Falwell Found Unconscious

[sara1998]

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/05/15/jerry.falwell.ap/index.html

LYNCHBURG, Virginia (AP) -- The Rev. Jerry Falwell was hospitalized in "gravely serious" condition after being found unconscious in his office Tuesday, a Liberty University executive said.

Ron Godwin, the executive vice president of Falwell's Liberty University, said Falwell was found unresponsive around 10:45 a.m. and taken to Lynchburg General Hospital. Godwin said he was not sure what caused the collapse, but "he has a history of heart challenges."

"I had breakfast with him, and he was fine at breakfast," Godwin said. "He went to his office, I went to mine and they found him unresponsive."

Godwin said Falwell was receiving emergency care. A hospital spokeswoman said she had "no information to release at this time" on Falwell

Falwell, a television evangelist who founded the Moral Majority, became the face of the religious right in the 1980s. He later founded the conservative Liberty University and serves as its president.

Falwell survived two serious health scares in early 2005. He was hospitalized for two weeks with what was described as a viral infection, then hospitalized again a few weeks later after going into respiratory arrest.

[estranged4life]

I dont wish bad will on anyone...BUT (Need I say more)

[Sarah]

Yeah, well, that sucks in that he's a human being, but if and when he dies, I won't really be sad about it. Preacher of fear, intolerance, and hate. No thanks.

[estranged4life]

They just reported he kicked the bucket

[Rickypt]

Evil horrible person who made the world a worse place for many people. I will not miss him and I am not sad.

[Sarah]

bulletin just posted on the AP wire...

LYNCHBURG, Va. (AP) - A Liberty University executive says the Reverend Jerry Falwell has died.
Falwell was taken to a hospital after being found unconscious today in his office at the school he founded in Virginia. He was 73 years old.
Falwell was a T-V evangelist who founded the Moral Majority, and then became the face of the religious right in the 1980s.
He's had some heart trouble in recent years.

[JazmenFlowers]

Evil horrible person who made the world a worse place for many people. I will not miss him and I am not sad.
amen.

I think we should all camp outside the hospital holding signs that say things to encourage his demise.

[estranged4life]

amen.

I think we should all camp outside the hospital holding signs that say things to encourage his demise.
How a sign that says "God hates a Hypocrite"? Or one that says "Hypocrites go to hell"?

[gldstwmn]

Somewhere Larry Flynt is having a party.

[JazmenFlowers]

ding dong. the witch is dead.

looks like all collective prayers have been answered within minutes.

[strandinthewind]

. . . I think we should all camp outside the hospital holding signs that say things to encourage his demise.

To me, that would make me just as bad as him wishing death on people - though I think he never really did that -- that was Pat Robertson LOL. There is just too much hate in the world I guess.

In any event, I hope he finds peace.

[estranged4life]

Poor Jerry, betcha he is finding out that God loves a good joke, thus his exiled cannonball into that pool of burning fire.

Brian "Jerry Flawed-well is dead, proof there is a God afterall" j.

[jannieC]

I feel for the people who loved him, but whatever. He'll have many followers taking up where he left off, I'm sure.

[JazmenFlowers]

To me, that would make me just as bad as him wishing death on people - though I think he never really did that -- that was Pat Robertson LOL. There is just too much hate in the world I guess.

In any event, I hope he finds peace.
I was being slightly sarcastic. I don't think I'd actually do that either.

as for him finding peace, I can't agree there. if there is a god and there is a hell and god does punish people by sending them to hell, he surely deserves to be there.

[strandinthewind]

I was being slightly sarcastic. I don't think I'd actually do that either . . . .

Mea Culpa!!

[DavidMn]

You know, they say these things go in 3's. Let's have Pat Robertson and Fred Phelps follow him out the proverbial door.:nod:

[Phoenix]

[QUOTE=JazmenFlowers;687917]
as for him finding peace, I can't agree there. QUOTE]

It is true. He needs to be made aware....and if the universe has any justice, and it does, and if God lets you know just how you affected other people in your life time, it is nesessary that ALL sides of the story be told.

[estranged4life]

as for him finding peace, I can't agree there. if there is a god and there is a hell and god does punish people by sending them to hell, he surely deserves to be there.

why does everyone ASSUME we want him down below? I mean really, we, the minions of hell have standards to up-keep ya know :rolleyes: Gays, chiffonheads are fine, hypocrites arent allowed!!!

Brian "Hell's Asst.Manager" j.

[The Tower]

To me, that would make me just as bad as him wishing death on people - though I think he never really did that -- that was Pat Robertson LOL. There is just too much hate in the world I guess.

