Songs that are horrible live

[I'msoAfraid95]

What songs, to you, are horrible when played live, or don`t hold up to the studio version?

[elle]

What songs, to you, are horrible when played live, or don`t hold up to the studio version?

Say Goodbye.

studio version is far from great but live you can really hear how just dreadful this song really is (other than beautiful guitar parts, but they cannot save it unlike Time Precious Time). :distress:

[vivfox]

The one thing I really miss about FM's live shows from 1975-1982 is how they were brave enough to make their songs sound a little bit different every night of the tour. I say they but I really mean Stevie. Beginning in 1987 they have tried too hard to make most of the songs sound like the records. I like all their live songs except Not That Funny and only because the jam session was tediously long.

[KindOfWoman90]

I really don't like Second Hand News live - I love the studio version, but live I feel as if it's slower (may very well be the case). Also, the repetition of the bow bow bit just...no, it makes me cringe for some reason (only live of course).


On the other hand, I love Say Goodbye recorded version AND live. :) Had to say that since I keep seeing it brought up in various threads. I love the guitar parts, I love the harmonies, I love the lyrics :nod:

[Peestie]

I've never thought SHN worked quite as well live. I love the studio version but the live version (with the possible exception of the Rumours tour) feel sluggish and "heavy". The new versions since 2003 suffer from this especially. I think it's because of Lindsey playing the Turner instead of the light acoustic guitars and timbres of the studio version.

[Regina]

LOVE Say Goodbye. Everything that was great about B/N shines in this song. Plus, I'm a mushball. I admit it.

I don't know. In general, I'd say I like almost everything better live than recorded. So, I'd almost have to answer the question in reverse (and, the answer would be "everything!").

OK-I hate Not That Funny. Live is even more aggravating than recorded. I dislike Say You Will live. I really, really am tired of Don't Stop both live and recorded. So Afraid--I do like better than the recorded version, I groan when I hear the opening strains, but--at the end, I'm into it just like (almost) everyone else.

[On Ice]

I would have to say that Dreams doesn't work well live, it loses its intimacy and with Stevie unable or unwilling to reach those high notes, the song loses much of its power. The real problem with the song live is that it always, always sounds rushed, like lets just get through Dreams and move on. This classic deserves better and if she won't sing it properly, shelve it. :sorry:

[drzubritsky]

I don't know if I would call it horrible, but "Gypsy" has never translated well to a live setting. The song is such a layered and intricate creation in its studio version that would be impractical to recreate onstage. Also, onstage Lindsey tends to sing his parts at the end much too forcefully, which doesn't work for the delicate nature of the song. Oddly, the one live version of "Gypsy" that I do love is the acoustic performance by just Stevie and Lindsey at one of those Heart Institute benefits in the early 2000s...for some reason, stripping the song down to its acoustic minimum actually works as a lovely alternative to the complex studio version.

I agree that "Dreams" hasn't worked too well onstage for the past couple of decades. However, judging from the performance on FM Live and clips from the late 70s, Stevie was capable of delivering a lead vocal that came close to the studio version. Unfortunately, they blew it on the chorus by having Stevie take the high harmony part rather than the lead.

WTH were they thinking with "Everywhere" on the TITN tour (with Stevie squealing "I wanna BEEEE with you")?! Fortunately,by the time of The Dance they refined the live arrangement into something much more palatable.

[vivfox]

I forgot to mention Big Love. The first time Lindsey played it solo it was great and exciting but since then he has shoved that version down our throats. Every fan that comments on this song has said they wish he'd perform a full band version of it but noooooooooo. That's the biggest fault of Fleetwood Mac members. They get a good audience response on something and they'll never change the arrangement again.
I agree also with the other poster who said Dreams live is boring. It is but if it was placed later in the set it could feel more revived. I don't like the fact that we can pretty much predict the setlist. It never changes all that much. I wish just once they could really surprise us all and do something different.

[FierySequences]

Landslide....for the 10th million time:angel:

[vivfox]

Landslide....for the 10th million time:angel:

Only because it's been played to death but in the live setting there is nothing to compare to that sound when the song ends of 10,000 people stomping their feet on the floor in approval and practically feeling the building shake.That sensation makes those 3 minutes worth it for me.

[FierySequences]

Beginning in 1987 they have tried too hard to make most of the songs sound like the records. I like all their live songs except Not That Funny and only because the jam session was tediously long.

I respectfully agree and disagree with Viv. I also like most of the songs they perform live (even NTF, b/c we don't hear it often).

The 87/88 tour saw different arrangements of TITN songs such as Everywhere and 7W. Of course, I am biased b/c I love the TITN dvd. I agree LL and IIM sound alot like the album version. But IIM rocked! However, after 10+ years it was nice to hear them dust off these tunes (Everywhere) and SYLM and give them a fresher, modern day appeal.

[elle]

I forgot to mention Big Love. The first time Lindsey played it solo it was great and exciting but since then he has shoved that version down our throats. Every fan that comments on this song has said they wish he'd perform a full band version of it but noooooooooo. That's the biggest fault of Fleetwood Mac members.

WRONG!

Big Love acoustic is a masterpiece and a showpiece for LB. maybe "fans" don't like it, but everybody from the street and causal listeners who hear it are blown away by it every time.

it would be a huge mistake to drop it or change it, although if he did i trust LB that he would do an extraordinary job and make something different from a studio version. i've seen him change enough songs around into something different and unexpected. but there's no need to do that with acoustic BL considering it's perfect as is.

full studio version is just an ordinary dated song.

