Stevie's Soft vs. Loud Voice

[jannieC]

I've mentioned this in other threads, but I don't remember ever really getting an answer. Is it more difficult to sing softly than it is to belt out a song? Is it an issue of control? A big part of my love of Stevie's voice comes from soft, unexpected moments. I notice that when Stevie sings live, she sings strongly in places where she didn't used to. I think Landslide lost its appeal to me years ago because of that.

[OutsideTheRain]

It seemed Stevie lost a lot of those dynamics you speak of when she started using in-ear monitors. She seems to sing with that same strength and volume throughout every performance. I think it's an audio thing more than anything. I am a professional singer, and I can tell you when I use in ear monitors, the sound is so accurate that you often lose the passion in the performance. I think between her monitors and a vocal coach she probably stays "on script". I think it really does make me miss some of the mystery and allure of Stevie's early vocals, I heard someone say of her once "she never sang the same song, the same way twice". I don't know if that is true of her anymore unfortunately.

[On Ice]

In the past Stevie has used her softer tones in concert but I think over the years it has become a matter of confidence. Around the Tusk era when her vocal range deepened and she forever shied away from the live higher notes, belting actually became easier for her. Certainly in the modern era, I think it has become a way for her to take care of her voice. I find however in a few of live renditions of songs that the louder tone does not suit the song and the song for me loses appeal. I found this especially with Storms and later versions of Silver Springs after the Dance era. Her early louder tones however were fantastic and I found that she used them more appropriately in the earlier Mac days to about the end of the Wild Heart tour. Fast forward to today, and I think the latest album and the live versions are showing a better control and closer to her mid-later 90's vocal comeback. TISL and Say You Will for me were both hit and miss as to whether she carried the tones successfully.

[GoldDustWoman22]

I do think that singing softly intentionally is harder than singing loudly unintentionally. Sometimes, you get a situation where a person can't sing softly so your really bored during the song until they get to the loud part. I think in Stevie's case though she may sing louder because she still wants to prove that her voice is strong at her age. I do think that FWIW has lost just teeny tiny bit of is meaning when she performs it live. Because of her belting out all of the notes.

Btw, I totally agree with you about Landslide. To me the definitive version of that song is the one on the FM Live album. The fragility in her voice totally puts the lyrics to that song in perspective.

[mitzo]

In recent years she really does drop-dead vocals on her ballads, but she tends to disintegrate into hoarse, winded, bellowing vocals on some of her more uptempo things.

[louielouie2000]

I've mentioned this in other threads, but I don't remember ever really getting an answer. Is it more difficult to sing softly than it is to belt out a song? Is it an issue of control? A big part of my love of Stevie's voice comes from soft, unexpected moments. I notice that when Stevie sings live, she sings strongly in places where she didn't used to. I think Landslide lost its appeal to me years ago because of that.

Apparently singing softly not only requires more skill, but can also damage the vocal chords. Stevie's only been doing her now-patented scream-belt since she's been using vocal coaches (since roughly the Dance era). Before, she sort of sang from the back of her throat... which gave her voice a beautiful tone, IMO. These days she pushes her voice out from her diaphragm... which really is the 'proper' way to sing. But I think it's totally ruined the character of her voice & it's beautiful nuances. She's been throwing in softer interludes into her songs lately, but it's almost like a lightswitch... there's no transitioning, and it comes across as quite jagged. Stevie has thanked and praised her vocal coach for nearly 15 years now, but I just don't think coaching has been good to her at all. It's not like he's saved her voice from deterioration... I think her voice has deteriorated more in the past 10 years than it did in the 30 years prior. But these are just my opinions... I'm sure others will fiercely disagree with my summations. :)

[bombaysaffires]

Btw, I totally agree with you about Landslide. To me the definitive version of that song is the one on the FM Live album. The fragility in her voice totally puts the lyrics to that song in perspective.

Completely agree!!

