Article: "Unfinished Business"

[CADreaming]

October 18, 2009

The Sunday Times

Fleetwood Mac's unfinished business (http://entertainment.timesonline.co.uk/tol/arts_and_entertainment/music/article6874608.ece?token=null&offset=0&page=1)

If the bust-ups are over, Stevie Nicks and Lindsey Buckingham still have unfinished business as their latest tour hits the UK

Dan Cairns

Mick Fleetwood, 6ft 6in of military bearing, white beard, gold watch chain and pinstriped waistcoat, sits back in an armchair that can barely contain his extensive frame. “You know what I’d love?” the Fleetwood Mac drummer says to a hovering assistant, eyeing the bottle of water in front of him with some disdain, “A little glass of red.” In the old days, that little glass of red would have been the first of many libations, accompanied by copious quantities of cocaine: when the band recorded Rumours, a velvet bag full of the drug was kept beneath the studio mixing desk, for dipping into at will.

Nowadays, the group’s remaining co-founder is drug-free, and, though he still carries about him an unmistakable whiff of volcanic unpredictability, the 62-year-old seems to be settling into his role as the calm centre of the Fleetwood Mac storm. During the band’s mid-1970s commercial heyday, he served briefly as their unofficial manager, which, considering that he was running amok on brandy and cocaine, probably says a lot.

Thirty-plus years on, the group have individual managers, together with an impressive number of helpmeets, chauffeurs and eagle-eyed enablers. The band appear to travel for the most part separately, with their own retinues. What Lindsey Buckingham will later describe as the “residue” of historic dysfunction still requires placating. They could surely, I suggest to Fleetwood, just sort it all out themselves, couldn’t they?

“It could be a lot easier,” he agrees with a characteristic chuckle. “You know, make a decision and move on. We all used to be so much more in control of our own destinies, we just bundled along ourselves and did pretty well — considering. I always call the managers, and I don’t mean it nastily, the Gang of Five [Christine McVie, who left the band in 1998, is still represented], like a kind of Maoist thing. So, yes, things take a little more time now. But, you know, we’re still here.”

Fleetwood is holding court in a hotel suite in Copenhagen, the city where, several days later, the four surviving members of the Rumours line-up — Fleetwood and his fellow original bandmate John McVie, plus Stevie Nicks and Buckingham, who both joined in 1974 — are due to kick off the European leg of their current world tour. To accompany the dates, a double album of greatest hits is being released, featuring the songs that make up the majority of the set-list they will perform. It is the first time they have headed out on the road without a new studio album to promote, but that, says Fleetwood, has its advantages. “There’s a lot less of that pressure, of having to rehearse a load of new songs, then force people to listen to them.” Does he wonder why they didn’t try it years ago?

“I always joke with Lindsey,” he replies, “that we’re probably the worst run but most ongoingly successful music franchise in the business, if you look at what we don’t do and what we could have done. If you were a cynic and went, ‘Huh, they’re just doing it for the money,’ it’s like, ‘Hang on a minute, I wish we had.’”

None of this is said with any apparent bitterness: Fleetwood has the avuncular-referee role down pat. He admits the biggest pleasure he derives from the hits-only set list is the opportunity it gives him to place the band’s key albums in some sort of perspective. The biggest surprise, he says, is how linked they strike him as being: the feeling-their-way radio pop/lingering blues hybrid of the new line-up’s self-titled 1975 debut, the soft-rock masterclass of Rumours and the wildly experimental disjointedness of 1979’s Tusk. And how uncategorisable. “As poppy as our legacy is in many ways,” he says, “I think, equally, there’s a darkness about it. We’ve never done coy and cute.”

The tension Fleetwood admits marred the band’s previous world tour — to promote 2003’s Say You Will album — is, he believes, less evident now. Not that things don’t remain unsaid: this is Fleetwood Mac, after all. But there is still no chance, he says, of recruiting a group therapist, of the type documented in the Metallica film Some Kind of Monster. “At various times,” Fleetwood laughs, “I think we’ve all been to one on our own. When it sort of imploded with emotion was when all of us were besotted with emotional overload, so nobody could sort of take the back seat and come in impartially. But it’s like kids in a playground. Last week someone was your best friend, and this week they’re inviting someone else round for a play.”

Several days earlier, in a different suite at the same hotel, one of the other kids in the Mac playground reclines with a Lady Bertram-like torpor on a giant sofa, her eyes hidden behind vintage Aviator shades. It would simply not be possible to talk to either Nicks or Buckingham about their love affair, which famously crashed and burned during the Rumours sessions, in tandem with the collapse of the McVies’ marriage, without reopening a can of worms. “Residue”, Buckingham called it. I’m not sure that does it justice.

“Lindsey is definitely still angry with me,” Nicks says in her dusky drawl. “Absolutely. He’s never quite understood why we broke up. Even though he’s married and he’s very happy, and he’s a great dad, I think that he never really forgave me for breaking up our relationship.”

Long characterised as an away-with-the-fairies fruitcake, Nicks strikes me as having a core of steel, no matter her languor or penchant for woolly soliloquy. By her own admission the only member of the band who could rival Fleetwood — with whom she had an affair — for hedonism, she long ago conquered her drug addiction, then endured a lengthy and briefly life-threatening dependency on the tranquillisers she had been prescribed to wean her off cocaine. These days, she appears to be physically somewhat fragile, but the mischievous candour remains. She tells me she finally went to see a psychologist “about five years ago, a really sweet little lady, and we were just talking about my life, and I was telling her about those years, when Lindsey and I first moved to LA, and I was a waitress, a cleaning lady, and anything else I could do to pay our rent, and I said to her, ‘But there was something about those years that I really loved.’ And she said, ‘Well, in many ways, Stevie, the day you joined Fleetwood Mac was the saddest day of your life — because it was the day you stopped being the caretaker.’ You can imagine, there was a real big silence in the room when she said that”.

When Nicks and Buckingham joined Fleetwood Mac, they were at the tail end of a four-year struggle to make it as a duo, and heavily in debt. But they both to this day believe that they would have made it on their own terms, and it is this sense of unfinished business and unrealised dreams, together with nostalgia for a time before what Nicks calls the “very fast and very hard” ascent to stardom they experienced with Fleetwood Mac, that appears to haunt them still.

“It was scary,” Nicks continues. “To not have enough money to even file a tax return, then to have so much, eight months later, that you had to hire someone to file it for you. All of a sudden you have a big, huge house, and you end up filling up your time, doing drugs and just getting lost in that whole world. I didn’t any longer have the responsibility of having to watch out for Lindsey. We all just stayed in great places, and we got room service. Nobody had to cook, nobody had to clean up the kitchen.”

She looks suddenly lost. “We joined Fleetwood Mac, we made a record in three months, put it out, went on the road in May. We did a four-month tour, we got home and we had close to $1m between us. What Lindsey grieves for, in my opinion, is, if he had the chance to go back and decide, when we were beginning the second Buckingham-Nicks record and we got asked to join Fleetwood Mac, he would not join.” Again, she pauses. “If we had not moved to LA, would Lindsey and I have gotten married and had kids? Probably.”

The man she refers to, and whom she can, on one level, still not let go of, sits in a dressing room, legs up on the chair in the lotus position, the tension crackling off him as audibly as it does off his music. Easily the most uncomfortable interviewee — however courteous — of the three, the band’s 60-year-old sonic architect answers in carefully structured, emotionally arid chunks, cool where Nicks is confessional.

“When we first got together to talk about the tour,” he says, “because Stevie had some trust issues in terms of her perception of how things ended up at the end of the last tour, my comment was, ‘Stevie, if nothing else, you and I have known each other since high school, and we need to have this thing end up in a way that dignifies how it started.’ And you wouldn’t think that, at this point in our lives, it would be a work in progress. You’d think that things would be fine. But there is still an evolution going on.”

If he shares a similar degree of regret with Nicks about what they lost, rather than gained, by joining the band, he hides it well. His answers are startlingly impersonal. “When we made the decision to join, we both gave up something that had been more essentially ourselves. And it wasn’t just giving up the synthesis between the two of us in terms of how we wrote together, sang together. It was Stevie losing herself to having been singled out as Stevie Nicks, in capital letters. This is one of the things I think has been hardest for her over the years, having sort of been asked to be this person who’s out front, the pressure of that. And what I gave up was a great deal of my style as a guitarist. I mean, I had to adapt to an existing situation — something as fundamental as changing the guitar I used because it didn’t fit into the pre-existing sound.”

Watching Nicks apparently goading Buckingham during the rehearsal later, complaining about the loudness of his guitar and asking for further ear protection, you rewind to that answer — about his “style as a guitarist”, for God’s sake — and begin to see why she might feel the need to poke him for a reaction. Buckingham cuts a moody, needy figure, the human equivalent of a Just Married car, with others forced to bang and clatter along the road behind him. From his drum stool, Fleetwood observes the scene impassively, a weather eye on the sort of playground scrap he has doubtless witnessed many times before. Then the band strike up the opening chords of Dreams, Nicks purrs “Now here you go again”, and you think, that’s why we still bother. And why they do, too. Heaven knows, though, they don’t make it easy.

The Very Best of Fleetwood Mac is released tomorrow on Warners. The British tour opens in Glasgow on Thursday

[TrueFaith77]

Really interesting article. Really cuts through Lindsey to his core. Ouch.

[holidayroad]

[QUOTE=CADreaming;847930
“When we first got together to talk about the tour,” he says, “because Stevie had some trust issues in terms of her perception of how things ended up at the end of the last tour, my comment was, ‘Stevie, if nothing else, you and I have known each other since high school, and we need to have this thing end up in a way that dignifies how it started.’

When you read this, you have to wonder if Lindsey meant the end of the tour or the end of Fleetwood Mac....

[trackaghost]

That's a great article, but it made me feel sad. Everything points to this being the end I think.

[CADreaming]

“When we first got together to talk about the tour,” he says, “because Stevie had some trust issues in terms of her perception of how things ended up at the end of the last tour, my comment was, ‘Stevie, if nothing else, you and I have known each other since high school, and we need to have this thing end up in a way that dignifies how it started.’

When you read this, you have to wonder if Lindsey meant the end of the tour or the end of Fleetwood Mac....

