Will Fleetwood Mac release a new album by the end of 2010?

[TrueFaith77]

I hope nobody is getting annoyed by these polls.

With all the media rumours, I thought it would be interesting to see what people think?

It's certainly possible.

[michelej1]

I think they will. I'm not sure it will be an album of all new songs though, but we should get a handful.

Michele

[jbrownsjr]

With them, I'll beleive it when I see it... although I much rather have solo albums at this point..

[nailatixela]

No way they could get a studio album done that fast.

[Matthew]

It is really possible, but I don´t think it would be so quick... but it would be awesome. And I don´t know what kind of new stuff I would prefer (I mean if solo albums, or Fleetwood Mac). It´s true that Fleetwood Mac album would be probably more famous... or... you know what I mean. But I definitely like Trouble In Shangri-La much more than Say You Will. It´s not that I´m fan of Stevie and don´t care about Lindsey at all, but I just compare Stevie´s songs there and there. And TISL is damn better! But who knows how would it be next year...

But I still think that sometime Stevie will record something new... alone or with FM... we´ll see... it will be interesting next year.

But I didn´t forget. This time last year I would really laugh if you told me that I´ll see Fleetwood Mac live... well, it happens... so I would´t say anything about recording new album now :).

[Spikey]

I voted yes, how much stuff must they still have laying around?

Think of all the 'old new' tracks that showed up on Say You Will, especially Stevie's, and Lindsey's stuff was mostly solo work. So it wouldn't take as long as the 70's/80's stuff.

- Spike

[Musicman408]

I really am hoping and have my fingers crossed, since I haven't witnessed a new release. I voted yes!!

[Fannymac]

I never thought I'd be saying this, but I almost DON'T want a new album, unless it's really, REALLY good! To me, SAY YOU WILL, while OK, just seemed like two solo albums smooshed together, with a REALLY good rhythm section tossed in.
I would need Stevie and Lindsey to REALLY write for a FLEETWOOD MAC album, maybe even doing some stuff together (though I doubt that will EVER happen!).
Needless to say, I would be waiting with baited breath if a release date WERE announced!!:blob2:

[LukeA]

Even if they record a new album, it won't be out until '11 at the earliest, since they can't tour North America again until at least '11.

[Villavic]

I think they were not glad with the SYW commercial results (silly, cause no old band can make a blockbuster with new songs, it's very hard though not impossible). But.. I'm just supposing

[BellaDonna]

I voted yes ... maybe just wishful thinking but I think they probably have some songs they haven't put out there yet.. like some we got on the SYW album ... I hope they are new and refreshing tho.. REALLY REALLY hope so!!

[louielouie2000]

Nope! It takes them around 18 months+ to record and release these days. That means they would have had to start recording this past June for a Christmas 2010 release. They are supposedly meeting in January to discuss recording again. For ****s and giggles, let's say they decide to begin recording a new album during that meeting (which at this point, I am highly doubtful of). They'll take a good 6 months off after January to recover from their world tour, and spend that time searching for a recording venue and a producer. With all the egos involved, that will be no easy task getting everyone to agree on common ground for all this. So we're looking at an earliest possible start date for recording in June 2010. That means an earliest possible release date of around Christmas 2011. And I'm being very conservative... I think it will likely take longer because everyone will say they need a big break after the tour, then they'll fight and bitch about a recording venue, and ESPECIALLY a producer. Mark my words, that will be a big showdown, and could sink the project altogether. And this is all assuming they decide in January that they really want to move forward with a new album at all! :rolleyes:

[TrueFaith77]

I can't understand why the Twilight producers didn't get FMac to do a song for the soundtrack. Seems a no-brainer to me.

[Steviefan49]

Even if they record a new album, it won't be out until '11 at the earliest, since they can't tour North America again until at least '11.

And you know this how?

[jbrownsjr]

And you know this how?

I'll take a stab at this Luke.... cos they've saturated the market and know they won't sell tickets if they tour any sooner...

[chriskisn]

Maybe by the end of 2013

[LukeA]

I'll take a stab at this Luke.... cos they've saturated the market and know they won't sell tickets if they tour any sooner...

Bingo! :thumbsup:

[David]

Bingo! :thumbsup:
They've sure saturated my market.

[louielouie2000]

They've sure saturated my market.

Mine too. They stopped 3+ times in my area for the SYW tour. Now they're back hitting those exact same markets multiple times sans any new material... yawn. You know you're in trouble when you've even tired your hardcore fanbase.

[daniellaaarisen]

I hope not. I feel like they'd do a lot of recycling if they hoped to get an album out that fast.

[Steviefan49]

I'll take a stab at this Luke.... cos they've saturated the market and know they won't sell tickets if they tour any sooner...

For the "greatest hits tour" maybe... NOT for any new materials! I know I'd race out to by a ticket for this one, knowing it's all new music! Haven't thought about that one did ya?:)

[Steviefan49]

Bingo! :thumbsup:

Bingo for who? Not any FM fans I know, and I've been around awhile! ;)

[TrueFaith77]

I hope not. I feel like they'd do a lot of recycling if they hoped to get an album out that fast.

Not necessarily. Artists used to release 2 albums a year. Any less than one every year, to me, is lazy. The Pet Shop Boys have released, on average, an album's worth of new music every year this decade. And it's all be superb. Same with Morrissey (since coming out of "retirement" in 2004).

[Steviefan49]

They've sure saturated my market.

Not mine by a long shot.. and I have a feeling that I speak for a LOT of the die hard fans! I'm DYING to hear new music, and I'd go to hear them perform it all in a New York second! :wavey:

[Steviefan49]

I hope not. I feel like they'd do a lot of recycling if they hoped to get an album out that fast.

Exactly Dani!! And they do! I can't wait to see them come out with some new material.. :xoxo:

[Steviefan49]

Not necessarily. Artists used to release 2 albums a year. Any less than one every year, to me, is lazy. The Pet Shop Boys have released, on average, an album's worth of new music every year this decade. And it's all be superb. Same with Morrissey (since coming out of "retirement" in 2004).

It's already been quoted that they have "TONS" of music left over from SYW that didn't get added to that album.. If you look at FM's track record of coming out with new albums, you will see their pattern. These guys have never been a band to come out with 2 albums in one year.. You're comparing apples to onions here.. LOL.. It's definitely time for FM to put a new album - and they'll do just that! ;)

[daniellaaarisen]

Not necessarily. Artists used to release 2 albums a year. Any less than one every year, to me, is lazy. The Pet Shop Boys have released, on average, an album's worth of new music every year this decade. And it's all be superb. Same with Morrissey (since coming out of "retirement" in 2004).

Yeah, but you're forgetting who we are talking about. It took a while to make Say You Will and they pretty much had all of Lindsey's songs already done, minus Stevie's backing vocals and little tweaks here and there. If they were to release something within a year, I think we'd get a lot of leftovers from the Say You Will sessions... and I just think they'd do a lot better if they went into the studio with a totally new slate. They don't necessarily need to be writing totally new songs-- but I'd like any near-completed recordings to be taken off the table. For one, if it wasn't good enough for an 18 track album in 2003, it ain't gonna be good enough now. And also, I really want to see the band writing and producing with their own personal issues from SYW in their minds. Obviously many of the fans and the band itself are not fully satisfied with SYW... I personally think that it sounds like two solo albums crashed into one. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE the individual tracks on the album. But as a unit, it isn't "Mac"-- it's Stevie and Lindsey.... and at times, maybe Stevie vs. Lindsey. I don't want to listen to any future releases and say the exact same thing. I'd rather wait a little longer as long as the extension is well used to make better material... and that they stay in the best musical form possible (specifically in voice).

[LukeA]

For the "greatest hits tour" maybe... NOT for any new materials! I know I'd race out to by a ticket for this one, knowing it's all new music! Haven't thought about that one did ya?:)

Because the SYW tour was all about the SYW album. Right.

Harsh reality: even a full Rumours reunion lineup tour in Summer 2010 (complete with new studio album) would be hard pressed to outsell (or even match) what the Unleashed tour did. Only way this hypothetical tour does better than Unleashed is if you move it to the Fall and call it a "Farewell Tour".

NYSE/NASDAQ aside, the economy is only getting worse. They took way too much money out of practically every viable market in North America, sputtering through more than a few major embarrassments/cancellations along the way.

A new album would be great for fans, but lets be real. At LEAST half (if not more) of the people who attended an Unleashed show would never purchase a new FM studio album.

[Steviefan49]

Because the SYW tour was all about the SYW album. Right.

Harsh reality: even a full Rumours reunion lineup tour in Summer 2010 (complete with new studio album) would be hard pressed to outsell (or even match) what the Unleashed tour did. NYSE/NASDAQ aside, the economy is only getting worse. They took way too much money out of practically every viable market in North America, sputtering through more than a few major embarrassments/cancellations along the way.

A new album would be great for fans, but lets be real. At LEAST half (if not more) of the people who attended an Unleashed show would never purchase a new FM studio album.

Actually, the harsh reality here may be that because the Rumors cd/dvd is tied up in legal issues right now, truth be known on that, we may never know when they release that one. We're not discussing the "Rumors" issue now at all, as that's not even on the table! As has been stated, it will be a new album full of all "NEW" materials!

