excuse my extra shipperness.....(pet names)

[fumidesigns]

do we know if Lindsey had a petname for Stevie?

*lowers head in shipper shame*

don't ask me where this question came from. it just popped in this cottoncandy head of mine! lol!

[WildHearted]

"Schizophrenic bitch."





.... I jest. 'Angel' has been long rumoured as a shared pet name between the two of them, hasn't it?

[fumidesigns]

"Schizophrenic bitch."

HEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEY! :laugh:

NO..........i mean sweet pet names!

[CADreaming]

do we know if Lindsey had a petname for Stevie?

*lowers head in shipper shame*

don't ask me where this question came from. it just popped in this cottoncandy head of mine! lol!

:lol::lol::lol:

Check your pm.

[fumidesigns]

"Schizophrenic bitch."





.... I jest. 'Angel' has been long rumoured as a shared pet name between the two of them, hasn't it?

awwwwwwwwwwwwww really?! awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww! that so sweet! :D :blob1:

[fumidesigns]

:lol::lol::lol:

Check your pm.

i don't have one..........

ok now i do lol

[fumidesigns]

soooooooooo is "angel" about Lindsey?

[WildHearted]

soooooooooo is "angel" about Lindsey?

I have no clue. I've always assumed it was based on the lyrics and the Tusk documentary footage and what Stevie said about that, but like everything it's open to interpretation I guess.

Regarding the pet names, I have absolutely no clue where the whole 'angel' thing came from - that's just what I've always heard and read from other people. Supposedly that's how Goodbye Angel ties in as well?

[mezzoforte]

soooooooooo is "angel" about Lindsey?

Some think so, but I tend to believe Carol Ann Harris. She wrote that after Mick left her for Sara, Stevie was livid and would sit in the studio glaring at all of them and furiously scribbling the lyrics to what became Angel.
I think Lindsey thought it was about him, though--the Tusk doc!

[fumidesigns]

@mezzoforte and @wildhearted

ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh ok! *deep sigh* i like the 'angel' thing. this makes me very happy!!!! :]

eventho i was hopeful of "pumpkin" for stevie. lmao! i think that would roll of lind's tongue nicely. awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww pumpkin!!!!

i'm a loser.........i know :lol:

[fumidesigns]

Some think so, but I tend to believe Carol Ann Harris. She wrote that after Mick left her for Sara, Stevie was livid and would sit in the studio scribbling away the lyrics to what became Angel.
I think Lindsey thought it was about him, though--the Tusk doc!

i need that damn book!!!! like................NOW!

[WildHearted]

@mezzoforte and @wildhearted

ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooh ok! *deep sigh* i like the 'angel' thing. this makes me very happy!!!! :]

eventho i was hopeful of "pumpkin" for stevie. lmao! i think that would roll of lind's tongue nicely. awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww pumpkin!!!!

i'm a loser.........i know :lol:

In one interview for the SYW tour, they quoted Stevie as calling Lindsey 'honey.' :laugh:

[fumidesigns]

In one interview for the SYW tour, they quoted Stevie as calling Lindsey 'honey.' :laugh:

awwwwwwwwwwwwwwww where!!!? please post it! omg!!!! :blob1:

[CADreaming]

In one interview for the SYW tour, they quoted Stevie as calling Lindsey 'honey.' :laugh:

Well, and I'm pretty sure they have both overused 'baby'...

[WildHearted]

awwwwwwwwwwwwwwww where!!!? please post it! omg!!!! :blob1:

Google has yet to fail me. Here's the excerpt from it.


"Things are better now than they used to be," says Nicks. "In the old days we were angry with each other and didn't like each other. We had to go on stage and play. It was all about dirty looks and not having much fun. That's partly to do with why Lindsey left the band in '83."

"Eighty-seven," interjects Buckingham and, as if on cue, there follows a few minutes of intense discussion between them about just when the guitarist was in the band and when he wasn't.

"But honey, you really left in '83, you only came back to do [the album] Tango in the Night in 1987. You didn't tour."

"No, no, I was in the band until 1987," he insists, and suddenly it's as if only the two of them are in the room. "I was there for the whole thing. I produced the album and then I pulled out for the tour because it was just too crazy."

Nicks gives this a few seconds' thought.

"I thought you pretty much left. Oh, I can't even remember," she concedes.

Buckingham, however, is eager to make his point, recalling how the artistically adventurous Tusk, the relatively unsuccessful follow-up to Rumours, was a turning point in his relationship with the other members. He's still addressing this only to Nicks.

"It was harder for me because after Tusk there was this dictum that came down [from the other members] that we weren't going to move to the left too much anymore. It was hard for me to reconcile the process because that was interesting to me. In some ways I was treading water, but I was never not there. I was there for everything."

Nicks thinks again. "So where was I?"

Then, realising there's a third person in the room, they laugh and acknowledge the therapy session ambience.

:laugh:

[fumidesigns]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ awwwwwwwwwwwwwww i'm over here squealing like a lil girl!!!!!!! i love it!

[Amlyn]

i need that damn book!!!! like................NOW!
If we end up getting together on the 26th, i'll bring you mine to read.

[gypsy4life]

Google has yet to fail me. Here's the excerpt from it.



