She Loves Him Still

[welcomechris]

I've Always Loved this demo, I hope they have not changed it too much. It is so sweet, and I think it is about Lindsey

No one heard her call his name
No one heard the sound she made
They would not like it much anyway
To know that she still loves him

No one understands this love
No one ever will
'Til his dying day
Not even he himself can change this
She loves him still

I miss my friend
I miss the sound of his laughter
She remembers him saying, "Well, where are you going?
Just what is it that you are after?"

No one understands this man
No one ever will
'Til his dying day
Not even he himself can change this
She loves him still

So, how are you?
Have you learned to deal with it?
"Oh, no," she says, "No, I have not learned"
You see, I cannot deal without it
So the flame still burns
The flame burns on

No one understands this love
No one ever will
'Til his dying day
She was heard to say
She loves him still

And the sands of time like shattered glass go past her...
She still loves him
Oh, no, they would not like it much anyway
But she still loves him
And the sands of time like shattered glass go past her
Straight back to the sea

She still loves him

LISTEN Here (1984 Outtake) (http://www.mediafire.com/listen/rgn1xb9xl00d54n/She_Loves_Him_Still.mp3)


I love how this closes the album!

[bombaysaffires]

I think it's about Joe. I think "they" would have been much more disapproving of her still loving him after the ****e way he treated her, but…there are so many men she's been with that we have no idea about

This one makes me most nervous.. there was such a vulnerability and fragileness to her vocal on the demo (take 1) that I just don't think post-rehab she can quite pull off now… but I hope to be proven wrong.

And whoever is playing the acoustic guitar on that demo is great-- reminds me of Lindsey's playing on the Rumours version of Silver Springs. I really hope they keep that arrangement too.

[brickney723]

I've been thinking about this song- immediately I thought- it's either about Joe or Lindsey. That it was written in 1984 made me initially think it would more likely be about Joe.. however the lines "Well, where are you going? Just what is it that you are after?" are not questions I can imagine Joe asking Stevie given his later thoughts on their relationship… but they are definitely questions Lindsey would have asked her in the aftermath of theirs. Also, I think that the song closing out this album gives more credence to it being about Lindsey.

[sorcerer999]

I think it's about Joe. I think "they" would have been much more disapproving of her still loving him after the ****e way he treated her.

I actually don't know very much about Joe & Stevie's relationship. How exactly did he treat her? And how long were they together?

[brickney723]

Another thing I just thought of- "How Still My Love" and the lyric "they say you're not the man for me." She makes clear that song IS about Lindsey- "you go your way.. but you don't forget me." Also, Lindsey's made references in his music- clearly there may have been forces steering her away from him.

[bombaysaffires]

Another thing I just thought of- "How Still My Love" and the lyric "they say you're not the man for me." She makes clear that song IS about Lindsey- "you go your way.. but you don't forget me." Also, Lindsey's made references in his music- clearly there may have been forces steering her away from him.

what do you mean she's made it clear it's about LB? because she says go your way??

honestly I think so many songs are about so many men we don't know. everyone was so sure Beautiful Child was about either LB or Mick and it turned out to be about the guy who worked for the Beatles no one knew about. Sleeping Angel was about Paul Fishkin…FWIW about her drummer friend… and on and on and on…. and since she and Paul were together a while I'd bet there are many more songs about him and what about Jimmy Iovine? Any song could be about him… and what about the engineer she went with during recording sessions for Rumours? She dated JD Souther for a short while, she was with Henley off and on for quite a bit, It's all a crap shoot.

[bombaysaffires]

I actually don't know very much about Joe & Stevie's relationship. How exactly did he treat her? And how long were they together?

she says 83-85.

They hooked up when he was the opening act for her on The Wild Heart tour. She says they locked eyes across a crowded room and that was it and she went over and crawled into his lap right then and there in the hotel bar. He says they were monogamous throughout the tour but then after that….she apparently fell head over heels for him and thought he might be "the one" (I believe he's the one she's talking about in the song I Sing for the Things-- I'll take off my cape for you/I'll take down my hair for you/ANything you want me to do/My love/I'll sit home and wait for you") but he thought of it he says as just a road fling and kinda jerked her around for quite a while after that-- booty calls and then blowing her off for months. They were both mega coke addicts during this time.

[brickney723]

what do you mean she's made it clear it's about LB? because she says go your way??



Ya, that's exactly what I mean! It's a clear shout out to him!

And I agree she's written about a lot of different men. I don't think Lindsey thinks so though- he's said their lyrics were always dialogues to each other.

[brickney723]

One thing though.. just because you've been with a lot of different men in no way means every person you date becomes a muse. Just food for thought.

[bombaysaffires]

One thing though.. just because you've been with a lot of different men in no way means every person you date becomes a muse. Just food for thought.

see I think everything in Stevie's life is fodder for her songs. I think when she gets stuck, Lindsey is a reliable go-to source.

My point, seriously, though, is that she writes about everything and yes even a one-night stand can and probably does lead to her writing SOMETHING. She and Lindsey were together for a looong time so yes there is a hella lot more to draw from there in terms of song material, especially wistful kinds of stuff. But I think most of her can't-wait-to-see-you, midnight-plane, love that starts out in the darkness, secret love kind of stuff is NOT Lindsey but her affairs on the road and such. And there's been a LOT of those.

[brickney723]

see I think everything in Stevie's life is fodder for her songs. I think when she gets stuck, Lindsey is a reliable go-to source.

My point, seriously, though, is that she writes about everything and yes even a one-night stand can and probably does lead to her writing SOMETHING. She and Lindsey were together for a looong time so yes there is a hella lot more to draw from there in terms of song material, especially wistful kinds of stuff. But I think most of her can't-wait-to-see-you, midnight-plane, love that starts out in the darkness, secret love kind of stuff is NOT Lindsey but her affairs on the road and such. And there's been a LOT of those.

Yeah, but we're only talking about two songs- How Still My Love and She Loves Him Still. Just because I think they're about him doesn't mean I think every song is about Lindsey. I don't.

[brickney723]

I mean I wouldn't jump to the conclusion if you think a couple of songs are about Joe Walsh, that u think every song is about Joe Walsh. (Who I actually, btw, think IS the love of HER life. )

[wheart]

I always thought this song was about Joe...not sure why, just a feeling. When I first heard it, it struck me very deeply...I don't even remember what was going on in my life at the time but I'm pretty sure it wasn't good so I related very much to the despair and longing of the lyrics. I can't tell you how happy I am that she included this. I didn't expect that she would. And I can honestly say I don't care how it turns out, as long as it's there. It can't sound like the demo, that is an amazing vocal but it will still be wonderful..."the flame still burns...the flame burns on..."

[brickney723]

We should start a poll on all these songs. Joe? Lindsey? Other?

[DauphineMarie]

I say Joe with this one. But with what everyone was asking about Stevie and Joe's relationship, I remember in one interview saying he left her, after something that happened during the Rock a Little recordings... "When you hang up that phone baby, well you cease to exist." I also know Stevie said that if her and Joe had stayed together for much longer, they both would have died because of all the drugs and everything. That's what I think Mabel Normand's about, as well as just about everything from the Rock a Little master reels in demo form we have.

[PenguinHead]

I like the song but personally care less about who it's about, or the meaning of it. Stevie's very fluid explaining the subject of her songs; often changing the "meaning" depending on when she is asked about it.

Of course all her songs are inspired by someone or something, but there is not a direct line. Stevie's strength and uniqueness is in her impressionist songwriting style, usually evoking emotion and feeling more than a straight narrative. Hence, her lyrics are more poetic. That's why, when she strays into specific topical matter like Jane Goodall, the result become little dicey.

I'm happy that she chose to unearthed She Loves Him Still; it's a good album closer. I won't mind if she alters it in any way; it's not that precious.

[sodascouts]

I think it could be about both Joe and Lindsey at the same time - one of her "blends" like "Sara."

However, the line "the sands of time like shattered glass go past her, straight back to the sea" is imagery and phrasing she's used when talking about Lindsey before in "Crystal" and "Trouble in Shangri-La" (although I'm not sure she's confirmed the latter). I'm not citing this as "proof" of anything, but I don't think it's a coincidence.

[Bandon]

Done right with strings, this could be a great second single. :nod:

[welcomechris]

I think it could be about both Joe and Lindsey at the same time - one of her "blends" like "Sara."

However, the line "the sands of time like shattered glass go past her, straight back to the sea" is imagery and phrasing she's used when talking about Lindsey before in "Crystal" and "Trouble in Shangri-La" (although I'm not sure she's confirmed the latter). I'm not citing this as "proof" of anything, but I don't think it's a coincidence.

Not to mention, she also says that very line in Goodbye Baby which was written in 1976

[welcomechris]

I mean I wouldn't jump to the conclusion if you think a couple of songs are about Joe Walsh, that u think every song is about Joe Walsh. (Who I actually, btw, think IS the love of HER life. )

No way, Lindsey is the love of her life, Stevie has said Joe is ONE of the loves, but Lindsey is the love of her life.

Some Songs Inspired by Lindsey (That just come to mind)

Crystal
Crying In The Night
Long Distance Winner
Landslide
Dreams
I Don't Want To Know
Gold Dust Woman
That's Alright
Kind Of Woman
No Questions Asked
Ooh My Love
I Still Miss Someone (Blue Eyes)
Blue Denim
Thrown Down
Without You
Smile At You
Not Make Believe
My Heart
Everybody Loves You
Destiny Rules
Silver Springs

Songs for Joe Walsh

She Loves Him Still
Priest of Nothing
If I Were You
Ooh Ooh Baby
I Can't Wait


Stevie STILL loves Lindsey, shes way over Joe Walsh

[WildHearted]

To be fair, the length of her relationship with Lindsey alone (romantic and platonic) is probably a huge reason she's written so many songs about him. Not that he didn't affect her/inspire her/whatever, because obviously he did, but I'm just saying, when someone is an integral part of your world for decades pushing all your buttons [the good and the bad] you're gonna have a lot material to be inspired by. Joe was in her life for what, 2 years? And then he pretty much hit and run, and as far as I know they haven' t kept in touch. Maybe there just wasn't anything left to say, whereas her relationship with Lindsey has always been ongoing in some sense. Maybe she was just more prolific in general in the 70s than she was in the mid-80s. She also had a good 15-16 years to write about Lindsey before she and Joe were even a thing. So I don't think it's useful to rank her "loves" based on the volume of work they inspired - there are too many other factors at play that go into that. Actually, I don't think you can compare loves at all because each one is different and that doesn't necessarily make it better or worse. Just different.

And I say this as someone who could care less about Joe Walsh- actually, I kind of can't stand the dude.

[brickney723]

Yeah, really I can't stand Joe Walsh either, I just call it like I see it- and I think he really is the only one she would have given it all up for. Sorry! I wish it wasn't so too!

I do think she's come to regret things with Lindsey in her later years though.

[brickney723]

Stevie's very fluid explaining the subject of her songs; often changing the "meaning" depending on when she is asked about it.


I also think she does this A LOT.

[Danigirl]

No way, Lindsey is the love of her life, Stevie has said Joe is ONE of the loves, but Lindsey is the love of her life.

Stevie has stated that Lindsey is the "musical love" of her life.
And I thought "Ooh ooh baby" was about JW, thanks for reinforcing my assumption.

[danax6]

Also, I think that the song closing out this album gives more credence to it being about Lindsey.This.
With her self-proclaimed sequencing skills and how she said this album told 'her story', it does give more credence to it being about Lindsey, seeing as that relationship -in whatever form- is still ongoing.

[Johnny Stew]

Stevie's very fluid explaining the subject of her songs; often changing the "meaning" depending on when she is asked about it.

I've often wondered if it's not so much that she changes the meanings, but that she changes which aspect of the meanings she chooses to talk to about. We know that many of her songs were written about more than one experience and/or person, so perhaps sometimes she feels more interested in discussing one aspect of a song's inspiration as opposed to another aspect. (Such as how she sometimes discusses the Tom & Jane Petty inspiration for "Edge," and sometimes she discusses the John Lennon/John Nicks aspect.)

[brickney723]

I've often wondered if it's not so much that she changes the meanings, but that she changes which aspect of the meanings she chooses to talk to about. We know that many of her songs were written about more than one experience and/or person, so perhaps sometimes she feels more interested in discussing one aspect of a song's inspiration as opposed to another aspect. (Such as how she sometimes discusses the Tom & Jane Petty inspiration for "Edge," and sometimes she discusses the John Lennon/John Nicks aspect.)

And sometimes completely ignores the part about Lindsey in there (and he's definitely in there).. She admitted later Lindsey was all over Bella Donna lyrically anyway.

[bombaysaffires]

And sometimes completely ignores the part about Lindsey in there (and he's definitely in there).. She admitted later Lindsey was all over Bella Donna lyrically anyway.

that's not so surprising really since so much of that material had already been around for a long time by then -- a lot of it written in the BN days

[bombaysaffires]

No way, Lindsey is the love of her life, Stevie has said Joe is ONE of the loves, but Lindsey is the love of her life.

Some Songs Inspired by Lindsey (That just come to mind)

Crystal
Crying In The Night
Long Distance Winner
Landslide
Dreams
I Don't Want To Know
Gold Dust Woman
That's Alright
Kind Of Woman
No Questions Asked
Ooh My Love
I Still Miss Someone (Blue Eyes)
Blue Denim
Thrown Down
Without You
Smile At You
Not Make Believe
My Heart
Everybody Loves You
Destiny Rules
Silver Springs

Songs for Joe Walsh

She Loves Him Still
Priest of Nothing
If I Were You
Ooh Ooh Baby
I Can't Wait


Stevie STILL loves Lindsey, shes way over Joe Walsh

I think there are a lot more songs than this about joe. If I had time I'd go thru and list them all but I don't right now.
I Sing for the Things is one of them off the top of my head. And No Questions Asked is Joe.

[brickney723]

I think there are a lot more songs than this about joe. If I had time I'd go thru and list them all but I don't right now.
I Sing for the Things is one of them off the top of my head. And No Questions Asked is Joe.

I know you mentioned I Sing for the Things.. even though it ended up on Rock a Little, I had read it was a piano demo from the Bella Donna era on Wikipedia- so not sure how accurate that is.

I think No Questions Asked is Lindsey.

[welcomechris]

I think there are a lot more songs than this about joe. If I had time I'd go thru and list them all but I don't right now.
I Sing for the Things is one of them off the top of my head. And No Questions Asked is Joe.

No Questions Asked is not about joe, it is about lindsey leaving fm, Stevie has discussed it before.

[bombaysaffires]

No Questions Asked is not about joe, it is about lindsey leaving fm, Stevie has discussed it before.

hmm… I'll have to see if I can dig it out one of these days..there was somewhere where she talked about the line "he wants her to be with him/he wants her with him now" or whatever it is (i'm going by memory) being about meeting Joe and their eyes locking across the room and that whole thing of her going over and crawling in his lap. Could well be like someone said earlier just another song with pieces from many different moments with different people. I always find these discussions of who a song is about so fascinating!

[brickney723]

I just read an old thread where someone was convinced No Questions Asked was about Tom Petty.

"There are songs that Stevie has written all throughout our relationship which I assumed were about me, then discovered that they weren’t or that they were hybrids. I can be as confused about that as the general listener, believe me.” -LB 2003

At least Lindsey's as confused as we are.

[sodascouts]

Not to mention, she also says that very line in Goodbye Baby which was written in 1976

Of course, how could I forget that! Thanks.

[nicole21290]

I think it could be about both Joe and Lindsey at the same time - one of her "blends" like "Sara."

However, the line "the sands of time like shattered glass go past her, straight back to the sea" is imagery and phrasing she's used when talking about Lindsey before in "Crystal" and "Trouble in Shangri-La" (although I'm not sure she's confirmed the latter). I'm not citing this as "proof" of anything, but I don't think it's a coincidence.

She has confirmed TISL is about him, actually. Well, the first verse of it. She did the same with Say You Will - confirming a PART of the song is about him, even though the narrative structure and so on kind of indicates more than just that 'part' is about him...

"The first verse is absolutely about Lindsey and me. When I was writing it I wasn’t conscious of that because I just write long poems. I write poems with about 20 stanzas and then some of them have to go when you actually put it to a song. But ‘I remember him, he was very young / No one spoke like him, he was someone / And I carried on, like I couldn’t stop / All of it for us, baby.’ All of it for love basically." (2001)

Stevie has stated that Lindsey is the "musical love" of her life.
And I thought "Ooh ooh baby" was about JW, thanks for reinforcing my assumption.

Stevie goes backwards and forwards on this one. One point? Saying he is her 'musical love' doesn't mean he isn't her romantic love; some people seem to think the two are mutually exclusive and they're not. There’s a constancy and a dependency and a desire there that I don’t think has ever gone away regarding Lindsey that I don't think is there with Joe, actually. She changes her public thoughts fairly frequently - depending on mood, what’s been going on with SnL behind the scenes, who she’s talking to, what she wants the media/public to hear, etc etc.

I certainly don't buy Stevie's claim that she fell in love with Joe at first sight, tbh. The idea that she didn't meet him until 1983 seems WILDLY implausible, especially considering the relationship with Henley and the fact FM and The Eagles both played the same gig on several occasions in the 70s. I also think she exaggerates about that time with him. I think that for several reasons (her usual over-romanticism, her needing to think it was more than what he saw it, her own self-image, being on the outs with Lindsey or at least pretending to be, etc) she makes more of it than what it honestly probably was. Her stories are a little inconsistent regarding the relationship but, certainly, if we go by her accounts she really felt very, very strongly about him. I think that need and feeling were exacerbated by other things going on - drugs, touring, what was happening/what had happened with Lindsey, etc. I think that these days she will pull his name out in interviews quite often as a deflector - away from Lindsey. If she needs to portray things not going so well in that camp, she’ll big Joe up as the love of her life. When she doesn’t need to portray things being bad between her and Lindsey, all of a sudden “it’s not important that we talk about him”…

I have sure confidence that Lindsey is the (musical and romantic) love of her life. There’s a reason she always compares them to, not just artistic double acts, but double acts who were COUPLES in every sense - Johnny and June, George and Gracie, Katharine and Spence. HE is the one she can’t shut up about (and I honestly think it's false that it’s all an act to play up to shippers and to sell press/records), HE is the one she is STILL writing songs about, that she stills feels that ‘ssssss’ and attraction with/to, that she still hugs, flirts and kisses in a natural, comfortable way. HE is the one that she sees in all her imaginings of the future (moving to San Jose, sitting on the bed alone, hitting him with her walker). He is ALWAYS there. Joe is not. She may have loved Joe a lot but she’s admitted that of all the men in her life, Lindsey has loved her the most. And I think the opposite is true also.

“Now I just adore him,” says Nicks, with ravishing candour. “He is my love. My first love and my love for all time." (2003)

"He was absolutely the romantic love of my life." Stevie speculated, "I think if we had not moved from San Francisco to L.A., both of us feel we would have gotten married and stayed there, and we also believe we would have still been famous." (2011)

I've often wondered if it's not so much that she changes the meanings, but that she changes which aspect of the meanings she chooses to talk to about. We know that many of her songs were written about more than one experience and/or person, so perhaps sometimes she feels more interested in discussing one aspect of a song's inspiration as opposed to another aspect. (Such as how she sometimes discusses the Tom & Jane Petty inspiration for "Edge," and sometimes she discusses the John Lennon/John Nicks aspect.)

THIS. She has certain ways of talking about songs and I think some of these methods are ways to avoid discussing certain aspects of songs, or who they are about. This doesn't just apply to her, btw; I've had long arguments about the meanings of Paul McCartney's songs because of the way he discusses them.

There is always a focal point and angle taken when an album is released. Regarding SnL, they’ll pick a few songs to talk about in EVERY interview. And they’ll very rarely be the really eyebrow raising ones about each other. Never. Even if they do discuss songs about each other (Everybody Loves You, for example), they’ll avoid discussing the juicy stuff, avoid answering the questions people should be asking. They do this in several ways.

1. talking about the origin or inspiration of the song (Everybody Loves You was a poem I wrote and Dave was sitting opposite me…)
2. talking about the instrumentation and playing on the song (Stand Back was cool; Prince came in and played…)
3. talking about only a select few lyrics and ignoring the rest of the song (You May Be The One is only addressed in terms of the chorus not the MUCH more interesting verses)
4. talking in generalities only (Seeds We Sow being about choices and the consequences they have…)
5. lying outright. For example, Stevie has said The Highwayman is all about Henley. In fact, she said it over and over and over again during the 2005 Jim Ladd interview. The language and theme/s points me towards Lindsey anyway, but the fact that it has a copyright of 1975?! Yeah, Mr Buckingham is definitely in that one.

[Danigirl]

I think Stevie knows how to keep fans and media talking about her, her lyrics, and her loves.....
Always be mysterious
Never set anything in stone, meaning never giving a definitive answer.
And always keep people guessing.

Strategy people!!!

[brickney723]

I love these discussions, here is my opinion, it's just an opinion.

Here are some quotes I already had together about Joe Walsh, I'm sure there are more. I would love to think the love of her life was Lindsey, but I guess I connect so well with what she's said about both of them and relate it to my personal experience- having had a love somewhat analogous to Lindsey and to Joe. I haven't heard her express the same sentiment for Lindsey as she has for Joe. I remember an article with Playboy post- Lindsey, pre-Joe which was very telling - about finding the "big love" and that she has not found it yet.
____
1982

PLAYBOY: Do you want to marry eventually and have a family?

NICKS: If I had a family, I'd probably love it. Right now, I have my dog Sarah, two cats and a baby Doberman. But I wish I had a little girl. Even a little boy. Getting married would, of course, depend on the man; also on whether I cared enough. ]If I fell that deeply in love with someone, I'd have no idea of what to do. But I'd be willing to make whatever compromises were necessary. [/B]

PLAYBOY: What compromises?

NICKS: My interest in the music and everything else would have to drop off a little bit. But I don't fall in love that often, because it's sad when you fall in love and it doesn't work out. I know it’s better to have loved, because otherwise I wouldn’t have anything to write about. And there are different kinds of love. But if it were the big love, I’d drop everything. I’d still have my job, of course, but I’d get in my car and drive across town in the middle of the night ~ which I will not do under other circumstances, because I don’t have a license. I’d go crazy, I suppose. It’s probably the most wonderful feeling in the world.

PLAYBOY: It sounds as if Your job Would get in the way.

NICKS: It invades it. You can call up your boyfriend and say, "I'm sick; I can't go to dinner." But you cannot call in sick to Fleetwood Mac. So a certain number of my relationships are ruined, not because of the people involved but because of my other commitments. And so, every time, I'm just a little less interested in starting something up, because what has happened before is probably going to happen again. It's not a lack of interest on my part; it's a lack of time to be interested.

So maybe it's good that I haven't fallen deeply enough in love to give up a good half of what I do.
------
In the end as much as Lindsey loved her, she obviously did not love him enough to be with him, and certainly not in the way she describes above. Clearly she did feel that way about Joe- the problem is he left her (and her life for good) and seemingly did not feel the same about her. If he had, who knows what would've happened?

BBC Interview with Nicky Horne ~ August 27, 1991
(about her relationship with Joe Walsh)"We went on the Wild Heart tour and after about a week I went into a bar and he [Joe] was sitting there and he just looked up at me and that was it. It was love at first sight. You should have seen me, I went and yelled at people about his sound checks. I bought him incredible silk shirts and leg warmers that he wore! I took really good care of him and I think that is what scared Joe the most because I was too in tune with him and he was too used to being out of tune with everyone. I really understood him well. I was really hard nosed about him. If my house was full and Joe called I would tell everyone to get out."


BBC Interview with Nicky Horne ~August 27, 1991
(about whether she still loves Joe Walsh)"I will always love Joe. It will probably be hard for me to find somebody else that ever ever made me feel like Joe did. [After the breakup] At that point I just thought it was over, I thought that I would just be an old maid and just live with a bunch of dogs and cats in the mountains somewhere and that would be it because there just wouldn't be anything else for me."

And who has been the greatest love of her life?

'My great, great love was Joe Walsh.'


'I don't know - why do you love somebody? Why do you love them so much that when they walk in the room your heart jumps out of your chest? I don't know. But I fell in love with Joe at first sight from across the room, in the bar at the Mansions Hotel in Dallas. I looked at him and I walked across the room and I sat on the bar stool next to him, and two seconds later I crawled into his lap, and that was it. -2007

'We were probably the perfect, complete, crazy pair. He was the one that I would have married, and that I would probably have changed my life around for."

She tells People magazine, "There was nothing more important than Joe Walsh - not my music, not my songs, not anything."
-----

Keep in mind some of these quotes are decades apart. I don't think she's making it up. I also think she's being genuine about the love at first sight thing- because I also relate this to my own personal experience- had met somebody in passing before, but then had THE moment later- it WAS love at first sight- even though I had actually seen him, even met him, before.

I think she's genuine when she talks about Lindsey too- in some cases it's how she feels at the time. I also think how she feels and what she says about Lindsey depend on whether she's sleeping with him at the time. (Yes, I think she's been sleeping w/Lindsey on and off for years and years, unlike Joe) I also think there's a clear delineation between her feelings pre-Dance and post-Dance, too much territory to cover really. I remember her talking about "Landslide,"about how she didn't know if she wanted to be with Lindsey but "the music was important" -I think that was the most important aspect of keeping that relationship together from her end. I think a huge thing for her is how Lindsey never let her go emotionally- she definitely did not get unconditional love from Joe Walsh. When someone loves you the way Lindsey loved her, it effects you. Lindsey's definitely a great love as well, but in sum, I think she hit the nail on the head when she said this : " I fell in love with Joe the way Lindsey fell in love with me." I think that's 100% honest.

[Danigirl]

I find it ironic that Stevie uses the term Big Love (Playboy, 1982), the same title as a Lindsey written track.

[brickney723]

I find it ironic that Stevie uses the term Big Love (Playboy, 1982), the same title as a Lindsey written track.

Yeah, nobody used that phrase back then. This was before the series "Big Love" too. I think he was inspired to write the song based at least partially upon what she said in the article.

[bombaysaffires]

well, and as regards Joe, remember this too: she had just married and divorced Kim very quickly. She went out on the Wild Heart tour that summer the divorce went through. (and she'd only married him at the beginning of the year). I have a clip of her somewhere talking to like Entertainment Tonight at the start of the tour and they mention the divorce and she says "well my life has to go on". So I think she was in a weird place going out on that tour… maybe feeling a little guilty about that whole marriage, feeling sad, feeling a lot of things-- and then she's out on the road away from all that and things click between her and Joe. I'm willing to bet that relationship was a nice distraction from all the messiness of the Kim stuff.

Isn't it curious we never seem to speculate on songs that might have been written about Kim? Even if he wasn't the greatest love of her life that whole situation seems ripe for songs of regret and messed up relationships and all that.

I always thought for some reason that When I See You Again was about that relationship. I think the lines
If she sees him again
Will your very best friend
Will your very best friend
Oooh have been replaced by some other?

was about that.. in typical Stevie switching person style, the "she" and "your" are both her, and she's asking if I see Kim again will my very best friend Robin have been replaced by some other, by some stranger? I don't know why I always heard that line that way, but there you go. And remember that break up was acrimonious.. he was really angry with her and they didn't speak for a long time.

Again, who the flip knows!!

[bombaysaffires]

I think Stevie knows how to keep fans and media talking about her, her lyrics, and her loves.....
Always be mysterious
Never set anything in stone, meaning never giving a definitive answer.
And always keep people guessing.

Strategy people!!!

agree 100%

[DauphineMarie]

I think Stevie knows how to keep fans and media talking about her, her lyrics, and her loves.....
Always be mysterious
Never set anything in stone, meaning never giving a definitive answer.
And always keep people guessing.

Strategy people!!!

I know she said in an interview at some point that no one will ever know what her songs really mean unless she wants us to know.. ;) Maybe she's better at PR than we first expected lol

[PenguinHead]

I've often wondered if it's not so much that she changes the meanings, but that she changes which aspect of the meanings she chooses to talk to about. We know that many of her songs were written about more than one experience and/or person, so perhaps sometimes she feels more interested in discussing one aspect of a song's inspiration as opposed to another aspect. (Such as how she sometimes discusses the Tom & Jane Petty inspiration for "Edge," and sometimes she discusses the John Lennon/John Nicks aspect.)

That's an extremely good articulation of what I was getting at. I see no definitive subject/person in the way she writes her songs. The beauty of her impressionistic approach is that everyone can interpret them in their own way...like a photograph so rare, like a painting. In her liner note of the Enchanted, referring to her songs, she writes something like "I hope you find a message, an answer...you know I love that."
Clearly, there are many answers!

Sorry for the unintended derailment of this thread, which was started just about the song She Loves Him Still. But it sparked an interesting and thoughtful discussion about the inner-workings of Stevie's song craft.

[michelej1]

That's an extremely good articulation of what I was getting at. I see no definitive subject/person in the way she writes her songs. The beauty of her impressionistic approach is that everyone can interpret them in their own way...[I]

And she acknowledges that. She has laughed that everyone thinks Sara is about them and it actually is about several people she said, but probably not about all the people who think it is about them. And of course she has described how her father thought Landslide was about him and she didn't tell him it wasn't.

Michele

[HoursAndHours]

And she acknowledges that. She has laughed that everyone thinks Sara is about them and it actually is about several people she said, but probably not about all the people who think it is about them. And of course she has described how her father thought Landslide was about him and she didn't tell him it wasn't.

Michele

It would be neat if, as part of - or an alternative to - her memoir/autobiography, she instead published the lyrics to each song she's released, and explained all the different things the song was about.

[michelej1]

It would be neat if, as part of - or an alternative to - her memoir/autobiography, she instead published the lyrics to each song she's released, and explained all the different things the song was about.

If she can remember. It amused me no end when, as much as Stevie likes to talk, Courtney Love just talks even more than she does and wore poor Stevie out until she just had to wave her white flag, "You know what, Courtney? I don’t really know what "Gold Dust Woman" is about."

You keep asking Stevie enough questions about a song, verse by verse and she'll just give up. It's about drugs or sex or I don't know, leave me alone. It's like going to the optometrist and he keeps asking you which lens is better and finally you don't even care if you can read or even see, anymore. "Just give me some glasses and let me leave. I don't care."

Michele

[bombaysaffires]

If she can remember. It amused me no end when, as much as Stevie likes to talk, Courtney Love just talks even more than she does and wore poor Stevie out until she just had to wave her white flag, "You know what, Courtney? I don’t really know what "Gold Dust Woman" is about."

You keep asking Stevie enough questions about a song, verse by verse and she'll just give up. It's about drugs or sex or I don't know, leave me alone. It's like going to the optometrist and he keeps asking you which lens is better and finally you don't even care if you can read or even see, anymore. "Just give me some glasses and let me leave. I don't care."

Michele

and honestly much of the time I bet she really doesn't know. Writers always report that words just come to them and they just write them down. Stevie has said that a bunch of times it's like something/someone is speaking through her and she just writes the words that seem to be coming to her from somewhere. And that she doesn't question it. So I think part of it is she doesn't want to over analyze a lot of the lyrics because she doesn't want to jinx herself. And then she just explains them in whatever way suits her at the time.

[DauphineMarie]

and honestly much of the time I bet she really doesn't know. Writers always report that words just come to them and they just write them down. Stevie has said that a bunch of times it's like something/someone is speaking through her and she just writes the words that seem to be coming to her from somewhere. And that she doesn't question it. So I think part of it is she doesn't want to over analyze a lot of the lyrics because she doesn't want to jinx herself. And then she just explains them in whatever way suits her at the time.

I know that as a song writer, I will look back at songs I've written from even two years, and say "lol what is this even about was I drunk" and then looking back on it, it will have a different meaning than when I wrote it. Because a song is more than just words; it's a feeling and emotion, and the words just act as a vessel for your own feelings and interpretations. Take a line I've written - "The only thing between us is you, and me, and the other ones you're too afraid to mention" It sounds like it's about a romance, right? Well I thought so too when I wrote it. Looking back on it, the whole song is not really romantic, it's more of a sorrowful retrospective about an old friend. But (actually looking at what I wrote right now lol) it really does seem like a romance. So I can honestly say I have no idea what it's about, and my journal entry from that day says "nothing happened and I want to cry." wtf I have no idea why I am sharing this with you I just can understand her not knowing what something is about from over 30 years ago because I can't even remember what I wrote like less than a year ago haha

[michelej1]

I know that as a song writer, I will look back at songs I've written from even two years, and say "lol what is this even about was I drunk" and then looking back on it, it will have a different meaning than when I wrote it.

True, like what she said about Angel. It had a meaning, which wasn't readily apparent to her when she wrote it.

Michele

[michelej1]

And you know, I think we realize things about ourselves on a subconscious level, that we don't actually know until later. It's like Stevie said she must be psychic because she wrote Rose Garden before she was even rich, but I don't think it's seeing into the future, so much as seeing into the psych. You have patterns and I don't think you always see them until you mature. So, you write things and you kind of grow into the true meaning of what you wrote -- or it eventually means something different as your life changes.

It's not unlike Lindsey saying he'd been drawing that image of the old man for years and now he is beginning to think that man is him. Frankly, I think the man is more Ben Franklin than LB, but whatever....

Michele

[PenguinHead]

If she can remember. It amused me no end when, as much as Stevie likes to talk, Courtney Love just talks even more than she does and wore poor Stevie out until she just had to wave her white flag, "You know what, Courtney? I don’t really know what "Gold Dust Woman" is about."

You keep asking Stevie enough questions about a song, verse by verse and she'll just give up. It's about drugs or sex or I don't know, leave me alone. It's like going to the optometrist and he keeps asking you which lens is better and finally you don't even care if you can read or even see, anymore. "Just give me some glasses and let me leave. I don't care."

Michele

Some don't really understand Stevie's limitations. It's a great idea, but she isn't the type of artist who could pulled that off with any amount of integrity. A super smart artist like Elvis Costello could to that, but Stevie doesn't have that kind of acumen; I'm not inferring that she's dumb, but she lacks that level of intellect . That's why I don't welcome an autobiography ( which would need a co-writer). I rather have a biography written by an established biography writer who's known for doing thorough research. That's the only way we're going to get objectivity and real story. Sadly, the only time this will likely happen when she's an invalid or when she's dead.