We're NOT comparing an "Unleashed" tour to a tour with new materials, and a new cd! You can say what you will, but I'm taking a poll now on facebook, as I have over 300 "Fleetwood Mac" fans on my friend's list who completely and uttlerly "DISAGREE" in every level to what you are saying, and will be standing in a line, like "MOST" of us fans - in a heartbeat!!! And I SOO can't wait to be laughing at you, come tour time, once I see you saying how you're going! And if you don't- it's just one better chance for a front row seat for me, and all of the rest of us die-hard fans! :rolleyes:

Oh, and a PS, if I were you, I wouldn't put any money down on any of us fans who attended a "Unleashed" show NOT purchasing a new Fleetwood Mac Studio album! You can be your own "Debbie Downer" all you want, but the facts will speak for themselves!

[CADreaming]

They took way too much money out of practically every viable market in North America, sputtering through more than a few major embarrassments/cancellations along the way.

You call three cancellations, two of which were made up major? I think you exaggerate.
:rolleyes:

[Steviefan49]

You call three cancellations, two of which were made up major? I think you exaggerate.
:rolleyes:

Exactly! Plus, after doing shows every other day..I don't feel that 3 cancellations hardly constitute any sort of embarrassment by a long shot! And yes.. they did make up 2 of those! :thumbsup:

[louielouie2000]

Yeah, but you're forgetting who we are talking about. It took a while to make Say You Will and they pretty much had all of Lindsey's songs already done, minus Stevie's backing vocals and little tweaks here and there. If they were to release something within a year, I think we'd get a lot of leftovers from the Say You Will sessions... and I just think they'd do a lot better if they went into the studio with a totally new slate. They don't necessarily need to be writing totally new songs-- but I'd like any near-completed recordings to be taken off the table. For one, if it wasn't good enough for an 18 track album in 2003, it ain't gonna be good enough now. And also, I really want to see the band writing and producing with their own personal issues from SYW in their minds. Obviously many of the fans and the band itself are not fully satisfied with SYW... I personally think that it sounds like two solo albums crashed into one. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE the individual tracks on the album. But as a unit, it isn't "Mac"-- it's Stevie and Lindsey.... and at times, maybe Stevie vs. Lindsey. I don't want to listen to any future releases and say the exact same thing. I'd rather wait a little longer as long as the extension is well used to make better material... and that they stay in the best musical form possible (specifically in voice).

Boy, I absolutely agree with everything you said! I know I for one, would find a way to scrape some money together to go see them if they toured in the future behind new material. Otherwise... I'm staying home. I just don't want to go hear the same songs year in and year out, slowly getting worse in form and function :sorry:. I'd rather remember them for their searing performances of the SYW tour: the passion behind the new songs, next to the comforting familiarity of the classics.

Moving on, it honestly slipped my mind about SYW taking 18 months, with over half the songs being completed at the beginning of those 18 months. Yikes. It could be a WHILE before we get some new material. But I really don't think we'll see an 18 track album next time around (assuming there will be such an album, of course). I'm hoping they'll make a tighter, more concise statement ala Rumours, Gift Of Screws, etc. That's what they need... around 12 solid, familiar yet fresh sounding tunes which have different personalities, but sit well together in context. SYW was so rambling and scattered that the point it was trying to make was utterly lost. You'd think if Stevie and Lindsey can nail this idea of precision with TISL and GOS, that they could together make it happen in FM. I suppose we'll see... or maybe not.

[ILoveFM]

Oh, and a PS, if I were you, I wouldn't put any money down on any of us fans who attended a "Unleashed" show NOT purchasing a new Fleetwood Mac Studio album! You can be your own "Debbie Downer" all you want, but the facts will speak for themselves!

Arlene, I love you :D


Oh, and I voted yes! I'm not sure if they will, but I sure hope so. I'd love for it to be something that they love more importantly. And if not by 2010, I'm hopeful for an early 2011 release. As long as I get to see them again, I'll be happy ;)

[Steviefan49]

Boy, I absolutely agree with everything you said! I know I for one, would find a way to scrape some money together to go see them if they toured in the future behind new material. Otherwise... I'm staying home. I just don't want to go hear the same songs year in and year out, slowly getting worse in form and function :sorry:. I'd rather remember them for their searing performances of the SYW tour: the passion behind the new songs, next to the comforting familiarity of the classics.

Moving on, it honestly slipped my mind about SYW taking 18 months, with over half the songs being completed at the beginning of those 18 months. Yikes. It could be a WHILE before we get some new material. But I really don't think we'll see an 18 track album next time around (assuming there will be such an album, of course). I'm hoping they'll make a tighter, more concise statement ala Rumours, Gift Of Screws, etc. That's what they need... around 12 solid, familiar yet fresh sounding tunes which have different personalities, but sit well together in context. SYW was so rambling and scattered that the point it was trying to make was utterly lost. You'd think if Stevie and Lindsey can nail this idea of precision with TISL and GOS, that they could together make it happen in FM. I suppose we'll see... or maybe not.

There ya go.. You and everyone else in Fleetwood Macdom, or a lot of us will definitely be standing in a line pretty quickly to see them do some new material! I know starting with myself, I'll definitely buy the cd upon it coming out, and buying a good ticket to see them tour with it! :thumbsup:

[Steviefan49]

Arlene, I love you :D


Oh, and I voted yes! I'm not sure if they will, but I sure hope so. I'd love for it to be something that they love more importantly. And if not by 2010, I'm hopeful for an early 2011 release. As long as I get to see them again, I'll be happy ;)

Awwww.. I love you too! I SO wish it won't take them long, but they are normally all about "quality".. I do agree with Dani, with what she said about SYW sounding like 2 collaborations a bit.. but I do feel they put their heart and soul into their work- as a whole. And who knows when it will be released, but it's SOOO good to know that it's all going to be "in the works" - which is fantastic! I too, voted "yes".. as I know it's going to be done. I'm hoping to see it be done before the end of 2010- but again, if not.. it's all good to me, just as long as I know it's happening- I'm GREAT with that! :thumbsup:

Hugs,

Arlene

[daniellaaarisen]

First of all, I'm glad we are on the same page Louie. :)

Also, Luke has a point. Everyone in Mac is 60+ and they haven't had a big hit album for over 10 years. They have to cut the crap and make something really noteworthy if they expect to match the Unleashed tour results... let alone surpass them. It's going to get harder and harder for them to be successful as time goes on just because they are fading more and more. As Stevie lovingly said on Destiny Rules, the typical Mac generation isn't "sitting around smoking dope and watching Billboard to see what they need to buy as their next record!" Even when Stevie and Mac's album quality has been questionable, they were still able to sell because they were somewhat current. They don't have that benefit anymore.

Which basically means that if they're going to put the work into getting another album out, they better as hell make it worth it. Because if they were disappointed with SYW sales, it's not going to be any better this time around. We all love them and will buy anything they put out without a question, but we are a very select group of people, people. They need to work ten times harder to make even a fraction of the impression that they used to make on the music scene. So cut the **** and get writing and recording! They can't go around doing greatest hits tours forever. I will follow this band to my grave so yes, I would be at those shows.... but I'd do it a bit spitefully if they let whatever is left of their creative potential go down the drain. They aren't getting any younger, either.

[LukeA]

You call three cancellations, two of which were made up major? I think you exaggerate.
:rolleyes:

You're slightly mistaken. Rochester & Greensboro were both canceled far in advance due to disastrous (not an exaggeration) ticket sales (I don't consider the 2nd Toronto show a "makeup"- more like a fill date). Sacramento was due to be rescheduled, but after something like 20% of the tickets (presumably from amateur scalpers) got returned after the postponement, the show got blown out. Edmonton & Calgary got rescheduled because they were two of the half dozen or so shows that did extremely well.

As for the embarrassments, see: SLC, Milwaukee, MSG #2, Baltimore, Manchester, Tampa, Orlando, St. Louis, Omaha, Rosemont #2, Albany.. and at least one or two more than I'm forgetting. The main reason why half of those shows weren't canceled is because they got enough action on the 2-for-1/allocating previously priced $135 tickets to 2-for-$60 packages. Greensboro didn't, and that's why it got axed.

[Steviefan49]

You're slightly mistaken. Rochester & Greensboro were both canceled far in advance due to disastrous (not an exaggeration) ticket sales. Sacramento was due to be rescheduled, but after something like 20% of the tickets (presumably from amateur scalpers) got returned after the postponement, the show got blown out. Edmonton & Calgary got rescheduled because they were two of the half dozen or so shows that did extremely well.

As for the embarrassments, see: SLC, Milwaukee, MSG #2, Baltimore, Manchester, Tampa, Orlando, St. Louis, Omaha, Rosemont #2, Albany.. and at least one or two more than I'm forgetting. The main reason why half of those shows weren't canceled is because they got enough action on the 2-for-1/allocating previously priced $135 tickets to 2-for-$60 packages. Greensboro didn't, and that's why it got axed.

Luke, you can moan all you want to, regarding what you "feel" is disastrous- but there's a LOT of us, who actually are NOT Debbie Downers, like yourself, and feel that the Mac laughs all the way to the bank, my friend! I have no idea as to what you're talking about on ANY shows being 2-for 60$ or any packages for that! I never saw them when it came time for my show, and trust me, I searched everywhere! The best I could do was 250$ PER ticket- and that wasn't on the floor, even though I didn't want to sit in a floor seat in our venue! The side seats by the stage are much better, IMO..

At any rate, no matter how "down" you may be about this band, this is WHY you are on this very board, is it not?? I'm definitely, again, NOT one of the FM/Stevie people that feel they can do no wrong, as I've seen them in concert since 1981- and I have seen what they are all about. In a nutshell, they will ALWAYS be one of my favorite, all time bands and there is nothing or NO ONE on this board, or anywhere that could ever change my mind ! :thumbsup:

[LukeA]

Luke, you can moan all you want to, regarding what you "feel" is disastrous- but there's a LOT of us, who actually are NOT Debbie Downers, like yourself, and feel that the Mac laughs all the way to the bank, my friend!

Fleetwood Mac shouldn't be laughing. Live Nation was far from satisfied with the results of the Unleashed tour. Barring a "farewell" tour, when it comes to the ridiculously high up-front fee they've been accustomed to the last two tours, they have ZERO leverage for such a tour in 2010. So, pardon me for being a "Debbie Downer" for considering things like "facts" & "trends" and impersonal concepts like "over-saturation" when discussing the band's future- it doesn't make me any less of a fan. ESPECIALLY since its generally accepted by most (not just me) that the band basically exists in 2009 to make money... and where do 99.9% of all bands make most of their money?

I have no idea as to what you're talking about on ANY shows being 2-for 60$ or any packages for that!

I stand corrected- it was 2 previously-$135 tickets for $80 (for Omaha) http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showthread.php?t=39995

Other links to help refresh your memory ($25 tickets galore):
http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showthread.php?t=39835
http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showthread.php?t=39899

Almost every show had hundreds of tickets given away- the ten-or-so shows that I listed each had over a thousand comps out.

At any rate, no matter how "down" you may be about this band, this is WHY you are on this very board, is it not??

Do not pretend or presume to have even the slightest clue why I've chosen to be a part of this community for 12+ years. Thank you.

[Amlyn]

First of all, I'm glad we are on the same page Louie. :)

Also, Luke has a point. Everyone in Mac is 60+ and they haven't had a big hit album for over 10 years. They have to cut the crap and make something really noteworthy if they expect to match the Unleashed tour results... let alone surpass them. It's going to get harder and harder for them to be successful as time goes on just because they are fading more and more. As Stevie lovingly said on Destiny Rules, the typical Mac generation isn't "sitting around smoking dope and watching Billboard to see what they need to buy as their next record!" Even when Stevie and Mac's album quality has been questionable, they were still able to sell because they were somewhat current. They don't have that benefit anymore.

Which basically means that if they're going to put the work into getting another album out, they better as hell make it worth it. Because if they were disappointed with SYW sales, it's not going to be any better this time around. We all love them and will buy anything they put out without a question, but we are a very select group of people, people. They need to work ten times harder to make even a fraction of the impression that they used to make on the music scene. So cut the **** and get writing and recording! They can't go around doing greatest hits tours forever. I will follow this band to my grave so yes, I would be at those shows.... but I'd do it a bit spitefully if they let whatever is left of their creative potential go down the drain. They aren't getting any younger, either.



Let's face it, we don't have decades left with this band so they need to focus on quality and not quanity. Hopefully the experience of touring together for a year and then heading into the studio will provide a more solid and stable foundation to produce an album from the ground up.

I think the cohesiveness lacking in SYW can absolutely be attributed to the fact that everyone in the band attempted to join forces after being on completely separate paths for what 4-5 years? Maybe a little less? SYW was the first time in a long time they were really coming from four absolutely different places (not to mention the first time without Christine.) Obviously, a break in this duration is not uncommon for this band, but prior to SYW, well maybe at least prior to the Dance, they sort of were all coasting along their separate lives, but sort of at a similar pace. But in 2001-2002, at 50 something, they are all at such different milestones - Stevie in unattached and focused on her solo career, Lindsey is newly married with a growing family, Mick has his new girls, and John is raising a teenager but would probably rather be sailing. You get where I'm going. They were all really doing such different things in their lives, which probably wasn't so true when creating studio albums before this, and if it was, probably wasn't as evident as it was when creating SYW. Really, other then being in a band with legendary history what was common amongst them at that point? All this, plus the experience of doing an album 25 years past their heyday must have contributed to the lack of synergy and resulted in what seemed to be a collaboration of two artist's solo albums.

But, maybe, just maybe, if they can take the momentum that they have had by working with each other over the past year and being intertwined with each other's lives, and truly believe that a studio album can be a positive experience, we can see something wonderful from them in the future. :thumbsup:

[Steviefan49]

Fleetwood Mac shouldn't be laughing. Live Nation was far from satisfied with the results of the Unleashed tour. Barring a "farewell" tour, when it comes to the ridiculously high up-front fee they've been accustomed to the last two tours, they have ZERO leverage for such a tour in 2010. So, pardon me for being a "Debbie Downer" for considering things like "facts" & "trends" and impersonal concepts like "over-saturation" when discussing the band's future- it doesn't make me any less of a fan. ESPECIALLY since its generally accepted by most (not just me) that the band basically exists in 2009 to make money... and where do 99.9% of all bands make most of their money?



I stand corrected- it was 2 previously-$135 tickets for $80 (for Omaha) http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showthread.php?t=39995

Other links to help refresh your memory ($25 tickets galore):
http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showthread.php?t=39835
http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showthread.php?t=39899

Almost every show had hundreds of tickets given away- the ten-or-so shows that I listed each had over a thousand comps out.



Do not pretend or presume to have even the slightest clue why I've chosen to be a part of this community for 12+ years. Thank you.

Let's put it this way... Since you seem to know SO much about Live Nation, and how "unsatisfied" they were with the Mac, is that WHY they are STILL backing them?? :laugh: Really..

And as far as any "farewell" tour goes- I wouldn't be holding my breath for that one, as it won't be on any time soon. That I can assure you! ;)

I never once said that you being a "Debbie downer" ever made you less of a fan.. but it sure does prove you being a true "Pessimist".. LOL...The only "facts" that you've mentioned is that Fleetwood Mac performed a U.S. Leg of the tour, and are now onto a European leg! As far as any "leverage" they carry for a 2010 tour.. again, don't hold your breath, my friend... ;)

Also most of the bands who have been performing since the 70's- live for their "greatest hits" as that's what most of the general population remember them for! Us die hard fans always are on the look out for new material, which is the still the case! Always has been, and always will be! :nod: Facts are facts!

And another "PS" for you..there was "NOT" and I repeat "NOT" one show that was EVER in the 20$ dollar range in Houston, TX or anywhere in Texas, my friend! Just becase they may have had a few states that had that, most of the people I know had front row seats to every show they went to, and they want to MANY!!!

Again, regarding Fleetwood Mac laughing all the way to the bank, is a saying.. They live their "SUCESS" and it shows! Thus, the new album, and upcoming tour to go with it, plus their re-release of Rumours down the road, as well.. They're FAR from throwing in any towels on any "farewell tour" hun!

[Steviefan49]

Let's face it, we don't have decades left with this band so they need to focus on quality and not quanity. Hopefully the experience of touring together for a year and then heading into the studio will provide a more solid and stable foundation to produce an album from the ground up.

I think the cohesiveness lacking in SYW can absolutely be attributed to the fact that everyone in the band attempted to join forces after being on completely separate paths for what 4-5 years? Maybe a little less? SYW was the first time in a long time they were really coming from four absolutely different places (not to mention the first time without Christine.) Obviously, a break in this duration is not uncommon for this band, but prior to SYW, well maybe at least prior to the Dance, they sort of were all coasting along their separate lives, but sort of at a similar pace. But in 2001-2002, at 50 something, they are all at such different milestones - Stevie in unattached and focused on her solo career, Lindsey is newly married with a growing family, Mick has his new girls, and John is raising a teenager but would probably rather be sailing. You get where I'm going. They were all really doing such different things in their lives, which probably wasn't so true when creating studio albums before this, and if it was, probably wasn't as evident as it was when creating SYW. Really, other then being in a band with legendary history what was common amongst them at that point? All this, plus the experience of doing an album 25 years past their heyday must have contributed to the lack of synergy and resulted in what seemed to be a collaboration of two artist's solo albums.

But, maybe, just maybe, if they can take the momentum that they have had by working with each other over the past year and being intertwined with each other's lives, and truly believe that a studio album can be a positive experience, we can see something wonderful from them in the future. :thumbsup:

Absolutely!! I SOOO agree with you.. very well stated!:thumbsup:

[louielouie2000]

Let's put it this way... Since you seem to know SO much about Live Nation, and how "unsatisfied" they were with the Mac, is that WHY they are STILL backing them?? :laugh: Really..

Well that's an easy one... it's called contracts :D.

[justcrazylove]

Arelene you're just rambling. Luke is talking facts about the recording and touring industry. I understand you're coming from a purely fan perspective, which is fine but it is not reality. A saturated market is basic marketing principle and no matter which way you look at it, they have saturated the American market with the last touring schedule. Azoff will know this, Stubbner will know this and the band will know this. I believe they will record again but this will take time and they cannot possibly tour until at least 2012. Being realistic doesn't make you any less of a fan. "debbie downer" give me a break. Luke has a track record on this site as being very well informed and an intelligent poster.

BOOKMARK this thread and his point will be proven!

[DavidMn]

Reality check: I loved this tour. Went to 23 shows and 2 next week in London. However, as much as I loved going (and always will) Luke is 100% right when he mentions sputtering through certain markets. Chicago #2, Detroit, Toronto#1, Cleveland, St Louis, Omaha, and Milwaukee all shows I attended had SEVERAL sections in the upper levels closed off because of lack of demand, and lest we forget some of these shows had that 2 for 1 or $25 thing going because they couldnt sell. I wonder though if they hadnt waited until the last few shows in North America to discount the tip price if that woudlve made that much of a difference.:shrug:

[Steviefan49]

Well that's an easy one... it's called contracts :D.