In any event, I hope he finds peace.
Meh. I'm glad he's dead- if only because I don't have to listen to his crap anymore. He was an evil man.

I'm with ya Jason, that I don't wish bad things to happen to anyone. However, when Darth Vader goes one kind of breathes a sigh of relief.

[strandinthewind]

. . . it is nesessary that ALL sides of the story be told.

I agree. And, this bigot though his missions did a great amount of good for very many people. Was that enough to outweigh the things I saw as bad. IMO - they were not. I hope he finds peace in death.

[sara1998]

Somewhere Larry Flynt is having a party.

I was so thinking the same thing....

[strandinthewind]

I was so thinking the same thing....

and, I'd like to be there in drag!

[Rickypt]

"AIDS is the wrath of a just God against homosexuals." (Falwell)

[JazmenFlowers]

“It appears that America's anti-Biblical feminist movement is at last dying, thank God, and is possibly being replaced by a Christ-centered men's movement which may become the foundation for a desperately needed national spiritual awakening” (Falwell)

[JazmenFlowers]

“(re: 9/11 attacks) "...throwing God out of the public square, out of the schools, the abortionists have got to bear some burden for this because God will not be mocked and when we destroy 40 million little innocent babies, we make God mad...I really believe that the pagans and the abortionists and the feminists and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People for the American Way, all of them who try to secularize America...I point the thing in their face and say you helped this happen." (Falwell)

[Phoenix]

I agree. And, this bigot though his missions did a great amount of good for very many people. Was that enough to outweigh the things I saw as bad. IMO - they were not. I hope he finds peace in death.


That is Not what i meant. I hope that he is made aware of JUST HOW WRONG HE WAS. THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR THE HATE THAT HE SAID, AND PREACHED. I DO NOT HOPE HE FINDS PEACE. I HOPE THAT HE IS MADE AWARE OF JUST HOW WRONG HE IS. THat is what i meant.

[JazmenFlowers]

“[homosexuals are] brute beasts...part of a vile and satanic system [that] will be utterly annihilated, and there will be a celebration in heaven.” (Falwell)

[estranged4life]

"AIDS is the wrath of a just God against homosexuals." (Falwell)

"Death is the wrath of humanity against some relig-a-tard" (Me)

[JazmenFlowers]

"AIDS is the wrath of a just God against homosexuals." (Falwell)
:lol:

we had the same idea!

[strandinthewind]

Those ideas are not wholly outside of the scope of The Bible, when it is taken literally :shrug:

Note - I disagree with them, just as I disagree with JF telling me what God is doing, which interestingly also is mostly against the teachings of The Bible.

[Rickypt]

Falwell got to live a relatively long life of privilege. I do not feel anything bad has happened to him, as we all die, and he got off pretty easy.

[SuzeQuze]

Can I get an amen and a hallelujah? See you in hell, Brian J.!

[estranged4life]

“[homosexuals are] brute beasts...part of a vile and satanic system [that] will be utterly annihilated, and there will be a celebration in heaven.” (Falwell)

homosexuals and Satanist part of the same system? I dont see many Satanists who listen to Judy Garland or Barbara Streisand or who're snazzy dressers :shrug: :lol:

[sara1998]

homosexuals and Satanist part of the same system? I dont see many Satanists who listen to Judy Garland or Barbara Streisand or who're snazzy dressers :shrug: :lol:

You are too damn funny sometimes.... :lol:

[estranged4life]

Can I get an amen and a hallelujah? See you in hell, Brian J.!

the cocktail weiners...And we'll have the Mac provide the music, so a good time for all.

It will be like a Fleetwood Mac fan party, minus the cool air :shrug:

[SuzeQuze]

the cocktail weiners...And we'll have the Mac provide the music, so a good time for all.

It will be like a Fleetwood Mac fan party, minus the cool air :shrug:

Whomever gets there first grabs the table by the window. Wait, do they have windows?

[DrummerDeanna]

“[homosexuals are] brute beasts...part of a vile and satanic system [that] will be utterly annihilated, and there will be a celebration in heaven.” (Falwell)

Yeah...that just SCREAMS Christian love to me. :rolleyes:

Though shocked at the news, sad is something I'm not at all feeling.

[estranged4life]

Whomever gets there first grabs the table by the window. Wait, do they have windows?
Sure there's windows (Freshly cleaned with Windex), so y'all can enjoy Jerry Flawed-well on the treadmill/furnace (Think of it as a hamster wheel of purgatory) running from the same people he wanted to vellify :thumbsup:

[Sarah]

give me a break. that man was not a christian, he just found some sheep who would listen and provide him with the fame and fortune that he wanted.

maybe in the beginning he was in it to spread a message, but once you get a taste of that money, it becomes all about that. it's not up to us to pass eternal judgement, but if i had to guess, i'd wager that he'll be burning just for all the grandmothers he brainwashed into sending in their social security money. for god. :rolleyes:

the filth he spewed is just not logical. if AIDS and 9/11 were retribution for homosexuality, how come thousands breeders have died from those causes as well? ...yeah, ****ing dumbass.

[danax6]

Karma's a bitch.

[JazmenFlowers]

http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/7423/jerryfalwellbastardbyinti5.th.jpg (http://img504.imageshack.us/my.php?image=jerryfalwellbastardbyinti5.jpg)

[mikeschmike]

Ha!

God bless the pork farmers and Mcdonald's workers that sped this along. He was extremely overdue for a big fat heart attack. Let's hope Robertson is next, and not poor Tammy Faye.

[GODDESS6]

Karma's a bitch.
:lol: my sentiments exactly!!!~

[skcin]

“homosexuals are brute beasts...part of a vile and satanic system [that] will be utterly annihilated, and there will be a celebration in heaven.” (Falwell)

That first part is really more of a compliment, don't you think? :cool:

[JazmenFlowers]

That first part is really more of a compliment, don't you think? :cool:
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[GypsySorcerer]

What a despicable, vile excuse for a human being. I cannot muster any sympathy for someone who perpetrated so much hate.

"Jerry has been a tower of strength on many of the moral issues which have confronted our nation," fellow evangelist Pat Robertson said Tuesday. :rolleyes:

[BombaySapphire3]

One of the things that really galled me is that while this disgusting no neck swine of an excuse for a human being was spewing his nonsense about gays .feminists and others contributing to 9/11 a gay man gave his life to stop the terrorists from killing even more people on that day on United 93 while this pig was likely sitting at home and stuffing his face which thankfully contributed to his demise... too bad it couldn't have come sooner.

[SortaSavageLike]

I blame the pagans, abortionists, feminists, gays, lesbians, the ACLU, and the People For the American Way for giving Jerry Falwell a heart attack. My only regret is that he didn't fall on Fred Phelps and crush him to death in the process.

[estranged4life]

I blame the pagans, abortionists, feminists, gays, lesbians, the ACLU, and the People For the American Way for giving Jerry Falwell a heart attack. My only regret is that he didn't fall on Fred Phelps and crush him to death in the process.

let's make the above image more entertaining, shall we? Jerry should have fell on TOP of and INSIDE of Fred Phelps, then his last living memory would be that of committing that 'sin' he was of so offended of - Whatta great send off!

Brian "Ding Dong Jerry Flawed-Well is Dead - Happy Happy Joy Joy!" j.

[foxyluva]

Im really saddened by some of the comments I have read on here :(

[77Rumours77]

OOOOooo, What a shame. Suxh a damn shame.
Now will someone pass me my motha****in party poppers! :]


He won't be missed my me. HEY FRED PHELPS! YOUR DAY IS COMING!.. BITCH

[DrummerDeanna]

Im really saddened by some of the comments I have read on here :(

Really?

I mean someone who spewed so much hatred and divisivness in life - I'm surprised some people are being as NICE as they are! :eek:

[petep9000]

Im really saddened by some of the comments I have read on here :(


Oh come off it, sunshine

[Michelle Daya]

To me, that would make me just as bad as him wishing death on people - though I think he never really did that -- that was Pat Robertson LOL. There is just too much hate in the world I guess.

In any event, I hope he finds peace.

i just had to pipe in to say that your post is by far the most compassionate & i agree with it :nod:

ps. no i'm not a falwell fan.

[sparky]

“homosexuals are brute beasts..."

Let's hope.

What a douchebag this guy was.

In theory, I piss on his grave. In reality, I wouldn't waste the water.

[foxyluva]

Really?

I mean someone who spewed so much hatred and divisivness in life - I'm surprised some people are being as NICE as they are! :eek:

Well, I don't live in the US, so I really can only comment from what I have read. But I guess that the attitude people have displayed in here is exactly what he would have wanted :shrug:

The idea of 'pissing on someones grave' disgusts me. I could not do that no matter how vile I thought the person was...

[mikeschmike]

Well, I don't live in the US, so I really can only comment from what I have read. But I guess that the attitude people have displayed in here is exactly what he would have wanted :shrug:

The idea of 'pissing on someones grave' disgusts me. I could not do that no matter how vile I thought the person was...

