View Full Version : Question about the live albums
depp91
02-14-2013, 10:08 AM
Does anyone know if there were fixes, overdubs, etc. made to the recordings of the FM live albums in the studio before they were released?
If so, has anyone got further information?
I was listening to the live performance of Stand Back from The Chain box set and somehow it doesn't sound very live to me, especially the vocals. When you watch the Tango In The Night DVD it seems even more staged, with all those close-ups of Stevie, which I can't believe were really filmed at the concert itself...
TheWILDheart
02-14-2013, 11:02 AM
It's quite a well known fact that, at Stevie's insistence, most (if not all) of her TINT live vocals were over-dubbed, and her close-up's all reshot and edited in later. This is something that started with her Red Rocks live video as she was such a mess on stage due to being coked up that her close-up's HAD to be reshot. I'm not sure what made her reshoot her close ups for TINT. Probably because most of her facial expressions during this time looked like she was thinking "I DO NOT WANT TO BE HERE!".
Prior to this, I think the live recordings (live footage for the Tusk and Mirage videos, the Live (1980) album and Stevie's HBO special) had very little studio touch ups. It was only in the mid-late 80's that over-dubbing and reshooting became popular
Josh2003
02-14-2013, 11:20 AM
I'm pretty sure The Dance was *heavily* sweetened in the studio.
TheWILDheart
02-14-2013, 11:49 AM
I'm pretty sure The Dance was *heavily* sweetened in the studio.
Because "The Dance" was filmed at Warner Studios, I don't think it would've taken that much tweeking. Something like "Live In Boston" or the TINT video would've had more touch ups as they were just filmed at a standard concert venue, not one that is specifically set up for filming.
D.W-Suite
02-14-2013, 03:35 PM
The 1982 Mirage Tour special was edited slightly, though not overdubbed, just very lazily edited. Sisters of the Moon was spliced together from two seperate shows. You can see Lindsey's shirt strangely opens mid song. Also Eyes of the World was edited so that the 1st chorus and the 2nd chorus are actually one and the same.
Ulpian
02-14-2013, 03:41 PM
Because "The Dance" was filmed at Warner Studios, I don't think it would've taken that much tweeking. Something like "Live In Boston" or the TINT video would've had more touch ups as they were just filmed at a standard concert venue, not one that is specifically set up for filming.
The Dance needed a lot doing to it. If you look at articles around that time, Lindsey spent quite a lot of time in the studio on it. There was a fair bit of augmentation and re-recording of instruments and vocals. When Live in Boston came out, I remember him remarking that it would be far more raw than The Dance, which was intentionally very polished.
windbecame
02-14-2013, 03:47 PM
The 1982 Mirage Tour special was edited slightly, though not overdubbed, just very lazily edited. Sisters of the Moon was spliced together from two seperate shows. You can see Lindsey's shirt strangely opens mid song. Also Eyes of the World was edited so that the 1st chorus and the 2nd chorus are actually one and the same.
and Stevie's hair keeps changing in Blue Letter....:nod: LOL
KarmaContestant
02-14-2013, 04:00 PM
The Dance needed a lot doing to it. If you look at articles around that time, Lindsey spent quite a lot of time in the studio on it. There was a fair bit of augmentation and re-recording of instruments and vocals. When Live in Boston came out, I remember him remarking that it would be far more raw than The Dance, which was intentionally very polished.
This is no surprise. the Dance was also touted on the radio as a forthcoming album of "re-recorded classics" before it actually happened....and we got a live album, so I think recording the live show and polishing everything in the studio was the intent all along.
chiliD
02-14-2013, 04:31 PM
Does anyone know if there were fixes, overdubs, etc. made to the recordings of the FM live albums in the studio before they were released?
In a word....YES.
It's pretty much an industry standard that "Live" albums are "sweetened" in post-production.
Dave Mason's Certified Live was one of the first ones that "outted" the practice back in the late '70s. That was opening a can o' worms...pretty much every live album that had been released in the prior few years (and there were a whole lot of them at the time...that's the "era of the double live album") was then looked at (& listened to) with jaded eyes/ears...everything from Frampton Comes Alive onward was questioned as to its "authenticity" of "live-ness".
depp91
02-15-2013, 05:02 AM
Thanks for all your replies!!!!
