Do You Think It's Over?

[~GoldDustWoman~]

I love the Mac and Stevie especially even though i'm still new to the "Penquinhead" culture (aren't Mac fans Penguinheads? or MacHeads? If not would be a good fan name!). But how many times can you release a greatest hits or very best of album?! And on top of that when was the last time any of them released any original material? It was Lindsey right with Gift of Screws? (2008?) I hate to say it, but maybe it's time they went their own ways and just continued with solo careers or maybe managed other up and coming bands? I mean they still perform good, but it's nothing new. I hate to say all this but i've been thinking about it.

What do you guys think?

[FMlex]

It's not like they're a "new"/"current" band - they've been around for over 40 years.

I certainly don't expect them to crank out a new studio album every year or every two years -- it's a ridiculous expectation.

I agree that there's only so many greatest hits albums we can handle, but I'd rather a new greatest hits album come out (with two or so new songs, like they usually do) than not have anything come out at all.

Let them take their time regarding new material... they're gettin' old.

[GypsyBlueEyes]

No, No, No, No, No, No, No, and NO! They HAVE to release something else...or I'm going to be reallllllllllly sad! I don't even want to imagine a world where FM is over and done with. I know that the day is going to come when the realization will be that there won't be any new material...but they can't end it yet and they can't end it with the Unleased tour...they just can't! It has to be bigger than that. I know that there are those who have been around a lot longer who remember FM in their heyday and feel that they won't ever reach those heights again and may have the opinion that they should move on but I'm not one of them...I missed out on so much and I HATE that...so my perspective is a lot different...I'm not ready for FM to be a thing of the past. I think they've still got it :nod:

[CADreaming]

They're just looking for the right place to fade...:wavey:

[jbrownsjr]

They're just looking for the right place to fade...:wavey:

Like a ghost throught the fog?

[David]

Fleetwood Mac at some point down the line . . . .

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[CADreaming]

Like a ghost throught the fog?

Exactly......

[louielouie2000]

I personally think it's over. Stevie seems disinterested in recording new material because she and Fleetwood Mac are no longer a platinum selling artists. She also has chronicled how miserable she was during the making of Say You Will, and how she didn't like the end product of the album. She seems perpetually angry with Lindsey too. I see more touring to come, but no more new albums. I just don't think Stevie and Lindsey can find any middle ground or reason to record with Christine the moderator and voice of reason being gone. I don't know that I see more solo albums from Stevie either... and it'll probably be a decade before we see anything from Lindsey again.

[FMlex]

Well this thread sure is making me depressed guys -- come on, where's the optimistic outlook? :(

[SteveMacD]

I'd be more optimistic, but with the death of Mary Travers and the subsequent end of Peter Paul & Mary (a very similar sounding group to the "Rumours" Fleetwood Mac, IMO, only with significantly more substance), the writing is kind of on the wall for Fleetwood Mac. Nothing lasts forever.

[LukeA]

I personally think it's over. Stevie seems disinterested in recording new material because she and Fleetwood Mac are no longer a platinum selling artists. She also has chronicled how miserable she was during the making of Say You Will, and how she didn't like the end product of the album. She seems perpetually angry with Lindsey too. I see more touring to come, but no more new albums. I just don't think Stevie and Lindsey can find any middle ground or reason to record with Christine the moderator and voice of reason being gone. I don't know that I see more solo albums from Stevie either... and it'll probably be a decade before we see anything from Lindsey again.

I agree with every single word of this.

I put the over/under of forthcoming Fleetwood Mac concerts (including dates that are already scheduled) at 200. Its all about money/rehearsed false in-concert sincerity at this point.

[daniellaaarisen]

I think they'll do it. I do however think that it'll be a while.

[blemelin]

This is the way the world ends
Not with a bang but a whimper.

—T.S. Eliot, "The Hollow Men" (1925)

[daniellaaarisen]

This is the way the world ends
Not with a bang but a whimper.

—T.S. Eliot, "The Hollow Men" (1925)

Eliot is perfect. Great quote by one of my favorite poets ever.

[Phoenix]

Well this thread sure is making me depressed guys -- come on, where's the optimistic outlook? :(

HERE I COME TO SAVE THE DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY!:] No seriously, I lurked here from 2002 and joined in 2005, and We have this conversation like every ten minutes. ITS DONE! ITS OVER! NEVER AGAIN! Stevie too! Blah,BLah,BLAH. AND it never is. It of course is not as much as i would like, (new studio albums cranked out every couple of years or so), but there is ALWAYS *SOMETHING that surprises me. For example, Since stevies TISL, There was "touched by an angel", "your NOT the one" w/Cheryl crow, "THE one" w/ venessa Carlton, the stand back remixes, the remastered tusk w/demos, white album with single versions, and rumors w/demos AND single versions, the Dreams REMIXes, Mr. Buckingham s soundstage and albums and tour,the Tom Petty Tour (featuring "INSIDER" live) which by the way was one of the "NEVER"s also. Other "NEVERS" include Beautiful child live, and STORMS live which people always said "I could die happy if stevie would ONLY just actually sing INSIDER, BEAUTIFUL CHILD, or STORMS, Live". Crystal visions ( I LIKED having all the videos, and a Good quality version of Rock and roll and edge w/the orchestra ect., the Say you will album, the tour, The DESTINY RULES Documentary, Stevies couple of solo tours and Her SOUNDSTAGE which i think is one of the BEST things shes ever done. and then the CD with Circle Dance and Crash and my FAVORITE version of how still my love. AND then this New tour, where there going to Europe and NZ. It really isnt as bleak as it sometimes made out to be, so keep the faith. they/she are not yet done.:thumbsup:

[LukeA]

HERE I COME TO SAVE THE DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY!:] No seriously, I lurked here from 2002 and joined in 2005, and We have this conversation like every ten minutes. ITS DONE! ITS OVER! NEVER AGAIN! Stevie too! Blah,BLah,BLAH. AND it never is. It of course is not as much as i would like, (new studio albums cranked out every couple of years or so), but there is ALWAYS *SOMETHING that surprises me. For example, Since stevies TISL, There was "touched by an angel", "your NOT the one" w/Cheryl crow, "THE one" w/ venessa Carlton, the stand back remixes, the remastered tusk w/demos, white album with single versions, and rumors w/demos AND single versions, the Dreams REMIXes, Mr. Buckingham s soundstage and albums and tour,the Tom Petty Tour (featuring "INSIDER" live) which by the way was one of the "NEVER"s also. Other "NEVERS" include Beautiful child live, and STORMS live which people always said "I could die happy if stevie would ONLY just actually sing INSIDER, BEAUTIFUL CHILD, or STORMS, Live". Crystal visions ( I LIKED having all the videos, and a Good quality version of Rock and roll and edge w/the orchestra ect., the Say you will album, the tour, The DESTINY RULES Documentary, Stevies couple of solo tours and Her SOUNDSTAGE which i think is one of the BEST things shes ever done. and then the CD with Circle Dance and Crash and my FAVORITE version of how still my love. AND then this New tour, where there going to Europe and NZ. It really isnt as bleak as it sometimes made out to be, so keep the faith. they/she are not yet done.:thumbsup:

Thanks for summarizing everyone's solo careers under the guise of prophesizing the group's future. Like we didn't already know all of this ourselves- even in the context of this conversation.

No offense, seriously, but no one is talking about the creative vitality of any one member. We're talking about the group. If you can come up with anything the band has done since 2004 that could possibly suggest that there is a creative future afoot, please go right ahead.

[Nikolaj]

I think it's over, yes. Their fortune is in the touring, and that's where they are focused. Sadly, I also think they aren't wanted by Warner, Reprise, or any label. They're in their 60s. At most, I think they'd only get a generous offer to once again re-record their best known songs (Carly Simon's soon to be released project) a "genre" type album (like when Rod Stewart did those standards albums) or cover songs that would guarantee the label a good publishing cut- I may not be phrasing correctly-
What I mean is that a new cd of new material wouldn't have any guaranteed money for anyone except possibly Fleetwood Mac, and due to everything- age, the Internet, lack of radio interest, even Fleetwood Mac wouldn't make much money, likely. I think its why we also don't see new cds from Aerosmith, Heart, or anyone in the 60ish age bracket unless they do a 'songs of the 70s' kind of project. Good old Cher has a deal now she's doing her best to sound enthusiastic about, a songs of the 60s cd, paraphrasing "there were so many great songs from that era and I want to do songs I loved hearing on my transister radio or on the AM radio in my '65 Ford Mustang'-- so, the label makes money if 'Warner (Brothers) Publishing' just happens to be among the hits she'll re-record. I think LB has too much artistic integrity to play that game, when it comes to recording. Yet, as a father of 3 with a young wife to support, and being a gifted performer, he can make a fortune playing live with Mac (not solo, most definitely) and it's wise for him to do so.
I think Stevie would do the cover types of project, or play the game, more than LB will. I give him a lot of credit for his 2 recent solo cds and dvd, because he stuck to his guns and got the projects released on his own terms and likely, for not much money. I mean, of all people, both Donny Osmond and Barry Manilow have had recent releases giving the labels what they wanted- remakes of old hits. I just don't think any label wants a new Fleetwood Mac cd enough to pay the band what I think they expect, and haven't, apparantly, been offered.

[louielouie2000]

Thanks for summarizing everyone's solo careers under the guise of prophesizing the group's future. Like we didn't already know all of this ourselves- even in the context of this conversation.

No offense, seriously, but no one is talking about the creative vitality of any one member. We're talking about the group. If you can come up with anything the band has done since 2004 that could possibly suggest that there is a creative future afoot, please go right ahead.

Indeed. The problem with most of the stuff Phoenix listed too is almost none of it included new studio albums. In this decade we've seen 4 new studio albums between Fleetwood Mac, Stevie, and Lindsey. For comparison, the Mac, Stevie, and Lindsey put out 8 studio albums in the 1980s, 3 in the 1970s, and 4 in the 1990s. I'm kind of stretching my definition of studio albums around the Rumours crew, and am including Time against my will just so I don't get yelled at :laugh:. So if you look at it that way, the kids aren't being as lazy as we think they are. But even this is flawed logic. Fleetwood Mac put out 3 studio albums in the '70s, but the Rumours band only existed for the second half of that decade. Also, in the 80s, between Lindsey and Stevie combined recorded 3 times the amount of albums that Fleetwood Mac itself put out. Then in the 90s, S&L only recorded 1 album each. My point with all this confusing soup is that you can spin numbers any way you want.

I think Blemelin put it more succinctly than any of us have been able to. I think we're all waiting for that last, sublime album. The album to trump all others, the mythical Swan Song. Instead, the band is aging exactly like a person: getting fat, slowing down, working less, suffering hip injuries, having memory issues, until it finally wheezes it's last breath and dies. How much of this have we already seen with our own eyes??? :laugh::p

[LukeA]

If Fleetwood Mac wanted to record/release an album in 2010, they'd have no problem doing so. They might not get the advance they've been accustomed to (or what they got in 2002 for SYW), but they would get more than enough. Its just that they don't want to- its not worth the effort to Stevie, and Lindsey has finally realized that there's an outlet for his material when presented solo.

If we're ever going to get new material from them, I bet it'll probably come in the form as a song or two available as downloads- presented as a lark of sorts (where Lindsey will get to tell everyone how this is their new "single" with his mock pride). Stevie's content in cashing her ~$200K checks every night (as long as she doesn't have to sing SS *every* *night*!!), and Lindsey's just along for the ride.

[silvasprings]

I think this is just one of those dooms day rants...
"The day Fleetwood mac finally decides to die..."
But instead of saying it's over and going home and crying about it, why not just suck it up and admire all the amazing work they have created in the last 40 years...
Sure it's sad that it's coming to an end, but it doesn't have to if we all take out our albums and LISTEN!!!
It's not like there isn't anymore that you can absorb from a band like this...
And if you've had your fill, then find another band to get obsessed over and stop making this forum a negative/ one foot in the grave scenario....

[belladonnadream]

I personally think it's over. Stevie seems disinterested in recording new material because she and Fleetwood Mac are no longer a platinum selling artists. She also has chronicled how miserable she was during the making of Say You Will, and how she didn't like the end product of the album. She seems perpetually angry with Lindsey too. I see more touring to come, but no more new albums. I just don't think Stevie and Lindsey can find any middle ground or reason to record with Christine the moderator and voice of reason being gone. I don't know that I see more solo albums from Stevie either... and it'll probably be a decade before we see anything from Lindsey again.
Well everythings been a " been there done that" with them after 30 years....the only thing left I'd like to see happen is a Buckingham Nicks reunion...a strictly Lindsey and Stevie effort...a focus on their original sound ..maybe a new album that brings that back...call it Buckingham Nicks 2 or something and a tour....Frozen Love Live...I'm waiting! Now that would be the way to to go out...the same way they came in...a beautiful Love Story.

[belladonnadream]

I think this is just one of those dooms day rants...
"The day Fleetwood mac finally decides to die..."
But instead of saying it's over and going home and crying about it, why not just suck it up and admire all the amazing work they have created in the last 40 years...
Sure it's sad that it's coming to an end, but it doesn't have to if we all take out our albums and LISTEN!!!
It's not like there isn't anymore that you can absorb from a band like this...
And if you've had your fill, then find another band to get obsessed over and stop making this forum a negative/ one foot in the grave scenario....
Stevie did just recently say she's not retiring...I think she still has a spark and will do some fun things... I truly believe this..I don't think after seeing them in 2009 that I got any sense that they just wanted to quit.

[Peestie]

Its just that they don't want to- its not worth the effort to Stevie, and Lindsey has finally realized that there's an outlet for his material when presented solo.


I think this could be the main problem. Lindsey still seems to want to be creative with Fleetwood Mac and he's still writing and recording as much now or more than he was 30 years ago, but if FM aren't on the same page as him he'll just get frustrated and go off and do his solo thing again because he still feels he has something to say. I think the future holds a few more Lindsey solo albums and tours, along with maybe one or two more big Fleetwood Mac tours. I would love to see a new Fleetwood Mac album but if Stevie isn't 100% into it then I would rather we just got more Lindsey solo because then, in two years, we won't have to listen to "I wasn't happy with this, that and the other thing".

[GavinBrown]

I honestly think it was a good idea to do this tour for everyone involved. I also think that stevie hasnt sounded this upbeat in a LONG time....when the tour is done they are gonna hit the studio...i feel it!

[trackaghost]

I think this could be the main problem. Lindsey still seems to want to be creative with Fleetwood Mac and he's still writing and recording as much now or more than he was 30 years ago, but if FM aren't on the same page as him he'll just get frustrated and go off and do his solo thing again because he still feels he has something to say. I think the future holds a few more Lindsey solo albums and tours, along with maybe one or two more big Fleetwood Mac tours. I would love to see a new Fleetwood Mac album but if Stevie isn't 100% into it then I would rather we just got more Lindsey solo because then, in two years, we won't have to listen to "I wasn't happy with this, that and the other thing".

I agree but I think the minute Lindsey said yes to this greatest hits tour it was the end of them as a recording band. He was always against doing tours like that before and becoming a nostalgia act, and adamant about having new material in the set. I think Stevie enticed him into doing this tour with the possibility of recording again but once it got underway and was somewhat successful I think all that flew out of the window. I think Lindsey just accepted it as a cash-in, something he needed to do money-wise in order to do his solo projects, which let's face it is where his heart and creativity lies these days.

[JeannieKartis]

I agree with every single word of this.

I put the over/under of forthcoming Fleetwood Mac concerts (including dates that are already scheduled) at 200. Its all about money/rehearsed false in-concert sincerity at this point.


I agree, other then maybe Lindsay, I think the others, especially Stevie are turned off by the logistics, money and time it would take to do another studio album.....why bother making another album when you can tour, much easier, and make loads of $$ without having to work too hard....

[chiliD]

I would love to see a new Fleetwood Mac album but if Stevie isn't 100% into it then I would rather we just got more Lindsey solo because then, in two years, we won't have to listen to "I wasn't happy with this, that and the other thing".

Where does it say that Fleetwood Mac MUST have Stevie Nicks as a member? There was a Fleetwood Mac before she arrived, there was a Fleetwood Mac when she didn't want to be involved.

I'd WELCOME a new Fleetwood Mac album without her. Let them carry on with just Lindsey, Mick & John and add Brett & Neale as full-fledged members. back to an all-male Fleetwood Mac.

Fleetwood Mac is dead....long live Fleetwood Mac.

[David]

Nobody here is giving Mick Fleetwood any credit for all the recording he's done. Whether he calls it the Zoo or the Blues Band or something else, he keeps recording every so often.

A few people want a Buckingham Nicks project of some sort or other, but what? An album? A tour? How would that actually differ from the last Mac album or tour?

Others say Fleetwood Mac has another huge tour or two in the future. At what? Age 65? 70?

I think the best thing for Stevie Nicks to do is to park herself at Caesar's Palace or Wynn in Las Vegas for six weeks & do three or four shows a week there. Maybe Mick Fleetwood will drum for her.

[Peestie]

Where does it say that Fleetwood Mac MUST have Stevie Nicks as a member? There was a Fleetwood Mac before she arrived, there was a Fleetwood Mac when she didn't want to be involved.

I'd WELCOME a new Fleetwood Mac album without her. Let them carry on with just Lindsey, Mick & John and add Brett & Neale as full-fledged members. back to an all-male Fleetwood Mac.

Fleetwood Mac is dead....long live Fleetwood Mac.

I'd like that even more than a Lindsey solo album and it could just be perfect - it could end up being like the original GOS sessions - but at this stage I don't think it would even occur to Mick, John and Lindsey to do an album without Stevie under the banner of Fleetwood Mac unless, maybe, they got Christine to come back. Maybe they maybe feel that if it's just one of the three Rumours songwriters then it's not Fleetwood Mac. :shrug:

[chiliD]

Maybe they maybe feel that if it's just one of the three Rumours songwriters then it's not Fleetwood Mac. :shrug:

That's their problem...they've banked their entire 40 year history on one album. And, not even their BEST album (musically speaking) at that.

After all, that is the main reason WHY Peter Green named the band that way. The guitarists, keyboardists, songwriters, singers may come & go, but if Mick's behind the drums and John's anchored next to the drum riser on bass, it's Fleetwood Mac.

[~GoldDustWoman~]

I like Rumours but I think I prefer SYW to be honest, I am still at the listening to all the albums stage and so far i pick and chose when it comes to the other albums, but I don't have all of them so I have to go with what I have downloaded which for two of the albums isn't all the songs.

[JohnL]

As much as I have loved Fleetwood Mac over the years, the magic is gone. This last tour was like the Lindsey show which is so not what I want to see when I go. I do miss Christine but we all know she is not returning. However, I will be perfectly happy to have Stevie continue solo. Lindsey's music just doesnt do it for me and if I never have to hear one more hour of guitar solos in a FM show again, I will die a happy camper. JMO...I know it isnt the same for Lindsey fans.

[~GoldDustWoman~]

From the Destiny Rules DVD which sorry Lindsey fans, it seems like it is definitely about the money for him. I do like his playing i love his song I'm So Afraid, and Murrow Turning Over in his Grave.

[Erin]

From the Destiny Rules DVD which sorry Lindsey fans, it seems like it is definitely about the money for him. I do like his playing i love his song I'm So Afraid, and Murrow Turning Over in his Grave.

Apparently you saw a very different documentary than I did. Lindsey was willing to make Say You Will a double album and eat the extra costs. His two recent solo tours certainly didn't make him any money either. I'm not saying he doesn't want to get paid, but he's no more greedy than the rest of the band, in fact strikes me as less so than certain other members, cough...Mick...cough.

[louielouie2000]

Where does it say that Fleetwood Mac MUST have Stevie Nicks as a member? There was a Fleetwood Mac before she arrived, there was a Fleetwood Mac when she didn't want to be involved.

I'd WELCOME a new Fleetwood Mac album without her. Let them carry on with just Lindsey, Mick & John and add Brett & Neale as full-fledged members. back to an all-male Fleetwood Mac.

Fleetwood Mac is dead....long live Fleetwood Mac.

Because they tried that in 1994 and it flopped miserably. At this point in the game, after 35+ years of history, Stevie is cemented as the face of Fleetwood Mac. If you ask a random person on the street to name the members of Fleetwood Mac, I guarantee you Stevie Nicks is the only one most people can name. Whether it's good for the Fleetwood Mac moniker or not, whether it's to anyone's personal preferences or not, we're stuck with a Fleetwood Mac that includes Stevie at this point.

[jbrownsjr]

whether it's to anyone's personal preferences or not, we're stuck with a Fleetwood Mac that includes Stevie at this point.

That's because Heroes are Hard to Find.... :woohoo:

[daniellaaarisen]

I think that if they put another album out, they'll be able to continue touring at the bigger venues (even if its debatably a bad business decision). If they try to do the greatest hits tour thing again (and again, and again...), I think we'll end up seeing a lot smaller venues, including wineries, and no more international shows. It'll be like what Heart and Lynyrd Skynyrd are doing these days although I'm not sure they even feel the need to put out greatest hits albums to correlate with their tours, unlike those two bands...... I donno. I hope they make a new album but if they do solo works, I'm fine with that, too-- just as long as we get another Mac tour out of it.

[LukeA]

Fleetwood Mac would sooner call it a day if they aren't able to play large capacity/big money venues- after all, that's the whole point of why the group still exists as we head into 2010.

[cristochango]

I'm hoping for one more mac album.
I know there'll be another stevie album.

But I wanna say I was a fan when a fleetwood album was released.
I didnt know anything about them back in 03

[starshine]

Its very interesting to read everyones thoughts......I don't mind if there different at all.....we don't have to agree on anything.....Personally, I think Mac are 'done'.....the magic isn't there & many other things bother me......I don't even think they like there own music much(same for Stevie solo too)......sorry the set list thing still bothers me.....(same for Stevie solo).....plus the high ticket prices....thats one reason I didn't buy any for this tour & won't again /same for Stevie solo as well.....its not worth it to me......I've paid there way over the yrs through all that I've purchased......Personally, its sad with as much history as Mac has (as well as each solo artist in the band) that they couldn't make the most of what 'they' have. Put out the rest of the re-issues even if it's in limited quanities....(from like 'live' on....with extras) release all your video's/give us some rare live material....which we know exsists. Stevie could do the same as well. Use the Net to your advantage instead of dis-advantage. But no they will keep giving us GHits packages over & over again......thats lame and boring......yes maybe the 'have' to? I have no clue but 'if' they want to do something they can & will find a way but I don't think many of them are really interested in recording anything 'new' at all.......esp Stevie.....we all know what she's stated in the press these last couple of yrs.......not that she'd recall it probably.....anyway, no offence but well it ...is what it is........and there's no going back........:shrug::nod:

[jbrownsjr]

I'll say it again... I think Christine left because she felt they were done too... The magic, the music, the voices... not cute anymore...

[~GoldDustWoman~]

Sorry maybe I misunderstood eating the cost thing, I thought it just struck me as being greedy. Why does everyone want Stevie out? I agree that she is the most recognizable an that she is the reason i started to like The Mac.

[jbrownsjr]

Sorry maybe I misunderstood eating the cost thing, I thought it just struck me as being greedy. Why does everyone want Stevie out? I agree that she is the most recognizable an that she is the reason i started to like The Mac.

I don't think people want stevie out... I think what Chili is saying.. is that FM can still survive without her. And I'm guessing he wouldn't mind seeing that happen...

My ideal line up would be LB CM JM MF... raw four piece ....

all 4 musicians write all the music... dream on jbrownsjr...

[trackaghost]

Where does it say that Fleetwood Mac MUST have Stevie Nicks as a member? There was a Fleetwood Mac before she arrived, there was a Fleetwood Mac when she didn't want to be involved.



Of course Stevie doesn't have to be in the band, but there's no money in that and really isn't that the whole point of the latest tour, making money?

[jbrownsjr]

Of course Stevie doesn't have to be in the band, but there's no money in that and really isn't that the whole point of the latest tour, making money?

Well, with my line up they could do a small arena tour like Winwood....

of course out goes millions... in comes thousands.... :sorry:

[LukeA]

I'll say it again... I think Christine left because she felt they were done too... The magic, the music, the voices... not cute anymore...

I continue to maintain that Chris nixed the planned, highly lucrative Dance tour extension because of how distressing those cold outdoor October/November gigs (especially Atlanta) were- even though the following dates would have been all indoor arenas.

If it wasn't the primary reason, it was unquestionably the nail in the coffin.

[louielouie2000]

Why does everyone want Stevie out?

Everyone wants Stevie out because she seems to be the sole person in the band preventing any real forward movement. If not for her issues, the band might even have an album out right now, or well entrenched in recording one instead of going through the motions on an oldies tour. People are tired of Stevie badmouthing Lindsey in the press, tired of her whining about how people aren't buying her music, and about people stealing it through the internet. With the notable exception of Chili and a few others, most of us really don't want her out though. We just want her to suck it up, stop the boohooing, and get serious about recording some good music with the band. Because she still has enormous talent, a great voice, and something to say. Yes, it's not Fleetwood Mac without the drama... but this is just the wrong type of drama.

[jbrownsjr]

I continue to maintain that Chris nixed the planned, highly lucrative Dance tour extension because of how distressing those cold outdoor October/November gigs (especially Atlanta) were- even though the following dates would have been all indoor arenas.

If it wasn't the primary reason, it was unquestionably the nail in the coffin.

I don't disagree with that either...

[Erin]

Sorry maybe I misunderstood eating the cost thing, I thought it just struck me as being greedy. Why does everyone want Stevie out? I agree that she is the most recognizable an that she is the reason i started to like The Mac.

Eating the cost means he would have paid for it himself, i.e. the opposite of being greedy.

I don't want Stevie out of the band, but I understand others frustration and I do think it's time for Neale and Brett to be considered actual members of Fleetwood Mac.

[~GoldDustWoman~]

I've never heard of her crying about no one buying her music. I could see the Lindsey bashing but i've again never seen it. Got examples?

[chiliD]

Because they tried that in 1994 and it flopped miserably. At this point in the game, after 35+ years of history, Stevie is cemented as the face of Fleetwood Mac. If you ask a random person on the street to name the members of Fleetwood Mac, I guarantee you Stevie Nicks is the only one most people can name. Whether it's good for the Fleetwood Mac moniker or not, whether it's to anyone's personal preferences or not, we're stuck with a Fleetwood Mac that includes Stevie at this point.


So effing what? Nobody knew who Lindsey Buckingham or Stevie Nicks were in 1975 either. Time to stop "living in the past" and reinvent themselves (again). You don't see Neil Young or Bob Dylan resting on their laurels, they keep finding ways to be fresh & relevant. Heck, The Beatles reinvented themselves about 4 times in 8 years.

For as entrepreneurial as Fleetwood appears to be, when it comes to Fleetwood Mac, he's incredibly lazy when it comes to the creative side of things. No wonder they've become a "nostalgia" act...they've kept themselves locked in 1977 for 32 years. Just imagine how much MORE they would've accomplished had they not gotten sucked into the Rumours whirlpool for all these years.

[David]

I don't want Stevie out of the band, but I understand others frustration and I do think it's time for Neale and Brett to be considered actual members of Fleetwood Mac.As hired sessionists, aren't they cheaper to pay than they would be as members? If Fleetwood Mac becomes a six-piece, how would that affect their individual guarantees on tour? Say You Will was an odd (read: telling) situation because Brett & Neale weren't involved in the recording at all.

Something makes me think that those two are not going to become members of Fleetwood Mac.

[Erin]

As hired sessionists, aren't they cheaper to pay than they would be as members? If Fleetwood Mac becomes a six-piece, how would that affect their individual guarantees on tour? Say You Will was an odd (read: telling) situation because Brett & Neale weren't involved in the recording at all.

Something makes me think that those two are not going to become members of Fleetwood Mac.

I'm sure you're right, but I think they've earned their dues, especially if the band does not record again.

[jwd]

Sorry maybe I misunderstood eating the cost thing, I thought it just struck me as being greedy. Why does everyone want Stevie out? I agree that she is the most recognizable an that she is the reason i started to like The Mac.

I'm a big Stevie fan, and I want her out. The chemistry just isn't there any more between them. She's be much better off pursuing her solo career and working with other artists at this point. And there are many, many roads open to her. She needs to get that Rhiannon project done, write some children's stories, do a standards album with David Foster that she talked about, or hey just do another amazing solo record with the likes of John Shanks.

As for the Mac, I think they should and will carry on. Whether it's going back to their blues roots or carrying on with Lindsey, I think they would still be a viable music force. Just don't opt for that cheap imitation routine and try to replace Stevie with a blonde woman front singer. I despise that whole charade, much like Queen has tried to replace Freddie Mercury over the years. It just can't be done.

[Musicman408]

If the Eagles can put out a multi-platinum record in the 60's- I don't see why Fleetwood Mac couldn't do the same if they really tried~

[michelej1]

As hired sessionists, aren't they cheaper to pay than they would be as members?

They're well paid for what they do -- which is nothing exceptional. I am very fond of them, just from having them on the road with Lindsey and the affection that they, particularly Brett, seem to have for him quite touches me. However, I think they're contributions are fungible -- and I would never want them to be members of FM.

But I have a feeling it's not something I really have to worry about. I don't think adding them would ever occur to the band, so that's a relief.

Michele

[GypsyBlueEyes]

Isn't it sort of weird though that after all this time Lindsey agreed to do something like the Unleashed tour...not that I'm knocking it. I was right there in the audience with everyone else and loved every second of it. Still, I worried when it was first announced that it was a sign that he may be over FM as an artistic endeavor...I was just really surprised that he of all people didn't push to record new material. All these years he has been the leader of the group in terms of putting together an album...Mick, I'm really not sure what exactly he wants (other than play his drums and have fun, though I do believe he wants the group to stay together) and John never says anything! I really don't think the problem is so much with Stevie...I think she's just waiting for Lindsey to decide that he's ready to really do something with the group as opposed to the same thing they've been doing (hopefully reinvent themselves somehow)...I think if he is passionate about it, she will be right there with him.

[jbrownsjr]

As hired sessionists, aren't they cheaper to pay than they would be as members? If Fleetwood Mac becomes a six-piece, how would that affect their individual guarantees on tour? Say You Will was an odd (read: telling) situation because Brett & Neale weren't involved in the recording at all.

Something makes me think that those two are not going to become members of Fleetwood Mac.

yeah... "money"

[jbrownsjr]

They're well paid for what they do -- which is nothing exceptional. I am very fond of them, just from having them on the road with Lindsey and the affection that they, particularly Brett, seem to have for him quite touches me. However, I think they're contributions are fungible -- and I would never want them to be members of FM.

But I have a feeling it's not something I really have to worry about. I don't think adding them would ever occur to the band, so that's a relief.

Michele

I agree... what would the point be? I'm glad Sheryl C never joined either...

FM needs to seriously change their formula, if not the members to get my attention... Things like having Christine play the beautiful intro to Rhiannon was fresh (Dance)... I wished they would have just had Stevie and Christine do a 3 min duo version of that song and moved on....

They just refuse to be interesting.. and that happens when it's not about the music and more about being famous and making money.

Their talent gets hidden in the constant repetition of doing the same thing... It's almost like telling the same joke over and over again... and even tho it was funny at some point.. it's annoying now...

[jbrownsjr]

If the Eagles can put out a multi-platinum record in the 60's- I don't see why Fleetwood Mac couldn't do the same if they really tried~

They stopped trying long ago...

[LikeAWillow]

I've never heard of her crying about no one buying her music. I could see the Lindsey bashing but i've again never seen it. Got examples?

The most depressing and telling instance of this was when she blamed us (her most loyal fans) for the fact that her records don't sell well, saying something along the lines of, "yeah, maybe 30,000 (I have no idea what number she actually gave) hardcore fans buy the album, and then with the click of their fingers, they send it to 6 million of their friends." It's been at least a year since I've read the interview, but I think I've covered the gist of it. She then went on to say that because of this, she's been turned off of recording new music.

If you want the opinion of how Stevie's recent interviews look to someone who isn't a loyal and forgiving fan, see here:

http://www.antiquiet.com/news/editorials/2009/04/stevie-nicks-vs-the-internet/

[LukeA]

If the Eagles can put out a multi-platinum record in the 60's- I don't see why Fleetwood Mac couldn't do the same if they really tried~

Eagles are considerably more popular than Fleetwood Mac at this point- and not because of said album.

[shackin'up]

Do You Think It's Over?

...........No.







.

[wheart]

I personally think it's over. Stevie seems disinterested in recording new material because she and Fleetwood Mac are no longer a platinum selling artists. She also has chronicled how miserable she was during the making of Say You Will, and how she didn't like the end product of the album. She seems perpetually angry with Lindsey too. I see more touring to come, but no more new albums. I just don't think Stevie and Lindsey can find any middle ground or reason to record with Christine the moderator and voice of reason being gone. I don't know that I see more solo albums from Stevie either... and it'll probably be a decade before we see anything from Lindsey again.

I have to agree with you. I just don't think they'll be able to see eye to eye on recording a new album. I pray to God you're wrong about Stevie. I think she's got another solo album or two up her chiffon sleeve. Perhaps that's just wishful thinking. I think for Stevie, a lot of the magic is gone from Fleetwood Mac.

[iamnotafraid]

Heck I thought it was over in 1987, so what do I know?

[BombaySapphire3]

I might not have said it before this last tour but I will now .Stick a fork in em' they're done.Sure they'll continue to tour as long as there is moolah to be made but as far as any real creativiy in the future I just don't see it.

[wheart]

I might not have said it before this last tour but I will now .Stick a fork in em' they're done.Sure they'll continue to tour as long as there is moolah to be made but as far as any real creativiy in the future I just don't see it.

Unless they come up a drastically different show, I don't want them to tour anymore. SYW was good because it had been 6 years since The Dance and they had new songs to perform. The Unleashed Tour (aka Greatest Hits but not really) is a one time only thing. If they come back in a few years and do the same tour, they will have really beaten their legacy into the ground. My suggestion: A Lindsey and Stevie outing, with equal billing and a stripped down band. They could play theatres, with each performing alone and then doing songs together. And I'm not talking about Stand Back, Rhiannon, Go Your Own Way or I'm So Afraid. They would do (gasp) different songs. They would reach into their SOLO catalogs and maybe do a FM song or two (acoustic Gypsy anyone?) I can see it, I can hear it...pure heaven.

[sjpdg]

Nobody here is giving Mick Fleetwood any credit for all the recording he's done. Whether he calls it the Zoo or the Blues Band or something else, he keeps recording every so often.

A few people want a Buckingham Nicks project of some sort or other, but what? An album? A tour? How would that actually differ from the last Mac album or tour?

Others say Fleetwood Mac has another huge tour or two in the future. At what? Age 65? 70?

I think the best thing for Stevie Nicks to do is to park herself at Caesar's Palace or Wynn in Las Vegas for six weeks & do three or four shows a week there. Maybe Mick Fleetwood will drum for her.

I could not agree more!! Mick has put out various projects that nobody bothers to mention. Some good, some not so fantastic, but he keeps going! "Blue Again!" is phenomenal IMHO, and I think we virtually guaranteed more from the MFBB.

I think of anyone, we can expect some new recordings from Mick (in some form or another) more often than Stevie or Lindsey over the next 10 years or so. After that, then maybe we can discuss the "end" of Fleetwood Mac, but not until then.

The idea of Stevie doing the Vegas thing is a great one. It would fit her perfectly. Throw in some guest appearances by Mick, John, Lindsey and Tom Petty and you have quite a show there.

That's my 2 cents. (at this point anyway!!)

[sjpdg]

That's their problem...they've banked their entire 40 year history on one album. And, not even their BEST album (musically speaking) at that.

After all, that is the main reason WHY Peter Green named the band that way. The guitarists, keyboardists, songwriters, singers may come & go, but if Mick's behind the drums and John's anchored next to the drum riser on bass, it's Fleetwood Mac.

You took the words right out of my mouth chiliD!!!! Awesome!!! Hit the nail on the head, knocked the ball out of the park!! PG named the band as such specifically for this reason.

I have a little "conspiracy theory" you may or may not have seen posted on the "Post Rumours" board a while back that talks about what Mick may or may not be planning in the next few years with the MFBB. In summary: If this does turn out to be "the end" of the LB/SN era of FM, then so be it. Stevie will likely record more solo projects (perhaps 2 -3) then retire completely. Lindsey will likely record several more solo projects and possibly tour before he retires. John will either hook up with Mick off and on as part of the MFBB/retro-FM gig or just retire all together. Mick will keep working with Rick on the MFBB and eventually drop all pretence and just call it Fleetwood Mac with John coming in and out as mentioned in between sailing trips and Rick Vito fronting the group. Perhaps Christine will drop in now and again when they play UK/Europe dates, but not likely. She's done. Eventually Mick will become just too damned old to move and finally retire. That will really be "the end".

[brysondt]

Alright, somebody KILL this thread. I don't want to see it anymore. The Mac will never be over. Touring or no touring, they are not over.

[LukeA]

Alright, somebody KILL this thread. I don't want to see it anymore. The Mac will never be over. Touring or no touring, they are not over.

Well, you could alter the course of the thread by providing a compelling argument for that- if you're so sure about it. You know, instead of just "killing" it.

[LiamMcConville]

Well, you could alter the course of the thread by providing a compelling argument for that- if you're so sure about it. You know, instead of just "killing" it.

:lol::laugh::laugh:

[mylittledemon]

I don't think it's over for them. There's something left in this band. What it is, I can't guess.

What I'd like to see is a "two-fer" MAC project (like Buckingham did with his last two solo albums). I'd also like to see Stevie release another solo project! :nod:

[MoonWaterPoet]

I don't think it's over for them. There's something left in this band. What it is, I can't guess.

What I'd like to see is a "two-fer" MAC project (like Buckingham did with his last two solo albums). I'd also like to see Stevie release another solo project! :nod:


I agree Brandon, I don't think it's over... also... I feel like there might be 2 more albums... I especially feel like a new album is in the making right now also... Just my spectulation... I would like to see 2 or 3 more albums, even if they were recording from their walkers and wheel chairs in 10 more years... and didn't tour...

Besides, it's NOT over until the Fat Lady Sings!!! Eh...??? :laugh::laugh::laugh:


Donnie Wayne ~

[mylittledemon]

I agree Brandon, I don't think it's over... also... I feel like there might be 2 more albums...

Besides, it's NOT over until the Fat Lady Sings!!! Eh...??? :laugh::laugh::laugh:

Donnie Wayne ~

I would love to see 2 more albums from them before "retirement." I have a feeling that the band will never really "stop" until one of them dies. And when that happens, they should respectfully take a bow.

[LukeA]

I have a feeling that the band will never really "stop" until one of them dies. And when that happens, they should respectfully take a bow.

I'm assuming you mean one of the current four, right? Something tells me SN/LB/MF/JM aren't going to let a pre-Rumours lineup death get in the way of big paydays.

[newyawka]

I've stated it before, they are done for...bye, bye Fleetwood Mac.

[jbrownsjr]

I'm assuming you mean one of the current four, right? Something tells me SN/LB/MF/JM aren't going to let a pre-Rumours lineup death get in the way of big paydays.

hahahahaha... they'd step right over the dead body thru the stage door if it was a pre-rumours line up...

[gldstwmn]

I have to agree with you. I just don't think they'll be able to see eye to eye on recording a new album. I pray to God you're wrong about Stevie. I think she's got another solo album or two up her chiffon sleeve. Perhaps that's just wishful thinking. I think for Stevie, a lot of the magic is gone from Fleetwood Mac.

I have no doubt she has the songs. I don't think she is willing to do what it takes to market a new record in today's industry. I think the best we could hope for is reissues of Bella and WH with some of the outtakes.

[gldstwmn]

Heck I thought it was over in 1987, so what do I know?

Well in a way it was. That particular version was gone until The Dance. And they created magic again with strong new songs but failed to capitalize on it. Touring be damned, they should have gone into the studio with Chris after that and captured some of that magic.

[vermicious knid]

Stevie could take a lesson from Dolly Parton. She has released 6 albums this decade. She couldn't find a record compay to release her most recent album, so she created a record company to do it. She says "I will never be over. I'll be making records if I have to sell them out of the trunk of my car."

If you are not creating, you are not an artist. Dolly is an artist. Stevie is not.

[mylittledemon]

I've stated it before, they are done for...bye, bye Fleetwood Mac.

Well they are still out there selling a gaggle of concert tickets, and touring the world. So, with respect, you're quite wrong. ;)

[BombaySapphire3]

Stevie could take a lesson from Dolly Parton. She has released 6 albums this decade. She couldn't find a record compay to release her most recent album, so she created a record company to do it. She says "I will never be over. I'll be making records if I have to sell them out of the trunk of my car."

If you are not creating, you are not an artist. Dolly is an artist. Stevie is not.

I have Backwoods Barbie ..I didn't know the part about the record label though.It is a dismal day when that happens to an artist of Dolly's stature but it is great that she released it herself.It is equally dismal that La Nicks still has a record contract but just can't be bothered.

[CADreaming]

Well they are still out there selling a gaggle of concert tickets, and touring the world. So, with respect, you're quite wrong. ;)

:thumbsup: THANK YOU.

[BombaySapphire3]

Well they are still out there selling a gaggle of concert tickets, and touring the world. So, with respect, you're quite wrong. ;)

Speaking for myself I was answering the question from the perspective that as far as creating anything new as artists is it all over for them as a band?They have given no recent indication that the answer to this is anything but yes.If you know of something that would indicate otherwise please let us in on it!

[mylittledemon]

I'm sorry...I'm not following you/ I was responding to "newyaka"s comment about Fleetwood Mac being over with.

[Fleetwoodmark]

Do I think it's over ?.....erm No.

Mick Fleetwood won't let it die, he is the driving force behind it all. Lindsey also seemed very positive in his NZ interview about them putting out another album.

That's all I want, One more kick ass album written from the ground up with proper collaberation and production.

After that they can all retire gracefully and we can celebrate the life of the best band in the world.

[David]

After Fleetwood Mac & its various stringers all retire or die or get raptured skyward or whatever, can THE LEDGE remain with good times, good friends, & good conversation?

That's more important to me. Let's keep The Ledge around for years to come. We can discuss Fleetwood Mac's baroque, classical, romantic, & modern eras from the soon-to-be distant past. We can keep the legend alive.

[Phoenix]

After Fleetwood Mac & its various stringers all retire or die or get raptured skyward or whatever, can THE LEDGE remain with good times, good friends, & good conversation?

That's more important to me. Let's keep The Ledge around for years to come. We can discuss Fleetwood Mac's baroque, classical, romantic, & modern eras from the soon-to-be distant past. We can keep the legend alive.

that sounds good.:thumbsup:

[michelej1]

That's more important to me. Let's keep The Ledge around for years to come. We can discuss Fleetwood Mac's baroque, classical, romantic, & modern eras from the soon-to-be distant past. We can keep the legend alive.

Well, we're getting older too. By the time all the Macsters die, it won't be much longer until we bite the dust too. Michele

[mylittledemon]

I'll be the age they are now when they (the band) are in their 90s.

[wheart]

Stevie could take a lesson from Dolly Parton. She has released 6 albums this decade. She couldn't find a record compay to release her most recent album, so she created a record company to do it. She says "I will never be over. I'll be making records if I have to sell them out of the trunk of my car."

If you are not creating, you are not an artist. Dolly is an artist. Stevie is not.

Stevie used to be an artist but I agree with you, an artist she is no longer. Sorry, Stevie but we calls 'em like we sees 'em

[mylittledemon]

Aww come on now. Once an artist, always an artist. Stevie may not be creating anymore... but...

Hypothetically... if Dali painted his last painting in 1978...and died in 1989 (which he did)... you wouldn't have said he was no longer an artist between '78 to his death, would you? :rolleyes:

[CADreaming]

Aww come on now. Once an artist, always an artist. Stevie may not be creating anymore... but...

Hypothetically... if Dali painted his last painting in 1978...and died in 1989 (which he did)... you wouldn't have said he was no longer an artist between '78 to his death, would you? :rolleyes:

Just because she isn't sharing, doesn't mean she isn't creating...

[mylittledemon]

Also true! ;)

[louielouie2000]

Just because she isn't sharing, doesn't mean she isn't creating...

Exactly. And she actually is doing some of both to a very small degree. She sang a portion of the New Orleans Song in New Orleans earlier this year. So we know she's got new stuff. And she technically shared it. Judging by the crowd's reaction, the fanbase still very much would like to hear new songs. I hope she gets over her insecurities, and gets back to recording.

[BombaySapphire3]

Exactly. And she actually is doing some of both to a very small degree. She sang a portion of the New Orleans Song in New Orleans earlier this year. So we know she's got new stuff. And she technically shared it. Judging by the crowd's reaction, the fanbase still very much would like to hear new songs. I hope she gets over her insecurities, and gets back to recording.

It is preposterous that she has these insecurities now.If you combine her work with Fleetwood Mac with her self penned singles from her first 2 solo albums she is arguably the most successful female singer/songwriter of her time.She did not get there by being insecure.She was in fact a tough single-minded careerist who knew what she wanted and did not give up until she had it.It truly boggles my mind that she is now too insecure to create new music.I'm just not buying it.

[louielouie2000]

It is preposterous that she has these insecurities now.If you combine her work with Fleetwood Mac with her self penned singles from her first 2 solo albums she is arguably the most successful female singer/songwriter of her time.She did not get there by being insecure.She was in fact a tough single-minded careerist who knew what she wanted and did not give up until she had it.It truly boggles my mind that she is now too insecure to create new music.I'm just not buying it.

I think that's exactly the problem though. She was once one of the hottest sex symbols in the world, and anything she touched went platinum. I can't imagine how tough it must be to come down from that. To be a female sex symbol and age. To have each new album sell half of the one before it. To lose popular relevance. While I agree she should just be grateful for the ride she's had thus far, none of us can really know what it's like, because we haven't gone through it. Maybe despite what she says, she really is bitter about not taking time for herself to marry and have kids. Maybe she is angry with herself for losing her forward career momentum and relevance to the Klonopin years. Maybe she's really not over Lindsey, and is upset with herself about that. Who knows. I'd be ok with her leaving her solo career at TISL, but I just really hope Stevie can pull it together for one last decent Mac album... we just can't have SYW be their last effort. :eek:

[BombaySapphire3]

I think that's exactly the problem though. She was once one of the hottest sex symbols in the world, and anything she touched went platinum. I can't imagine how tough it must be to come down from that. To be a female sex symbol and age. To have each new album sell half of the one before it. To lose popular relevance. While I agree she should just be grateful for the ride she's had thus far, none of us can really know what it's like, because we haven't gone through it. Maybe despite what she says, she really is bitter about not taking time for herself to marry and have kids. Maybe she is angry with herself for losing her forward career momentum and relevance to the Klonopin years. Maybe she's really not over Lindsey, and is upset with herself about that. Who knows. I'd be ok with her leaving her solo career at TISL, but I just really hope Stevie can pull it together for one last decent Mac album... we just can't have SYW be their last effort. :eek:

Well if you scroll back a page or two in this thread a poster compared her to Dolly Parton who was herself once a sex symbol and a huge star as well as a great songwriter so she has been where Stevie was and then found herself without even a label to release her most recent album so she put it out herself ,vowing that she will create even if she has to sell her music out of the the trunk of her car.LA Nicks should take a lesson from that.

[louielouie2000]

Well if you scroll back a page or two in this thread a poster compared her to Dolly Parton who was herself once a sex symbol and a huge star as well as a great songwriter so she has been where Stevie was and then found herself without even a label to release her most recent album so she put it out herself ,vowing that she will create even if she has to sell her music out of the the trunk of her car.LA Nicks should take a lesson from that.

Yeah, I saw that. It's astounding to me that somebody of Dolly's stature couldn't get a contract. I hope somebody alerts Stevie to this, because Dolly is a household name far more than she is... I think this could be the slice of humble pie Ms Nicks needs to be served. But then again, in her current state of mind, she'd just blame it on the internet and people stealing music :rolleyes:.

[CADreaming]

Exactly. And she actually is doing some of both to a very small degree. She sang a portion of the New Orleans Song in New Orleans earlier this year. So we know she's got new stuff. And she technically shared it. Judging by the crowd's reaction, the fanbase still very much would like to hear new songs. I hope she gets over her insecurities, and gets back to recording.

I don't think she has "insecurities" about recording as such. I have "heard" that she was trying to get out of her deal with WB for years. So, there could be a lot of reasons behind that or there may be some wars going on with the label. For instance, she may have really wanted to do new material but the label insisted on another repackaging of greatest hits. Statistically, I think it's proven veteran acts sell more greatest hits packages than new releases. Let's not forget what the bottom line is for a label - the almighty dollar. They do not care one iota about creativity. It's a miracle that LB was able to release his last two. There's probably some kind of mutual deal going on that allowed for it.

[Black_Moon]

The first thing we need to do is to stop comparing Stevie to other artists of her time and age. I know it's human nature to want to put things in little boxes, but come on. People react to things in different ways, for instance after the klonopin years Stevie surely should have had a creative spurt from her because she is such a prolific songwriter. To cut a long story short, any inspiration for her when she's at her most creative tends to lead to a song. However, in between the seven years after "Street Angel" there was only one album of fully new material released - I do not count that God awful song "Sweet Girl" on "The Dance" as new material. Maybe she doesn't fully trust in her abilities as an artist anymore? Maybe she doesn't want to deal with the bull**** anymore? Who knows? By pitting her up against other musicians though we're only causing ourselves more despair. People work in different ways.

[CADreaming]

The first thing we need to do is to stop comparing Stevie to other artists of her time and age. I know it's human nature to want to put things in little boxes, but come on. People react to things in different ways, for instance after the klonopin years Stevie surely should have had a creative spurt from her because she is such a prolific songwriter. To cut a long story short, any inspiration for her when she's at her most creative tends to lead to a song. However, in between the seven years after "Street Angel" there was only one album of fully new material released - I do not count that God awful song "Sweet Girl" on "The Dance" as new material. Maybe she doesn't fully trust in her abilities as an artist anymore? Maybe she doesn't want to deal with the bull**** anymore? Who knows? By pitting her up against other musicians though we're only causing ourselves more despair. People work in different ways.

You are assuming that she is able to release/record anything she has written in the past decade. The comparison made earlier with Dolly Parton had nothing to do with the lack of creativity. Actually, just the opposite. Dolly found herself in a position where she had no outlet (record label) for her creativity...and so, she created one. Stevie, being under contractural obligation to WB (until recently, I believe) has simply found herself between a rock and a hard place. It doesn't mean she isn't being creative or that she doesn't have new material, it simply means that her label either isn't interested or they haven't negotiated a deal that she agrees with (or her management agrees with) or both.

I would assume in the current industry climate, there is much discussion over the best ways to market/distribute new material for all artists - and especially vets. Seriously, when the majority of your audience may not be as hip to downloading - what's an artist and record label to do? I have no doubt that Stevie will be creating until she dies - in one form or another - but we may never hear new songs or know what other outlets she has found. I mean, for all we know, she paints all day or does flower arrangements or makes scrapbooks. And, frankly, I'm fine with that. It's just the nature of the beast. One of my favorite singers of all time has lost his voice and while I still hold him in the same affection, it honestly pains me to hear him sing any more. I prefer to remember him with the voice that in my opinion made him the best. Stevie is not naive enough to think that in her backside years everything she does needs to be given to the general public - which is why we had a "greatest hits" tour this summer. And, she was happy. I guarantee it.

None of this means that Fleetwood Mac won't pull off one more album, however. They have alluded to it greatly over the past several months. What remains to be seen is whether it will be a repackaged deal with a couple of newbies thrown in for kicks or if it will be a full new album. Lindsey has said he would like for he and Stevie to write together - and for all we know they have already done that. So, I guess time will tell. I just want them to let us know if they are "done" so I can get on with my life. LOL. ;)

[jbrownsjr]

I thought Sweet Girl was much better than Temporary One or Bleed to Love her or that God awful song My Little Demon... I really don't like it...

[michelej1]

I thought Sweet Girl was much better than Temporary One or Bleed to Love her or that God awful song My Little Demon... I really don't like it...

Be careful. You don't want that demon coming after you! I liked the song, but I liked it better on the GOS demos. Or maybe I liked it equally. I just wish the more serious one, with the slower tempo had been formally recorded.

I don't consider Temporary One and Sweet Girl songs though. When I heard those dogs, I did think it was over:distress:. It's funny because Chris said she had about 40 songs and she gave FM 10 to listen to and that was the one they chose. Huh? That's frightening. There were 9 other songs that were worse than that or did they just like the message in Temporary One? Did it remind them of FM's reunion, even though it wasn't really written about FM.

Michele

[Musicman408]

They stopped trying long ago...

Well that is very sad then! :(

[GypsyBlueEyes]

aww, I really love Sweet Girl. :angel:

[Dodfather]

I thought Sweet Girl was much better than Temporary One or Bleed to Love her or that God awful song My Little Demon... I really don't like it...

I have totally the opposite view of this - I really like both My Little Demon and Temporary One! They're both great to sing along to whereas Sweet Girl just doesn't do much for me at all. It's just kind of a repetitous melody line that goes nowhere. Yes, the other 2 songs may be similar in that way but they have a spark to them that I think Sweet Girl totally lacks, and I'm a huge Stevie fan!

Hey ho though, not everyone can agree. That's what makes things interesting!

[jbrownsjr]

Be careful. You don't want that demon coming after you! I liked the song, but I liked it better on the GOS demos. Or maybe I liked it equally. I just wish the more serious one, with the slower tempo had been formally recorded.

I don't consider Temporary One and Sweet Girl songs though. When I heard those dogs, I did think it was over:distress:. It's funny because Chris said she had about 40 songs and she gave FM 10 to listen to and that was the one they chose. Huh? That's frightening. There were 9 other songs that were worse than that or did they just like the message in Temporary One? Did it remind them of FM's reunion, even though it wasn't really written about FM.

Michele


I love the melodic feel in the chorus of Sweet Girl... Wow 10 songs!!! maybe Christine presented them with Easy Come Easy Go... lol....

How good would Friend have been on that Dance tour!!!

[daniellaaarisen]

I adore Sweet Girl. :shrug:

[LukeA]

Wow 10 songs!!! maybe Christine presented them with Easy Come Easy Go... lol....

Yes- those were the two they rehearsed, and they went with Temporary One.

[CADreaming]

Yes- those were the two they rehearsed, and they went with Temporary One.

Just so Lindsey could say she burned her bridges for the next ten years.

[Black_Moon]

I adore Sweet Girl. :shrug:

I think of other songs that were written in this time period - "Love Is", "Have No Heart" etc. - and whether or not they were written for "Trouble in Shangri-La" is permitting, but why oh why did Fleetwood Mac choose to use "Sweet Girl"? I generally adore Stevie's songs, but no matter how much I try to listen to this my hand is itching for the skip button.

[jbrownsjr]

Yes- those were the two they rehearsed, and they went with Temporary One.

I don't like either of those songs...

[jbrownsjr]

I adore Sweet Girl. :shrug:

Me2... I love they lyrics and the melody...

[michelej1]

I don't like either of those songs...

Many people say that Friend sounds just like FM. I never thought it myself, but a lot of people do. Michele

[louielouie2000]

I think of other songs that were written in this time period - "Love Is", "Have No Heart" etc. - and whether or not they were written for "Trouble in Shangri-La" is permitting, but why oh why did Fleetwood Mac choose to use "Sweet Girl"? I generally adore Stevie's songs, but no matter how much I try to listen to this my hand is itching for the skip button.

Because it's a song about Stevie's career in Fleetwood Mac, and it has a very Macish sound. I can't think of a more appropriate song for her to record for the Dance than Sweet Girl. It's one of those 'full circle' songs.

[Black_Moon]

Because it's a song about Stevie's career in Fleetwood Mac, and it has a very Macish sound. I can't think of a more appropriate song for her to record for the Dance than Sweet Girl. It's one of those 'full circle' songs.

Still... no. I think it's the melody that annoys me the most. I keep waiting for a crescendo, or just something to happen, and it doesn't.

[jbrownsjr]

Still... no. I think it's the melody that annoys me the most. I keep waiting for a crescendo, or just something to happen, and it doesn't.

I think you get your crescendo in the chorus...

I chose to dance across the stages of the world.........
Every said I'd never learn....
But IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII still hear your words....
I've waited all my life for you!!...


from the sort of mundane verses...
mp - mf of...

And he says, what do you love to do?
Outside your world,
Who spends timewith you?
Whom do you love when youre not working?


What I might agree with you on is they need that blow out in this tune like silver springs.... where she really starts howling her cries... (she's good at that and maybe could have done more with it here)

[jbrownsjr]

Hey CalDreamin... I totally forgot she says ghost through the fog in Sweet Girl.... lol....

:p

[Musicman408]

Love Temporary One and Sweet Girl (actually thinking about doing a live cover of this). My Little Demon is good- but the weird demon noises are confusing!

[Angel69]

Well they are still out there selling a gaggle of concert tickets, and touring the world. So, with respect, you're quite wrong. ;)

I still feel there is a market for Fleetwood Mac. If Madison Square Garden holds say 19,000 seats, 15 of them were sold for their show there in June. All this after basically saturating the NY area market. I also went to look at a house today and while in one of the kids bedrooms, there were cd racks. So of course I had to look and sure enough this guy had all of BN era Fleetwood Mac cd's. He also had all of Stevie's solo discs and Lindsey's. They were there along with NIN, Metallica, Led Zeppelin, Pearl Jam etc etc. My friends 16 year old daughter loves them. Ans about a month ago i had one of my FM t-shirts on and this girl (about 13) told me she loves them and went to their MSG concert with her older sister. So I dont feel its time to write them off just yet.

As for the sets being stale. Eh. They still put on a great show and from the looks of the crowd reaction, a satisfying one.

[MoonWaterPoet]

Because it's a song about Stevie's career in Fleetwood Mac, and it has a very Macish sound. I can't think of a more appropriate song for her to record for the Dance than Sweet Girl. It's one of those 'full circle' songs.


I agree Louie... I love "Sweet Girl"... It has special meaning to me from a journal/letter that I gave to Stevie at her 'Street Angel' tour concert when I saw her in Dallas, September 10th 1994... on the 'Street Angel' tour, prior to the Dance album and tour...


Donnie Wayne ~

[LukeA]

I still feel there is a market for Fleetwood Mac. If Madison Square Garden holds say 19,000 seats, 15 of them were sold for their show there in June.

http://www.yahoofreak.com/animated%20emoticons/Lol%20Animated%20Emoticons/disco.gif

This show did about 6K paid.

[Nikolaj]

After Fleetwood Mac & its various stringers all retire or die or get raptured skyward or whatever, can THE LEDGE remain with good times, good friends, & good conversation?

That's more important to me. Let's keep The Ledge around for years to come. We can discuss Fleetwood Mac's baroque, classical, romantic, & modern eras from the soon-to-be distant past. We can keep the legend alive.

David, I think you're more right than you even know! To me, The Ledge is almost the only interesting thing about being a Fleetwood Mac fan right now- the band gives us no new inspiration and it's depressing- they haven't done a thing for their fans in ages. They wouldn't even sit together for photos for a new tourbook or get one lousy single (or a great one) up on the Net, or in stores, or do anything significant with their website. The tour is nice, but they are doing it for them, for sure. It certainly isn't interesting or imaginative, musically, its so predictable, and need not be. As long as 'Dreams' is so stagnantly placed in their set as song 2 or 3, as it has been for 30 years, the concert fights an uphill battle to be exciting, whereas if it were placed late in the set, it'd actually build some anticipation for it and not just slow the concert down. Little things can mean a lot. And LB I think would be willing to shake things up a bit, but apparantly he's outvoted. They are on their huge money-making quest, and I enjoyed the show, but found it very stultifying that basically the years 1975 through 1982 were what was represented, and not even in an interesting enough way.
The Ledge keeps it alive for me, because it's lean times for longtime fans. They are raking in many millions of dollars on this greatest hits 'Unleashed' tour- they should put free new music up on their website if they are so disenchanted with the recording industry. Like that would happen- and most of us would be willing to pay for downloads of unreleased demos we already have to support the band, but again, they just aren't interested in throwing us even a bone in their commerce-driven 'Unleashed' venture- I have nothing against commerce or greatest hits, but they need to find a balance, because Fleetwood Mac is about the music, and there hasn't been ANY new music in 7 years.

[tuigirl]

nikolaj..wow..interesting post and I think I can agree with you. Maybe this is why, I've gone off them a bit and onto other newer people ( I kept thinking their music and concert material , I'd seen and heard on youtube lately has become ...dare I say it gereatric).Lindsey, is the one to appeal to, for shaking things up, but if he's out voted then what can he do? I think your suggestion of song rotation might be the only answer, they need to sit down and check out other artists and see, how they do it.

[GypsyBlueEyes]

One thing I would really like to see them do in the future is just loosen up...everything is planned now to the smallest detail...its just way too polished. I don't know that they are aware of how much is lost when you do that. Spontaneity is so important. If the performance is less than extraordinary it might be because they're so damn bored doing and saying the same thing over and over and over. Remember the days when you never knew what the hell Stevie was going to say or exactly how they were going to interact with each other?? I say just go out there and do whatever comes natural to you at the moment...don't think about it...just feel it. Isn't that what you're supposed to do with music anyway??? I think that throwing out their carefully crafted rule book would do a lot to breathe new life into the show...and they'd probably start to enjoy it a lot more too.

[Peestie]

One thing I would really like to see them do in the future is just loosen up...everything is planned now to the smallest detail...its just way too polished.

And the worst thing is that this is exactly what Lindsey does on his solo tours so he knows how to do it. Check out the UTS tour where he'd take requests at the end of the show. He didn't do it much until the second half of the GOS tour but I think he was just settling in to the new tour and new material. As Blues players I'm sure Mick and John know how to loosen up and play around with the set and improvise and I bet Stevie could do it as well. It's just a pity that they get into the Mac-machine and suddenly they have to give the audience "product" rather than "music".

[LukeA]

The average person who pays ~$150 to see Fleetwood Mac in 2009 doesn't want to see them do anything other than the hits. Its not like Bruce Springsteen, where the fan base actually clamors to hear songs rarely performed.

This is the conundrum. If FM started a tour and they mixed things up every night for a handful of songs for the first couple shows, word would get out, and it wouldn't be good. 13,000 people- only 1,500 are going to even recognize (however vaguely), say, "Straight Back". Not worth it.

[vivfox]

The average person who pays ~$150 to see Fleetwood Mac in 2009 doesn't want to see them do anything other than the hits. Its not like Bruce Springsteen, where the fan base actually clamors to hear songs rarely performed.

This is the conundrum. If FM started a tour and they mixed things up every night for a handful of songs for the first couple shows, word would get out, and it wouldn't be good. 13,000 people- only 1,500 are going to even recognize (however vaguely), say, "Straight Back". Not worth it.

So very sad but so very true.

<a href="http://s220.photobucket.com/albums/dd169/cielosharon/?action=view&current=638.gif" target="_blank"><img src="http://i220.photobucket.com/albums/dd169/cielosharon/638.gif" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

[GypsyBlueEyes]

And the worst thing is that this is exactly what Lindsey does on his solo tours so he knows how to do it. Check out the UTS tour where he'd take requests at the end of the show. He didn't do it much until the second half of the GOS tour but I think he was just settling in to the new tour and new material. As Blues players I'm sure Mick and John know how to loosen up and play around with the set and improvise and I bet Stevie could do it as well. It's just a pity that they get into the Mac-machine and suddenly they have to give the audience "product" rather than "music".

I think it amazing that Lindsey was able to do that! I guess maybe its easier to do things like that when its just one person as opposed to a whole band. :shrug: Its the small stuff that I think is most important. Everything is so planned out...they stand in the exact same places and say the exact same things night after night. It would be great if they would switch the sets around a bit instead of putting on the exact same show night after night. Mostly, though, I just want them to go out and get lost in the experience of being on stage the same way the audience can get lost in the performance. I don't know how to explain it...it just seems that there was an air of freedom that they lack now.

[holidayroad]

Isn't it sort of weird though that after all this time Lindsey agreed to do something like the Unleashed tour...not that I'm knocking it. I was right there in the audience with everyone else and loved every second of it. Still, I worried when it was first announced that it was a sign that he may be over FM as an artistic endeavor...I was just really surprised that he of all people didn't push to record new material. All these years he has been the leader of the group in terms of putting together an album...Mick, I'm really not sure what exactly he wants (other than play his drums and have fun, though I do believe he wants the group to stay together) and John never says anything! I really don't think the problem is so much with Stevie...I think she's just waiting for Lindsey to decide that he's ready to really do something with the group as opposed to the same thing they've been doing (hopefully reinvent themselves somehow)...I think if he is passionate about it, she will be right there with him.
I agree it was strange for Lindsey to go on the road without a new FM album. Maybe he was thinking that as long as he makes the record company money on the road with FM that he will be able to keep doing his solo albums, (whether they make money or not) and not be dropped from the label.
I worry about the future of Fleetwood Mac too. Lindsey is my fave and I feel he would probably take more chances on different directions for FM if he could. As for Stevie waiting for Lindsey to "decide he's ready to do something different", I don't know if that's an issue. I guess they're all afraid to reinvent the band for fear of losing "us" (faithful fans). I do feel they could get out in the public more, not just for concerts, but out connecting with all of us who have stood by them through all these changes. Maybe we expect too much, I don't know. I just want FM to be successful
and sell more albums to new fans also, but without the members of FM feeling like they are "selling out"

[TrueFaith77]

They just need to follow this formula:

1. Stevie, write 6 songs about Lindsey that are constructed around private, mystical metaphors.

2. Lindsey, write 6 songs about Stevie spiked by sexual innuendo, double entendre, puns, and grunts/groans.

3. Alternate between tracks that are rockin' and tracks that are (very) pretty.

4. Title it: Rumours II.

That would be bliss.

[GypsyBlueEyes]

^lol...wouldn't it be funny that after all these years of them trying to do something "not Rumours," doing another Rumours themed album would be the thing that put them back on top :lol: You know what they say..."if it ain't broke..." :p

[michelej1]

They just need to follow this formula:

1. Stevie, write 6 songs about Lindsey that are constructed around private, mystical metaphors.

2. Lindsey, write 6 songs about Stevie spiked by sexual innuendo, double entendre, puns, and grunts/groans.

3. Alternate between tracks that are rockin' and tracks that are (very) pretty.

4. Title it: Rumours II.

That would be bliss.

You know what was funny to me reading interviews from 1976 http://www.ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showthread.php?t=41594is that even then Lindsey was looking beyond Rumours (the album that had not even been released yet). He told Cameron Crowe that he didn't think making an album that would follow up to the White album would be hard and now that the new album was about to be released, he looked forward to getting back in the studio after the tour:

I'd really like to develop in the studio with this band. Ater the album comes out and we complete the road cycle that will follow it, we're going to lay back a little and spend the time to refine our work even further.


He was saying as soon as they got off the Rumours tour, maybe they could spend time in the studio with each other. Even though he was praising the new album, even then Rumours seemed something he wanted to get past, so he could return to the studio. Little did he know he'd still be trying to do the same thing 35 years later.

Michele

[tuigirl]

They just need to follow this formula:

1. Stevie, write 6 songs about Lindsey that are constructed around private, mystical metaphors.

2. Lindsey, write 6 songs about Stevie spiked by sexual innuendo, double entendre, puns, and grunts/groans.

3. Alternate between tracks that are rockin' and tracks that are (very) pretty.

4. Title it: Rumours II.

That would be bliss.

OMG, I think you've got it, this would be perfect :] and to add, sit down and watch 52 Slowride videos of Adam and Allison on the 2009 Idol tour and see how to change it up every night for 50 nights.brilliant

[~GoldDustWoman~]

Wow I never knew that this thread was going to be so popular!

[CADreaming]

You picked a good title.

[David]

Wow I never knew that this thread was going to be so popular!
You're my favorite ledgie of all time -- & that's no mean feat.
I find that I relate best to you & your thought processes.

[jbrownsjr]

You're my favorite ledgie of all time -- & that's no mean feat.
I find that I relate best to you & your thought processes.

Tell me Lies tell me sweet little lies....

[jbrownsjr]

The average person who pays ~$150 to see Fleetwood Mac in 2009 doesn't want to see them do anything other than the hits. Its not like Bruce Springsteen, where the fan base actually clamors to hear songs rarely performed.

This is the conundrum. If FM started a tour and they mixed things up every night for a handful of songs for the first couple shows, word would get out, and it wouldn't be good. 13,000 people- only 1,500 are going to even recognize (however vaguely), say, "Straight Back". Not worth it.

So that's why Steve Winwood tours 3000 seat arenas... But his shows are sooooo damn good!!!

[Nikolaj]

Originally Posted by LukeA
The average person who pays ~$150 to see Fleetwood Mac in 2009 doesn't want to see them do anything other than the hits. Its not like Bruce Springsteen, where the fan base actually clamors to hear songs rarely performed.

This is the conundrum. If FM started a tour and they mixed things up every night for a handful of songs for the first couple shows, word would get out, and it wouldn't be good. 13,000 people- only 1,500 are going to even recognize (however vaguely), say, "Straight Back". Not worth it.
Then vivfox agreed:
So very sad but so very true.

Sorry guys, but I totally disagree. The concert stage was not besieged by angry mobs nor was there a massive exodus to the restrooms by audiences on the last 2 tours when 'Beautiful Child', 'I Know I'm Not Wrong', 'Eyes of the World' or 'Storms' were given a place in the set. 3 of these songs were not from a #1 album, while 'Straight Back' was from a #1 album, it's a known song, potentially, by anyone who had the album. I never wrote 'don't play the hits', I meant there's more than enough material for the band to play along with the hits, as they have been doing, but not to the extent that I feel would make for a better concert. 'Gypsy' is a disaster and needs to go, that's one hit that Stevie sounds embarassingly inept performing live now, and 'Straight Back' would have to be a huge improvement.
With 'Tango' being so huge a cd in Europe, they'd be wise to play the title track, and near the start of the show, to show they can be more adventurous and give their fans more than the very same songs, as always, from the first notes played, for much of the concert; and/or SevenWonders, its not like I'm suggesting they do something obscure like 'Mick the Screecher' :)
I also don't agree with the position expressed (and also by Stevie) that 'the average person' attends their concerts. I think their audience vastly are repeat customers and is the audience they've held onto for 30+years (or from the start of Stevie's solo career circa 1982). It's only right to represent more of their songwriting catalogue than the band has been willing to attempt, thus far. An 'average fan' doesn't shell out several hundreds of dollars for 1 or 2 seats to see a band they don't care much about. I'm a 'casual' fan of some bands like Heart, and would go see Heart for a reasonable ticket price of under $75 or so, but passed on their double-bill with Journey for $140 that played here in CT this month.
People could handle one or 2 new songs, most of the hits, and a rotation of album cuts, like 'Thrown Down' or a mashup of 'Big Love' with 'Everybody Finds Out'. It might take editing of the teleprompter between the 'Go To Tent' messages the band relies on, but it could be done. One writer here who pointed out the lack of any spontaneous moment in the 'Unleashed' set hit the nail right on the head.
Underestimating an audiences attention span is a good way to maintain some lazy performing habits.
I do see your points, just don't agree in this case, cheers, regardless :)
(and 'Roseanne' and 'Frazier' and 'Friends')

[CADreaming]

Underestimating an audiences attention span is a good way to maintain some lazy performing habits.

:lol::lol: Good point!

[Nikolaj]

You're my favorite ledgie of all time -- & that's no mean feat.
I find that I relate best to you & your thought processes.

Not to take away from GoldDustWoman, but I suspect you actually mean GldDstWmn, without the vowels, who has had an amazing presence in her writings here for years.
Whichever, may they both 'rock on' here on The Ledge for years :)

[mylittledemon]

4. Title it: Rumours II.



:lol:

Yeah sure. Exit Buckingham for the 2nd time.

[BombaySapphire3]

Not to take away from GoldDustWoman, wonderful in her own right, but I suspect you actually mean GldDstWmn, without the vowels, who has had an amazing presence in her writings here for years.
Whichever, may they both 'rock on' here on The Ledge for years :)

He may be getting up there but I think he can still discern the difference between the 2 aforementioned posters.:laugh:

[nailatixela]

:lol:

Yeah sure. Exit Buckingham for the 2nd time.

They can name it Tusk two just to make him happy.

[gldstwmn]

I think of other songs that were written in this time period - "Love Is", "Have No Heart" etc. - and whether or not they were written for "Trouble in Shangri-La" is permitting, but why oh why did Fleetwood Mac choose to use "Sweet Girl"? I generally adore Stevie's songs, but no matter how much I try to listen to this my hand is itching for the skip button.

The demo is great. The Dance version reminds me of the Allman Brothers. :shrug:

[gldstwmn]

Many people say that Friend sounds just like FM. I never thought it myself, but a lot of people do. Michele

It would have sounded better with FM. :sorry:

[gldstwmn]

I think you get your crescendo in the chorus...

I chose to dance across the stages of the world.........
Every said I'd never learn....
But IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII still hear your words....
I've waited all my life for you!!...


Or
I want to fly across the world
In a golden ball
Many of the cities
Well I never saw at all
Sometimes I think I was always on call
Sometimes even I am allowed to fall
He said come down here for a minute
Sweet girl

[gldstwmn]

Love Temporary One and Sweet Girl (actually thinking about doing a live cover of this). My Little Demon is good- but the weird demon noises are confusing!

I also thought Bleed To Love Her was fantastic.

[gldstwmn]

Not to take away from GoldDustWoman, wonderful in her own right, but I suspect you actually mean GldDstWmn, without the vowels, who has had an amazing presence in her writings here for years.
Whichever, may they both 'rock on' here on The Ledge for years :)

Yes. I'll marry you. :laugh:

[jbrownsjr]

I also thought Bleed To Love Her was fantastic.

I liked it a lot when I saw it for the first time... but I don't think it compares to Sweet Girl...

I guess I love the message in Sweet Girl as well... it's such a compelling romantic story...

[gldstwmn]

I liked it a lot when I saw it for the first time... but I don't think it compares to Sweet Girl...

I guess I love the message in Sweet Girl as well... it's such a compelling romantic story...

Stevie does one of her trademark songwriting tricks with the 'track a ghost though the fog' lyric. I love it when she does that. Lindsey does it too. For some reason I always think of her grandfather when I hear this song.

[jbrownsjr]

Stevie does one of her trademark songwriting tricks with the 'track a ghost though the fog' lyric. I love it when she does that. Lindsey does it too. For some reason I always think of her grandfather when I hear this song.

I guess i really appreciate what Stevie had forgone to lead the life she had... and I know she would do it all over again...

[tuigirl]

:lol:

Yeah sure. Exit Buckingham for the 2nd time.

Noooo, he can't do that, he's the ONLY one who could actually make it happen!!!

[mylittledemon]

I also thought Bleed To Love Her was fantastic.

Yup. Best new song on "The Dance."

[TrueFaith77]

They can name it Tusk two just to make him happy.

(that was (almost) say you will)

I'm actually serious about Rumours II, by the way. That phrase has entered the mythology -- put there by Lindsey himself; I'd think he might actually appreciate the irony. Besides, it's what the world wants/needs: a continuation or a resolution. That's why "Silver Springs" rocked the 90s.

[Erin]

Sorry guys, but I totally disagree. The concert stage was not besieged by angry mobs nor was there a massive exodus to the restrooms by audiences on the last 2 tours when 'Beautiful Child', 'I Know I'm Not Wrong', 'Eyes of the World' or 'Storms' were given a place in the set. 3 of these songs were not from a #1 album, while 'Straight Back' was from a #1 album, it's a known song, potentially, by anyone who had the album. I never wrote 'don't play the hits', I meant there's more than enough material for the band to play along with the hits, as they have been doing, but not to the extent that I feel would make for a better concert. 'Gypsy' is a disaster and needs to go, that's one hit that Stevie sounds embarassingly inept performing live now, and 'Straight Back' would have to be a huge improvement.
With 'Tango' being so huge a cd in Europe, they'd be wise to play the title track, and near the start of the show, to show they can be more adventurous and give their fans more than the very same songs, as always, from the first notes played, for much of the concert; and/or SevenWonders, its not like I'm suggesting they do something obscure like 'Mick the Screecher' :)
I also don't agree with the position expressed (and also by Stevie) that 'the average person' attends their concerts. I think their audience vastly are repeat customers and is the audience they've held onto for 30+years (or from the start of Stevie's solo career circa 1982). It's only right to represent more of their songwriting catalogue than the band has been willing to attempt, thus far. An 'average fan' doesn't shell out several hundreds of dollars for 1 or 2 seats to see a band they don't care much about. I'm a 'casual' fan of some bands like Heart, and would go see Heart for a reasonable ticket price of under $75 or so, but passed on their double-bill with Journey for $140 that played here in CT this month.
People could handle one or 2 new songs, most of the hits, and a rotation of album cuts, like 'Thrown Down' or a mashup of 'Big Love' with 'Everybody Finds Out'. It might take editing of the teleprompter between the 'Go To Tent' messages the band relies on, but it could be done. One writer here who pointed out the lack of any spontaneous moment in the 'Unleashed' set hit the nail right on the head.
Underestimating an audiences attention span is a good way to maintain some lazy performing habits.
I do see your points, just don't agree in this case, cheers, regardless :)
(and 'Roseanne' and 'Frazier' and 'Friends')

Unfortunately I've encountered many of the casual fan types who shelled out the big bucks for these shows. In fact that's usually the type of "fan" I'm surrounded by at the front, whether at Stevie or Fleetwood Mac shows (Lindsey is different). There are exceptions of course (and the people who manage to get up front despite where they're supposed to be sitting:p) Stevie is right they don't want to hear anything different, and for the few songs that are not "hits" they do go to the bathroom and for more beer. Why they pay so much for these seats and don't enjoy the show is beyond me. It's too bad the band is unwilling to play smaller venues so they could be more creative in their set list.

[TrueFaith77]

Well they aren't entirely uncreative in the setlist. I think it's shame that it doesn't change, but the following were nice additions:

Monday Morning
I Know I'm Not Wrong
Go Insane (full band)
Storms
Say You Love Me
Oh Well

Actually, now that I list it, that's not that many. :laugh: But still, they aren't the usual suspects.

[David]

I'm actually serious about Rumours II, by the way. That phrase has entered the mythology -- put there by Lindsey himself; I'd think he might actually appreciate the irony. Besides, it's what the world wants/needs: a continuation or a resolution. That's why "Silver Springs" rocked the 90s.Of course, the phrase seems to mean something different to each person. I think I know what Lindsey meant by it, but I don't know what you mean by it or what another ledgie means by it. Based on what I mean by it, it would be impossible at this stage.

[David]

Monday Morning
I Know I'm Not Wrong
Say You Love Me
Oh Well
But remember that these are just revivals of once-frequently-performed songs.

[Black_Moon]

(that was (almost) say you will)

I'm actually serious about Rumours II, by the way. That phrase has entered the mythology -- put there by Lindsey himself; I'd think he might actually appreciate the irony. Besides, it's what the world wants/needs: a continuation or a resolution. That's why "Silver Springs" rocked the 90s.

Okay, I'll put forward my interpretation of "Rumours II", based on what you said. This will be a wild guess!

After the thirty-two years of turmoil, angst, and more love affairs than The Tudors could ever have hoped for, Fleetwood Mac need to end their recording career (assuming the "next" album would be the last) reflecting on this. Like "Rumours" did, but a continuation of the album. So, back to the Southern Californian sound Buckingham-Nicks had when they first joined the band, with just tight harmonies and the narrative to carry the songs.

[wheart]

I adore Sweet Girl. :shrug:

I adore the demo version,not the FM version. Quite a difference between the two.

[GypsyBlueEyes]

It's too bad the band is unwilling to play smaller venues so they could be more creative in their set list.

I absolutely agree with this! It wouldn't mean that they would have to give up the big tours and all the money...but as a fan who appreciates more than just the hits I would love the opportunity to see them do something on a smaller, more initmate scale :nod:

[TrueFaith77]

Okay, I'll put forward my interpretation of "Rumours II", based on what you said. This will be a wild guess!

After the thirty-two years of turmoil, angst, and more love affairs than The Tudors could ever have hoped for, Fleetwood Mac need to end their recording career (assuming the "next" album would be the last) reflecting on this. Like "Rumours" did, but a continuation of the album. So, back to the Southern Californian sound Buckingham-Nicks had when they first joined the band, with just tight harmonies and the narrative to carry the songs.

That's pretty close to what I mean. Sequels are underrated. Lindsey's sarcastic expression "Rumours II" refers to a formula to be followed (this album needs a "Go Your Own Way", this album needs a "Dreams") and commercial considerations foisted upon artists by the industry. But as history has shown, sequels can also be liberating. In movie terms, Godfather II & III, Robocop 2, Empire Strikes Back, Another 48 Hours, Gremlins 2: A New Batch, Crank 2: High Voltage all are examples of sequels that deepened the proven appeal of their popular predecessors.

I think there is something joyful in the formula that I described, that can be enriched, now, by the fact that Stevie and Lindsey are. . . older. Songs like "Thrown Down" and "Under the Skin" suggest that they are still responding to each other in fascinating, complicating ways that illuminate all human experience. The pop audience has an investment in the relationship these two share: 12 songs to explicate its various nuances could be a beautiful thing.

I think that kind of lazer-focus can be freeing.

But I wouldn't want this to be a goodbye. AFTER Rumours II, I'd be all for the Fleetwood Mac political album: Stevie's songs about Iraq War veterans & Katrina; Lindsey's songs about the decline of the music industry & his struggles to maintain his artistic integrity within it. Imagine those two perspectives interwoven. Marx would approve.

Call that political album: Vampire Song

:)

[holidayroad]

Unfortunately I've encountered many of the casual fan types who shelled out the big bucks for these shows. In fact that's usually the type of "fan" I'm surrounded by at the front, whether at Stevie or Fleetwood Mac shows (Lindsey is different). There are exceptions of course (and the people who manage to get up front despite where they're supposed to be sitting:p) Stevie is right they don't want to hear anything different, and for the few songs that are not "hits" they do go to the bathroom and for more beer. Why they pay so much for these seats and don't enjoy the show is beyond me. It's too bad the band is unwilling to play smaller venues so they could be more creative in their set list.

I also think FM should play smaller venues and there ought to be a way for all of us serious fans to have the good seats!! I know casual fans bring in money but the faithful are the ones out there buying the new albums and the ones who will stick by the band no matter what!!

[~GoldDustWoman~]

I definently think ya'll are referring to the other GDW, I am the newbie who is the PETA member hippie Marine...nuff' said.

[BombaySapphire3]

I definently think ya'll are referring to the other GDW, I am the newbie who is the PETA member hippie Marine...nuff' said.

You left out Wiccan ?:shrug:

[~GoldDustWoman~]

You left out Wiccan ?:shrug:

Sorry! Yes: The tree hugging, Wiccan, PETA member, hippie US Marine. Wait til I get out of the Marines...it's on then....life will be interesting!....now...i'm off to go swim....blah taking swim lessons to get better.

[BombaySapphire3]

Sorry! Yes: The tree hugging, Wiccan, PETA member, hippie US Marine. Wait til I get out of the Marines...it's on then....life will be interesting!....now...i'm off to go swim....blah taking swim lessons to get better.

Cool I'm a tree hugger too! And where I live north of San Francisco there are plenty of tress to hug. My favorite even over the Redwoods are the Oaks leading me to believe I am probably a Druid.

[jbrownsjr]

Cool I'm a tree hugger too! And where I live north of San Francisco there are plenty of tress to hug. My favorite even over the Redwoods are the Oaks leading me to believe I am probably a Druid.

I like Sequoias too...

[~GoldDustWoman~]

I meant tree hugger as a joke! LOL But I love nature and animals as Wiccans do! I love to look up at night and feel that feeling of how little we are compared to the stars and moon. Also when I look at the trees and stuff I feel like it so amazing to have such a beautiful world that we live in. Also I love to see animals when i'm around they usually show up! LOL!

I have to admit myself (and my mom who is also Wiccan) are part of the "Stevie is a Wiccan" group....btw as i've expressed before please don't say witch! I hate that, because there is a difference between practicing that and Wicca. Wicca is a religion where you worship the God and Goddess or just the Goddess depending on your preference with the spells and rituals in order to help you out in life or to worship. As for just practicing witchcraft its all just spells. And Wiccans follow the Wiccan Rede: "An it harm none, do what ye will". There i'm off my rant....just wanted to express why I hate being called a WITCH! Granted you can be called a witch as a Wiccan it just drives me crazy! I hate when my Sgt's pull that I actually have a Sgt who lives 40 mins from Salem so he loves to pull that.

[BombaySapphire3]

I hike all the time in the parks of the coastal ranges and literally lay hands on trees and feel that Oak trees in particular have great spiritual enegry.the tradition of worshipping Oaks can be found in many pre-Christian religions not only the Driuids of the British Isles but the people in ancient Greece venerated them.I feel a great peace and connection with the Earth when I am in these groves.I am not part of a formal group but if there are any Druids in the North bay reading this fell free to PM.:wavey:

[~GoldDustWoman~]

Don't know too much about it but hey I feel a bit better at least knowing there is someone who at least knows a bit of where i'm coming from! :D

Also btw going off on that rant reminds me of Stevie! HA I'm not a witch! :D

[markolas]

Whoever posted the link to the "Stevie Hates the Internet" article: that pretty much sums up how I feel about the woman these days, as talented as I think she was in her heyday, and as much I will always love her work with FM and much (most?) of her solo material.

I originally became a fan watching VH1 Storytellers all those years ago, where she portrayed herself as this artiste, and was disillusioned when she went from that to caring more about her image as an arena rock diva or some such hooey. I went through a period of about two years where I didn't listen to her or FM at all - I've started doing so again, and while I will always love her music, it isn't quite the same and likely never will be.

As far as it being over...I would be utterly shocked if Stevie ever released another solo album - in 2002, if you'd have told me that Joni Mitchell would release another album, and LB would release two more solo albums before Stevie did, I'd have thought you were out of your everloving mind. I think it's even less likely FM will do another album. Stevie will probably continue to tour for a few more years, but as far as doing anything creative either solo or as part of FM - I'll be very surprised, to say the least. This tour is probably the end of the road for FM and they all must know it on some level.

[BombaySapphire3]

. This tour is probably the end of the road for FM and they all must know it on some level.

The rest of the post is pretty accurate but does anybody believe that as money grubbing as this band has become that they will not milk the inevitable round of "farewell tours"?

[LukeA]

The rest of the post is pretty accurate but does anybody believe that as money grubbing as this band has become that they will not milk the inevitable round of "farewell tours"?

Lindsey's the wild card here, but, yes, they'll most definitely be back for one final go-round.

It'll probably have to wait until '11 or '12, since they needlessly oversaturated North America this year. Probably '12- economy should be better, 35th anniversary of Rumours, maybe a new Greatest Hits package with a few new by-the-numbers songs that blatantly allude to the journey the band has had, etc. And- the most important- the pièce de résistance - a nice big fat juicy lucrative 100 date arena Farewell Tour that will, for the very first time, entirely focus on/celebrate the hits.

[louielouie2000]

Lindsey's the wild card here, but, yes, they'll most definitely be back for one final go-round.

It'll probably have to wait until '11 or '12, since they needlessly oversaturated North America this year. Probably '12- economy should be better, 35th anniversary of Rumours, maybe a new Greatest Hits package with a few new by-the-numbers songs that blatantly allude to the journey the band has had, etc. And- the most important- the pièce de résistance - a nice big fat juicy lucrative 100 date arena Farewell Tour that will, for the very first time, entirely focus on/celebrate the hits.

I'd be willing to bet money on the fact you've pretty much nailed the Mac's future. Markolas really wrapped up things in a tidy bow too: when they agreed to do this oldies tour, that was the final nail in the coffin of the Fleetwood Mac creative legacy. It's unfortunate, because there is still so much potential left. But at least we aren't caught off guard and surprised... we know the band is dying a painfully slow, agonizing public death. I still think Stevie needs to be burned at the stake like the WITCH she is for killing the band :lol: :xoxo: . We get it that she's unhappy and insecure, but did she really have to take the sorry @ss remnants of FM down with her?? :shrug:

[markolas]

The rest of the post is pretty accurate but does anybody believe that as money grubbing as this band has become that they will not milk the inevitable round of "farewell tours"?

You may be right, but I dunno...given how Stevie bitched about the SYW tour being a "boys' club" and how much she (says she) hated it, and then how it took five years to get back out on the road...it's hard to say. They're certainly doing this for the money, and if they do it again, it'll be for the money. It's certainly conceivable that Stevie could love the money more than she hates touring with the band.

They're all at least 60 now - and Mick is pushing 70, I don't care how old he says he is. :nod: How many "farewell" tours could there be?


I still think Stevie needs to be burned at the stake like the WITCH she is for killing the band :lol: :xoxo: . We get it that she's unhappy and insecure, but did she really have to take the sorry @ss remnants of FM down with her?? :shrug:

I know chiliD et al think it's heresy, but as others have said, Stevie is the face of FM and has been since the late '70s. Take her away, and there is no point, and I think the rest of the band knows that. I wouldn't have agreed at the time of SYW, but Christine was truly the glue that held the band together and kept it from flying off in several different directions and generally deteriorating into a big stinking mess, which is what it sounds like the SYW project was (and I don't necessarily mean the album itself, but the process of making it and then touring behind it).

[CADreaming]

Y'all are so harsh...and too harsh.

[holidayroad]

I meant tree hugger as a joke! LOL But I love nature and animals as Wiccans do! I love to look up at night and feel that feeling of how little we are compared to the stars and moon. Also when I look at the trees and stuff I feel like it so amazing to have such a beautiful world that we live in. Also I love to see animals when i'm around they usually show up! LOL!

I have to admit myself (and my mom who is also Wiccan) are part of the "Stevie is a Wiccan" group....btw as i've expressed before please don't say witch! I hate that, because there is a difference between practicing that and Wicca. Wicca is a religion where you worship the God and Goddess or just the Goddess depending on your preference with the spells and rituals in order to help you out in life or to worship. As for just practicing witchcraft its all just spells. And Wiccans follow the Wiccan Rede: "An it harm none, do what ye will". There i'm off my rant....just wanted to express why I hate being called a WITCH! Granted you can be called a witch as a Wiccan it just drives me crazy! I hate when my Sgt's pull that I actually have a Sgt who lives 40 mins from Salem so he loves to pull that.

I'm also a Wiccan but don't mind being refered to as a witch...but I understand your opinion on it. Too bad the word "witch" has such a bad reputation attached...:)

[jwd]

Y'all are so harsh...and too harsh.

Stevie wrote a song about it back in the 70s. She's known all along.