[elle]

Only because it's been played to death but in the live setting there is nothing to compare to that sound when the song ends of 10,000 people stomping their feet on the floor in approval and practically feeling the building shake.That sensation makes those 3 minutes worth it for me.
looking forward to experience that for the first time.

[I'msoAfraid95]

I don`t like the early live version of I`m So Afraid. Dreams, the Rumours era versions are good.To me, Tusk live isn`t that good.

[FierySequences]

Of course there are some songs form the 80's (Hold Me, Gypsy-on Mirage tour) that tanked. Gypsy was resurrected and finally found a good translation into the set in 97. Hold Me can do the same, today :D

There isn't many "live" tunes I despise (perhaps, that is too strong a word). But SS has lost it's luster since 97, but then again that could be just the delivery from Nicks whom was not all present at the last Mac show I saw in 09.

[elle]

I would have to say that Dreams doesn't work well live, it loses its intimacy and with Stevie unable or unwilling to reach those high notes, the song loses much of its power. The real problem with the song live is that it always, always sounds rushed, like lets just get through Dreams and move on. This classic deserves better and if she won't sing it properly, shelve it. :sorry:

yeah i get that feeling with a good number of songs - Dreams, Sara, even GDW (although i love that song), Rhiannon, regular version Gypsy - all these songs these days seem to be performed monotonally, rushed, just because they were big hits and they "have" to be done.

i also agree that Second Hand News was never as good live as it was on Rumours, although faster versions like the Rumours tour one and especially SYW one (which sounded almost like a march) were much better. only during SWS tour did Lindsey and the guys finally do justice to SHN - same with Tusk. both finally sounded good and really rocking during SWS tour so i hope he keeps those versions.

[FierySequences]

it would be a huge mistake to drop it or change it, although if he did i trust LB that he would do an extraordinary job and make something different from a studio version. i've seen him change enough songs around into something different and unexpected. but there's no need to do that with acoustic BL considering it's perfect as is.



I would be A-ok with LB keeping BL the way it is...ahem as long as we can finally hear the masterpiece TITN! (even the ordinary studio version would do the trick) :]

[KindOfWoman90]

I would have to say that Dreams doesn't work well live, it loses its intimacy and with Stevie unable or unwilling to reach those high notes, the song loses much of its power. The real problem with the song live is that it always, always sounds rushed, like lets just get through Dreams and move on. This classic deserves better and if she won't sing it properly, shelve it. :sorry:

You know, I've been listening to IYD lately, trying to decide whether she can hit these notes that no longer exist in live performances - it made me think, wasn't there a bit in the IYD documentary where she sang Rhiannon or Dreams with the high notes? I haven't seen it yet, but I remember someone saying something to that effect... Is she just trying to save her voice? If she can hit those high notes I'd love to hear them...especially for Dreams and Rhiannon. Those two songs are in desperate need of some new life.

[wheart]

You know, I've been listening to IYD lately, trying to decide whether she can hit these notes that no longer exist in live performances - it made me think, wasn't there a bit in the IYD documentary where she sang Rhiannon or Dreams with the high notes? I haven't seen it yet, but I remember someone saying something to that effect... Is she just trying to save her voice? If she can hit those high notes I'd love to hear them...especially for Dreams and Rhiannon. Those two songs are in desperate need of some new life.

Not sure about the notes but I agree that these songs need new life...especially Rhiannon. They've been doing the same arrangement of this song on stage forever. I know Rhiannon will never be what it once was on stage; however, if they did stretched out the middle instrumental part like they used to, and give Stevie a chance to do some full on chiffon waving drama, it would really revitalize the song.

As far as on stage clunkers, Gypsy is the first song that comes to mind. It never sounds as good as the recorded version...not even close.

[moon]

Come on, Say Goodbye is amazing live!!!!!!! :thumbsup::thumbsup:

Songs that sound horrible live for me:

- Second Hand News (too fast)
- World Turning (too long!!!!)
- Big Love and Go Insane (only becuse I want to hear something new)
- I'm So Afraid and Rhiannon before 1979.
- Sisters of the Moon (I love this song, but I can't feel the power of the studio version)
- the last Gypsies (empty versions. The Dance version is beautiful, but then...)
- And all the Mirage songs that were performed at least once live.

Regards!

[Josh2003]

I'm not a fan of how LB has been doing "Never Going Back Again" over the past decade. The studio version is poppy and upbeat, but the live versions of late have been slowed down considerably, quite a bit "darker," and, while he puts a great deal of emotion into the lyrics, I think this takes away from the fun of the studio version.

Just my opinion though, as I'm sure others love the newer take.

[elle]

I really don't like Second Hand News live - I love the studio version, but live I feel as if it's slower (may very well be the case). Also, the repetition of the bow bow bit just...no, it makes me cringe for some reason (only live of course).

aww, how can you not like bam bam bam - that part i think it's good even in the worst live SHN versions (and i agree with you there are a number of those). but look here:

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/h3q_I_Y9l-E" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[elle]

I'm not a fan of how LB has been doing "Never Going Back Again" over the past decade. The studio version is poppy and upbeat, but the live versions of late have been slowed down considerably, quite a bit "darker," and, while he puts a great deal of emotion into the lyrics, I think this takes away from the fun of the studio version.

Just my opinion though, as I'm sure others love the newer take.

agree with you. he sped it up a little on OMS tour compared to the SWS tour when it was just dreadfully slow, but it needs to be sped up more, at least to the Soundstage version.