I'd be really interested to see / hear the original recordings of Stevie at the TITN show... I guess I will now listen to some bootlegs of that tour to hear if her voice was really that bad during this period :D
Concerning The Dance, I'd never suspected they cleaned it up in the studio that much as some of you say. To me it doesn't sound very polished... but then again neither does Stevie's HBO concert - but I found this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SgJgVqI0ZY
I'm totally ok with editing live stuff, for example splicing two versions together to get the best performance. But I think I'm a bit sensitive to additional overdubs and rerecorded vocals. That's not live anymore at all.
It's probably because I'm also an Elvis Presley fan and all his live recordings that feature additional overdubs sound rather strange to me. His live albums were overdubbed as early as 1969, btw. So I guess it was common to do it even then. With so many EP collectors' releases available it's an easy thing to compare the originally recorded versions with their overdubbed counterparts, btw.
It would be great if we were able to do that for The Dance!
TheWILDheart
02-15-2013, 05:38 AM
Thanks for all your replies!!!!
I guess I will now listen to some bootlegs of that tour to hear if her voice was really that bad during this period :D
From everything I've heard, her voice wasn't too bad. Certainly better than her Rock A Little tour vocals. But she sounded quite flat a lot of the time. Mind you, I guess she was feeling pretty flat due to the klonopin.
seekerj
02-15-2013, 12:54 PM
Thanks for all your replies!!!!
I'd be really interested to see / hear the original recordings of Stevie at the TITN show... I guess I will now listen to some bootlegs of that tour to hear if her voice was really that bad during this period :D
Concerning The Dance, I'd never suspected they cleaned it up in the studio that much as some of you say. To me it doesn't sound very polished... but then again neither does Stevie's HBO concert - but I found this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SgJgVqI0ZY
I'm totally ok with editing live stuff, for example splicing two versions together to get the best performance. But I think I'm a bit sensitive to additional overdubs and rerecorded vocals. That's not live anymore at all.
It's probably because I'm also an Elvis Presley fan and all his live recordings that feature additional overdubs sound rather strange to me. His live albums were overdubbed as early as 1969, btw. So I guess it was common to do it even then. With so many EP collectors' releases available it's an easy thing to compare the originally recorded versions with their overdubbed counterparts, btw.
It would be great if we were able to do that for The Dance!
Really? The first time I heard The Dance, it sounded so fake. I remember saying to my brother "This sounds so wimpy.... this band didn't use to sound like this, and I have bootlegs to prove it". Then later when I was at the Hartford show (the first Dance show), they sounded so different than the Dance CD, so much more raw and edgey; it was so obvious after going to more shows just how "unlive" (dead?) that "The Dance" sounds.
Really? The first time I heard The Dance, it sounded so fake. I remember saying to my brother "This sounds so wimpy.... this band didn't use to sound like this, and I have bootlegs to prove it". Then later when I was at the Hartford show (the first Dance show), they sounded so different than the Dance CD, so much more raw and edgey; it was so obvious after going to more shows just how "unlive" (dead?) that "The Dance" sounds.
yup they tinkered with The Dance for months after recording it. the guy who was producing it with Lindsey described that when they were presenting Lindsey with Les Paul or whatever was one of the other awards he was given about a year ago.
compare that to the most recent Lindsey's One Man Show release that was put out within a month or so of the actual show, while LB was still on the same tour.
bombaysaffires
02-15-2013, 02:31 PM
but then again neither does Stevie's HBO concert - but I found this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SgJgVqI0ZY
Thanks for posting this link! To me Edge of 17 had some of the most obvious tweaks/overdubs of that whole concert, so it was fun to hear what the original sounded like.
Thanks for all your replies!!!!
... but then again neither does Stevie's HBO concert - but I found this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SgJgVqI0ZY
Man, this is so sad! But well, you can see it: Stevie is moving all the time, so her voice could change with some moves.
Sometimes I really don't know why they make those changes. I know sometimes the artists ask for it, but sometimes, with its "original" sound, a live version can be good too!
About The Dance, well, I listened to some radio broadcast (that included other songs that wer not released on the CD), but I couldn't hear any vocal change.
SteveMacD
02-15-2013, 08:29 PM
compare that to the most recent Lindsey's One Man Show release that was put out within a month or so of the actual show, while LB was still on the same tour.
Well, it doesn't take much tweaking when you're playing along to pre-recorded backing tracks. I was going to see him, but then I caught a live show on TV. If he had taken the Richard Thompson approach to an one man show (literally just a man and a guitar), I may have been interested.