And contracts can definitely be "broken"..:wavey:

[louielouie2000]

Arelene you're just rambling. Luke is talking facts about the recording and touring industry. I understand you're coming from a purely fan perspective, which is fine but it is not reality. A saturated market is basic marketing principle and no matter which way you look at it, they have saturated the American market with the last touring schedule. Azoff will know this, Stubbner will know this and the band will know this. I believe they will record again but this will take time and they cannot possibly tour until at least 2012. Being realistic doesn't make you any less of a fan. "debbie downer" give me a break. Luke has a track record on this site as being very well informed and an intelligent poster.

BOOKMARK this thread and his point will be proven!

You're absolutely right! Arlene has this mindset of 'either you're for us or against us,' don't let her ruffle your feathers too much ;). The reality is, fans come in completely different packages, and we all have different opinions. That's the great thing about message boards... bouncing ideas off one another, and spirited debate. I'd actually say that we as hardcore fans, and nobody else, has the right to critique the band, or to doubt them, or call their bluffs. Because really, we're the most informed people on the face of the earth when it comes to Fleetwood Mac. None of us has the right to demand why another person posts here if they disagree with our train of thought. Let's cherish our differences... otherwise we'd be Stepford Ledgie Bots! :eek:

And you're totally right... in regards to touring, the band knows it either has to give it a rest for a year or two after the European leg; or record, then tour behind a new album. These people have been in the music business 40 years, they're not dumb. They are represented by some of the most veteran players in the music biz, who are also NOT DUMB. There is a finite amount of Fleetwood Mac that the general public can absorb. Just because some of us would like more, doesn't mean that the majority of the concert buying public will. The band and it's management, etc know they've saturated the market for the time being, especially in this recession. And as much as I'd like an album of new material next year too, positive thoughts and flowery posts on a message board simply won't make it happen. The band is slow and irregular... they're all in their 60s, they're spoiled old rock stars. They only do things on their own terms, on their own timeframes, exactly as they want it. And you know what? As much as I dislike it, they've earned that right I suppose.

Here's what my personal crystal ball tells me: They'll likely take off a good chunk of next year to recoup from touring, and spend time with their loved ones. Then they'll piddle around finding the perfect place to record, and especially the right producer (if they end up going down that road). Then they'll fiddle in the studio for well over a year. The last time they recorded and released an album in under a year was 1975, so we have no grounds to expect them to do that this day and age. If the band is really going to do a ground up collaborative album, it could take longer than a year. We have to keep in mind, starting with Tusk, the various members came to the table with fairly fleshed out songs. They're saying they won't do that this time around (we'll see). I'm betting *IF* we get a new album, it'll be in the 2011-2012 timeframe. And it could be longer... just look at the band and it's solo members track records. Trust me, just because I highly doubt we'll see any new material from the kids in the next year plus doesn't mean I don't want new material. Quite the opposite. I'm just being realistic. And there's nothing wrong with being realistic. :thumbsup:

[Steviefan49]

Arelene you're just rambling. Luke is talking facts about the recording and touring industry. I understand you're coming from a purely fan perspective, which is fine but it is not reality. A saturated market is basic marketing principle and no matter which way you look at it, they have saturated the American market with the last touring schedule. Azoff will know this, Stubbner will know this and the band will know this. I believe they will record again but this will take time and they cannot possibly tour until at least 2012. Being realistic doesn't make you any less of a fan. "debbie downer" give me a break. Luke has a track record on this site as being very well informed and an intelligent poster.

BOOKMARK this thread and his point will be proven!

Excuse you, but the one who's "just rambling" seems to be Luke, as always! There is not "ONE" fact that he's stated so far in all of his "ramblings"- And if you're talking Azoff, he's already been included in things coming up! Darlin' - i'm not just coming from a "fan's perspective"- I'm stating FACTS, as I have a very reliable "inside source" who I speak with on a regular basis, regarding everything Stevie/FM... I really don't feel YOU are being realistic in telling someone they are coming from a "fan perspective" when YOU, don't know FACTS! Let's find out FACTS first before mouthing off.. k? And no.. sorry to disagree but the only thing that i've seen Luke have a "track record" of, is bullying people with his "facts" and beliefs! That's NO track record in my book! He's a total Debbie downer when it comes to bashing band members of Fleetwood Mac, and members of this board, and frankly I'm sick and tired of it!

[Steviefan49]

You're absolutely right! Arlene has this mindset of 'either you're for us or against us,' don't let her ruffle your feathers too much ;). The reality is, fans come in completely different packages, and we all have different opinions. That's the great thing about message boards... bouncing ideas off one another, and spirited debate. I'd actually say that we as hardcore fans, and nobody else, has the right to critique the band, or to doubt them, or call their bluffs. Because really, we're the most informed people on the face of the earth when it comes to Fleetwood Mac. None of us has the right to demand why another person posts here if they disagree with our train of thought. Let's cherish our differences... otherwise we'd be Stepford Ledgie Bots! :eek:

And you're totally right... in regards to touring, the band knows it either has to give it a rest for a year or two after the European leg; or record, then tour behind a new album. These people have been in the music business 40 years, they're not dumb. They are represented by some of the most veteran players in the music biz, who are also NOT DUMB. There is a finite amount of Fleetwood Mac that the general public can absorb. Just because some of us would like more, doesn't mean that the majority of the concert buying public will. The band and it's management, etc know they've saturated the market for the time being, especially in this recession. And as much as I'd like an album of new material next year too, positive thoughts and flowery posts on a message board simply won't make it happen. The band is slow and irregular... they're all in their 60s, they're spoiled old rock stars. They only do things on their own terms, on their own timeframes, exactly as they want it. And you know what? As much as I dislike it, they've earned that right I suppose.

Here's what my personal crystal ball tells me: They'll likely take off a good chunk of next year to recoup from touring, and spend time with their loved ones. Then they'll piddle around finding the perfect place to record, and especially the right producer (if they end up going down that road). Then they'll fiddle in the studio for well over a year. The last time they recorded and released an album in under a year was 1975, so we have no grounds to expect them to do that this day and age. If the band is really going to do a ground up collaborative album, it could take longer than a year. We have to keep in mind, starting with Tusk, the various members came to the table with fairly fleshed out songs. They're saying they won't do that this time around (we'll see). I'm betting *IF* we get a new album, it'll be in the 2011-2012 timeframe. Trust me, just because I highly doubt we'll see any new material from the kids in the next year plus doesn't mean I don't want new material. Quite the opposite. I'm just being realistic. And there's nothing wrong with being realistic. :thumbsup:

Uh.. Excuse you as well, but your another one of the "Naysayers" on this board, who also is "Misinformed".. and for your own information... I don't at ALL have a mindset of "you're either for us or against us".. I think your "Crystal balls" definitely need brushing off, once again! And what's funny was, we were actually on the same page before.. WOW..

Sorry - but no matter how hard you and Luke "TRY" to bully me, or anyone else, you will never change my mind on "known facts" that I know to be truths by inside sources... Good try tho..:laugh:

[daniellaaarisen]

Excuse you, but the one who's "just rambling" seems to be Luke, as always! There is not "ONE" fact that he's stated so far in all of his "ramblings"- And if you're talking Azoff, he's already been included in things coming up! Darlin' - i'm not just coming from a "fan's perspective"- I'm stating FACTS, as I have a very reliable "inside source" who I speak with on a regular basis, regarding everything Stevie/FM... I really don't feel YOU are being realistic in telling someone they are coming from a "fan perspective" when YOU, don't know FACTS! Let's find out FACTS first before mouthing off.. k? And no.. sorry to disagree but the only thing that i've seen Luke have a "track record" of, is bullying people with his "facts" and beliefs! That's NO track record in my book! He's a total Debbie downer when it comes to bashing band members of Fleetwood Mac, and members of this board, and frankly I'm sick and tired of it!

I do think you need to give David's opinion a little credit, though, considering he's been to so many shows (impressive, by the way-- TOTALLY JEALOUS). And I'm actually with the guys on this one. :/ I don't think anyone is trying to bully you in this particular situation, Arlene, but instead they are trying to show you that Fleetwood Mac can't survive without some organization and strategizing.

Cheer up! :) The band is going to do what they want to do and all the speculation in the world isn't going to change that.

[Steviefan49]

I do think you need to give David's opinion a little credit, though, considering he's been to so many shows (impressive, by the way-- TOTALLY JEALOUS).

I always love DavidMn's posts.. and I have given it credit.. In fact I loved the fact he's been to 23 shows, as that speaks volumes! :D

[DavidMn]

Excuse you, but the one who's "just rambling" seems to be Luke, as always! There is not "ONE" fact that he's stated so far in all of his "ramblings"- And if you're talking Azoff, he's already been included in things coming up! Darlin' - i'm not just coming from a "fan's perspective"- I'm stating FACTS, as I have a very reliable "inside source" who I speak with on a regular basis, regarding everything Stevie/FM... I really don't feel YOU are being realistic in telling someone they are coming from a "fan perspective" when YOU, don't know FACTS! Let's find out FACTS first before mouthing off.. k? And no.. sorry to disagree but the only thing that i've seen Luke have a "track record" of, is bullying people with his "facts" and beliefs! That's NO track record in my book! He's a total Debbie downer when it comes to bashing band members of Fleetwood Mac, and members of this board, and frankly I'm sick and tired of it!Arlene sweetheart, I like you, but I feel you're off base just a bit here. There's no need to overreact to Luke or anyone else here. I honestly dont feel he's a downer, and this isnt because he's my bff or anything like that. I like what he brings to this board and I don't feel there's any maliciousness in his posts. I'm not trying to take sides here, but I just dont want some flame war to start quite honestly because I like both of you, that's all.:)

[justcrazylove]

Arlene, You're accusing Luke about bullying, after that post...oh the irony! Grow up. and let's not play that "i know inside people" card it just comes across as desperate and a little how would you say "debbie downer"

Pathetic

[Steviefan49]

I do think you need to give David's opinion a little credit, though, considering he's been to so many shows (impressive, by the way-- TOTALLY JEALOUS). And I'm actually with the guys on this one. :/ I don't think anyone is trying to bully you in this particular situation, Arlene, but instead they are trying to show you that Fleetwood Mac can't survive without some organization and strategizing.

Cheer up! :) The band is going to do what they want to do and all the speculation in the world isn't going to change that.

Hey Dani..

Though I do see a few valid points, I'm totally being "bullied" as it's very clear, and it's fine, as I just laugh and go on.. It will never change "facts" which have been stated to me by MY inside sources! ;) Everyone is entitled to their opinions, and every group, be it in the business for 2 years- to 50 years needs organization and stategizing.. I'm not disagreeing with that at ALL..What I'm disagreeing with, is the negative idea that is being tossed around about how Fleetwood Mac is on their last legs and performing their "farewell tour".. They are FAR from that status.. ;)

[louielouie2000]

Excuse you, but the one who's "just rambling" seems to be Luke, as always! There is not "ONE" fact that he's stated so far in all of his "ramblings"- And if you're talking Azoff, he's already been included in things coming up! Darlin' - i'm not just coming from a "fan's perspective"- I'm stating FACTS, as I have a very reliable "inside source" who I speak with on a regular basis, regarding everything Stevie/FM... I really don't feel YOU are being realistic in telling someone they are coming from a "fan perspective" when YOU, don't know FACTS! Let's find out FACTS first before mouthing off.. k? And no.. sorry to disagree but the only thing that i've seen Luke have a "track record" of, is bullying people with his "facts" and beliefs! That's NO track record in my book! He's a total Debbie downer when it comes to bashing band members of Fleetwood Mac, and members of this board, and frankly I'm sick and tired of it!

Ok, so I'll bite here. I know you love to bait people, and like a dummy, I always play along :D. Do divulge your factual evidence and/or experience that proves Fleetwood Mac will indeed record and release a new album in the next 12 months. No hiding behind "I have an inside source" crap, explain in your beloved FACTS exactly why we'll be getting an album so quickly. Trust me, I'd loooooove to be proven wrong and we all get a surprise Mac album next year. I'll eat crow and smile with it stuck between my teeth if I'm wrong! :lol: But history an experience tells me we can't be expecting a new album so soon...

[Steviefan49]

Arlene, You're accusing Luke about bullying, after that post...oh the irony! Grow up. and let's not play that "i know inside people" card it just comes across as desperate and a little how would you say "debbie downer"

Pathetic

Yes I am.. I've seen him do it a LOT on this board.. I'm not 18 hun.. I've been on fan boards for years.. and I've seen it all..No irony, as I'm not "bullying him" at all! If you go back and read my posts.. I refer to him as "my friend".. I don't consider that "bullying" anyone! I think YOU are the one who needs to grow up! Sorry, but you aren't going to win any tennis matches with me, so it's time for you to move on and try to "impress" someone else.. It isn't phasing me in the least.. :wavey:

[daniellaaarisen]

Hey Dani..

Though I do see a few valid points, I'm totally being "bullied" as it's very clear, and it's fine, as I just laugh and go on.. It will never change "facts" which have been stated to me by MY inside sources! ;) Everyone is entitled to their opinions, and every group, be it in the business for 2 years- to 50 years needs organization and stategizing.. I'm not disagreeing with that at ALL..What I'm disagreeing with, is the negative idea that is being tossed around about how Fleetwood Mac is on their last legs and performing their "farewell tour".. They are FAR from that status.. ;)

I don't think that's what Luke was saying at all... he was saying that the band needs to strategize before they go on tour again so they can continue to be successful for years to come.

Also, this inside source thing is intriguing. Care to share more about that? It will help us understand you a little more on this topic.

[Steviefan49]

Ok, so I'll bite here. I know you love to bait people, and like a dummy, I always play along :D. Do divulge your factual evidence and/or experience that proves Fleetwood Mac will indeed record and release a new album in the next 12 months. No hiding behind "I have an inside source" crap, explain in your beloved FACTS exactly why we'll be getting an album so quickly. Trust me, I'd loooooove to be proven wrong and we all get a surprise Mac album next year. I'll eat crow and smile with it stuck between my teeth if I'm wrong! :lol: But history an experience tells me we can't be expecting a new album so soon...

Ok.. well that's great that you like to be proven wrong.. as you will be. I'm not about to "divulge" a thing.. as I don't need to. All I will say at this time, is it was stated to me by someone in their camp- and again, we can play tennis all night long... but you won't win hun.. You can trust me on this one!:)

[Steviefan49]

I don't think that's what Luke was saying at all... he was saying that the band needs to strategize before they go on tour again so they can continue to be successful for years to come.

Well, that's not at all what I read in his posts.. I feel everyone needs organization and great management, which they have.. There's a lot more of what he said that I completely and utterly disagree with..;)

[Steviefan49]

I don't think that's what Luke was saying at all... he was saying that the band needs to strategize before they go on tour again so they can continue to be successful for years to come.

Also, this inside source thing is intriguing. Care to share more about that? It will help us understand you a little more on this topic.

And actually he did state that, about this next tour being Fleetwood Mac's "farewell tour".. That isn't going to happen for a LONG time to come..

[justcrazylove]

What's this 18 thing? who's 18? and why are playing tennis? "blah blah blah I'm a fan for years, blah blah blah that makes my point more valid than yours.... i'll stop there, as everyone else has said, i would be more than pleased to be proven wrong. If respect comes from seeing the band a heap of times i'm not going to sit here and list my dedication to this band to someone i will never meet, yet let alone care about. I'm out this bitch! peace

[louielouie2000]

Hey Dani..

Though I do see a few valid points, I'm totally being "bullied" as it's very clear, and it's fine, as I just laugh and go on.. It will never change "facts" which have been stated to me by MY inside sources! ;) Everyone is entitled to their opinions, and every group, be it in the business for 2 years- to 50 years needs organization and stategizing.. I'm not disagreeing with that at ALL..What I'm disagreeing with, is the negative idea that is being tossed around about how Fleetwood Mac is on their last legs and performing their "farewell tour".. They are FAR from that status.. ;)

Yeah, but you're bullying people right back saying they shouldn't post here if they don't have flowery, happy things to say all the time. I'd consider getting off the 'everybody is attacking me if they don't agree with me' thought train too... that's simply not the case.

And see? We actually do agree on something. I don't think at all that Fleetwood Mac is on it's last legs, and I don't think this is their farewell tour either. Why? Because they're gonna milk the HELL outta that **** when the time comes :laugh:. We'll have a strong indication when we're getting our last album, and most certainly will know when we're getting a farewell tour (though I suspect, we'll get a couple of these). I also have to believe the band will never really be over. I bet you anything they'll still do a concert here, or a TV show there when they're well into their 70s, maybe even 80s. BB King is in his mid 80s and is still touring like he was in his 20s! I do however believe that the Mac's creative engine is winding down. Unless Stevie and Lindsey have an epiphany during the recording of their next album, and REALLY enjoy themselves... I firmly believe the next new album we get will be our last. But again, I'd loooove to be proven otherwise! :D

[Steviefan49]

Arlene sweetheart, I like you, but I feel you're off base just a bit here. There's no need to overreact to Luke or anyone else here. I honestly dont feel he's a downer, and this isnt because he's my bff or anything like that. I like what he brings to this board and I don't feel there's any maliciousness in his posts. I'm not trying to take sides here, but I just dont want some flame war to start quite honestly because I like both of you, that's all.:)

You're very sweet Dav.. I'm truly not at all off base, as I stand firm on what I know and believe! He's entitled to his opinion, just as everyone is, and so am I! I'm not over reacting at all.. Just tired of seing the same actions out of people, over and over again, as it truly gets old after awhile.. How about we all just agree to disagree and move forward! As I've told them, we can all go back and forth all night long with this, but it's not getting anyone anywhere.. We all stand firm in our own beliefs! And I love you too..:xoxo:

[louielouie2000]

Ok.. well that's great that you like to be proven wrong.. as you will be. I'm not about to "divulge" a thing.. as I don't need to. All I will say at this time, is it was stated to me by someone in their camp- and again, we can play tennis all night long... but you won't win hun.. You can trust me on this one!:)

Once yet again, where are your "facts" to support your claim of a new album in 12 months? They've been conveniently left out again. Without any evidence, your claims aren't valid. I've just served and the ball is in your court! :p

[DavidMn]

You're very sweet Dav.. I'm truly not at all off base, as I stand firm on what I know and believe! He's entitled to his opinion, just as everyone is, and so am I! I'm not over reacting at all.. Just tired of seing the same actions out of people, over and over again, as it truly gets old after awhile.. How about we all just agree to disagree and move forward! As I've told them, we can all go back and forth all night long with this, but it's not getting anyone anywhere.. We all stand firm in our own beliefs! And I love you too..:xoxo:fair enough. Too bad I couldnt have come to that Houston show earlier this year. I wouldve loved to haev met you.:nod:

[Steviefan49]

Yeah, but you're bullying people right back saying they shouldn't post here if they don't have flowery, happy things to say all the time. I'd consider getting off the 'everybody is attacking me if they don't agree with me' thought train too... that's simply not the case.

And see? We actually do agree on something. I don't think at all that Fleetwood Mac is on it's last legs, and I don't think this is their farewell tour either. Why? Because they're gonna milk the HELL outta that **** when the time comes :laugh:. We'll have a strong indication when we're getting our last album, and most certainly will know when we're getting a farewell tour (though I suspect, we'll get a couple of these). I also have to believe the band will never really be over. I bet you anything they'll still do a concert here, or a TV show there when they're well into their 70s, maybe even 80s. BB King is in his mid 80s and is still touring like he was in his 20s! I do however believe that the Mac's creative engine is winding down. Unless Stevie and Lindsey have an epiphany during the recording of their next album, and REALLY enjoy themselves... I firmly believe the next new album we get will be our last. But again, I'd loooove to be proven otherwise! :D

Again, nice try hun.. but I've never bullied a soul on this board by saying any such thing.. I love it when people post in with their various opinions, as if everyone always posted in with the same opinions life would really be boring! As I recall, you and I had this very same conversation back when Stevie was being "bashed" on this board.. and again, I will say the same thing..and stand firm in my opinion and belief! Also, I'm not on any "everyone is attacking me" train either, as that's not my beliefs either.. I've had numerous PM's tonight from a lot of members here, saying they are also tired of seeing a certain few people "bullying" others.. and I can't agree more! It's the same people that do the bullying..

YAY.. I'm SOOO glad that we agree that this isn't FM's Farewell tour! I totally agree on the second part of your post.. as that's exactly how I feel as well..

[Steviefan49]

fair enough. Too bad I couldnt have come to that Houston show earlier this year. I wouldve loved to haev met you.:nod:

Awwwww.. you're a sweetheart.. as I would have LOVED to have met you too! It's in the talking stages of me trying to come up to NJ next year hopefully.. so maybe we can do a huge meetup then..:thumbsup:

[DavidMn]

Awwwww.. you're a sweetheart.. as I would have LOVED to have met you too! It's in the talking stages of me trying to come up to NJ next year hopefully.. so maybe we can do a huge meetup then..:thumbsup:that'd be great. Id definitely make a point to meet you for sure!:xoxo:

[Steviefan49]

Once yet again, where are your "facts" to support your claim of a new album in 12 months? They've been conveniently left out again. Without any evidence, your claims aren't valid. I've just served and the ball is in your court! :p

Well sweetie.. it's gonna be a tied score, and love all.. LOL :p- I can't at this time divulge any sort of "facts" but they have been presented to me by a reliable inside source.. and I do wish I could reveal more.. I could care less if claims are valid or invalid.. but they stand as they stand.. Who is to say if things will even go as planned anyway?? No one is God, nor can they predict a problem that needs to have time to be corrected, if need be.. so we'll all just have to take a seat in the limo and wait and see what happens! Agreed?:p

[Steviefan49]

that'd be great. Id definitely make a point to meet you for sure!:xoxo:

Awwww.. absolutely Dav! :xoxo:

[daniellaaarisen]

If you're talking about Sara, I don't think that a) its fair for you to put words in her mouth when she is relatively familiar with a few people on the Ledge and sometimes comes here herself and b) I don't consider anyone who isn't an active member of the business aspect of the band a "reliable inside source" on this topic.

[Steviefan49]

If you're talking about Sara, I don't think that a) its fair for you to put words in her mouth when she is relatively familiar with a few people on the Ledge and sometimes comes here herself and b) I don't consider anyone who isn't an active member of the business aspect of the band a "reliable inside source" on this topic.

No Dani.. I'm not by a long shot talking about Sara.. I can't reveal who my source is, and I won't at this time.. I'll just say this person "IS" very much a part of the business aspect of the band!;)

[daniellaaarisen]

No Dani.. I'm not by a long shot talking about Sara.. I can't reveal who my source is, and I won't at this time.. I'll just say this person "IS" very much a part of the business aspect of the band!;)

Okay... fair enough!

[louielouie2000]

No Dani.. I'm not by a long shot talking about Sara.. I can't reveal who my source is, and I won't at this time.. I'll just say this person "IS" very much a part of the business aspect of the band!;)

Again, I'm just playing "tennis" with you... but even if you do have a bidness contact within the Mac family, how can that person speculate on the timing of a new album dropping? The white album took 3 months to record... but their next album took 4 times that long. Imagine how that must have surprised the execs at Warners! There just isn't any predicting the creative process. Especially when it involves the egos of Stevie Nicks and Lindsey Buckingham. Not to mention the nature of the current economy... several big name movies and albums these past 2 years have had their release dates pushed back, by up to 6 months or more, so that they'll hopefully earn the most money. There are just too many random variables to be able to say definitively that there will be a new album next year. I'm just not convinced. We've gotta look at this realistically... this band does NOTHING quickly, decisively, or firmly. Stevie will say she's never reuniting with Fleetwood Mac again, then she turns around the next year and does a world tour with them. Mick will tell us we're getting an album in a year, then 6 passes with nothing. The only thing predictable about Fleetwood Mac is the fact they're unreliable!

[Steviefan49]

Again, I'm just playing "tennis" with you... but even if you do have a bidness contact within the Mac family, how can that person speculate on the timing of a new album dropping? The white album took 3 months to record... but their next album took 4 times that long. Imagine how that must have surprised the execs at Warners! There just isn't any predicting the creative process. Especially when it involves the egos of Stevie Nicks and Lindsey Buckingham. Not to mention the nature of the current economy... several big name movies and albums these past 2 years have had their release dates pushed back, by up to 6 months or more, so that they'll hopefully earn the most money. There are just too many random variables to be able to say definitively that there will be a new album next year. I'm just not convinced. We've gotta look at this realistically... this band does NOTHING quickly, decisively, or firmly. Stevie will say she's never reuniting with Fleetwood Mac again, then she turns around the next year and does a world tour with them. Mick will tell us we're getting an album in a year, then 6 passes with nothing. The only thing predictable about Fleetwood Mac is the fact they're unreliable!

Well, that's exactly what I just told you in my last post to you. It was something that was "scheduled" to happen before the end of the year, which means just that..That's what they are "shooting" for.. but as I said, no one is God, nor can anyone predict what the future holds.. And you're exactly right..there isn't any way of predicting that creative process.. No one knows what lies ahead.. so it's all a wait and see game.. You have me laughing at the ego's of Stevie and Lindsey.. That's a whole other can of worms.. LOLOL :p- And yes.. that's SO typical Stevie.. she's done that several times.. of saying how she'll never tour with the Mac again, and lo and behold.. here's a new album in the works.. Anyway, so leaving it at that note, I guess we'll all just have to wait and see how things go! I'd love for them to have a album out by that date, but as you said, there's a lot of factors. I totally see your point, and agree..

[StephenC]

No chance.

Personally, I think they should attempt an Unplugged album and sort the other remasters out.

[TrueFaith77]

No chance.

Personally, I think they should attempt an Unplugged album and sort the other remasters out.

Even though I'd PREFER an album of new material, I was JUST thinking that. . . I'm really more surprised that it hasn't happened yet.

ETA: Erasure did a very interesting album of unplugged renditions of their LESSER known album tracks. It was quite pretty. OMG... we should do FM unplugged wishlist!!??!!!??

[BellaDonna93]

I soooooooo hope that they will record next year, BUT I don't think it'll be done that fast...it surley takes time to record and do a record! :) And I sooo hope that they will tour the world soon agan! After the album (if there's going to be one) is out they have to come here to Europe, Scandinavia, again! :D

You have talked about if this tour was their farwell tour??? I don't think so because if they do a farwell tour they HAVE to tell us that!!! They just can't go out there touring and letting us think that The Mac IS Back!! So, when it comes to the time of the LAST tour, I really hope that they tell us about it...

[steviefan59]

hi guys...i voted no for this poll simply bc i think it will be 2011 b4 they can get enough material ready to record for a new album...i truly believe there will be excellent material by both lindsey and stevie and they will use some of their older unreleased material and rework it into the new album...i will def be looking for a tour in 2011 around summer time so i have my fingers crossed that this will occur...i hope they do a much better job of putting the album together as i also found syw all messed up in the track placements...ur dealing with 2 very dif artists and they are each quite stubborn in their own way but i think stevie tends to give in too much and lets lindsey bully her...i think thats why she insisted lindsey not be the producer of this next album and wasnt happy with syw...as to the mac not having the appeal they had in previous years i think a lot of the unsold seats were due to the ECONOMY not the waning interest in the mac...most of us have had to tighten up our belts this past year and have given up things like concerts and even vacations...hugs pat

[gldstwmn]

And contracts can definitely be "broken"..:wavey:

There is no way Live Nation and FM are about to get into a legal battle. Hell, one of their managers (Irving Azoff) is currently involved in a merger of Live Nation and Ticketmaster. Live Nation will take their lumps from this tour and proceed with caution. I dont even know who is promoting the European shows? Is it Live Nation? The players in the game have changed names (but not faces) so many times in the last 10 years that I can't keep up anymore.

[gldstwmn]

The reality is, fans come in completely different packages, and we all have different opinions.

True. I don't feel like any less of a fan because I didn't go to any shows on this tour. The tickets in my market were at least $150 and I didn't feel like shelling out that kind of money in this economy for a product that I'd seen many times over in 2003 ( and had the time of my life doing BTW).

[gldstwmn]

..What I'm disagreeing with, is the negative idea that is being tossed around about how Fleetwood Mac is on their last legs and performing their "farewell tour".. They are FAR from that status.. ;)

But that's not what he said. He said the only way they could do a monetarily viable tour in the next year or so would be to call it a "Farewell Tour." And I think you're misunderstanding where Luke is coming from. He is stating the facts as he sees and knows them from being in the business. That's all. It's nothing against you, I don't think.

[gldstwmn]

Also, this inside source thing is intriguing. Care to share more about that? It will help us understand you a little more on this topic.

I'm still waiting to hear from the kid that knows Sara Fleetwood. :shrug:

[gldstwmn]

No chance.

Personally, I think they should attempt an Unplugged album and sort the other remasters out.

MIRAGE!!!!!!!! Including all of the outtakes.

[TrueFaith77]

But that's not what he said. He said the only way they could do a monetarily viable tour in the next year or so would be to call it a "Farewell Tour." And I think you're misunderstanding where Luke is coming from. He is stating the facts as he sees and knows them from being in the business. That's all. It's nothing against you, I don't think.

Well, I remember reading someone in this thread saying that these sales were pathetic particularly for a "farewell" tour. But now I can't find that original comment. . .

[TrueFaith77]

MIRAGE!!!!!!!! Including all of the outtakes.

Yes, that would be great. I should start another thread.

[Fannymac]

I think they were not glad with the SYW commercial results (silly, cause no old band can make a blockbuster with new songs, it's very hard though not impossible). But.. I'm just supposing

Actually, the last Eagles CD was a HUGE hit...which HAS to bug the band (particularly Lindsey!), so that might be insentive enough right there!:D

[Fannymac]

Not necessarily. Artists used to release 2 albums a year. Any less than one every year, to me, is lazy. The Pet Shop Boys have released, on average, an album's worth of new music every year this decade. And it's all be superb. Same with Morrissey (since coming out of "retirement" in 2004).

99.9% of ALL artists, be they "classic" or new, have not released an album a year, let alone two, in over two decades!!
This may have been the norm in the '70's, but it went the way of the dinosaur in the early '80's, and I GUARANTEE you will NEVER see it again, at least not through the major labels!!

[Fannymac]

First of all, I'm glad we are on the same page Louie. :)

Also, Luke has a point. Everyone in Mac is 60+ and they haven't had a big hit album for over 10 years. They have to cut the crap and make something really noteworthy if they expect to match the Unleashed tour results... let alone surpass them. It's going to get harder and harder for them to be successful as time goes on just because they are fading more and more. As Stevie lovingly said on Destiny Rules, the typical Mac generation isn't "sitting around smoking dope and watching Billboard to see what they need to buy as their next record!" Even when Stevie and Mac's album quality has been questionable, they were still able to sell because they were somewhat current. They don't have that benefit anymore.

Which basically means that if they're going to put the work into getting another album out, they better as hell make it worth it. Because if they were disappointed with SYW sales, it's not going to be any better this time around. We all love them and will buy anything they put out without a question, but we are a very select group of people, people. They need to work ten times harder to make even a fraction of the impression that they used to make on the music scene. So cut the **** and get writing and recording! They can't go around doing greatest hits tours forever. I will follow this band to my grave so yes, I would be at those shows.... but I'd do it a bit spitefully if they let whatever is left of their creative potential go down the drain. They aren't getting any younger, either.

BRILLIANTLY stated!!!!:thumbsup:

[Fannymac]

Let's face it, we don't have decades left with this band so they need to focus on quality and not quanity. Hopefully the experience of touring together for a year and then heading into the studio will provide a more solid and stable foundation to produce an album from the ground up.

I think the cohesiveness lacking in SYW can absolutely be attributed to the fact that everyone in the band attempted to join forces after being on completely separate paths for what 4-5 years? Maybe a little less? SYW was the first time in a long time they were really coming from four absolutely different places (not to mention the first time without Christine.) Obviously, a break in this duration is not uncommon for this band, but prior to SYW, well maybe at least prior to the Dance, they sort of were all coasting along their separate lives, but sort of at a similar pace. But in 2001-2002, at 50 something, they are all at such different milestones - Stevie in unattached and focused on her solo career, Lindsey is newly married with a growing family, Mick has his new girls, and John is raising a teenager but would probably rather be sailing. You get where I'm going. They were all really doing such different things in their lives, which probably wasn't so true when creating studio albums before this, and if it was, probably wasn't as evident as it was when creating SYW. Really, other then being in a band with legendary history what was common amongst them at that point? All this, plus the experience of doing an album 25 years past their heyday must have contributed to the lack of synergy and resulted in what seemed to be a collaboration of two artist's solo albums.

But, maybe, just maybe, if they can take the momentum that they have had by working with each other over the past year and being intertwined with each other's lives, and truly believe that a studio album can be a positive experience, we can see something wonderful from them in the future. :thumbsup:

Once again, VERY well said!!!;)

[holidayroad]

What they should do is work on the next album as if it will be the last album the public ever gets to hear from them, because at their ages, it very well may be.....

[TrueFaith77]

What they should do is work on the next album as if it will be the last album the public ever gets to hear from them, because at their ages, it very well may be.....

That's right! But that is the essence of the challenge:

1. It has to be great
2. It has to be made quickly

But, seriously, I just think they should sit in a studio recording music and releasing it until it's the end.

[louielouie2000]

99.9% of ALL artists, be they "classic" or new, have not released an album a year, let alone two, in over two decades!!
This may have been the norm in the '70's, but it went the way of the dinosaur in the early '80's, and I GUARANTEE you will NEVER see it again, at least not through the major labels!!

Not necessarily. My favorite current artist, Joseph Arthur, put out no fewer than 5 albums last year. All with a completely different feel. And Joseph is said to have a backlog of hundreds of unreleased songs. He is on a major label, and writes songs for movies and TV shows on top of his album releases; all while juggling a side band, the Lonely Astronauts, and making guest appearances on albums. He also is a visual artist, and even has his own section in the Museum of Modern Art in New York. Yes, there is a formula that modern day record companies prefer to lock people into... but if you are headstrong enough, you can certainly break through that.

And we know that Stevie alone has a backlog of around 50 unreleased songs (who knows, maybe much more). Lindsey put out two solo records within the last few years, so we know the potential is there for the kids to be more prolific. They just chose to let their personal issues and egos get in the way of new creativity. Actually, I don't think it fair to say it's the entire band's fault. I'm sure Mick and John wouldn't protest to working more often. And Lindsey seems to be enjoying his newfound 'boutique' success immensely, and is becoming extremely prolific. I think the blame lies squarely with Ms Nicks. She just can't get over 30 year old issues with Lindsey. More importantly, I don't think she is taking declining sales and being an aging sex symbol very well either.

The reason why I may seem negative so often is because I'm lamenting all the lost momentum that this band has. I think Stevie's and Lindsey's latest solo albums are the best of their respective careers. I think their individual songwriting talents are just getting better with age. They have so much potential, and it's wasted because of REALLY silly reasons. They just throw up their arms and surrender to drama, and they're in their 60s... it's more than a bit ridiculous. The really subpar product we got from SYW for these DUMB reasons just angers me. Trust me, I love the band and will until my last breath. It's because of this love of the band and it's members that I get so bent outta shape. I simply want more GOOD music dammit!!! :D

[gldstwmn]

Not necessarily. My favorite current artist, Joseph Arthur, put out no fewer than 5 albums last year. All with a completely different feel. And Joseph is said to have a backlog of hundreds of unreleased songs. He is on a major label, and writes songs for movies and TV shows on top of his album releases; all while juggling a side band, the Lonely Astronauts, and making guest appearances on albums. He also is a visual artist, and even has his own section in the Museum of Modern Art in New York. Yes, there is a formula that modern day record companies prefer to lock people into... but if you are headstrong enough, you can certainly break through that.

This guy's an artist while we're talking about rock stars here. Big difference. :laugh:

[APerfectLie]

I voted yes mainly because I think if FM started in January and really worked their asses off, they could definitely get a new album out in late 2010 or early 2011. Will they do it? Who knows. FM is completely unpredictable and since they aren't a new band, they don't really have to be in a hurry to get a new album out in order to get their name out there. So I don't know if they will get one out, but I do know one thing and that is that 2010 needs to be the beginning of a new era for FM and Stevie. Stevie did Crystal Visions CD, tour and Soundstage and FM did their Unleashed tour and both were all based on their greatest hits. I think 2009 needs to be the end of all the reflective greatest hits stuff. I think in 2010 they need to hit the studio and make a kick ass record, that not only appeals to their die hard fans but also to a whole new generation of people. They need a new album, new setlist, and new marketing. Fleetwood Mac needs to be on the radio, they need to be doing interviews, they need to be on MTV and VH1, they need to be on the cover of Rolling Stone and on the cover of Alternative Press. They need a twitter, a myspace, and a continually updated website. They need advertisements on the TV's at Target, Wal-Mart, and Best Buy. They need to stop acting like the superband that they are and assuming they already have a fanbase. They can use their legacy to their advantage, but that can't be their main focus and they really need to get their name out there. I am 20 years old and I feel that FM has never been marketed to me. If I hadn't been a big time FM fan for years, I probably wouldn't have even known FM was on tour right now. I feel they miss so many marketing opportunities its ridiculous. So even though I desperately want a new FM record as soon as possible, I think they would be better off going into the studio and working their asses off to make a kick ass record and then go out and market this record and how amazing it is for a few months before its release to really build up anticipation for it. They need to make their album the most anticipated album of 2011. And all it takes it some really good music and some really good marketing. It doesn't matter if they saturated the touring market with Unleashed, the music store market has been severely depleted of FM for years, and if they can make the new album sell they will have no problem with a new tour.

[daniellaaarisen]

Not necessarily. My favorite current artist, Joseph Arthur, put out no fewer than 5 albums last year. All with a completely different feel. And Joseph is said to have a backlog of hundreds of unreleased songs. He is on a major label, and writes songs for movies and TV shows on top of his album releases; all while juggling a side band, the Lonely Astronauts, and making guest appearances on albums. He also is a visual artist, and even has his own section in the Museum of Modern Art in New York. Yes, there is a formula that modern day record companies prefer to lock people into... but if you are headstrong enough, you can certainly break through that.

I love him. "Honey and the Moon" is a godsend.

[michelej1]

Fleetwood Mac shouldn't be laughing. Live Nation was far from satisfied with the results of the Unleashed tour. Barring a "farewell" tour, when it comes to the ridiculously high up-front fee they've been accustomed to the last two tours, they have ZERO leverage for such a tour in 2010. So, pardon me for being a "Debbie Downer" for considering things like "facts" & "trends" and impersonal concepts like "over-saturation" when discussing the band's future- it doesn't make me any less of a fan. ESPECIALLY since its generally accepted by most (not just me) that the band basically exists in 2009 to make money... and where do 99.9% of all bands make most of their money?



I don't think the band is just in it to make money, but I find the objective bases for your conclusions very convincing. It's certainly a dollars game. We know it and Azoff knows it.

Maybe they can do the sheds next summer, if they have some product to promote. Even if it's just that Rumours CD/DVD, but 2010 definitely does seem to be pushing their luck. They haven't forgotten the sting of the 2nd leg of the SYW tour.

Michele

[David]

You have talked about if this tour was their farwell tour??? I don't think so because if they do a farwell tour they HAVE to tell us that!!! This question is for anyone: How would a hypothetical farewell tour be different from this year's Unleashed tour? What would be different? The set list? The personnel? The size of the venture? The marketing? Any other aesthetic aspect? (The lighting? The arrangements?)

My questions are just about all rhetorical, in case that wasn't made clear. I don't think anything would be different from this year's tour. So, subsequently, who cares what they call it in 2010 or 2011 or 2012?

[michelej1]

This question is for anyone: How would a hypothetical farewell tour be different from this year's Unleashed tour? What would be different? The set list? The personnel? The size of the venture? The marketing? Any other aesthetic aspect? (The lighting? The arrangements?)

My questions are just about all rhetorical, in case that wasn't made clear. I don't think anything would be different from this year's tour. So, subsequently, who cares what they call it in 2010 or 2011 or 2012?

But farewell means something, as we saw when Cher said farewell for two years, before signing a contract with Caesar's.

Are you telling me that if Fleetwood Mac said, "See us now, because this is the last time you'll get to see us before we die or you die, that wouldn't sell a ticket to you?"

Well, what if they brought Carlos back? Would that change your mind? Then, it would be different personnel, on top of being your last chance to see them before you keel over. You callin' Ticketmaster yet?

Michele

[David]

Well, what if they brought Carlos back? Would that change your mind? Then, it would be different personnel, on top of being your last chance to see them before you keel over. You callin' Ticketmaster yet? All right, knock it off.

I'd go if John Kinney were to go. I have a little score to settle with him ... something about having been banned from his stupid chat room many years ago (all for referring to one of the great James Bond heroines, Pussy Galore).

[daniellaaarisen]

All right, knock it off.

I'd go if John Kinney were to go. I have a little score to settle with him ... something about having been banned from his stupid chat room many years ago (all for referring to one of the great James Bond heroines, Pussy Galore).

I'm still an admin of that chat! I haven't been in for years but I remember banning people. Ha.

[jbrownsjr]

For the "greatest hits tour" maybe... NOT for any new materials! I know I'd race out to by a ticket for this one, knowing it's all new music! Haven't thought about that one did ya?:)

yeahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.... NO

[SorcererJP]

I'm still an admin of that chat! I haven't been in for years but I remember banning people. Ha.

Yeah, the Ledge/Nicksfix chats on IRC....always planned on a sundaynight...alas for me in the f*cking (ban me ban me i said f...!) middle of the night ;-)

Those were the days :-)

[LukeA]

Just catching up now...

So, apparently-

Fleetwood Mac shouldn't be laughing. Live Nation was far from satisfied with the results of the Unleashed tour. Barring a "farewell" tour, when it comes to the ridiculously high up-front fee they've been accustomed to the last two tours, they have ZERO leverage for such a tour in 2010.

means

What I'm disagreeing with, is the negative idea that is being tossed around about how Fleetwood Mac is on their last legs and performing their "farewell tour".. They are FAR from that status.. ;)

& more hilariously

And actually he did state that, about this next tour being Fleetwood Mac's "farewell tour".. That isn't going to happen for a LONG time to come..

WHERE DO I SAY FM'S NEXT TOUR NEEDS TO BE/ONLY HOPE IS THEIR FAREWELL TOUR? I clearly said that if Fleetwood Mac wants to tour in 2010 at the same venues for the same fee next year, it would take a few extreme developments to facilitate such an arrangement (and not just a new studio album).

You want to talk about bullying? How about blatantly and inexcusably misinterpreting what someone says for the purpose of belittling them? Jesus.

[holidayroad]

I think what would help Fleetwood Mac sell more albums and tickets is for them to interact more with their fans (at least in the U.S.). In the pics that have been posted on here recently from concerts outside the U.S., FMac seems to pose more willlingly for photos with fans, etc. They need to get out in the audience some at concerts. They need to show their fans that they are honored that they came to see them. For example, My husband is a fan of Rick Springfield and in the recent concert footage I've seen of Rick, he seems SO appreciative of his fans. He interacts with them, gets out in the audience, acts like it's the best time he's ever had! He's about the same age as Lindsey and Stevie. If he can do it, so can they. In no way am I trying to compare Rick and FMac musically. I'm just trying to say that in the music business today, it is a necessity to make your fans feel like they matter.

[David]

You want to talk about bullying? How about blatantly and inexcusably misinterpreting what someone says for the purpose of belittling them? Jesus.The "positive" people are often the most negative on the board --- toward other board members.

But let's have peace & a veritable cornucopia of opinion, I say.

[Steviefan49]

The "positive" people are often the most negative on the board --- toward other board members.

But let's have peace & a veritable cornucopia of opinion, I say.

Haha.. time to agree to disagree again... Completely the other way around..(Obviously) :p

[Steviefan49]

Just catching up now...

So, apparently-



means



& more hilariously



WHERE DO I SAY FM'S NEXT TOUR NEEDS TO BE/ONLY HOPE IS THEIR FAREWELL TOUR? I clearly said that if Fleetwood Mac wants to tour in 2010 at the same venues for the same fee next year, it would take a few extreme developments to facilitate such an arrangement (and not just a new studio album).

You want to talk about bullying? How about blatantly and inexcusably misinterpreting what someone says for the purpose of belittling them? Jesus.

Sorry.. but you seriously have me laughing..."Only Hope it's their Farewell tour"? I can't quit laughing... Hey.. You ever thought about going to a Country western board? :laugh:

I far from misinterpreted what you said.. I got it spot on, which was why I said what I did...

Have a wonderful weekend MY FRIEND! :wavey:

[Steviefan49]

I think what would help Fleetwood Mac sell more albums and tickets is for them to interact more with their fans (at least in the U.S.). In the pics that have been posted on here recently from concerts outside the U.S., FMac seems to pose more willlingly for photos with fans, etc. They need to get out in the audience some at concerts. They need to show their fans that they are honored that they came to see them. For example, My husband is a fan of Rick Springfield and in the recent concert footage I've seen of Rick, he seems SO appreciative of his fans. He interacts with them, gets out in the audience, acts like it's the best time he's ever had! He's about the same age as Lindsey and Stevie. If he can do it, so can they. In no way am I trying to compare Rick and FMac musically. I'm just trying to say that in the music business today, it is a necessity to make your fans feel like they matter.

Totally agree with you...;)

[starshine]

Nope! It takes them around 18 months+ to record and release these days. That means they would have had to start recording this past June for a Christmas 2010 release. They are supposedly meeting in January to discuss recording again. For ****s and giggles, let's say they decide to begin recording a new album during that meeting (which at this point, I am highly doubtful of). They'll take a good 6 months off after January to recover from their world tour, and spend that time searching for a recording venue and a producer. With all the egos involved, that will be no easy task getting everyone to agree on common ground for all this. So we're looking at an earliest possible start date for recording in June 2010. That means an earliest possible release date of around Christmas 2011. And I'm being very conservative... I think it will likely take longer because everyone will say they need a big break after the tour, then they'll fight and bitch about a recording venue, and ESPECIALLY a producer. Mark my words, that will be a big showdown, and could sink the project altogether. And this is all assuming they decide in January that they really want to move forward with a new album at all! :rolleyes:You took the words right out of my mouth......how better could it be said...totally agree....I picked NO....I personally don't see anything happing with them....period....heck what happend to the uptenth Rumours re-issue with DVD we were 'suppose' to get anyway....if that can't be worked out how is anything totally 'new' gonna be worked out......I just don't see it happening......it is whatever it is.....:sorry::distress: