Obama Getting Americans Hooked On 'Crack Cocaine' Of Health Care Dependency [Archive]

HejiraNYC

10-01-2013, 12:28 PM

I happen to agree with what Michele Bachmann is saying. She makes sense. And contrary to what Obama said yesterday, it's actually he and Harry Reid who are mainly responsible for having the government shut down.

“Because, once they enroll millions of more individual Americans, it will be virtually impossible for us to pull these benefits back from people,” the congresswoman explained.

Michele Bachmann is so stupid that she let slip the GOP game plan in that quote: to delay Obamacare implementation so that they will have time to kill it before it gets a chance to be implemented. Um... so what exactly did she say that makes sense to you? She is throwing up that tired old canard about "private information." Or that people will "suffer." Oh please. The only people potentially suffering are corporate CEOs who worry that their bonuses will be only $100 million instead of $125 million. And what exactly has been the awful fallout of the U.S. interception of phone records and emails? Excuses, excuses...

We aren't talking about giving iPads to the poor. This is a matter of life and death. Prosperity vs. destitution. The ability for people to ensure the wellbeing of their families. It takes a seriously evil person to want to "pull these benefits back from people."

QueenStevie

10-01-2013, 12:48 PM

louielouie2000

10-01-2013, 01:46 PM

it's actually he and Harry Reid who are mainly responsible for having the government shut down.

I don't see how you figure that- The Affordable Care Act was passed by Congress, the Senate, and was signed into law by the President. Activist Republicans in the House are trying to pull the rug out from under something they themselves already agreed to; a law which was upheld by the Supreme Court. House Republicans had their turn to kill/modify the bill before it was signed into law, and they didn't. Instead they're resorting to fiscally unsafe, and quite frankly, underhanded tactics to try & bully their way out of a deal. Says a lot about that party's ethics, to be honest. Pretty much any time there has EVER been a government shutdown, it's because the Republican party has renegged on a deal at the last minute, and suddenly want to rewrite the rules. It's the 21st Century... the Republican party can't keep behaving in this fashion- the world's too transparent, now. They're in serious danger of writing their own epitaph.

HejiraNYC

10-01-2013, 02:27 PM

Government does NOT owe ANYONE healthcare! It's NOT a right! It's NOT the responsibility of the government to provide healthcare for all! Everyone should be responsible for his or her OWN well-being! Obamacare is SOCIALIZED medicine, but the US isn't a socialized country last time I checked!

Here's a suggestion: Try turning off the Faux News Channel and try reading up on the law before you pass judgment. It is not socialized medicine. It is not government-provided healthcare. It is healthcare reform that leaves private insurers in place and allows people to pick and choose the healthcare coverage they need. The government provides subsidies only if you qualify and ask for it. Quit trying to paint it as something that it is not.

louielouie2000

10-01-2013, 02:36 PM

Here's a suggestion: Try turning off the Faux News Channel and try reading up on the law before you pass judgment. It is not socialized medicine. It is not government-provided healthcare. It is healthcare reform that leaves private insurers in place and allows people to pick and choose the healthcare coverage they need. The government provides subsidies only if you qualify and ask for it. Quit trying to paint it as something that it is not.

Exactly. Government doesn't technically "owe" us access to clean air, drinking water, and safe food, either. But we pass these type provisions anyway since we're an advanced nation.

QueenStevie

10-01-2013, 03:14 PM

Exactly. Government doesn't technically "owe" us access to clean air, drinking water, and safe food, either. But we pass these type provisions anyway since we're an advanced nation.

Healthcare shouldn't be grouped together with clean air, drinking water, and safe food because it's completely different from them!

HejiraNYC

10-01-2013, 10:34 PM

Healthcare shouldn't be grouped together with clean air, drinking water, and safe food because it's completely different from them!

Um... food and drugs are both regulated by the same agency (FDA), which is a division of an even larger government agency, the Health and Human Services (headed by Kathleen Sebelius). Safe food, safe medicine and sound health policy ARE grouped together whether you like it or not. :rolleyes:

Macfanforever

10-02-2013, 12:43 AM

I dont know much about Michele Bachmann but I want to make sure they keep inspecting my food before I eat it.

I pay for my water which includes the sewer service.It better be safe to wash and drink.

TV talk and radio talk shows could fill a dump truck with BS with a pay loader.

QueenStevie

10-02-2013, 01:32 AM

Um... food and drugs are both regulated by the same agency (FDA), which is a division of an even larger government agency, the Health and Human Services (headed by Kathleen Sebelius). Safe food, safe medicine and sound health policy ARE grouped together whether you like it or not. :rolleyes:

What I meant was this: They're completely different because healthcare is an internal matter, having to do with a person being able to have total control over his or her own body, whereas clean air, drinking water, and safe food are externals that one person cannot have total control over.

louielouie2000

10-02-2013, 08:10 AM

What I meant was this: They're completely different because healthcare is an internal matter, having to do with a person being able to have total control over his or her own body, whereas clean air, drinking water, and safe food are externals that one person cannot have total control over.

You could really argue against that. There would probably be some radical people who feel only those who can afford clean drinking water & safe food should have access to these things. If they can't afford them, they should just work harder. :p

MikeInNV

10-02-2013, 08:16 AM

You could really argue against that. There would probably be some radical people who feel only those who can afford clean drinking water & safe food should have access to these things. If they can't afford them, they should just work harder. :p

Not to mention that the quality of your food, air, and water directly impacts your health, so therefore none of us have "total control" over our own bodies.

QueenStevie

10-02-2013, 11:39 AM

Not to mention that the quality of your food, air, and water directly impacts your health, so therefore none of us have "total control" over our own bodies.

We actually DO have total control over our own bodies!

chiliD

10-02-2013, 12:54 PM

We actually DO have total control over our own bodies!

You're delusional if you really believe that. :shocked:

Try getting an abortion in Mississippi or Alabama. No control over your own body in those states. Try getting an organ transplant in a Catholic run hospital...ain't gonna happen. :eek:

Silver23

10-02-2013, 02:38 PM

We actually DO have total control over our own bodies!

Factors that people cannot control include air pollution, chemicals in both food and cosmetics, and poor working/living conditions. (Take for example, the factory collapse in Bangladesh).

I mean, in an ideal world, people would have total control over their bodies, but that clearly isn't true. Anyone could end up with diabetes, cancer, or in a horrible accident that they didn't cause.

becca

10-02-2013, 02:56 PM

I know people who do and don't like the Affordable Care Act. I asked some who don't if they found any comfort/fellowship in this sort of 'protest' of it by suddenly after not working on the main job making delay of it a condition for finally doing that job. I try to see something good in things usually. Apparently they are just mad at both sides now is all. The tea party people were saying for years they would shut down things and I don't see why they are not owning what they have now achieved. Perhaps Obama has some blame in meeting past extortion style demands, rewarding that sort of rule breaking?

I see one side with an ever growing list of hated enemies and see little future to them. I also see some sensible and non-extreme Republicans and hope they begin to get more attention instead of the stunt obsessed and name-calling reckless younger types. :(

becca

10-02-2013, 03:06 PM

Abortion: I am against it for the most part, but the best people to make the decisions are the people directly involved and trained and informed doctors, not politicians. It should be available, but so should all the birth control methods to avoid such drastic situations from happening in the first place as much as possible. There should be limitations on abortion that are wide enough and broad-based in wisdom but past that it should be about health and not religious ideas.

Talk about the government being involved in your health care; it seems like the religious fanatics among the politicians are the main ones actually doing that! Freedom seems to be a very subjective thing for some. Some in their extremism do not want to 'allow' anything for abortion, nor same-sex marriage and parenting, but then want even the mentally insane to have military weaponry in civilian neighborhoods (for safety of all things, maybe they should consider the sacred fetus could possibly be shot as well?).

May God grant a renewed balance to my closest neighbor! :)

QueenStevie

10-04-2013, 10:56 PM

More and more people are blaming (Obama and) Harry Reid, who has been called "COLD-hearted" by conservatives in the news media! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3acr9OfFhTg

redbird

10-05-2013, 02:47 PM

There needs to be a nation-wide "Ignore" button for Michele Bachmann. Woman is frightening.

becca

10-05-2013, 03:43 PM

There needs to be a nation-wide "Ignore" button for Michele Bachmann. Woman is frightening.

Agreed, but i saw some recent ratings thing saying Fox (which has these tea party talking heads on the most) was still the most watched 'news' channel. :shrug:

Can you imagine deliberately, knowingly, getting your information from a source that leaves out half the info most of the time? I saw through Limbaugh and Michael Moore ages ago and would be very careful about any info I got through either. Sadly there are more and more of these half-truth manufactured outrage merchants in the U.S. than ever, I think at one time such things were against FCC regulations. I suppose this is a case where throwing away regulations (that took years of hard experience to show the need to create) did stimulate the economy (Limbaugh makes around 50 million a year last I heard) but the price to the public I think has been too steep.

redbird

10-05-2013, 05:31 PM

For me the only way to approach news is going to many sources as possible and then thinking through the differences and similarities in reporting for myself. Anyway I get most of my news online now, cable news is too vulnerable to the requirements of ratings to not get annoying at some point or other. Maybe it stimulates the industry economically but it also creates an arms race of sensationalism that nobody wins, and yes I agree the responsibility to the public that the media is supposed to have trumps that. Journalism in general isn't the cash cow that's going to save the country anyway.

KarmaContestant

10-08-2013, 02:27 PM

I'm just gonna say it. The mandate to purchase health insurance sucks. I know it does. If you don't have insurance and you are suddenly faced with the prospect of buying it, it's scary, expensive and overwhelming and it would be easier to go back to the status quo.

No.

The status quo is what got us here.

I have employer provided coverage, though they pay only a portion and I pay a portion. Year after year after year, the premiums go up. Sometimes that increase is mine to shoulder, and sometimes my employer covers it. My plan is over $7K annually. These constant increases in price are *the direct result* of increases in the cost of healthcare. The increases in costs of healthcare are the direct result of *two* things: greed, and the uninsured mooching off the system by getting their sore throats and ankle spraigns checked out in hospital ER rooms.

We might not be able to stop greed, but we can stop people from being unisured.

Now, let's not forget, almost everyone, universally, who supports the ACA was probably in favor of a universal, single-payer program covered by taxes. Medicare, for everyone. It would have been perfect. It's what other countries do, it works, and with the proper regulations it can control costs. But oh no, Conservatives in this great nation opposed that - it's too expensive, it will never work, it's Hillarycare, no one wants a government nanny, lines will be long, care will be rationed, there will be death panels - every dishonest, outright false fear tactic in the book was used to prevent an expandsion of Medicare for all from coming into being. Conservatives had a better idea - it's about *personal responsibility* they said. It's a private marketplace - lets keep it that way, they said. Let's just enact a mandate to purchase health insurance, they said, and costs will come down. They even did it in Massachusetts, with a Republican governor who called it his 'landmark' and 'career defining' legislation.

So that's what happened. The conservative right got what they wanted. They fought tooth and nail to make sure Americans did not get a socialized medical insurance plan that covered *all* Americans. They wanted the mandate, and now they've got it. They wanted their cake, and to eat it too.

Enjoy. I'm sure it's delicious. :thumbsup:

ironman_01701

10-08-2013, 02:59 PM

Insurance companies suck, all of them, they win when your healthy and when your sick --- now that everyone must pay them.

Get rid of companies that profit from illness.

As long as Insurance company lobbyist are allowed to control ($$$) both houses of congress, you will not control health costs.

Major tax reform is needed to get rid of this corrupt economy.

We got the best government (members of Congress) that money can buy.

Jondalar

10-08-2013, 07:04 PM

There needs to be a nation-wide "Ignore" button for Michele Bachmann. Woman is frightening.

Do you remember the movie Network with Faye Dunaway? She reminds me of the crazy anchorman who kills himself on air. She is someone who I know wants End of Days...

chiliD

10-09-2013, 12:17 PM

What the Tea Baggers are doing is downright TREASON. They all should be arrested, tried (and obviously convicted), then SHOT!! :mad:

Macfanforever

10-09-2013, 12:41 PM

As I was talking to a friend the other night. As he said .Probably with the mandate.They want to get rid of all the freeloaders out of the hospital emergency rooms and Doctors offices because of they are costing millions to the medical system and the state tax payers to pay their way.

I can see where he was coming from on that.

QueenStevie

10-09-2013, 01:06 PM

IMPEACHABLE, Spiteful Obama and his Spite House! -- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipCU-Wx_woM

Macfanforever

10-09-2013, 01:36 PM

I know this forum is not a place to discuss hot topics like politic but term limits across the board for all elected officials. This will clean up these stalemate career politicians which been in office for a life time.

Also it seems like when the first week of November everybodies brain goes blank when they vote.

Impeach the president .That will never happen.unless he/she pulled some serious BS.

At this point I dont want to be in Pres Obama's shoes dealing with the BS going on down there.

At this point I figure they would of iron this budget crisis shutdown out by now.Now they have the debt ceiling coming up to deal with.

QueenStevie

10-09-2013, 02:33 PM

Impeach the president .That will never happen.unless he/she pulled some serious BS.

What do you mean, "unless he/she pulled some serious BS"?!?!?! News for you and anyone else in denial or with an abnormally high tolerance for Obama's BS: Obama ALREADY has had one too many REAL, SERIOUS SCANDALS that make him IMPEACHABLE! Obama's the WORST U.S. President in history, OVERTAKING Jimmy Carter now!

diane_k

10-09-2013, 03:36 PM

RockawayBlind

10-09-2013, 03:39 PM

Usually it helps to understand what words mean. Obamacare is not socialized medicine, and that's not even close to the point. Saying the US is not a "socialized" country is a baffling statement. Every country is a "socialized" country, so long as it consists of a society.

Also, conservatives calling anyone on the other side "cold-hearted" is a total laugh. I don't like Harry Reid, and he may well be cold-hearted, but his heart has got to be at least a few degrees warmer than those people who would deny health care to the neediest in this country.

Obamacare is problematic. It gives too much to the insurance companies -- it is a Republican plan, after all -- but it does correct some gross injustices of the past, such as denying coverage to people with pre-existing conditions. Holding the country hostage over a law that is already in effect is akin to taking your ball home after the other team repeatedly scores against you.

What's even more egregious here is that a group of 30 or so backward, head-up-the-ass yahoos from districts gerrymandered specifically to leave out blacks, assorted minorities and Democrats are holding the country hostage. It shows just how screwed up this country would be if these types of people ever got into the White House or took full control of Congress. As much as they claim to represent "real" Americans, these people represent the worst of America.

Dove

10-09-2013, 04:34 PM

You're delusional if you really believe that. :shocked:

Try getting an abortion in Mississippi or Alabama. No control over your own body in those states. Try getting an organ transplant in a Catholic run hospital...ain't gonna happen. :eek:

If I may, I'd just like to point something out.

Yes people have control over their own bodies. If I were to reach out and smack you in the head for being a loon, that's 100% my doing and no one else. That was a bit of sarcasm, but you see my point.

Also, I believe that people should be allowed to do what they wish when it comes to abortions/organ transplants/etc. but...you KNOW that the majority of Catholics are against abortion/organ transplants so WHY go to a Catholic hospital to get one? That's equivalent to walking into a gay pride parade and announcing how much you want to see gay marriage outlawed..People that complain about abortion being illegal can very well go find somewhere where it is legal and get it done.

As for Michelle Bachman, she's simply using her right to free speech, just as all of us are doing right now. People should cut her some slack. Just because you don't agree with someone doesn't make them dangerous.

Just my two cents! :)

Dove

10-09-2013, 04:48 PM

olive

10-09-2013, 08:22 PM

I Love My President !

RockawayBlind

10-09-2013, 10:04 PM

but...you KNOW that the majority of Catholics are against abortion/organ transplants so WHY go to a Catholic hospital to get one?

Wrong. Polls consistently show that at least 50 percent to 55 percent of US Catholics favor abortion rights, though not necessarily in all cases. So you are way overstating something.

The Catholic Church, as part of its pro-life stance, actually favors organ donation as an act of charity. Remember, the Church is big on charity. Catholics favor organ donation by a factor of two to one. So there too you overstated something.

And let's not forget that more than 90 percent of Catholic women use contraception, in contravention of Church doctrine.

chiliD

10-09-2013, 10:55 PM

What do you mean, "unless he/she pulled some serious BS"?!?!?! News for you and anyone else in denial or with an abnormally high tolerance for Obama's BS: Obama ALREADY has had one too many REAL, SERIOUS SCANDALS that make him IMPEACHABLE! Obama's the WORST U.S. President in history, OVERTAKING Jimmy Carter now!

F off with your crap.

Look what has happened to this country since Bill Clinton's successor took over. He & his facist 8 year regime. #45 ruined the country...& I don't really think it was #45 POTUS, but his VP, his cabinet & advisors ran roughshod over him and basically propped his Alfred E Newman A$$ up as a marionette in front of the cameras. IT was all the behind the scenes stuff that sold this country down the river. From "World Superpower" to subservient nation to the Corporate dollar. Karl Rove, The Koch Brothers, et al, should be tried & executed for what they've done & continue to do to this country. And, their mouthpiece Fox News should be shut down.

Stop with the FOX (UN)NEW Rhetoric and research the REAL state of the union. You're just spewing the same bulls**t Tea Party crap. Don't be a Fox News Lemming.

****, even for being a bunch of "good ol' boys" all NASCAR does is make left turns.

vivfox

10-09-2013, 11:25 PM

Holding the country hostage over a law that is already in effect is akin to taking your ball home after the other team repeatedly scores against you.

This makes no sense.

QueenStevie

10-09-2013, 11:56 PM

F off with your crap.

Look what has happened to this country since Bill Clinton's successor took over. He & his facist 8 year regime. #45 ruined the country...& I don't really think it was #45 POTUS, but his VP, his cabinet & advisors ran roughshod over him and basically propped his Alfred E Newman A$$ up as a marionette in front of the cameras. IT was all the behind the scenes stuff that sold this country down the river. From "World Superpower" to subservient nation to the Corporate dollar. Karl Rove, The Koch Brothers, et al, should be tried & executed for what they've done & continue to do to this country. And, their mouthpiece Fox News should be shut down.

Stop with the FOX (UN)NEW Rhetoric and research the REAL state of the union. You're just spewing the same bulls**t Tea Party crap. Don't be a Fox News Lemming.

****, even for being a bunch of "good ol' boys" all NASCAR does is make left turns.

You make sensible people laugh! :lol: -- You JUST CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH! :lol:

Sapphire Girl

10-10-2013, 12:33 AM

F off with your crap.

Look what has happened to this country since Bill Clinton's successor took over. He & his facist 8 year regime. #45 ruined the country...& I don't really think it was #45 POTUS, but his VP, his cabinet & advisors ran roughshod over him and basically propped his Alfred E Newman A$$ up as a marionette in front of the cameras. IT was all the behind the scenes stuff that sold this country down the river. From "World Superpower" to subservient nation to the Corporate dollar. Karl Rove, The Koch Brothers, et al, should be tried & executed for what they've done & continue to do to this country. And, their mouthpiece Fox News should be shut down.
Stop with the FOX (UN)NEW Rhetoric and research the REAL state of the union. You're just spewing the same bulls**t Tea Party crap. Don't be a Fox News Lemming.

****, even for being a bunch of "good ol' boys" all NASCAR does is make left turns.

Of course. Then all the press conferences can go like this--

Pres Obama: I can now take some questions. You there.
MSNBC reporter: Mr. President, do you like to eat arugula?
Pres Obama: Yes. Yes, I like to eat arugula. Next question.
CNBC reporter: Mr. President, do you like to play golf?
Pres Obama: Yes. Yes, I do like to play golf. Sorry, but that's all I have time for.

diane_k

10-10-2013, 08:09 AM

This makes no sense.

It means being a sore loser. The worst kind of loser.

diane_k

10-10-2013, 08:12 AM

You make sensible people laugh! :lol: -- You JUST CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH! :lol:

It's embarrassing how far the tea baggers have come. On so little! You do know there were THIRTEEN Benghazi-like attacks during the Dubya years. Where is your outcry for those lost souls?

RockawayBlind

10-10-2013, 09:17 AM

This makes no sense.

What puzzles you about it?

RockawayBlind

10-10-2013, 09:19 AM

CNBC reporter: Mr. President, do you like to play golf?
Pres Obama: Yes. Yes, I do like to play golf. Sorry, but that's all I have time for.

Uh, you do realize CNBC is actually very pro-business and by and large filled with conservatives, right?

RockawayBlind

10-10-2013, 09:35 AM

It's embarrassing how far the tea baggers have come. On so little! You do know there were THIRTEEN Benghazi-like attacks during the Dubya years. Where is your outcry for those lost souls?

Diane, something you need to understand about Tea Partiers: They don't understand facts. They don't believe in evolution, science is a hoax and the mirrors they look into are programmed to show princes and princesses.

Remember, now, this is the same crowd that convinced itself Obama was going to lose badly against Romney, that all the polls that showed Obama was leading were wrong for some reason, that when Ohio was called for Obama (effectively guaranteeing his reelection) they couldn't believe it. They are now convincing themselves Obama, whom they hate so much, created the current situation, but the facts don't bear that out.

The funny thing is some of those delusional people, like Karl Rove, have actually come around. They are now trying to figure out how to slay the monster they created with the know-nothing tea partiers.

Look, you have to choose to be informed in this society where information hits you so fast and from so many places that it makes you dizzy. And if you choose to be informed, you learn, for instance, that a few string-pullers in the Republican Party planned this shutdown for months. It's fact and it's documented. You learn that Democrats gave in on budgeting demands from tea partiers. It's fact and it's document. That this battle started two weeks ago over Obamacare and now has morphed into a battle about the debt ceiling. Again, fact and documented.

Thankfully the tea party adherents, who claim they would have us go back to the 1950s (though what they really mean is pre-civil war times) would have us do away with work safety protections, kill the EPA, reverse civil rights legislation and send everybody who disagrees with them "back to where they came from." They want their country back, they say. The funny thing is, it's not their country. Never was, never will be. America has set an example to the world in bringing lots of different cultures together, melding those cultures, and for the most part succeeding in living peacefully with each other. Tea partiers aren't interested in that. When they claim Obama is racist, for instance, they are looking at one of those special mirrors I mentioned earlier.

It's a perplexing thing, and I fear the only way to solve this issue is going to through some kind of ugly struggle... and the tea partiers will be the first ones to take their guns out.

diane_k

10-10-2013, 09:46 AM

Diane, something you need to understand about Tea Partiers: They don't understand facts. They don't believe in evolution, science is a hoax and the mirrors they look into are programmed to show princes and princesses.

Remember, now, this is the same crowd that convinced itself Obama was going to lose badly against Romney, that all the polls that showed Obama was leading were wrong for some reason, that when Ohio was called for Obama (effectively guaranteeing his reelection) they couldn't believe it. They are now convincing themselves Obama, whom they hate so much, created the current situation, but the facts don't bear that out.

The funny thing is some of those delusional people, like Karl Rove, have actually come around. They are now trying to figure out how to slay the monster they created with the know-nothing tea partiers.

Look, you have to choose to be informed in this society where information hits you so fast and from so many places that it makes you dizzy. And if you choose to be informed, you learn, for instance, that a few string-pullers in the Republican Party planned this shutdown for months. It's fact and it's documented. You learn that Democrats gave in on budgeting demands from tea partiers. It's fact and it's document. That this battle started two weeks ago over Obamacare and now has morphed into a battle about the debt ceiling. Again, fact and documented.

Thankfully the tea party adherents, who claim they would have us go back to the 1950s (though what they really mean is pre-civil war times) would have us do away with work safety protections, kill the EPA, reverse civil rights legislation and send everybody who disagrees with them "back to where they came from." They want their country back, they say. The funny thing is, it's not their country. Never was, never will be. America has set an example to the world in bringing lots of different cultures together, melding those cultures, and for the most part succeeding in living peacefully with each other. Tea partiers aren't interested in that. When they claim Obama is racist, for instance, they are looking at one of those special mirrors I mentioned earlier.

It's a perplexing thing, and I fear the only way to solve this issue is going to through some kind of ugly struggle... and the tea partiers will be the first ones to take their guns out.

ALL true. And high f'ing five for putting it so well.

It's also fact that the majority of the TP comes from the fattest, reddest, poorest, most uneducated states in the Union. They follow the person that hollers the loudest, and unfortunately that has never really been a trait of logical people.

I'm really hoping that turtle in a suit (Mitch McConnell as he's known on the street) doesn't get far with taking the caps off of campaign spending limits. God only knows what could happen if the old rich men could throw in as much cash as they wanted. Of course, Sheldon Adelsson's (sp) plan for 2012 didn't really go the way he wanted, so maybe there's hope?

chiliD

10-10-2013, 10:20 AM

You make sensible people laugh! :lol: -- You JUST CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH! :lol:

I make most people laugh..it's what I do. But, to put yourself in that group of people described as "sensible" is the most laughable.

Ledge Moderators

10-10-2013, 01:14 PM

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JUST A NOTE: Heated discussion is most welcome, but personal attacks (name calling, insinuations) are NOT. Please limit debate to the issues.

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Sapphire Girl

10-10-2013, 01:38 PM

Who here has been successful in signing up on the $634 million ACA/Obamacare site aka www.trainwreck.gov?

WatchChain

10-10-2013, 08:09 PM

OK, we get it !! You HATE the man.

jwd

10-11-2013, 05:59 PM

It's also fact that the majority of the TP comes from the fattest, reddest, poorest, most uneducated states in the Union.

Well what are you bitching about Ms. K.? These fat people that you dislike so much! These are the people that you and your party cater to. The fat, lazy asses sitting on their couches all day with free health care, subsidized housing, and food stamps. The only time they do move is to spread their legs so they can produce another offspring that the rest of us can take care of. And this isn't restricted to any one part of the country, it's all over, even in your state Ms. K!

becca

10-11-2013, 09:36 PM

Well this went well. :shocked:

vivfox

10-11-2013, 11:33 PM

These are the people that you and your party cater to. The fat, lazy asses sitting on their couches all day with free health care, subsidized housing, and food stamps.

I feel sorry for you because you think with a venemous mind.

jwd

10-11-2013, 11:59 PM

I feel sorry for you because you think with a venemous mind.

I feel sorry for you because you think with a naive mind and can't differentiate between those who need and those who abuse.

louielouie2000

10-12-2013, 11:02 AM

Okay, folks... keep it to the issues or this thread will be closed.

vivfox

10-12-2013, 01:56 PM

Well what are you bitching about Ms. K.? These fat people that you dislike so much! These are the people that you and your party cater to. The fat, lazy asses sitting on their couches all day with free health care, subsidized housing, and food stamps. The only time they do move is to spread their legs so they can produce another offspring that the rest of us can take care of.

I'm trying to picture what these people look like in your mind. Can you please describe them in detail to me. Who are they? What people are you referring to?

Macfanforever

10-12-2013, 05:37 PM

I just got my copy of RollingStone mag in the mail today.

It looks like they got a good article in the National Affairs section about whats going on down there.

I dont know its available online.

Ill read it tonight.

jwd

10-13-2013, 11:33 AM

I'm trying to picture what these people look like in your mind. Can you please describe them in detail to me. Who are they? What people are you referring to?

I think this sums it up.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/jpIrJE_iuSQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

becca

10-13-2013, 02:03 PM

On topic here is the healthcare view from one provider Canada: I first started having a problem just before last Christmas, got on the waitlist to see specialist in January, saw him in April, then in May he decided it was too advanced for him and was put on the list to see another specialist. I saw him in late August and am now waiting for the call to have surgery. Meanwhile the problem is nearing on completely debilitating.

I think concerns about rationing and wait lists are legitimate. I do like that you have choices of providers though which we haven't had here since the early '70s in my part of Canada. I have in the past always had people asking about how they can move to Canada from the U.S. when they find out I am Canadian and am down there, usually they cited healthcare as a main reason, but then they often had ideas that things were covered that in fact aren't (like dental). Over time we have seen many procedures de-listed from what is covered, so in a way we are creeping towards s user pay two tier model.

My previous relationship was with an Alaskan man who was diagnosed with cancer and the costs involved despite having employer insurance was staggering to me and kept us from marrying as planned as I had health costs of my own. He was in the operating room within days of diagnosis however which speed amazed me, and in fact his surgeon was trained in Canada. It's all very complicated. I hope it becomes less political, that part is hard to follow as I know Romney originally promoted the same basic model of affordable care in Massachusetts and then later decided it was terrible for the whole country to have. Very confusing stuff that!

louielouie2000

10-13-2013, 04:50 PM

I think this sums it up.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/jpIrJE_iuSQ" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

The specter of Welfare leaches seems to be the single biggest fear & rallying cry of right wing folks. But have you ever actually known anyone on Welfare? I certainly haven't. :shrug:

Something most people don't know is that Welfare a.k.a. Temporary Assistance for Needy Families has a lifetime limit of 60 months, or 5 years. However, if someone has been on the program 24 months without finding employment, they are kicked out of the program. Some states restrict these programs much more. The moral of the story is: there aren't people who just live their entire lives on Welfare.

Macfanforever

10-13-2013, 06:08 PM

I never collected from any of those programs except for unemployment comp.

Some people beat the system and abuse it and get away with it and ruin it for the people that are really in need for it.

They are clamping down on those issues and limit the needs in some states like mentioned.

Note on that video.I thought I was fat.I got keep walking.

jwd

10-13-2013, 07:18 PM

The specter of Welfare leaches seems to be the single biggest fear & rallying cry of right wing folks. But have you ever actually known anyone on Welfare? I certainly haven't. :shrug:

Something most people don't know is that Welfare a.k.a. Temporary Assistance for Needy Families has a lifetime limit of 60 months, or 5 years. However, if someone has been on the program 24 months without finding employment, they are kicked out of the program. Some states restrict these programs much more. The moral of the story is: there aren't people who just live their entire lives on Welfare.

I most certainly do know of someone on welfare.

You speak of one program, there are many welfare programs. Some welfare statistics:

http://www.statisticbrain.com/welfare-statistics/

becca

10-14-2013, 01:58 PM

They used to do the divide and conquer thing in Canada too about cheats... there are always going to be some in any system, meanwhile while you're looking down at somebody somewhere scarpering with that $200 you won't be looking up at the ones getting the $2mill! :lol:

It's off topic though, I was kind of hoping to hear more about the affordable care act and experiences with it now it's arrived. I know some people who are putting off deciding what they will do. Hopefully any kinks will get worked out soon. I pay through the nose right now to get extended coverage for when I'm in the U.S., wonder if that would get better? It's even worse since I've had an existing condition (didn't even want to think about entering when it was undiagnosed) but now I'm not able to travel at all well anyway. Hope that will change too. :(