Ken Caillat Seeks Input for Book

[ThePenguin]

Hi Ledgies,

Ken Caillat has asked for our help on a book that he is writing. Perhaps you could lend an assist by posting questions, comments and info regarding the making of Rumours in this thread.

I know we've had new questions for Ken ever since SYW and In The Meantime were released, but right now, he needs feedback just focusing on the making of Rumours. Let's keep the feedback on that one subject here in this thread and then, if there are any further discussions that arise among us, about some of the questions posed here, then that should go in other threads, for conversation just among Ledgies.

Since Ken plans on contacting anyone he can find from that era, he is also seeking information about people who were employed by the band: crew, security, engineers, receptionists at all the other studios, or rock journalists who ever interviewed the band, etc.--or most recent contact information. So, if you have any leads, send them along. If you have contact or sensitive information that should not be on a public board, send that to caillatcomments[at sign]fleetwoodmac.net.

Otherwise, post all your feedback here. Here's a note from Ken:


Hello everyone, This is Ken Caillat and I need your help. I am writing a
book on the Making of Rumours. It's being published by Harper Collins. I
want this to be the most accurate account of what went in to making this
great album. I'll be contacting everyone I can find who was there for that
epic year of recording including the band and asking new questions. I
know you fans know stories that I may not be aware of or you might
want questions answered that you have about how or why things
happened they way they did.

Well, ask away! Also, I'm looking for lost photos shot during this
album, including studio shots outside the studio shots, etc. If we use your
question, you could be in my book.

Thank you,
Ken Caillat

[Moz]

(It's early, so forgive me if none of this makes sense..)

Cool! I have a question regarding Lindsey's shirt that's shown in the gatefold of the insert that came with the LP. It's the one where Mick is laying on the ground with a bottle of wine near his feet and everyone is sitting/standing behind him. Lindsey's shirt says "Milt" and I was told it was an inside joke regarding their drug dealer. :p

Also on the insert, near the top, there's a line of six pictures of Lindsey smoking something. It looks like he's wearing a shower cap! :laugh:

Whose idea was it for Chris to play a chair in Second Hand News? What kind of chair was it? :laugh:

Who designed the whispering penguins?

What were the easiest and hardest songs to record?

Why is Oh Daddy such an awesome song? :p

Was there a conscious attempt to make You Make Loving Fun sound sort of "disco"?

When making up his bass parts, did John do it all by himself or did someone else (let's take Lindsey for example) say, "let's play it like this"...? If that makes sense.

Did Lindsey or Stevie do any little 'piano things', or was it all done by Christine? Likewise, did Christine do any stuff on the guitar?

Is it true that Stevie had a cold during the recording Dreams (the take that would eventually make it on to the album. Sounds like she does.)?

Why was a pane of glass broken during the recording of Gold Dust Woman? Also, in the last minute or so of GDW, there's an eerie sort of wailing sound. There has been discussion about whether or not it's Stevie wailing or Lindsey messing around on his guitar.

Why does Lindsey whisper "fffff*ck" at the beginning of the Chain?

I have about a bazillion photos I could put up here, but I'm not sure what Ken's looking for!

What did the band do for fun?

What other songs were recorded during this time that never made it onto the album, aside from Silver Springs? I always figured The Dealer was from this time..

ETA: There are a few hours of outtakes/behind the scenes footage from the band's stop in Japan in December '77. It has been floating around for a few years, I imagine. Anyway, was this footage supposed to be used for some sort of documentary? It's quite amusing ("interviews" with Christine and Stevie, Lindsey noodling around on the guitar and piano and remarking how "at the end of this year we'll have played 98 shows. 98! I'M SICK OF PLAYING!") and there is an excellent version of Gold Dust Woman. While I don't have any information regarding other people employed by the band, roadies and other helpers are shown in this footage.

[Moz]

Okay, here are some Rumours era photos. Not sure if they're as "lost" as Ken would like, but I thought it would be fun.

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z245/buckinghamnicks77/Super%20Awesome%20Pics/03.jpg

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z245/buckinghamnicks77/Super%20Awesome%20Pics/06.jpg

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z245/buckinghamnicks77/Super%20Awesome%20Pics/4d_12fix.jpg.

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z245/buckinghamnicks77/Super%20Awesome%20Pics/30-1.jpg

There are two in this post (http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showpost.php?p=810175&postcount=12). And here (http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showpost.php?p=810332&postcount=22), and here (http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showpost.php?p=810518&postcount=26).

[shackin'up]

Ok, Ken (Chicken Shack pun intended :p), I admire your work on this epic album, but with all the respect in the world: in this year, 2009, we should
* talk about and
* write books about and
* reissue film- and audio from ....
the best album ever recorded. 30 years ago. TUSK. Why aren't we, and especially the band and all Tusk-coworkers, focussing on that?????????

[Peestie]

Why aren't we, and especially the band and all Tusk-coworkers, focussing on that?????????

Because publishers aren't interested in putting out a book about a "flop" album when they can put one out about Rumours?

I don't have any specific questions at the minute but I'm sure I'll be back with some. The closest I have to a question is a request that plenty of technical stuff goes in about how the album was produced and how the fantastic sound of that album was produced. What techniques etc. were used? I'll try come back with more specific questions but I'd just eat up any technical information, if it's available.

[TeenageMac]

Ok, Ken (Chicken Shack pun intended :p), I admire your work on this epic album, but with all the respect in the world: in this year, 2009, we should
* talk about and
* write books about and
* reissue film- and audio from ....
the best album ever recorded. 30 years ago. TUSK. Why aren't we, and especially the band and all Tusk-coworkers, focussing on that?????????

Don't worry - A book about the making of Tusk is due out March 2010! http://www.continuumbooks.com/books/detail.aspx?BookId=131532

[shackin'up]

Because publishers aren't interested in putting out a book about a "flop" album when they can put one out about Rumours?

.

But I'm talking to Ken here, Peestie, not to a publisher: Ken KNOWS that Tusk is a artistic masterpiece (and besides, one of the best-selling double-albums ever) with an amazingly important influence on todays new-folk-movement and the lo-fi singersongwriters-wave of the late nineties. That's what the world should be interested in.

[JeannieKartis]

Hi Ledgies,

Ken Caillat has asked for our help on a book that he is writing. Perhaps you could lend an assist by posting questions, comments and info regarding the making of Rumours in this thread.

I know we've had new questions for Ken ever since SYW and In The Meantime were released, but right now, he needs feedback just focusing on the making of Rumours. Let's keep the feedback on that one subject here in this thread and then, if there are any further discussions that arise among us, about some of the questions posed here, then that should go in other threads, for conversation just among Ledgies.

Since Ken plans on contacting anyone he can find from that era, he is also seeking information about people who were employed by the band: crew, security, engineers, receptionists at all the other studios, or rock journalists who ever interviewed the band, etc.--or most recent contact information. So, if you have any leads, send them along. If you have contact or sensitive information that should not be on a public board, send that to caillatcomments[at sign]fleetwoodmac.net.

Otherwise, post all your feedback here. Here's a note from Ken:


Hello everyone, This is Ken Caillat and I need your help. I am writing a
book on the Making of Rumours. It's being published by Harper Collins. I
want this to be the most accurate account of what went in to making this
great album. I'll be contacting everyone I can find who was there for that
epic year of recording including the band and asking new questions. I
know you fans know stories that I may not be aware of or you might
want questions answered that you have about how or why things
happened they way they did.

Well, ask away! Also, I'm looking for lost photos shot during this
album, including studio shots outside the studio shots, etc. If we use your
question, you could be in my book.

Thank you,
Ken Caillat

I've got some stuff from the rumours era, I will have to dig it up and I'm sure I will come up with some questions...
btw, I did not realize Colbie Caillat was Ken's daughter, she was just here in vabeach for a show....

[ShangriLaTroubl]

I've got some stuff from the rumours era, I will have to dig it up and I'm sure I will come up with some questions...
btw, I did not realize Colbie Caillat was Ken's daughter, she was just here in vabeach for a show....

You know I never knew that either! That's awesome! I saw her live, opening for John Mayer in Irvine last summer, she puts on a heck of a show!
ANYWAY!

Ken: We all know there was a lot of fuss about "Silver Springs" being cut from the record, because of space and "I Don't Want to Know" was put in its place.

Was there ever discussion about evenly splitting up the songs for the 3 songwriters or did it never get that anal?

While Stevie had "Dreams," "Gold Dust Woman," and dueted with Lindsey on "I Don't Want to Know" she had the least amount of LEAD VOCAL runtime on the album.

Was this ever a point of discussion after the news of dropping "Silver Springs" was out?

[Erin]

Ken,

Are any of the proceeds from this book going to help preserve the Sausalito plant where the album was recorded? Mick has taken an interest in preserving the building:http://www.oursausalito.com/2009/05/mick-fleetwood-speaks-out-to-save-the-old-record-plant-in-sausalito.html

A little off topic but my librarian side wants to know...you brought up something I had been thinking about previously when you mentioned looking for old photographs, etc. Is there or has there been any thought about preservation of Fleetwood Mac memorabilia? Creating an archive/museum beyond what exists in various Hard Rock Cafes and the Rock and Roll Museum in Cleveland? So much of music paraphernalia is ephemeral and subject to rapid deterioration. I hate to think of photographs, recordings, clothes, etc. sitting in various garages with no thought to their future existence. Maybe the Sausalito building could even house some of this stuff...sorry thinking out loud here. Thanks for asking for fan input!

Erin

[Somajoseph]

One question I wanted to ask. What did the band record in Miami at Criteria Studios? Was that in January 1976 before the Sausalito sessions? And is it true the entire band stayed in the same house while they were in Miami?

Thanks!

[louielouie2000]

Mick has said there was a house up in the Sausalito hills that the boys rented, and "God help you what went on up there." Were you a resident? What really happened up there?

Stevie and Christine said they rented condos in Sausalito harbor. Were you ever a visitor down there? What were their places like if so?

Stevie says she hasn't driven since like 1976, how did she get around town, and home? Anyone have any memorable cars during that time?

What was daily life like with the band? What time did recording start and end? Did everyone ever go on outings together such as daytrips? Did everyone go out to eat and to bars together?

How did each band member and yourself change from 1976-1978?

[bucklind17]

I remember reading/hearing that at some point in the recording process, the master tapes began to lose the high end. I'm not very knowledgeable about what exactly would cause something like this to happen outside of overuse but was curious what kind of process goes into restoring that. Did the tracks have to be entirely re-recorded or just the affected aspects? What songs, if not all, were affected by this and did any changes to the final tracks occur because the originals weren't usable?

Sorry if this is a boring question or something that's more well known to most than it is to me. I'm oddly curious about it!

[Madness Fades]

How much money did each of the 5 and members Make from Tusk, Rumours & Mirage?