It just goes to show you how wretched he was as a person if the good people of the ledge would even contemplate doing such a thing. :shrug:

[Rickypt]

It just goes to show you how wretched he was as a person if the good people of the ledge would even contemplate doing such a thing. :shrug:

And it shows the tremendous impact that the man's vile words, couched in religion, had on many of us. I will never forgive anyone who spewed such hateful words while gay community experienced the horror of the early years of AIDS. I will not wish him peace until he spends a great deal of time on the other side understanding the extremely negative impact he had on this world. And I am disgusted that he is being given nearly nonstop media coverage today that is mostly positive.

There is only a handful of people who I would take time to write negative things about the day they die, but Falwell was pretty damn close to the top.

[foxyluva]

What did he do exactly that was different to the hundreds of other 'gays are evil' people? Maybe Im missing something :shrug:

[Rickypt]

What did he do exactly that was different to the hundreds of other 'gays are evil' people? Maybe Im missing something :shrug:

He was a man of leadership and with tremendous influence.

[foxyluva]

He was a man of leadership and with tremendous influence.

Is there are place to read up on him? I mean, I must be missing something if people hold such a strong hatred for the guy...

[JazmenFlowers]

Is there are place to read up on him? I mean, I must be missing something if people hold such a strong hatred for the guy...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_falwell

[foxyluva]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_falwell

I read that already, and it fails to support why people have such a strong hatred for him.

[sparky]

The idea of 'pissing on someones grave' disgusts me. I could not do that no matter how vile I thought the person was...

You haven't read some of the quotes people have written here?

At one point this heap of trash advocated and basically called for the murder of homos. From his pulpit, in his church, televised. And he raised many millions of dollars, influenced more than one president, and bought numerous politicians.


Piss is too good for him. I can't picture a torture or horror vile enough. They ought to just toss him into a landfill. His actions render him nearly subhuman in my eyes.

[foxyluva]

At one point this heap of trash advocated and basically called for the murder of homos. From his pulpit, in his church, televised. And he raised many millions of dollars, influenced more than one president, and bought numerous politicians.


Where can I read about this?

[sparky]

Where can I read about this?


Dude, why bother?

If the Wikipedia stuff didn't sufficiently horrify you, nothing will.

[foxyluva]

Dude, why bother?

If the Wikipedia stuff didn't sufficiently horrify you, nothing will.

I never said it didn't horrify me - I actually find it disgusting. But I find the hateful things said on here pretty digusting too :shrug:

[Richard B]

I never said it didn't horrify me - I actually find it disgusting. But I find the hateful things said on here pretty digusting too :shrug:

Do a Google search. Use good keywords to bring up search results that you need immediately.

[strandinthewind]

Really?

I mean someone who spewed so much hatred and divisivness in life - I'm surprised some people are being as NICE as they are! :eek:

For me, it's all about not being the person that you despise. In other words, if I hate, how am I different than Falwell.

Now, do not get me wrong, I did not like Falwell - in fact, I loathed, despised, and disagreed with him. I would even go so far as to say that I am glad that his breed seems to be thinning out by whatever means.

But, I am never happy that another human being suffers. To me, that makes me a hypocrite.

Having said that, I am a hypocrite because if someone murdered my kid, I'd likely personally torture and then kill them. Yet, I mostly oppose the death penalty. Such is life.

[strandinthewind]

Dude, why bother?

If the Wikipedia stuff didn't sufficiently horrify you, nothing will.

But, is that worth losing your self worth and wishing the same pain on another human being?

Then again, I could be the only one who finds that hypocritical.

And, all of this is just my opinion. I do not expect people to agree with me ;)

[foxyluva]

For me, it's all about not being the person that you despise. In other words, if I hate, how am I different than Falwell.

Now, do not get me wrong, I did not like Falwell - in fact, I loathed, despised, and disagreed with him. I would even go so far as to say that I am glad that his breed seems to be thinning out by whatever means.

But, I am never happy that another human being suffers. To me, that makes me a hypocrite.


Thanks for saying what I have been trying to say this entire time :angel:

[SortaSavageLike]

Apparently the Westboro Baptist Church will be picketing Jerry Falwell's funeral. Hopefully, the two groups will confront one another in a vicious battle to the death that leaves no survivors.

[sparky]

But, is that worth losing your self worth and wishing the same pain on another human being?

My self worth? Are you kidding me? Calling a scumbag a scumbag doesn't make me anything but honest. His actions and words hurt a lot of people. I wouldn't advocate misery for him and his ilk because of who they have sex with (as they would me), but because of the intentional damage he and his fellow nutcases caused to so many other human beings on this earth.

People who inflict pain, incite violence, and create the kind of environment he worked his whole life to create for homos are essentially social terrorists in my book. Game over. Book shut.

He may have never murdered anyone, but he may as well have.

Come to think of it, I don't think Hitler ever killed anyone either.

Are those glad that Hitler died losing their self worth too?:lol:

[BlackWidow]

amen.

I think we should all camp outside the hospital holding signs that say things to encourage his demise.

I'll see you there..I hope he rots in hell.:cool:

[carrie721]

My self worth? Are you kidding me? Calling a scumbag a scumbag doesn't make me anything but honest. His actions and words hurt a lot of people. I wouldn't advocate misery for him and his ilk because of who they have sex with (as they would me), but because of the intentional damage he and his fellow nutcases caused to so many other human beings on this earth.

People who inflict pain, incite violence, and create the kind of environment he worked his whole life to create for homos are essentially social terrorists in my book. Game over. Book shut.

He may have never murdered anyone, but he may as well have.

Come to think of it, I don't think Hitler ever killed anyone either.

Are those glad that Hitler died losing their self worth too?:lol:

wow. i'll say it again, you need to write a book. :xoxo:

[Sarah]

I think there's a little bit of a difference in hating thousands of people because of how they are - how they were born - without even knowing anything about them and personally hating one man for the viral things he publicly preaches and stands behind. He hates for no reason other than misunderstanding, disregard, and lack of desire to learn acceptance. I hate him because of his slander and libel, which I don't have to compute much to understand.

Like I said, I'm sorry in that he was a human being. I'm not sorry in that he was a simple minded, mean-hearted bastard, and this world has wayyy too many of those.

[Sarah]

Apparently the Westboro Baptist Church will be picketing Jerry Falwell's funeral. Hopefully, the two groups will confront one another in a vicious battle to the death that leaves no survivors.

+10 :wavey:

Friggin' Christian Terrorists need to hook us up with a suicide mission. Well.. that was a little wrong to say, but hey. They're yucky people.

[strandinthewind]

My self worth? Are you kidding me? Calling a scumbag a scumbag doesn't make me anything but honest. His actions and words hurt a lot of people. I wouldn't advocate misery for him and his ilk because of who they have sex with (as they would me), but because of the intentional damage he and his fellow nutcases caused to so many other human beings on this earth.

People who inflict pain, incite violence, and create the kind of environment he worked his whole life to create for homos are essentially social terrorists in my book. Game over. Book shut.

He may have never murdered anyone, but he may as well have.

Come to think of it, I don't think Hitler ever killed anyone either.

Are those glad that Hitler died losing their self worth too?:lol:

I agree Falwell was an a$$hole, idiot, jerk, etc. I am not arguing that.

The Hitler example is a good one. I suppose the people who do not believe in the death penalty would have to say no, they are not happy Hitler died like that. I do think, though, that Falwell was a far cry from Hitler and the countless tens of millions slaughtered as a direct result of Hitler's insanity. Interestingly, Falwell equally condemned people who did violence toward gay people. I get that he knew his words could incite violence, but he did preach against it. That makes him different than people like Hitler.

Again, I disliked Falwell and everything he stoood for. I just have problems relishing in someone's death. To me, that is the same as them relishing the death of gay people. I mean I think people that picketed the soldiers funerals because they were fighting for gay Americans were awful people. To me, picketing for the death of Falwell is equally as awful. I'd be the one trying to reason with him and arguing Biblical theory to support my views. But, that is just me.

[foxyluva]

I agree Falwell was an a$$hole, idiot, jerk, etc. I am not arguing that.

The Hitler example is a good one. I suppose the people who do not believe in the death penalty would have to say no, they are not happy Hitler died like that. I do think, though, that Falwell was a far cry from Hitler and the countless tens of millions slaughtered as a direct result of Hitler's insanity. Interestingly, Falwell equally condemned people who did violence toward gay people. I get that he knew his words could incite violence, but he did preach against it. That makes him different that people like Hitler.

Again, I disliked Falwell and everything he stoood for. I just have problems relishing in someone's death. To me, that is the same as them relishing the death of gay people.

I 100% agree again :woohoo:

[amber]

“[homosexuals are] brute beasts...part of a vile and satanic system [that] will be utterly annihilated, and there will be a celebration in heaven.” (Falwell)

That's going to be one hellavuh boring-ass party. I wouldn't even take my coat off. No gays = no party.

[DrummerDeanna]

I agree Falwell was an a$$hole, idiot, jerk, etc. I am not arguing that.

The Hitler example is a good one. I suppose the people who do not believe in the death penalty would have to say no, they are not happy Hitler died like that. I do think, though, that Falwell was a far cry from Hitler and the countless tens of millions slaughtered as a direct result of Hitler's insanity. Interestingly, Falwell equally condemned people who did violence toward gay people. I get that he knew his words could incite violence, but he did preach against it. That makes him different than people like Hitler.

Again, I disliked Falwell and everything he stoood for. I just have problems relishing in someone's death. To me, that is the same as them relishing the death of gay people. I mean I think people that picketed the soldiers funerals because they were fighting for gay Americans were awful people. To me, picketing for the death of Falwell is equally as awful. I'd be the one trying to reason with him and arguing Biblical theory to support my views. But, that is just me.


I can see what y'all are saying....I can get behind that.

But I also understand those who feel the way they do about his death. For myself, I don't wish harm on anyone, but I also do not mourn his death.

Also...he's set it up so that his sons will take over...will they be any better? So really...someone will always step up to take his place....

[strandinthewind]

I can see what y'all are saying....I can get behind that.

But I also understand those who feel the way they do about his death. For myself, I don't wish harm on anyone, but I also do not mourn his death.

Also...he's set it up so that his sons will take over...will they be any better? So really...someone will always step up to take his place....

I, too, am not really sad he is dead. I was just taken aback by people wishing him pain and suffering.

This whole area of hating just makes me confused and anxious. And again, I am a hypocrite in my views. I think most people are though.

Yea - his sons are likely just as bigoted as he was.

[DrummerDeanna]

I, too, am not really sad he is dead. I was just taken aback by people wishing him pain and suffering.

This whole area of hating just makes me confused and anxious. And again, I am a hypocrite in my views. I think most people are though.

Yea - his sons are likely just as bigoted as he was.

Oh we all have some hypocrite in us for sure. I do not wish him pain or suffering....I can't in good consious do that...but it's about as close as I've ever come ;)

There is no shortage of bigots in the world, sadly...the things these people teach is just so hurtful...and dangerous. and depressing.

[strandinthewind]

Oh we all have some hypocrite in us for sure. I do not wish him pain or suffering....I can't in good consious do that...but it's about as close as I've ever come ;)

There is no shortage of bigots in the world, sadly...the things these people teach is just so hurtful...and dangerous. and depressing.

Oh child - I have founbd myself many a time saying out loud that I wished he and everyone like him would die - but then I regret it and think that is not the way out of the hate. For me, the way out is to show people that being different is okay and is not the awful thing that people like Falwell tell them it is.

[estranged4life]

As one who used to see things from Flawed-Wells point-of-view in his homophobic stupid-ass younger days, but who pulled his head outta his ass and made up his OWN MIND ("Someone's Gotta Change Your Mind"), His death has no bearing on me now...

Just more TV news fodder for those who love that type of thing.

[strandinthewind]

The general public's reaction:

Falwell's legacy: faith, hate or Teletubbies?
By Jonathan Mandell
CNN
(CNN) -- "When I have children one day," Samantha Krieger of Dallas, Texas, wrote to CNN.com, "they will know of the legacy that Dr. Jerry Falwell left."

But what will that legacy be?

To Krieger, who had personal connections to Falwell -- she attended the college he founded; he officiated at her wedding; her husband was his nurse -- the evangelist "was a great leader and hero."

Victoria Kidd of Winchester, Virginia, believes the exact opposite: "The damage he has done to the Christian faith is immeasurable," she wrote to CNN.com

Others would prefer to think that he has no legacy at all.

"He should be erased from every history book and media story," wrote Brian Pippinger of St. Petersburg, Florida.

Jerry Falwell was the evangelical minister who founded the Moral Majority, the Christian right political movement, in 1980. He died Tuesday at age 73, and it's clear from the differing assessments of his legacy that he was a controversial figure.

Matt Foreman, head of the National Lesbian and Gay Task Force, calls Falwell "a founder and leader of America's anti-gay industry. His lasting legacy will be the polarization of the American electorate and the rise of Christian evangelicals as a political force in American politics."

Gene Mims, a trustee of Liberty University, which Falwell founded as Lynchburg Baptist College in 1971, says he "pulled us all towards faith." More narrowly, Mims says that Falwell's founding of the university will be his specific, lasting legacy. "For the past 10 years, that was his focus."

That seems to be what the Rev. Billy Graham believes, as well. "His accomplishments went beyond most clergy of his generation," Graham said in a statement. "Some of my grandchildren have attended, and are attending, Liberty University. "

Susan Friend Harding, a professor of anthropology at the University of California Santa Cruz, studied Falwell and his movement beginning in the 1980s, culminating in a book published in 2000, "The Book of Jerry Falwell: Fundamentalist Language and Politics."

"I see him as a major figure in American political and religious history," says Harding, who considers him the principal leader who brought fundamentalists back into the mainstream of society. "Jerry Falwell led fundamentalism out of political and cultural exile in the 1980s. He did so most famously as the leader of the Moral Majority in 1980s, but also through his national radio and TV ministry, Liberty University and countless sermons, campaigns, rallies, speeches, publications, broadcasts and debates over his 50-year career as a preacher. Under his leadership, fundamentalists transformed themselves from a marginal, anti-worldly separatist people into a visible and vocal force and reintroduced vigorous religious speech into American public life.

"Fundamentalists had been a separatist movement," Harding says, "which was stigmatized even by other Protestants" for three-quarters of a century, ever since their "self-imposed exile" after the Scopes Monkey Trial of 1925, which was ostensibly about the teaching of evolution in the schools, but in effect put fundamentalist intolerance on trial. "Falwell openly and actively disavowed the separatism."

Before Falwell, in the world of fundamentalist evangelicals, Harding says, "being a minister or a missionary was the highest calling. Now it's to be a Supreme Court justice, or the president of the United States. Or a lawyer, doctor, corporate executive, journalist, filmmaker, you name it. It even means being a teacher -- including of biology -- in all the school systems."

Falwell helped break down the walls of the separatism in many ways. "True fundamentalists didn't have friendships, even with other fundamentalists who associated with non-fundamentalists," Harding says. "Falwell said this was wrong; we're going to stop having religious tests. He included you if you supported his agenda -- an agenda that involved attacking other groups."

To many critics, this paradox is what makes his legacy so lamentable. "He made it comfortable for churches to get actively involved in politics," says the Rev. Barry W. Lynn, executive director of Americans United for the Separation of Church and State. "His strategy will be continued by his would-be successors -- a focus on hot-button issues like gay marriage (rather than significant moral issues like child poverty and health care), and an eagerness to make outrageous statements to the media, in order to build a religious-political empire."

Many now remember him most for outrageous statements he made after leaving the Moral Majority -- in 1999, his house organ the National Liberty Journal warned parents that the Tinky Winky TV character was secretly gay and morally dangerous; in 2001, he blamed the September 11 terrorist attack on "pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People For the American Way, all of them who have tried to secularize America."

Susan Friend Harding sees these as his King Lear moments. "He had already lost power by then. It's sad to think he'll be remembered for his remark about Teletubbies."

Find this article at:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/05/15/falwell.legacy/index.html

and another similar one:

Loathed by liberals, Falwell was force among right-wing
Story Highlights• Falwell turned to politics after the Roe v. Wade ruling in 1973
• The decision that granted abortion rights moved Falwell to found Moral Majority
• Moral Majority was credited with helping to elect right-leaning politicians
• Group's platform: Pro-life, anti-gay rights and return to conservative values

CNN -- The son of an alcoholic who sold bootleg whiskey during Prohibition, Jerry Falwell was the father of a movement to restore America as God's country.

Falwell died Tuesday at age 73.

A big thinker from a small town, Falwell began humbly in Lynchburg, Virginia, with 35 members of his Thomas Road Baptist Church at its first Sunday worship service in 1952. The church became a mega-sanctuary with 24,000 worshippers today, according to the church Web site. (Watch how Falwell went from the pulpit to politics)

His church's first offering was $135. Thomas Road Church now banks $200 million annually, according to the Web site.

On the heels of 1973's Roe v. Wade case, the Supreme Court ruling that gave women the right to have an abortion, Falwell was spurred to create the Moral Majority Coalition in the late 1970s. (Watch how Falwell was a major influence on evangelical voters in American politics)

Using the organization as a pulpit to rail against abortion, pornography and a host of other issues he deemed in defiance of God's will, Falwell became a lightning rod for controversy, famously saying AIDS is God's punishment for homosexuality. (Watch how Falwell "changed the face of the earth")

Falwell joined singer Anita Bryant's 1977 campaign to revoke a South Florida ordinance that gave equal rights to gays and lesbians.

The Moral Majority aligned itself with the Republican party, taking credit for helping to elect Ronald Reagan in 1980.