Well, how did it start? ;)

[holidayroad]

Well, how did it start? ;)

I see what you mean!:laugh:

[daniellaaarisen]

I feel like I don't know much about the "tensions" going on during the Say You Will tour. All three of them acknowledge that the band, specifically Stevie, wasn't so happy, but I've only ever heard her complain about being the only woman in the band without Christine...

On another note, I don't believe Lindsey's comment ("we need to have this thing end up in a way that dignifies how it started") can really be taken as an indicator that he's anticipating "the end." All he really explicitly said is that when the band "ends" (whatever that may mean), it must be "dignified." From the tone of his portion of the interview, it doesn't sound like he thinks they have achieved that yet. :shrug: Somebody better pull out this article if he ever starts backing out... "Lindsey, if you were saying THIS at the end of Unleashed, do you really think you guys were giving dignity to ANYTHING?"

[CADreaming]

I feel like I don't know much about the "tensions" going on during the Say You Will tour. All three of them acknowledge that the band, specifically Stevie, wasn't so happy, but I've only ever heard her complain about being the only woman in the band without Christine...

On another note, I don't believe Lindsey's comment ("we need to have this thing end up in a way that dignifies how it started") can really be taken as an indicator that he's anticipating "the end." All he really explicitly said is that when the band "ends" (whatever that may mean), it must be "dignified." From the tone of his portion of the interview, it doesn't sound like he thinks they have achieved that yet. :shrug: Somebody better pull out this article if he ever starts backing out... "Lindsey, if you were saying THIS at the end of Unleashed, do you really think you guys were giving dignity to ANYTHING?"

Stevie, according to "reports" and "interviews" about the SYW tour, said she was going through menopause, had hip problems and I guess was miffed at Lindsey due to his testosterone levels (although I think it had more to do with her testosterone levels...) ;) Apparently, there was also a lot of high drama on the tour, peripherally related, but it all filtered down to the front people anyway... (of course!)

LOL about pulling out the interview to show LB!! I wish we had the opportunity - we could pull out a million of 'em to show to him, Stevie and Mick!!! :laugh:

[michelej1]

“It could be a lot easier,” he agrees with a characteristic chuckle. “You know, make a decision and move on. We all used to be so much more in control of our own destinies, we just bundled along ourselves and did pretty well — considering. I always call the managers, and I don’t mean it nastily, the Gang of Five [Christine McVie, who left the band in 1998, is still represented],

But is John represented? Last time I saw any credits, he wasn't.

Michele

[michelej1]

This is a great interview if for nothing else but the fact Stevie was complaining about the guitar in rehearsal and saying she needed more ear protection. Classic.

Of course, that's not the change in his guitar style Lindsey meant. Can I get the name of that psychiatrist Stevie went to see? She might be better than Lindsey's psychiatrist. If Lindsey keeps talking about that guitar pick I myself will have a nervous breakdown.

Seriously, unless John and Mick also molested him when they asked him to use a pick, I don't know why it was such a traumatic experience. Asking him to change guitars. John playing bass on every song for some inexplicable reason and that woman playing piano all over the place and being feminine and everything. How much more could my guy have been forced to stand? Lindsey is one strong man.

Michele

[goldustsongbird]

away-with-the-fairies fruitcake.

:D

[daniellaaarisen]

This is a great interview if for nothing else but the fact Stevie was complaining about the guitar in rehearsal and saying she needed more ear protection. Classic.

Of course, that's not the change in his guitar style Lindsey meant. Can I get the name of that psychiatrist Stevie went to see? She might be better than Lindsey's psychiatrist. If Lindsey keeps talking about that guitar pick I myself will have a nervous breakdown.

Seriously, unless John and Mick also molested him when they asked him to use a pick, I don't know why it was such a traumatic experience. Asking him to change guitars. John playing bass on every song for some inexplicable reason and that woman playing piano all over the place and being feminine and everything. How much more could my guy have been forced to stand? Lindsey is one strong man.

Michele

The best part? We'll all be dying of laughter in six months if/when they DO actually start recording..... because Lindsey will be telling the press that it was painstakingly difficult to commit to another record but he's willing to tackle all the adversity and everything. I mean, after all, Fleetwood Mac has always been a ****show, right? He could've let this pick thing be the final straw but no-- Lindsey Buckingham ALWAYS perseveres.





away-with-the-fairies fruitcake.

:D

Possibly my favorite part of the article.

[CADreaming]

But is John represented? Last time I saw any credits, he wasn't.

Michele

I swear the last time I saw something, John was also repped by Sanctuary, but God knows I don't remember where. Have to dig.

Lindsey is one strong man.

Michele

Bwaaaa!!! :thumbsup:

away-with-the-fairies fruitcake.

:D

ME TOO! Hysterical.

[michelej1]

Bwaaaa!!! :thumbsup:


And you know I use that line because it is one of my favorite videos, even if it is really bad quality. I just love the way Stevie comes up to him and takes the guitar and so does Christine and then Christine takes the guitar and Stevie is rubbing Lindsey's back as they walk off stage. So sweet.

Michele

[CADreaming]

And you know I use that line because it is one of my favorite videos, even if it is really bad quality. I just love the way Stevie comes up to him and takes the guitar and so does Christine and then Christine takes the guitar and Stevie is rubbing Lindsey's back as they walk off stage. So sweet.

Michele

You know I love that too...although I do think Lindsey looked irritated. (could have been pain though...) :(

[michelej1]

You know I love that too...although I do think Lindsey looked irritated. (could have been pain though...) :(

Lindsey really looked out of it. Drugged -- and not the usual marijuana:laugh:.

You know, I realize I'm just being sentimental here, but it seems to me that whenever an interviewer asks Lindsey a broad question about the members of Fleetwood Mac, he always answers in terms of 5. Then, he might follow up and clarify and say that Christine burned her bridges, but the first instinct seems to be to include her and think of 5 people.

I remember first thinking this after the SYW tour around 2006 when he was promoting UTS. He was asked if he kept in touch with FM members and he said that he heard from Christine about once a year and then he said that he and John were never really that close anyway and that comment left me with the impression that when you say Fleetwood Mac to him, even if you use the term in the current tense, not the past, that he was still not used to not thinking of Chris too.

Michele

[hippilil86]

Lindsey really looked out of it. Drugged -- and not the usual marijuana:laugh:.



I'm guessing that he was on some pretty strong painkillers at the time. There was probably a "healthy" combination of painkillers, alcohol, and pot going on there.

[CADreaming]

Lindsey really looked out of it. Drugged -- and not the usual marijuana:laugh:.

You know, I realize I'm just being sentimental here, but it seems to me that whenever an interviewer asks Lindsey a broad question about the members of Fleetwood Mac, he always answers in terms of 5. Then, he might follow up and clarify and say that Christine burned her bridges, but the first instinct seems to be to include her and think of 5 people.

I remember first thinking this after the SYW tour around 2006 when he was promoting UTS. He was asked if he kept in touch with FM members and he said that he heard from Christine about once a year and then he said that he and John were never really that close anyway and that comment left me with the impression that when you say Fleetwood Mac to him, even if you use the term in the current tense, not the past, that he was still not used to not thinking of Chris too.

Michele

That's true, Michele - and Stevie does it as well. Although, since I wax nostalgic for BN, I always love the AOL session for SYW when Lindsey said it only took 25 years for them to do what they really wanted to do anyway and Stevie cracked a smile. I felt like he was a bit excited by the prospect of getting back in more of a BN groove and very ok with Chris' departure.

[vivfox]

These days, she appears to be physically somewhat fragile, but the mischievous candour remains. She tells me she finally went to see a psychologist “about five years ago, a really sweet little lady, and we were just talking about my life, and I was telling her about those years, when Lindsey and I first moved to LA, and I was a waitress, a cleaning lady, and anything else I could do to pay our rent, and I said to her, ‘But there was something about those years that I really loved.’ And she said, ‘Well, in many ways, Stevie, the day you joined Fleetwood Mac was the saddest day of your life — because it was the day you stopped being the caretaker.’ You can imagine, there was a real big silence in the room when she said that”.

Great article! Thanks for posting.
The saddest day of her life? I don't think so!!!

[StreetAngel86]

Well, how did it start? ;)

WORD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D

Interviewer: Could you please elaborate on that incident?

[Kena]

You know I love that too...although I do think Lindsey looked irritated. (could have been pain though...) :(

What video is this from? Must watch immediately...

[~GoldDustWoman~]

They seem to be the most dysfunctional band known to man, but why does everything have to be about all the negativity? The sheer fact that they are together still should make the papers after all the craziness that has gone on over the years. As for SnL, i think that whomever the pissed off party is, should move on! Although the fact that they work together doesn't make that easy i'm sure. Also i don't think either one has gotten closure from the other over the breakup cause they still write about each other in song!

[michelej1]

What video is this from? Must watch immediately...

I think it's Largo 1978. This is the end of the show as they're walking off the stage. Lindsey played through his spinal tap wound and Stevie said, "Lindsey is one strong man." It's a boot that's been traded around. I've only seen really bad quality video.

Michele

[daniellaaarisen]

I think it's Largo 1978. This is the end of the show as they're walking off the stage. Lindsey played through his spinal tap wound and Stevie said, "Lindsey is one strong man." It's a boot that's been traded around. I've only seen really bad quality video.

Michele

You were right, Michele.

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[Kena]

Humm, I wonder if Stevie kissed it and made it all better?:xoxo:

[BellaDonna93]

That's a great article, but it made me feel sad. Everything points to this being the end I think.

Made me feel a little sad too, BUT if it was the end then why would Mick always scream at the end of the shows "The Mac is back!!!!" :blob1:
So how should it be??? Stevie says there's going to be a meeting in January about a new album and Lindsey says this is the end, or what???? No, it's impossible! The Mac never ends, we know that, but when Stevie's 75, we can start talking about that, LOL :laugh: I hope Stevie's right and that they will rcord a new album, hopefully next year!!!

[Nico]

Thanks for posting that video. I've always loved the way Stevie says that, and yes LB seems out of it during this performance but after reading about his situation in that CAH book, I'm surprised he even made it on stage.

Anyway, yeah, this interview...it's difficult to really have much more to add to what already has been said here. Stevie's world shattered once she joined FM, Lindsey's true personality/feelings are apparently masked behind cliche, unemotional phrases and he perseverates on stuff that he consistently mentions in interviews, Christine left, Mick is Mick, and John isn't even mentioned.:shrug:

There is just so much drama with this group that probably doesn't need to be there. Perhaps on top of all the individual psychiatrists they should have group therapy sessions where they let this all out to each other's faces, but why do I feel that that would probably just be Lindsey and Stevie and everyone else just sitting and watching?

I've said it before and I'll say it again: they are seriously overgrown children in so many ways, but I still love them.

[Musicman408]

I'll tell you what, this is the most serious/intense talks of a new album that we've had here since I've been a member, which in ways exciting. Although of course, we really have o idea what the Mac is up to in terms of their thinking about this new album. I really do not think (and God knows don't hope) that this is the Mac's last project. To me anyway, it just doesn't seem grand enough to me to be the last straw. Now although I would never expect, nor really want the Mac to go all out like U2 has done for their current tour, I really do think that their "farewell" would be grander than what they are currently doing.

While on the topic of farewells, I don't really think the Mac will ever do a "farewell" type of tour and really stick with it. They're the kind of band that always seems to keep coming back, even if it takes several years for thing to re-materialize again.

So, I'm keeping a positive outlook on things. New album, and touring!!! Go Mac!!!:]

[CADreaming]

While on the topic of farewells, I don't really think the Mac will ever do a "farewell" type of tour and really stick with it. They're the kind of band that always seems to keep coming back, even if it takes several years for thing to re-materialize again.

So, I'm keeping a positive outlook on things. New album, and touring!!! Go Mac!!!:]

I wouldn't count out a real "farewell" tour. I remember a little over a year ago reading how they were in fact building up to a huge farewell tour. Can you imagine what kind of revenue they would generate by putting that kind of label on a tour? No way in the world any of them would turn that down - I don't care how sentimental you are (ahem, Mick) - even sentimentality has its price...

So, perhaps all of these things will be marketed together - a new album, a cd/dvd re-release of Rumours, and a Fleetwood Mac Farewell Tour... it's a thought. And, one that I'm sure has not escaped Irving Azoff and Howard Kaufman.

Btw, if anyone's listening - the 35th anniversary (December 24th we're told) of the BN joining FM is just around the corner. I wouldn't mind some kind of release to honor that...

[Musicman408]

I wouldn't count out a real "farewell" tour. I remember a little over a year ago reading how they were in fact building up to a huge farewell tour. Can you imagine what kind of revenue they would generate by putting that kind of label on a tour? No way in the world any of them would turn that down - I don't care how sentimental you are (ahem, Mick) - even sentimentality has its price...

So, perhaps all of these things will be marketed together - a new album, a cd/dvd re-release of Rumours, and a Fleetwood Mac Farewell Tour... it's a thought. And, one that I'm sure has not escaped Irving Azoff and Howard Kaufman.

Btw, if anyone's listening - the 35th anniversary (December 24th we're told) of the BN joining FM is just around the corner. I wouldn't mind some kind of release to honor that...

Buckingham Nicks released on CD!!!!:blob2:

[David]

Seriously, unless John and Mick also molested him when they asked him to use a pick, I don't know why it was such a traumatic experience. Asking him to change guitars.I can't speak for Lindsey's trauma, per se, but it's an unspoken law among rock musicians that they don't tell other bandmates what to play with or on. On the rare occasions that this happens, friction results.

[BellaDonna93]

I wouldn't count out a real "farewell" tour. I remember a little over a year ago reading how they were in fact building up to a huge farewell tour. Can you imagine what kind of revenue they would generate by putting that kind of label on a tour? No way in the world any of them would turn that down - I don't care how sentimental you are (ahem, Mick) - even sentimentality has its price...

So, perhaps all of these things will be marketed together - a new album, a cd/dvd re-release of Rumours, and a Fleetwood Mac Farewell Tour... it's a thought. And, one that I'm sure has not escaped Irving Azoff and Howard Kaufman.

Btw, if anyone's listening - the 35th anniversary (December 24th we're told) of the BN joining FM is just around the corner. I wouldn't mind some kind of release to honor that...

This tour is big, if you ask me! They play in countries they haven't been to in 20 years and so if they will do a farwell tour is that going to be bigger than this?? :) I hope so!!! Because what if they come to Sweden again and I'll se them again!!!!

And yeah, it has to be some release in honour of Stevie and Lindsey joined the band!!!

[CADreaming]

Buckingham Nicks released on CD!!!!:blob2:

That's right - with the new version of "Stephanie". If that was a birthday present or something, it's time to give it to the world thank you very much...

[michelej1]

You were right, Michele.



That band rocked. It makes me wish that Mick still had a drum solo that long at the end of SHN. Certainly, I am loving the Unleashed tour and I loved the SYW tour, but you see a clip like that and I just miss what they were so much.

Michele

[CADreaming]

One section of this interview that I did find very interesting was Lindsey's comments and even compassion about the effects of "stardom" on Stevie:

“When we made the decision to join, we both gave up something that had been more essentially ourselves. And it wasn’t just giving up the synthesis between the two of us in terms of how we wrote together, sang together. It was Stevie losing herself to having been singled out as Stevie Nicks, in capital letters. This is one of the things I think has been hardest for her over the years, having sort of been asked to be this person who’s out front, the pressure of that.”

It just reminds me of how she has adamantly stated she preferred being in the background to Lindsey, she liked being his back up, and how she didn't ask to be that person thrust into the spotlight. Sure, she's made comments that she didn't mind it like Christine did, but I'm sure it was a lot more pressure than she bargained for too.

[michelej1]

It just reminds me of how she has adamantly stated she preferred being in the background to Lindsey, she liked being his back up, and how she didn't ask to be that person thrust into the spotlight. Sure, she's made comments that she didn't mind it like Christine did, but I'm sure it was a lot more pressure than she bargained for too.

Except I never believed her when she said that all she was trying to do on BN is make him sound better and if you really love someone, you just want the best for them and she never wanted to be a star. In fact, I've always thought she probably gravitated towards him over the other men in Fritz mainly because she thought he was the one more likely to have a future beyond Fritz. If she didn't think they could go farther musically together as 2 than Fritz could as a whole, I doubt a romance between them would have lasted for more than a few months.


Michele

[CADreaming]

Except I never believed her when she said that all she was trying to do on BN is make him sound better and if you really love someone, you just want the best for them and she never wanted to be a star. In fact, I've always thought she probably gravitated towards him over the other men in Fritz mainly because she thought he was the one more likely to have a future beyond Fritz. If she didn't think they could go farther musically together as 2 than Fritz could as a whole, I doubt a romance between them would have lasted for more than a few months.


Michele

Oh, I'm sure his talent is a large part of the attraction. But, it worked both ways. He was certainly drawn to her for the same reasons. As she pointed out:

"I can compare it to Johnny Cash and June Carter Cash in that movie — they loved each other for two reasons. You can love somebody because you fall in love with them, but you also love what they do. And that’s a double whammy." - Stevie Nicks, 2007

[michelej1]

Oh, I'm sure his talent is a large part of the attraction. But, it worked both ways. He was certainly drawn to her for the same reasons. As she pointed out:

I don't think Lindsey was drawn to Stevie because of her talent, per se. I think her personality attracted him. I don't think he thought she would help him make it musically. Instead, I think he felt he'd rather not make it, if it meant not being with her. I think about what Waddy said about wanting Lindsey to tour with him and stop making all those flower and vine songs for Stevie. He didn't know how Lindsey could stand it. I think Lindsey had opportunities that he didn't take because he wanted to be with her.

I think he felt that making music with her was a way to explore and expand what they felt for each other. Stevie though . . . I think if Javier had a chance of catching a record exec's eye like Lindsey did, that she'd have wound up with Javier. Which is not to say that Stevie doesn't love Lindsey. The thing about him is that just because he's in love, he doesn't become passive. Well, he didn't then. I don't know how he interacts with Kristen. So, once he and Stevie were together, she couldn't wrap him around her finger and I think the clash of personalities kept it passionate for her and always makes it possible for him to keep pushing her buttons, the loving and the angry buttons.

But I don't think for a minute that she was selfless and just wanted him to succeed when they became more than friends way back then. Of course, I don't think Lindsey just wanted Stevie to succeed either -- but he never says he did. He's not saying he just tried to play the guitar as well as he could on Frozen Love because he wanted her to shine. But she says stuff like that. Michele

[daniellaaarisen]

I don't think Lindsey was drawn to Stevie because of her talent, per se. I think her personality attracted him. I don't think he thought she would help him make it musically. Instead, I think he felt he'd rather not make it, if it meant not being with her. I think about what Waddy said about wanting Lindsey to tour with him and stop making all those flower and vine songs for Stevie. He didn't know how Lindsey could stand it. I think Lindsey had opportunities that he didn't take because he wanted to be with her.

I think he felt that making music with her was a way to explore and expand what they felt for each other. Stevie though . . . I think if Javier had a chance of catching a record exec's eye like Lindsey did, that she'd have wound up with Javier. Which is not to say that Stevie doesn't love Lindsey. The thing about him is that just because he's in love, he doesn't become passive. Well, he didn't then. I don't know how he interacts with Kristen. So, once he and Stevie were together, she couldn't wrap him around her finger and I think the clash of personalities kept it passionate for her and always makes it possible for him to keep pushing her buttons, the loving and the angry buttons.

But I don't think for a minute that she was selfless and just wanted him to succeed when they became more than friends way back then. Of course, I don't think Lindsey just wanted Stevie to succeed either -- but he never says he did. He's not saying he just tried to play the guitar as well as he could on Frozen Love because he wanted her to shine. But she says stuff like that. Michele

I wish the Ledge was like Facbook and had a "like" button. I find myself strongly agreeing with what you say on a regular basis but I don't want to waste a post and only say, "well, Michele... like usual, I like this." We just need a button!

[michelej1]

I wish the Ledge was like Facbook and had a "like" button.

Oh I know what you mean. Sometimes, you just want to post a smiley face or a laugh or a thumbs up or something and the system won't let you. It demands you write at least 10 characters and if you don't have anything to add, 10 characters can be a LOT :laugh:. Michele

[CADreaming]

I don't think Lindsey was drawn to Stevie because of her talent, per se. I think her personality attracted him. I don't think he thought she would help him make it musically. Instead, I think he felt he'd rather not make it, if it meant not being with her. I think about what Waddy said about wanting Lindsey to tour with him and stop making all those flower and vine songs for Stevie. He didn't know how Lindsey could stand it. I think Lindsey had opportunities that he didn't take because he wanted to be with her.

I agree her personality attracted him, but the shared dream and mutual commitment to their aspirations had to play a factor. "I dare anyone to say we were too young, we were only trying for the sun"... Sure, once LB was besotten with her that was it. I'm sure after his Everly Brothers gig and their subsequent fight, there's was no chance he would take on anything else solo - he certainly wouldn't join FM without her.

I think he felt that making music with her was a way to explore and expand what they felt for each other. Stevie though . . . I think if Javier had a chance of catching a record exec's eye like Lindsey did, that she'd have wound up with Javier. Which is not to say that Stevie doesn't love Lindsey. The thing about him is that just because he's in love, he doesn't become passive. Well, he didn't then. I don't know how he interacts with Kristen. So, once he and Stevie were together, she couldn't wrap him around her finger and I think the clash of personalities kept it passionate for her and always makes it possible for him to keep pushing her buttons, the loving and the angry buttons.

Eh...Idk. Javier? I think that's maybe a bit exaggerated in his mind. Also, she's a flirt. So, perhaps he was totally misreading her. And, what teenage guy wouldn't? As for her clashes with LB - could be greatly exaggerated - or at least the afteraffects. Christine said they actually got along quite well. Push each other's buttons for sure - but aren't those the closest relationships?

But I don't think for a minute that she was selfless and just wanted him to succeed when they became more than friends way back then. Of course, I don't think Lindsey just wanted Stevie to succeed either -- but he never says he did. He's not saying he just tried to play the guitar as well as he could on Frozen Love because he wanted her to shine. But she says stuff like that. Michele

Yeah, I think all of that becomes so muddled with time. And, of course I don't believe we've ever gotten the entire truth (or ever will for that matter). Besides, so much of what is said is based on how people are feeling at the time, isn't it?

You're right about her not being selfless. And, I totally think she believed in Lindsey, but I think she also believed he needed her.

In his heart he wishes her stardom
His eyes want for her much more

I don't think Lindsey ever wanted her stardom to come from anything other than Buckingham Nicks.

[michelej1]

Eh...Idk. Javier? I think that's maybe a bit exaggerated in his mind. Also, she's a flirt. So, perhaps he was totally misreading her.

Oh, I didn't say Javier based on anything that Javier said. I just used him as an example. I think she would have been drawn to anyone she thought had musical potential. And by potential, I don't even necessarily mean talent. Just having an aunt to leave you $10,000 so you can have equipment to make demos sound really good is enough. Or having a coffee plant room you can use at night . . . I think those things made Lindsey attractive.

For Lindsey, let's say she had the same personality, but she fancied herself a clothes designer. I think he would have wanted to be with her just the same. She said Lindsey was the type of man who would have been glad to have her, his "old lady" stay home and wash clothes and not be on the stage with him and I believe her. I think music made her as interested in him as she was and that kept them together and that's what made it fun for both of them. But if she could have been the same person she was and be as into him, but NOT have been a singer, I think he would have been just as happy.

Lindsey, he would rather I just stayed at home doing laundry. We are talking about a man who was in love with a woman and would just as soon she had faded out and just been his old lady or wife. Period

Christine said they could get along quite well when they were working on a song and we saw some of that in the Tusk footage of them working on Angel. So, I think he liked the music they made as something they could do that brought them close. But I think he could have felt the same way about her if she hadn't been a singer, while I don't think she would have felt the same about him if he hadn't been a musician. Michele

[mgikallaroundme]

he could have felt the same way about her if she hadn't been a singer, while I don't think she would have felt the same about him if he hadn't been a musician. Michele

Buckingham is a born nerd. His huge ego was nowhere to be found before this amazing girl looked at him in supreme awe and with complete adoration. She felt the way she did about him, not becuase he could do for her, but because she saw his greatness and wanted to be a part of making something happen for him. I believe her when she says she wanted him to be the long distance winner. I believe him when he says it was hard for her to be the one thrust into the spotlight.

I don't think Lindsey ever wanted her stardom to come from anything other than Buckingham Nicks.

ITA with this.

[michelej1]

Buckingham is a born nerd. His huge ego was nowhere to be found before this amazing girl looked at him in supreme awe and with complete adoration. She felt the way she did about him, not becuase he could do for her, but because she saw his greatness and wanted to be a part of making something happen for him. I believe her when she says she wanted him to be the long distance winner. I believe him when he says it was hard for her to be the one thrust into the spotlight.



I doubt it and from descriptions of Lindsey from those who knew him at the time, it sounds like he had pretty much the same personality, good and bad traits, both ego wise and sensitivity wise, then that he has now. His sense of self probably had much more to do with the way he was raised and his position as the youngest in that family than it did with Stevie.

And Stevie's boasts about being the star of Fritz that everyone was talking about don't say to me that she was thinking of Lindsey and his dreams of success at that time. I think she was eating up the attention she was getting on the stage and off, from the men in the band who were fighting over her -- according to her.

As for her clashes with LB - could be greatly exaggerated - or at least the afteraffects. Christine said they actually got along quite well. Push each other's buttons for sure - but aren't those the closest relationships?




Having just watched Curb Your Enthusiasm I was reminded of an old interview of Larry David's. He said he went to camp with Richard Lewis when they were boys and he has known him for 40-50 years. He said that Richard is the one person that he can scream at at the top of his lungs one minute and then ask him where he wants to eat lunch the next minute.

I think Lindsey and Stevie are like that. I don't think their fighting is exaggerated. I DO think they argue that much. I just don't think it means anything or changes their feelings for each other. Even when Stevie said she would never work with Lindsey again after the SYW tour, I don't think anyone believed her for a second, John, Mick or Lindsey. And if we fans had known about that edict we wouldn't have believed her either.

So, yes I agree that the pushing buttons is indicative of the closeness of the relationship. Michele

[CADreaming]

Oh, I didn't say Javier based on anything that Javier said. I just used him as an example. I think she would have been drawn to anyone she thought had musical potential. And by potential, I don't even necessarily mean talent. Just having an aunt to leave you $10,000 so you can have equipment to make demos sound really good is enough. Or having a coffee plant room you can use at night . . . I think those things made Lindsey attractive.

For Lindsey, let's say she had the same personality, but she fancied herself a clothes designer. I think he would have wanted to be with her just the same. She said Lindsey was the type of man who would have been glad to have her, his "old lady" stay home and wash clothes and not be on the stage with him and I believe her. I think music made her as interested in him as she was and that kept them together and that's what made it fun for both of them. But if she could have been the same person she was and be as into him, but NOT have been a singer, I think he would have been just as happy.

Christine said they could get along quite well when they were working on a song and we saw some of that in the Tusk footage of them working on Angel. So, I think he liked the music they made as something they could do that brought them close. But I think he could have felt the same way about her if she hadn't been a singer, while I don't think she would have felt the same about him if he hadn't been a musician. Michele

Ha! I see where you're coming from Michele. And, I think there's a lot of truth in your perception of Stevie. But, I think she would have been totally into him regardless as well. Much to our benefit, it worked out they were both into music though.


And Stevie's boasts about being the star of Fritz that everyone was talking about don't say to me that she was thinking of Lindsey and his dreams of success at that time. I think she was eating up the attention she was getting on the stage and off, from the men in the band who were fighting over her -- according to her.

True, that. But, all the insecurities are still there. She has said they would have been too scared (both of them) to ever pursue anything alone at that time. Which is why (she said) they moved to LA together. (Of course, that and Olsen wanted them as a duo).

I think Lindsey and Stevie are like that. I don't think their fighting is exaggerated. I DO think they argue that much. I just don't think it means anything or changes their feelings for each other. Even when Stevie said she would never work with Lindsey again after the SYW tour, I don't think anyone believed her for a second, John, Mick or Lindsey. And if we fans had known about that edict we wouldn't have believed her either.

So, yes I agree that the pushing buttons is indicative of the closeness of the relationship. Michele

Yes, that's what I mean. People misinterpret their fighting as a measuring stick of their 'hatred' for one another. I think it's more a measure of how much they care or are passionate towards one another. If they just hated each other's guts then they wouldn't be onstage together in Europe today...

[peer_gynt10]

Fast forward to December 2012. I just came across this touching thread with all those wonderfully insightful comments and felt that it deserved to be bumped up and rediscovered, especially in light of the upcoming tour, the rumours about a re-release of Buckingham Nicks, and Lindsey's comments about the two new songs that he's written with Stevie in mind. Nothing ever changes, no it doesn't...

[KindOfWoman90]

Thanks for bumping this thread, it was a nice read :)

I have a BN related question, if anyone out there knows, were Stevie and Lindsey a couple before they moved to LA? I ask this because I know about Olsen, I just wondered if being picked out by him was what led to their relationship evolving, or if that happened before. I've never seen any articles that say one way or the other.

It's also nice to read through these old posts and gain some perspective on today. We can all stress out about the "what ifs" and "is this the end?!" but ultimately, I think we're pretty safe for a while ;) - like Lindsey says in the Mirage tour - "We're here to show you, we just refuse to go away." Good to know that's still the case :xoxo:

[CADreaming]

Thanks for bumping this thread, it was a nice read :)

I have a BN related question, if anyone out there knows, were Stevie and Lindsey a couple before they moved to LA? I ask this because I know about Olsen, I just wondered if being picked out by him was what led to their relationship evolving, or if that happened before. I've never seen any articles that say one way or the other.



Yes, they were. But, they have been known to stretch the blanket about the timing - for whatever reason & there are plenty of quotes.

[KindOfWoman90]

Yes, they were. But, they have been known to stretch the blanket about the timing - for whatever reason & there are plenty of quotes.

Thanks :p Oh I'm sure there are, I'm just lazy, and I should be getting work done...But alas, FM/BN is my favorite distraction :o

[Amlyn]

She tells me she finally went to see a psychologist “about five years ago, a really sweet little lady, and we were just talking about my life, and I was telling her about those years, when Lindsey and I first moved to LA, and I was a waitress, a cleaning lady, and anything else I could do to pay our rent, and I said to her, ‘But there was something about those years that I really loved.’ And she said, ‘Well, in many ways, Stevie, the day you joined Fleetwood Mac was the saddest day of your life — because it was the day you stopped being the caretaker.’

Oh wow, I knew I had read this somewhere a few years back. Stevie mentioned this exact thing in one of the IYD Q&As in October, think Pleasantville, and I couldn't remember where I first had seen that.