Live 1980 Album - Retracked

[Andy Man]

I've always enjoyed the 1980 live double album, however I can't help but wonder how much more epic it would have been if the track listing had been different. First, I would have not added any of the new studio tracks - only live cuts. Secondly, I would have focussed more on the best live songs the Mac had at the time, many of which were not included. Here would be my ideal list:

Side A
01. Monday Morning
02. Say You Love Me
03. Dreams
04. The Chain
05. Oh Well
06. Over & Over

Side B
01. Tusk
02. Sara
03. Why
04. Never Going Back Again
05. Landslide
06. Gold Dust Woman

Side C
01. Over My Head
02. Rhiannon
03. Second Hand News
04. Don't Let Me Down Again
05. Sisters Of The Moon

Side D
01. You Make Loving Fun
02. Don't Stop
03. Go Your Own Way
04. I'm So Afraid
05. Songbird

What would your ideal 1980 Live look like?

[PenguinHead]

Firelies, Farmer's Daughter, and Oh Well made the album special - it gave us something new. LIVE was somewhat unconventional because it wasn't a straight shot live show, but tracks from different shows.

Oh Well aside, Firelies, One More Night and Farmer's Daughter have ever been in the set list up to that time. Dreams and Don't Stop were rehearsals, and a few of the tracks are from the Rumours era.

I assume that they have the rest of the live recordings from the Tusk tour in the can. It would be great if they if they released an expanded version of LIVE with all the outtakes. One issue of concern is congruity; many of the tracks on the album were sweetened up in the studio. I wonder if the outtakes got the same treatment, or were they left in their original form.

I'd love a live collection that features all the prior Mac/related songs they initially performed early on when Lindsey and Stevie first joined.

Get Like You Used to Be
Station Man
Green Manalishi
Sunny Side of Heaven
Believe Me
Why

Frozen Love and Jumping at Shadows were only one-time performances. I doubt they were ever professionally recorded.
I'm surprised they never performed Black Magic Woman -- perhaps because it was a huge hit for Santana around that time.

[SteveMacD]

That would never fit on vinyl.

[Macfanforever]

It should go in order as the setlist goes.

[PenguinHead]

It should go in order as the setlist goes.

There are different approaches to Live albums. It could be one entire performance, or selected performances from various shows.

I like the LIVE album because it's not conventional. But I was a little disappointed that the live disc from the most recent Rumours deluxe edition wasn't an entire show, but just a stingy 12 songs with no reference of where they were performed. But it's very clear that they received no touch up.

[Andy Man]

There different approaches to Live albums. It could be one entire performance, or selected performances from various shows.

I like the LIVE album because it's not conventional. But I was a little disappointed that the live disc from the most recent Rumours deluxe edition wasn't an entire show, but just a stingy 12 songs with no reference of where they were performed. But it's very clear that they received no touch up.

Yes, I agree. This release was a bigger disappointment. Had they included "Second Hand News" and "You Make Loving Fun" it would have been a stellar live collection from the tour.

[Macfan4life]

This has been brought up several times before.
Thank goodness they did this live album because they were on top of their game. It has the best live versions of Rhiannon, Over My Head, Oh Well, Say You Love Me and the ultimate live version of I'm So Afraid.

Missing is the Chain and Sisters for sure. Fireflies and One More Lonely Night are duds IMHO. Its nice to put something new but lacking production and creativity. I would like the Chain and Sisters live over these songs anyday.

Love they put some deep cuts from Tusk on the album like Over and Over. That song live translates into a completely different realm. The guitar with harmonies at the end are amazing.

I like the song Dreams and usually every live version is ok but this live version is horrible. Stevie is milking her voice sounding like an amateur. It was not recorded during the Tusk tour and they took it from a Paris sound check from the Rumours tour. I think she let the success of the song at that time go to her head and that is why she sounds the way that she does LOL :eek:

But OMG even though this album was not a huge financial success and even the band and management was against it. Mick wrote in his 1990 book that it was his idea and sort of forced everyone to make it happen. Thank goodness it happened. It really shows the difference between Fleetwood Mac in the studio and Fleetwood Mac LIVE.

Another goodie is a live version of Don't Let Me Down Again.

[WayOfTheDragon]

Attempting to fit things onto a double vinyl album:

Side A
1. The Chain
2. Think About Me
3. Dreams
4. Oh Well
5. Rhiannon


Side B
1. Over and Over
2. Sara (using the original concert performance-- without the re-done vocals)
3. Not That Funny (using the shorter version from the first leg of the '79 tour)
4. Get Like You Used To Be
5. Landslide


Side c
1. Tusk
2. Angel
3. You Make Loving Fun
4. What Makes You Think You're The One
5. One More Night


Side D
1. Go Your Own Way
2. Blue Letter
3. I'm So Afraid
4. Songbird
5. The Farmer's Daughter

[SteveMacD]

I've been playing around with this, and I've noticed that Stevie's songs tend to be pretty long. While those performances were pretty epic during the shows, it becomes a logistical nightmare when putting together an album like this, since each side of an album should be 22 minutes at most (although they certainly went over a few times on this one). It always appears like she's getting the shaft whenever I put something together, even though she's getting the same amount of album time. I can get like six or seven of Lindsey's songs in the same space as four of Stevie's.

[MikeInNV]

I've been playing around with this, and I've noticed that Stevie's songs tend to be pretty long. While those performances were pretty epic during the shows, it becomes a logistical nightmare when putting together an album like this, since each side of an album should be 22 minutes at most (although they certainly went over a few times on this one). It always appears like she's getting the shaft whenever I put something together, even though she's getting the same amount of album time. I can get like six or seven of Lindsey's songs in the same space as four of Stevie's.

Pretty much the same situation as the Tusk album, right?

[SteveMacD]

Pretty much the same situation as the Tusk album, right?
Pretty much.

[PenguinHead]

I wish Fleetwood Mac would release an expansive live anthology similar to the one Tom Petty did - five discs of 62 songs. His compilation includes album tracks and covers from various eras in random order.

It would be an arduous task to select the best rendition of their staple songs among so many eras. It's such a personal matter of opinion. I'd also include the songs performed with the Time band, but I can't remember what they played. Fleetwood Mac's all inclusive live repertoire would require perhaps six CDs.


1. Jumping at Shadows - bootleg
2. Green Manalishi
3. Spare Me a Little
4. Believe Me
5. Why
6. Get Like You Used to Be
7. Don't Let Me Down Again
8. Frozen Love -bootleg
9. Say You Love Me
10. Monday Morning
11. Blue Letter
12. Rhiannon
13. Over My Head
14. Landslide
15. World Turning
16. I'm So Afraid
17. Second Hand News
18. Dreams
19. Never Going Back Again
20. Don't Stop
21. Go Your Own Way
22. Songbird
23. Silver Springs
24. You Make Loving Fun
25. Gold Dust Woman
26. Oh Daddy
27. The Chain
28. Over and Over
29. The Ledge - rehearsal
30. Think About Me
31. Save Me a Place
32. Sara
33. What Makes You Think You're the One
34. Storms
35. Not That Funny
36. Sisters of the Moon
37. Angel
38. That's Enough for Me -bootleg
39. Brown Eyes
40. I Know I'm Not Wrong
41. Beautiful Child
42. Tusk
43. Eyes of the World
44. Love in Store
45. Hold Me
46. Gypsy
47. Big Love
48. Seven Wonders
49. Everywhere
50. Little Lies
51. Isn't it Midnight
52. Go Insane
53. Sweet Girl
54. Temporary One
55. Bleed to Love Her
56. In The Back of My Mind
57. Save Me
58. Love is Dangerous
59. When the Sun Goes Down
60. Stand Back
61. Has Anyone Ever Written Anything for You
62. Say You Will
63. Goodbye Baby
64. Running Through the Garden
65. What's the World Coming To
66. Come
67. Say Goodbye
68. Peacekeeper
69. My Little Demon
70. Sad Angel
71. Oh Well
72. Stop Messing Around
73. I Loved Another Woman

[michelej1]

I've been playing around with this, and I've noticed that Stevie's songs tend to be pretty long. While those performances were pretty epic during the shows, it becomes a logistical nightmare when putting together an album like this, since each side of an album should be 22 minutes at most (although they certainly went over a few times on this one). It always appears like she's getting the shaft whenever I put something together, even though she's getting the same amount of album time. I can get like six or seven of Lindsey's songs in the same space as four of Stevie's.

That's what they said.

Michele

[SteveMacD]

I'd also include the songs performed with the Time band, but I can't remember what they played.
Blow By Blow
Dreamin' The Dream
The Bigger The Love
Only You Know & I Know
Tear It Up
Imagine

[gssmith]

The album is great the way it is. You can not fit everything on it. I still listen to it and the Dance a lot. More than the expanded Rumours live disc, 1982 live cd from the DVD, and especially 1987's live cd from that DVD, and 2004's live cd.
Each one has some gems though

The Chain on the live Rumours disc is kind of lame. Love the 1982 version!!

[David]

There different approaches to Live albums. It could be one entire performance, or selected performances from various shows.

The band (or its label) went back and forth about what to release. The earlier intention—advertised in Patrick Goldstein's Pop Eye column in the L.A. Times—was to record the then-upcoming Hollywood Bowl concerts for a live album. But minds must have changed. The last Bowl show was Sept. 1 and the album was released Dec. 8, so the group must have recorded the show still believing it was going to be for the album. I think the final live album was a rush job—the time frame of no more than two months lends credence to that. I have the impression of Mick, Lindsey, and Christine (Stevie was in South America learning to stand on her own) sitting in a studio while some other cats play them various cuts of their own concerts from 1975 to 1980, and just randomly picking what sounded good (or odd) to them. There's such a mishmash of different years on the album, I'd bet things weren't even labeled well. And then, of course, there's cocaine. I think if anyone involved was doing any thinking about this whatsoever, it was Lindsey, and he probably wanted to make a second Tusk statement—idiosyncrasy, explosive energy, incoherence, etc. LIVE is a postmodern live album avant la lettre.

[BlueDenimLamp]

Firelies, Farmer's Daughter, and Oh Well made the album special - it gave us something new. LIVE was somewhat unconventional because it wasn't a straight shot live show, but tracks from different shows.

Oh Well aside, Firelies, One More Night and Farmer's Daughter have ever been in the set list up to that time. Dreams and Don't Stop were rehearsals, and a few of the tracks are from the Rumours era.

I assume that they have the rest of the live recordings from the Tusk tour in the can. It would be great if they if they released an expanded version of LIVE with all the outtakes. One issue of concern is congruity; many of the tracks on the album were sweetened up in the studio. I wonder if the outtakes got the same treatment, or were they left in their original form.

I'd love a live collection that features all the prior Mac/related songs they initially performed early on when Lindsey and Stevie first joined.

Get Like You Used to Be
Station Man
Green Manalishi
Sunny Side of Heaven
Believe Me
Why

Frozen Love and Jumping at Shadows were only one-time performances. I doubt they were ever professionally recorded.
I'm surprised they never performed Black Magic Woman -- perhaps because it was a huge hit for Santana around that time.

"Black Magic Woman" was a top 5 hit for Santana back in 1970 and FM performed it during the Bob Welch era so it's probably more of LB not wanting to play "other peoples songs" than anything else...

[FuzzyPlum]

Overall I really like the Live album.
Obviously the omission of The Chain is curious but aside from that I'm very happy with it. The Farmers daughter, One More Lonely Night and Fireflies are all lovely (I usually hate the word lovely but I cant think of an alternative that is as fitting).
It does a pretty damned good job of representing their live show at that time. Quite like the cover too.

[Jezzup]

I'd like to have SOTM and Angel from the Tusk documentary. Lets remove Dreams and Sara. I'd replace Over & Over with Think About Me. Not That Funny and NGBA I'd replace with Silver Springs and Tusk.

[PenguinHead]

tThe album is great the way it is. You can not fit everything on it. I still listen to it and the Dance a lot. More than the expanded Rumours live disc, 1982 live cd from the DVD, and especially 1987's live cd from that DVD, and 2004's live cd.
Each one has some gems though

The Chain on the live Rumours disc is kind of lame. Love the 1982 version!!

I agree. I like the LIVE album as it is. Forgive them for The Chain on the Rumours disc. It was an early performance, and the song hadn't found its legs yet.

[PenguinHead]

"Black Magic Woman" was a top 5 hit for Santana back in 1970 and FM performed it during the Bob Welch era so it's probably more of LB not wanting to play "other peoples songs" than anything else...

I didn't realize Santana's version was from the 1970. It was a radio staple throughout the 70's!

[PenguinHead]

The band (or its label) went back and forth about what to release. The earlier intention—advertised in Patrick Goldstein's Pop Eye column in the L.A. Times—was to record the then-upcoming Hollywood Bowl concerts for a live album. But minds must have changed. The last Bowl show was Sept. 1 and the album was released Dec. 8, so the group must have recorded the show still believing it was going to be for the album. I think the final live album was a rush job—the time frame of no more than two months lends credence to that. I have the impression of Mick, Lindsey, and Christine (Stevie was in South America learning to stand on her own) sitting in a studio while some other cats play them various cuts of their own concerts from 1975 to 1980, and just randomly picking what sounded good (or odd) to them. There's such a mishmash of different years on the album, I'd bet things weren't even labeled well. And then, of course, there's cocaine. I think if anyone involved was doing any thinking about this whatsoever, it was Lindsey, and he probably wanted to make a second Tusk statement—idiosyncrasy, explosive energy, incoherence, etc. LIVE is a postmodern live album avant la lettre.

Thanks for the insight and context. Aside from the Hollywood Bowl, I suppose there must be other shows that were professionally recorded over the years. Given their unabashed propensity to mine that era of the band, I'm surprised that haven't officially released any of those shows in the long periods of their dormancy. Does Warner Brothers own them?

[brad975]

I have read before that "Rhiannon" was from the Rumours tour. But I hadn't heard that about "Dreams" on Live as well. I had been kind of surprised she could still hit some of those notes circa 1980.

But how do we really know what tour those takes came from? Just curious

[SisterNightroad]

The Hollywood Bowl wasn't professionally recorded.
The list of songs and their origins are listed on Wikipedia:

Side one
"Monday Morning" (Buckingham) – recorded at Tokyo – 3:51
"Say You Love Me" (McVie) – recorded at Wichita – 4:18
"Dreams" (Nicks) – recorded at Paris sound check – 4:18
"Oh Well" (Green) – recorded at St. Louis – 3:23
"Over & Over" (McVie) – recorded at Oklahoma City – 5:01

Side two
"Sara" (Nicks) – recorded at St. Louis – 7:23
"Not That Funny" (Buckingham) – recorded at Cleveland – 9:04
"Never Going Back Again" (Buckingham) – recorded at Tucson – 4:13
"Landslide" (Nicks) – recorded at London – 4:33

Side three
"Fireflies" (Nicks) – recorded at the Santa Monica Civic Auditorium for crew and friends – 4:37
"Over My Head" (McVie) – recorded at Kansas City – 3:27
"Rhiannon" (Nicks) – recorded at London – 7:43
"Don't Let Me Down Again" (Buckingham) – recorded at Passaic – 3:57
"One More Night" (McVie) – recorded at the Santa Monica Civic Auditorium for crew and friends – 3:43

Side four
"Go Your Own Way" (Buckingham) – recorded at Cleveland – 5:44
"Don't Stop" (McVie) – recorded at Paris sound check – 4:05
"I'm So Afraid" (Buckingham) – recorded at Cleveland – 8:28
"The Farmer's Daughter" (Wilson, Love) – recorded at the Santa Monica Civic Auditorium for crew and friends – 2:25

[cactusjack]

what the hell? Fireflies is amazing. They should be performing it on the current tour - it's all about the Five being back together

[David]

I have read before that "Rhiannon" was from the Rumours tour. But I hadn't heard that about "Dreams" on Live as well. I had been kind of surprised she could still hit some of those notes circa 1980.

But how do we really know what tour those takes came from? Just curious
It's based on what instruments they're playing (Christine and Lindsey started playing noticeably different instruments in 1979), on arrangements ("Never Going Back Again," for example, is rearranged between the earlier tour and the later tour), and on comparisons with all the audience concert tapes people have.

The songs NOT from the Tusk tour on that album are:

Monday Morning
Say You Love Me
Dreams
Over My Head
Rhiannon
Don't Let Me Down Again
Don't Stop


Nobody's ever been able to figure out where Stevie's post-recorded vocal on "Sara" came from—or why it sounds so beautifully gin-soaked in 1980, exactly like a 1982 rendition.

[PenguinHead]

The songs NOT from the Tusk tour on that album are:

Monday Morning
Say You Love Me
Dreams
Over My Head
Rhiannon
Don't Let Me Down Again
Don't Stop


Nobody's ever been able to figure out where Stevie's post-recorded vocal on "Sara" came from—or why it sounds so beautifully gin-soaked in 1980, exactly like a 1982 rendition.

Thanks for clarifying those songs. I assumed they were pre-Tusk, mostly from 1976-1977. Perhaps Stevie's post-recorded vocal was done during the sweetening sessions while the album was being prepped. I remember Christine saying this was a "warts and all" album. Stevie, in particular, didn't want to show her warts.

[WayOfTheDragon]

Perhaps Stevie's post-recorded vocal was done during the sweetening sessions while the album was being prepped.

I assume this was the case, because Christine & Lindsey do some backing vocal parts that are completely different to the way they usually performed it on tour.

[joe]

[QUOTE=David;1164150

Nobody's ever been able to figure out where Stevie's post-recorded vocal on "Sara" came from—or why it sounds so beautifully gin-soaked in 1980, exactly like a 1982 rendition.[/QUOTE]

but why why why replace that original vocal? there was nothing wrong with that st louis performance - vocally or otherwise.:shrug:

[Andy Man]

The band (or its label) went back and forth about what to release. The earlier intention—advertised in Patrick Goldstein's Pop Eye column in the L.A. Times—was to record the then-upcoming Hollywood Bowl concerts for a live album. But minds must have changed. The last Bowl show was Sept. 1 and the album was released Dec. 8, so the group must have recorded the show still believing it was going to be for the album. I think the final live album was a rush job—the time frame of no more than two months lends credence to that. I have the impression of Mick, Lindsey, and Christine (Stevie was in South America learning to stand on her own) sitting in a studio while some other cats play them various cuts of their own concerts from 1975 to 1980, and just randomly picking what sounded good (or odd) to them. There's such a mishmash of different years on the album, I'd bet things weren't even labeled well. And then, of course, there's cocaine. I think if anyone involved was doing any thinking about this whatsoever, it was Lindsey, and he probably wanted to make a second Tusk statement—idiosyncrasy, explosive energy, incoherence, etc. LIVE is a postmodern live album avant la lettre.

Yes, I agree with this post completely. "Live" does sound like an extension of the "Tusk" style, meaning very little cohesiveness and just a sprawling sound of chaos. In that sense I think it is a very original live album (i.e. it does not flow like a typical live album cash grab with only the hits).

However, I brought this topic up as I do think the live album was also a means for Lindsey to assert himself as the important player that he was in the band's success. Truly, it is his album. He has the most live cuts and they go on the longest due to massive guitar solos. I can imagine that by the time 1980 rolled around and the general public had pretty much identified Fleetwood Mac with Stevie Nicks, this would have had to have some less than positive reactions from the band. In the case of Lindsey, he must have felt some frustration with the fact that it was essentially his production that brought the band to its height of popularity (in addition to the songs of all three, of course). I think that "Live" was in some ways a statement to the public that when you take away the theatrics that Stevie added to a show, it was essentially Lindsey guiding the energy (I would argue that this is still the case). "Live" certainly proves this. However, this does, of course, come at the expense of the others. It would have been great if Christine got at least one other live cut ("You Make Loving Fun" would have been nice, or, if they wanted more album tracks, "Oh Daddy" / "Songbird").

I do enjoy the album considerably as is. However, much like "Tusk", there are moments of the record where in fact we are listening to the Lindsey Buckingham show.

[SisterNightroad]

If someone wants to know where the songs were recorded in detail I discovered the answer was in plain sight on www.fleetwoodmac.net:

Monday Morning
Date Performance: 1977-12-05
Recorded in Tokyo on the "Rumours" tour

Say You Love Me
Date Performance: 1977-09-00
Recorded in Wichita on the "Rumours" tour

Dreams
Date Performance: 1977-04-14
Recorded live at Paris sound check on the "Rumours" tour

Oh Well
Date Performance: 1979-11-06
Recorded in St. Louis

Over & Over
Date Performance: 1980-08-22
Recorded in Oklahoma City

Sara
Date Performance: 1979-11-00
Recorded in St. Louis

Not That Funny
Date Performance: 1980-05-00
Recorded in Richfield (Cleveland)

Never Going Back Again
Date Performance: 1980-08-28
Recorded in Tucson

Landslide
Date Performance: 1980-06-27
Recorded in London

Fireflies
Date Performance: 1980-07-00
Recorded live at the Santa Monica Civic Auditorium for crew & friends

Over My Head
Date Performance: 1977
Recorded in Kansas City (if true, would've been the Sept. 16, 1977 show, although some believe it's mislabeled & that it is really Oklahoma City May 18, 1977) on the "Rumours" tour

Rhiannon
Date Performance: 1977-04-00
Recorded in London on the "Rumours" tour

Don't Let Me Down Again
Date Performance: 1975
CRecorded in Passaic on the "Fleetwood Mac" (1975) tour

One More Night
Date Performance: 1980-07-00
Recorded live at the Santa Monica Civic Auditorium for crew & friends

Go Your Own Way
Date Performance: 1980-05-00
Recorded in Richfield (Cleveland)

Don't Stop
Date Performance: 1977-04-14
Recorded live at Paris sound check on the "Rumours" tour

I'm So Afraid
Date Performance: 1980-05-00
Comments: Recorded in Richfield (Cleveland)

The Farmer's Daughter
Date Performance: 1980-07-00
Recorded live at the Santa Monica Civic Auditorium for crew & friends



http://www.fleetwoodmac.net/discog/discog.php?pid=37

[Macfan4life]

Wow thanks for posting and writing all that information. Curious why they picked the Don't Stop sound check where Lindsey breaks a guitar string at the end. You hear his guitar at the end sound like he breaks a string and then Christine says...You broke a string, didn't you.
I love all the songs but Dreams. And I like all live Dreams performances. You can tell it was recorded during the Rumours tour because Stevie is sort of dramatic singing it and that drives me crazy. She usually does not sing like that but it sounds like a karokee version of the song :eek:

Best live performances of Rhianon, Sara, Oh Well, Over My Head, and I'm So Afraid. I'm So Afraid is probably one of the best live performances ever for the Mac on this album. But the real treat of the album is Over and Over. To include a song from Tusk that was not a single was a great idea but the harmonies live at the end are really something.

[Montclare]

I'll echo that thank you! I've always wondered when these were done and could only find the locations. I'm surprised that Oh Well was done on the Tusk tour. For whatever reason, I can't picture Tusk era Lindsey performing this.

Speaking of breaking a string, it always amazes me when a guitarist is able to continue on after doing so. There's that video of GYOW in Australia 1977 where Lindsey breaks a string and just continues on with the song. I just think of the fast thinking you have to do to be able to continue on and applaud the guitarist for being able to do so.

[SisterNightroad]

For those wondering about Sara recorded at St Louis, I think it is not the same performance of the Tusk documentary since the band performed two nights at the Checker Dome, the 5th and the 6th of November.

[David]

Curious why they picked the Don't Stop sound check where Lindsey breaks a guitar string at the end.
It was conveniently "ready" for this rush job live album. The Dreams and Don't Stop videos had already been filmed for promos. And the Cleveland concert had been filmed, too—it was used in the ABC 20/20 program. And of course Sara and Oh Well from St. Louis were filmed, too.

I forgot that the Tokyo gig was filmed—that takes care of Monday Morning.