[WildHearted]

It's not a matter of singing softly being bad for your vocal chords, it's a matter of singing softly incorrectly being bad for them - just like singing loudly incorrectly can also damage them. My guess is that Stevie had probably been doing both of those things.

It seems most likely to me, that Stevie probably has damaged her voice (I use probably loosely, I think it's very obvious..) over the years, and as a result, she no longer has as much control over her voice when she sings softly. That's why in a live setting in particular, she tends to belt things out. That's why we got the soft voice on the Moonlight studio version (she CAN still sing softly), but we don't get it at the concerts.

Edit: louie, I agree about the degradation of her voice. Listening to live vocals from 10 years ago is a huge difference from now. Stevie may have lost some range between 1975 and 1997, but what she's lost now is a lot of her unique tone quality and color.

[On Ice]

Here is a stunning version of Landslide out of the Dance Era. Her tone and texture is often better here than the studio version:

http://youtu.be/FhNrrrCCTdA

Don't know if the link will work, but it's U-Tube of Stevie and Lindsey I think from David Letterman.

[On Ice]

I disagree that Stevie has completely lost her tone and texture, I think it's very present on In Your Dreams and some songs live, such as Love Is and Moonlight. But I do agree as a whole that it is difficult for her to carry a whole concert and some songs just need to be retired. Personally, I would love it if she devoted more time to recording and made occasional appearances like this year's Wiltern or maybe 12-24 date tours (of different areas), and save the stellar vocals (that I truly believe she still has in her) for recording purposes. Besides have we ever known an artist who the bulk of her best work is recorded but unreleased? :o

[Etisl]

The singing stronger vs. softer may depend on the voice itself and also the lenght of time singing. I am a singer, and for me when I first start it is much easier to get the falsetto's, etc. After a few songs my vocal range can change a bit as it warms up. When I first start singing, it is not so easy to belt out those strong loud vocals, but after about 3-4 sounds I am right there getting the sweet tone. I can hit the highest notes when my voice is warmed up, but not the soft high notes. For my specific vocal tone, I have to hit the high notes much stronger. They are clearer, but I couldn't sing something like "Beautiful Child" right after belting out "The Ghost's are Gone". My voice needs to rest 5-10 minutes before the chords kind of get back to a normal place.

For Stevie, because she is belting out songs for 90 mins on stage, it is very hard for her to hit those falsetto's for example in "Sorcerer", it is probably much easier to lower the register or just sing the notes in full force. When I try to sing soft notes after a strong song.... my voice tends to crack when I hit the falsetto's.

But, like I mentioned it does depend on your vocal type and alot on your training. I can say my voice can now go for longer periods of time the more careful I am with it. but, if you want to get those really pretty soft tones from me I do need some hot tea, lime, and a few minutes to let my voice rest.

[fringed n fab]

I also miss her lighter softer vocals and think it has more to do with a (boring) vocal coach these days. Sure she might have been wrecking her voice singing all over the place those early years but that was when she was the most exciting and fun. I also agree with some other artists who sing lightly like Alison Krauss and Patty Griffin, sometimes a whisper is louder than a scream when singing cause those two ladies can sing with a whisper and it still hit up in the rafters because of their singing style. :nod:

[mikephxaz]

very interesting discussion ....i'm not a singer and know nothing about the art of singing...i have been a long time fan of stevie and have witnessed her losing the infliction in her voice...and the varity of notes she will use....all i can say is that regardless of her limitations, as time has passsed she has vastly improved with holding her notes and staying on key...she is doing something right...must be the vocal coach!

[MarkMc1990]

Agreed. Listen to any recording of Landslide from the Tusk Tour and none of them are identical, she always finds some word or phrase or lyric or melody in the song to sing differently.

[windbecame]

ahh, i love that she's at least been bringing back the soft voice for some of her vocals. i think part of the reason i don't care for Love Is on TISL (besides Sarah M background vocals sounding like a garbage truck backin up..boop boop boop) is when Stevie belts out "corner of her MOOOOOUUUUTH!!" it just makes me cringe, if i listen to it at all. I do like it live tho' cuz she softened that up just a tad. if only she could go in and re-record it... tho i know most people just love it... the loud, belting vocal just doesn't work for me on any ballad?? sorry:o

[GypsySorcerer]

ahh, i love that she's at least been bringing back the soft voice for some of her vocals. i think part of the reason i don't care for Love Is on TISL (besides Sarah M background vocals sounding like a garbage truck backin up..boop boop boop) is when Stevie belts out "corner of her MOOOOOUUUUTH!!" it just makes me cringe, if i listen to it at all. I do like it live tho' cuz she softened that up just a tad. if only she could go in and re-record it... tho i know most people just love it... the loud, belting vocal just doesn't work for me on any ballad?? sorry:o

:laugh: Perfect description.


I'm not a fan of the "shouting-singing" thing, either. I did think she sounded great on The Dance/Enchanted... but since Trouble in Shangri-La, she just hasn't been the same. Her recent singing has been a bit better.

[HejiraNYC]

:laugh: Perfect description.


I'm not a fan of the "shouting-singing" thing, either. I did think she sounded great on The Dance/Enchanted... but since Trouble in Shangri-La, she just hasn't been the same. Her recent singing has been a bit better.

I think the Dance/Enchanted tours were marked by some of her worst singing in recent memory- often off-pitch, shouty and ragged. I cringe often when I listen to her 1998 Woodstock show.

I think she is clearly able to sing softly when she wants to, as evidenced by her live harmonies on "Say Goodbye." But I think she shies away from using the soft voice on lead vocals simply because she has never had the ability to project her falsetto very well. Her voice is either reedy with a sharp edge, or feathery and wispy; there is just no in-between with her voice. Accordingly, she is probably not able to control the pitch and consistency of her falsetto very easily, especially when she is trying to compete with thudding drums and crunchy guitar riffs in her monitor. I do not blame her for belting things out- it's much more predictable and consistent, whereas it would suck mightily to sing falsetto and hit some bad notes. During her intro to "Leather and Lace" at the Bristow show, she told her usual story about using a vocal coach and taking voice lessons every day. But she added an interesting anecdote about listening to "cassettes" of Fleetwood Mac shows from the 1970s and remarking about all of the "bad singing" and having lots of bad nights on the road. Of course the audience audibly showed its disagreement with that statement. :lol: So, needless to say, in Stevie's world, singing a song differently every night is a bad thing, while projecting from the diaphragm and singing consistently every night is a good thing. I think there is merit to her views on this even though I do wish she would occasionally surprise us with a falsetto note here and there.

[Macfanforever]

I played the 1986 Red Rocks vid for my friend.He said it stinked.I explained to him after seen it about she was out of it.Now he seems to like her singing.except for the 2010 Foxwoods MGM show where the sound was not good.To echoey he said.As we know her vocal range changed as she is getting older.

[jannieC]

I do think that singing softly intentionally is harder than singing loudly unintentionally. Sometimes, you get a situation where a person can't sing softly so your really bored during the song until they get to the loud part. I think in Stevie's case though she may sing louder because she still wants to prove that her voice is strong at her age. I do think that FWIW has lost just teeny tiny bit of is meaning when she performs it live. Because of her belting out all of the notes.

Btw, I totally agree with you about Landslide. To me the definitive version of that song is the one on the FM Live album. The fragility in her voice totally puts the lyrics to that song in perspective.

Yes. FWIW totally won me over on the CD because of the fragility and vulnerabliity. It does not have the same feeling (for me) when it's belted out. And as I sit here at work :) I'm thinking of Gold Dust Woman (...rock on, ancient queen. Follow those who pale in your SHADOW) as an example. Storms is another good one. I'm not necessarily thinking of the falsetto AND the soft together. Just the soft.

The singing stronger vs. softer may depend on the voice itself and also the lenght of time singing. I am a singer, and for me when I first start it is much easier to get the falsetto's, etc. After a few songs my vocal range can change a bit as it warms up. When I first start singing, it is not so easy to belt out those strong loud vocals, but after about 3-4 sounds I am right there getting the sweet tone. I can hit the highest notes when my voice is warmed up, but not the soft high notes. For my specific vocal tone, I have to hit the high notes much stronger. They are clearer, but I couldn't sing something like "Beautiful Child" right after belting out "The Ghost's are Gone". My voice needs to rest 5-10 minutes before the chords kind of get back to a normal place.

For Stevie, because she is belting out songs for 90 mins on stage, it is very hard for her to hit those falsetto's for example in "Sorcerer", it is probably much easier to lower the register or just sing the notes in full force. When I try to sing soft notes after a strong song.... my voice tends to crack when I hit the falsetto's.

But, like I mentioned it does depend on your vocal type and alot on your training. I can say my voice can now go for longer periods of time the more careful I am with it. but, if you want to get those really pretty soft tones from me I do need some hot tea, lime, and a few minutes to let my voice rest.

This was really interesting- thank you for your input! Next time I have front row, I am going to present Stevie with some hot tea and lime if I sense a need. :laugh:

[fringed n fab]

I think the Dance/Enchanted tours were marked by some of her worst singing in recent memory- often off-pitch, shouty and ragged. I cringe often when I listen to her 1998 Woodstock show.

I think she is clearly able to sing softly when she wants to, as evidenced by her live harmonies on "Say Goodbye." But I think she shies away from using the soft voice on lead vocals simply because she has never had the ability to project her falsetto very well. Her voice is either reedy with a sharp edge, or feathery and wispy; there is just no in-between with her voice. Accordingly, she is probably not able to control the pitch and consistency of her falsetto very easily, especially when she is trying to compete with thudding drums and crunchy guitar riffs in her monitor. I do not blame her for belting things out- it's much more predictable and consistent, whereas it would suck mightily to sing falsetto and hit some bad notes. During her intro to "Leather and Lace" at the Bristow show, she told her usual story about using a vocal coach and taking voice lessons every day. But she added an interesting anecdote about listening to "cassettes" of Fleetwood Mac shows from the 1970s and remarking about all of the "bad singing" and having lots of bad nights on the road. Of course the audience audibly showed its disagreement with that statement. :lol: So, needless to say, in Stevie's world, singing a song differently every night is a bad thing, while projecting from the diaphragm and singing consistently every night is a good thing. I think there is merit to her views on this even though I do wish she would occasionally surprise us with a falsetto note here and there.

I thought she sung great during the Dance/Enchanted years and was in top form when I saw her both times in Cincinnati on those tours. I think the Woodstock video she was either having fun singing and carefree with the crowd, or was a bit tipsy acting even? I've always thought. Or maybe something was just on her mind and bothering her that night judging by the end.

[KarmaContestant]

I know I'm generalizing - so I apologize - but I think a lot of the shouting she does on stage is her trying to compensate for the volume of Waddy's guitar. It's annoying unless the song is a full-fleged rocker like Edge.

Again, I may be wrong, but I can't help but wonder if a softer, quieter, unplugged acoustic performance would allow her to sing the vocals instead of yelling them over the band.

Like the AHI acoustic Gypsy, with Lindsey. :nod:

[Etisl]

I think the Dance/Enchanted tours were marked by some of her worst singing in recent memory- often off-pitch, shouty and ragged. I cringe often when I listen to her 1998 Woodstock show.

I think she is clearly able to sing softly when she wants to, as evidenced by her live harmonies on "Say Goodbye." But I think she shies away from using the soft voice on lead vocals simply because she has never had the ability to project her falsetto very well. Her voice is either reedy with a sharp edge, or feathery and wispy; there is just no in-between with her voice. Accordingly, she is probably not able to control the pitch and consistency of her falsetto very easily, especially when she is trying to compete with thudding drums and crunchy guitar riffs in her monitor. I do not blame her for belting things out- it's much more predictable and consistent, whereas it would suck mightily to sing falsetto and hit some bad notes. During her intro to "Leather and Lace" at the Bristow show, she told her usual story about using a vocal coach and taking voice lessons every day. But she added an interesting anecdote about listening to "cassettes" of Fleetwood Mac shows from the 1970s and remarking about all of the "bad singing" and having lots of bad nights on the road. Of course the audience audibly showed its disagreement with that statement. :lol: So, needless to say, in Stevie's world, singing a song differently every night is a bad thing, while projecting from the diaphragm and singing consistently every night is a good thing. I think there is merit to her views on this even though I do wish she would occasionally surprise us with a falsetto note here and there.


I have to admit, I do agree. As much as I love Stevie, I think she did have quite a few "bad" nights during those tours, but atleast she admits it. I just wonder if back then she still didn't have her confidence back, like maybe she didn't realize how much people still loved her and wanted to see her.

Her stage presence now is like the article said "commanding". She owns the stage now, and it's almost like she is very comfortable singing, and very relaxed but at the same time very confident. I see her now, it truly looks "very natural" like she is not trying to hard to be too perfect.....and by doing this, she sounds really amazing. It makes me very happy to see Stevie enjoying herself on stage, and talking with the audiences.

For a woman who has been doing this for decades, she still has this need to want to be good at what she does. She almost has this innocence back now. If you are straight, gay, or old, or young.......... Stevie Nicks still has the ability to make you fall in love with her....from the moment she steps on that stage. Everytime I see her, I feel like I am 13 years old again......walking into Reunion Arena in Dallas to see the Wild Heart Tour. I have seen many concerts, but.... no one will ever compare in my lifetime. She is truly doing what God meant for her to do!!! And, I hope she NEVER STOPS!!!!!

[mitzo]

I know I'm generalizing - so I apologize - but I think a lot of the shouting she does on stage is her trying to compensate for the volume of Waddy's guitar. It's annoying unless the song is a full-fleged rocker like Edge.

Again, I may be wrong, but I can't help but wonder if a softer, quieter, unplugged acoustic performance would allow her to sing the vocals instead of yelling them over the band.

Like the AHI acoustic Gypsy, with Lindsey. :nod:

Absolutely .... I haven't enjoyed her live except for tender ballads, she has to shout over a wall of noise on uptempo songs and it sounds bad.

[mitzo]

ahh, i love that she's at least been bringing back the soft voice for some of her vocals. i think part of the reason i don't care for Love Is on TISL (besides Sarah M background vocals sounding like a garbage truck backin up..boop boop boop) is when Stevie belts out "corner of her MOOOOOUUUUTH!!" it just makes me cringe, if i listen to it at all. I do like it live tho' cuz she softened that up just a tad. if only she could go in and re-record it... tho i know most people just love it... the loud, belting vocal just doesn't work for me on any ballad?? sorry:o

A beautiful, creative piece of production, the album version of Love Is. Sarah and her band should have produced more of Stevie's work IMO.

[windbecame]

:laugh: boop boop boop:laugh: sorry couldn't resist!!!

[darklinensuit]

Stevie's only been doing her now-patented scream-belt since she's been using vocal coaches (since roughly the Dance era). Before, she sort of sang from the back of her throat

Yes, for a long time she sang from the back of her goat.:angel:
(Somewhere Emily Litella is sorry she missed this one.)

I think that she is doing more with less these days. It used to be that Stevie's voice sounded layered in & of itself, sort of like what they say about individual Tibetan monks being able to sing chords at the same time. Moreover, it sounded effortless from her, whether she belted, rasped, or whispered. Her voice has gotten pared down over the years, which is not to say that it's bad, and it's certainly far better than 20 years ago. But it's not as effortless as it was 30 years ago, even if she was damaging that voice while she sang so beautifully.

And yes, Nancy, I know I did nothing to answer your question, and I plead school. :D

- Jake