Stevie's most criminal songs

[porkpie]

OK - let em start by saying I don't want to slag Stevie but considering how awesome IYD is it got me thinking about what she was thinking at times when the quality control slipped (in my opinion) and wondered if others feel the same.

For me, the worst songs are Silver Girl and Sweet Girl. I think lyrically and musically they're both dull and I hate it when she writes a barely disguised version of herself in the third person as a character. At the time of the Dance, I foundnit really hard to believe that was the strongest song she could have come up with considering that Lyndsey and Christine's songs were all pretty strong. The ther nght I rewatched Destiny Rules and Mick was talking aobut what a strong set of songs Stevie brought to the project, but again I'm surprised Silver Girl made the cut.

What are everyone else's thoughts on these songs?

[tabruns]

I agree with you in that Stevie had a period of years where the quality of her material slipped, but I wouldn't pick "Silver Girl" or especially "Sweet Girl" (which I consider to be a strong song) as evidence of same.

For me Nicks' career has been something like this:

1. Classic Nicks (includes the albums Fleetwood Mac, Rumours, Tusk and Bella Donna) - the fact that Nicks could only get her best songs on the first 3 Mac albums helped establish her reputation as a talented songwriter. For her first solo album she was able to cull from a big backlog of songs, so she came up with a very strong set.

2. Cocaine Nicks (Mirage, Wild Heart and Rock A Little) - For these albums Nicks still has moments of brilliance but you can see the effect that massive cocaine use is having on her music. She's getting somewhat sloppy, and some of the songs lack the focus of the earlier material. Each consecutive album shows more of the impact of coke.

3. Klonopin Nicks (Tango In The Night, The Other Side Of The Mirror, Behind The Mask, Street Angel). While coke made Nicks erratic and wild, klonopin dulled her senses and her songwriting ability. Again, each consecutive album shows more of the effect - by the time of Street Angel, Nicks was reduced to recording songs that had been left-overs from previous recording sessions. Her songs during this period became more and more pedestrian, lacking that magic spark that they used to have. She also began to rely more on outside writers for the music than previously.

4. Recovery Nicks ("Paper Doll", "Twisted", The Dance, Trouble In Shangri-La, Say You Will, In Your Dreams). IMO what we see here are momentary returns to form ("Paper Doll", "Twisted" and "Sweet Girl") that became more and more consistent as time went on. TISL was Nicks' most focused album since Bella Donna. Had Say You Will been a regular Mac album - i.e. with 3 Nicks songs on it - she probably would have turned in "Say You Will", "Thrown Down" and I think "Illume" (even though many people on here don't like it....she, Lindsey and Mick all do). In Your Dreams is a great album, probably her first to really reach "classic Mac" levels.

[Thrown_Down]

I agree with you in that Stevie had a period of years where the quality of her material slipped, but I wouldn't pick "Silver Girl" or especially "Sweet Girl" (which I consider to be a strong song) as evidence of same.

For me Nicks' career has been something like this:

1. Classic Nicks (includes the albums Fleetwood Mac, Rumours, Tusk and Bella Donna) - the fact that Nicks could only get her best songs on the first 3 Mac albums helped establish her reputation as a talented songwriter. For her first solo album she was able to cull from a big backlog of songs, so she came up with a very strong set.

2. Cocaine Nicks (Mirage, Wild Heart and Rock A Little) - For these albums Nicks still has moments of brilliance but you can see the effect that massive cocaine use is having on her music. She's getting somewhat sloppy, and some of the songs lack the focus of the earlier material. Each consecutive album shows more of the impact of coke.

3. Klonopin Nicks (Tango In The Night, The Other Side Of The Mirror, Behind The Mask, Street Angel). While coke made Nicks erratic and wild, klonopin dulled her senses and her songwriting ability. Again, each consecutive album shows more of the effect - by the time of Street Angel, Nicks was reduced to recording songs that had been left-overs from previous recording sessions. Her songs during this period became more and more pedestrian, lacking that magic spark that they used to have. She also began to rely more on outside writers for the music than previously.

4. Recovery Nicks ("Paper Doll", "Twisted", The Dance, Trouble In Shangri-La, Say You Will, In Your Dreams). IMO what we see here are momentary returns to form ("Paper Doll", "Twisted" and "Sweet Girl") that became more and more consistent as time went on. TISL was Nicks' most focused album since Bella Donna. Had Say You Will been a regular Mac album - i.e. with 3 Nicks songs on it - she probably would have turned in "Say You Will", "Thrown Down" and I think "Illume" (even though many people on here don't like it....she, Lindsey and Mick all do). In Your Dreams is a great album, probably her first to really reach "classic Mac" levels.

I'd agree with all that, but I would be more inclined to put Wild Heart in the classic section.

[tabruns]

I'd agree with all that, but I would be more inclined to put Wild Heart in the classic section.

Yep. And some would put Rock A Little in classic mode as well.

It should be stressed that even though Nicks was producing albums while dependent on coke and then on klonopin that she was still making music that people love....even though one can hear the effect of each on the albums. This is particularly true of albums produced later in the dependency.

The only work of hers that I have a hard time embracing is the Tango In The Night-Behind The Mask-Street Angel period. IMO during those albums she was rarely producing songs anywhere near the quality of her earlier work, and the best track from that time period ("Seven Wonders") wasn't written by her at all.

[fumidesigns]

I agree with you in that Stevie had a period of years where the quality of her material slipped, but I wouldn't pick "Silver Girl" or especially "Sweet Girl" (which I consider to be a strong song) as evidence of same.

For me Nicks' career has been something like this:

1. Classic Nicks (includes the albums Fleetwood Mac, Rumours, Tusk and Bella Donna) - the fact that Nicks could only get her best songs on the first 3 Mac albums helped establish her reputation as a talented songwriter. For her first solo album she was able to cull from a big backlog of songs, so she came up with a very strong set.

2. Cocaine Nicks (Mirage, Wild Heart and Rock A Little) - For these albums Nicks still has moments of brilliance but you can see the effect that massive cocaine use is having on her music. She's getting somewhat sloppy, and some of the songs lack the focus of the earlier material. Each consecutive album shows more of the impact of coke.

3. Klonopin Nicks (Tango In The Night, The Other Side Of The Mirror, Behind The Mask, Street Angel). While coke made Nicks erratic and wild, klonopin dulled her senses and her songwriting ability. Again, each consecutive album shows more of the effect - by the time of Street Angel, Nicks was reduced to recording songs that had been left-overs from previous recording sessions. Her songs during this period became more and more pedestrian, lacking that magic spark that they used to have. She also began to rely more on outside writers for the music than previously.

4. Recovery Nicks ("Paper Doll", "Twisted", The Dance, Trouble In Shangri-La, Say You Will, In Your Dreams). IMO what we see here are momentary returns to form ("Paper Doll", "Twisted" and "Sweet Girl") that became more and more consistent as time went on. TISL was Nicks' most focused album since Bella Donna. Had Say You Will been a regular Mac album - i.e. with 3 Nicks songs on it - she probably would have turned in "Say You Will", "Thrown Down" and I think "Illume" (even though many people on here don't like it....she, Lindsey and Mick all do). In Your Dreams is a great album, probably her first to really reach "classic Mac" levels.

well said my dear!!!!! :thumbsup:

[Jondalar]

Paper Doll and Sweet Girl were awful.

[BombaySapphire3]

, and the best track from that time period ("Seven Wonders") wasn't written by her at all.

and neither was it recorded during the Klonopin era but rather over Halloween weekend of 1986 just before she went to Betty Ford making it the last of her "coke" songs.

[Christopher]

I'd agree with all that, but I would be more inclined to put Wild Heart in the classic section.
Naw, "The Wild Heart" is the album when Stevie began her dependence on collaboraters (Sandy Stewart co-wrote the music tracks on 3 songs & Petty again wrote one, while Prince basically wrote the music track to Stand Back, which is essentially Little Red Corvette's chord progression with different lyrics & melody:nod:) And even more co-writer dependence when RAL was released having only 3 sole Stevie penned songs. That was a shock for us fans who were wondering where the mad hatter prolific songwriter of Bella Donna had gone.:nod:

There was so much pressure after Bella Donna's blockbuster success with its string of hit singles to deliver more of the same, that Jimmy & Stevie turned more and more to outside writers (remember JI was always on the hunt for Stevie next big single, unsure if Stevie could deliver one unintentionally on her own. So Stevie definitely ramped up her coke use after Bella Donna, not only to keep up her hectic schedule balancing FM (Mirage) & her exploding solo career going into the making The Wild Heart, not to mention she was already exhibiting obvious outward signs of abuse during the "Mirage" tour and in her person life by making wildly impulsive decisions like marrying Kim Anderson (Robin's widower).