:laugh:


Thanks for that! The "Honey" thing made me squeal too! lol :o

[crylove77]

Some think so, but I tend to believe Carol Ann Harris. She wrote that after Mick left her for Sara, Stevie was livid and would sit in the studio glaring at all of them and furiously scribbling the lyrics to what became Angel.
I think Lindsey thought it was about him, though--the Tusk doc!

And my response to that has always been- how would CAH know what Stevie was writing? Was she looking over her shoulder, stole her journal, what? Really, I think Stevie would sock her one if she got that physically close to her.:p And even if she did see the lyrics, how does CAH know it was about Mick? Unless Stevie was repeatedly scribbling Mrs. Stevie Fleetwood on the same page or something.:laugh:

[Artemis]

And my response to that has always been- how would CAH know what Stevie was writing? Was she looking over her shoulder, stole her journal, what? Really, I think Stevie would sock her one if she got that physically close to her.:p And even if she did see the lyrics, how does CAH know it was about Mick? Unless Stevie was repeatedly scribbling Mrs. Stevie Fleetwood on the same page or something.:laugh:

Exactly. Plus, CAH wasn't exactly the sharpest tool in the box. If Stevie wanted to go through Mick's book with a red pen, she'd have a field day with Carol's! :laugh:

[Macfanforever]

I think I mentioned awhile ago I had a tabby cat named Rhiannon back in 1988.My landlady had to take her away because I wasn't suposted to have pets in the apt.

[mezzoforte]

And my response to that has always been- how would CAH know what Stevie was writing? Was she looking over her shoulder, stole her journal, what? Really, I think Stevie would sock her one if she got that physically close to her.:p And even if she did see the lyrics, how does CAH know it was about Mick? Unless Stevie was repeatedly scribbling Mrs. Stevie Fleetwood on the same page or something.:laugh:

Haha, yeah, I admittedly have no way of knowing who Angel is about and neither does CAH.

But it doesn't seem illogical to me that she would write about him during Tusk, especially since she had to watch him fall straight into the arms of her close friend.
The Stevie/Mick relationship will never be romanticized by fans, but both have spoken about its significance to them.
They may not be soul mates, but isn't it still possible that he was, for a brief while, the angel of her dreams?

http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q295/GraceChristine/tumblr_l9xeoq6Wdv1qc7px3o1_400.jpg

[fumidesigns]

If we end up getting together on the 26th, i'll bring you mine to read.

Yay!!!!!! I'm sooooooooo ready! Thanks girl!!!!!!!

[fumidesigns]

Yeah if CAH ever tried to take a look, peek or quick glance Stevie would have hooked off early. She put her in her place more than a few times I'm sure. My personal fav was telling that worthless ass that she belonged in coach! Lmbao!

I can see how Angel could be about mick tho! "I still look up", "that girl was me"......I mean really just a second ago that girl was Stevie! Nice speculation right here.

Ha! As I type this "long distance winner" starts to play!!!!

[CADreaming]

Yeah if CAH ever tried to take a look, peek or quick glance Stevie would have hooked off early. She put her in her place more than a few times I'm sure. My personal fav was telling that worthless ass that she belonged in coach! Lmbao!

I can see how Angel could be about mick tho! "I still look up", "that girl was me"......I mean really just a second ago that girl was Stevie! Nice speculation right here.

Ha! As I type this "long distance winner" starts to play!!!!

It's a sign - it's Lindsey! :laugh:

And Roflol about CAH sitting in coach! Hysterical!

[fumidesigns]

It's a sign - it's Lindsey! :laugh:

And Roflol about CAH sitting in coach! Hysterical!

lmaoooooooooooo wasn't that too funny! Our girl in full divaness and LB didn't say a damn thing.

[Ghosty]

i mentioned this in another post, but i do recall stevie saying at some point in the past that Angel was about mick. i remember her saying something about the line "i still look up when you walk in the room, we both pretend, no great pretender." she said how mick always had such a presence when he walked in a room, being so tall, and she thought he had this sort of english elegance (or whatever her word was). and i remember her talking about him like that once when she was talking about when she first met fleetwood mac, and how mick had this amazing presence, like a big rock and roll star an his very wonderful english look, his vest and pocket watch (with it's "watch chain") hanging, and i think she even mentioned him smelling really good, like some spicey woodsy scent?

she has talked about him like this a few times, she really seemed to dig him from the moment she met him. i guess that makes sense. she was not a star yet, and here she was, meeting a very famouse english rock music star who has hung out with the beatles, eric clapton, and so on.and stevie loved that sort of dickens, old world england kind of vibe and look. i'm sure the accent didn't hurt.

[fumidesigns]

i mentioned this in another post, but i do recall stevie saying at some point in the past that Angel was about mick. i remember her saying something about the line "i still look up when you walk in the room, we both pretend, no great pretender." she said how mick always had such a presence when he walked in a room, being so tall, and she thought he had this sort of english elegance (or whatever her word was). and i remember her talking about him like that once when she was talking about when she first met fleetwood mac, and how mick had this amazing presence, like a big rock and roll star an his very wonderful english look, his vest and pocket watch (with it's "watch chain") hanging, and i think she even mentioned him smelling really good, like some spicey woodsy scent?

she has talked about him like this a few times, she really seemed to dig him from the moment she met him. i guess that makes sense. she was not a star yet, and here she was, meeting a very famouse english rock music star who has hung out with the beatles, eric clapton, and so on.and stevie loved that sort of dickens, old world england kind of vibe and look. i'm sure the accent didn't hurt.

i'm sooooooooo sorry. i have to re-read this. not because of what you wrote. u just happen to use some keywords that tend to grab my attention when it comes to Mick. i would highlight them, but that could get me banned lmao!

thanks for the info tho. i can totally see how "angel" is about mick. i listened to it again this morning to see how he.......fits in.

[TrueFaith77]

Remember, also, that one of the threads in the CAH book is how delusional she is about Lindsey and Stevie's relationship. My favorite example is how Lindsey went to confront Stevie about the harsh words she said to CAH. CAH waits for HOURS for Lindsey's return. Everybody but CAH knows what was going on in Stevie's hotel room.

[fumidesigns]

Remember, also, that one of the threads in the CAH book is how delusional she is about Lindsey and Stevie's relationship. My favorite example is how Lindsey went to confront Stevie about the harsh words she said to CAH. CAH waits for HOURS for Lindsey's return. Everybody but CAH knows what was going on in Stevie's hotel room.

what i tell you about making me lol at work!!!!!!? omg! i can't wait to read this book! i love it!

[Artemis]

I can see how Angel could be about mick tho! "I still look up", "that girl was me"......I mean really just a second ago that girl was Stevie! Nice speculation right here.

Ooh, I've never thought of it that way before! Really interesting spin on the song, I happen to totally agree with it too. Also, now that we're on about it being about Mick; the "great pretender" stuff makes sense too; since I think their affair was still secret at that point?

[AnthonyMI]

People keep using this word and it sort of came out of nowhere. WTF is it? :mad:

[Artemis]

I tried to explain it in my own words, but couldn't figure out how to, so, I just checked out Wikipedia;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shipping_%28fandom%29

Hope that helps :laugh:

[fumidesigns]

Ooh, I've never thought of it that way before! Really interesting spin on the song, I happen to totally agree with it too. Also, now that we're on about it being about Mick; the "great pretender" stuff makes sense too; since I think their affair was still secret at that point?

their affair was a secret during tusk? really? i thought since they stopped screwing around during the rumours tour then they told LB around that time...........no? enlighten me.

[Artemis]

Well, even if they weren't still having an affair, I don't think anyone else knew about it when they were recording Tusk. I'm never quite certain on the Stevie/Mick timeline :laugh:

[AnthonyMI]

Oh. ok. So I am guessing this shipperingness is applied to Stevie/Lindsey?

[fumidesigns]

Well, even if they weren't still having an affair, I don't think anyone else knew about it when they were recording Tusk. I'm never quite certain on the Stevie/Mick timeline :laugh:

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm i wonder. i have mick's book at home. i need to see when he claims it all came out.

i wonder how much that really hurt LB. i mean he said "it was just one more thing" but does anyone know if Stevie and him got into about that?

[fumidesigns]

what's a shipper? i am a shipper. that's what a shipper is.

[Heartboy]

I've heard that word so many times being a 'BH, 90210' & 'Buffy' fan! :lol:

[KarmaContestant]

I lean more on the slasher side of things. I think Lindsey and John had had a secret affair for years!

Just kidding. :sorry:

[bluefox4000]

People who think Stevie and Lindsey were meant to be together forever and ever and OMG they totally should get back together........In other words....Complete BS...:rolleyes:

That's my best description anyway.

Mick

[fumidesigns]

I lean more on the slasher side of things. I think Lindsey and John had had a secret affair for years!

Just kidding. :sorry:

i just threw up in my mouth.................

i mean just knowing that lindsey would have to be the bottom truly tears my heart apart! :lol:

[fumidesigns]

People who think Stevie and Lindsey were meant to be together forever and ever and OMG they totally should get back together........In other words....Complete BS...:rolleyes:

That's my best description anyway.

Mick

i had no idea we were beefing.

:p

[TrueFaith77]

It's interesting that such concepts as "Shipper," "Birther," "Truther" in which people devote a lot time and energy drawing connections, analyzing information, and tying it together with conjecture always ends in "er"... I wonder when that all started. There's no such term for those who think JFK assassination was an inside job or a conspiracy. It's an interesting, probably 'net-based sociological phenomenon. IT's also interesting how much valuable information "ers" provide despite their interpretations sometimes being coloured by their forgone conclusions.

I love the contribution shippers make to Mac fandom. I don't THINK I am one, but I do read the art from a shipper perspective sometime (e.g., all Lindsey's songs are about Stevie and vice-versa).

[bluefox4000]

i had no idea we were beefing.

:p

Never:thumbsup: You ship away.:p Nothing wrong with it.

Powa to da shippers:lol:

Mick

[CADreaming]

People who think Stevie and Lindsey were meant to be together forever and ever and OMG they totally should get back together........In other words....Complete BS...:rolleyes:

That's my best description anyway.

Mick

Hey, guess what? Based on that description even Stevie and Lindsey are shippers!! LOL! :lol:

[fumidesigns]

It's interesting that such concepts as "Shipper," "Birther," "Truther" in which people devote a lot time and energy drawing connections, analyzing information, and tying it together with conjecture always ends in "er"... I wonder when that all started. There's no such term for those who think JFK assassination was an inside job or a conspiracy. It's an interesting, probably 'net-based sociological phenomenon. IT's also interesting how much valuable information "ers" provide despite their interpretations sometimes being coloured by their forgone conclusions.

I love the contribution shippers make to Mac fandom. I don't THINK I am one, but I do read the art from a shipper perspective sometime (e.g., all Lindsey's songs are about Stevie and vice-versa).



just FACT!!!!! anyone that says different is from the debil lol!

[fumidesigns]

Hey, guess what? Based on that description even Stevie and Lindsey are shippers!! LOL! :lol:

well of course they are. that's just the way it is...............and always will be.

[bluefox4000]

Hey, guess what? Based on that description even Stevie and Lindsey are shippers!! LOL! :lol:

Basically....yes:laugh:

Mick

[TrueFaith77]

There's a mind-blowing Shipper thread on sevenwonders. I forget what it's called. I haven't been to that site in over a year or two, but it made for intense reading! It was in the Lindsey section. Something about a photoshoot or something.

[markolas]

People who think Stevie and Lindsey were meant to be together forever and ever and OMG they totally should get back together........In other words....Complete BS...:rolleyes:

That's my best description anyway.

Mine, too. But I've decided to not even try to understand it and ignore it as best I can. :)

[michelej1]

I've heard that word so many times being a 'BH, 90210' & 'Buffy' fan! :lol:

We used to have endless shipper and noromo (no romance) discussions on the X-Files boards.

Michele

[CADreaming]

There's a mind-blowing Shipper thread on sevenwonders. I forget what it's called. I haven't been to that site in over a year or two, but it made for intense reading! It was in the Lindsey section. Something about a photoshoot or something.

Oh geez...you had to bring that up!

[michelej1]

People who think Stevie and Lindsey were meant to be together forever and ever and OMG they totally should get back together........In other words....Complete BS...:rolleyes:

That's my best description anyway.

Mick

I don't think it's even a question of thinking they are meant to be together or should get back together. From my perspective, shipperism has always been about looking at the clues and trying to determine whether or not there is a relationship, rather than whether or not you want one in a "they lived happily ever after" manner. On the X-Files, Chris Carter seemingly had nothing better to do with his time than throw bones out for the noromos and shippers to dissect and argue over.

With Stevie and Lindsey, I don't think in terms of romance and I don't think they ever could be together living in a house, sharing recreational activities again. I don't see them doing that.

But I see the ship as just a RELATIONSHIP in all of its forms and permutations, be it sexual or whatever else it is after you've been sharing a stage with the same person for 40 years. They have lived through the culmination of better, worse, richer, poorer, sickness and health and in a way it is a marriage. I think it's fascinating that the core relationship is never going to change no matter what. If one bombed the other's house, other than an angry flare up that lasted a couple of days, I don't really think it would cause a true break in the relationship.

However, to a lesser extent, I think the same could be said of all of the band members, even John and Lindsey. Lindsey and Christine: I don't think he doesn't love her and I don't think he could make her stop loving him -- even though some of his comments in 2003 were especially trying. I always look at the 5 members of FM in terms of a ship.

Michele

[michelej1]

As the lyric changes from Great Pretender, to no great pretenders, I think it could be Mick or Lindsey. The song probably has threads of both, actually.

CAH wrote that no one was fooled by what was going on with Mick and Stevie, even though they tried to keep it a secret. So, they weren't good at pretending.

On the other hand, Stevie and Lindsey never broke up emotionally, even when they weren't having an affair. So, going through a daily band routine and acting as if nothing was there, when it was . . . they were no great pretenders as well.

Michele

[caroline79]

"Schizophrenic bitch."




.... I jest. 'Angel' has been long rumoured as a shared pet name between the two of them, hasn't it?

:lol::lol::lol:

And my response to that has always been- how would CAH know what Stevie was writing? Was she looking over her shoulder, stole her journal, what? Really, I think Stevie would sock her one if she got that physically close to her.:p And even if she did see the lyrics, how does CAH know it was about Mick? Unless Stevie was repeatedly scribbling Mrs. Stevie Fleetwood on the same page or something.:laugh:

:laugh::laugh::laugh:

[caroline79]

i just threw up in my mouth.................

i mean just knowing that lindsey would have to be the bottom truly tears my heart apart! :lol:

Can't...get image...out of....my head! :eek:
I need to head on over to the Stevie/Lindsey intimacy thread after that!

[KarmaContestant]

i mean just knowing that lindsey would have to be the bottom truly tears my heart apart! :lol:

:laugh:

Oh, but maybe not.

[fumidesigns]

As the lyric changes from Great Pretender, to no great pretenders, I think it could be Mick or Lindsey. The song probably has threads of both, actually.

CAH wrote that no one was fooled by what was going on with Mick and Stevie, even though they tried to keep it a secret. So, they weren't good at pretending.

On the other hand, Stevie and Lindsey never broke up emotionally, even when they weren't having an affair. So, going through a daily band routine and acting as if nothing was there, when it was . . . they were no great pretenders as well.

Michele

ooooooooooooooooooooooooh dang! nice michele. well the pictures that mick and stevie took sure didn't make it seem like they were tryna hide much. everytime i think about their affair all i see is that pic of her, i think she's sitting on his lap, maybe they're at a party, and they're laughing. unless she's a 'hop in his lap' type chick........

[TrueFaith77]

what i tell you about making me lol at work!!!!!!? omg! i can't wait to read this book! i love it!

Oh i forgot that the funniest part is the way CAH writes about it, it's as if Lindsey were her knight in shining armor spending hours standing up for her against the wrath of Stevie (Stevie grabbed CAH, tightly around the arm, backstage during a concert and warned her: YOU WILL NEVER MARRY LINDSEY!! NEVER!!!!!!).

Could anything have turned Lindsey on more than knowing Stevie felt this way!?

The next day Stevie apologized profusely to CAH. CAH saw it as a victory for herself, rather than recognizing that Lindsey and Stevie had obviously re-established their superior bond and that Stevie no longer saw CAH as a threat. :laugh: After all... STEVIE WAS RIGHT! Lindsey never did marry CAH.

[fumidesigns]

Oh i forgot that the funniest part is the way CAH writes about it, it's as if Lindsey were her knight in shining armor spending hours standing up for her against the wrath of Stevie (Stevie grabbed CAH, tightly around the arm, backstage during a concert and warned her: YOU WILL NEVER MARRY LINDSEY!! NEVER!!!!!!).

Stevie wasn't wrong was she?

Could anything have turned Lindsey on more than knowing Stevie felt this way!?

The next day Stevie apologized profusely to CAH. CAH saw it as a victory for herself, rather than recognizing that Lindsey and Stevie had obviously re-established their superior bond and that Stevie no longer saw CAH as a threat. :laugh: After all... STEVIE WAS RIGHT!

Or maybe I'm just shippering.

oh it doesn't matter. i like the way you think boo!

my gosh this is gonna be the best read ever!!!! i can't wait!!! Amy don't forget this masterpiece please lol!

[TrueFaith77]

oh it doesn't matter. i like the way you think boo!

my gosh this is gonna be the best read ever!!!! i can't wait!!! Amy don't forget this masterpiece please lol!

You'll enjoy it. CAH is so deluded and lacking in self-awareness that it makes for a strangely tension-filled read; the spectacle of a skewed perspective.

AND the biggest laugh I've ever had on this board was a joke inspired by the car-in-reverse hair-pulling moment. #inappropriatehumour

[SapphireSister]

Someone should merge all these shipper/LB threads. :nod:

[caroline79]

Am I the only one who thinks CAH was telling the truth, at least somewhat? :shrug:

[fumidesigns]

Am I the only one who thinks CAH was telling the truth, at least somewhat? :shrug:

well i never read the book and i'm pretty sure there was truth to it. i have never heard anyone, in the band, say she was lying................have i? have any of you ever read/heard a member say "that's not true! CAH has never walked in on linds and i ever!" or something like that..............HOPEFULLY SOMETHING JUST LIKE THAT! :lol:

[TrueFaith77]

i mean just knowing that lindsey would have to be the bottom truly tears my heart apart! :lol:


*sigh* remember the footage of Lindsey doing the "oooh oooh's" on the "bathroom" studio floor in the Tusk doc? #70sjeans

[fumidesigns]

*sigh* remember the footage of Lindsey doing the "oooh oooh's" on the "bathroom" studio floor in the Tusk doc? #70sjeans

oh God! y'd you take my mind there!!!!!! lmaooooooooooooooo! so so wrong!
:lol:

[TrueFaith77]

well i never read the book and i'm pretty sure there was truth to it. i have never heard anyone, in the band, say she was lying................have i? have any of you ever read/heard a member say "that's not true! CAH has never walked in on linds and i ever!" or something like that..............HOPEFULLY SOMETHING JUST LIKE THAT! :lol:

Well, some might think that Lindsey wrote a song in response to the book: "Treason".

As for whether CAH is lying...

I dont' think she was lying about Lindsey being in Stevie's rooms for hours after the incident. But she doesn't know what happened. She wasn't there. And neither was I. I DO think she's lying to herself about Stevie and Lindsey's relationship. She was blind to it. Yet, she includes little details (something in how she describes Lindsey's demeanor when he returns to his&CAH's room) that make it clear she SEES the truth even though she won't admit it.

Her self-destructiveness (esp in relations to men) is something to which she never fully admits. It's one of the disturbing, fascinating, sad aspects of the book in a narrative presumably about self-actualization.

[fumidesigns]

Well, some might think that Lindsey wrote a song in response to the book: "Treason".

As for whether CAH is lying...

I dont' think she was lying about Lindsey being in Stevie's rooms for hours after the incident. But she doesn't know what happened. She wasn't there. And neither was I. I DO think she's lying to herself about Stevie and Lindsey's relationship. She was blind to it. Yet, she includes little details (something in how she describes Lindsey's demeanor when he returns to his&CAH's room) that make it clear she SEES the truth even though she won't admit it.

Her self-destructiveness (esp in relations to men) is something to which she never fully admits. It's one of the disturbing, fascinating, sad aspects of the book in a narrative presumably about self-actualization.


*in my dumbest chick in the world voice*
"y are you tired? dead tired? and y are your clothes wrinkled and thrown on backwards?! what happened to your hair? and my god what is that smell?"

lawwwwwwwwwwd i can't wait to read this book!!!!

[michelej1]

Her self-destructiveness (esp in relations to men) is something to which she never fully admits. It's one of the disturbing, fascinating, sad aspects of the book in a narrative presumably about self-actualization.

Yes, I don't think CAH is as naive or as unaware as she makes herself out in the book. In fact, I think she is rather shrewd. She is not even really acting on a subconscious level. She is painting a picture in the book and she's not doing it out of ignorance. She's coming from a place of knowledge about where she wants facts to lead.

Michele

[caroline79]

I am sure CAH is not as naive as she portrays herself, but it is her book, she is automatically going to try and make herself look as innocent as possible.

I found out about this book in January and it seemed like the majority of people who had read it thought she was lying about almost everything. I'm not talking about this board at all because I had yet to discover it. None of us can difinitively say what did or did not happen, obviously, but I just feel like most of the personal stuff that happened between her and Lindsey is probably true. I don't see a reason why she would make up such awful things to publish in a book so many years after the fact.

But this is all speculation. Perhaps I am a little too obsessed with the CAH/LB relationship. They are my avatar afterall :laugh:

[TrueFaith77]

hmmm... I wonder where I put my copy of Storms. My memory is that she is very naive in the book. I'm not sure how it's not her genuine state of mind; even today. She just strikes me as exactly what Lindsey needed--a subservient, pretty girl. Those very qualities also made her open to drugs and other things that pulled her away from Lindsey, which is likely what sparked the violence.

Evidence A: The Elvis Costello fight. Not only at the time, but as narrator of the book, to this day!, she acts like she has no idea why Lindsey was angry, from where the violence stemmed. Yet, she describes in detail her behavior during the Costello concert; the kind of behavior that would offend a risk-taking artist like Lindsey re: another risk-taking artist (doing the kind of pastiche work that Lindsey himself would do on the Law & Order and Mirage albums). Lindsey truly struggles with the pull of his muse and the weight of the Mac/WB juggernaut--and he expects, then demands, her total support. The way she writes about it, Lindsey was angry at Elvis Costello and was taking it out on her. :confused:



ETA: We TOTZ should have had a Mac book club reading this book together chapter-by-chapter!

[caroline79]

hmmm... I wonder where I put my copy of Storms. My memory is that she is very naive in the book. I'm not sure how it's not her genuine state of mind; even today. She just strikes me as exactly what Lindsey needed--a subservient, pretty girl. Those very qualities also made her open to drugs and other things that pulled her away from Lindsey, which is likely what sparked the violence.

Evidence A: The Elvis Costello fight. Not only at the time, but as narrator of the book, to this day!, she acts like she has no idea why Lindsey was angry, from where the violence stemmed. Yet, she describes in detail her behavior during the Costello concert; the kind of behavior that would offend a risk-taking artist like Lindsey re: another risk-taking artist (doing the kind of pastiche work that Lindsey himself would do on the Law & Order and Mirage albums). Lindsey truly struggles with the pull of his muse and the weight of the Mac/WB juggernaut--and he expects, then demands, her total support. The way she writes about it, Lindsey was angry at Elvis Costello and was taking it out on her. :confused:



ETA: We TOTZ should have had a Mac book club reading this book together chapter-by-chapter!

YES! I told holidayroad this, but I was actually offering to pay my friends to read and discuss this book with me...:distress::laugh:

I need to find my copy as well because my memory of the Elvis Costello incident is a little (a lot) fuzzy. As well as the "Lindsey talking to Stevie for hours then coming back to the hotel room" incident. I only read the book once a couple of months ago. I just meant that I think the abuse is very real, now why it happened/how much of it is exaggerated is anyone's guess. But I would certainly be down for a book club!

[TrueFaith77]

YES! I told holidayroad this, but I was actually offering to pay my friends to read and discuss this book with me...:distress::laugh:

I need to find my copy as well because my memory of the Elvis Costello incident is a little (a lot) fuzzy. As well as the "Lindsey talking to Stevie for hours then coming back to the hotel room" incident. I only read the book once a couple of months ago. I just meant that I think the abuse is very real, now why it happened/how much of it is exaggerated is anyone's guess. But I would certainly be down for a book club!

I agree that the abuse is real. And I want to change the word "naive" in my post to "totally self-deluded."

[michelej1]

I agree that the abuse is real. And I want to change the word "naive" in my post to "totally self-deluded."

I don't think she is at all, based on the fact that a few months after the book was published she talked about SnL's relationship in an interview (the Sex, Drugs and Rock and Roll interview, or with a title something along those lines) and completely contradicted the oblivious take she had in the book. The book was going for one angle, but I believe Carol saw the complete picture, then and now.

And I've always held that as small as the Rolling Stone bed cover shoot incident is, the fact that she would change the facts to say it took place in her house, in her bed, indicates that she was trying to contradict what others have said about that photo shoot, which didn't take place in Lindsey's house at all. I think there's an attempt to mislead there that was calculated, not just a fuzzy memory.

As far as a Storms book club goes. There was one. People here discussed the book ad nauseum when it came out, in an ongoing thread. http://www.ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showthread.php?t=36386&highlight=storms

Michele

[caroline79]

I don't think she is at all, based on the fact that a few months after the book was published she talked about SnL's relationship in an interview (the Sex, Drugs and Rock and Roll interview, or with a title something along those lines) and completely contradicted the oblivious take she had in the book. The book was going for one angle, but I believe Carol saw the complete picture, then and now.

And I've always held that as small as the Rolling Stone bed cover shoot incident is, the fact that she would change the facts to say it took place in her house, in her bed, indicates that she was trying to contradict what others have said about that photo shoot, which didn't take place in Lindsey's house at all. I think there's an attempt to mislead there that was calculated, not just a fuzzy memory.

As far as a Storms book club goes. There was one. People here discussed the book ad nauseum when it came out, in an ongoing thread. http://www.ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showthread.php?t=36386&highlight=storms

Michele

I wasn't around for the "club" the first time around :( Would like to get opinions now from newer members as well as opinions after a couple readings. Seeing as how I'm thinking my views may slightly change if I read it again...
So where did the photo shoot take place? I think she wrote the book from her perspective back then, she probably wasn't completely clueless about the SnL relationship at the time, but she probably knows a lot more about it now then she did before.

[daniellaaarisen]

i need that damn book!!!! like................NOW!

Of everyone I know, I think you'd love it the most. It's soooooo juicy.

[fumidesigns]

Of everyone I know, I think you'd love it the most. It's soooooo juicy.

Omg Dani u know I'd adore it! I can't wait to flip thru those pages!

[Amlyn]

Omg Dani u know I'd adore it! I can't wait to flip thru those pages!

Wasn't there some of it out on google books? Or am I thinking of Mick's book. Maybe enough to get you started Mimi. I'll have to see if i can find it later.

[michelej1]

So where did the photo shoot take place? I think she wrote the book from her perspective back then, she probably wasn't completely clueless about the SnL relationship at the time, but she probably knows a lot more about it now then she did before.

The photographer arranged the venue for the shoot. It's one of the most famous photo shoots in rock and roll history. I doubt Carol could mistakenly think it took place in her bedroom, in her bed.

The thing about the photo shoot is that Stevie and Lindsey made comments about holding each other during the shoot, with Lindsey saying it lasted for 15 minutes and Stevie claiming it lasted a lot longer than that. It seems to me that Carol described the photo shoot in her book in a way designed to address these comments and to indicate that with her there, there was little chance for intimacy between Stevie and Lindsey when the shoot occurred.

For me there's no reason to think that the book is all lies. I think it contains some truth, some lie and more than a bit of sleight.

Michele

[fumidesigns]

Wasn't there some of it out on google books? Or am I thinking of Mick's book. Maybe enough to get you started Mimi. I'll have to see if i can find it later.

awwwwwwwwwwwwwww sookie!!!!! i'ma check for that when i get home. i have Mick's book. i'ma look at that tonight and see when he told lindsey about him bussin stevie down.

[caroline79]

The photographer arranged the venue for the shoot. It's one of the most famous photo shoots in rock and roll history. I doubt Carol could mistakenly think it took place in her bedroom, in her bed.

The thing about the photo shoot is that Stevie and Lindsey made comments about holding each other during the shoot, with Lindsey saying it lasted for 15 minutes and Stevie claiming it lasted a lot longer than that. It seems to me that Carol described the photo shoot in her book in a way designed to address these comments and to indicate that with her there, there was little chance for intimacy between Stevie and Lindsey when the shoot occurred.

For me there's no reason to think that the book is all lies. I think it contains some truth, some lie and more than a bit of sleight.

Michele

That's on thing I don't understand. I think her more personal stories are true, but I don't see why she lies about things like the photo shoot. She exaggerated the AMA incident too, seems strange to do that when there is video of it. I don't see the point in lying about things that aren't that important. The photo shoot and AMA thing wasn't really important to me when I first read the book, but now hearing how she twisted facts makes me want to go back and read those parts again.

awwwwwwwwwwwwwww sookie!!!!! i'ma check for that when i get home. i have Mick's book. i'ma look at that tonight and see when he told lindsey about him bussin stevie down.

It's there. I couldn't wait after I ordered it so I started reading it there :lol:

[Morgana]

Yeah if CAH ever tried to take a look, peek or quick glance Stevie would have hooked off early. She put her in her place more than a few times I'm sure. My personal fav was telling that worthless ass that she belonged in coach! Lmbao!

I can see how Angel could be about mick tho! "I still look up", "that girl was me"......I mean really just a second ago that girl was Stevie! Nice speculation right here.

Ha! As I type this "long distance winner" starts to play!!!!

That's on a youtube video, that conversation.

[fumidesigns]

That's on a youtube video, that conversation.

which convo? angel or telling CAH to go sit in 2nd class?

[Morgana]

which convo? angel or telling CAH to go sit in 2nd class?

It's telling CAH to sit in 2nd class, I think it was a Rumours behind the scenes like video.

[WildHearted]

It's telling CAH to sit in 2nd class, I think it was a Rumours behind the scenes like video.

Oh gosh someone please find this.

I've watched all of those that are on YT now but there are so many that I can't remember them all...

[michelej1]

From what I could see and hear, I think Stevie told Carol she was ok, but it was Lindsey about whom she wasn't sure, as to whether he should sit in first or not.

The only thing I found striking about that video was the fact that Stevie was boisterous and crazy when Lindsey got on the plane and he looked displeased, so I have no idea why he and Carol sat directly behind her. I would have tried to sit as far away from her as possible.

Michele

[fumidesigns]

Oh gosh someone please find this.

I've watched all of those that are on YT now but there are so many that I can't remember them all...

i'm tryna find it for you NOW!

lawd have mercy how i'm sooooooooooooooo trying to find this for you! wtf?! it's taking foreva!

[fumidesigns]

ok they board the plane at 2:40!!!!

<iframe width="640" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/0-TOfe1k2I4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[henryscutter]

ok they board the plane at 2:40!!!!

<iframe width="640" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/0-TOfe1k2I4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Woah Stevie's bodyguard looks good in this (two tickets to the gun show :thumbsup:) , I think I figured out who her secret love was :xoxo:

[michelle2677]

i haven't read CAH's book but does it talk about stevie telling her to go to 2end class? is this the only evidence of this because it looks like she's talking to CAH, then her head shifts to the left just a little like she's talking to those people who are walking by.

then again, it's kinda hard to make out.

[michelej1]

i haven't read CAH's book but does it talk about stevie telling her to go to 2end class? is this the only evidence of this because it looks like she's talking to CAH, then her head shifts to the left just a little like she's talking to those people who are walking by.

then again, it's kinda hard to make out.

No, that's not mentioned in the book at all.

I don't think she's talking to CAH in that clip.

Michele

[fumidesigns]

No, that's not mentioned in the book at all.

I don't think she's talking to CAH in that clip.

Michele

Well if she wasn't talking to CAH, then y did CAH respond? U can hear her say "be kind" or "really kind" to stevie. I'm at work so I can't watch it right now.

[CADreaming]

Well if she wasn't talking to CAH, then y did CAH respond? U can hear her say "be kind" or "really kind" to stevie. I'm at work so I can't watch it right now.

It's been a while since I watched it, but I remember some of the girls who were near saying to Stevie, "she's not trash!" I heard CAH say "really?" to Stevie and she said either "really" or "yeah, really." I also thought she specifically pointed to where she was commanding Carol and also Lindsey to sit. LOL!

[fumidesigns]

It's been a while since I watched it, but I remember some of the girls who were near saying to Stevie, "she's not trash!" I heard CAH say "really?" to Stevie and she said either "really" or "yeah, really." I also thought she specifically pointed to where she was commanding Carol and also Lindsey to sit. LOL!

Love it! Ima watch it again tonight! Toooooooooo funny!

[WildHearted]

What I heard was..

Stevie says something about Carol looking like a stewardess, standing there like that. So then she mimics a stewardess, directing people where to sit, "You, over there.. you to second class.. " etc. That's what it seemed like to me.

But all in all those few seconds are really confusing and I can't quite figure out what is going on, what's being said and whom it is being said to, etc.

[michelej1]

What I heard was..

Stevie says something about Carol looking like a stewardess, standing there like that. So then she mimics a stewardess, directing people where to sit, "You, over there.. you to second class.. " etc. That's what it seemed like to me.



Yes, I think she was being a stewardess too. I got the impression that she was talking to Lindsey, playfully telling him he didn't belong in first class, not Carol. I think she waved Carol through as belonging in first class.

Michele

[CADreaming]

Yes, I think she was being a stewardess too. I got the impression that she was talking to Lindsey, playfully telling him he didn't belong in first class, not Carol. I think she waved Carol through as belonging in first class.

Michele

Ok, that version was better than the original one I saw. It does look that way, but it's still hard to be 100% certain since we can't see exactly who she's pointing to. I did hear her say, "Carol, you look like a stewardess standing there" before she began the pointing. It's funny to me she would be totally ok with Carol sitting behind her, but not Lindsey! :lol:

[WildHearted]

Ok, that version was better than the original one I saw. It does look that way, but it's still hard to be 100% certain since we can't see exactly who she's pointing to. I did hear her say, "Carol, you look like a stewardess standing there" before she began the pointing. It's funny to me she would be totally ok with Carol sitting behind her, but not Lindsey! :lol:

But I think the whole point is that she was joking about it all. :lol:

[michelej1]

I did hear her say, "Carol, you look like a stewardess standing there" before she began the pointing.

And I'm sure Carol didn't appreciate that comment. I laughed watching that Discovery Health clip and hearing how she started as a sound engineer.

Michele

[CADreaming]

And I'm sure Carol didn't appreciate that comment. I laughed watching that Discovery Health clip and hearing how she started as a sound engineer.

Michele

:lol: Yeah, talk about a stretch!!