Rock A Little track listing - November 1984 - And More!

[mikebise]

I was rummaging through my Stevie Boxes to find the lyrics to "Night Hawk" for APerfectLie (still, the Night Hawk eludes me!), and I found some ancient fanzines with some cool info. The "What might have beens" and unreleased recordings have always fascinated me, and I thought I'd share a few cool things I read.

In the November 1984 issue of Dreams, the editor is given an update on Rock A Little by Ginny Kamano, the woman who used to do Stevie's fan mail. Ginny says that 21 songs were recorded for Rock A Little in Dallas and Los Angeles, and that it will be released on January 15, 1985. She lists several of the tracks recorded for possible inclusion:

"Mirror, Mirror" ~ The lead single to precede the album's release!
"Chanel, Chanel"
"Lady From The Mountains"
"One More Big Time Rock And Roll Star"
"The Dealer"
"Thousand Days"
"Rock A Little"
"Battle Of The Dragon" ~ With Tom Petty and The Heartbreakers

Of course, Rock A Little was not released in January 1985, and in August 1985, the new release date was October 1985, with 25 songs now fully recorded for the album, including:

"Has Anyone Ever Written Anything For You?"
"She Still Loves Him"
"Sister Honey"

Isn't it wild that only 3 of those songs made it onto the official album? Also, while I've heard Rock A Little era recordings of "Lady From The Mountains", I've never heard any version of "The Dealer" from then! Wow!

It's also noted that Don Henley sang back-up on two songs(one of which is presumably "Reconsider Me") and Lindsey on one. Also, Dave Stewart produced two tracks for Stevie as well! "Don't Come Around Here No More", which she gave up and... ?

[Nikolaj]

Fascinating what might have been, and exciting that any possible deluxe reissue of 'RAL' easily could be 2 cds. I'd love a deluxe RAL with all the unissued tracks. I can only imagine how many photo sessions in all those delays they went through, also. Could be an awesome booklet and a really excellent re-release. Think it will ever happen?

[mikebise]

In the 11th issue of Velvet Underground (April 1987), they mention how "Welcome To The Room... Sara" was very important for Stevie to include on the album after she came out of the Betty Ford Clinic, so it bumped off one of her other songs on Tango In The Night. Stevie had recorded at least seven songs for the album, and one of the axed songs was... "Whole Lotta Trouble"!!! This is April 1987 when it was published. All these long lost mysterious things.

BTW, the album's original title was Forbidden, then The Last Tango, before finally settling with Tango In The Night. Stevie was originally only going to be allowed to have two songs on the album, but Warner Bros. insisted she have three.

"Seven Wonders"
"Welcome To The Room... Sara"
"When I See You Again"
"Joan Of Arc"
"What Has Rock And Roll Ever Done For You?" (I've never heard a FM version of this, only Stevie solo)
"Juliet"
"Whole Lotta Trouble" (I wonder how this sounds!!! Off in some vault!)

[mikebise]

This is from the Affairs Of The Heart fanzine from the Netherlands:

September 1992 - STREET ANGEL is "completed", just needing mixing and mastering, with a Spring 1993 release date expected. "Thousand Days" has been recorded with another producer (Chris Lord-Alge) and may or may not make it on the Glyn Johns-produced album. "Kick It" is mentioned. "Street Angel" is said to have been written about homeless children during the L.A. riots.

Again, an alternate version of "Silver Springs" is supposed to be on the upcoming FM Box Set. "Paper Doll" is named as Stevie's new song on the box.

Stevie's recorded a duet, "Secret", with Robin Zander, to be released in 1992.

April 1994 - Track listing for STREET ANGEL:
Maybe Love Will Change Your Mind
Blue Denim
Unconditional Love
Destiny
Listen To The Rain
Rose Garden
Street Angel
Just Like A Woman
I Call You Missing
Kick It
Inspiration
Greta
Jane's Song
Docklands

[Josh2003]

Interesting...this is the first I think it's ever been mentioned that "Chanel, Chanel" is actually from the RAL era. Weird. I think most just assumed that it's a much more recent song.

[mikebise]

Fascinating what might have been, and exciting that any possible deluxe reissue of 'RAL' easily could be 2 cds. I'd love a deluxe RAL with all the unissued tracks. I can only imagine how many photo sessions in all those delays they went through, also. Could be an awesome booklet and a really excellent re-release. Think it will ever happen?

I hope so!!! With lots of gorgeous never-before-seen photos of Stevie! Diana Ross did it. Stevie can do it!

I meant to mention above that "Whole Lotta Trouble" was going to be a b-side for one of Tango's singles, since it was bumped off of the album proper for "Welcome To The Room... Sara".

[mikebise]

That August 1985 issue of Dreams said that Stevie had been recording in L.A. in May with Jimmy Iovine and Rick Nowels. That sparked a few things in my head. If "Mirror, Mirror" was going to be the lead single, and TPTB decided it wouldn't be as effective as another song, was this when Stevie was "encouraged" to record Warren Zevon's "Reconsider Me", to give her a hit single?

Also, when Stevie performed at the Bodega Bay with (then boyfriend) Les Dudek in May 1985, before she sang "Talk To Me", she said, "This is a very new song!" (BTW, mind-blowingly crazily wonderfully wild ragged version, IMO!!!!). So, another song Stevie didn't write coming in later on, possible to boost the commerciality of Rock A Little. :shrug:

"Chanel, Chanel" ~ Well, the recording we all have is from circa 1998 with Sheryl, yes, so it's another oldie Stevie dredged up from the Vault, since it was on the track listings for Rock A Little in Late 1984. I really like the lyrics to that song! I wonder what the Rock A Little version sounds like!!! :)

[Sanne2]

Stevie had recorded at least seven songs for the album, and one of the axed songs was... "Whole Lotta Trouble"!!! This is April 1987 when it was published. All these long lost mysterious things.