Who blew the most on Drugs?

What did the Recording Studio in Sausilito smell like?

Who Caused the most arguments?

Tell me more about Lindsey phoning the Radio DJ that Played Go Your Own Way and said " Hmmm, I dont Know about that one".

[Peestie]

But I'm talking to Ken here, Peestie, not to a publisher: Ken KNOWS that Tusk is a artistic masterpiece (and besides, one of the best-selling double-albums ever) with an amazingly important influence on todays new-folk-movement and the lo-fi singersongwriters-wave of the late nineties. That's what the world should be interested in.

I'd love it if the world had an interest in Tusk but even the band doesn't seem interested enough in it to do anything about it on its 30th anniversary :(

[Lori40]

I have always wondered if the rest of the band shares Lindsey's misguided belief that Rumours was so popular because the record-buying public was voyeuristic. I think that many of us who bought the album were too wrapped up in our own lives and what their songs meant to us, to worry about what was going on in the band members' personal lives. We knew that they must have loved and lost like we had, because they had expressed our feelings through their music, and that's why we love them.

[HejiraNYC]

I remember reading/hearing that at some point in the recording process, the master tapes began to lose the high end. I'm not very knowledgeable about what exactly would cause something like this to happen outside of overuse but was curious what kind of process goes into restoring that. Did the tracks have to be entirely re-recorded or just the affected aspects? What songs, if not all, were affected by this and did any changes to the final tracks occur because the originals weren't usable?

Sorry if this is a boring question or something that's more well known to most than it is to me. I'm oddly curious about it!

If memory serves, I believe they had to resort to using the drum tracks on the safety tapes, which meant having to painstakingly synch them with all of the other recording tracks after the fact. I'm sure back in the day this involved a lot of splicing and manipulation of reel-to-reels. :eek:

Ironically enough, when I first bought my vinyl copy of Rumours back in the day, I thought the audio quality sounded like ****, especially the muddy drum track that sounded like someone was beating a bean bag. That's why it has been a joy for me to hear the re-mastered CD-issued tracks with the crisp snare drums and high-hats. :nod:

[aleuzzi]

Ken, what is the real, honest reason why "Silver Springs" was not included on the album? The official story has been "it was too long." But the song is not that long--and certainly not that much longer than "I Don't Wanna' Know."

I have always suspected that "IDWK" was chosen because Lindsey has a prominent vocal part on it. Without that song, his vocal presence would be largely absent from side two of the record, thus offsetting the feminine/masculine balance of voices. Furthermore, if "SS" were to be put in its place, wouldn't the pace of side two have lagged a bit?

Am I imagining new reasons for the song switch? Is "it was too long" the real answer? If you were to investigate this your book could debunk a common, easy explanation...

[aleuzzi]

Here's one more question:

Why doesn't Christine sing the verses on the studio version of "The Chain"? She does live and in that setting the blending of the three voices is powerful.

[ontheEdgeof17]

Why can't the band move past the Rumours era and try to boost sales of other albums? Hasn't Rumours sold enough?

[wetcamelfood]

Ken, what is the real, honest reason why "Silver Springs" was not included on the album? The official story has been "it was too long." But the song is not that long--and certainly not that much longer than "I Don't Wanna' Know."

I have always suspected that "IDWK" was chosen because Lindsey has a prominent vocal part on it. Without that song, his vocal presence would be largely absent from side two of the record, thus offsetting the feminine/masculine balance of voices. Furthermore, if "SS" were to be put in its place, wouldn't the pace of side two have lagged a bit?

Am I imagining new reasons for the song switch? Is "it was too long" the real answer? If you were to investigate this your book could debunk a common, easy explanation...

Further to this, we've been told it wouldn't fit on an album side and this just doesn't add up, litteraly.

When you add up the running times to all the tracks, even including SS, no mater how you slice it, it shouldn't have been a problem.

I'm not buying this deal about "we had to put 'I Don't Want To Know' instead just because it saves one full minute of running time".

John

[kencaillat]

Ok, Ken (Chicken Shack pun intended :p), I admire your work on this epic album, but with all the respect in the world: in this year, 2009, we should
* talk about and
* write books about and
* reissue film- and audio from ....
the best album ever recorded. 30 years ago. TUSK. Why aren't we, and especially the band and all Tusk-coworkers, focussing on that?????????

Exactly my thoughts! My first work with them was Rumours and that is truely where the story begins. I believe that the story of Rumours with all the heartache and sacrafice and work, will set the stage to tell about the other 3 albums I did with Fleetwood Mac (and all crazy events that went on in between). Kc

[kencaillat]

Further to this, we've been told it wouldn't fit on an album side and this just doesn't add up, litteraly.

When you add up the running times to all the tracks, even including SS, no mater how you slice it, it shouldn't have been a problem.

I'm not buying this deal about "we had to put 'I Don't Want To Know' instead just because it saves one full minute of running time".

John

Well John the real reason was that is was too long! It killed me when we came to the realization that it wouldn't fit on the L.P. In those days of vinyl, 22 minutes a side was the max time you could put on without droping the level of the whole side. But you are right that in that difficult decision we took into consideration all the factors like tempo, composer, vocal balance but in the end had there been enough time, it would have gone on. We even shortened some of the other songs to make room for it. But when someone suggested SS go on the B side of the first single, everybody was happy.
KC

[kencaillat]

If memory serves, I believe they had to resort to using the drum tracks on the safety tapes, which meant having to painstakingly synch them with all of the other recording tracks after the fact. I'm sure back in the day this involved a lot of splicing and manipulation of reel-to-reels. :eek:

Ironically enough, when I first bought my vinyl copy of Rumours back in the day, I thought the audio quality sounded like ****, especially the muddy drum track that sounded like someone was beating a bean bag. That's why it has been a joy for me to hear the re-mastered CD-issued tracks with the crisp snare drums and high-hats. :nod:

Great question! It requires a long answer, I will answer it in the book! But the reason why it shed was we were using Ampex 456 2" tape. Years later we found out that while it sounds great, if it is played too much, the emultions starts to shed off the backing. It happened suddenly, one day......
KC

[kencaillat]

One question I wanted to ask. What did the band record in Miami at Criteria Studios? Was that in January 1976 before the Sausalito sessions? And is it true the entire band stayed in the same house while they were in Miami?

Thanks!

The band had a short tour scheduled in the middle of making Rumour around July, and they had about a week off (while the rehearsed for the tour) so, not to waste time (or rest up) Richard and I flew out to record whatever we could. We recorded the lead solo's for Go your own way, I got strangled by lindsey (by mistake) and harmonies on Oh Daddy. We had hotels in Miami, but the boys stayed in the same house in Sausalito. It smelled like ocean air, beer and pot probably. (to answer someone else)
KC

[kencaillat]

(It's early, so forgive me if none of this makes sense..)

Cool! I have a question regarding Lindsey's shirt that's shown in the gatefold of the insert that came with the LP. It's the one where Mick is laying on the ground with a bottle of wine near his feet and everyone is sitting/standing behind him. Lindsey's shirt says "Milt" and I was told it was an inside joke regarding their drug dealer. :p

Also on the insert, near the top, there's a line of six pictures of Lindsey smoking something. It looks like he's wearing a shower cap! :laugh:

Whose idea was it for Chris to play a chair in Second Hand News? What kind of chair was it? :laugh:

Who designed the whispering penguins? Larry Viagon

What were the easiest and hardest songs to record?

Why is Oh Daddy such an awesome song? :p

Was there a conscious attempt to make You Make Loving Fun sound sort of "disco"? No

When making up his bass parts, did John do it all by himself or did someone else (let's take Lindsey for example) say, "let's play it like this"...? If that makes sense. John did not like anyone telling him what to play, suggestions were ok

Did Lindsey or Stevie do any little 'piano things', or was it all done by Christine? Likewise, did Christine do any stuff on the guitar? Yes and NO

Is it true that Stevie had a cold during the recording Dreams (the take that would eventually make it on to the album. Sounds like she does.)? I don't think so

Why was a pane of glass broken during the recording of Gold Dust Woman? Also, in the last minute or so of GDW, there's an eerie sort of wailing sound. There has been discussion about whether or not it's Stevie wailing or Lindsey messing around on his guitar.

Why does Lindsey whisper "fffff*ck" at the beginning of the Chain?
Because he could! Actually when he was o/d the dobro part, he became tired and cranky and said f**k, (or whatever you said) as in here we go again, i hope i get it this time!

I have about a bazillion photos I could put up here, but I'm not sure what Ken's looking for! I'm looking for pics we've never seen before that will make us all smile

What did the band do for fun?

{During Rumours)They would Play jokes on each other, drink, the usual things people do when standed together.

What other songs were recorded during this time that never made it onto the album, aside from Silver Springs? I always figured The Dealer was from this time..

ETA: There are a few hours of outtakes/behind the scenes footage from the band's stop in Japan in December '77. It has been floating around for a few years, I imagine. Anyway, was this footage supposed to be used for some sort of documentary? It's quite amusing ("interviews" with Christine and Stevie, Lindsey noodling around on the guitar and piano and remarking how "at the end of this year we'll have played 98 shows. 98! I'M SICK OF PLAYING!") and there is an excellent version of Gold Dust Woman. While I don't have any information regarding other people employed by the band, roadies and other helpers are shown in this footage.

Micks nickname was Milt like Milt the Stilt or uncle Milty as he became know as, the bands t-shirt department made a few t-shirts for everyone

[shackin'up]

Exactly my thoughts! My first work with them was Rumours and that is truely where the story begins. I believe that the story of Rumours with all the heartache and sacrafice and work, will set the stage to tell about the other 3 albums I did with Fleetwood Mac (and all crazy events that went on in between). Kc


Well, alright then, if that is the case, you can start with the beginning! :o

I just banged my head against the wall seeing that Ken Caillat quoted my response! Thanks, you made my day Ken!

I just read an incredible good book on the making of Rumours by Cath Carroll.
In that book there's a passage about that Mick and John bonded and Christine and Stevie bonded during the emotional hard times, but that Lindsey bonded mostly with Dashut and went back in the studio with him for long long periods just to focus on the work. How do you recall that? Do you think that part of LB's obsessive studiobehaviour is based on the urge for running away for reality? ( Sorry for my english, I'm Dutch.)

Gerald



..

[trackaghost]

Hi Ken,
I'd just like to ask about how involved Stevie was in the production of her songs and how much was Lindsey's vision. I ask for two reasons, firstly Christine says in the episode of Classic Albums about the making of Rumours that when she first heard Dreams, she thought it was quite boring because it was just two notes and obviously the finished version sounds much more intricate and layered. Secondly, in the 80s and 90s, Stevie said many times that Lindsey would often take her songs and they would come back completely different. I'm curious about things like the breaking of the glass and atmospherics at the end of Gold Dust Woman, were these collaborative decisions? There's also an acoustic version of Gold Dust Woman on the second disc of the Rumours reissue which instead has the end of what became her solo song If You Ever Did Believe. At what point did that change?

Also regarding Silver Springs, I've always been curious why this was the first choice to cut. Was there any thoughts about taking away one of the other songs instead and having a 10 song album? I'm just asking because there are four songs by Christine, and just three credited to Stevie and Lindsey each (with The Chain being a group collaboration). All Christine's songs are amazing but then so is Silver Springs.

Thanks! And I second Gerald's comments about Tusk. Given its influence, I'm surprised more hasn't been written about Tusk in recent years.

Sharon

[David]

I think Ken should listen to some of the weird, amazing audio the fans have amassed over the decades, like Fleetwood Mac's old sessions for "Smile at You" and "The Chain." A good part of the "Rumours" story, historically speaking, is right there in the audio and video material that has been circulated for so long -- things the band doesn't even know about or remember.

These recordings (including outtakes, demos, concert clips, and even conversations) are prime archival sources, and can certainly help jog Ken's memories of the time -- which are, after all, almost thirty-five years old by now.

The Chain
Sausalito 1976(?)
<table bgcolor="#000000" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tr><td><embed quality="high" pluginspage="http://www.macromedia.com/go/getflashplayer" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" bgcolor="#000" width="328" height="94" src="http://www.esnips.com//escentral/images/widgets/flash/esnips_player.swf" flashvars="theTheme=blue&amp;autoPlay=no&amp;theFile=http://www.esnips.com//nsdoc/e0173e3a-a10d-4e28-b283-5a7db61f7823&amp;theName=02 The Chain Writing Process&amp;thePlayerURL=http://www.esnips.com//escentral/images/widgets/flash/mp3WidgetPlayer.swf"></embed></td></tr><tr><td><table cellpadding="2" style="font-family:Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; padding-left:2px; color:#FFFFFF; text-decoration:none ; ; font-size:10px; font-weight:bold"><tr><td><a style="color:#FFFFFF; text-decoration:none " href="http://www.esnips.com/CreateWidgetAction.ns?type=0&objectid=e0173e3a-a10d-4e28-b283-5a7db61f7823"> Get this widget </a></td><td style="font-size:7px; font-weight:normal;">|</td><td align="center"><a align="center" style="color:#FFFFFF; text-decoration:none " href="http://www.esnips.com/doc/e0173e3a-a10d-4e28-b283-5a7db61f7823/02-The-Chain-Writing-Process/?widget=flash_player_esnips_blue"> Track details </a></td><td style="font-size:7px; font-weight:normal;">|</td><td><a align="center" style="color:#FF6600; text-decoration:none" href="http://www.esnips.com//adserver/?action=visit&cid=player_dna&url=/socialdna"> eSnips Social DNA </a></td></tr></table></td></tr></table>

We can also help Ken remember when tours started, ended, and stopped for breaks. I think Ken would be surprised at just how much we have on our hard disk drives, and he'd probably find a huge amount of it helpful in getting his book researched and written.

Atlanta GA
August 8, 1980
The Omni
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[gold_dust]

Hello Ken,

I'd like to ask whether their fighting was ever really that bad? Sometimes you read/hear stories that it was, then other times you watch little candid video clips (i.e. backstage Japan '77) and they look relatively at ease with each other. Were you ever caught up in it?

Was there a particular song that they had difficulty recording - instrumentally or vocally?

I once read somewhere that additional backing vocals (the studio crew, I think) were added to Don't Stop. Is this true and were you one of the said vocalists? Was there a reason for the additional set of backing vocals?

Stevie once mentioned that the drugs weren't really that big a part of the recording process during Rumours. What would your take on that be? Did it enhance their sound? Did it take anything away?

Thank you very much.

[aleuzzi]

Well John the real reason was that is was too long! It killed me when we came to the realization that it wouldn't fit on the L.P. In those days of vinyl, 22 minutes a side was the max time you could put on without droping the level of the whole side. But you are right that in that difficult decision we took into consideration all the factors like tempo, composer, vocal balance but in the end had there been enough time, it would have gone on. We even shortened some of the other songs to make room for it. But when someone suggested SS go on the B side of the first single, everybody was happy.
KC

You say you shortened some of the songs to make room for it. Did these songs stay shortened even after the band made a decision not to include it? I'm thinking of the longer and shorter versions of YMLF.

[kencaillat]

Because publishers aren't interested in putting out a book about a "flop" album when they can put one out about Rumours?

I don't have any specific questions at the minute but I'm sure I'll be back with some. The closest I have to a question is a request that plenty of technical stuff goes in about how the album was produced and how the fantastic sound of that album was produced. What techniques etc. were used? I'll try come back with more specific questions but I'd just eat up any technical information, if it's available.

Flop album!? Have you hear tusk? Do you know how many albums it sold, double albums??
KC

[kencaillat]

You say you shortened some of the songs to make room for it. Did these songs stay shortened even after the band made a decision not to include it? I'm thinking of the longer and shorter versions of YMLF.

I thought you'd ask that, They mostly stayed shorter because, the album was balanced nicely and played well (good pacing). What you guys don't realize that nearly every song starts off longer than it ends up being. And usually we speed them up slightly from their original tempo. You can tell those because if you play your guitar or piano along with them, it won't be in tune. Stevie's songs we're usually all over 6 minutes. Yikes!!

[kencaillat]

Hello Ken,

I'd like to ask whether their fighting was ever really that bad? Sometimes you read/hear stories that it was, then other times you watch little candid video clips (i.e. backstage Japan '77) and they look relatively at ease with each other. Were you ever caught up in it?

Was there a particular song that they had difficulty recording - instrumentally or vocally?

I once read somewhere that additional backing vocals (the studio crew, I think) were added to Don't Stop. Is this true and were you one of the said vocalists? Was there a reason for the additional set of backing vocals?

Stevie once mentioned that the drugs weren't really that big a part of the recording process during Rumours. What would your take on that be? Did it enhance their sound? Did it take anything away?

Thank you very much.
Horrible fights within each couple, not Mick, he was along, and very sad. but remember they had to keep it together to make this album happen, their career depended on it. I was so supprised at what i had gotten myself into!
I go into great detail in the book and get the bands point of view too.
Thanks
KC

[kencaillat]

I have always wondered if the rest of the band shares Lindsey's misguided belief that Rumours was so popular because the record-buying public was voyeuristic. I think that many of us who bought the album were too wrapped up in our own lives and what their songs meant to us, to worry about what was going on in the band members' personal lives. We knew that they must have loved and lost like we had, because they had expressed our feelings through their music, and that's why we love them.
I'll have to ask him but I don't think he thought the fans just wanted to hear the details. I think people genuinely indentified with these songs. Songbird, is what we called my daughter, etc. Again, I'll be sure to ask the band.
KC

[kencaillat]

Further to this, we've been told it wouldn't fit on an album side and this just doesn't add up, litteraly.

When you add up the running times to all the tracks, even including SS, no mater how you slice it, it shouldn't have been a problem.

I'm not buying this deal about "we had to put 'I Don't Want To Know' instead just because it saves one full minute of running time".

John
The silver spring that was on side 2 was a several minutes longer, it was cut do still to fit on a 45 single. But I'll ask Stevie and Lindsey, there may have been a publishing issue also. I'm finding out so much that I was unaware of even while i was there with them. They had many secrets! You'll see!
Keep the good questions coming!
KC

[kencaillat]

If memory serves, I believe they had to resort to using the drum tracks on the safety tapes, which meant having to painstakingly synch them with all of the other recording tracks after the fact. I'm sure back in the day this involved a lot of splicing and manipulation of reel-to-reels. :eek:

Ironically enough, when I first bought my vinyl copy of Rumours back in the day, I thought the audio quality sounded like ****, especially the muddy drum track that sounded like someone was beating a bean bag. That's why it has been a joy for me to hear the re-mastered CD-issued tracks with the crisp snare drums and high-hats. :nod:

I answered this today, I don't know where it went but briefly, we were using Ampex 456 2" tape which had a manufacturing defect that when played too much the oxide containing the sound falls off the tape. It was a nightmare and happened all at once.
KC

[fleetwoodtrick]

Well, quite honestly, I've nothing to say as far as questions go at the moment, I'd just like to thank you for taking the time to talk to the Ledgies. :) Sadly enough, I didn't exist until 17 years after the recording of Rumours, but I can't wait to read your book and learn more about it! I'd also like to thank the people who run the Ledge/the Penguin for tracking down all of these FM related people so that we can ask them questions! And I can't believe I didn't put two and two together that Colbie Calliat is your daughter! That's so cool, I like to find ways that my other favorite artists relate to FM!

Thanks again!
Rhiya :thumbsup:

[CADreaming]

Well John the real reason was that is was too long! It killed me when we came to the realization that it wouldn't fit on the L.P. In those days of vinyl, 22 minutes a side was the max time you could put on without droping the level of the whole side. But you are right that in that difficult decision we took into consideration all the factors like tempo, composer, vocal balance but in the end had there been enough time, it would have gone on. We even shortened some of the other songs to make room for it. But when someone suggested SS go on the B side of the first single, everybody was happy.
KC

The silver spring that was on side 2 was a several minutes longer, it was cut do still to fit on a 45 single. But I'll ask Stevie and Lindsey, there may have been a publishing issue also. I'm finding out so much that I was unaware of even while i was there with them. They had many secrets! You'll see!
Keep the good questions coming!
KC

Hi Ken,

When you say everyone was "happy" with Silver Springs being on the B side of GYOW, does this mean Stevie was ok with that decision? She gave her mother publishing on the song and has mentioned her anger/hurt of the song being cut due to this. Would the royalties from a single vs. an album in those days be a considerable difference, especially at that point not knowing how well Rumours would sell and would that possibly have appeased Stevie?

Also, how many of the Rumours songs were completed works prior to the initial recording sessions in February 1976? ("Go Your Own Way" for example, was played live prior to 1976 without the second verse).

What other songs that didn't make Rumours were either considered or worked on for that project?

Finally, how many of the "rumours" were really just rumours...or will those secrets ever be revealed?? :D

Thanks!

[Moz]

Ken - what songs were shortened in order to make room on the album?

I have this great acoustic version of Gold Dust Woman that sounds like it's from the Rumours sessions. Were any other songs done in an acoustic fashion like this? (aside from NGBA, of course.)

I think Ken should listen to some of the weird, amazing audio the fans have amassed over the decades, like Fleetwood Mac's old sessions for "Smile at You" and "The Chain." A good part of the "Rumours" story, historically speaking, is right there in the audio and video material that has been circulated for so long -- things the band doesn't even know about or remember.

These recordings (including outtakes, demos, concert clips, and even conversations) are prime archival sources, and can certainly help jog Ken's memories of the time -- which are, after all, almost thirty-five years old by now.

The Chain
Sausalito 1976(?)
<table bgcolor="#000000" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0"><tr><td><embed quality="high" pluginspage="http://www.macromedia.com/go/getflashplayer" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" bgcolor="#000" width="328" height="94" src="http://www.esnips.com//escentral/images/widgets/flash/esnips_player.swf" flashvars="theTheme=blue&amp;autoPlay=no&amp;theFile=http://www.esnips.com//nsdoc/e0173e3a-a10d-4e28-b283-5a7db61f7823&amp;theName=02 The Chain Writing Process&amp;thePlayerURL=http://www.esnips.com//escentral/images/widgets/flash/mp3WidgetPlayer.swf"></embed></td></tr><tr><td><table cellpadding="2" style="font-family:Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; padding-left:2px; color:#FFFFFF; text-decoration:none ; ; font-size:10px; font-weight:bold"><tr><td><a style="color:#FFFFFF; text-decoration:none " href="http://www.esnips.com/CreateWidgetAction.ns?type=0&objectid=e0173e3a-a10d-4e28-b283-5a7db61f7823"> Get this widget </a></td><td style="font-size:7px; font-weight:normal;">|</td><td align="center"><a align="center" style="color:#FFFFFF; text-decoration:none " href="http://www.esnips.com/doc/e0173e3a-a10d-4e28-b283-5a7db61f7823/02-The-Chain-Writing-Process/?widget=flash_player_esnips_blue"> Track details </a></td><td style="font-size:7px; font-weight:normal;">|</td><td><a align="center" style="color:#FF6600; text-decoration:none" href="http://www.esnips.com//adserver/?action=visit&cid=player_dna&url=/socialdna"> eSnips Social DNA </a></td></tr></table></td></tr></table>



What the crap! I've never heard that before! Are there any other songs like that (works in progress, I mean, whether it's for Rumours or any other album)? Is there an mp3?

[CADreaming]

Lindsey at The Record Plant:

http://mixonline.com/mag/710lindseybuck.jpg

[MoonWaterPoet]

Horrible fights within each couple, not Mick, he was along, and very sad. but remember they had to keep it together to make this album happen, their career depended on it. I was so supprised at what i had gotten myself into!
I go into great detail in the book and get the bands point of view too.
Thanks
KC

So it sounds that you've already finished your BOOK... AND GREAT DETAILS... so why should our (fans) point of view matter now?


Donnie Wayne ~

[MoonWaterPoet]

Flop album!? Have you hear tusk? Do you know how many albums it sold, double albums??
KC

Yes ~ and Tom Petty's fight for record sales back then...


Donnie Wayne ~

[MoonWaterPoet]

Yes ~ and Tom Petty's fight for record sales back then...


Donnie Wayne ~

Is this thread for real???


Donnie Wayne ~

[wetcamelfood]

Well John the real reason was that is was too long! It killed me when we came to the realization that it wouldn't fit on the L.P. In those days of vinyl, 22 minutes a side was the max time you could put on without droping the level of the whole side. But you are right that in that difficult decision we took into consideration all the factors like tempo, composer, vocal balance but in the end had there been enough time, it would have gone on. We even shortened some of the other songs to make room for it. But when someone suggested SS go on the B side of the first single, everybody was happy.
KC

OK thanks Ken, I just could've sworn either you or Richard said "24" minutes per side in the Classic Albums doc was all. :)

John

[Peestie]

Flop album!? Have you hear tusk? Do you know how many albums it sold, double albums??
KC
"Flop" in comparison to the mega-selling Rumours, hence the "" marks. I don't consider it a flop at all (double platinum for a double album, right?) but Lindsey has said it was considered a commercial disappointment after selling 16million for Rumours.

It's easily my favourite Mac album so I'd love to see it get more attention but it does seem to get somewhat forgotten about sometimes. I'll be looking forward to any of your books, especially the Tusk one.;)

Lindsey is often touted as the "Architect of the Fleetwood Mac sound" and I was wondering if that was true of Rumours or if Tusk was where he became more prominent. When it came to arrangements of songs was Lindsey the one with most of the ideas and vision for how it should sound or was each band member heavily involved in arranging their own and other songwriters' songs? I imagine Christine had a pretty good idea about her songs, even if Stevie allowed Lindsey to take her songs off and work on them. Did you and Richard Dashut help much with arrangements or were you both there for the more technical points of the production and recording? Was there much head butting between, say, Lindsey and John over how a particular part should be played? I noticed that on the Rumours 2 disc release a few years ago the demo of Second Hand News has a totally different bass line to the final version. Who would have made the decision as to which bass line worked best to go on the album?

Sorry, that's lots of questions. :o

[gold_dust]

Horrible fights within each couple, not Mick, he was along, and very sad. but remember they had to keep it together to make this album happen, their career depended on it. I was so supprised at what i had gotten myself into!
I go into great detail in the book and get the bands point of view too.
Thanks
KC

Thank you very much for your reply. I cannot wait for this book!

[aleuzzi]

Ken, you appear to work very well with Christine. After all, she invited you to help her out on her most recent solo album in 2004. Were you two particularly close in a professional context during the recording of Rumours? What was she like to work with? I've heard she can be quite generous in laying down foundations for other musicians to build upon. Do you recall specific example of this?

[gldstwmn]

Flop album!? Have you hear tusk? Do you know how many albums it sold, double albums??
KC

:lol: Amen. School these kids Ken.

[Steviefan49]

Hi Ken,

I know I had privately e-mailed you regarding the pictures and Herbert Worthington, but I wanted to come on and say "Thank you" for taking the time to contact the Ledge for this project! I'm very excited about your book, and can't wait to get it, once it comes out! Thanks SO much again!


Warm regards,

Arlene

[wetcamelfood]

I thought you'd ask that, They mostly stayed shorter because, the album was balanced nicely and played well (good pacing). What you guys don't realize that nearly every song starts off longer than it ends up being. And usually we speed them up slightly from their original tempo. You can tell those because if you play your guitar or piano along with them, it won't be in tune. Stevie's songs we're usually all over 6 minutes. Yikes!!

Ah yes, though unrelated, I noticed this on a remastered version of a Camel album (funnily enough titled "Mirage") where they included the original speed version of "Lady Fantasy" as a bonus track as well as the faster "finished" version.

I used to notice slight speed differences in some turntables I used to have too (one would play a little faster on 33 than it would on 33 on another, first noticed this listening to songs on the radio after getting an album so this does add up now). Wish I could find an mp3 editor that works with Vista so I can play with the speeds of the FM tracks some more! :)

John

[SortaSavageLike]

An odd question:

Is the photo on the Rumours cover flipped horizontally? All of the outtakes I've seen, and I've seen dozens have Mick on the right and Stevie on the left. It's not really a "major" query, but it's something that's bothered me for years.

[Peestie]

:lol: Amen. School these kids Ken.
Yeah, I wasn't being sarcastic at all. :rolleyes:

[starshine]

Hi Ken: First of all thanks for thinking of us here at The Ledge....its nice to know that 'us' as fans do matter. Sometimes , sadly, it (meaning we as fans) seem to get 'lost' in the shuffle or so it seems really. I also look forward to your book & I do also hope you'd do a book for Tusk as well. I really love the Tusk LP/cd....I think I may like it a little bit more than Rumours. Anyway: lets see as far as questions go.....

1/Why was the one line cut from 'Songbird' of Christines song (...I see you smile...) personally, I love that little extra line in the song. Even though the song is beautiful as it is but I wish that would be included in the 'new' issue of Rumours but that is IMO anyway.

2/With Stevie's Silver Springs: why has the offical/or extended full 7 minute version (if it really is 7 minutes?) offically released? I know we have the re-issue versions etc but I'm speaking of the offical version culled from the edited version that was on the back of GYOW? Will that full version ever 'see' the true light of day? Cause I'd love to hear it all.

3/Is there any talk of 'live' versions of songs from the Rumours tour or a full 'live' dvd to be released. Personally, I'd love it ....other than the 'new' Rumours stuff to be released later this yr? (A Tusk one would be nice also!!)

4/I'd love to see more rare outtake pictures of the band during Rumours too....LP cover outtakes...as well as full band outtakes...and some great 'live' pictures would be nice color pictures too....not just b/w pictures....

5/I also would love to know what other songs (again besides the one's released on the Rumours re-issue cd) were considered for the Rumours lp??

If I think of other questions I'll put them in here. Also: as another question unrelated to Rumours. Do you know if re-issue's will ever be done on Mirage (which needs it badly) with an extra cd of outtakes etc/'Live' with extra live songs /extra cd/Tango --again with extra cd or Mask?? Speaking as a fan it would be great to have them ...esp Mirage....I love it but my cd is so 'low' sounding its hard to listen to it really. Plus as much as I loved the re-issue to Tusk...on disc 2 I'd wished more outtakes would've been included. But thats just my opinion.
Anyway, can't wait for your book....hope you do many more & I hope theres alot of great outtake pictures inside too. Thanks for your time. Sue:D

[jbrownsjr]

First of all Ken, it's a honor... you're amazing...

I would like to know about the history of the Chain from your point of view. From what I understand Christine wrote some of the music (the title was different)... Lindsey had written more.... Stevie wrote the words... then Mick and John added???

it's all so confusing lol....

[kencaillat]

Ken,

Are any of the proceeds from this book going to help preserve the Sausalito plant where the album was recorded? Mick has taken an interest in preserving the building:http://www.oursausalito.com/2009/05/mick-fleetwood-speaks-out-to-save-the-old-record-plant-in-sausalito.html

A little off topic but my librarian side wants to know...you brought up something I had been thinking about previously when you mentioned looking for old photographs, etc. Is there or has there been any thought about preservation of Fleetwood Mac memorabilia? Creating an archive/museum beyond what exists in various Hard Rock Cafes and the Rock and Roll Museum in Cleveland? So much of music paraphernalia is ephemeral and subject to rapid deterioration. I hate to think of photographs, recordings, clothes, etc. sitting in various garages with no thought to their future existence. Maybe the Sausalito building could even house some of this stuff...sorry thinking out loud here. Thanks for asking for fan input!

Erin

2 Execellent ideas! Thank you, I will contact the plant. I will be visiting there at the end of this month and have already contacted them.
KC

[kencaillat]

First of all Ken, it's a honor... you're amazing...

I would like to know about the history of the Chain from your point of view. From what I understand Christine wrote some of the music (the title was different)... Lindsey had written more.... Stevie wrote the words... then Mick and John added???

it's all so confusing lol....

You are a genius! But that's the beginning and ending of my book, the majesty of it all!
KC

[Ench]

Some other bands, for example The Beatles, all chipped in a bit on each others' songs, even when not credited.

Did the same thing happen with FM? Did they all share ideas to some extent?



Did Christine, working temperamental 70s electric keyboards, have much in the way of equipment "issues"?

[gldstwmn]

Yeah, I wasn't being sarcastic at all. :rolleyes:

I'm sorry Peestie. I was just playin'.

[Moz]

Here are some studio shots, but I'm not sure if some are actually from the White Album era, so.

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z245/buckinghamnicks77/Liddy%20Buck/LBuckTune.jpg

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z245/buckinghamnicks77/Liddy%20Buck/LBuckFax03.jpg

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z245/buckinghamnicks77/Liddy%20Buck/LBuckCute.jpg

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z245/buckinghamnicks77/Bewbs/Stevie312.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v280/deathbysoup/fm%20picspam/48.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v280/deathbysoup/fm%20picspam/5.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v280/deathbysoup/fm%20picspam/NewImage48.jpg

And these are just awesome:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v280/deathbysoup/fm%20picspam/NewImage4yt.jpg

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z245/buckinghamnicks77/Group%20and%20Partial%20Group/nicksfix143.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v280/deathbysoup/fm%20picspam/img246.jpg

[Peestie]

I'm sorry Peestie. I was just playin'.

I guessed that, but I was a bit drunk and not in the best mood when I sent that reply. My apologies to you for being snappy. :)

[jbrownsjr]

You are a genius! But that's the beginning and ending of my book, the majesty of it all!
KC

Thank you Ken... and while it's true I'm a genius.. I didn't produce or engineer one of the most successful albums in our history... :thumbsup:

I'll wait for my answer after I buy your book.. .and yes that may be a little easy or kiss ass... but again.. the end result of your work produced 16 million units in the first year.. and I was 8 years old and i played it over and over and over again until that 8 track tape broke...

Many thanks John from Northridge, CA

[gldstwmn]

I guessed that, but I was a bit drunk and not in the best mood when I sent that reply. My apologies to you for being snappy. :)

No worries. Erin go bragh!

[nodmod]

Hey Ken

Thanks for reaching out to the fan community for input into this great sounding book, would you consider bundling the book with the unreleased DVD-Audios that you did for Fleetwood Mac (white album) and Tusk.

Such a shame that these never saw the light of day!

[Erin]

No worries. Erin go bragh!

Why are you talking about my bra?:laugh:

[kencaillat]

OK thanks Ken, I just could've sworn either you or Richard said "24" minutes per side in the Classic Albums doc was all. :)

John
No, if you want to go longer than 22 minutes you have to start dropping to overall volume of the whole album 3, 4, 5 db! We couldn't have that!

kc

[kencaillat]

So it sounds that you've already finished your BOOK... AND GREAT DETAILS... so why should our (fans) point of view matter now?


Donnie Wayne ~
Wow, nice attitude. First the fans point of view always matter and it was a long time ago and I'm trying to put as many details back together as possible. Remember we worked 12 hours a day 7 days a week, sitting in a room together, working things out. My book is not finished, I wrote a 130 page outline and now I'm finding the people who were there and have disappeared.
kc

[strandinthewind]

Ken

Thank you for doing this. Things like this THRILL the fans on this board. It is safe to say you made several days here :cool:

I think it would be cool if you included in your book not only why songs got cut in time, but what was cut out of them - Songbird being a great example. There is a demo floating around with the following lyrics, which were omitted from the final product:

You smile, and you make feel good inside...it's a feeling, and it's so hard to hide.

I can't post the demo. here because it is an officially released product.

Anyway - everyone's a critic :D - but stuff like that is manna for the fans!

[brysondt]

Ken,

Maybe this has already been said, I'm not sure. Sorry if it has. But I was thinking...what might be really, really interesting in this book, is to kind of touch on the actual personalities of the band. I am 24, so I have NO IDEA what to even ask about the making of Rumours, although I love it so much(great job, btw). But as far as the fans go, the people who are going to buy this book and love it so much, we really are interested in getting to know who Stevie, Lindsey, Mick, Chris, and John were/are, you know? Not that I am saying make this a biography, that is NOT what I mean. I just mean, Fleetwood Mac is kind of like a little mystery to us all. As a Stevie fan, I must say, we find her very mysterious, haha, if that is what she was going for, it worked.

I'm just saying, it might add some spice to your book to include maybe some personality traits about the band that are lesser known to their fans. We love them and we love hearing about them. And thanks so much for caring what we silly fans think, haha. Oh, and I love Colbie! Thanks again, Ken.

[kencaillat]

"Flop" in comparison to the mega-selling Rumours, hence the "" marks. I don't consider it a flop at all (double platinum for a double album, right?) but Lindsey has said it was considered a commercial disappointment after selling 16million for Rumours.

It's easily my favourite Mac album so I'd love to see it get more attention but it does seem to get somewhat forgotten about sometimes. I'll be looking forward to any of your books, especially the Tusk one.;)

Lindsey is often touted as the "Architect of the Fleetwood Mac sound" and I was wondering if that was true of Rumours or if Tusk was where he became more prominent.
Let's see if I can insert answers--Well, there are a lot of things that go into the sound of a record, as engineer, I had a lot to do with that. However much of that album is the overdubs or additional instrumentation and those were Lindseys. During Rumours we went for clean sharp guitar sounds. On the first day of Tusk, Lindsey said he didn't want to make another repeat of Rumours like the Eagles did with Hotel California (almost mockingly) and then he had me make his guitars sound dark and distorted. That was his thing, he liked distortion, the more the merrier. So Tusk went darker...

When it came to arrangements of songs was Lindsey the one with most of the ideas and vision for how it should sound or was each band member heavily involved in arranging their own and other songwriters' songs?

The guitar layering was lindsey, keyboard layering Chris or Stevie.

I imagine Christine had a pretty good idea about her songs, even if Stevie allowed Lindsey to take her songs off and work on them. Did you and Richard Dashut help much with arrangements or were you both there for the more technical points of the production and recording?

Dash and I were there for everything, but lindsey was a genius guitar player, we could make suggestions or keep him from losing ideas which we always tried to do.. give the band a good listening experience to see (hear) the songs grow.

Was there much head butting between, say, Lindsey and John over how a particular part should be played?
I noticed that on the Rumours 2 disc release a few years ago the demo of Second Hand News has a totally different bass line to the final version. Who would have made the decision as to which bass line worked best to go on the album?
Not at first, but as we did the later albums, Lindsey would sometime insist that John play the bass the way he heard it. John often refused and this became an interesting standoff, particularly if drinking was involved

Sorry, that's lots of questions. :o

Lindsey is often touted as the "Architect of the Fleetwood Mac sound" and I was wondering if that was true of Rumours or if Tusk was where he became more prominent.

Let's see if I can insert answers--Well, there are a lot of things that go into the sound of a record, as engineer, I had a lot to do with that. However much of that album is the overdubs or additional instrumentation and those were Lindseys. During Rumours we went for clean sharp guitar sounds. On the first day of Tusk, Lindsey said he didn't want to make another repeat of Rumours like the Eagles did with Hotel California (almost mockingly) and then he had me make his guitars sound dark and distorted. That was his thing, he liked distortion, the more the merrier. So Tusk went darker...

When it came to arrangements of songs was Lindsey the one with most of the ideas and vision for how it should sound or was each band member heavily involved in arranging their own and other songwriters' songs?

The guitar layering was lindsey, keyboard layering Chris or Stevie.

I imagine Christine had a pretty good idea about her songs, even if Stevie allowed Lindsey to take her songs off and work on them. Did you and Richard Dashut help much with arrangements or were you both there for the more technical points of the production and recording?

Dash and I were there for everything, but lindsey was a genius guitar player, we could make suggestions or keep him from losing ideas which we always tried to do.. give the band a good listening experience to see (hear) the songs grow.

Was there much head butting between, say, Lindsey and John over how a particular part should be played?
I noticed that on the Rumours 2 disc release a few years ago the demo of Second Hand News has a totally different bass line to the final version. Who would have made the decision as to which bass line worked best to go on the album?
Not at first, but as we did the later albums, Lindsey would sometime insist that John play the bass the way he heard it. John often refused and this became an interesting standoff, particularly if drinking was involved

[Ghost_Tracker]

I think this is a GREAT idea, getting help from the Ledge.

Here's some questions that occur to me at first blush...

Mick indicates in his book that there's multiple reasons that Silver Springs was left off of Rumours. However, only one has been discussed in detail. It might be interesting to explore what those other reasons were; at least as far as what might be acceptable to the band members to publish.

The story about having to put all of Rumours together "without a sync track" is VERY interesting; and some further details about how that was accomplished, who did it, how long it took etc. would be great to hear.
And just how close was the album to NOT happening, because of this?

How did you and Richard Dashutt come to be associated with the album?
(The details, I mean.) Were there others who were considered? How do you feel you personally influenced the album? Did this influence continue to show in later albums?

How and where did you learn to Engineer records? Do you have suggestions for those who want to get into this aspect of the business?

What was the best part of working on the album? The worst?
What was the funniest thing that happened?

Is there a specific day that really stands out in your mind?

When did you first know that this was gonna be REALLY big?

Who first suggested that the album be called "Rumours?"
Were other possible titles discussed?

How did making this record differ from the way it might have been today?

Looking forward to the book! :)

[Moz]

Who first suggested that the album be called "Rumours?"
Were other possible titles discussed?


I'm not Ken (obviously) but I heard that it was to be called "Don't Stop" and John commented that the whole album sounded like a bunch of rumours.

[JeannieKartis]

Wow, nice attitude. First the fans point of view always matter and it was a long time ago and I'm trying to put as many details back together as possible. Remember we worked 12 hours a day 7 days a week, sitting in a room together, working things out. My book is not finished, I wrote a 130 page outline and now I'm finding the people who were there and have disappeared.
kc

thanks for doing this Ken and btw, I did not know that colbie was your daughter! She was just here in Virginia Beach and I'm sorry that I did not make her show, hopefully she will return.

[David]

I think this is a GREAT idea, getting help from the Ledge.

Here's some questions that occur to me at first blush...Most of your questions are addressed in the Q&A Ken gave us a few years ago.

http://www.fleetwoodmac.net/fwm/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=146&Itemid=166

I recommend everyone read it, & then try to think of new questions for Ken.

[Ghost_Tracker]

Remember we worked 12 hours a day 7 days a week, sitting in a room together, working things out. kc

This actually raises an interesting question itself - -

Who determined the hours? Who chose the start time, when to call it quits, etc.? Who got others motivated or let them know if they needed to "step up" a little more? In other words, who were the "real leaders?"
And what did you guys do about food, etc? Did you just usually order take-out? Or did you pretty much have enough time for a "normal" three square meals a day, outside of the studio? Who picked what to order? (etc. - might be some stories there...)

Also, were there any "signs of greatness" in Stevie that you could see yet? Would you have believed that this person would still pretty much be a "superstar" in the year 2009, with a solid fan base? Or was she kind of "mousy" and not very assertive, etc. at that point? Could you see her growing and learning? How about the rest of the band, also?

[kencaillat]

2 Execellent ideas! Thank you, I will contact the plant. I will be visiting there at the end of this month and have already contacted them.
KC

I have suggested that they make the old studio into a museum. Now they need memorabilia. Any suggestions? Donated or for sale?

[kencaillat]

Ken, you appear to work very well with Christine. After all, she invited you to help her out on her most recent solo album in 2004. Were you two particularly close in a professional context during the recording of Rumours? What was she like to work with? I've heard she can be quite generous in laying down foundations for other musicians to build upon. Do you recall specific example of this?

No, we were not particually close. She could be rather arrogant at times. Like if she didn't like the shirt I was wearing she would blurt out
" Ken, what a F@@King stupid shirt you're wearing, then puff on her cig and sip her champagne. But in the studio, musically, she was hard working and professional, like one of the guys. I liked her.

[kencaillat]

Some other bands, for example The Beatles, all chipped in a bit on each others' songs, even when not credited.

Did the same thing happen with FM? Did they all share ideas to some extent?



Did Christine, working temperamental 70s electric keyboards, have much in the way of equipment "issues"?

She was the bands keyboard player. Everyone helped everyone and shared ideas. It was their album. They wanted it to sell well.
No she didn't have equipment issues, those keyboards worked great all the time. We did have issues keeping the grand in tune.
kc

[Erin]

I have suggested that they make the old studio into a museum. Now they need memorabilia. Any suggestions? Donated or for sale?

Just off the top of my head: Photographs, awards, costumes, gold & platinum records, instruments, and other unique and sundry items. Perhaps you could ask the band members if they would be willing to donate any of their collections. This could go beyond the Rumours era band as well, and depending on the size of the space could include memorabilia from other bands who have recorded at the plant. If the Sausalito plant is serious about this endeavor it would be necessary to have some people on staff who have museum, archives, preservation and librarian backgrounds. Like myself. ;)

I know that much of Judy Wong's photograph collection were and continue to be sold on Ebay. I'm not certain if the negatives were sold or just the prints, but from what I have seen she had an extraordinary collection which would be wonderful thing for the Plant to obtain.

Erin

[Moz]

I have suggested that they make the old studio into a museum. Now they need memorabilia. Any suggestions? Donated or for sale?

There is a tour case thing on eBay from about 1975 for $300.

[jbrownsjr]

No, we were not particually close. She could be rather arrogant at times. Like if she didn't like the shirt I was wearing she would blurt out
" Ken, what a F@@King stupid shirt you're wearing, then puff on her cig and sip her champagne. But in the studio, musically, she was hard working and professional, like one of the guys. I liked her.

Awesome... I love her even more now...

[daniellaaarisen]

First of all, thank you so much for bringing an insider's look to Rumours to all of us through this book! As a 17-year-old who absolutely adores Fleetwood Mac but has missed the opportunity to experience the greater portion of their career, I am especially grateful :)

The VH1 program on Rumours touched on this a little, but I think there's probably much more to be said-- Considering the album's autobiographical nature, what was it like to watch Christine, Stevie and Lindsey introduce potential tracks for the album to the rest of the band? Was Stevie ever writing new music in response to a new Lindsey song, and vice versa? To what extent did the hostility/tension exist initially, and how strongly would it carry through the recording sessions?

We all know that although there was a lot of arguing between the couples, Rumours still somehow managed to make it through. It would be interesting to hear what affect the drug use played on the dynamics in the studio-- did it make the couples more or less "emotionally charged"?

I know that a few of Stevie's songs were taken from an earlier era, but what about Lindsey and Christine's? Were they writing immediately before or during the recording of Rumours?

Outside of their musical components, what did each member of the band bring to the making of Rumours? Mick served as the backbone/neutral witness to all the insanity, another member showed the most hostility and couldn't hide his or her emotions, yet another did a good job moving past the relationship issues and focusing on the music....? What specific characteristics an attitudes shone through each person?

I think that's all I have for now, but I'll come back here if I think of anything else. I'm sorry if my questions are vague or already answered-- but honestly, these are the things that I feel truly intensify the album's success.

Thank you so much, Ken! Awesome that you're doing this :)

[RoseGarden]

Thanks Ken for chosing the Ledgies for input!!!!
Lots of good questions here---and I cant' think of much more and can't wait to read your book.

Well, my question that hasn't been asked yet is:

You had come into the Mac's life before the HUGE sucess and helped them achieve their Iconic status. There was once an interview which each member claimed all that money/sucess hadn't changed them. I 'd like to know if you REALLY believe that? And if so, what changes had you witnessed in your opinion?


Thanks again!

[MoonWaterPoet]

Wow, nice attitude. First the fans point of view always matter and it was a long time ago and I'm trying to put as many details back together as possible. Remember we worked 12 hours a day 7 days a week, sitting in a room together, working things out. My book is not finished, I wrote a 130 page outline and now I'm finding the people who were there and have disappeared.
kc

I was not trying to be 'flip' with my statement... and was actually complimenting that it sounded like your book had Great Details...


Donnie Wayne ~

[sjpdg]

Ken,
Thank you for doing this. I greatly appreciate it. "Rumours" is one of the FM albums/CD's that I used to help teach me to play the drums and I return to it frequently when practicing. (I'm a huge fan of Mick's as you could probably tell.)

My question is about his drums during that period. Are there plans for the book to discuss his drum sound, his playing, his attitude toward various tracks and his input on those? I would assume so but wanted to make sure.

Also, did any special technical issues arise in Mick's vision/input on drum tracks for the album? If so, what?

Finally, did Mick have any special drums made for the album? Things not readily available at the local music store or anything outside the norm?

Thanks again Ken. Best of luck on the book.

[Gailh]

No, we were not particually close. She could be rather arrogant at times. Like if she didn't like the shirt I was wearing she would blurt out
" Ken, what a F@@King stupid shirt you're wearing, then puff on her cig and sip her champagne. But in the studio, musically, she was hard working and professional, like one of the guys. I liked her.

How rude!

Gail

[gldstwmn]

Who blew the most on Drugs?

I'm sure no one remembers the answer to that question. :lol:



What did the Recording Studio in Sausilito smell like?

Probably some really fine pot and occasionally some hash. :cool:

[gldstwmn]

Exactly my thoughts! My first work with them was Rumours and that is truely where the story begins. I believe that the story of Rumours with all the heartache and sacrafice and work, will set the stage to tell about the other 3 albums I did with Fleetwood Mac (and all crazy events that went on in between). Kc

Please, please follow through on this. There is so precious little we know about Mirage.

[kencaillat]

Thanks Ken for chosing the Ledgies for input!!!!
Lots of good questions here---and I cant' think of much more and can't wait to read your book.

Well, my question that hasn't been asked yet is:

You had come into the Mac's life before the HUGE sucess and helped them achieve their Iconic status. There was once an interview which each member claimed all that money/sucess hadn't changed them. I 'd like to know if you REALLY believe that? And if so, what changes had you witnessed in your opinion?


Thanks again!

Hi, no they changed! Over the years it got worse and worse. But money and fame and people coming after you all the time does that. Most celebs have two sides one, their regular person side and two the celeb. With some people they can only show the regular person side and with most they are aloof and reserved. But we all know when they show us the star side, it's just bs. "Please, put that crap away" John and Mick are the best. Lindsey and Stevie and Chris can be just full of themselves.

[skcin]

Hi, no they changed! Over the years it got worse and worse. But money and fame and people coming after you all the time does that. Most celebs have two sides one, their regular person side and two the celeb. With some people they can only show the regular person side and with most they are aloof and reserved. But we all know when they show us the star side, it's just bs. "Please, put that crap away" John and Mick are the best. Lindsey and Stevie and Chris can be just full of themselves.


Just as I suspected. :D

[shackin'up]

Just as I suspected. :D

Well, Mick is more often accused for being full of himself than Chris. It's good that Ken's view puts THAT in perspective.

[Gypsy-Rhiannon]

No, we were not particually close. She could be rather arrogant at times. Like if she didn't like the shirt I was wearing she would blurt out
" Ken, what a F@@King stupid shirt you're wearing, then puff on her cig and sip her champagne. But in the studio, musically, she was hard working and professional, like one of the guys. I liked her.

Fabulous! I can hear her saying that! :laugh:

[jbrownsjr]

Well, Mick is more often accused for being full of himself than Chris. It's good that Ken's view puts THAT in perspective.

Buck is exactly like we thought he was... :laugh:

I can imagine those 3 bitches duking it out...

[aleuzzi]

Oh, I'll bet they were a handful to deal with. Bob Weston said in his Q and A that by the time of Rumors and right after they were full of themselves and impossible to deal with--a stark contrast with the early days when they were content to be "just musicians."

However, Ken, I am imagining you have some bond with them that goes beyond the professional, "strictly-work" thing--otherwise you wouldn't have been willing to make In the Meantime with Christine...Hopefully she wasn't full of herself during the making of that?

[skcin]

Well, Mick is more often accused for being full of himself than Chris. It's good that Ken's view puts THAT in perspective.

Yes, but MY suspicions were proven. :cool:

I know what you mean though. I think that since Mick was so outgoing, putting himself & the band out there, it was assumed by many that he was the egomaniac. Not to say he doesn' thave his moments, but I personally have always felt that he was a bit more down to earth than the other 3, with John being the most "normal." Neither of them strike me as very cocky or full of themselves.

[golddustdrummer]

a couple questions I thought of that haven't already been asked in this thread (as far as I know...)

Who does the hand clapping in "I Don't Want to Know"?

I also want to know about Mick's drums...
Did he tune them himself?
What brand were they?
Did he use different drums for different tracks?


--------------------

and I know the book is about Rumours, but in Sugar Daddy...does anyone notice the car horn right after she says "pick me up in a big fancy car"??
Anyone know the story behind it? whose car? what kind of car? etc.

[sleepless child]

I have a question. when the Mac starting working on the songs, and it became apparent that the words were about their relationships, how did everyone react to it? Did they realize it then that the songs were about each other? an example would be when Christine wrote Oh Daddy, did she tell Mick that the song was inspired by him? And since Stevie's words were more obsure, did the others ask her what the songs were about? Also, how was the relationship between Christine and Stevie? Thank you so much Ken for doing this. I can't wait for the book. Have you read Carol Harris' book and if you have, do you think it's very accurate?

[kencaillat]

Oh, I'll bet they were a handful to deal with. Bob Weston said in his Q and A that by the time of Rumors and right after they were full of themselves and impossible to deal with--a stark contrast with the early days when they were content to be "just musicians."

However, Ken, I am imagining you have some bond with them that goes beyond the professional, "strictly-work" thing--otherwise you wouldn't have been willing to make In the Meantime with Christine...Hopefully she wasn't full of herself during the making of that?

You know, they were pretty good during rumours, pretty normal for musicians. I thought Chris and I were good when I first started Meantime, but she was stopping drinking and smoking and trying to get over the school teacher, and hiding out in Cantebury with her dogs, and I started feeling her eccentricity. I had to leave the room while her dogs ate, and her favorite quote was "I'm not too old to tour, just too rich!" Too bad...I have requested she be interviewed by me for the book, and I got no reply from her or her manager, not even a simple no thank you. I still love my memories of her and the band.

[Erin]

You know, they were pretty good during rumours, pretty normal for musicians. I thought Chris and I were good when I first started Meantime, but she was stopping drinking and smoking and trying to get over the school teacher, and hiding out in Cantebury with her dogs, and I started feeling her eccentricity. I had to leave the room while her dogs ate, and her favorite quote was "I'm not too old to tour, just too rich!" Too bad...I have requested she be interviewed by me for the book, and I got no reply from her or her manager, not even a simple no thank you. I still love my memories of her and the band.

This happened several years ago already. Meantime came out in 2003, I believe. I hope she's gotten better rather than worse, but the no reply for the interview request doesn't bode well. I wonder if she will show up for any of the London shows now, not that anyone expects her to perform at this stage. Ken, have you secured interviews with the rest of the band? I'm sure we will all be most interested to hear how that goes!

[aleuzzi]

and I know the book is about Rumours, but in Sugar Daddy...does anyone notice the car horn right after she says "pick me up in a big fancy car"??
Anyone know the story behind it? whose car? what kind of car? etc.

A similar question was asked of Keith Olsen during his Q&A with this website. Since he produced the white album with the band, he'd be the best source for information. Unfortunately, he couldn't say for sure, but his response suggested the horn was John's idea. Don't know what car horn it was.

[Lala]

Hi Ken,

I missed the memo on this thread and I'm just catching up now. I don't have a question, but I'll try to come up with something intelligent. For now, I'd just like to say thanks for taking to time to post on this board. Your answers provide some treasured insight into the people and music that we know a lot about...but DON'T know a lot about. I'm looking forward to learning more from your book.

Cheers!

[Moz]

Who does the hand clapping in "I Don't Want to Know"?


I've always wanted to know that too!

[iamnotafraid]

Who does the hand clapping in "I Don't Want to Know"?


I hope Ken doesn't mind me answering that one.
The clapping was done by none other than Mr. Elvis Presley.
Although to be honest, they did give Barry a go at it.

[sjpdg]

and I know the book is about Rumours, but in Sugar Daddy...does anyone notice the car horn right after she says "pick me up in a big fancy car"??
Anyone know the story behind it? whose car? what kind of car? etc.


I've noticed that for years. I've played it for a couple of friends and for some odd reason they say they can't hear it!!! It's obviously there, so why can't they hear it?! I've always loved that about that song. I'd be interested to know what kind of car it is too and who it belonged to, strictly for "useless trivia"s sake!:laugh:

[Ghost_Tracker]

Too bad...I have requested she be interviewed by me for the book, and I got no reply from her or her manager, not even a simple no thank you. I still love my memories of her and the band.


Yeah, I hate it when 'ya send polite requests or questions to people and they completely blow 'ya off. Makes one feel like a tiny little gnat that's not even worth talking to. :wavey:

;) :lol:

[kencaillat]

Hi All, if you can remember what you were doing when you first heard Rumours, can you let me know?

[jbrownsjr]

Hi All, if you can remember what you were doing when you first heard Rumours, can you let me know?

My mom and I were driving down I-77 from Cleveland Ohio to Myrtle Beach, SC.... It was at night and very dark...

My dad and brothers were sleeping in the back of the van.. and we had the 8 track tape going... The fidelity sounded so good at low volume that we kept it on... it must have played like 5 or 6 times before we put in another tape...

There's just something about watching the white lines go by on the freeway listening to songs like Oh Daddy and Gold Dust Woman, The Chain... it was pretty haunting... I'll never forget the experience because I was allowed to stay up past 9pm which was a treat... I had no idea that these were almost the same people that were on Heroes are Hard to Find, which my uncle had.. I did know that this was the same as the white album however...

So here we were on the west virginia turnpike listening to these incredible harmonies and melodies... The sound of Fleetwood Mac was way bigger than any of the band members... as a kid I remember it sounded like a lot of people were in this band.... and singing along with the album was so much fun... Songbird, Dont Stop and The Chain were my favorites back then... my mom loved Dreams...

Side note, it was one of the best vacations our family ever had... and I never realized it but FMac was with us...

[desertangel]

When I first heard Fleetwood Mac's Rumours, I had been listening to The Eagles Hotel California for weeks.

There was so much hype and marketing surrounding the release of this line up's sophmore album, I didn't bother to run right out and buy it when it dropped because I knew all my friends and neighbors would.

That day, I was at a friend's house kicking back listening to albums when some dude came in clutching a Music Plus bag. He was really excited and obviously a big fan. He explained he'd just gotten a copy of the newly released Rumours after having "waited so long for the band to finally finish it." He walked over to the record player, removed Hotel California and put Rumours on. I liked the cover art. It wasn't like a lot of cover art of the day. It was mysterious and Edwardian. First time through, Gold Dust Woman was the stand out song for me. I didn't listen to Hotel California too much longer after that. I currently own 6 copies of Rumours; 3 on vinyl, 1 CD, 1 remastered CD and 1 DVD-A.

[CADreaming]

When I first heard Fleetwood Mac's Rumours, I had been listening to The Eagles Hotel California for weeks.

There was so much hype and marketing surrounding the release of this line up's sophmore album, I didn't bother to run right out and buy it when it dropped because I knew all my friends and neighbors would.

That day, I was at a friend's house kicking back listening to albums when some dude came in clutching a Music Plus bag. He was really excited and obviously a big fan. He explained he'd just gotten a copy of the newly released Rumours after having "waited so long for the band to finally finish it." He walked over to the record player, removed Hotel California and put Rumours on. I liked the cover art. It wasn't like a lot of cover art of the day. It was mysterious and Edwardian. First time through, Gold Dust Woman was the stand out song for me. I didn't listen to Hotel California too much longer after that. I currently own 6 copies of Rumours; 3 on vinyl, 1 CD, 1 remastered CD and 1 DVD-A.

That was really interesting! Thanks for sharing.

[Old Man Wise]

I remember like it was yesterday...

At a house party, I was having for a few High School friends, some brought their own albums for me to play. I never heard of Fleetwood Mac (this was in 1977 when RUMOURS was released) and was not a rock fan at all. That would explain why I never heard of FM - just wasn’t interested in rock music. When a friend handed me her own album of RUMOURS and asked me to play this next, I was drawn by the cover art - especially the fonts used on the album. ( I am now a graphic designer by profession, which explains my initial interest.)

When I played the album I never heard anything like it before and was an instant fan. I didn’t favor any particular cuts on the album at that time - I loved the whole sound of it. After the party I purchased the white FM album and RUMOURS and really thought these albums were just perfect in every way (that goes not only for the music but also for the photographs, inserts, fonts, etc.)

Later, when I used to go for pizza on Friday nights (glorious High School days!) I used to play the B-side to the single of GO YOUR OWN WAY on the juke box. Of course, it was SILVER SPRINGS and that must have confused the whole restaurant every time I played this masterpiece!

Because of RUMOURS and the songs of Stevie Nicks, I even started writing songs (at 17) which would later be used as the soundtrack to a fairy tale I published for friends. (This is another story not relevant here... just to illustrate how RUMOURS inspired me).

I am a new member and this is my first entry! Hello everyone!

[sleepless child]

I had really gotten into the White Album when it came out in '75. I listened to it religously. I think I first heard "Go Your Own Way" on the radio and was so excited. I was 15 years old. I got the album and played it all the time. I was at a friends house one day we were talking about how cool Fleetwood Mac was and he mentioned the song Silver Springs. I thought I was such an expert and kept saying "they don't do a song called Silver Springs" Well, he pulled out the single and sure enough there was Silver Springs on the B side. We played it over and over all night. I even heard the song on the radio once. I loved this album so much. Fleetwood Mac was THE group in 1977.

[sleepless child]

Here is a photos from the Rumours era

[desertangel]

That was really interesting! Thanks for sharing.

srsly? or you dont' agree.. ? I was in So.Cali at the time (weren't you?) seemed to me the place was rather mad with hype at the time.

[CADreaming]

srsly? or you dont' agree.. ? I was in So.Cali at the time (weren't you?) seemed to me the place was rather mad with hype at the time.

Seriously, it was interesting. No, I wasn't in California. I was 7 when Rumours was released. So, it's fascinating to read the perspective about the hype from someone who can remember it first hand. Instead of all the "second hand news" we usually get...

[desertangel]

Seriously, it was interesting. No, I wasn't in California. I was 7 when Rumours was released. So, it's fascinating to read the perspective about the hype from someone who can remember it first hand. Instead of all the "second hand news" we usually get...

OH, okay! I was just out of high school and it totally seemed to me like So.Cali was FM-land in those days. From just after the white album (Rhiannon) to after Tusk. Frankly, I was getting a bit sick of it and is why I refused to jump on the bandwagon at the time, little rebellious imp that I was. It took the better part of a year before I joined that crowd. :o

[Spikey]

2 things:

1. Ken, kudos for that Q&A in 2001. Amazing read, just spend my Sunday learning about Rumours. Also, you have a pretty mean sales pitch for your DVD's, I wanna buy it now ;)

2. I don't know if this counts, but I'm only 23, and first heard Rumours last year (CD rerelease), walking home from work, my wife having put me onto the band. I remember thinking "Man, this music is too good/detailed to listen to with these ambient sounds and car noise!" and had to listen to it again at home and spent the afternoon lying on my bed listening, and really was blown away, kinda wondering what I'd just listened to. Absolute musical inspiration in one album. I never thought I'd like albums. Now I regularly listen to them. Rumours converted me (White Album was OK, but didn't hook me).

Incidentally, I have a small home studio, and LOVED your tips.

- Spike

P.S. This isn't your question, but I have to say it anyway, Tusk was almost life-changing for me. I almost despised it the first time I heard it (because it wasn't Rumours? :P), but the second or third time, when I listened again, more carefully, it became my favourite album of all-time. Big kudos to you and Herman and the rest for such a phenomenal work of art, it really has changed my life in some ways.

[CADreaming]

2. I don't know if this counts, but I'm only 23, and first heard Rumours last year (CD rerelease), walking home from work, my wife having put me onto the band. I remember thinking "Man, this music is too good/detailed to listen to with these ambient sounds and car noise!" and had to listen to it again at home and spent the afternoon lying on my bed listening, and really was blown away, kinda wondering what I'd just listened to. Absolute musical inspiration in one album. I never thought I'd like albums. Now I regularly listen to them. Rumours converted me (White Album was OK, but didn't hook me).

I'll throw my story in since it's more recent too. I am sure Ken is looking for stories from '77 but...

I became interested in FM after seeing The Dance, being primarily a country fan up until that point. After seeing Destiny Rules and a repeat airing of the Making of Rumours, I decided I should check Rumours out. I purchased it and listened to it on a drive up to Nashville, about 4 or 5 years ago. I immediately was amazed that I knew almost every song, (exception being Oh Daddy). Then, I realized what a huge influence the band had in the landscape of pop-rock music. What a timeless album.

[daniellaaarisen]

I'm only seventeen so my story is relatively recent, but I'll share it anyway.

I first heard Rumours when I was around five. I was obsessed with the Dance around this same time and after wearing the CD out day after day (it was the first CD I ever owned), my mom got me Rumours. I distinctly remember sitting on my carpeted bedroom floor and putting the CD in my stereo. I just sat there and listened to the entire thing all the way through.... I think 5 or 6 times that first day. I had also just learned to read so I had a lot of fun deciphering the lyrics within the album booklet. Rumours taught me how to spell some hard third grade level words when I was only in kindergarten (examples: "heartless", "challenge", "together", "clean"....) :) If my newfound obsession wasn't concrete after The Dance, it sure was after Ruours. The album stuck to my bones and won't come off :)

[LB Freakazoid]

I was about 11 when Rumours came out and I remember my mom's best friend used to sing to it all the time - she sounded just like Stevie and us kids were always pestering her to sing cuz she sounded "just like the record". My friend (my mom's friend's daughter) and I would play Second Hand News over and over again - I think that's where my fascination with Lindsey started! Lindsey immediately squashed my obsession with Kris Kristopherson from A Star is Born at the time. Several years later, I remember listening to my 8-track of Rumours during a rather psychedelic evening, watching one of those wave machines and finally "getting it". That the music fit the words which amplified their meaning and not the other way around... yes, it was a luminous evening:cool:

Then, on the same day the Rumours DVD 5.1 came out -- that was in '01 I think --well, my TV and VCR both died! So I figured it was a sign from above for me to go out and get a home theater system so that I could listen to the new Rumours to test it out! You could hear things in the music that just got lost on vinyl or CD... and no psychedelics this time! None needed.

[Ghost_Tracker]

I'm only seventeen so my story is relatively recent, but I'll share it anyway.

I first heard Rumours when I was around five. I was obsessed with the Dance around this same time and after wearing the CD out day after day (it was the first CD I ever owned), my mom got me Rumours. I distinctly remember sitting on my carpeted bedroom floor and putting the CD in my stereo. I just sat there and listened to the entire thing all the way through.... I think 5 or 6 times that first day. I had also just learned to read so I had a lot of fun deciphering the lyrics within the album booklet. Rumours taught me how to spell some hard third grade level words when I was only in kindergarten (examples: "heartless", "challenge", "together", "clean"....) :) If my newfound obsession wasn't concrete after The Dance, it sure was after Ruours. The album stuck to my bones and won't come off :)

I don't think I've ever heard anyone before mention that Fleetwood Mac was so important in their childhood development (learning to read, being a pretty early memory etc.). That's an amazing, amazing thing when you really think about it... :nod:

[daniellaaarisen]

I don't think I've ever heard anyone before mention that Fleetwood Mac was so important in their childhood development (learning to read, being a pretty early memory etc.). That's an amazing, amazing thing when you really think about it... :nod:

AND it was in this time frame that I started to write, all because I thought Stevie's writing was "really really pretty", as my mom likes to quote. :) And then it began...

[aleuzzi]

I was seven when Rumours was released. My older sister, then 13, went out and bought it right away. We must have listened to Don't Stop 400 times that first week, because my mom loved it. My sister liked The Chain and would play that all the time, too. (Interesting side note: the bass solo reminded me of a bass solo on Boston's first record, which was released a few months earlier.)

I loved the cover art, thought Stevie was gorgeous, and thought Dreams was a really great song. But I also liked You Make Loving Fun. My other sister loved Songbird and Oh Daddy. Of course we used to listen to the whole album through all the time. But, oddly, I was the only one who liked Gold Dust Woman.

[vivfox]

Hey ken it's Viv here with my input. I do expect to be a part of your story.
In 1977 and up to that point I never bought whole albums, just singles.
Fleetwood Mac were huge on the radio then. In late 1976 Go Your Own Way was the first single and I loved it. In late spring/early summer Dreams was a huge hit on the radio and I absolutely loved it. Then came Don't Stop and I thought that was a great song too.
So I say to myself "if this group puts out one more fabulous song like these other three, then I will definately buy the whole album."
Then came You Make Loving Fun and I was blown away again. By this time it was spring or summer of 1978 and I still remember going to the record store and seeing the album for the first time. I loved the pose of Stevie wearing that beautiful see through black chiffon cape, looking like the major hottie that she is, with her leg draped over Mick's leg, with his foot resting on that fancy stool. It was the first time I saw what the band looked like, when I saw the front and back covers.
I bought it and took it home and put it on the turntable and played it from beginning to end. Not back to front the way Stevie listens to albums, but front to back, the way I listen to music.
I loved every song except for I Don't Want To Know, Songbird and Oh Daddy. My standout favorites were The Chain and Gold Dust Woman. To this very day you could play me GDW over and over again and I'd never be sick of it.

Over time I ended up loving the whole album with the exception of Songbird. Never really cared for that one. Like the words to it but not the melody.

I announced to my friends in the summer of 1978 that FM was my favorite Band and Stevie Nicks was my favorite singer.

Oh and one more thing I'd like to add, I was always a huge fan of the gothic soap opera DARK SHADOWS, and Stevie on the cover of Rumours looked as if she were a character plucked right out of the TV show and placed on the cover of the album.
I always loved the font you guys chose to put the lyrics in and was thrilled to have the words available to me and always enjoyed checking out the collage of pictures on the flip side of the lyric sheet as well.
I'm 47 years old now and I was 16 in 1978 and my love for FM and Stevie has never waned.

All my Love, VivFox

[Ghost_Tracker]

AND it was in this time frame that I started to write, all because I thought Stevie's writing was "really really pretty", as my mom likes to quote. :) And then it began...


"And there changed your life." . . . . ;)

[michelej1]

Publisher's Weekly, 10-12-2009

http://www.publishersweekly.com/article/CA6701397.html

'Rumour' Mill

Peter McGuigan, of Foundry Literary + Media, sold, at auction, Fleetwood Mac producer Ken Caillat's Starting Rumours. Kate Hamill at It Books took world English rights to the Grammy winner's behind-the-scenes take on the making of the band's seminal album, Rumours. According to McGuigan, the book, which he called an “oral biography,” includes Caillat's firsthand experiences as well as interviews with a wide swath of people, from band members and roadies to studio execs.

[michelej1]

Palm Beach Post (Pulse)
http://www.pbpulse.com/arts-and-culture/book-reviews-arts/2010/01/31/major-domo-of-hemingways-cuban-home-adds-to-lore-on-papa/

It Books will publish Starting Rumours, a book by Ken Caillat about the making of Fleetwood Mac’s legendary album Rumours.

[Betsy]

^^ BUMP ^^

This is a good read. I was busy in 2009 and totally missed this. Someone referred to it in the other thread, so I checked it out.

If you haven't read this one, or joined after it was started, you might want to read it. I am headed to Amazon to order Ken's book.

[On edit --> Thanks Amlyn for pointing me in this direction...from the Books on the Mac thread.]

[TerraRhiannon]

Is it true this book is due out on May 3rd?

[CADreaming]

Is it true this book is due out on May 3rd?

Looks like it. Everything I can find has May 3rd as the release date. Seems that May is gonna be a busy month around here! :]

[mezzoforte]

Is it true this book is due out on May 3rd?

According to amazon, yes. The dates they list are typically pretty accurate. I'll definitely be twitching with excitement leading up to May 3rd.

Loved reading this thread (I wasn't around at the time). I'm surprised how open he was about Christine, Stevie, and Lindsey's egos, and particularly Christine's "eccentricity." It's definitely promising for the book (although posting something on a forum where the people in question are highly unlikely read it is quite different from publishing it). I'm sure he'll be cautious about burning bridges, but I'd love to read honest descriptions of the personalities and dynamics during Rumours.

[TerraRhiannon]

According to amazon, yes. The dates they list are typically pretty accurate. I'll definitely be twitching with excitement leading up to May 3rd.

Loved reading this thread (I wasn't around at the time). I'm surprised how open he was about Christine, Stevie, and Lindsey's egos, and particularly Christine's "eccentricity." It's definitely promising for the book (although posting something on a forum where the people in question are highly unlikely read it is quite different from publishing it). I'm sure he'll be cautious about burning bridges, but I'd love to read honest descriptions of the personalities and dynamics during Rumours.

Looks like it. Everything I can find has May 3rd as the release date. Seems that May is gonna be a busy month around here! :]

Oh, I didn't even think to look it up on Amazon. I just heard it was coming out on May 3rd. Wow, that's ironic. May 3rd 2011 is going to be an exciting day, I can't wait to go out and buy both 'Spreading Rumours,' & 'In Your Dreams' on the same day :}

[kencaillat]

Hi All, sorry no release date yet, looking for the right publisher. Soon hopefully!
Ken

[shackin'up]

Hi All, sorry no release date yet, looking for the right publisher. Soon hopefully!
Ken

Looking for a publisher? You're in the same boat as Lindsey! :lol:

Good Luck, Ken, publish it and then write the ultimate Tusk-story. Because I still think the story behind that one is at least even complex and interesting.

[HomerMcvie]

Hi All, sorry no release date yet, looking for the right publisher. Soon hopefully!
Ken
I hope you find one soon! I'm sure most of us will buy a copy.

[erwk05]

Looking for a publisher? You're in the same boat as Lindsey! :lol:

Good Luck, Ken, publish it and then write the ultimate Tusk-story. Because I still think the story behind that one is at least even complex and interesting.

Totally agreed here - would love to know the tusk story too.
I wasnt even thought of when rumours came out but I think its great that youre on the board and giving this opportunity to FM fans :) NICE WORK.:blob1: