.

[bombaysaffires]

I think it's more just that he's kinda awkward. I remember Ken Caillait or others saying he's just not really a people person and is just naturally serious. So he's probably just not super comfortable on a red carpet.

Maybe.

I think he's just afraid someone might get the mistaken impression that he's into the "fame" thing, that he's courting fame. Stevie makes no bones about it, but Lindsey has always had an uncomfortable relationship with the 'fame' and 'star' thing.... always wanting it to be about the art. He seems to have at some point since like The Dance embraced the being a "Performer" onstage but he does resort a bit to the "artiste" thing onstage, at least at solo shows. But at solo shows he's still more of a mix of Performer and Artist now than he used to be.

[dreamsunwind]

Maybe.

I think he's just afraid someone might get the mistaken impression that he's into the "fame" thing, that he's courting fame. Stevie makes no bones about it, but Lindsey has always had an uncomfortable relationship with the 'fame' and 'star' thing.... always wanting it to be about the art. He seems to have at some point since like The Dance embraced the being a "Performer" onstage but he does resort a bit to the "artiste" thing onstage, at least at solo shows. But at solo shows he's still more of a mix of Performer and Artist now than he used to be.

I don't think that particular thing is on his mind on a red carpet but I agree, I think he always wanted to be successful in the realms of those big famous musicians but he never really wanted/cared to be the 'celebrity' that they were.