So yeah, I'd agree that Mirage through Rock A Little, and I'd also throw in Tango In The Night were the "Cocaine Nicks" years. I add TITN only because the majority of her written or submitted material and her vocals were recorded before she went into rehab. (think "Seven Wonders" wild wicked vocals, again on display on WISYA and the outtakes & demos; "Joan Of Arc", "Juliet" & What Has Rock n'Roll Ever Done For You" :nod:). The Klonopin started to rear its head subtly during some TITN promotional interviews & the "Shake The Cage" tour later, but it was much more evident on OSOTM and that tour - which was exacerbated when Stevie broke her foot in her pool @ a month before it kicked-off, which prolly led not only to a ramp up on her Klonopin, but pain medication or Tranquilizers as well.:distress: Accordingly, her OSOTM tour has 2 distinctions. It the only tour Stevie absolutely has no recollection of... AT ALL :eek: And the foot accident led to the 1st sighting of the Stevie in Frankenboks on stage.:o

[Jondalar]

Naw, "The Wild Heart" is the album when Stevie began her dependence on collaboraters (Sandy Stewart co-wrote the music tracks on 3 songs & Petty again wrote one, while Prince basically wrote the music track to Stand Back, which is essentially Little Red Corvette's chord progression with different lyrics & melody:nod:) And even more co-writer dependence when RAL was released having only 3 sole Stevie penned songs. That was a shock for us fans who were wondering where the mad hatter prolific songwriter of Bella Donna had gone.:nod:

There was so much pressure after Bella Donna's blockbuster success with its string of hit singles to deliver more of the same, that Jimmy & Stevie turned more and more to outside writers (remember JI was always on the hunt for Stevie next big single, unsure if Stevie could deliver one unintentionally on her own. So Stevie definitely ramped up her coke use after Bella Donna, not only to keep up her hectic schedule balancing FM (Mirage) & her exploding solo career going into the making The Wild Heart, not to mention she was already exhibiting obvious outward signs of abuse during the "Mirage" tour and in her person life by making wildly impulsive decisions like marrying Kim Anderson (Robin's widower).

So yeah, I'd agree that Mirage through Rock A Little, and I'd also throw in Tango In The Night were the "Cocaine Nicks" years. I add TITN only because the majority of her written or submitted material and her vocals were recorded before she went into rehab. (think "Seven Wonders" wild wicked vocals, again on display on WISYA and the outtakes & demos; "Joan Of Arc", "Juliet" & What Has Rock n'Roll Ever Done For You" :nod:). The Klonopin started to rear its head subtly during some TITN promotional interviews & the "Shake The Cage" tour later, but it was much more evident on OSOTM and that tour - which was exacerbated when Stevie broke her foot in her pool @ a month before it kicked-off, which prolly led not only to a ramp up on her Klonopin, but pain medication or Tranquilizers as well.:distress: Accordingly, her OSOTM tour has 2 distinctions. It the only tour Stevie absolutely has no recollection of... AT ALL :eek: And the foot accident led to the 1st sighting of the Stevie in Frankenboks on stage.:o

U are giving Prince way toooo much credit for Stand Back. It's not essentially his song and eventhough it was inspired by Little Red Corvet, it doesn't sound anything like it. And the Petty song was the weakest song on the album.

[fumidesigns]

Paper Doll and Sweet Girl were awful.

damn sure are! i can't staaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand Sweet Girl! that always gets skipped! and my God when Silver Girl comes on, i just stare at my ipod and say "y haven't i taken this off here yet!?"

[Christopher]

U are giving Prince way toooo much credit for Stand Back. It's not essentially his song and eventhough it was inspired by Little Red Corvet, it doesn't sound anything like it. And the Petty song was the weakest song on the album.

All I'm saying is the chord progression is the same. Even Stevie admits that she hummed her song & lyrics right in between Prince's & viola Stand Back was born. If you have any musical ability or ear, it's easy to spot. I can sing Stand Back easily while Little Red Corvette is playing and visa versa. I agree Stevie came up with a whole different song and feel, but the chords and key are the same.

[Hawkeye]

Whats with all this Sweet Girl hate. Thats one of my all time favotie Stevie songs. It's almost her theme song. "she chose to dance across the stages of the world."

And it's a part of the Ghost through the fog triology Fumi, you can't hate it :laugh:

[bluefox4000]

Her cover of just like a woman. Criminal. Listen to Ritchie's Havens cover. That is how you do that song:nod:

OTHERS.

When I See You Again

Illume, Yawn

That's alright, Country crap.

I gotta stop:laugh:

Mick

[fumidesigns]

Her cover of just like a woman. Criminal. Listen to Ritchie's Havens cover. That is how you do that song:nod:

OTHERS.

When I See You

Illume, Yawn

That's alright, Country crap.

I gotta stop:laugh:

Mick

bite your tongue! i love this song lmao!

[markolas]

I'm gonna go through all the albums (FM & solo) and just list the songs I can't stand:

- Nothing Ever Changes
- I Will Run to You
- When I See You Again
- Two Kinds of Love
- Desert Angel
- Sometimes it's a Bitch
- Love's a Hard Game to Play
- Unconditional Love
- Maybe Love Will Change Your Mind
- Jane
- One More Big Time Rock & Roll Star
- That Made Me Stronger
- Too Far from Texas (good song, hideous vocal)
- Not Make Believe

I could take or leave most of her SYW songs, but there aren't any I'd classify as "criminal," except for Not Make Believe. But the ones on this list, she simply never should've recorded (IMO), with the possible exception of Too Far from Texas - she should've at least tried for a better vocal.

[fumidesigns]

I'm gonna go through all the albums (FM & solo) and just list the songs I can't stand:

- Nothing Ever Changes
- I Will Run to You
- When I See You Again
- Two Kinds of Love
- Desert Angel
- Sometimes it's a Bitch
- Love's a Hard Game to Play
- Unconditional Love
- Maybe Love Will Change Your Mind
- Jane
- One More Big Time Rock & Roll Star
- That Made Me Stronger
- Too Far from Texas (good song, hideous vocal)
- Not Make Believe

I could take or leave most of her SYW songs, but there aren't any I'd classify as "criminal," except for Not Make Believe. But the ones on this list, she simply never should've recorded (IMO), with the possible exception of Too Far from Texas - she should've at least tried for a better vocal.

i hate this song so much that i can't even remember how it goes..........

[porkpie]

damn sure are! i can't staaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand Sweet Girl! that always gets skipped! and my God when Silver Girl comes on, i just stare at my ipod and say "y haven't i taken this off here yet!?"

Thank you! Someone else who agrees - these two songs almost sound like a pastiche of Stevie. If you were asked to write in the style of Stevie (at that time) you'd just have to write about a female protagonist and write one sentence contradicted by the next one, things like, "she knew everything, yet she knew nothing, it was the best of times, it was the worst of times, everyone was there, but she was alone,etc." Awful cliched lyrics. Very happy she's back on track.

[WildHearted]

I'm gonna go through all the albums (FM & solo) and just list the songs I can't stand:

- Nothing Ever Changes
- I Will Run to You
- When I See You Again
- Two Kinds of Love
- Desert Angel
- Sometimes it's a Bitch
- Love's a Hard Game to Play
- Unconditional Love
- Maybe Love Will Change Your Mind
- Jane
- One More Big Time Rock & Roll Star
- That Made Me Stronger
- Too Far from Texas (good song, hideous vocal)
- Not Make Believe

I could take or leave most of her SYW songs, but there aren't any I'd classify as "criminal," except for Not Make Believe. But the ones on this list, she simply never should've recorded (IMO), with the possible exception of Too Far from Texas - she should've at least tried for a better vocal.

I love Nothing Ever Changes (the chorus is sexy, tbh, and I love the beati w) and When I See You Again (although I love the latter in a somewhat ironic way...).

And I don't think I Will Run To You should really count since she didn't write it. However, it really shouldn't have made the album...

But generally I agree.

ETA: Sweet Girl is one of my favorites. I'm not sure why. I think it's for the 'I chose to dance across the stages of the world' line, and that alone.