Well, it doesn't take much tweaking when you're playing along to pre-recorded backing tracks. I was going to see him, but then I caught a live show on TV. If he had taken the Richard Thompson approach to an one man show (literally just a man and a guitar), I may have been interested.
what live show on tv? One Man Show was never on tv. it's not a DVD, or CD, just itunes download.
yeah he took his own unique approach with great results. but why do that when he could have done the same as everyone else touring solo acoustically these days, right? :p :rolleyes:
people's reaction and non-opened mind to Lindsey's One Man Show approach, without ever seeing or hearing it, has amazed me for a while now. at least you are not primarily a LB fan so i can understand your skepticism. :shrug:
WildHearted
02-15-2013, 08:52 PM
Well, it doesn't take much tweaking when you're playing along to pre-recorded backing tracks. I was going to see him, but then I caught a live show on TV. If he had taken the Richard Thompson approach to an one man show (literally just a man and a guitar), I may have been interested.
For most of the songs, he did. The only songs he used backing tracks for (if I recall correctly, anyway) were Stephanie and the electric songs like Come, I'm So Afraid, and GYOW.
Unless I'm having a memory lapse and he used them on all of them... I felt like the others were all just him and the acoustic.
For most of the songs, he did. The only songs he used backing tracks for (if I recall correctly, anyway) were Stephanie and the electric songs like Come, I'm So Afraid, and GYOW.
Unless I'm having a memory lapse and he used them on all of them... I felt like the others were all just him and the acoustic.
you are not having a memory lapse - just those 4.
bombaysaffires
02-15-2013, 09:20 PM
you are not having a memory lapse - just those 4.
why would he need a pre-recorded backing track for Stephanie??
olive
02-15-2013, 09:26 PM
In a word....YES.
It's pretty much an industry standard that "Live" albums are "sweetened" in post-production.
Dave Mason's Certified Live was one of the first ones that "outted" the practice back in the late '70s. That was opening a can o' worms...pretty much every live album that had been released in the prior few years (and there were a whole lot of them at the time...that's the "era of the double live album") was then looked at (& listened to) with jaded eyes/ears...everything from Frampton Comes Alive onward was questioned as to its "authenticity" of "live-ness".
According to peter criss the only thing live on KISS alive were the drums and Paul Stanles rsps everything else was done in the studio
why would he need a pre-recorded backing track for Stephanie??
idk. guess he wanted a bit layered guitar sound?
there is a thread with tons of live versions here http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showthread.php?t=50195&highlight=stephanie so you can draw your own conclusions. :shrug:
olive
02-15-2013, 09:29 PM
In a word....YES.
It's pretty much an industry standard that "Live" albums are "sweetened" in post-production.
Dave Mason's Certified Live was one of the first ones that "outted" the practice back in the late '70s. That was opening a can o' worms...pretty much every live album that had been released in the prior few years (and there were a whole lot of them at the time...that's the "era of the double live album") was then looked at (& listened to) with jaded eyes/ears...ever
ything from Frampton Comes Alive onward was questioned as to its "authenticity" of "live-ness".
According to peter criss the only thing live on KISS alive were the drums and Paul Stanley'
s raps everything else was done in the studio
olive
02-15-2013, 09:31 PM
In a word....YES.
It's pretty much an industry standard that "Live" albums are "sweetened" in post-production.
Dave Mason's Certified Live was one of the first ones that "outted" the practice back in the late '70s. That was opening a can o' worms...pretty much every live album that had been released in the prior few years (and there were a whole lot of them at the time...that's the "era of the double live album") was then looked at (& listened to) with jaded eyes/ears...ever
ything from Frampton Comes Alive onward was questioned as to its "authenticity" of "live-ness".
According to peter criss the only thing live on KISS alive were the drums and Paul Stanley'
s raps everything else was done in the studio it's so horrible they had to rerecord everything
SteveMacD
02-15-2013, 10:58 PM
what live show on tv? One Man Show was never on tv. it's not a DVD, or CD, just itunes download.
My bad. It was the show they play on Palladia (which I had to turn off when the canned backing vocals for "Down On Rodeo" came on). However, I have seen YouTube clips from the One Man shows.
yeah he took his own unique approach with great results.
I would hardly call using canned backing music and vocals a "unique approach". At best, it's glorified karaoke. Now, Lindsey USED to be great at completely rearranging his songs and turning them into something unique, like "Big Love" and "Go Insane".
but why do that when he could have done the same as everyone else touring solo acoustically these days, right?
Find me somebody who can do what Richard Thompson does, and we'll talk.
people's reaction and non-opened mind to Lindsey's One Man Show approach, without ever seeing or hearing it, has amazed me for a while now. at least you are not primarily a LB fan so i can understand your skepticism. :shrug:
No, but I am a guitarist, and I work for an legendary indie rock band. The perfection that Fleetwood Mac seeks only makes them less relevant.
Lindsfan
02-15-2013, 11:38 PM
why would he need a pre-recorded backing track for Stephanie??
idk. guess he wanted a bit layered guitar sound?
He doesn't need it. He likes it, for the reason Elle mentioned. That's not a surprise. He likes his songs, even live, to sound just the way he likes them to sound. I, for one, am happy with the results. Stephanie sounded awesome, and the electric stuff with the backing tracks were incredible. I was wondering how they'd sound, when I heard about him doing that, but I liked the effect. Obviously people have different tastes, so it's not for everyone, but Lindsey's mentioned that too. That his music isn't for the masses, but rather for those who get it. I'm glad I get it :D
redtulip
02-15-2013, 11:45 PM
He doesn't need it. He likes it, for the reason Elle mentioned. That's not a surprise. He likes his songs, even live, to sound just the way he likes them to sound. I, for one, am happy with the results. Stephanie sounded awesome, and the electric stuff with the backing tracks were incredible. I was wondering how they'd sound, when I heard about him doing that, but I liked the effect. Obviously people have different tastes, so it's not for everyone, but Lindsey's mentioned that too. That his music isn't for the masses, but rather for those who get it. I'm glad I get it :D
I'm glad I get it too, because OMS ISA is amazing and I don't want to hear it with a band anymore. That backing track is sublime.
My bad. It was the show they play on Palladia (which I had to turn off when the canned backing vocals for "Down On Rodeo" came on). However, I have seen YouTube clips from the One Man shows.
lol. they've been playing Songs From The Small Machine Live In LA regularly on Palladia. even as a non-guitarist who doesn't work for any legendary band i can see there are 4 people on stage there, not one man and a guitar. :shrug: :angel:
and also, even as a non-guitarist i can hear there's no Rodeo there. ;)
but maybe you are talking about Soundstage from 2004? you can check the discussion in this thread http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showthread.php?t=51232 to learn about LB's different live albums and the range of opinions people have about them. please feel free to jump in there (if you ever consider worthy taking some of your precious time to take a listen to any of them ;) ).
there are some youtube clips of non-rehearsed acoustic versions of Down on Rodeo from last 3 tours without anything canned or pre-recorded. i think it's gorgeous but we all do enjoy different things. :)
SteveMacD
02-15-2013, 11:49 PM
He doesn't need it. He likes it, for the reason Elle mentioned. That's not a surprise. He likes his songs, even live, to sound just the way he likes them to sound. I, for one, am happy with the results. Stephanie sounded awesome, and the electric stuff with the backing tracks were incredible. I was wondering how they'd sound, when I heard about him doing that, but I liked the effect. Obviously people have different tastes, so it's not for everyone, but Lindsey's mentioned that too. That his music isn't for the masses, but rather for those who get it. I'm glad I get it :D
Those are two different things, though. I like his music and consider him one of the great guitarists AND I want a completely live show. I'd gladly pay to see him if he didn't use pre-recorded backing tracks or have a bunch of psychobabble for stage bantar. It kind of kills me that he's taking this route for his live shows.
redtulip
02-15-2013, 11:53 PM
Those are two different things, though. I like his music and consider him one of the great guitarists AND I want a completely live show. I'd gladly pay to see him if he didn't use pre-recorded backing tracks or have a bunch of psychobabble for stage bantar. It kind of kills me that he's taking this route for his live shows.
Only 4 songs out of 13 had a backing track. And I think the only one with vocals was GYOW. You didn't even see one show so I'm not sure how you can come to the conclusion it was so awful.
Those are two different things, though. I like his music and consider him one of the great guitarists AND I want a completely live show. I'd gladly pay to see him if he didn't use pre-recorded backing tracks or have a bunch of psychobabble for stage bantar. It kind of kills me that he's taking this route for his live shows.
i'll say to you what i said to everybody that kept giving the same spiel you are now before they actually experienced OMS - those are assumptions, and unless you experienced in person either one of the OMS shows or listened to OMS recording, i can't take your opinion on this as relevant. i have heard too many people saying very similar things as you are saying now and doing 180 when they actually saw the show.
now when people have heard the show and tell me they didn't like it, i respect their opinion. not everyone will like it - of course.
i don't understand how someone can say "i consider him one of the greatest guitarists" and not willing to hear live what he came up with before offering half-informed opinions and criticisms. but you are not the only one. :shrug:
michelej1
02-16-2013, 12:08 AM
Those are two different things, though. I like his music and consider him one of the great guitarists AND I want a completely live show. I'd gladly pay to see him if he didn't use pre-recorded backing tracks or have a bunch of psychobabble for stage bantar. It kind of kills me that he's taking this route for his live shows.
This One Man Show is my least favorite tour of his. Since I wouldn't mind a purely acoustic show myself your suggestion is one I'd endorse, but as far as the psychobabble goes, all told he probably spends 5 minutes top on his song introductions combined, so I don't know why that would keep you away from a concert. It's not like the talk goes on forever, nor does he comment prior to each song. Just 3 or so.
A meditation on contemplation on anticipation on fascination . . . it's kind of like a flu shot: it may hurt a little, but it's over fast.
Michele
Only 4 songs out of 13 had a backing track. And I think the only one with vocals was GYOW. You didn't even see one show so I'm not sure how you can come to the conclusion it was so awful.
lol. we posted basically the same thing at the same time, except you were nice and concise while i was rambling in circles.:rolleyes:
and yeah, only GYOW has vocals on it. def least favorite of OMS.
This One Man Show is my least favorite tour of his. Since I wouldn't mind a purely acoustic show myself your suggestion is one I'd endorse, but as far as the psychobabble goes, all told he probably spends 5 minutes top on his song introductions combined, so I don't know why that would keep you away from a concert. It's not like the talk goes on forever, nor does he comment prior to each song. Just 3 or so.
A meditation on contemplation on anticipation on fascination . . . it's kind of like a flu shot: it may hurt a little, but it's over fast.
Michele
yup he barely talked during OMS. and he made an effort to change it a bit from time to time. plus if you don't want him to say the same pre-rehearsed thing, you could influence what he says - the intimate setting allows you to say stuff that he will hear and respond to you or get into a teasing back-an-forth.
michelej1
02-16-2013, 12:18 AM
yup he barely talked during OMS. and he made an effort to change it a bit from time to time. plus if you don't want him to say the same pre-rehearsed thing, you could influence what he says - the intimate setting allows you to say stuff that he will hear and respond to you or get into a teasing back-an-forth.
Lindsey has excellent hearing when he wants. It's kind of funny how he'll comment on things even several rows back, if he feels like it.
Michele
SteveMacD
02-16-2013, 12:19 AM
lol. they've been playing Songs From The Small Machine Live In LA regularly on Palladia. even as a non-guitarist who doesn't work for any legendary band i can see there are 4 people on stage there, not one man and a guitar. :shrug: :angel:
and also, even as a non-guitarist i can hear there's no Rodeo there. ;)
You know, it all blends together for me -Palladia, YouTube, etc- so I'm not going to d*ck around with what was on what because, whatever the case, I end up reaching the same conclusion: Whether he's with the band or is playing a one man show, Lindsey has been using canned tracks, and that's the musical equivalent of glorified karaoke. I think it's crap. It's the easy way of doing things. It's the coward's way of putting on a show. It sickens me that it spilled into Fleetwood Mac shows.
The last Fleetwood Mac-related show I've seen to date was Lindsey in Cincinnati in 2006. I remember the canned tracks at that show, too. That and the psychobabble ("I wrote this song when I realized a dream I had wasn't going to come true, and that I had to give myself time to mourn the loss of that dream") are the reasons I quit going to his shows. It's not art, it's not intellectual, it's not interesting, and it's not entertaining. The best moment of the night was a somewhat sloppy version of "Bwana", which was just a one-off.
please feel free to jump in there (if you ever consider worthy taking some of your precious time to take a listen to any of them ;) ).
Not that my time's precious, it's just that I've moved on. I'm simply not interested in listen to a "live" show that's not really live. And, judging by some of what I've heard about half full venues, I'm apparently not alone. I know a lot of those venues from touring. It's sad when the guy who wrote "Go Your Own Way", "Tusk", "Trouble", "Go Insane", and "Big Love" and is still a member of a legendary band can't sell-out small venues.
Lindsfan
02-16-2013, 12:19 AM
Those are two different things, though. I like his music and consider him one of the great guitarists AND I want a completely live show. I'd gladly pay to see him if he didn't use pre-recorded backing tracks or have a bunch of psychobabble for stage bantar. It kind of kills me that he's taking this route for his live shows.
From what you're saying, I think you would have liked his show. To see him so close, while he's playing is something special. Not Too Late, Bleed to Love Her, Big Love (duh), NGBA, Go Insane, Trouble. These were truly jaw-dropping. Cast Away Dreams was beautiful. ISA and Come (both with backing tracks) brought down the house at every performance I saw. Lindsey is Lindsey. He's never going to walk out with just one guitar and play in the stripped down fashion you're speaking of. I'd enjoy that as well, but it's never gonna happen. It's not who he is :shrug: But who he is is awful darn good, and I hope you take the opportunity next time he tours solo, regardless of how he chooses to present his songs.
michelej1
02-16-2013, 12:27 AM
("I wrote this song when I realized a dream I had wasn't going to come true, and that I had to give myself time to mourn the loss of that dream")
Woo hoo. From a shipper perspective, that introduction is fascinating. Thanks man!
Michele
I'm simply not interested in listen to a "live" show that's not really live. And, judging by some of what I've heard about half full venues, I'm apparently not alone.
see you keep loosing me more and more with every post... so you are right, we should just let this go. i'm used to forming opinions on at least some facts. you are listing assumptions or what you think may be true based on something you last saw 7 years ago.
and OMS actually had tons of sold out shows, just check nickslive blog for some statistics. it was also the first solo tour on which he actually made money. :shrug:
Lindsfan
02-16-2013, 12:36 AM
i'll say to you what i said to everybody that kept giving the same spiel you are now before they actually experienced OMS - those are assumptions, and unless you experienced in person either one of the OMS shows or listened to OMS recording, i can't take your opinion on this as relevant. i have heard too many people saying very similar things as you are saying now and doing 180 when they actually saw the show.
now when people have heard the show and tell me they didn't like it, i respect their opinion. not everyone will like it - of course.
This :nod:
And, judging by some of what I've heard about half full venues, I'm apparently not alone.
I saw 13 shows, from Seattle to Knoxville and they were all sold out...and tons of fun :)
SteveMacD
02-16-2013, 12:36 AM
Woo hoo. From a shipper perspective, that introduction is fascinating. Thanks man!
From a social worker's perspective, especially when said social worker was working at a homeless shelter, it kind of made me want to puke. Mourn the loss of a dream? Yeah, tell that to the guy who was assaulted over a mustard sandwich.
From a social worker's perspective, especially when said social worker was working at a homeless shelter, it kind of made me want to puke. Mourn the loss of a dream? Yeah, tell that to the guy who was assaulted over a mustard sandwich.
see now there's something we can finally agree on. these people (all macsters except maybe johnny mac who at least once said "we are not curing cancer here" so maybe he has some sense of reality) are so self-absorbed and self-important... even few weeks ago "we were heroic" they say "in recording rumours"?!?!? what? you were sitting in the studio getting high with some pretty people around you some of them who happen to be your exes, and making some music. yeah, really heroic :rolleyes:
SteveMacD
02-16-2013, 12:41 AM
it was also the first solo tour on which he actually made money. :shrug:
Of course he made money. It's amazing how much you save when you don't have to pay three guys.
Of course he made money. It's amazing how much you save when you don't have to pay three guys.
it's interesting that you skipped the part about sold out shows ;)
redtulip
02-16-2013, 12:47 AM
From a social worker's perspective, especially when said social worker was working at a homeless shelter, it kind of made me want to puke. Mourn the loss of a dream? Yeah, tell that to the guy who was assaulted over a mustard sandwich.