Billboard magazine from October 11, 1986 reports that Stevie cut a single titled "Whole Lot Of Trouble" for a future Fleetwood Mac album at Ardent Studios in Memphis (Joe Hardy engineerd and Pat Taylor assisted)

[mikebise]

Billboard magazine from October 11, 1986 reports that Stevie cut a single titled "Whole Lot Of Trouble" for a future Fleetwood Mac album at Ardent Studios in Memphis (Joe Hardy engineerd and Pat Taylor assisted)

How exciting! Can you imagine what it sounds like??? Open the Vaults!!! Reissues!!!! :]

[vermicious knid]

In the 11th issue of Velvet Underground
BTW, the album's original title was Forbidden, then The Last Tango, before finally settling with Tango In The Night. Stevie was originally only going to be allowed to have two songs on the album, but Warner Bros. insisted she have three.


Scandalous. Now that is some major band resentment towards her.

[Sanne2]

Another interesting thing I noticed in an old Billboard issue from september 1986: Atlantic announces the release of "The Best Of Stevie Nicks" in November that year!
I guess they realised it was a bit early.

[mikebise]

Another interesting thing I noticed in an old Billboard issue from september 1986: Atlantic announces the release of "The Best Of Stevie Nicks" in November that year!
I guess they realised it was a bit early.

Oh yeah!!! The fanzines also reported that Stevie was prepping her Greatest Hits/Best Of for release in 1987 as well as recording for an album of new material for release in 1988. I guess the Tango tour and the money were so successful that they kept on touring in 1988 and the FM Greatest Hits was released instead. But this solo Stevie Best Of was definitely on the roll in 1986 & 1987!

They said that Stevie would have 3 new songs on her 1987 solo Best Of... I wonder what they would have been... Stevie recorded a few songs with Mick Jones of Foreigner in May 1987 in Manhattan.

In May 1987, Barbara Nicks let several fans who visited her hear a rough cut of "Silent Night".

[SuiteShangriLa]

Isnt the 'Blues Demo' of Whole Lotta Trouble the demo from TITN?

[mikebise]

Well, I thought about that. Are those Mick's drums? I can't tell. I confess that I only care about Stevie and her songs, so I'm not the best instrument-player-spotter in regards to her FM bandmates.

Stevie's voice certainly fits the 1986 era in that recording! Perhaps that version is from Tango In The Night, putting another piece in the puzzle!

[SuiteShangriLa]

I confess that I only care about Stevie and her songs, so I'm not the best instrument-player-spotter in regards to her FM bandmate

yeah same here. :D i just assumed it was. :shrug:

[APerfectLie]

Haha I kinda feel bad for making you look thru all your stuff to find these lyrics Mike! But at least you are finding some amazing stuff!!! Thanks so much! Also, Joan of Arc so should have been on TITN. It would have fit sooo well.

[HejiraNYC]

Scandalous. Now that is some major band resentment towards her.

It could also be because Stevie's songs submitted for the Tango sessions were among her worst ever. I'm not counting "Seven Wonders" because she didn't write it.

[APerfectLie]

It could also be because Stevie's songs submitted for the Tango sessions were among her worst ever. I'm not counting "Seven Wonders" because she didn't write it.

Joan of Arc, Juliet, and Whole Lotta Trouble are actually very good. And Seven Wonders, tho not her song, is an amazing song. When I See You Again and Welcome To The Room Sara aren't the best, but they sure as hell beat Family Man.

[SapphireSister]

"Chanel, Chanel" ~ Well, the recording we all have is from circa 1998 with Sheryl, yes, so it's another oldie Stevie dredged up from the Vault, since it was on the track listings for Rock A Little in Late 1984. I really like the lyrics to that song! I wonder what the Rock A Little version sounds like!!! :)
I would give my right arm (or left) to hear the RAL version of Chanel, Chanel! You guys know that's like my favorite song ever.
Who ever is out there keeping it all to themselves I beg of you, give up the RAL Chanel!!

Or better yet, Stevie release it on your new album!

[SapphireSister]

Joan of Arc, Juliet, and Whole Lotta Trouble are actually very good. And Seven Wonders, tho not her song, is an amazing song. When I See You Again and Welcome To The Room Sara aren't the best, but they sure as hell beat Family Man.
Actually Stevie co-wrote Seven Wonders w/ Sandy Stewart so she deserves some of the writing credit. I mean do we really know specifically who wrote which parts? I'm saying this b/c SW is one of Stevie's best songs so I prefer it not be considered "not her song". Not to be rude or anything :xoxo:.

[Sanne2]

I mean do we really know specifically who wrote which parts?

We do. Stevie's misheard the lyric "All the way down to Emmaline" (it originally was "All the way down you held te line", or something like that) and that got her a co-writing credit.

[kokoro]

We do. Stevie's misheard the lyric "All the way down to Emmaline" (it originally was "All the way down you held te line", or something like that) and that got her a co-writing credit.

Or rather an "additional lyrics by" credit.

Joan of Arc, Juliet, and Whole Lotta Trouble are actually very good. And Seven Wonders, tho not her song, is an amazing song. When I See You Again and Welcome To The Room Sara aren't the best, but they sure as hell beat Family Man.

Definitely agree. I really enjoy Joan of Arc, Juliet, and Whole Lotta Trouble. You have to wonder how the two throwaways ended up on the record. Of course, I think Welcome of the Room... Sara is really a lost opportunity. It's got some pretty interesting lyrics, but the melody is just terrible. And Family Man is probably one of the worst songs I've ever heard. Why, Lindsey, why would you do that to us?

[HejiraNYC]

Joan of Arc, Juliet, and Whole Lotta Trouble are actually very good. And Seven Wonders, tho not her song, is an amazing song. When I See You Again and Welcome To The Room Sara aren't the best, but they sure as hell beat Family Man.

"Joan of Arc" is actually a very interesting song, and I really love what Lindsey did with it... but does it hold up in the musical/commercial sense with songs like "Little Lies" and "Big Love?" Not! It's not as catchy as the other songs on the album and it's very, very dark; it's just not among Stevie's great songs. I also loved the Fleetwood Mac demo of "Juliet," but it's just not up to par with the other (non-Stevie) songs that ended up on Tango.

WLT is not suitable for a Fleetwood Mac album, period, and WISYA and WTTRS, as we know, are not great Stevie songs. That is why I consider that batch of songs to be among her weakest ever, even behind Street Angel.

[mikebise]

I made a bunch of notes 'til late last night, going through the 'zines. "I Call You Missing" and "The Nightmare" are listed as on Rock A Little in Summer 1985 in one of the mags.

I Wish that Stevie would do a deluxe 2-disc set of her albums, especially Rock A Little, where it looks like the album was completed, and then Stevie kept recording what she and the suits hoped would be hit singles. Plus, Stevie was still writing songs constantly. Maybe we could have one disc of the "original" unreleased Rock A Little, and the other could a remastered version of the official release, plus b-sides & remixes.

I'm also intrigued by that weird 1987-88 period, as Stevie was writing and recording, not only for her Best Of but also her new album. The Masters list Jimmy Iovine as "Producer" of "Dial The Number" & "Lily Girl", both recorded in February 1988, with no mention of Rupert Hine. Was Jimmy supposed to be Stevie's producer once again, but that fell through, probably because of Stevie's renewed commitment to the LB-Free Fleetwood Mac?

I find speculation of these mysteries fascinating.

[SapphireSister]

We do. Stevie's misheard the lyric "All the way down to Emmaline" (it originally was "All the way down you held te line", or something like that) and that got her a co-writing credit.
Yes I know the Emmaline story but are you saying that was her only contribution to the entire song?

[APerfectLie]

"Joan of Arc" is actually a very interesting song, and I really love what Lindsey did with it... but does it hold up in the musical/commercial sense with songs like "Little Lies" and "Big Love?" Not! It's not as catchy as the other songs on the album and it's very, very dark; it's just not among Stevie's great songs. I also loved the Fleetwood Mac demo of "Juliet," but it's just not up to par with the other (non-Stevie) songs that ended up on Tango.

WLT is not suitable for a Fleetwood Mac album, period, and WISYA and WTTRS, as we know, are not great Stevie songs. That is why I consider that batch of songs to be among her weakest ever, even behind Street Angel.

Joan of Arc definitely isn't a commercial song, however I think it would have fit perfectly between Caroline and Tango In The Night making the album much stronger. The album started off with its three catchy hits, and then starts getting into the meat of the album, but Stevie falls off a cliff and disappears for six songs! I just think Joan Of Arc would have made everything mesh a little better.

[Nikolaj]

Yes I know the Emmaline story but are you saying that was her only contribution to the entire song?

That's what I always had heard, and thought. I think Sandy Stewart was glad enough to have had the Stevie connection that she allowed herself to be scr*wed a little, regarding Stevie and Welsh Witch getting a piece of 'Seven Wonders'. Sandy was on Modern, likely at Stevie's insistance, and had written with her on 'The Wild Heart' cd, as everyone knows. Sandy's "Cat Dancer" album on Stevie's (co-owned) label probably only happened because of her ties with Stevie. So, Tango was a tough time for SN, maybe SS wanted to say 'thank you'. I think a lot of the songwriting and production on 'Cat Dancer' but as a vocalist, Sandy was fortunate to have gotten signed. Sorry! She wasn't an awful singer, her super-thin voice just didnt have "it"- imo.

[SapphireSister]

Well if anyone has any inside knowledge or speculation into the Seven Wonders mystery please feel free to share as I am very curious as to how much Stevie did indeed contribute to the song if anything (besides a word). Maybe that IS the seventh wonder!

[APerfectLie]

Well if anyone has any inside knowledge or speculation into the Seven Wonders mystery please feel free to share as I am very curious as to how much Stevie did indeed contribute to the song if anything (besides a word). Maybe that IS the seventh wonder!

Yeah, all I've heard is that Stevie heard "all the way down to Emmiline" so she changed that one line and the rest was Sandy.

"Her next album with Fleetwood Mac, titled Tango in the Night, included Nicks' song "Seven Wonders," which reached #19 on the Billboard charts. Sandy Stewart wrote the song "Seven Wonders," and because Nicks had only listened to the song a few times before recording it, the lines "all the way down you held the line" was misheard by Nicks as "all the way down to Emmeline". "

[APerfectLie]

However, according to Ledgie fannymac, who interned at Modern, in an earlier post back in 2008 she said,

"Sandy almost asked to have "Seven Wonders" removed from TANGO IN THE NIGHT. Seems Stevie changed a number of lyrics AND the title (originally called "Aaron"), and Sandy was pretty upset. Paul Fishkin put it to her this way...."You can A) have the song for your next release, or B) leave it the way it is, let Fleetwood Mac release it, and make a ton of money! Needless to say, Sandy went with B!"

So IDK :shrug:

[mikebise]

Nik, I thought your post had some very interesting and intriguing points. Stevie is so contradictory in the different stories she tells. That Timothy White interview was perculating in the back of my mind, but I couldn't grasp it until you quoted from it, and that was awesome! Ginny Kamano certainly could have given erroneous information out to the fanzines in 1987. That's why I think these old mysteries are so fascinating, and I loved your input.

"Seven Wonders" ~ I dunno. I've heard and read several versions of what Stevie contributed to the song. The Rock Star radio interview has Stevie making it sound like she changed more than one word of the song, a la what APerfectLie posted above.

The gist I got from Stevie only being allowed 2 songs on TIIN was that came from the band since she "wasn't there" (despite having recorded 6 songs with them in 1986 prior to "Welcome To The Room... Sara"). They even stipulated that Stevie would only be heard on two other songs on the album not hers! (This is from the Velvet Underground fanzine).

However, Warner Bros. wanted more of a Stevie presence on the record, hence the three slots allowed for her. That seems plausible with all of the drama flying around them in those days! Stevie was still the most visible, famous and commercially successful member of the band. But, like I said, I'm a Stevie Fan, and I'm sure I read too much into things! :)

[nicksphan]

Billboard magazine from October 11, 1986 reports that Stevie cut a single titled "Whole Lot Of Trouble" for a future Fleetwood Mac album at Ardent Studios in Memphis (Joe Hardy engineerd and Pat Taylor assisted)

WLT was definitely around in '86. Stevie sang the line, "this could be a whole lotta trouble for you" after one of the songs at one of the Jones Beach RAL shows.

[Nikolaj]

[QUOTE=mikebise;912390]
Nik, I thought your post had some very interesting and intriguing points. Stevie is so contradictory in the different stories she tells. That Timothy White interview was perculating in the back of my mind, but I couldn't grasp it until you quoted from it, and that was awesome! Ginny Kamano certainly could have given erroneous information out to the fanzines in 1987. That's why I think these old mysteries are so fascinating, and I loved your input.


Wow, thank you for those words, MikeBise, I never expected that. The reason I deleted it after all of the typing was that I felt that you and others had given the correct information, and that the tone of the chapter in the book was Stevie at her angriest, and it would just stir stuff up, not even related to 'Whole Lotta Trouble' but a whole lotta anger, and possible debate over something decades old and resolved. So, I just deleted it, because I've had enough disharmony with strangers on The Ledge whom I like, lately, and if even a small sh*tstorm was raised, it would have been me who caused it.
For anyone interested, I was referencing a book called 'Rock Lives' that had a very long Stevie article in it written by the late Billboard editor Timothy White, the interview he conducted with her was just as LB was leaving Fleetwood Mac in '87.
Oh, I liked the various fanzines, very much, and I have only a few.

Personally, I think you have it in you to do a new 'Rock A Little Revisted' fanzine and do a bangup job on it and sell it not at any loss. You're organized. And have 'attention to detail'.
In my LA days; one of the weirdest things I encountered was that a PR firm had in their bio; mission statement, whatever it was called back then, their commitment to "attention to detial." -- It was so silly, I thought I was being tested- I wasn't. They had missed the gaffe. Professionals.

[cactusjack]

Personally, I think you have it in you to do a new 'Rock A Little Revisted' fanzine and do a bangup job on it and sell it not at any loss. You're organized. And have 'attention to detail'.

yes, yes, do it Mike!

[wildheart048]

What a great thread! very interesting...thanks!:angel:

[iamnotafraid]

WLT is not suitable for a Fleetwood Mac album, period, and WISYA and WTTRS, as we know, are not great Stevie songs. That is why I consider that batch of songs to be among her weakest ever, even behind Street Angel.

Whole Lotta Trouble isn't suited for any album.
Oh, how I hate that song.

[demonchaser]

However, according to Ledgie fannymac, who interned at Modern, in an earlier post back in 2008 she said,

"Sandy almost asked to have "Seven Wonders" removed from TANGO IN THE NIGHT. Seems Stevie changed a number of lyrics AND the title (originally called "Aaron"), and Sandy was pretty upset. Paul Fishkin put it to her this way...."You can A) have the song for your next release, or B) leave it the way it is, let Fleetwood Mac release it, and make a ton of money! Needless to say, Sandy went with B!"

So IDK :shrug:

There is an interview where Stevie says after she found out Sandy was upset, she wanted to re-record the vocals using the original lyrics. Lindsey would not let her because he he like the original vocals. Thus the compromise of adding the "additional lyrics by" .

People tend to focus on Stevie's answer to a question asking what is Emmeline, where she answers she misread the lyric and that is why she received a songwriting credit. Given other interviews and Stevie's history regarding co-writing credits (offering one to Prince for Stand Back, refusing Brett Michael's offer to give her one on "love's a hard game to play' after she changed lyrics to that song'), I would tend to believe there was a significant change to the lyrics.

Does anyone one know if the additional lyrics by credit amounts to different royalty percentage than a co-writing credit?

[mikebise]

I'm always fascinated by when Stevie wrote her songs, the groupings of them, even if they are recorded out of order. Can you imagine November 1985, when Stevie got her first acetate of the about-to-be-released Rock A Little, and then Joe Walsh pissed her off again, a whole year after they broke up, and she was spurred into writing "Long Way To Go". You know she's wishing she had been able to put that on Rock A Little ~ too late!

Then, in February 1986, she wrote up a whole storm...
"Whole Lotta Trouble"
"You Like Me"
"Two Kinds Of Love"
"Juliet"

It's like there's this "other" post-Rock A Little album Stevie, with all kinds of new songs. It's like, after the hassle of getting RAL done, Stevie suddenly had a brand new creative burst! And I don't consider any of Stevie's songs junk, just of varying enjoyment for me personally.

I've often tried to make CDs of "era" songs, to see how they sound together. Songs recorded at different times across the decades, but written around the same time. Despite the differences in musicians and Stevie's voices, are these songs discernible from a timespace point of view?

[petep9000]

Whole Lotta Trouble isn't suited for any album.
Oh, how I hate that song.

ha, me too. Yet I know others adore it, and I can't understand why. It's so un-Stevie, the whole sound. When she played it live I cringed, and left to visit the concessions. I think Lori (or was it Sharon) confessed to feeling dorky singing it on stage too.

[vermicious knid]

The first time I heard that song, it was on a website where you could play a 30-second snippet. It was a clip of a menacing verse, and I loved what I heard. You didn't hear the blaring horns or the chorus, and I have always fantasized about a superior version of that song that maintains the Tanita Tikaram (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXSTe9YMCKo) vibe throughout.

[petep9000]

and I'm so 'anti' that I must confess that I never pursued alternate takes or demos, so for all I know, other versions of WLT do have the haunting quality the Tikaram track has.
I know in an interview, Stevie says she wrote 4 or 5 different versions of WLT waiting for Mike Campbell to come back and work on the track with her.

[SapphireSister]

I've complained about this before because it really bugs me but I wish they would have discerned on the writing credits who wrote the lyrics and who wrote the music (on Nickfix for example). I know some of them do say "music by..." or "lyrics by..." but a lot of them don't and for some reason it's really important to me to know which music and lyrics Stevie wrote as opposed to other people writing or composing for her. Maybe it's just too complicated.
My request is that Stevie herself go through every one of her released songs that she didn't write the music and lyrics to and break down for us the specific parts of each song she did and didn't write. Ha! Like she'd even remember lol. Obviously this will never happen.

[Maxd9]

I've often tried to make CDs of "era" songs, to see how they sound together. Songs recorded at different times across the decades, but written around the same time. Despite the differences in musicians and Stevie's voices, are these songs discernible from a timespace point of view?

This is an interesting idea; one I never would have thought of. Do the songs work together? And if so...Playlist!!
x

[silvasprings]

Then, in February 1986, she wrote up a whole storm...
"Whole Lotta Trouble"
"You Like Me"
"Two Kinds Of Love"
"Juliet"



I'm pretty sure that in an interview she said that she wrote this song whilst in Australia on tour with Bob Dylan and Tom Petty at the end of 1985. I always assumed the Whole Lotta Trouble thing related to the fact that the Aust. authorities where going to kick her out for not having a working visa. She said it was the first time she'd written a song on guitar in a long time, and also that Tom and Bob thought it sounded " Just like an old John Lee Hooker song" And of course much of the song is from other poems i think.
Also thanks for an awesome thread, the whole story behind RAL has always been one of intrigue for me.

[michelej1]

Here are some Stevie quotes about WLT:

"I wrote Whole Lotta Trouble myself, on the guitar, which I seldom do because of my fingernails. Again, along with Two Kinds of Love, in Australia on the Bob Dylan/Tom Petty tour. I went to Michael's room, he had his 4-track set up, gave me his guitar, tuned it to an open G, you know that . . . [demonstrates song start] Well, I can play pretty well. I can play real good rhythm guitar. But with long fingernails and an open tuning, you can only just play that one note, so it's like bass. So I played it, and he recorded it and he sang it, and he took it home, and a year later, I went to Michael's house and he had cut a complete track on it. And he had written a little bridge in the middle of it. And the wildest thing about it was that I had already, in the years that had gone between, I had written probably five or six more Whole Lotta Troubles. So I was all into my new Whole Lotta Troubles, and Michael brought his little yellow ghettoblaster and said, 'Stevie, this is the way we wrote it' and he made me listen to it. And then he put on his track, and it was one of the most amazing moments of my life, was that exactly what I had played on the little yellow ghettoblaster, went exactly along with this incredible track that he had done, and he said 'Now you have to relearn it that way.' And of course I hate that. I hate when anybody tells me that. But I adore Michael, so it's like, 'Yes sir, Mr. Campbell, I'll learn it. Give me five minutes.' So I learned it, I sang it, and it remained very much, exactly ike it is on the record."

_____________________

"We went into a recording studio called Lionshare, and by the grace of the gods, the LA rhythm horn section was doing another session down the hallway. And I had never in a million years expected that those horns would be anything but synthesizers. Well, they were, like, walking down the hall with all their horns, right? And Rupert [Hine] and I saw them, and it was like, we went, 'Hey! Are you guys, like, really tired? Are you going home? Do you have any extra time?' And they said, 'Nah,' like, we got nothing to do.' So they came in; they listened to the song once, and they went out, and they played the horns all the way through the song one time, and then said, 'Is there anything else you want us to play on?' So we, just out of magic, just as a special gift from the gods of music, got them. And they loved it. I mean, you could tell they loved it. We loved it. It was so special, because I never had any horn players play anything on my record before, except for the things that Kenny had played, and that's a whole different. He's like a little archangel, you know? And these are like, these four heavy-duty guys that got these big, huge horns and stuff, and they -- I couldn't believe it. I walked in and they were out there, and they were doing the moves, the up and the down, and it sounded incredible, and I never in a million years expected it to be anything but programmed-in horn sounds off of a synth. Because that's what Michael had done, and that sounded great, it sounded just like horns to the point of I never complained and said 'You know, this is really not fair, I think we should have real horn players.' I just never expected it. So, they were in and out in thirty minutes."
_________
[Then from Timespace, she says it was written for Tom and Bob]

"I recorded this song in Michael's room in Sydney, Australia, on his 4-Track. I actually played guitar, and almost a year later, Michael had worked up a track right along with what I had played in Australia. He wrote a bridge for it, and when I got home from my tour, he insisted I come up and sing it exactly as I had played it that night; and he could play his track right along to me playing rock and roll guitar. I was totally flattered. On the other side of the coin, he is the only person in my whole life who has ever done one of my songs exactly as I had written it. So thank you Michael, for all your wonderful music and for sharing some of it with me, nothing like a tour with Tom Petty and Bob Dylan to make you extremely creative. I asked Tom if I could be an honorary Heartbreaker, and he said:
'You already are one, Stevie'"

[Artemis]

The gist I got from Stevie only being allowed 2 songs on TIIN was that came from the band since she "wasn't there" (despite having recorded 6 songs with them in 1986 prior to "Welcome To The Room... Sara"). They even stipulated that Stevie would only be heard on two other songs on the album not hers! (This is from the Velvet Underground fanzine).

However, Warner Bros. wanted more of a Stevie presence on the record, hence the three slots allowed for her. That seems plausible with all of the drama flying around them in those days! Stevie was still the most visible, famous and commercially successful member of the band. But, like I said, I'm a Stevie Fan, and I'm sure I read too much into things! :)

Good grief, they only wanted Stevie to appear on 4 songs, total? And only 2 lead vocals? That's ridic. (Although, she only did appear on 4 really... but 3 lead vocals)

The band probably could have done more to include her, but it was probably ego mania back then that stopped them from doing so, I suppose. I think the fact that she had been such a successful solo star was what saved her, since Fleetwood Mac with Stevie involved would have gotten more attention that Fleetwood Mac minus Stevie.

Sorry, I'm just rambling now xD

[PenguinHead]

The band probably could have done more to include her, but it was probably ego mania back then that stopped them from doing so, I suppose. I think the fact that she had been such a successful solo star was what saved her, since Fleetwood Mac with Stevie involved would have gotten more attention that Fleetwood Mac minus Stevie.

Sorry, I'm just rambling now xD

Don't blame the band! Lindsey, on record, has stated that Stevie was not very "present" during the recording of Tango, and how difficult it was to work with her. Take in to account that Stevie was several years away from heading down the road to rehab. I suspect Stevie was very stubborn, defiant and indifferent at this time. Even her voice sounded very shrill and slightly angry. I think the cocaine habit, along with her issues with Lindsey are some of the reasons she didn't spend much time in the studio during the making of the album. I bet when she was there she was very unpleasant...I can imagine some outrageous behavior.

Regarding her contribution to Seven Wonders. I don't think she delibrately changed the lyrics. I imagine that when she recorded her vocals, she didn't have a firm grasp of Sandy's lyrics and just winged it...ad-libbing in places where she was at a loss. Unfortunately for Sandy, Lindsey didn't care about the lyrics --he was looking at it purely for the vocal performance. Does anyone know the original lyrics?

[Nikolaj]

[QUOTE=PenguinHead;912586]Don't blame the band!. Take in to account that Stevie was several years away from heading down the road to rehab. QUOTE]


She already had completed rehab at Betty Ford before she belatedly worked on TITN, hadn't she? Maybe it was partially why she was late? Like, she was just out of Betty Ford, hence 'Welcome To The Room, Sara' being on Tango. She did the RAL tour in 86, Betty Ford late-ish in '86, probably Lindsey and the rest of the band were working on TITN while Stevie was raking leaves and wondering which set of doors were hers at Ford.
I know that's a different song, but I always suspected that the opening lines to 'Affairs Of the Heart' - on the next Mac album with Billy and Rick- also referenced her stay at Betty Ford.

[vivfox]

[QUOTE=PenguinHead;912586]Don't blame the band!. Take in to account that Stevie was several years away from heading down the road to rehab. QUOTE]


She already had completed rehab at Betty Ford before she belatedly worked on TITN, hadn't she? Maybe it was partially why she was late? Like, she was just out of Betty Ford, hence 'Welcome To The Room, Sara' being on Tango. She did the RAL tour in 86, Betty Ford late-ish in '86, probably Lindsey and the rest of the band were working on TITN while Stevie was raking leaves and wondering which set of doors were hers at Ford.
I know that's a different song, but I always suspected that the opening lines to 'Affairs Of the Heart' - on the next Mac album with Billy and Rick- also referenced her stay at Betty Ford.


I think FM recorded most of TITN while Stevie was touring for RAL.

[mlourimore]

I've always wanted to know what song Lindsey helped her with on RAL. I've read articles with both of them saying I didn't want to help her but she was at her wits ends on this song and I was able to fix it and from her I tried and tried and only he knows my songs best. In any situation there was a online ask them a question I have asked them both what song it is and neither have ever answered.

[michelej1]

Don't blame the band! Lindsey, on record, has stated that Stevie was not very "present" during the recording of Tango, and how difficult it was to work with her. Take in to account that Stevie was several years away from heading down the road to rehab. I suspect Stevie was very stubborn, defiant and indifferent at this time. Even her voice sounded very shrill and slightly angry. I think the cocaine habit, along with her issues with Lindsey are some of the reasons she didn't spend much time in the studio during the making of the album. I bet when she was there she was very unpleasant...I can imagine some outrageous behavior.



I'd agree. In that UK interview they did last year, Stevie pretty much took responsibility for not really being there for Tango.

Michele

[petep9000]

At the time, I think Stevie was a HUGE star, and maybe felt (though she'd always deny this) that being part of a group thing was holding her back. Think of how it would be if there was a Destiny's Child reunion, and how much of an ego Beyonce would have working on that project. Her availabilty would be very limited too.

Again, Stevie would totally deny this because she's always maintained that FM was her first love. But in the 1986 period she was still a hot solo property.

[michelej1]

Again, Stevie would totally deny this because she's always maintained that FM was her first love. But in the 1986 period she was still a hot solo property.

Once you're mingling with Tom and Bob, it's hard to go back to the farm (literally, judging from the setting of the Little Lies video).

Michele

[PenguinHead]

At the time, I think Stevie was a HUGE star, and maybe felt (though she'd always deny this) that being part of a group thing was holding her back. Think of how it would be if there was a Destiny's Child reunion, and how much of an ego Beyonce would have working on that project. Her availabilty would be very limited too.

Again, Stevie would totally deny this because she's always maintained that FM was her first love. But in the 1986 period she was still a hot solo property.

I disagree with that. I don't think Stevie felt the group was holding her solo career back. In fact, her fame in the group allowed her to establish a solo career! She has always been loyal to the band, for better or worse.

The big difference is that in the group dynamic she is beholden to others, dealing with the band's dramas, and relinquishing a certain amount of control. Having established a viable solo career -- she was in complete control, and didn't have to answer to anyone. I'm sure that was freshening for her, giving her a bit of confidence and clout. But that didn't mean she had any less respect for the group.

[SaidSomething]

I know a lot of you guys here personally. Most don't really know much about me.
Anyway I was in the entertainment business all my life and during the Regan area...corporate greed and cruelty was on the rise. As an artist...and a person in public eye...someone starts to believe what is poisoned into them. You want to work? Date this person for publicity...do this song...this is your age, Bio, sexual orientation, friends ...etc. And if you don't...I have those photos, footage, stories...and I will ruin you...you'll never write again...do you want all the world to know your dirty secrets? Btw...who are they going to believe? The druggie? There...I knew you'd see things our way.

I spent the last year and a half working with my best friend on her book....and have done 2 espisodes of her new show.
It tells of how its a miracle. Anyone of us survived with noses and souls intact.
Because...so many didn't survive.

[Fannymac]

In the 11th issue of Velvet Underground (April 1987), they mention how "Welcome To The Room... Sara" was very important for Stevie to include on the album after she came out of the Betty Ford Clinic, so it bumped off one of her other songs on Tango In The Night. Stevie had recorded at least seven songs for the album, and one of the axed songs was... "Whole Lotta Trouble"!!! This is April 1987 when it was published. All these long lost mysterious things.

BTW, the album's original title was Forbidden, then The Last Tango, before finally settling with Tango In The Night. Stevie was originally only going to be allowed to have two songs on the album, but Warner Bros. insisted she have three.

"Seven Wonders"
"Welcome To The Room... Sara"
"When I See You Again"
"Joan Of Arc"
"What Has Rock And Roll Ever Done For You?" (I've never heard a FM version of this, only Stevie solo)
"Juliet"
"Whole Lotta Trouble" (I wonder how this sounds!!! Off in some vault!)

Don't forget, though.....before Lindsey got pissed at Stevie (AGAIN!!), and erased all her vocals off pretty much every cut except "Little Lies", TANGO IN THE NIGHT was a VERY different sounding album.
I was interning at Modern at the time.....believe me, as successful as TANGO was....that version would have blown sales out of the water!!!

[petep9000]

I would like to hear those mixes, if they are floating around. I still remember Mick Fleetwood's book and the section where he describes a Stevie Nicks blow-up, and after calming her down they 'gleefully' layered her vocals into 'Everywhere'.

Darned if I can hear 'em though.

[Musicman408]

Alrighty, this 1986, "Bluesy" version of WLT that everyone is talking about- could someone post this? I've never heard of it until now! :)

[FMM2]

Yeah! Someone please post it! :)

FMM2

[mikebise]

Well, I'm listening to it now, but we all know my connection is so slow. Stevie sounds very Rock A Little Tour era!!!!!!!

Much longer... I found a major upgrade and it's freaking fantastic!!! Some crazee overdubs throughout, especially at the end!!! Ooh, this is SO 1986!!!!!!!!!

[Nathan]

watchu talkin bout, mike - do you have whole lotta trouble from 86??!!

[SuiteShangriLa]

Well, I'm listening to it now, but we all know my connection is so slow. Stevie sounds very Rock A Little Tour era!!!!!!!

Much longer... I found a major upgrade and it's freaking fantastic!!! Some crazee overdubs throughout, especially at the end!!! Ooh, this is SO 1986!!!!!!!!!

say what??? you have a longer better RAL demo of WLT?? :eek: please share:]

[SapphireSister]

Well, I'm listening to it now, but we all know my connection is so slow. Stevie sounds very Rock A Little Tour era!!!!!!!

Much longer... I found a major upgrade and it's freaking fantastic!!! Some crazee overdubs throughout, especially at the end!!! Ooh, this is SO 1986!!!!!!!!!
You big TEASE! Give that **** up!

[mikebise]

I'm sure it's what everyone has. I have several outtakes from The Other Side Of The Mirror, but this one is definitely 1986-ish.

It's 5:16, with a wild, Rock A Little-era sounding Stevie. With all the production, I find it hard to call it a "demo", but maybe that's all it is. I'll try my best to upload it to mediafire, although I'm sure everyone will go, "Oh, that?!" and be disappointed.

I think it's fantastic and this much better sound really excited me! If the uploading works, I'll post it after work today.

[nicksphan]

I posted this clip in the Driving Me Crazy thread, but it ties into this conversation as well. Here at least is proof that Whole Lotta Trouble was around in '86. As she's walking off stage after I Can't Wait at Jones Beach she sings a quick line from Whole Lotta Trouble (it's at the very end of the clip, 5:05)


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[petep9000]

And that made no sense to anyone. But that made the RAL tour all the more groovier.

I love drunk-off-her-ass Stevie on stage, I'll admit it. :shrug:

[Nathan]

this is so weird. I have not a single demo or outrage of whole lotta trouble.

I loved the livearrangements of iton the airspace tour. les dudek!

[aleuzzi]

In the 11th issue of Velvet Underground (April 1987), they mention how "Welcome To The Room... Sara" was very important for Stevie to include on the album after she came out of the Betty Ford Clinic, so it bumped off one of her other songs on Tango In The Night. Stevie had recorded at least seven songs for the album, and one of the axed songs was... "Whole Lotta Trouble"!!! This is April 1987 when it was published. All these long lost mysterious things.

BTW, the album's original title was Forbidden, then The Last Tango, before finally settling with Tango In The Night. Stevie was originally only going to be allowed to have two songs on the album, but Warner Bros. insisted she have three.

"Seven Wonders"
"Welcome To The Room... Sara"
"When I See You Again"
"Joan Of Arc"
"What Has Rock And Roll Ever Done For You?" (I've never heard a FM version of this, only Stevie solo)
"Juliet"
"Whole Lotta Trouble" (I wonder how this sounds!!! Off in some vault!)

An interesting list. Although Whole Lotta Trouble is infinitely better than
Welcome to the Room, I don't think a bluesy song like that fits with the other Tango songs.

When I see this list I can't help wondering why Dealer, Smile at You, or (especially) Planets of the Universe weren't tried.

Honestly, as much as I love Stevie, her performance on Tango leads me to believe the band--not Warners--were in the right. Two songs would have been plenty.

[mikebise]

The uploading this morning didn't work, but it's working now. So, it'll be a little while longer. Hang on...

I was checking my "Whole Lotta Trouble"s ~

The 1986 version, which I'm uploading now.

An outtake from The Other Side Of The Mirror, timed at 5:41. A completely different lead vocal from Stevie, much longer (the album version is 4:55). Stevie sings until the band stops playing ~ it's awesome!

An alternate single remix by Tom Lord-Alge, noticeably different from his well-known single mix (on the CD-single and TimeSpace). Not as much super-echoing as on the other mix. I can hear the brass instruments very clearly, and some more guitar flourishes.

I'll get to those some other time to upload!

[SuiteShangriLa]

The uploading this morning didn't work, but it's working now. So, it'll be a little while longer. Hang on...

I was checking my "Whole Lotta Trouble"s ~

The 1986 version, which I'm uploading now.

An outtake from The Other Side Of The Mirror, timed at 5:41. A completely different lead vocal from Stevie, much longer (the album version is 4:55). Stevie sings until the band stops playing ~ it's awesome!

An alternate single remix by Tom Lord-Alge, noticeably different from his well-known single mix (on the CD-single and TimeSpace). Not as much super-echoing as on the other mix. I can hear the brass instruments very clearly, and some more guitar flourishes.

I'll get to those some other time to upload!

I have this OSOTM outtake but its horrible horrible quality and sound. an upgrade would be awesome!

[mikebise]

LOL, I figured that would be the case, Mike! The The Other Side Of The Mirror outtake is from the Masters, and I will upload it today and post it on the "Whole Lotta Trouble" thread. It's perfect sound quality.

[SuiteShangriLa]

LOL, I figured that would be the case, Mike! The The Other Side Of The Mirror outtake is from the Masters, and I will upload it today and post it on the "Whole Lotta Trouble" thread. It's perfect sound quality.

aah...well i wonder if its the same? is it the slow piano version?

[mikebise]

I just posted it on the "Whole Lotta Trouble" thread.

I have no slower, piano version of "Whole Lotta Trouble"! Can you please post it???!!! :)

[SuiteShangriLa]

I just posted it on the "Whole Lotta Trouble" thread.

I have no slower, piano version of "Whole Lotta Trouble"! Can you please post it???!!! :)

if i can find it...i dont have it on my hard drive because the sound quality is so horrible. youd have to turn it all the way up and still barely be able to hear it. maybe in a completely quiet room with headphones lol. its probably not even worth the time. maybe i can tweek it a bit and raise the levels on it??

[mikebise]

Bumped for relevancy concerning the eBay auctions!

[Travisevian]

"Joan of Arc" is actually a very interesting song, and I really love what Lindsey did with it... but does it hold up in the musical/commercial sense with songs like "Little Lies" and "Big Love?" Not! It's not as catchy as the other songs on the album and it's very, very dark; it's just not among Stevie's great songs.

I disagree and believe that Joan Of Arc is one of her greatest songs and could've been very suitable for Tango In The Night. By the way, the title track is rather dark as well. Stevie always had at least one dark song on a Fleetwood Mac album, Gold Dust Woman for Rumours, Sisters Of The Moon for Tusk and Straight Back for Mirage for instance.

Joan of Arc definitely isn't a commercial song, however I think it would have fit perfectly between Caroline and Tango In The Night making the album much stronger. The album started off with its three catchy hits, and then starts getting into the meat of the album, but Stevie falls off a cliff and disappears for six songs! I just think Joan Of Arc would have made everything mesh a little better.

To me, it sounds like a closing track.

[StevieNicksfann]

Can someone repost these Whole Lotta Trouble's referenced in this thread?

[PenguinHead]

Actually Stevie co-wrote Seven Wonders w/ Sandy Stewart so she deserves some of the writing credit. I mean do we really know specifically who wrote which parts? I'm saying this b/c SW is one of Stevie's best songs so I prefer it not be considered "not her song". Not to be rude or anything :xoxo:.

I recall the story being that Sandy wrote the song. When Stevie was recording it, she didn't have the original lyrics for reference, so she just ad-libed it, thinking she could go back and re-record the original lyrics. However, the producer loved a particular take, took executive order, and didn't care if the lyrics weren't as originally written.

[/I]Stevie felt bad about it, and called Sandy to apologize for the incident. The only reason Stevie got a writing credit was because she didn't sing the song as it was originally written.

[bombaysaffires]

I would give my right arm (or left) to hear the RAL version of Chanel, Chanel! You guys know that's like my favorite song ever.
Who ever is out there keeping it all to themselves I beg of you, give up the RAL Chanel!!

Or better yet, Stevie release it on your new album!

Yes, if someone can post a link to a download f or this version please do!

[mikebise]

"Whole Lotta Trouble" - 1986 Version
http://www.mediafire.com/?c6s35ve4gqclty7

"Chanel, Chanel" - Take 1
http://www.mediafire.com/?ber119967trtj49

"Chanel, Chanel" - Take 2
http://www.mediafire.com/?2snz04mgqn6upnc

[bombaysaffires]

thanks Mike! :angel:

[Djwidow]

after looking up the meaning of emmiline, it's german for peaceful home,
which means stevie could be using the line as "you held my hand all the way to emmiline, or you touch my hand on the way down to emmiline...on to a peaceful home..."either way I think it makes a better line...then the one sandy wrote...