[mitzo]

Stevie's work to me ranks "marvellous," "who cares?" or "dreadful." the dreadfuls are all from her solo work, and include the Petty-inspired arrangement stuff like Blue Lamp, Violet and Blue, I Need to Know, OMBTRARS...

Dumb songs she shouldn't have done:

BD: I detest most of the production on this album, and have neither faves (maybe EO17, Still of the Night?) nor hate-ables (Highwayman, title track?)

WH: I Will Run to You, Enchanted.

RAL: Sister Honey, Imperial Hotel

TOSOTM: 2 Kinds of Love, Rooms on Fire, Ghosts

TS: SIAB, LAHGTP. Desert Angel is god-awful but something about the arrangements and vocals touches, it's the lyrics (and overall theme) that hurt. Badly.

SA: Everything except MLWCYM, Kick It, and Jane. yes, Jane.

TISL: Bad production courtesy of Sheryl Crow abounds here. She shouldn't have done Everyday, TFFT. Bombay Sapphires is a nifty song ruined by some "WTF?" lyrics.

IYD: It is Dave Stewart's album. She shouldn't have done FWIW, AL, and IS really badly needed at least another verse or something.

Stevie is a balladeer, to me. The slow haunted stuff is where she shines and where her voice still hits the stars.

[chele_belle]

For me it's Jane - chimpanze should never be a lyric in a song!

[GypsySorcerer]

Her worst, IMO:

-When I See You Again
-Welcome to the Room...Sara
-The Nightmare (Bleccchh!!)
-Imperial Hotel
-Desert Angel
-That Made Me Stronger (the chorus is ridiculous, and the opening chords are just fug)
-Jane
-One More Big Time Rock and Roll Star
-Not Make Believe

And the most craptastic of them all: Listen to the Rain

[chiffon head]

Ummm, The Nightmare...but since it was just a demo I can't really judge & for some reason, I can always find a spot in my life for every Stevie song...stinker or not~just say'in:)

[ontheEdgeof17]

i hate this song so much that i can't even remember how it goes..........

There's a plane...
It's headed to London
24 hours more and he'll be on it
And I can't show my love
and I can't stop it....
Ohh, I can't stop it




ALL from memory.:laugh: ...I could probably type out the whole song.

[ontheEdgeof17]

Lock these three up and throw away the key. They have committed crimes to my ears!

-I Still Miss Someone
-Real Tears
-The Nightmare.



....the only 3 songs I could do without in her catalog.

[CADreaming]

i hate this song so much that i can't even remember how it goes..........

Lawd. I.totally.agree. barf.

[bombaysaffires]

I have the same problem with Two Kinds of Love that many have with FWIW.... wtf incomplete lyrics....

two kinds of love (ok so far)
one for the way you walk,
one for the way you love me??

wtf??

Ghosts....a total mess. I like what I *think* was the inspiration... the concept of the ghost of Christmas past, present and future, except here it's Stevie looking over her life and we've got the ghost of what you really want, the ghost of the past you live in, and the ghost of the future that you're so frightened of. The best part for me is the bridge, where she sings -

to fill the empty spaces she's feeling
she depends on her music like a husband
and she knows it's no good to fall in love again
One day they were lovers,
one day they were friends,
and there was nothing left to say...

I think it's a very touching insight into where she was at at that stage in her life, and accepting that maybe for real the notions she had of finding lasting long-term love and having kids was passing her by.

Same with Welcome to the Room, Sara.. it is a very interesting insight into the whole rehab and intervention thing.. as much as she wants to insist she went to rehab totally of her own volition... (Frontline baby...)

some of the crap on SA, however............especially the stuff she didn't write.....blech.

[louielouie2000]

OK - let em start by saying I don't want to slag Stevie but considering how awesome IYD is it got me thinking about what she was thinking at times when the quality control slipped (in my opinion) and wondered if others feel the same.

For me, the worst songs are Silver Girl and Sweet Girl. I think lyrically and musically they're both dull and I hate it when she writes a barely disguised version of herself in the third person as a character. At the time of the Dance, I foundnit really hard to believe that was the strongest song she could have come up with considering that Lyndsey and Christine's songs were all pretty strong. The ther nght I rewatched Destiny Rules and Mick was talking aobut what a strong set of songs Stevie brought to the project, but again I'm surprised Silver Girl made the cut.

What are everyone else's thoughts on these songs?

I disagree that these are Stevie's worst songs. I actually like both- they aren't earth shattering by any means, but they're solid enough works. I think Sweet Girl is a poignant little career retrospective. Silver Girl is a nice homage to a friend (Sheryl Crow). I can think of FAR worse lyrics Stevie has written:

Something in my heart died last night
Just one more chip off an already broken heart
I think the heart broke long ago

Blech... what repetitive cliche'd dreck. :eek:

[michelej1]

Something in my heart died last night
Just one more chip off an already broken heart
I think the heart broke long ago

Blech... what repetitive cliche'd dreck. :eek:

Cross my heart, the repetition of heart doesn't matter when all I have to do is read those words and I suddenly start singing, with all of my heart and at the top of my lungs: That's when I needed you, when I needed you MOSSSST. That's when I needed you . . .

The music sounds so good with the words. It lifts her voice which is itself a spirit in flight. Which is more than I can ever say for Silver Girl or Sweet Girl. The weak music makes those songs even worse. If I were Sheryl and Stevie had written Silver Girl for me, I'd stop being her friend.

Michele

[WildHearted]

To be honest, the music can really make or break a Stevie song. A lot of times her lyrics are made 100% more poignant because of the way she sings them, or the way they flow melodically/rhythmically.. so if that's off, then the lyrics -however nice they are - can fall flat. At the same time, it works in the opposite sense - what could be seen as maybe a pretty generic lyric or strange word choice or whatever can turn into something awesome because of how it's sung.

Example: I absolutely love the line, "I used to love you so much" in YMBTO because of the way it's sung. There's nothing deeply poetic about the lyric itself, but the way it sounds in your ears changes that.

[tabruns]

Well if I had to cite individual songs:

Welcome To The Room, Sara.....it's meandering and lacks a melody or hook
All four tracks on Behind The Mask.....pedestrian, boring music, completely lacking the Nicks magic
Street Angel album - Ditto

I like "Paper Doll". The lyrics are fun "you like a man with a future, you like a woman with a past" and the music is concise and inventive. "Sweet Girl" has an Allman Brothers band feel to it, and I love that lilting guitar line. Both of these songs are well made. On the other hand, "No Questions Asked" (which I like by the way) just kind of meanders on.

[mikephxaz]

There is no question for me that Street Angel contains so many bad songs that everything else pales in comparison. If I were forced to list my worst OTHER than Street Angels tracks I would say. What a matter baby, Silver girl, Two kinds of love, Desert angel, and No Heart....did I mention every crappy song on Street Angel??!?:mad:

[ahafan02]

OK - let em start by saying I don't want to slag Stevie but considering how awesome IYD is it got me thinking about what she was thinking at times when the quality control slipped (in my opinion) and wondered if others feel the same.

For me, the worst songs are Silver Girl and Sweet Girl. I think lyrically and musically they're both dull and I hate it when she writes a barely disguised version of herself in the third person as a character. At the time of the Dance, I foundnit really hard to believe that was the strongest song she could have come up with considering that Lyndsey and Christine's songs were all pretty strong. The ther nght I rewatched Destiny Rules and Mick was talking aobut what a strong set of songs Stevie brought to the project, but again I'm surprised Silver Girl made the cut.

What are everyone else's thoughts on these songs?


I don't mind Sweet Girl but Silver Girl along with Illume are two of her worst FM songs...and Say You Will (the song) is pretty dull as well

[WildHearted]

Just wanted to mention that when I first read the title of this thread, I thought this was going to be about songs that are self-incriminating or are talking about illegal/taboo stuff or something haha.

[Hawkeye]

After hearing the Street Angel version of Mirror Mirror it is absolutely a crime that half of Street Angel got released and Mirror Mirror didn't. It really defines criminal songs. Most specifically Unconditional Love, Listen to the Rain and a danm ****ty cover song made it over the brilliance of Mirror Mirror. I feel like anyone with ears involved with Street Angel had to catch these injustices.

[tabruns]

After hearing the Street Angel version of Mirror Mirror it is absolutely a crime that half of Street Angel got released and Mirror Mirror didn't. It really defines criminal songs. Most specifically Unconditional Love, Listen to the Rain and a danm ****ty cover song made it over the brilliance of Mirror Mirror. I feel like anyone with ears involved with Street Angel had to catch these injustices.

I'm just so happy that she bounced back after Street Angel. Trouble In Shangri-La was such a huge improvement, and then In Your Dreams being probably the best solo album she ever made. Really amazing.

[Hawkeye]

I'm just so happy that she bounced back after Street Angel. Trouble In Shangri-La was such a huge improvement, and then In Your Dreams being probably the best solo album she ever made. Really amazing.

Well overall i don't hate Street Angel. Although yea IYD is about 50 times better. The bigger issue for me is she recorded a perfectly great song during the Street Angel sessions, it was there for inclusion and they chose to include sh*t. Some of which not written by her.

[darklinensuit]

I'd like a restraining order on:

Alice - by far the worst song she ever released, IMO. I cannot think of anything I like about it. I don't think I can say that about any other song by her.

I Sing for the Things - I'll never understand how "She Still Loves Him" was passed over for this drek.

Love Changes - Is there a piano demo of this one out there? Typically her demos are so stripped-down, but it's hard to imagine this one being simpler and less imaginative than it is on the album.

Love Is - Yeah, I know, she sings the hell out of it live in 2011. But on the album it's painful. Talk about a song that goes nowhere fast. And the tear across the cheek to the corner of her mouth is more cringe-inducing than any line about a chimp. Might be my least favorite line in any Stevie song - other than half the lines in "Alice", of course.

Affairs of the Heart - musically & lyrically the blandest of a very bland era

Yes, this means that I think "Sweet Girl" and "Silver Girl" are better than all five of these songs. Sue me.


- Jake

[darklinensuit]

I can think of FAR worse lyrics Stevie has written:

Something in my heart died last night
Just one more chip off an already broken heart
I think the heart broke long ago

Blech... what repetitive cliche'd dreck. :eek:

I love that song & don't find it repetitive, but I think the vocal is what really lets her sell it and most of that album. "Gate and Garden" would be completely unbearable had she recorded it in the Klonopin era, for example.

- Jake

[Dodfather]

For her solo work: I can't stand Unconditional Love, Jane and Destiny - the usual suspects really. I'm not keen on Beauty and the Beast either. It's ok but I have to be in a very certain mood for it, otherwise it's just too mawkish for me. I also can't stand That Made Me Stronger - it's so dull and repetitive and I think it's by far the worst track on Trouble In Shangri-La.

But, as I've said before the worst song in her solo catalogue is...drumroll please... I Still Miss Someone. I just can't bear it. She can sing country really well so it should've worked but not with such a horrible synthy arrangement and a dreadful vocal that takes all of the emotion out of such a moving song. To quote Sideshow Mel - "Terrrrible!"

With FM it's only really Silver Girl and Love Is Dangerous. The rest of her work with them, while there are some songs much better/worse than others, I can at least stand to listen to and don't skip.

[Dodfather]

There's a plane...
It's headed to London
24 hours more and he'll be on it
And I can't show my love
and I can't stop it....
Ohh, I can't stop it




ALL from memory.:laugh: ...I could probably type out the whole song.

There's a house there
Somebody's waiting...

[Artemis]

Well overall i don't hate Street Angel. Although yea IYD is about 50 times better. The bigger issue for me is she recorded a perfectly great song during the Street Angel sessions, it was there for inclusion and they chose to include sh*t. Some of which not written by her.

She's done that for every album, I think. Look at TWH. Lots of people DESPISE I Will Run To You (not me, though) and she left off the absolutely amazing All The Beautiful Worlds for a song not written by her. And don't even get started on RAL... that's just a (fabulous) mess :laugh:

I think Street Angel gets a lot of unfair slack, but also a lot of fair criticism for some really bad lyrics. Like Jane. Really, during the Klonopin era, TITN-SA, I find it easier to say which songs aren't garbage. :o

[Jondalar]

Uggg, I forgot about I Still Someone Blues Eyes. What an embarrassment. Horrrrrrriiiiiibbbbbbllllllllle! God-awful.

[mitzo]

Uggg, I forgot about I Still Someone Blues Eyes. What an embarrassment. Horrrrrrriiiiiibbbbbbllllllllle! God-awful.

It is an interesting kind of experiment, a reggae-influenced version of a country song, with pretty decent vocals. A good singalong track, to me.

[markolas]

I like Sweet Girl a lot, and I think Silver Girl is a decent song, tho not one of my favorites. I'm not that familiar with Stevie's BTM songs...I need to go listen to them some more. I don't remember being knocked out by any of them.

I enjoy her cover of I Still Miss Someone quite a bit (that and Silver Girl seem to get the most bashing of any of her songs around here).

[sushud82]

Her worst, IMO:

-When I See You Again
-Welcome to the Room...Sara
-The Nightmare (Bleccchh!!)
-Imperial Hotel
-Desert Angel
-That Made Me Stronger (the chorus is ridiculous, and the opening chords are just fug)
-Jane
-One More Big Time Rock and Roll Star
-Not Make Believe

And the most craptastic of them all: Listen to the Rain

This would be my list almost exactly. I sort of like When I See You Again just for Lindsey's part in it, bless my little shipperly heart. The song itself though is just so...meh.

And I would add Silver Girl. Snooze.

[holidayroad]

Her worst, IMO:

-When I See You Again
-Welcome to the Room...Sara
-The Nightmare (Bleccchh!!)
-Imperial Hotel
-Desert Angel
-That Made Me Stronger (the chorus is ridiculous, and the opening chords are just fug)
-Jane
-One More Big Time Rock and Roll Star
-Not Make Believe

And the most craptastic of them all: Listen to the Rain

I agree with this,except for NMB. I do like it. Lindsey's solo totally saves WISYA. I would add....

The Highwayman
I Still Miss Someone
Doing the Best That I Can
Love Is Like a River
To0 Far From Texas
For What It's Worth
The Second Time

[WildHearted]

The Highwayman is a masterpiece!

[fumidesigns]

The Highwayman is a masterpiece!

lies. i can't stand that damn song. i love that entire album but i just can't do the highwayman to save my life! urgh! am i totally missing something with this song? what should i be feeling?

[WildHearted]

lies. i can't stand that damn song. i love that entire album but i just can't do the highwayman to save my life! urgh! am i totally missing something with this song? what should i be feeling?

The lyrics. The vocal. Don Henley's vocal.

I love all of Bella Donna almost equally, but this is one of the ones I love extra a lot.

"Will they ever win?
He the glory, she the love,
Still they try again."

[mitzo]

I absolutely love When I See You Again and Love Is (album version). Raw emotion.

[Dodfather]

I will never understand the hate towards The Highwayman! I love it!

[WildHearted]

I will never understand the hate towards The Highwayman! I love it!

Same here. I love it so much. It's a beautiful pics of poetry, at the very least.

[markolas]

The Nightmare is probably one of my top 5 favorite Stevie songs.

[fumidesigns]

I will never understand the hate towards The Highwayman! I love it!

i really need to listen to this song again.....

i'm not looking for to it.

[ontheEdgeof17]

lies. i can't stand that damn song. i love that entire album but i just can't do the highwayman to save my life! urgh! am i totally missing something with this song? what should i be feeling?

Feel this version. The girls take over the harmonies:


<iframe width="420" height="345" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/HgZHesa0onA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Spoinny]

When I see you again sucks major ****. :]

By far far far far my MOST hated Stevie songs and almost embarrassing to listen to, maybe it's just her pathetic warble on the song or sumthin'. It's just...terrible!

[wheart]

Here are a few of my non-favorites:

Listen to the Rain, Somebody Stand By Me, Inspiration, God's Garden, Think About It

[porkpie]

having started this thread saying how much I don't rate Silver Girl, Sweet Girl it's really interesting to see how some songs are equally loved and hated - I think that shows that she's a great writer as even though some of hate certain songs, others think they're amazing. Personally, I really liked the melodies and vocals on No Questions Asked, Affairs of the Heart and Paper Doll (though lyrically weak but I still love it).

[equeen102289]

Songs I just all around dislike:

1. Desert Angel
2. The Nightmare
3. Unconditional Love
4. Not Make Believe
5. Welcome to the Room . . . Sara
6. Fire Burning
7. Cheaper Than Free
8. Soldier's Angel

Songs where I can't stand the track but love the lyrics:

1. Blue Denim
2. Doing the Best I Can

[Jondalar]

Fire Burning
I Still Miss Someone
Two Kinds of Love
Blue Denim
Freedom
The Second Time
Sweet Girl
Cry Wolf (she hacked this great song)
Imperial Hotel
The Nightmare
I Sing for Things (produced wrong)
Doing the Best That I Can
Desert Angel
Loves a Hard Game to Play
Jane
Street Angel
Destiny
That Mad Me Stronger
Too Far From Texas (good song, vocal is horrible)
Paper Doll
Goodbye Baby

[wondergirl9847]

Ya'll have probably mentioned every song I don't like.

I love Sweet Girl though. It's got a great country-ish vibe to it and it's fun to sing along with. :)

I've not listened to much Stevie solo stuff in years except for IYD lately of course. I should revisit all the albums soon. I don't own Street Angel, and something tells me I won't.....ever. :laugh:

[mitzo]

Fire Burning
I Still Miss Someone
Two Kinds of Love
Blue Denim
Freedom
The Second Time
Sweet Girl
Cry Wolf (she hacked this great song)
Imperial Hotel
The Nightmare
I Sing for Things (produced wrong)
Doing the Best That I Can
Desert Angel
Loves a Hard Game to Play
Jane
Street Angel
Destiny
That Mad Me Stronger
Too Far From Texas (good song, vocal is horrible)
Paper Doll
Goodbye Baby

But I love those songs.

[bluefox4000]

Just thought i'd put in that The Highway man is my favorite Stevie Solo song.....the hate baffles me:(

Mick

[WildHearted]

Just thought i'd put in that The Highway man is my favorite Stevie Solo song.....the hate baffles me:(

Mick

I don't pick favorites (I'm too fickle for that, I love them all) but it's definitely one of my top. I love it so much. I don't understand the hate either.

[caroline79]

I will never ever understand the hate for Silver Girl, and especially Sweet Girl :confused: I loved Sweet Girl from the first time I heard it. The, "I watched you fly through the world in a golden ball..." all the way to end is perfection to me.

And I don't think Silver Girl is that bad. The first verse is actually quite good. I think the music makes up for some of the weird lyrics, and I love how the chorus with Lindsey sounds. All I have to do is pretend it's not about Sheryl Crow.

I like The Nightmare too.

[Christopher]

Cry Wolf (she hacked this great song)
I Sing for Things (produced wrong)
Too Far From Texas (good song, vocal is horrible)


Hacked? I disagree, I think Stevie does a great vocal on "Cry Wolf", and it just may be the most emotive and nuanced vocal altogether on OSOTM. And the musical arrangement is moody and chilling befitting of the song, much better than Laura Branigans version imo. I know most fans dislike this song mostly cause it wasn't written by Stevie, but I think it suited her well, and was one of my faves from OSOTM when the album was released. It stood out simply because it actually was one of the few songs on the record to have a obvious melody and hook with change-up.

But I agree, with ISFTT (underrated Stevie song in general, mostly because the production does nothing for it) And TFFT's vocal is the most dry and un-inspired take on all of TISL, which is strange cause Stevie usually shines in a duet or harmony situation:shrug:

[Dodfather]

Here are a few of my non-favorites:

Listen to the Rain, Somebody Stand By Me, Inspiration, God's Garden, Think About It

Whaaaaattt?? I love Think About It!

[Christopher]

My list of Stevie's criminal songs:

"God's Garden" ........SNOOOZE. I play this if I'd wanna pass out and fall asleep dead in my tracks, and I'd prolly still not be inspired to hit play on this:eek:

"Whole Lotta Trouble" - This song had potential, but someone really should've subtly suggested to Stevie, the lyrics needed some work in the edit/focus department. "change your mind at the very last minute, second, moment, second"... minute...moment. WAIT A MINUTE, this is jacked UP!!! Should have never been a single....same with TKOL. LWTG & OML should have been the singles:cool:

"I Still Miss Someone" - pure adult contempo circus reggae cr@p :nod: not to mention a really bad cover. Speaking of which...

"Just Like A Woman" - probably only made the cut because Dylan showed up and spit some harmonica all over this warmed over hash.

"Sometimes It's A Bitch" - It's a travesty this dreck is on Stevie's 1st "Best of" collection. What a monumental mis-step, even "Loves A Hard Game To Play" is slightly more palatable than this.

"Somebody Stand By Me" - Stevie contributed a good vocal, but production of the song is stuck in quicksand, which is surprising since Don Was was at the helm.

"UN -CON-DIT-IONAL - LOVE"!! Enunciate & SCREAM it at me baby! :p

"Jane" - If you asked me, there are TOO many Angel's & not enough chimpanzee's :rolleyes:

"All Stevie's "BTM" songs - mostly due to the dirge and tin-can pedestrian arrangements and production. Just say NO to Greg Ladanyi! Ok, maybe I don't exactly hate these songs, but they could have been so much better, even great. These and some of her SA songs are prime example's of why Stevie is highly vulnerable to having the right producer because Stevie is such a raw songwriting talent.

"That Made Me Stronger" - May be the world record for Stevie's overuse of the word "Well". Plus the song is such filler with over the top indulgent lyrics that I highly doubt any one of us regular folks relate much to it.

"My Heart" (the IYD version) She jacked with the verses, switched them up...and made them even more incoherent. "Like the eyes of the soul....from across the room" :eek: conjures up a bad horror flick to me:shrug:

"Not Make Believe" - the demo had so much potential. I can almost appreciate what Lindsey tried to do. The chorus arrangement is great, but the verses, because there is so little variation in Stevie's melody line...almost monotone, that the music needs more dynamics. And starting the song dry was a bad idea...same for RTTG & Destiny Rules.

[Travisevian]

"Whole Lotta Trouble" - This song had potential, but someone really should've subtly suggested to Stevie, the lyrics needed some work in the edit/focus department. "change your mind at the very last minute, second, moment, second"... minute...moment. WAIT A MINUTE, this is jacked UP!!! Should have never been a single....same with TKOL. LWTG & OML should have been the singles:cool:

"I Still Miss Someone" - pure adult contempo circus reggae cr@p :nod: not to mention a really bad cover. Speaking of which...


"UN -CON-DIT-IONAL - LOVE"!! Enunciate & SCREAM it at me baby! :p

"All Stevie's "BTM" songs - mostly due to the dirge and tin-can pedestrian arrangements and production. Just say NO to Greg Ladanyi! Ok, maybe I don't exactly hate these songs, but they could have been so much better, even great. These and some of her SA songs are prime example's of why Stevie is highly vulnerable to having the right producer because Stevie is such a raw songwriting talent.

"My Heart" (the IYD version) She jacked with the verses, switched them up...and made them even more incoherent. "Like the eyes of the soul....from across the room" :eek: conjures up a bad horror flick to me:shrug:

Christopher, your commentary made me laugh but I really like these songs, especially Unconditional Love. I do wonder why Stevie decided to change the lyrics of My Heart. The Trouble In Shangri-La version is great.

[michelej1]

I will never ever understand the hate for Silver Girl, and especially Sweet Girl :confused: I loved Sweet Girl from the first time I heard it. The, "I watched you fly through the world in a golden ball..." all the way to end is perfection to me.



Even if I didn't dislike the song before, once you quoted that particular lyric, I'd have to hate it.

Michele

[Dodfather]

"I Still Miss Someone" - pure adult contempo circus reggae cr@p :nod: not to mention a really bad cover. Speaking of which...

"UN -CON-DIT-IONAL - LOVE"!! [/B] Enunciate & SCREAM it at me baby! :p

"Jane" - If you asked me, there are TOO many Angel's & not enough chimpanzee's :rolleyes:


"That Made Me Stronger" - May be the world record for Stevie's overuse of the word "Well". Plus the song is such filler with over the top indulgent lyrics that I highly doubt any one of us regular folks relate much to it.



I agree with all of these and couldn't have said it better. I've vouced my disdain for her Cash cover many times, including on this thread!

[GypsySorcerer]

And I don't think Silver Girl is that bad. The first verse is actually quite good. I think the music makes up for some of the weird lyrics, and I love how the chorus with Lindsey sounds. All I have to do is pretend it's not about Sheryl Crow.



"Silver Girl" is nothing special, but it's pretty inoffensive to me. The version that was played during the Destiny Rules doc was better than the finished product, IMO.

I adore "The Highwayman." Stevie's unabashed romanticism is one of the reasons I love her, and this song is a perfect example.

I like "Paper Doll" well enough, despite Stevie's evident refusal to wear her coat. :rolleyes:

[holidayroad]

I forgot to mention 'Running Through the Garden'. I know quite a few people like it, but I just don't.

[Travisevian]

I forgot to mention 'Running Through the Garden'. I know quite a few people like it, but I just don't.

The Rock A Little demo is great.

[KarmaContestant]

My list of Stevie's criminal songs:

"God's Garden" ........SNOOOZE. I play this if I'd wanna pass out and fall asleep dead in my tracks, and I'd prolly still not be inspired to hit play on this:eek:

"Whole Lotta Trouble" - This song had potential, but someone really should've subtly suggested to Stevie, the lyrics needed some work in the edit/focus department. "change your mind at the very last minute, second, moment, second"... minute...moment. WAIT A MINUTE, this is jacked UP!!! Should have never been a single....same with TKOL. LWTG & OML should have been the singles:cool:

"I Still Miss Someone" - pure adult contempo circus reggae cr@p :nod: not to mention a really bad cover. Speaking of which...

"Just Like A Woman" - probably only made the cut because Dylan showed up and spit some harmonica all over this warmed over hash.

"Sometimes It's A Bitch" - It's a travesty this dreck is on Stevie's 1st "Best of" collection. What a monumental mis-step, even "Loves A Hard Game To Play" is slightly more palatable than this.

"Somebody Stand By Me" - Stevie contributed a good vocal, but production of the song is stuck in quicksand, which is surprising since Don Was was at the helm.

"UN -CON-DIT-IONAL - LOVE"!! Enunciate & SCREAM it at me baby! :p

"Jane" - If you asked me, there are TOO many Angel's & not enough chimpanzee's :rolleyes:

"All Stevie's "BTM" songs - mostly due to the dirge and tin-can pedestrian arrangements and production. Just say NO to Greg Ladanyi! Ok, maybe I don't exactly hate these songs, but they could have been so much better, even great. These and some of her SA songs are prime example's of why Stevie is highly vulnerable to having the right producer because Stevie is such a raw songwriting talent.

"That Made Me Stronger" - May be the world record for Stevie's overuse of the word "Well". Plus the song is such filler with over the top indulgent lyrics that I highly doubt any one of us regular folks relate much to it.

"My Heart" (the IYD version) She jacked with the verses, switched them up...and made them even more incoherent. "Like the eyes of the soul....from across the room" :eek: conjures up a bad horror flick to me:shrug:

"Not Make Believe" - the demo had so much potential. I can almost appreciate what Lindsey tried to do. The chorus arrangement is great, but the verses, because there is so little variation in Stevie's melody line...almost monotone, that the music needs more dynamics. And starting the song dry was a bad idea...same for RTTG & Destiny Rules.


Ditto, ditto and ditto. I couldn't have picked a better list of Stevie's un-greatest un-hits.

[caroline79]

Even if I didn't dislike the song before, once you quoted that particular lyric, I'd have to hate it.

Michele

If you didn't dislike the song before...wouldn't that mean you liked it? I don't see anything wrong with the lyrics, I think it's a nice introspect of Stevie. But then again The Dance is how I got introduced to FM/Stevie, so I don't think I could hate anything on it :)

I forgot to mention 'Running Through the Garden'. I know quite a few people like it, but I just don't.

Aww I'm one of those few people lol!

The Rock A Little demo is great.

I had never heard that demo before. Just listened and I love it!

[TheWILDheart]

There are very VERY few songs that Stevie has recorded that I dislike. I love 95%of them in their own way, including "No Questions Asked", "Paper Doll", "The Second Time", "Sweet Girl" and "Silver Girl", which are the songs that get the most grief from fans.

For me, she has only ever dipped a few times. "When I See You Again", I feel, is possibly the worst song that Fleetwood Mac ever recorded. The covers aren't great - "I Still Miss Someone" and "Just Like A Woman" are particularly bad. A few of the songs she didn't write - "Unconditional Love", "Some Become Strangers" and "Docklands" have been completely removed from my Street Angel and RAL playlists and replaced b-sides. "The Nightmare" frustrates me to no end - it's not a bad lyric or melody by any standards, but it's so badly produced and the vocals are horrific. Again, I have replaced this with a b-side on my play list. "Jane" is, without a doubt, the worst song she has written. She was trying so hard to be "Stevie Nicks" that it all went wrong. If she had just written what she was feeling at the time (although, this probably wasn't a lot), I think the results would've been far stronger. A lot of people say "Klonopin made her lazy", but I think Klonopin made her an unfeeling machine towards the end. At least with Tango and OSOTM, Stevie was still proud of herself for quitting coke (as she should be), but during 92/93, I think she'd pretty much switched off.

Other than the above mentioned, there really are no Stevie tracks I dislike. Yes, there are songs I love less, or that I don't have any real connection to, but this doesn't mean I don't like or appreciate them.

I would also like to add how immensely proud I am of our lady for always having the strength to keep going, and for getting to where she is today. The music she has brought out post-The Dance, to me, is the same quality of music she was writing and recording in the Buckingham Nicks days, and the early years with Fleetwood Mac. And to be able to still do that and still be a success at 63 is certainly something to be proud of.

Rock on gold dust woman - you continue to be an inspiration to legions of fans across the world and you will always have our support!

[bigmaclover]

I don't mind Sweet Girl but Silver Girl along with Illume are two of her worst FM songs...and Say You Will (the song) is pretty dull as well

To me the Say You Will track is Stevie's version of Say You Love Me. I always get the what would Chris do vibe from it.

[SapphireSister]

Whats with all this Sweet Girl hate. Thats one of my all time favotie Stevie songs. It's almost her theme song. "she chose to dance across the stages of the world."

And it's a part of the Ghost through the fog triology Fumi, you can't hate it :laugh:

I agree that The Dance version blows and I disliked this song for so long but a couple of years ago I listened to the Enchanted version for a change and it was like I get hit by a truck and fell in love with that version of Sweet Girl. It's also my song for my little Yorkie dog! Oh and I'd like for Stevie to call me her sweet girl, yeah that would be really sweet!

I started a thread a few months ago and I think it was called songs you dislike the most but in any case as the thread went on my list got longer and longer. I'll have to dig it up when time permits.

Edit: Time permitted and here's the list I compiled back in April of songs I don't like: (Is this bad?)
In no particular order:
Silver Girl
Jane
Too Far From Texas
Affairs of the Heart
Fire Burning
Freedom
Twisted
Gate and Garden
Running Through the Garden
That Made Me Stronger
Rose Garden
Love's a Hard Game to Play
Reconsider Me
Every Day
I Still Miss Someone
The Second Time
Thousand Days
God's Garden
Touched By An Angel
Enchanted
Welcome to the Room, Sara
Ooh My Love
Free Fallin
It's Late
Paper Doll

[porkpie]

I actually like a number of songs on your list but you've just reminded me of Touched by an Angel. That is a true crime, I wonder if her producers ever feel like saying "we love you, but this song is seriously aweful"

[SapphireSister]

I actually like a number of songs on your list but you've just reminded me of Touched by an Angel. That is a true crime, I wonder if her producers ever feel like saying "we love you, but this song is seriously aweful"

Totally and I feel bad to a certain extent because I know this song means a lot to a lot of people due to the loss of a loved one but I just aint feelin it on any level!

[Thrown_Down]

I actually really like 'Silver Girl'! I have to agree that Jane, the covers and the new material on 'Timespace' was the absolute scraping of the absolute bottom of a rotten old barrel though!

[bangdrum]

I don't have all of Stevie's solo albums, so this isn't a definitive list...

Hate:
That Made Me Stronger
Every Day
Thousand Days

Dislike (would be OK with some improvements):
Too Far From Texas
Silver Girl
The Second Time
Affairs Of The Heart
Illume
I Sing For The Things
Straight Back :sorry:

I love Paper Doll and Fire Burning (no comment on the artistic value of it; I just like singing along with it!).

[SapphireSister]

I don't have all of Stevie's solo albums, so this isn't a definitive list...

Hate:
That Made Me Stronger
Every Day
Thousand Days

Dislike (would be OK with some improvements):
Too Far From Texas
Silver Girl
The Second Time
Affairs Of The Heart
Illume
I Sing For The Things
Straight Back :sorry:

I love Paper Doll and Fire Burning (no comment on the artistic value of it; I just like singing along with it!).

Aw really, Illume? I happen to love it but do know there is a lot of distaste out there for it.

[michelej1]

If you didn't dislike the song before...wouldn't that mean you liked it?

No. I didn't say I didn't dislike the song before. I said "if I didn't dislike it before," a condition that hasn't existed, meaning that I did dislike it and still do and the lyrics you excerpted remind me of just one more reason why I do.

However, when I said that, I wasn't being super serious. I was just mocking golden balls, for the heck of it.

Michele

[J.Miller]

The words laundromat and chimpanzee almost ruin Street Angel single handedly. I love you guys but don't hate on my Enchanted.

[bangdrum]

Aw really, Illume? I happen to love it but do know there is a lot of distaste out there for it.

I just think it goes on for way too long sounding way too monotonous... I don't hate it entirely.

EDIT: and I also love Enchanted!

[mitzo]

Illume is one of best, IMO, so dark and powerful and totally Stevie. The song recalls emotions and images effortlessly.

[Travisevian]

I had never heard that demo before. Just listened and I love it!

I'm not sure which demo you listened to but as far as I know, there are two RAL demos for that song.

Dislike (would be OK with some improvements):
Too Far From Texas
Silver Girl
The Second Time
Affairs Of The Heart
Illume
I Sing For The Things
Straight Back :sorry:

Would you elaborate on Affairs Of The Heart? How do you think it could be improved?

[bluefox4000]

Awww I forgot Illume. It's like........2 years to long:lol: My bad.....I put it. lol

Mick

[bangdrum]

Would you elaborate on Affairs Of The Heart? How do you think it could be improved?

You made me dig out BTM and listen to it again. :p

Honestly, it sounded better this time than the last time I remembered. Stevie's vocals are very good on it... I think it's just that it's so generic sounding. You wouldn't really notice it outside the context of the album and you might not even realize it was Fleetwood Mac.

Having skimmed through the whole album, I'll add that I'm not by any means in love with Freedom, but for some reason I find it a lot more tolerable. Stevie has a subsection of songs that are TP-style, so it fits more with what you'd expect from her.

[Christopher]

You made me dig out BTM and listen to it again. :p

Honestly, it sounded better this time than the last time I remembered. Stevie's vocals are very good on it... I think it's just that it's so generic sounding. You wouldn't really notice it outside the context of the album and you might not even realize it was Fleetwood Mac.

Having skimmed through the whole album, I'll add that I'm not by any means in love with Freedom, but for some reason I find it a lot more tolerable. Stevie has a subsection of songs that are TP-style, so it fits more with what you'd expect from her.

I totally agree :nod:. Behind The Mask's production is THE worst of Nicks' FM albums. As I alluded to earlier in a post on this thread, Greg Ladanyi - who also mixed these recordings, sucked the life out of these songs. And Rick Vito, Billy Burnett & Christine obviously couldn't be bothered to come up with any interesting arrangements on Stevie's songs (they barely came up with anything more exciting on their own respective songs) The band probably stuck pretty close to her demos. "poor little fool"

"Freedom" is a subsection of TP's-style because the music was written by Mike Campbell. It's basically the musical precursor to Blue Denim - very similar, but less dynamic musically. But Freedom's lyrics are killer!

[SapphireSister]

I cringe at the sound of anything from BTM. It's so unFleetwood Mac sounding that it brings tears to my eyes. The fact that all of Stevie's songs are sh*t (at least the music) compared to what could have been on there is simply a waste of album space. Did I mention that album does not even deserve to be called Fleetwood Mac? It should have been called by another band name and then "including members of Fleetwood Mac". O.k. so I feel a little strongly about this. Billy and Rick who? :mad:

Edit: On second thought, I'm glad she didn't use any of our precious demos on this album with that line-up. Could have been easily ruined so she did a smart thing by putting weak tracks on there.

[mikephxaz]

The words laundromat and chimpanzee almost ruin Street Angel single handedly. I love you guys but don't hate on my Enchanted.

Amen. My thoughts exactly. Laundromat and chimpanzee sums up how bad street angel is....and . "oooooooooo, you're consistent and that's good" are equally bad lyrics on listen to the rain.

[rubylounge]

I'm gonna go through all the albums (FM & solo) and just list the songs I can't stand:

- Nothing Ever Changes
- I Will Run to You
- When I See You Again
- Two Kinds of Love
- Desert Angel
- Sometimes it's a Bitch
- Love's a Hard Game to Play
- Unconditional Love
- Maybe Love Will Change Your Mind
- Jane
- One More Big Time Rock & Roll Star
- That Made Me Stronger
- Too Far from Texas (good song, hideous vocal)
- Not Make Believe

I could take or leave most of her SYW songs, but there aren't any I'd classify as "criminal," except for Not Make Believe. But the ones on this list, she simply never should've recorded (IMO), with the possible exception of Too Far from Texas - she should've at least tried for a better vocal.

Here are the songs I don't care for:

Cheaper Than Free
Everybody Loves You
Free Fallin’
God’s Garden
I Need to Know
I Still Miss Someone with Blue Eyes
It’s Late
Just Like a Woman
Love is Like a River
Nothing Ever Changes
Paper Doll
Reconsider Me
That Made Me Stronger
Think About It
Touched by an Angel
Unconditional Love
Whole Lotta Trouble
You May be the One

[bombaysaffires]

So funny........in the interview in the Songwriting Q&A she says that she tells Dave that Cheaper Than Free could end up being the best song either of them ever wrote.......

[bluefox4000]

So funny........in the interview in the Songwriting Q&A she says that she tells Dave that Cheaper Than Free could end up being the best song either of them ever wrote.......

Ohhhhhhhh Stevie:rolleyes:

Mick

[glamorousnymph]

To me, there's a little bit of criminality in most of the songs after Tusk, in that she got lazy with her lyrics. Look at the tight writing of the songs on the first few albums, before she started peppering her songs with random words from the Stevie Song Generator. I still love a lot of WH and RAL, TISL and IYD, but she started losing the craft of writing, editing down, and she never got it back completely. Perhaps she surrounded herself with yes people or was such a terror to work with at that time, no one wanted to tell her "Quit saying 'well' every other line and find a way to make the line work" (Springsteen started doing this little trick with "sir," though to better effect) or "Stop switching from third to first person." well, Lindsey tried that once, with Thrown Down, and we all know what her response was.

A song like Nightbird, a great song, but it starts to creep in *slightly* with the lazy rhyme "blankets that I love / surrounded by too much love." or in "Edge" "hear you, hear you, unable to hear you." Also, the Edge line don't make no damn sense.

Then we get to a later stage with non-lyrics filling out songs, like Imperial Hotel "baby whoa my baby, you have to know, you have to know" (stop for a second, think for a minute, and write a real line!) or cringe-inducing contradictions like "they say unspoken words to explain it." I know it's rock'n'roll and all, but it seems like she started to fudge some of the lines when she didn't want to write them.

Many songs started with a good idea, but instead of crafting a full set of lyrics, she put one or two good verses and used filler or repeats for the rest. Instead of someone who wrote a lot of songs, she became someone who wrote the same three songs over and over. (I wouldn't say that about her now, but there were many years like that.)

[mikephxaz]

Then we get to a later stage with non-lyrics filling out songs, like Imperial Hotel "baby whoa my baby, you have to know, you have to know" (stop for a second, think for a minute, and write a real line!) or cringe-inducing contradictions like "they say unspoken words to explain it." I know it's rock'n'roll and all, but it seems like she started to fudge some of the lines when she didn't want to write them.
)

I agree with your thoughts in general but I love the simplicity of Imperial Hotel lyrics....the song reminds me of Tom Petty's Ways to be Wicked (that Lone Justice did an incredible cover of)
I wish Stevie would have covered that song but Maria McKee of Lone Justice sang the hell out of that song..Stevie couldn't touch her version..

[bombaysaffires]

To me, there's a little bit of criminality in most of the songs after Tusk, in that she got lazy with her lyrics. Look at the tight writing of the songs on the first few albums, before she started peppering her songs with random words from the Stevie Song Generator. I still love a lot of WH and RAL, TISL and IYD, but she started losing the craft of writing, editing down, and she never got it back completely. Perhaps she surrounded herself with yes people or was such a terror to work with at that time, no one wanted to tell her "Quit saying 'well' every other line and find a way to make the line work" (Springsteen started doing this little trick with "sir," though to better effect) or "Stop switching from third to first person." well, Lindsey tried that once, with Thrown Down, and we all know what her response was.

A song like Nightbird, a great song, but it starts to creep in *slightly* with the lazy rhyme "blankets that I love / surrounded by too much love." or in "Edge" "hear you, hear you, unable to hear you." Also, the Edge line don't make no damn sense.

Then we get to a later stage with non-lyrics filling out songs, like Imperial Hotel "baby whoa my baby, you have to know, you have to know" (stop for a second, think for a minute, and write a real line!) or cringe-inducing contradictions like "they say unspoken words to explain it." I know it's rock'n'roll and all, but it seems like she started to fudge some of the lines when she didn't want to write them.

Many songs started with a good idea, but instead of crafting a full set of lyrics, she put one or two good verses and used filler or repeats for the rest. Instead of someone who wrote a lot of songs, she became someone who wrote the same three songs over and over. (I wouldn't say that about her now, but there were many years like that.)

well.... she reused the "diamond snake in a black sky" twice on SYW and I've lost count how many times "it broke my/her heart, broke my/her heart" on this album....

[glamorousnymph]

I agree with your thoughts in general but I love the simplicity of Imperial Hotel lyrics....the song reminds me of Tom Petty's Ways to be Wicked (that Lone Justice did an incredible cover of)
I wish Stevie would have covered that song but Maria McKee of Lone Justice sang the hell out of that song..Stevie couldn't touch her version..

Oh, Maria McKee... I didnt know she covered that! I love her. I'm going to check that out.

[mikephxaz]

Oh, Maria McKee... I didnt know she covered that! I love her. I'm going to check that out.

yups check out Lone Justice..Ways To Be Wicked....she sings the hell out of that song....She writes and sings like a young southern Stevie

[WildHeart69]

Stevie's work to me ranks "marvellous," "who cares?" or "dreadful." the dreadfuls are all from her solo work, and include the Petty-inspired arrangement stuff like Blue Lamp, Violet and Blue, I Need to Know, OMBTRARS...

Dumb songs she shouldn't have done:

BD: I detest most of the production on this album, and have neither faves (maybe EO17, Still of the Night?) nor hate-ables (Highwayman, title track?)

WH: I Will Run to You, Enchanted.

RAL: Sister Honey, Imperial Hotel

TOSOTM: 2 Kinds of Love, Rooms on Fire, Ghosts

TS: SIAB, LAHGTP. Desert Angel is god-awful but something about the arrangements and vocals touches, it's the lyrics (and overall theme) that hurt. Badly.

SA: Everything except MLWCYM, Kick It, and Jane. yes, Jane.

TISL: Bad production courtesy of Sheryl Crow abounds here. She shouldn't have done Everyday, TFFT. Bombay Sapphires is a nifty song ruined by some "WTF?" lyrics.

IYD: It is Dave Stewart's album. She shouldn't have done FWIW, AL, and IS really badly needed at least another verse or something.

Stevie is a balladeer, to me. The slow haunted stuff is where she shines and where her voice still hits the stars.

I am going to pretend I didnt read about 90% of this post... ha!

Everyone has their own opinion

[tilthefirefades]

There are very few Stevie songs that I truly hate:
The Second Time
The Nightmare
Nightbird
Soldier's Angel
Ghosts are Gone

The rest I simply appreciate even if I don't love them.

[Dodfather]

I agree with your thoughts in general but I love the simplicity of Imperial Hotel lyrics....the song reminds me of Tom Petty's Ways to be Wicked (that Lone Justice did an incredible cover of)
I wish Stevie would have covered that song but Maria McKee of Lone Justice sang the hell out of that song..Stevie couldn't touch her version..

I LOVE that song!! Lone Justice's entire first album is excellent. Shelter (album no. 2) isn't quite as good but then we got Maria's solo debut, which is a stunning album!

[Dodfather]

yups check out Lone Justice..Ways To Be Wicked....she sings the hell out of that song....She writes and sings like a young southern Stevie


Absolutely. :nod:

[mikephxaz]

Absolutely. :nod:

McKee is writing now for other singers...if you get a chance...check out on youtube Bette Midlers' How I want To Deserve You...Maria wrote the song...Back in early 90ties Rolling Stone called McKee's song "Wheels" as the best of the year

[markolas]

I've only ever heard the Lone Justice version of Ways to Be Wicked...I can't imagine anyone else singing it, actually.

[TrueFaith77]

bite your tongue! i love this song lmao!

When/if I write my book about Fleetwood Mac, it will be titled: Illume

[mikephxaz]

I've only ever heard the Lone Justice version of Ways to Be Wicked...I can't imagine anyone else singing it, actually.

Maria McKee is Lone Justice:D

[markolas]

Maria McKee is Lone Justice:D

I know. I meant I've never heard the Tom Petty version.

[Christopher]

I LOVE that song!! Lone Justice's entire first album is excellent. Shelter (album no. 2) isn't quite as good but then we got Maria's solo debut, which is a stunning album!
I agree 100% with this! It also seemed to me with "Shelter", Iovine was subtly trying to cast Mckee in a more Nicksian light.:nod: I have all of Maria's solo albums - Her self titled debut & "Life Is Sweet" are my favorites.

Sorry to go off topic... just had to jump in on the Lone Justice & Maria Mckee love.

[glamorousnymph]

You Gotta Sin To Get Saved ...
My Girlhood Among The Outlaws, I'm Gonna Soothe You, the Van Morrison Covers! :blob1:

[PenguinHead]

yups check out Lone Justice..Ways To Be Wicked....she sings the hell out of that song....She writes and sings like a young southern Stevie

Maria McKee is in a whole other league than Stevie, vocally and lyric-wise, but they both share an eccentric nature. Ways to be Wicked is a great song. Maria usually writes her own songs, so that song is an anomoly. But since Tom Petty wrote it, it definately fits in with a style that fits Stevie perfectly. But Maria did the song justice (Lone Justice!). I love the group and her solo work. I have all of her albums, and have seen several performances.

[Travisevian]

Behind The Mask's production is THE worst of Nicks' FM albums.

I disagree.

I cringe at the sound of anything from BTM. It's so unFleetwood Mac sounding that it brings tears to my eyes.

Actually, it was more blues-oriented, which initially was the type of music Fleetwood Mac created. As for the adult contemporary sound, it was a product of its time, Fleetwood Mac in the late 1980's. Stevie may say that she didn't change with the times but the music certainly did.

Did I mention that album does not even deserve to be called Fleetwood Mac? It should have been called by another band name and then "including members of Fleetwood Mac".

I believe you mean the band, not the album but one could make a similar argument about Say You Will...or any of the albums with the Rumours lineup, for that matter.

Amen. My thoughts exactly. Laundromat and chimpanzee sums up how bad street angel is....and . "oooooooooo, you're consistent and that's good" are equally bad lyrics on listen to the rain.

What about the beautiful lyrics in Rose Garden?


Love is Like a River

The Rock A Little demo is great.

So funny........in the interview in the Songwriting Q&A she says that she tells Dave that Cheaper Than Free could end up being the best song either of them ever wrote.......

Better than Silver Springs or Beauty And The Beast? In your dreams...

To Deserve You...Maria wrote the song...

It's a beautiful song. I like the Bette Of Roses album from Bette Midler.

[mikephxaz]

Maria McKee is in a whole other league than Stevie, vocally and lyric-wise, but they both share an eccentric nature. Ways to be Wicked is a great song. Maria usually writes her own songs, so that song is an anomoly. But since Tom Petty wrote it, it definately fits in with a style that fits Stevie perfectly. But Maria did the song justice (Lone Justice!). I love the group and her solo work. I have all of her albums, and have seen several performances.

Her Sweet Sweet Baby of Mine and Shelter and Wheels are very Stevieisque...I love McKee but she sometimes mistakes screaming with singing....Unlike Stevie, I can't listen repeatedly to a McKee cd....However, she is one of the best female song writers out there.

[Christopher]

Maria McKee is in a whole other league than Stevie, vocally and lyric-wise.
Don't get me wrong I love Maria. But the same can be said about Stevie Nicks vocally and lyric-wise! Apples and Oranges. And also, there are many white blue-eyed soul, blues & country girl singers around that sound similar to Maria, both famous and in clubs across the world. But Stevie's voice is truly in a league of its own.:angel: