Has Stevie's decision to not record new FM album affected the way you feel about her?

[Jondalar]

Has Stevie's decision to not record a new Fleetwood Mac album affected the way you feel about her?

[Angel75]

Good poll, although I kinda would like one something more along the lines of...

Yes, I am disappointed in her lack of commitment as a final album with all 5 fireflies could be magic and would be fantastic for their legacy

[On Ice]

It may sound contradictory with what I'm about to say,but I do like what she's done solo in the last few years. I can say that if I scratch the last few Mac-related years off my brain and focus on the great music the band has created, they are still my favourite. I was pleased to see Christine come back and it's been a huge let down that almost 3 years later, we still don't have an album, that's not acceptable to me. With with these ridiculous antics, yes, it most definitely has changed the way I view Stevie Nicks in the context of the band. I also cringe and absolutely hate the living legend persona she is milking. There are also just way too many dry years with some poor performances and bad recordings to adorn her with that type of adoration, at least since the horrid Rock a Little, now 31 years ago. She may be a legend in my mind and the minds of the fans, but not in a broad based appeal in the same way that the Beatles and others are. There are only 3 truly great albums and that's not much in a 50 year career. One of the biggest problems with Fleetwood Mac in my view, is that she and the band squandered her vast treasure trove of classic music and left it "in the vaults" during a time they could've crafted it into something beautiful.

What it boils down to for me is her participation in the cash cow tours whilst skewering the band at every chance she gets makes me want to throw up. This is what has really turned me off especially for a band that took a huge risk back in 79 to become the anti-rumours-anti-corporate rock are now the very definition of same. I have not been to one of their concerts since 2004. If the band was truly a legacy band we'd be hearing 3-4 Rumours tracks at a concert-max. At this stage, it's really sad that it is all about the money and I just don't have a grand to shell out for 2 hours of going through the motions performances.

What will grab my attention is in hearing some creative new music and if that doesn't happen, I'm tuning out to whatever happens 2017 and beyond. I remain hopeful that something good can still happen.

[Macfanforever]

Hahahahahahaha.This poll made me LOL......I voted number 2.

One even voted number 3.

The not announcing BS in what shes going to do with the band got to stop is my only gripe with her.Also goes for the rest of the band too.

[Jondalar]

It may sound contradictory with what I'm about to say,but I do like what she's done solo in the last few years. I can say that if I scratch the last few Mac-related years off my brain and focus on the great music the band has created, they are still my favourite. I was pleased to see Christine come back and it's been a huge let down that almost 3 years later, we still don't have an album, that's not acceptable to me. With with these ridiculous antics, yes, it most definitely has changed the way I view Stevie Nicks in the context of the band. I also cringe and absolutely hate the living legend persona she is milking. There are also just way too many dry years with some poor performances and bad recordings to adorn her with that type of adoration, at least since the horrid Rock a Little, now 31 years ago. She may be a legend in my mind and the minds of the fans, but not in a broad based appeal in the same way that the Beatles and others are. There are only 3 truly great albums and that's not much in a 50 year career. One of the biggest problems with Fleetwood Mac in my view, is that she and the band squandered her vast treasure trove of classic music and left it "in the vaults" during a time they could've crafted it into something beautiful.

What it boils down to for me is her participation in the cash cow tours whilst skewering the band at every chance she gets makes me want to throw up. This is what has really turned me off especially for a band that took a huge risk back in 79 to become the anti-rumours-anti-corporate rock are now the very definition of same. I have not been to one of their concerts since 2004. If the band was truly a legacy band we'd be hearing 3-4 Rumours tracks at a concert-max. At this stage, it's really sad that it is all about the money and I just don't have a grand to shell out for 2 hours of going through the motions performances.

What will grab my attention is in hearing some creative new music and if that doesn't happen, I'm tuning out to whatever happens 2017 and beyond. I remain hopeful that something good can still happen.

It bothers me as well that all she wants to do is tour. It says to me that is no longer creative and not very deep. I feel sorry for the rest of the band.

[SisterNightroad]

I seriously hope some of the options of this poll aren't serious.

[Kubrick2788]

I'd just like to point out...Stevie isn't the only one with a worn voice. Christine and Lindsey have their own vocal issues. Stevie did sound pretty damn good when I saw the Seattle show earlier this month. She wouldn't need to whisper creepily or anything in a song...

[sodascouts]

It pained me to choose the option with the apostrophe error, but I did: "Yes. She has spoiled Fleetwood Macs last opportunity to have an album with all 5 members." I don't hate Stevie now - not even close; I still love her. However, I do think a bit less of her.

[Macfanforever]

I'd just like to point out...Stevie isn't the only one with a worn voice. Christine and Lindsey have their own vocal issues. Stevie did sound pretty damn good when I saw the Seattle show earlier this month. She wouldn't need to whisper creepily or anything in a song...

Shes in with the rest of her age group with the older voices .I heard Olivia N John struggling on some of the notes during her appearance on the Hollywood Christmas parade the other night. I still love them and other artist and bands at that age and still go out and do it.

[Neal]

Yes, I am disappointed in her lack of commitment as a final album with all 5 fireflies could be magic and would be fantastic for their legacy

This, right here.

[Angel75]

This, right here.

High five !
It's true right?

I am disappointed as I feel she should suck it up...give them one month of her life...give another producer two songs/ vault demos to sort out....do a few backing vocals...just as she did for the TITN album...and if really necessary avoid Lindsey throughout most of it if it pains her too much to be in the studio with him.....really is it that hard for her to do this?

[SisterNightroad]

High five !
It's true right?

I am disappointed as I feel she should suck it up...give them one month of her life...give another producer two songs/ vault demos to sort out....do a few backing vocals...just as she did for the TITN album...and if really necessary avoid Lindsey throughout most of it if it pains her too much to be in the studio with him.....really is it that hard for her to do this?
This is a recipe for a failure honestly; in fact Tango wasn't certainly a good period for her music-wise.

[Angel75]

This is a recipe for a failure honestly; in fact Tango wasn't certainly a good period for her music-wise.

I agree her music for Tango was poor but don't you feel if she allowed herself one month to at least contribute and be marginally on a final record would be better than not contributing anything at all to a final 5 album?

[SisterNightroad]

I agree her music for Tango was poor but don't you feel if she allowed herself one month to at least contribute and be marginally on a final record would be better than not contributing anything at all to a final 5 album?
Well, the last word may not yet have been spoken. I would like a last album by the 5 members too but I don't see why anyone should be coerced into doing something they don't want to to achieve it. I don't want another Tango, if it comes down to it I think I will settle for a Say You Will, but without Stevie instead of without Christine.

[SteveMacD]

I agree her music for Tango was poor but don't you feel if she allowed herself one month to at least contribute and be marginally on a final record would be better than not contributing anything at all to a final 5 album?
Not if it brings the album down. She's made it clear that she wants no part of it, and I suspect she'll give an uninspired, listless performance that will only kill the mood.

[Jondalar]

This is a recipe for a failure honestly; in fact Tango wasn't certainly a good period for her music-wise.

No but Tango was their second most popular album of all time and I and many others loved it. I would love another Tango. It just makes her look bad because it shows they don't need her.

[elle]

if it comes down to it I think I will settle for a Say You Will, but without Stevie instead of without Christine.

with you there, although in my case i wouldn't call it settling by any stretch. really looking forward to hear a cohesive album Christine and Lindsey constructed together. :]

[lilyfee]

Isn't this poll a little bit premature? She hasn't definitively said no yet. Granted, Stevie has expressed reservations, but she seems to be having the time of her life on tour right now and it seems to me that the band can stand to let a few years pass between tours in order to work on the album together.

Furthermore, let's keep in mind that the only time Stevie left the band was during a heated battle with Mick over Silver Springs. Therefore I think the only reasons she wouldn't participate are if 1) she truly didn't care (doubtful) or 2) she felt wronged by the band (i.e. for going on without her).

Of course I am disappointed in Stevie for not participating as of yet, however after seeing her on tour a few weeks ago I have definitely softened towards her. I saw her with FM the last time they toured as well and right now she is like a different person... Bubbly, engaged, commanding, energetic... Happy. I do believe she deserves to be so happy like this and I think she will come around and record the album if she has this time to herself.

[elle]

Of course I am disappointed in Stevie for not participating as of yet, however after seeing her on tour a few weeks ago I have definitely softened towards her. I saw her with FM the last time they toured as well and right now she is like a different person... Bubbly, engaged, commanding, energetic... Happy. I do believe she deserves to be so happy like this and I think she will come around and record the album if she has this time to herself.
so why would you want to send her back to the band where she doesn't want to be? she just goes through the motions on their tours, and is very clear she doesn't want to record new music with them.

i don't think any more or less of her, it was very clear already few years ago that she doesn't want to record with FM, so that's nothing new, she just finally said it publicly.

my bigger problem is with the other 4. not sure whether they couldn't get on the same page between the 4 of them, or why they kept waiting and hoping all these years. they needed to decide whether they are in FM for art or the money. i'm happy to see that apparently they decided to go for the art over money!

[SteveMacD]

my bigger problem is with the other 4. not sure whether they couldn't get on the same page between the 4 of them, or why they kept waiting and hoping all these years. they needed to decide whether they are in FM for art or the money. i'm happy to see that apparently they decided to go for the art over money!
I don't think it's been too long. The OWTS tour ended Nov. 22, 2015, right before the holidays. They all probably needed vacations and to spend time with their families and friends, as well as giving Stevie a little more time to come to a decision now that Christine was back. After she announced her tour, they started talking about making a new album and doing a small tour without her.

[iamnotafraid]

Okay, fess up. Who's going to spit on her grave?

[secondhandchain]

Absolutely changed my opinion. Really pissed at her.

[Macfan4life]

I see some irony here between 1987 and 2017. Lindsey did an album with all 5 and it was probably a tough thing for him to do. He also did it almost as an obligation to the band. In Mick's first book he writes that Lindsey threw it in his face that he helped Mick get back on his feet after bankruptcy and did the album for him. Lindsey could never go out on the road after struggling to work in the studio with them. So he left the band.
Stevie is saying the opposite. She does not want to come face to face with Lindsey and fight in the studio because it would crystalize and get worse on the tour. So she has the Lindsey philosophy but in reverse.
I wish Christine could work her magic and shelter Stevie. I also wish Stevie would be strong and try to put the drama aside for one FINAL album.

[James89]

Isn't this poll a little bit premature? She hasn't definitively said no yet.

Precisely. All of this talk and Stevie slamming really gets on my nerves because none of us know exactly what's going to happen. It's highly likely that they have everything planned out. Do they need to announce it? No. Will they eventually? Yes. So calm your beans!

[BLY]

Precisely. All of this talk and Stevie slamming really gets on my nerves because none of us know exactly what's going to happen. It's highly likely that they have everything planned out. Do they need to announce it? No. Will they eventually? Yes. So calm your beans!





I agree with you 100% on this. I think the only comment(s) that get me a bit miffed is the " No one buys records anymore" Fleetwood Mac has a huge fan base with 50 years of followers. You release the music for your growth and your FANS! Yes the days of million sales may be the the thing of the past but so is lot of other things.

[FuzzyPlum]

Precisely. All of this talk and Stevie slamming really gets on my nerves because none of us know exactly what's going to happen. It's highly likely that they have everything planned out. Do they need to announce it? No. Will they eventually? Yes. So calm your beans!


Take your head out of the sand. She's said she doesn't want to do an album. The other four have repeatedly said it looks as if she won't contribute. It seems as if they are getting close to a stage where they can release something. In the meantime, Stevie extends her tour.

She may not have explicitly come out and said 'I WILL DEFINITELY NOT DO ANOTHER ALBUM WITH FLEETWOOD MAC' but its very clear that's what she feels.

I'd say its highly, highly, highly unlikely the five of them have everything planned out (if you mean including Stevie on an album).

[Jondalar]

Take your head out of the sand. She's said she doesn't want to do an album. The other four have repeatedly said it looks as if she won't contribute. It seems as if they are getting close to a stage where they can release something. In the meantime, Stevie extends her tour.

She may not have explicitly come out and said 'I WILL DEFINITELY NOT DO ANOTHER ALBUM WITH FLEETWOOD MAC' but its very clear that's what she feels.

I'd say its highly, highly, highly unlikely the five of them have everything planned out (if you mean including Stevie on an album).

Exactly right. And all these fans who don't want to deal with reality get on my nerves. She is giving Fleetwood Mac, the group that made her a star, the finger. Time will not heal all wounds because they are out of time. Her timing is lousy.

[shackin'up]

I simply do not understand the fact that typing up facts about the four recording and cowriting FMtracks and one explicitly not participating is regarded as bashing or slamming the one.

[SorcererJP]

No, my fandom/opinion doesn't change.

To put in another perspective. These 4/5 people have not made any new music in about 15 years (ok, there was an EP). But toured 4 times since, without having an album out. It selled out large venues.

It's all about the money. Average music-geeks just want to see en hear the hits, they do not care for new music. Only we, as die-hard fans, want new music.

So I understand why Stevie does not want to record. Go out and play and satisfy the majority and sell out shows!

[SisterNightroad]

No but Tango was their second most popular album of all time and I and many others loved it. I would love another Tango. It just makes her look bad because it shows they don't need her.
Yes, Tango was their second best-selling album (especially in Europe) but Stevie's songs were lackluster; here we aren't talking about sales, or at least I hope so, but we are talking about quality, and to me an album must have consistent quality throughout all the songs. Tango is a good album that however had a much greater potential, it could have been a timeless classic but it was tarnished by many little things that prevented part of its success.
I really think that if Stevie had been more present and had submitted better songs and had worked longer on them, if Lindsey hadn't been on the verge of quitting Fleetwood Mac and if all of them had gone on the road together and in much better shape, then this album would have had about the same success rate of Rumours.

[Jondalar]

Yes, Tango was their second best-selling album (especially in Europe) but Stevie's songs were lackluster; here we aren't talking about sales, or at least I hope so, but we are talking about quality, and to me an album must have consistent quality throughout all the songs. Tango is a good album that however had a much greater potential, it could have been a timeless classic but it was tarnished by many little things that prevented part of its success.
I really think that if Stevie had been more present and had submitted better songs and had worked longer on them, if Lindsey hadn't been on the verge of quitting Fleetwood Mac and if all of them had gone on the road together and in much better shape, then this album would have had about the same success rate of Rumours.

Well there was nothing wrong with the quality of Lindsey's and Christine's songs. They easily surpassed her. Makes you wonder if that is the real reason she doesn't want to do it. She has nothing new to offer.

[elle]

No, my fandom/opinion doesn't change.

To put in another perspective. These 4/5 people have not made any new music in about 15 years (ok, there was an EP). But toured 4 times since, without having an album out.

exactly, and 3/5 and then 4/5 have pushed for new music most of those years, since at least 2009. we knew since 2010 that Stevie didn't want to record with Fleetwood Mac, so why change opinion about her now.

[SisterNightroad]

Well there was nothing wrong with the quality of Lindsey's and Christine's songs. They easily surpassed her. Makes you wonder if that is the real reason she doesn't want to do it. She has nothing new to offer.
Maybe it is, who knows, after all she doesn't put out something newly written since 2011. However I think she probably has tons of older songs to submit if she really wants to.
But my point was, why forcibly putting out an album if not all the songs are very good, especially at this point of their career?

[aleuzzi]

It has not changed the way I feel about her individually, but I am sad to see she is refusing to let the Mac swansong be what it could be.

Still, if she is so traumatized (and her behavior does read like a reaction to trauma) by the prospect of working with Lindsey in this way, then, godspeed.

One of the other options in the survey should be: "No, but I am REALLY annoyed with the remaining four for not embracing the situation and proudly moving ahead with the project." They might be finishing the album as we speak, but it's all so secretive, as if doing so were a dirty thing.

[elle]

Tango is a good album that however had a much greater potential, it could have been a timeless classic but it was tarnished by many little things that prevented part of its success.
I really think that if Stevie had been more present and had submitted better songs and had worked longer on them, if Lindsey hadn't been on the verge of quitting Fleetwood Mac and if all of them had gone on the road together and in much better shape, then this album would have had about the same success rate of Rumours.

that's a lot of ifs! :laugh:

i have no clue what potential are you talking about. Tango actually turned out much better than one would expect considering the circumstances (although i personally don't care too much for it), and that's really on the strength of Christine's collection of songs that became huge hits. i would expect that Lindsey and Christine together, nowadays, based on the strength of Lindsey's most recent songwriting, and expectations that Christine still has the same songwriting knack she always did, have created an album that is much stronger than Tango (and will of course sell 1/100000000 of what Tango did, but will stay as band's statement of artistic integrity for posterity).

[Jondalar]

Maybe it is, who knows, after all she doesn't put out something newly written since 2011. However I think she probably has tons of older songs to submit if she really wants to.
But my point was, why forcibly putting out an album if not all the songs are very good, especially at this point of their career?

Well Lindsey's and Christine's songs matter. Screw Stevie. Maybe all the songs will great if she doesn't contribute.

[elle]

Maybe it is, who knows, after all she doesn't put out something newly written since 2011. However I think she probably has tons of older songs to submit if she really wants to.
But my point was, why forcibly putting out an album if not all the songs are very good, especially at this point of their career?

exactly. there's no reason to force her to be on the album if she doesn't feel she can appropriately contribute. i'm glad the other 4 finally came to that conclusion, at least as far as we know.

FM 40 year old drama is wearing thin, time to put it behind and finally be adults.

2011 is IYD, right? there is no new music written by SN on that album. i'm guessing her last new music was on SYW. and unlike Christine and Lindsey who happily jumped into collaborating and co-writing, Stevie seems weary of trying that with either one of them.

[jbrownsjr]

Well there was nothing wrong with the quality of Lindsey's and Christine's songs. They easily surpassed her. Makes you wonder if that is the real reason she doesn't want to do it. She has nothing new to offer.

BINGO!!!!!!!!

[SisterNightroad]

that's a lot of ifs! :laugh:

i have no clue what potential are you talking about. Tango actually turned out much better than one would expect considering the circumstances (although i personally don't care too much for it), and that's really on the strength of Christine's collection of songs that became huge hits. I would expect that Lindsey and Christine together, nowadays, based on the strength of Lindsey's most recent songwriting, and expectations that Christine still has the same songwriting knack she always did, have created an album that is much stronger than Tango (and will of course sell 1/100000000 of what Tango did, but will stay as band's statement of artistic integrity for posterity).
Yes, that was the point, Tango turned better then you'd expect given the curcumstances but then that means that it could have been even much better; obviously there were good hits but I also don't care for some songs but I'm talking about albums as a whole and I think a good album should be organic and all the songs should be of good level, in contrast to an album that has just two or three hits and then the rest is fillers. That is artistic integrity for posterity in my opinion. If this is achieved with or without Stevie honestly I don't care much if this is what they all want.

Well Lindsey's and Christine's songs matter. Screw Stevie. Maybe all the songs will great if she doesn't contribute.
They're the only one that matter if they're also the only songwriters present in the album.

2011 is IYD, right? there is no new music written by SN on that album. i'm guessing her last new music was on SYW. and unlike Christine and Lindsey who happily jumped into collaborating and co-writing, Stevie seems weary of trying that with either one of them.
It depends on what you mean by new music written. The music was really all written by Dave Stewart. The lyrics were in most cases either partially old and partially new or short poems that were put together and turned into songs during the making of the album. Only Secret Love and Annabel Lee were truly very old songs in In Your Dreams, the rest is all music produced after her previous album.

[elle]

It depends on what you mean by new music written. The music was really all written by Dave Stewart. The lyrics were in most cases either partially old and partially new or short poems that were put together and turned into songs during the making of the album. Only Secret Love and Annabel Lee were truly very old songs in In Your Dreams, the rest is all music produced after her previous album.
yes, that's what i mean.

all new music was written by Dave Stewart, so we didn't get any new music written by Stevie in 2011.

[FuzzyPlum]

It has not changed the way I feel about her individually, but I am sad to see she is refusing to let the Mac swansong be what it could be.

Still, if she is so traumatized (and her behavior does read like a reaction to trauma) by the prospect of working with Lindsey in this way, then, godspeed.

One of the other options in the survey should be: "No, but I am REALLY annoyed with the remaining four for not embracing the situation and proudly moving ahead with the project." They might be finishing the album as we speak, but it's all so secretive, as if doing so were a dirty thing.


Well no, actually they haven't really been that secretive. They've openly said they've been recording off and on for a while. They posted pictures a while back of Chris and Lindsey in the studio. They said they'd be back in the studio in October. There was a picture recently released by another musician of him meeting Mick and Lindsey in the studio. They've given interviews in which they've said an album's worth of material is nearly finished. They've revealed the names of several songs.

Not sure what exactly you expect of them. I'm sure they'd like to be a bit more concrete about things but I reckon that's because they are careful about what to say because of Stevie. They are obviously at work and don't need to be giving interviews or twitting intermittently.

[SisterNightroad]

yes, that's what i mean.

all new music was written by Dave Stewart, so we didn't get any new music written by Stevie in 2011.
Well, then it she didn't write music even on Say You Will since she doesn't really write music ever in that way I meant. The lyrics and melodies were hers.

[jbrownsjr]

Well, then it she didn't write music even on Say You Will since she doesn't really write music ever in that way I meant. The lyrics and melodies were hers.

I hate when she plays piano. I cringe.

[bombaysaffires]

I hate when she plays piano. I cringe.

she used to be okay... listen to her playing on her demo of Sisters of the Moon... but I think she got lazy.

[elle]

Well, then it she didn't write music even on Say You Will since she doesn't really write music ever in that way I meant. The lyrics and melodies were hers.
new melodies on IYD were hers?

i believe there were new melodies on SYW written by her. her new songs there were not cowrites, she was the sole songwriter. i'm not talking about arrangements, or lyrics.

[HomerMcvie]

I hate when she plays piano. I cringe.
OMG, it's awful. So embarrassing!

[SisterNightroad]

new melodies on IYD were hers?

i believe there were new melodies on SYW written by her. her new songs there were not cowrites, she was the sole songwriter. i'm not talking about arrangements, or lyrics.
But not all the "new" In Your Dreams songs were cowritten with Dave.

[elle]

But not all the "new" In Your Dreams songs were cowritten with Dave.
you are funny! yes, they were co-written by either Dave, or Neale, or Mike Campbell, despite of you stating:
The music was really all written by Dave Stewart. The lyrics were in most cases either partially old and partially new or short poems that were put together and turned into songs during the making of the album. Only Secret Love and Annabel Lee were truly very old songs in In Your Dreams, the rest is all music produced after her previous album.

we keep having this same discussion over and over again when someone new joins here, or someone old forgets. in recent threads it looked like it was pretty much accepted fact that SN hasn't written any new music / melody / whatever you want to call it since i guess SYW.


I simply do not understand the fact that typing up facts about the four recording and cowriting FMtracks and one explicitly not participating is regarded as bashing or slamming the one.
i know!!!!!

guess we are living in post-factual world.

[Jondalar]

Well, then it she didn't write music even on Say You Will since she doesn't really write music ever in that way I meant. The lyrics and melodies were hers.

Oh stop it! They don't need her. It could be a 5 star album without her.

[BLY]

If they record the album with the 4 it will be " reviewed " like SYW. Great album but missing Stevie Nicks's.... (filling in the blank). I Love Say You Will and I'm sure I will love the new album if it's released with just the 4 but it will be missing a link.

[SisterNightroad]

Oh stop it! They don't need her. It could be a 5 star album without her.
I never stated otherwise.
you are funny! yes, they were co-written by either Dave, or Neale, or Mike Campbell, despite of you stating:


we keep having this same discussion over and over again when someone new joins here, or someone old forgets. in recent threads it looked like it was pretty much accepted fact that SN hasn't written any new music / melody / whatever you want to call it since i guess SYW.
Yes, half of the songs were written with Dave, one with Neal and one with Mike Campbell, but you took my quotes in which I was using the term music differently. Obviously Dave Stewart was the producer for all the songs and co-writer for 7 but I don't think that Stevie just threw some poems at him and the others and then left and they turned them to music.

[shackin'up]

OMG, it's awful. So embarrassing!

Come on. She doesn't play piano. She plays around with some basic chords just to find a basic melody and phrasing of her poems while reciting them. That is how she writes songs. And she once wrote classic songs that way. Don't judge her on her instrument-skills. I think it is extraordinary that you can write so beautiful without ANY musicianskills. She is unique BECAUSE of that.

[SteveMacD]

Yes, Tango was their second best-selling album (especially in Europe) but Stevie's songs were lackluster; here we aren't talking about sales, or at least I hope so, but we are talking about quality, and to me an album must have consistent quality throughout all the songs. Tango is a good album that however had a much greater potential, it could have been a timeless classic but it was tarnished by many little things that prevented part of its success.
I really think that if Stevie had been more present and had submitted better songs and had worked longer on them, if Lindsey hadn't been on the verge of quitting Fleetwood Mac and if all of them had gone on the road together and in much better shape, then this album would have had about the same success rate of Rumours.
Still . . .

It sold like 7-8 million copies and had two top-5 hit singles and four top-20 singles. That's a massive success by anyone's standards. It might have done better had Stevie contributed better songs and if Lindsey had stayed on for the tour. It could also be argued that the drama behind Lindsey quitting had a positive impact on album sales and that curiosity about the new lineup helped ticket sales.

I think TITN is exactly why Stevie isn't recording with them today. What a shock it must have been for her coming off of two albums (TWH and RAL) that spawned two top-5 singles, and then be the only one in the band to not have a song go into the top-15, far less the top-5, just a couple of years later.

[aleuzzi]

Come on. She doesn't play piano. She plays around with some basic chords just to find a basic melody and phrasing of her poems while reciting them. That is how she writes songs. And she once wrote classic songs that way. Don't judge her on her instrument-skills. I think it is extraordinary that you can write so beautiful without ANY musicianskills. She is unique BECAUSE of that.

I hear you. But what's cringeworthy is that she has played the piano for audiences with the expectation of applause and it's really not good. It doesn't even reach the level of competent. Yes, she is (or was) a GREAT songwriter who accomplished a lot not only in spite of but perhaps because of her musical limitations, but that doesn't mean her playing is acceptable in a concert or performance setting.

[HomerMcvie]

I hear you. But what's cringeworthy is that she has played the piano for audiences with the expectation of applause and it's really not good. It doesn't even reach the level of competent. Yes, she is (or was) a GREAT songwriter who accomplished a lot not only in spite of but perhaps because of her musical limitations, but that doesn't mean her playing is acceptable in a concert or performance setting.

Thank you. That IS what I'm saying...what she's playing for the camera is just so completely AMATEURISH, that she should stop. Because it's embarrassing!

[secret love]

I remember complaining to my dad once about Stevie's non-participation in the new album.

He said how old is she. I said "68" and Dad basically said, at that age, with that many millions of dollars, you can do whatever the **** you want.

And it's true.

Stevie has been trotting out a speech at her shows (I went to Sacramento) on how everyone should just do whatever it is they want to do (like tour with Pretenders and sabotage the swang song of Fleetwood Mac).

Let's face it, much as when Christine rejoined I fully expected a new album to be released by now, given Stevie's excitement about her friend's return, it's just never going to happen.

[Jondalar]

Thank you. That IS what I'm saying...what she's playing for the camera is just so completely AMATEURISH, that she should stop. Because it's embarrassing!

To her, I think it's about honesty. She is saying to people - this is how I create.

[secret love]

Come on. She doesn't play piano. She plays around with some basic chords just to find a basic melody and phrasing of her poems while reciting them. That is how she writes songs. And she once wrote classic songs that way. Don't judge her on her instrument-skills. I think it is extraordinary that you can write so beautiful without ANY musicianskills. She is unique BECAUSE of that.

She does play piano. I think so anyway.

I write songs and I write the same way she does. I choose four chords for the bass part, I work out the rhythm I want the lyrics to take and I write the notes I'm going to sing, play them while singing along ...lastly I write the treble accompaniment...all on keyboard or piano.

Listen to this and tell me she can't play!

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/-DJXwcgOmVg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Jondalar]

I doubt Stevie wants to remembered in a negative light but it may happen.

[jbrownsjr]

I hear you. But what's cringeworthy is that she has played the piano for audiences with the expectation of applause and it's really not good. It doesn't even reach the level of competent. Yes, she is (or was) a GREAT songwriter who accomplished a lot not only in spite of but perhaps because of her musical limitations, but that doesn't mean her playing is acceptable in a concert or performance setting.

This is exactly how I feel about it. It goes along with her pretension. It really is cringworthy.

[aleuzzi]

This is exactly how I feel about it. It goes along with her pretension. It really is cringworthy.

Thank you! Remember her cameo on American Horror Story, where she played Rhiannon to her own accompaniment for the supposedly awed would-be witches? THAT was unbearable.


That said, she has accomplished A LOT. She will be remembered as a great songwriter, unique signer, and electric stage performer. That's more than most can claim.

[SisterNightroad]

Still . . .

It sold like 7-8 million copies and had two top-5 hit singles and four top-20 singles. That's a massive success by anyone's standards. It might have done better had Stevie contributed better songs and if Lindsey had stayed on for the tour. It could also be argued that the drama behind Lindsey quitting had a positive impact on album sales and that curiosity about the new lineup helped ticket sales.
Yes, I don't doubt that and I love Tango, it was successful even in my country. I think we've gone too far from where I started; I was saying that as last album for Fleetwood Mac I would prefer a Say You Will than a Tango In The Night for all the reasons I've debated.

[jbrownsjr]

Thank you! Remember her cameo on American Horror Story, where she played Rhiannon to her own accompaniment for the supposedly awed would-be witches? THAT was unbearable.


That said, she has accomplished A LOT. She will be remembered as a great songwriter, unique signer, and electric stage performer. That's more than most can claim.

Her work w/ FMac and early solo work is superb! I will never take that away from her. She used to know who she was.

[shackin'up]

Thank you! Remember her cameo on American Horror Story, where she played Rhiannon to her own accompaniment for the supposedly awed would-be witches? THAT was unbearable.


That said, she has accomplished A LOT. She will be remembered as a great songwriter, unique signer, and electric stage performer. That's more than most can claim.

She did it in american horrorstory and that was so cringeworthy that I only consumed it only once. Couldn't bear it. That was a huge mistake. She also did it in that american songwriter- program. That was a lot better but still bad. As a televised performance, very poor. But the sympathy was there for her because she showed there how she writes. That was insightful and understandable.

[Macfanforever]

Yea .Shes not a piano player or guitar player as I'm not a typist in this keyboard.

[Say You Will]

All those years complaining that Christine wasn't in the band. Then she turns around and does this.
What a disappointment..:mad:

[lilyfee]

All those years complaining that Christine wasn't in the band. Then she turns around and does this.
What a disappointment..:mad:

Sixteen years is a solid amount of time to try to make something work.

[michelej1]

I am actually surprised no one picked the first option. Michele

[SisterNightroad]

I am actually surprised no one picked the first option. Michele
Well, it's somehow included in the third, fifth and seventh option.

[michelej1]

Well, it's somehow included in the third, fifth and seventh option.

You're right on 3 and 5. I don't know if the seventh exactly includes that, though.

Michele

[Jondalar]

Well, it's somehow included in the third, fifth and seventh option.

Well it may be a little redundant but I gave good choices. It's a good poll.

[shackin'up]

You're right on 3 and 5. I don't know if the seventh exactly includes that, though.

Michele I didn't read that in the 7th option. I'll always be a fan of her work until 83.

[michelej1]

I didn't read that in the 7th option. I'll always be a fan of her work until 83.

I am a fan of her work in general, IYD and 24K included. I don't think I would have gotten into the band without her (although once I became familiar with them as a whole, I fell hard for the others) Over the years, however, I believe her worst personality traits have become the dominant ones, rather than mellowed.

Michele

[aleuzzi]

I am a fan of her work in general, IYD and 24K included. I don't think I would have gotten into the band without her (although once I became familiar with them as a whole, I fell hard for the others) Over the years, however, I believe her worst personality traits have become the dominant ones, rather than mellowed.

Michele

Ditto for me, too. I remember my sister buying Rumours in 1977. I was just six and didn't really know the band much. Don't Stop was the song she played most. I also remember the world premier of the video Tusk. I thought, "THAT's the same band?!" Anyway, it wasn't until I heard (saw) Gypsy that I got hooked. I couldn't stop listening to that song, couldn't stop watching the video on MTV, either. The fact that they also did Hold Me was intriguing and enjoyable, but would it have been enough to pull me in? I doubt it. Stevie's song got me hooked. When I bought Mirage, however, I was immediately drawn to Love in Store and Eyes of the World, too. Then, about three months later, I heard Say You Love Me on the radio and remembered it from my early childhood, only this time I broke out in an excited sweat. Christine's voice and song were so amazing! From that point forward, I bought everything the band did and Christine became my favorite.

Stevie has always been able to give an electric performance. THE DANCE was a major testament to her strength and on-stage presence. But since that time she has become such a parody of the spacey diva that I have a hard time identifying with her.

[Aussie W/Heart]

No way, i am just grateful Stevie and all FM band members have survived the highs and lows from living the rock and roll lifestyles.. and have given us great music over the past 4 decades... I would NEVER begrudge Stevie not wanting to record with FM, it is hell being tied down for months and months on end with all the bickering its just not worth it for her!!! she will and should live HER life just the way she pleases. My opinion would be different if they were all in there 50's, Stevie should not feel pressured to do anything if she doesn't want to, not this late in the game.. She is happy, so let her be!!!

[bombaysaffires]

I am a fan of her work in general, IYD and 24K included. I don't think I would have gotten into the band without her (although once I became familiar with them as a whole, I fell hard for the others) Over the years, however, I believe her worst personality traits have become the dominant ones, rather than mellowed.


well put. :nod:

[secondhandchain]

I am a fan of her work in general, IYD and 24K included. I don't think I would have gotten into the band without her (although once I became familiar with them as a whole, I fell hard for the others) Over the years, however, I believe her worst personality traits have become the dominant ones, rather than mellowed.

Michele
so spot on.

[mylittledemon]

I'm feeling 50/50, siding equally with both of the winning choices in the poll.

[secondhandchain]

I'm feeling 50/50, siding equally with both of the winning choices in the poll.

If you add up what all the choices are positive or negative, more people are pissed. 46-35

[JohnL]

People have absolutely no right to be pissed. To me, this is like a job choice for one of us regular folk. Do I stay with a big company who has paid my bills for the last 30 years but been so very difficult to work with/for because of all the politics or do I venture out and start my own business that I know there is a market for but may reduce my stress levels, give me more freedom, and I really don't need the extra money from the big corporation? It is a no brainer. Do what makes you happy and gives you your life back.

[HomerMcvie]

People have absolutely no right to be pissed. To me, this is like a job choice for one of us regular folk. Do I stay with a big company who has paid my bills for the last 30 years but been so very difficult to work with/for because of all the politics or do I venture out and start my own business that I know there is a market for but may reduce my stress levels, give me more freedom, and I really don't need the extra money from the big corporation? It is a no brainer. Do what makes you happy and gives you your life back.

Mind you, she'd most likely have never escaped "being a waitress". She was lucky enough that Lindsey included her in the "package deal".
She'd have neither fame nor fortune, if it weren't for FM.

Yeah, you're right...she owes them nothing.:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:


:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

[SisterNightroad]

Mind you, she'd most likely have never escaped "being a waitress". She was lucky enough that Lindsey included her in the "package deal".
She'd have neither fame nor fortune, if it weren't for FM.

Yeah, you're right...she owes them nothing.:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:


:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:
None of them would escape poverty but perhaps Christine, Chicken Shack went pretty good. Lindsey, John and Mick while undoubtedly talented would have been totally uninteresting alone (and would have succumbed to their demons).

[elle]

People have absolutely no right to be pissed. To me, this is like a job choice for one of us regular folk. Do I stay with a big company who has paid my bills for the last 30 years but been so very difficult to work with/for because of all the politics or do I venture out and start my own business that I know there is a market for but may reduce my stress levels, give me more freedom, and I really don't need the extra money from the big corporation? It is a no brainer. Do what makes you happy and gives you your life back.

What you are saying makes complete sense.

To further go w your analogy - the problem is that she is keeping her job in the big corporation where she's slacking off stalling the production for the corporation while she's working on her smaller company projects. If corporations catch up to such behavior, you'd be fired, no?

[louielouie2000]

Mind you, she'd most likely have never escaped "being a waitress". She was lucky enough that Lindsey included her in the "package deal".
She'd have neither fame nor fortune, if it weren't for FM.

Yeah, you're right...she owes them nothing.:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:


:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

None of them would escape poverty but perhaps Christine, Chicken Shack went pretty good. Lindsey, John and Mick while undoubtedly talented would have been totally uninteresting alone (and would have succumbed to their demons).

While I agree Stevie totally owes her fame to FM, I don't exactly think she would have spent her life destitute, and neither would Lindsey. They both came from wealthy families. If they had never joined FM or broken through on their own, they most likely would have dusted themselves off, moved home, and gotten involved in their family businesses somehow. At the very least, their parents would have helped them complete their educations, and each would have reinvented themselves that way.

Christine has far and away always seemed like the most practical, grounded member of the bunch. Even if she had never found fame, she would have made a comfortable life for herself, in whatever form that might have taken.

Now John and Mick? They'd be the wildcards for sure. Real life would have been especially hard on Mick. He just doesn't seem like the type who would ever have been able to hold down a "real" job or support a family. And with John, you'd have to wonder how his alcoholism and temperament would have paved his life path.

[SisterNightroad]

While I agree Stevie totally owes her fame to FM, I don't exactly think she would have spent her life destitute, and neither would Lindsey. They both came from wealthy families. If they had never joined FM or broken through on their own, they most likely would have dusted themselves off, moved home, and gotten involved in their family businesses somehow. At the very least, their parents would have helped them complete their educations, and each would have reinvented themselves that way.

Christine has far and away always seemed like the most practical, grounded member of the bunch. Even if she had never found fame, she would have made a comfortable life for herself, in whatever form that might have taken.

Now John and Mick? They'd be the wildcards for sure. Real life would have been especially hard on Mick. He just doesn't seem like the type who would ever have been able to hold down a "real" job or support a family. And with John, you'd have to wonder how his alcoholism and temperament would have paved his life path.
Of course they wouldn't become beggars but there are many kinds of poverty. For example I know many people of my age that have a stable job that gives them 400€ per month and have a toddler and are barely getting by; even more jump from city to city chasing a poorly paid 4-months job after another.
In Stevie and Lindsey's case I'm not sure about what would become of them.
I really see Stevie as a stubborn woman and there's a point after which parents don't/can't help anymore, so it's not unlikely that in the end she couldn't have really given up on singing and become a struggling singer like her grand-father AJ Nicks.
About Lindsey I really see him as someone who isn't very adaptable or versatile and it could have been that he didn't know what to do beside music. He wouldn't certainly become homeless but I see him struggling from job to job never finding the right one.

[Macfanforever]

Its time to move on.Stevie and the Mac does not owe me anything.My only gripes with her and them is to try something different then what they normally do and lack of music.Other bands and artists put out multiple albums a year like hotcake pies on Christmas day.And they have 3 to 4 number one hits on one album.Too much studio time was wasted with them because of perfection and I want it this way BS.Other bands just record in one or 2 takes and dont give a crap how it sounds and if there is errors in the recordings. So I give them a F to a D minus on lack of output compared to their peers in the biz.

[FuzzyPlum]

Were it not for Fleetwood Mac the most talented in the band would still have carved out decent careers for themselves. Christine and Lindsey would have had a good role in the music industry somewhere, most likely in other good bands. John would have done well as a respected bass-man, whether in another top band or as a great session player. He was already established as being amongst the best blues bassist around before he joined FM. He'd have done alright.

Mick and Stevie- I'm not so sure. By his own admission Mick was never the most talented of drummers. He does what he does and he does it solidly but he isn't one of the greats. Stevie is a star and as such I'd like to think she'd have risen to prominence anyway.... but how many really good singer/songwriters are there out there that barely get anywhere? For solo singer/songwriters that aren't really musically accomplished it can be down to a big slice of luck whether they 'make it'. For every successful singer there are X numbers of supermarket cashiers.

[HomerMcvie]

Were it not for Fleetwood Mac the most talented in the band would still have carved out decent careers for themselves. Christine and Lindsey would have had a good role in the music industry somewhere, most likely in other good bands. John would have done well as a respected bass-man, whether in another top band or as a great session player. He was already established as being amongst the best blues bassist around before he joined FM. He'd have done alright.

Mick and Stevie- I'm not so sure. By his own admission Mick was never the most talented of drummers. He does what he does and he does it solidly but he isn't one of the greats. Stevie is a star and as such I'd like to think she'd have risen to prominence anyway.... but how many really good singer/songwriters are there out there that barely get anywhere? For solo singer/songwriters that aren't really musically accomplished it can be down to a big slice of luck whether they 'make it'. For every successful singer there are X numbers of supermarket cashiers.

I agree completely. Mick and Stevie are the two that would've been least likely to make it. I find it odd that they're the two drama queens as well...

[BombaySapphire3]

Stevie and Lindsey's parents were upper middle class..maybe upper upper middle class but not really wealthy. In comparison a contemporary of theirs country rock inventor Gram Parson's parents really were multi-millionaires.They would both have had to work at some point .Stevie a pretty girl, most likely would have married someone of comparable income to her dad .Lindsey would have done fine without FM eventually I'd guess as would have Chris and John as others have pointed out. Leaving Mick as Fleetwood Mac's most likely pauper which even with Fleetwood Mac he has been at times:laugh:

[SeanJT]

I still feel like Stevie is bluffing.

Everyone and their dog said Christine would never come back, and here she is.

It just doesn't make any sense otherwise.

[Phil]

I think it's pretty obvious by now that Stevie was not sincere regarding her supposed desire for Christine to return. I believe she felt confident Christine would never change her mind so capitalised on it in all manner of ways. Stevie has essentially made Christine a scapegoat for her own inability to demonstrate a commitment to the band.
Having said that, I also believe Stevie has the right to do as she pleases, but she needs to be completely honest about her choices. It's just a shame that she doesn't want to collaborate with Christine again - this in itself greatly disappoints me.

[AlexD]

God, The Ledge has been depressing lately

[HomerMcvie]

God, The Ledge has been depressing lately

And I only see one person keeping the band from making this a positive place to be.

We'd have a new album to listen to and discuss, if it weren't for her...


Look at all the people we've lost:
Bob Welch
Bob Weston
Bob Brunning
John Courage

If one of the current member croaks before(IF) we get a new album, I know exactly whose fault it's gonna be!!! That will be her legacy.:mad:

[olive]

Look at all the people we've lost:
Bob Welch
Bob Weston
Bob Brunning
John Courage

:

anyone named Bob , who was associated with the band must have been a bit nervous for awhile

[HomerMcvie]

anyone named Bob , who was associated with the band must have been a bit nervous for awhile

Not now. They all died.:distress:

[FuzzyPlum]

anyone named Bob , who was associated with the band must have been a bit nervous for awhile


Didn't they have an 'almost' member of the band back in the early 70's called Bobby Hunt? I do hope he's still with us.

[HomerMcvie]

Didn't they have an 'almost' member of the band back in the early 70's called Bobby Hunt? I do hope he's still with us.

I believe that during the Heroes tour they had two organists(they weren't there at the same time) filling out their live sound. The think the other one was named Doug Graves.

But that's like saying Brett Tuggle or the background singers are a member, which really isn't the case.

[FuzzyPlum]

I believe that during the Heroes tour they had two organists(they weren't there at the same time) filling out their live sound. The think the other one was named Doug Graves.

But that's like saying Brett Tuggle or the background singers are a member, which really isn't the case.


I said he was an 'almost' member- he was certainly associated with the band.
Jeez, I didn't intend for an in-depth discussion about what constitutes a band member :shrug:

[HomerMcvie]

I said he was an 'almost' member- he was certainly associated with the band.
Jeez, I didn't intend for an in-depth discussion about what constitutes a band member :shrug:

I wasn't trying to argue. About anything.

[jbrownsjr]

I think it's pretty obvious by now that Stevie was not sincere regarding her supposed desire for Christine to return. I believe she felt confident Christine would never change her mind so capitalised on it in all manner of ways. Stevie has essentially made Christine a scapegoat for her own inability to demonstrate a commitment to the band.
Having said that, I also believe Stevie has the right to do as she pleases, but she needs to be completely honest about her choices. It's just a shame that she doesn't want to collaborate with Christine again - this in itself greatly disappoints me.

Phil!! It's a new year! I agree 100%

[jbrownsjr]

I wasn't trying to argue. About anything.

A first for you! lol

[HomerMcvie]

A first for you! lol

Don't start with me, Nancy Jean. I know where you live.

[jbrownsjr]

Don't start with me, Nancy Jean. I know where you live.

That's Mister Nancy Jean, to you.

[HomerMcvie]

That's Mister Nancy Jean, to you.

I call everyone Nancy Jean...:p

[Macfanforever]

Excuse me guys .Who in the hell is Nancy Jean.I must of missed something in the text here.

[jbrownsjr]

Excuse me guys .Who in the hell is Nancy Jean.I must of missed something in the text here.

She's taking over for Shhhheeetttvie...

[HomerMcvie]

She's taking over for Shhhheeetttvie...

There's a new Shhhheeetttvie in town. Move over, bi*ch.

[Macfanforever]

There's a new Shhhheeetttvie in town. Move over, bi*ch.

She's taking over for Shhhheeetttvie...

OK .Any pix of her.

[FuzzyPlum]

OK .Any pix of her.

http://www.northplattepost.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/MCNEW-NANCY-JEAN-9-23-11.png

Nancy Jean McNew.
She'd fit in just fine.

[olive]

http://www.northplattepost.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/MCNEW-NANCY-JEAN-9-23-11.png

Nancy Jean McNew.
She'd fit in just fine.

Charges: Driving Under Influence ( of poor decision making and bad taste )

[Macfanforever]

http://www.northplattepost.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/MCNEW-NANCY-JEAN-9-23-11.png

Nancy Jean McNew.
She'd fit in just fine.

Charges: Driving Under Influence ( of poor decision making and bad taste )

Yes.I see her rap sheet.Wynonna Judd ,Heather Locklear and other celebs could fit that too.

[Macfanforever]

Would not mind hearing Wynonna doing some Stevie/Mac tunes.

[HomerMcvie]

http://www.northplattepost.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/MCNEW-NANCY-JEAN-9-23-11.png

Nancy Jean McNew.
She'd fit in just fine.

That's probably what Stevie would look like without any plastic surgery.

Welcome to the room, Nancy Jean!

[jbrownsjr]

hahahahahaha i love you guys!! you make ledging fun

[HomerMcvie]

hahahahahaha i love you guys!! you make ledging fun

Tru dat (10 characters)!!

[Nathan]

I love that Nancy Jean lady. She tell it like it is.

[HomerMcvie]

I love that Nancy Jean lady. She tell it like it is.

She is our new Shhhheeetttvie!!! It is said, and it is done.


She's bringing 3 new songs to the studio this week!!! There's no holding her back!


GO GO GO, Nancy Jean!!!

[jbrownsjr]

She is our new Shhhheeetttvie!!! It is said, and it is done.


She's bringing 3 new songs to the studio this week!!! There's no holding her back!


GO GO GO, Nancy Jean!!!

Nancy Jean can write!

[Macfanforever]

Looking at mug shots of celebs on the Smoking Gun website.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/mugshots/celebrity/hollywood

Stevie would be the best looking one on there.

[Jondalar]

I do think less of Stevie for not participating. They want to make art and she just wants a cash grab.

[jbrownsjr]

I do think less of Stevie for not participating. They want to make art and she just wants a cash grab.

exactly, how I feel.. So glad she's not part of it. I wanted her at first, but I'm really excited now that she isn't.

[Jondalar]

exactly, how I feel.. So glad she's not part of it. I wanted her at first, but I'm really excited now that she isn't.

The album will better without her. Her writing days are over.

[jbrownsjr]

The album will better without her. Her writing days are over.

I like that they can actually create together without her pretension.

[HomerMcvie]

I like that they can actually create together without her pretension.

Are you trying to say that she's pretentious?

Would you say that to Bob Dylan?

[jbrownsjr]

Are you trying to say that she's pretentious?

Would you say that to Bob Dylan?

I'm trying to say I would like some art without her bloviating and talking about herself ad nauseam.

[Jondalar]

I'm trying to say I would like some art without her bloviating and talking about herself ad nauseam.

I agree, she brings the drama, not Lindsey. She can't get over anything.