What does that have to do with anything? Completely irrelevant to this conversation.
michelej1
02-16-2013, 12:48 AM
From a social worker's perspective, especially when said social worker was working at a homeless shelter, it kind of made me want to puke. Mourn the loss of a dream? Yeah, tell that to the guy who was assaulted over a mustard sandwich.
see now there's something we can finally agree on. these people (all macsters except maybe johnny mac who at least once said "we are not curing cancer here" so maybe he has some sense of reality) are so self-absorbed and self-important... even few weeks ago "we were heroic" they say "in recording rumours"?!?!? what? you were sitting in the studio getting high with some pretty people around you some of them who happen to be your exes, and making some music. yeah, really heroic :rolleyes:
See I just lauhged when Steve said that, because you can start thinking that way about anything. I mean it can make the advice "don't stop thinking about tomorrow" seem insensitive, if you say, "Tell that to the guy who was stabbed for a mustard sandwich!"
Michele
SteveMacD
02-16-2013, 12:51 AM
He's never going to walk out with just one guitar and play in the stripped down fashion you're speaking of. I'd enjoy that as well, but it's never gonna happen. It's not who he is :shrug:
Which is why I'm so high on Richard Thompson right now. He DOES that, and his stage banter can be hilarious.
See I just lauhged when Steve said that, because you can start thinking that way about anything. I mean it can make the advice "don't stop thinking about tomorrow" seem insensitive, if you say, "Tell that to the guy who was stabbed for a mustard sandwich!"
Michele
i think Lindsey actually made that heroic comment. it really annoyed me and i was just waiting for a chance to criticize it somewhere.
that's actually why i really liked Lindsey's GOS1 lyrics - they were not as self-absorbed as the rest of the rumours-era mac catalogue.
but yours and redtulip's points are well taken.
michelej1
02-16-2013, 12:55 AM
Which is why I'm so high on Richard Thompson right now. He DOES that, and his stage banter can be hilarious.
Is the stage banter always different or are you familiar with it now?
Michele
SteveMacD
02-16-2013, 12:57 AM
See I just lauhged when Steve said that, because you can start thinking that way about anything. I mean it can make the advice "don't stop thinking about tomorrow" seem insensitive, if you say, "Tell that to the guy who was stabbed for a mustard sandwich!"
First, I said assaulted...
But, "don't stop thinking about tomorrow" is something that I would call encouraging. It can be an empowering lyric, especially at a homeless shelter. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that's the only mentality one can have to survive being in a homeless shelter and not go insane.
It's nothing at all like a guy babbling on about mourning the loss of a dream when that guy is tearing down his mansion in the Hills to build another mansion.:rolleyes:
michelej1
02-16-2013, 12:57 AM
i think Lindsey actually made that heroic comment. it really annoyed me and i was just waiting for a chance to criticize it somewhere.
I think Mick said that Lindsey said that to him. I was like, "Are these guys still smoking pot with each other." What is up. Do they really still talk about 1976-1977 when they are alone? Psychos.
Michele
michelej1
02-16-2013, 12:58 AM
First, I said assaulted...
I know you did. I was spicing it up a little for the "don't stop" comment.
Michele
Lindsfan
02-16-2013, 01:01 AM
See I just lauhged when Steve said that, because you can start thinking that way about anything. I mean it can make the advice "don't stop thinking about tomorrow" seem insensitive, if you say, "Tell that to the guy who was stabbed for a mustard sandwich!"
Michele
:thumbsup:
Which is why I'm so high on Richard Thompson right now. He DOES that, and his stage banter can be hilarious.
to each their own.
i'm more into rocking and intense myself. and OMS provided that in spades.
i used to go to music school, play piano and flute, and as a part of that we had to go to a lot of classical music concerts. it was not for me, i was bored at many of those. completely acoustic shows kinda remind me of that time. i can appreciate how great someone's playing, but it just doesn't grab me and hold my attention for the whole duration.
also, i like to think i can influence things and not just have them completely handed to me, even in the entertainment... as several of us said before, it is fun to banter with Lindsey and listen to his stage back-and-forth with others in the audience. a lot of it ends up being hilarious and interactive. but again, that's just me.
SteveMacD
02-16-2013, 01:07 AM
Is the stage banter always different or are you familiar with it now?
I've only recently gotten into RT's music, but there's enough on YouTube and enough live recordings out there to know that he's not babbling on all the time about how something was a healing moment for him. I mean, his devastatingly sarcastic rendition of "Oops, I Did It Again" from his "1000 Years Of Popular Music" album already puts him ahead of the curve, as does "I Agree With Pat Metheny" where he basically sh*ts all over Kenny G. I'm hoping to see him next month.
michelej1
02-16-2013, 01:15 AM
I mean, his devastatingly sarcastic rendition of "Oops, I Did It Again" from his "1000 Years Of Popular Music" album already puts him ahead of the curve, as does "I Agree With Pat Metheny" where he basically sh*ts all over Kenny G. I'm hoping to see him next month.
This sounds similar to what people in the This is 40 audience at the Roxy were telling me about Ryan Adams and what his full show is like. I guess it's as much a sardonic look at pop culture, mixed with his social commentary as it is about the music.
Of course, FM isn't like that.
Michele
just looked up Richard Thompson... he sounds very interesting actually, much better than what you described SteveMacD. i'll check him out if he comes around these parts :)
and i don't really see how he and LB are mutually exclusive. i'd think it would be just the opposite for most people who are at least somewhat familiar with one or the other. :shrug:
SteveMacD
02-16-2013, 01:20 AM
What does that have to do with anything? Completely irrelevant to this conversation.
Yeah, we're having this thing called a conversation, which has partially morphed into why I don't see Lindsey. One of the reasons I listed is that I don't like his banter, and at the last show I saw, the banter that was paraphrased rubbed me the wrong way for that reason.
#Reading
SteveMacD
02-16-2013, 01:25 AM
just looked up Richard Thompson... he sounds very interesting actually, much better than what you described SteveMacD. i'll check him out if he comes around these parts :)
What can I say. I suck at some things. Plus, I've never actually gotten to see him live, yet. I usually give better descriptions of things I've experienced.
Actually, he and his ex have a song that screams to be covered by Fleetwood Mac called For Shame Of Doing Wrong (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92bWeiAC1QU).
What can I say. I suck at some things. Plus, I've never actually gotten to see him live, yet. I usually give better descriptions of things I've experienced.
like if you actually experienced OMS show? ;)
:sorry: couldn't resist. it's all good. i learned something new. i'm also having a vague memory that somebody else may have brought up Thomson to me recently, as someone i may be interested in checking out.
LB Freakazoid
02-16-2013, 02:11 AM
First off... Consider the hour.... And I'm responding :cool: (been a fine evening of.... Libations....
However, with the old school of thinking... You have a show, you go on the road, over and over again..... Back in the day, you rehearsed a show... Did it over and over.. done....
Now... With his releasing the his latest online, no major label behind him...
I kinda think that with this last tour of OMS, LB learned the world of YouTube.. Testing it out.... You know he heard us requesting certain songs... ( Gawd knows I "urged" a few favs). And he smiled at some in the crowd .... Ignored a lot... And trailed on to HIS agenda.... However, I don't think that what was "called out" during his shows was lost on him.....
FM is always slow in technology.....no names called out here:cool:
Yes, the good ole days produce great music (which I'm sure the Sounds City doc reinforced SN's beliefs about the days gone by....)
However... That ain't now....
How 'bout Fleetwood Mac HOW is to figure out how to blow out fantastic sonic music in today's realms?!
LB is always trying to figure new sounds... Got it.. TUSK... On the solos of the time... We feel ot....
Now we've got 3 recent albums showing off his prowls of his found targeted talent.....
And now the challenge should be...
They did it analog... Bust the walls and figure out how to do it digitaly!
Find that sound! .. " .follow the sound"....
No one is doin it with FM's talent and ear.......
Or is just laziness?.... Or just money.... Or.... The constent need of NOW?
And in advance ... Thank you for my rambing...
SteveMacD
02-16-2013, 02:34 AM
First off... Consider the hour.... And I'm responding :cool: (been a fine evening of.... Libations....
Best kind! :thumbsup:
I think Mick said that Lindsey said that to him. I was like, "Are these guys still smoking pot with each other." What is up. Do they really still talk about 1976-1977 when they are alone? Psychos.
Michele
i realize now what you are referring to. Mick did say it in one of the videos, but he was talking about Lindsey calling it heroic in one of the earlier interviews from the same day.
there was also one of the later interviews where Mick kinda disputed calling it heroic and described it a bit more realistic... must have sounded way over the top even to him.
SteveMacD
02-16-2013, 03:55 AM
i realize now what you are referring to. Mick did say it in one of the videos, but he was talking about Lindsey calling it heroic in one of the earlier interviews from the same day.
there was also one of the later interviews where Mick kinda disputed calling it heroic and described it a bit more realistic... must have sounded way over the top even to him.
Which says a lot, when you think about it.
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