[elle]

Come on, Say Goodbye is amazing live!!!!!!! :thumbsup::thumbsup:
i know everybody thinks that but may opinion of SG live is somewhere en par with what i wrote in SN forum about Italian Summer. can't stand either song.

imo, one can love SG live only if at least one of the following is true:

you have shipper inclinations and that overrides other considerations when listening to the song for you; or
you love the music of Sinatra, Aznavour, or Julio Iglesias.

neither applies to me so i have to repeat that i think that song is just dreadful and even amazing guitar parts cannot save it. but tastes are different of course.

- Second Hand News (too fast)
ha, someone else just commented that it's too slow live. i don't mind the too fast versions, but i agree there are many bad live versions of SHN, interspersed with some great ones.

[rhiannondontgo]

I would have to say that Dreams doesn't work well live, it loses its intimacy and with Stevie unable or unwilling to reach those high notes, the song loses much of its power. The real problem with the song live is that it always, always sounds rushed, like lets just get through Dreams and move on. This classic deserves better and if she won't sing it properly, shelve it. :sorry:

I actually enjoyed Dreams at the Stevie solo shows I went to. I really think she's just way subdued and seems bored at FM shows. But her 'wildness' - for lack of a better word - really make her solo shows awesome. The tambourine crashing and twirling and silly rambling and funny little Stevie-dancing are what make the show amazing. I think she should put the passion she puts in her solo shows into FM shows. Lindsey certainly does. All these songs that everybody finds boring in FM shows would be way better if Stevie had a quarter of the passion and fun in it that she does when she's on her own. Just my opinion :shrug:

[jmn3]

WRONG!

Big Love acoustic is a masterpiece and a showpiece for LB. maybe "fans" don't like it, but everybody from the street and causal listeners who hear it are blown away by it every time.

it would be a huge mistake to drop it or change it, although if he did i trust LB that he would do an extraordinary job and make something different from a studio version. i've seen him change enough songs around into something different and unexpected. but there's no need to do that with acoustic BL considering it's perfect as is.

full studio version is just an ordinary dated song.

I have this same thought...it's a huge WOW moment for the non-fanatics when they see him do Big Love the way he has done it since '92. The fanatics in a lot of cases are now sick of it because he's been doing it this way for 20 years (15 since it really became huge with The Dance). But when I think more about it, is it the actual song Big Love that causes people to love it, or is it the fact that one man, a guitar, and a microphone on stage are capable of doing what Lindsey does with Big Love? I mean, Big Love was a hit, but it's not THAT huge of a hit...what if Lindsey plucked another song out of obscurity and rearranged it so that it was a one voice/one guitar masterpiece, would it have the same impact? I don't have the answer but I've definitely thought about this before.

[jmn3]

I'm not a fan of how LB has been doing "Never Going Back Again" over the past decade. The studio version is poppy and upbeat, but the live versions of late have been slowed down considerably, quite a bit "darker," and, while he puts a great deal of emotion into the lyrics, I think this takes away from the fun of the studio version.

Just my opinion though, as I'm sure others love the newer take.

Well I kinda thought in 2003-04 they went back to more of a poppy upbeat NGBA. It seemed in 2009 Lindsey went back to how he performed it back in the Rumours/Tusk/Mirage Tour days...slow, darker, etc.

[KindOfWoman90]

I actually enjoyed Dreams at the Stevie solo shows I went to. I really think she's just way subdued and seems bored at FM shows. But her 'wildness' - for lack of a better word - really make her solo shows awesome. The tambourine crashing and twirling and silly rambling and funny little Stevie-dancing are what make the show amazing. I think she should put the passion she puts in her solo shows into FM shows. Lindsey certainly does. All these songs that everybody finds boring in FM shows would be way better if Stevie had a quarter of the passion and fun in it that she does when she's on her own. Just my opinion :shrug:

I agree, I'm not sure what is it? I think LB has the same passion and energy in both his solo and FM concerts - Even if she isn't having a great time, fake it.

aww, how can you not like bam bam bam - that part i think it's good even in the worst live SHN versions (and i agree with you there are a number of those). but look here:


I know, but that's exactly what I mean lol - it's that performance I always think of and it drives me nuts :sorry: Especially with Stevie's adorable hand motions, I feel as if I've walked into some children's song, if that makes sense lol - I think it's the repetition of the bams or bows what have you :lol:

i know everybody thinks that but may opinion of SG live is somewhere en par with what i wrote in SN forum about Italian Summer. can't stand either song.

imo, one can love SG live only if at least one of the following is true:

you have shipper inclinations and that overrides other considerations when listening to the song for you; or
you love the music of Sinatra, Aznavour, or Julio Iglesias.

neither applies to me so i have to repeat that i think that song is just dreadful and even amazing guitar parts cannot save it. but tastes are different of course.


I admit shipper inclinations, but only in that I appreciate their ever evolving relationship. I find it fascinating and romantic. However, with all that aside, when I first heard this song I wasn't aware of all that baggage and I still thought it was beautiful. I don't think it's reminiscent of Sinatra, but I do love him (I don't know any songs by the other two, only know Julio's son, and Say Goodbye is definitely not as saccharine as Hero...).

I know Stevie has referred to Soldier's Angel as a BN-esque song lately, but honestly I feel like Say Goodbye sounds more like BN than SA. The harmonies are beautiful, and I love how the tempo changes; it gives the song such lift and emotion - for me it isn't schmaltzy at all. It's still so fascinating to me how FM fans can have such different tastes! :lol: But I think it's great, must be one of the reasons why they've been so successful all these years :)

[jmn3]

Not sure about the notes but I agree that these songs need new life...especially Rhiannon. They've been doing the same arrangement of this song on stage forever. I know Rhiannon will never be what it once was on stage; however, if they did stretched out the middle instrumental part like they used to, and give Stevie a chance to do some full on chiffon waving drama, it would really revitalize the song.

As far as on stage clunkers, Gypsy is the first song that comes to mind. It never sounds as good as the recorded version...not even close.

Rhiannon's current arrangement has been played to death and needs something refreshed. Stevie's never going to be wailing like it's 1976 again, but I agree, a longer instrumental part with a solo from Lindsey would do wonders for the song.

Gypsy is such a clunker on stage, that's always what I think when I hear it! Save for the acoustic version in 2000, ever since '82 it's fell flat live. The Dance DVD is a nice version, but the Dance Tour versions are clunkers like always.

World Turning, Not That Funny, and Don't Stop also are on the top of my live stinkers list.

[WildHearted]

i know everybody thinks that but may opinion of SG live is somewhere en par with what i wrote in SN forum about Italian Summer. can't stand either song.

imo, one can love SG live only if at least one of the following is true:

you have shipper inclinations and that overrides other considerations when listening to the song for you; or
you love the music of Sinatra, Aznavour, or Julio Iglesias.

neither applies to me so i have to repeat that i think that song is just dreadful and even amazing guitar parts cannot save it. but tastes are different of course.


Personally, I like the lyrics of Say Goodbye, the melody, and the instrumentation. Unfortunately, the studio version is entirely too fast and poorly produced to the point that it sounds robotic. The slower tempo when it's played live gives time to actually hear what he's saying and enjoy the song. If Lindsey were to play it at solo shows with Brett or Neale on harmony I would love it live just as much.

I don't know how that has anything to do with Frank Sinatra. :laugh:

But I appreciate the fact that you find the song dreadful. The great thing about this board is the sharing of opinions - even if those opinions are different. Especially then.

[GypsySorcerer]

I agree with the "Gypsy" sentiment. The studio version is just perfection, and so hard to recreate. I didn't like "Peacekeeper" during the SYW tour. It just lacked energy and brought the set to a crashing halt. And although I adore the song, I don't like "Oh Daddy" live, either.

[Ulpian]

Little Lies -- way worse live :distress:

[mitzo]

Stand Back is grotesque live.

[michelej1]

I didn't like Oh Daddy on the album and I disliked it in concert. I can't say it translated poorly to the stage. I just wasn't going to like it anyway and I don't think it should be in the setlist with Songbird. I type them together and you should just do one (preferably Songbird) or the other, not both.

Michele

[MacShadowsBall]

I agree with the reasons regarding Gypsy. It's such a studio masterpiece that's hard to translate to the stage. It's my favorite FM song, so it's kinda hard to say I don't like it live.

Little Lies and Seven Wonders didn't go well live, but Isn't It Midnight did!

World Turning is just too long live with Mick's solo and stuff.

Dreams for whatever reason is better with Stevie solo than with FM. :cool:

[Sleepless-Child]

i know everybody thinks that but may opinion of SG live is somewhere en par with what i wrote in SN forum about Italian Summer. can't stand either song.

imo, one can love SG live only if at least one of the following is true:

you have shipper inclinations and that overrides other considerations when listening to the song for you; or
you love the music of Sinatra, Aznavour, or Julio Iglesias.




:laugh::laugh::laugh: you're back with the Julio Iglesias thing, i absolutely don't hear it, you have to explain it to me Elle!
I'm a shipper and i like Aznavour sometimes, but i don't think those are the reasons why i like the song.
But i remember listening to the live version and my mom was in the room, and she asked if it was Fleetwood Mac and i said yes. And then she told me something like "this song doesn't sound like rock n' roll or folk, or anything. It is really bizarre.", so i guess there is a particular sound to this song that i'm not aware of because i'm so used to it. Maybe it really is Julio-ish :laugh:

[Bandon]

The one thing I really miss about FM's live shows from 1975-1982 is how they were brave enough to make their songs sound a little bit different every night of the tour. I say they but I really mean Stevie. Beginning in 1987 they have tried too hard to make most of the songs sound like the records. I like all their live songs except Not That Funny and only because the jam session was tediously long.

It's "funny" you say that. When I bought the FM live cassettes in 1980, I put the cassette in my car player, and for some reason, that was the first song that played. I thought I bought the wrong cassettes. Like it was from another band. I re-wound or fast-forwarded and realized what it was. Never listened to the live version again. :distress:

[moon]

Personally, I like the lyrics of Say Goodbye, the melody, and the instrumentation. Unfortunately, the studio version is entirely too fast and poorly produced to the point that it sounds robotic. The slower tempo when it's played live gives time to actually hear what he's saying and enjoy the song. [...]

I totally agree. The live version is slow but you must listen and feel lyrics and music better.

Hehehe, I respect Sinatra, and my father likes Julio Iglesias! But I don't think they're related with my opinion! :D
And I agree with all the opinions about the live Gypsy.
Regards!

[vivfox]

It's "funny" you say that. When I bought the FM live cassettes in 1980, I put the cassette in my car player, and for some reason, that was the first song that played. I thought I bought the wrong cassettes. Like it was from another band. I re-wound or fast-forwarded and realized what it was. Never listened to the live version again. :distress:


If NTF was the first song that played on your cassette, that meant you bought a used cassette.

[michelej1]

you love the music of Sinatra, Aznavour, or Julio Iglesias.


I love Sinatra and have dozens of his albums. I am familiar with Iglesias (only have one album, though). To my ears, there is no connection between their styles and Say Goodbye or their songs and Say Goodbye. They are quite different genres and, to me, they rise and fall on their on merits.

As for being a shipper, I don't think that makes you like a song that is otherwise stultifying. You can imagine shipper content in any song written by Stevie or Lindsey. That doesn't mean half of those songs aren't dogs. You can be romantic without being deaf.

Whether I liked the song or not, the live performance was rather awkward. I found it both dull and uncomfortable. You'd think where there was tension there wouldn't also be boredom, but that wasn't really the case. I was unnerved. Stevie seemed like she was as well. I actually liked some of Lindsey's introductions to the song a lot more than I liked the performance itself. Michele

[michelej1]

I was just thinking that Sad Angel is probably going to be an awful, treacly song that sounds awful live. It's going to go right up there with Sweet Girl.

I hope I'm proven wrong, but I think there's probably an at least 80% chance of doom. And please don't let them think of some creepy way to perform it together. You can't force these things people. Make it organic Linds.

Michele

[WildHearted]

I was just thinking that Sad Angel is probably going to be an awful, treacly song that sounds awful live. It's going to go right up there with Sweet Girl.

I hope I'm proven wrong, but I think there's probably an at least 80% chance of doom. And please don't let them think of some creepy way to perform it together. You can't force these things people. Make it organic Linds.

Michele

Maybe it will be really up-tempo and catchy.

Hoping for the best. With a title like that, what else can you do?

And I'm clinging for dear life to what Stevie said about SYW vs Unleashed vs Live 2013, regarding them not doing the same benign thing and actually just going up to play and have fun.

[elle]

:laugh::laugh::laugh: you're back with the Julio Iglesias thing, i absolutely don't hear it, you have to explain it to me Elle!
I'm a shipper and i like Aznavour sometimes, but i don't think those are the reasons why i like the song.
But i remember listening to the live version and my mom was in the room, and she asked if it was Fleetwood Mac and i said yes. And then she told me something like "this song doesn't sound like rock n' roll or folk, or anything. It is really bizarre.", so i guess there is a particular sound to this song that i'm not aware of because i'm so used to it. Maybe it really is Julio-ish :laugh:

i never went away ;). but you guys, i really really don't like that style of music, so please don't make me listen to Sinatra or Iglesias father or Aznavour to try to find songs that would make it clear to you. does schlager-like help?

see? your mom knows!

LB said once that as he ages he'd hope that his music would become more age-appropriate like Sinatra's was or something like that and this song may be an example of his try in that direction, whether it was intentional or not. luckily he didn't stray much more in that direction and stayed more true to himself instead. :D

[CADreaming]

I love Sinatra and have dozens of his albums. I am familiar with Iglesias (only have one album, though). To my ears, there is no connection between their styles and Say Goodbye or their songs and Say Goodbye. They are quite different genres and, to me, they rise and fall on their on merits.

As for being a shipper, I don't think that makes you like a song that is otherwise stultifying. You can imagine shipper content in any song written by Stevie or Lindsey. That doesn't mean half of those songs aren't dogs. You can be romantic without being deaf.

"Say Goodbye" is a very special song to my sister. I introduced it to her, she watched the Soundstage version on YouTube. I thought she would be touched by the SnL relationship and seeing their performance. But, to her it represents the passing of her 37 year old son to cancer. She still cries anytime she hears it.

It definitely has nothing to do with her like or dislike of Frank Sinatra, Aznavour, or Julio Iglesias...

[elle]

I was just thinking that Sad Angel is probably going to be an awful, treacly song that sounds awful live. It's going to go right up there with Sweet Girl.

I hope I'm proven wrong, but I think there's probably an at least 80% chance of doom. And please don't let them think of some creepy way to perform it together. You can't force these things people. Make it organic Linds.

Michele

lol. i really hope you are wrong but i find having low expectations can sometimes work wonders! or at least you might not be too disappointed.

see that might be a part of my problem with SG. i've heard lindsey's intro at the end of NGBA from soundstage which was a perfect setup for high expectations. then i watched that video but without any sound (bunch of people in the room listening to tv and no headphones handy :shrug:), while reading all the raving comments under the video on youtube. and then i finally heard the song and thought huh? that is what these people were raving about? what a dud. sinatra. iglesias. huh????? (even if not everybody hears it ;) ).

[michelej1]

Maybe it will be really up-tempo and catchy.

Hoping for the best. With a title like that, what else can you do?



That's why I haven't written off Miss Fantasy yet. I hope it will be uptempo and am crossing fingers for the best. But I think Sad Angel is going to tie in to her mother as well, so I'm not thinking good things about that.

When I think of Lindsey ballads, Gone Too Far is the only one that absolutely grabs me. The idea that he was aiming for something specific with these new songs is what scares me. If they were just songs he had, I wouldn't think so much about it, but because he wrote them with a purpose in mind, I think they're going to stink. I don't think Say Goodbye is bad on the album. And I do like the two Goodbye songs ending SYW in general.

Michele

[elle]

When I think of Lindsey ballads, Gone Too Far is the only one that absolutely grabs me. The idea that he was aiming for something specific with these new songs is what scares me. If they were just songs he had, I wouldn't think so much about it, but because he wrote them with a purpose in mind, I think they're going to stink.

when you put it that way... yeah, scary.

Lindsey ballads. Gone Too Far is gorgeous :thumbsup: :xoxo: :nod:. definitely on my list of requests. Walk A Thin Line is too, just the arrangement on Tusk sucks. it deserves a proper makeover.

[michelej1]

"Say Goodbye" is a very special song to my sister. I introduced it to her, she watched the Soundstage version on YouTube. I thought she would be touched by the SnL relationship and seeing their performance. But, to her it represents the passing of her 37 year old son to cancer. She still cries anytime she hears it.

It definitely has nothing to do with her like or dislike of Frank Sinatra, Aznavour, or Julio Iglesias...

Certainly, if you tie the song into something specific in your life it's going to change it for you. I think I feel that way about the entire Mirage album, taking it beyond the quality of the songs and into the personal memories they invoke for me.


It definitely has nothing to do with her like or dislike of Frank Sinatra, Aznavour, or Julio Iglesias...

Oh, Sinatra wouldn't even record Say Goodbye. It wasn't his style at all. I'm proud to say he did record one of Sonny's songs: Bang Bang (My Baby Shot Me Down).

Michele

[KindOfWoman90]

As for being a shipper, I don't think that makes you like a song that is otherwise stultifying. You can imagine shipper content in any song written by Stevie or Lindsey. That doesn't mean half of those songs aren't dogs. You can be romantic without being deaf.
Michele

^^ :lol: Very well put!

I was just thinking that Sad Angel is probably going to be an awful, treacly song that sounds awful live. It's going to go right up there with Sweet Girl.

I hope I'm proven wrong, but I think there's probably an at least 80% chance of doom. And please don't let them think of some creepy way to perform it together. You can't force these things people. Make it organic Linds.

Michele

I love him dearly, but I think that's often the key thing that trips him up! Imo goes along with over producing songs - sometimes he needs to learn to let well enough alone.

lol. i really hope you are wrong but i find having low expectations can sometimes work wonders! or at least you might not be too disappointed.


Yes! Set your expectations low and you won't be disappointed :nod: hehe

That's why I haven't written off Miss Fantasy yet. I hope it will be uptempo and am crossing fingers for the best. But I think Sad Angel is going to tie in to her mother as well, so I'm not thinking good things about that.

Michele

I'm really nervous about Sad Angel too...I'm anxious to hear these two songs. You never know though, positive thinking! At the very least Miss Fantasy better be up tempo, they can't give us two sappy songs...:shrug:

[elle]

As for being a shipper, I don't think that makes you like a song that is otherwise stultifying. You can imagine shipper content in any song written by Stevie or Lindsey. That doesn't mean half of those songs aren't dogs.

yup. as is SG :p (imo of course!).

You can be romantic without being deaf.
of course you can. or you can be both. or neither. ;)

[michelej1]

of course you can. or you can be both. or neither. ;)

I don't know why you'd analyze why another person doesn't like a song anyway. If you want to break apart why you like or dislike something, I can understand getting to the root of that in your head. But I wouldn't try to analyze why you like a song. Aha, you're really into WATL: let me tell you why you like that.

Michele

[elle]

I don't know why you'd analyze why another person doesn't like a song anyway. If you want to break apart why you like or dislike something, I can understand getting to the root of that in your head. But I wouldn't try to analyze why you like a song. Aha, you're really into WATL: let me tell you why you like that.

Michele

interesting! if i do that, i have to say that i don't know why, actually. in cases when someone states their personal opinion as the universal truth, i do feel the need to deconstruct where they are coming from.

i'd love to read your analysis of why i love WATL! :nod:

so you got me thinking about it now... why do i like WATL? good question. b/c i love the song, although i don't really like either version on extended Tusk CD - if i had my way i would make some kind of perfect combination of those 2 versions and get rid of tons of embellishments in arrangement that just distract from the beauty of that song. Deerhunter version is sublime, if only LB was singing on it. so i must love some version of WATL that i made up in my mind.

of course there was that snippet in Chicago Winery. that sounded like i imagined it would... beautiful even though it was haphazard and stripped down, with audience harmonizing.

also, when i first heard Tusk all the way through, WATL just hit me, and i had to listen to it 10 times in a row immediately. and then again. and again. for days in a row. i just couldn't believe this gem of a song existed for 30 years and i've never heard of it.

[vivfox]

also, when i first heard Tusk all the way through, WATL just hit me, and i had to listen to it 10 times in a row immediately. and then again. and again. for days in a row. i just couldn't believe this gem of a song existed for 30 years and i've never heard of it.


I used to listen to side four of the Tusk album to fall asleep to. I would just be dozing off when Tusk would jarr me awake momentarily. But then I'd casually drift back into dreamland and rarely ever got to hear Never Forget. Honey Hi, Beautiful Child and Walk A Thin Line were all such lullabies for me during those times. Eventually when I put the same collection on tape I replaced Tusk with Brown Eyes and those 5 songs were my sleeping pill.

That's the great thing about buying albums Elle, in that you will hear many gems that never saw the light of day on anyone's radio station.

[Zanobbi]

Stand Back is grotesque live.

"Grotesque", that's the best word to define it. And FM live version is even worst than SN. I miss the power that song had live in 83.
Sara
Dreams
Gypsy
Second Hand News

[aleuzzi]

FM is one of those bands where whether a song sounds good or not live depends almost entirely on the collective energy in a performance. Landslide sometimes sounds fantastic live, other times awful. The same can be said of Dreams, Go Your Own Way, or any number of their songs.

But, in general, the live versions of songs that often fail to spark for me on a playback include "Don't Stop," "Gypsy," "Say You Love Me" (as much as it hurts me to type that)--in other words, some of the big hits that sounded great in the studio but benefit from flawless vocals and sophisticated arrangements.

Then there are those songs that really hit during a live show but when heard played back might sound less, uh, wonderful. Consider the Mirage concert video performance of "Love in Store," which had the crowd riled up and where, instrumentally at least, the bad was cooking. But Christine's vocals there were pretty awful on the playback. I've thought that way about versions of "Stand Back" and "Go Your Own Way," too.

"Hold Me" has been mentioned above but I think the live version I heard of it was charming.

[michelej1]

FM is one of those bands where whether a song sounds good or not live depends almost entirely on the collective energy in a performance. Landslide sometimes sounds fantastic live, other times awful. The same can be said of Dreams, Go Your Own Way, or any number of their songs.

But, in general, the live versions of songs that often fail to spark for me on a playback include "Don't Stop," "Gypsy," "Say You Love Me" (as much as it hurts me to type that).

But I thought SYLM was a highlight of the Dance tour. Maybe because of the collective energy you mentioned.

Michele

[DashingDan]

Consider the Mirage concert video performance of "Love in Store," which had the crowd riled up and where, instrumentally at least, the bad was cooking. But Christine's vocals there were pretty awful on the playback.

So true! "Cooking" is the right word choice.

[FierySequences]

Stand Back is grotesque live.

mitzo, respectivelly we are all entitled to our opinions. I'm curious why you describe it as groteque.

IMO, it sounds nothing like it was originally intended in 83, but I don't find anything repulsive about it.

Surely, Stevie and Mick and millions of fans that love it live don't find it grotesque. If the band felt they couldn't pull off a decent version of it, it would have been dropped from the setlist by now.

[turquoise5]

Shorten Not That Funny, World Turning, and I'm So Afraid.....cut those solos WAY down....and they would all work better in concert.

Dreams live never has gotten the moody, mysterious vibe that the recorded version has.

[mitzo]

mitzo, respectivelly we are all entitled to our opinions. I'm curious why you describe it as groteque.

IMO, it sounds nothing like it was originally intended in 83, but I don't find anything repulsive about it.

Surely, Stevie and Mick and millions of fans that love it live don't find it grotesque. If the band felt they couldn't pull off a decent version of it, it would have been dropped from the setlist by now.

I know many like SB live but not me, for sure. What I hear is a hideous wall of thudding noise instead of instrumental music, and a load of winded hoarse off-key monotone bellowing and shouting from Stevie. It embarrasses me and I cannot imagine how, if she has ever seen or heard it played back, she could ever do that again.

[On Ice]

Adding to the Stand Back discussion, it deserves to go if only to include one of the dozens of great songs that are overlooked to play it. Toss in Go Insane too, ditch it for something like Save Me a Place. The band and definitely Stevie have outgrown the song, I love the Wild Heart version, but past that tour, it has really not been done justice for many years, soundstage being an exception.

[KindOfWoman90]

Adding to the Stand Back discussion, it deserves to go if only to include one of the dozens of great songs that are overlooked to play it. Toss in Go Insane too, ditch it for something like Save Me a Place. The band and definitely Stevie have outgrown the song, I love the Wild Heart version, but past that tour, it has really not been done justice for many years, soundstage being an exception.

I have fun with SB at concerts, but since this is FM I'd love for both of their solo songs to be replaced with FM songs that deserve some love. I love Save Me a Place, I doubt they'd replace Go Insane with that one ;) But there are dozens of songs I'd love to hear!

Side note, I've been watching different live performances recently because of this discussion and yes, are some better than others, of course - But, I'm starting to feel bad about citing bad performances :o Ultimately, when you are there, at the concert, I think you can't help but get caught up in the moment! I guess what I'm trying to say is I know I'm going to have a blast regardless of what they play, and I know they'll sound great :p

[blemelin]

Stevie hasn't seemed really interested in a Fleetwood Mac venture (whether recording or touring) since 1997's "The Dance" enterprise. Maybe it's because Christine left. Maybe it's because she's now the only girl/woman. Maybe it's because of computers or the internet or piracy or because "no one buys albums anymore" and it "breaks [my] heart." Maybe it's because she hasn't been relevant outside her fan base for so long. She just doesn't attract new listeners in large numbers anymore because her lyrics are so obtuse and self-involved, and she's practically incapable of telling/singing stories that non-fans can understand (since about 1985, maybe 1989 if one is being generous).

I've been watching old footage, and compared to what they once were, they're just not very tight as a band--MUSICALLY--anymore. Their timing is pretty awful. If it weren't for Lindsey, they wouldn't be able to hold it together. I saw them three times on the so-called "Unleashed" tour, which was anything but "unleashed." The performances I saw, including Madison Square Garden, were plodding, bloated, worn and drawn out. By the end of each show I saw, the audience was talking to each other more than they were watching the show. And a LOT of people were saying how they should never be allowed to play MSG again.

The set list for the 2013 tour would have to be pretty far-out and unusual for me to shell out the exorbitant amount of money it takes to score a decent ticket. And even then, do I really want a good seat to see a worn-out band whose members can barely function as a unit?

[Jondalar]

Stevie hasn't seemed really interested in a Fleetwood Mac venture (whether recording or touring) since 1997's "The Dance" enterprise. Maybe it's because Christine left. Maybe it's because she's now the only girl/woman. Maybe it's because of computers or the internet or piracy or because "no one buys albums anymore" and it "breaks [my] heart." Maybe it's because she hasn't been relevant outside her fan base for so long. She just doesn't attract new listeners in large numbers anymore because her lyrics are so obtuse and self-involved, and she's practically incapable of telling/singing stories that non-fans can understand (since about 1985, maybe 1989 if one is being generous).

I've been watching old footage, and compared to what they once were, they're just not very tight as a band--MUSICALLY--anymore. Their timing is pretty awful. If it weren't for Lindsey, they wouldn't be able to hold it together. I saw them three times on the so-called "Unleashed" tour, which was anything but "unleashed." The performances I saw, including Madison Square Garden, were plodding, bloated, worn and drawn out. By the end of each show I saw, the audience was talking to each other more than they were watching the show. And a LOT of people were saying how they should never be allowed to play MSG again.

The set list for the 2013 tour would have to be pretty far-out and unusual for me to shell out the exorbitant amount of money it takes to score a decent ticket. And even then, do I really want a good seat to see a worn-out band whose members can barely function as a unit?

For God's sakes, they are in their 60s and missing Christine. For their age, they are doing really well.

[FierySequences]

For God's sakes, they are in their 60s and missing Christine. For their age, they are doing really well.

Yes, I agree...but I also agree with blemelin that Stevie seems disinterested and going through the motions on most songs....but then kicks it up a notch for SB and GDW.

and that's the only thing I agree with on that post. I still love the band live b/c they still rock!

[FierySequences]

I know many like SB live but not me, for sure. What I hear is a hideous wall of thudding noise instead of instrumental music, and a load of winded hoarse off-key monotone bellowing and shouting from Stevie. It embarrasses me and I cannot imagine how, if she has ever seen or heard it played back, she could ever do that again.

Fair enough...I don't completely agree with you, however I do notice a difference in the way Stevie tackles SB and delivers it with Mac vs. Solo.

The Live in Chicago solo dvd was awesome and Stevie delivered a powerful performance of this song and many, many other tunes.

Which leads me to question why SN gives 100% for her solo gigs and barely just goes through the motions with FM. These are her songs, one would think that she would still want to reach near perfection performances regardless of whom was backing her.

[aleuzzi]

But I thought SYLM was a highlight of the Dance tour. Maybe because of the collective energy you mentioned.

Michele

Agreed! I think of the dance tour arrangement/performances as exceptions to the decades of live performances of the song. Something about the piano in the original doesn't translate to the electric keyboard live. The piano drives the song, so if that isn't clicking...

[CADreaming]

mitzo, respectivelly we are all entitled to our opinions. I'm curious why you describe it as groteque.

IMO, it sounds nothing like it was originally intended in 83, but I don't find anything repulsive about it.

Surely, Stevie and Mick and millions of fans that love it live don't find it grotesque. If the band felt they couldn't pull off a decent version of it, it would have been dropped from the setlist by now.

I really enjoy the live version so much more than the recording. The recording is way too slow.

Plus, it's hilarious to watch Lindsey singing along and acting up with it onstage. Especially on "give me a little sympathy" when he beats his chest. LOL.

[michelej1]

Plus, it's hilarious to watch Lindsey singing along and acting up with it onstage. Especially on "give me a little sympathy" when he beats his chest. LOL.

That is cute. Michele

[SteveMacD]

I can't think of a horrible live song, however somebody needs to tell Lindsey to knock off the psychobabble during his banter. I'm wanna see a RAWK show, not hear what you learned from your therapist. Get on the mic, tell the Eagles to go F**K themselves, and play IKINW.

[louielouie2000]

Brown Eyes did not translate to the stage unfortunately. :distress:

Not That Funny was utterly obnoxious live. :eek:

[KarmaContestant]

I don't know that I would agree any Fleetwood Mac songs are "horrible" performed live, but I'd agree that *many* individual performances are lacking in energy, enthusiasm and interest.

Typically it's Stevie's songs that fall into this category, but the blame does not fall with the song, but rather the performers and musicians not executing the songs with any desire to impress.

[Sleepless-Child]

Certainly, if you tie the song into something specific in your life it's going to change it for you. I think I feel that way about the entire Mirage album, taking it beyond the quality of the songs and into the personal memories they invoke for me.




Oh, Sinatra wouldn't even record Say Goodbye. It wasn't his style at all. I'm proud to say he did record one of Sonny's songs: Bang Bang (My Baby Shot Me Down).

Michele

Hehehe :thumbsup::thumbsup:. Although i thought only Nancy recorded it (?). Her version is the best, the arrangements and her voice bring so much depth.
I love Sonny because he wasn't mainly a songwriter but he wrote some of the most legendary songs of all time.

[MacShadowsBall]

Agreed! I think of the dance tour arrangement/performances as exceptions to the decades of live performances of the song. Something about the piano in the original doesn't translate to the electric keyboard live. The piano drives the song, so if that isn't clicking...

Say You Love Me is absolutely a piano driven pop-rock song. You can hear very well the chord changes and everything. One of the reasons it's one of my favorite Mac songs is because of the unforgiving hard piano.

Now the single version is more guitar/drums driven, but still enought piano. :cool:

[michelej1]

Hehehe :thumbsup::thumbsup:. Although i thought only Nancy recorded it (?).

Oh yeah. That was even the title of Frank's album: She Shot Me Down. It was great.

Michele

[David]

I never liked "Love in Store" live that one year. On album, it wasn't that spectacular anyway, but it was certainly possible to get more of that texture on stage, and they didn't bother. They blew it; they really threw it away. Christine came down heavy on the B3 (as if it were an "I'm So Afraid" dirge), Mick made a boneheaded decision to pile-drive the tempo, and the three singers didn't connect at all harmonically on the chorus. They should have substituted something else for "Love in Store" if no one was going to put any effort into it.

[aleuzzi]

I never liked "Love in Store" live that one year. On album, it wasn't that spectacular anyway, but it was certainly possible to get more of that texture on stage, and they didn't bother. They blew it; they really threw it away. Christine came down heavy on the B3 (as if it were an "I'm So Afraid" dirge), Mick made a boneheaded decision to pile-drive the tempo, and the three singers didn't connect at all harmonically on the chorus. They should have substituted something else for "Love in Store" if no one was going to put any effort into it.

They were all high--at least that's how the vocals sounded.