In his 1980 book, "Listen, America!" Falwell said religious voters "cannot be silent about the sins that are destroying this nation," which he identified as pornography, abortion, "amoral liberals," drugs, welfare and the abandonment of biblical morality.

"If Americans will face the truth, our nation can be turned around and can be saved from the evils and the destruction that have fallen upon every other nation that has turned its back on God," he wrote.

"There is no excuse for what is happening in our country. We must, from the highest office in the land right down to the shoeshine boy in the airport, have a return to biblical basics."

A visionary to some, enemy to others
To right-leaning devotees, Falwell was a visionary.

Former President George H.W. Bush once said, "Jerry -- I'm glad to have been introduced by a loyal friend ... "

Falwell once said "Get them saved, baptized and registered."

But former President Jimmy Carter, a Democrat, once remarked of the fundamentalist leader, "In a very Christian way, as far as I'm concerned, he can go to hell!"

In the 1990s, Falwell used his television and radio shows to promote a videotape called "The Clinton Chronicles," which alleged that then-President Bill Clinton was at the center of a criminal conspiracy involving drug dealing and murder.

In the 2000 presidential race, Sen. John McCain singled out Falwell and the Rev. Pat Robertson as "agents of intolerance" within the Republican Party.

McCain lost his bid for the GOP nomination to then-Texas Gov. George Bush after a decisive primary battle in South Carolina, in which Falwell and Robertson lined up behind Bush.

But in gearing up for a second run in 2008, McCain received a warm reception when he addressed Falwell's Liberty University during its 2006 commencement.

Falwell drew the ire of many people, regardless of their their political leanings, when he said that the terrorist attacks on September 11, 2001 were caused by abortion providers, feminists and what he called a morally weak nation that grants too many rights to gays.

"I really believe that the pagans, and the abortionists, and the feminists, and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make that an alternative lifestyle, the ACLU, People For the American Way, all of them who have tried to secularize America," he said. "I point the finger in their face and say 'You helped this happen.' " (Watch Falwell blame 'pagans' for 9/11)

A day later, he told CNN that he would "never blame any human being except the terrorists, and if I left that impression with gays or lesbians or anyone else, I apologize."

In 1999, an article in "Jerry Falwell's National Liberty Journal" accused the creators of the PBS children's series "Teletubbies" of using the character "Tinky Winky" to promote a homosexual agenda.

Matt Foreman, executive director of the National Gay and Lesbian Task Force, extended condolences to those close to Falwell. He told The Associated Press that the leader will always be remembered for his anti-gay comments.

"Unfortunately, we will always remember him as a founder and leader of America's anti-gay industry, someone who exacerbated the nation's appalling response to the onslaught of the AIDS epidemic, someone who demonized and vilified us for political gain and someone who used religion to divide rather than unite our nation."


Find this article at:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/05/15/falwell.politics/index.html

[strandinthewind]

One more:

Your e-mails: Mixed feelings about Falwell's death

(CNN) -- The Rev. Jerry Falwell is dead at 73. Ron Godwin, executive vice president of Falwell's Liberty University, said Falwell had "a history of heart challenges" and was found unresponsive Tuesday at the university.

CNN.com asked readers what they thought of the legacy of the sometimes controversial television minister, responsible for founding the Moral Majority in 1979. Below is a selection of the responses we received, some of which have been edited for length and clarity.

Kimberly Reamey of Appomattox, Virginia
I have known Dr. Falwell since I was a year old. My dad was one of the first students to graduate from Liberty University (Lynchburg Baptist College). My mom was one of his secretaries many year ago. Dr. Falwell preached at my mother's funeral in 1984. He would come up to me and give me a hug, and if there was anyone around, he would let them know that he remembered when I used to ride my tricycle up and down the hallways of the school. Dr. Falwell will be missed greatly. He was loved by so many and hated by some. He was a great man of God. I love him dearly, but he is in a better place, and now he is with my momma.

Kathy Eastwood of Cornwall on Hudson, New York
Although I am sorry to hear of his death because he was a husband and father, he did have extreme Christian beliefs pointing to the weird at times. What I can remember is his "outing" of Tinky Winky, a character on a PBS cartoon for toddlers, as well as SpongeBob SquarePants. I also remember Rev. Falwell years ago in his attempt to take over the PTL [Praise the Lord] ministry, the PTL TV network and Heritage USA run by Jim Bakker due to adultery in the late '80s.

Kenneth of Dallas, Texas
You never want to see anyone die. As with all people, he now is being remembered by family and loved ones, and you have to feel sorry for them.

I personally will not miss him, and I hope that the news stations do not waste time upon his death as they did with Anna Nicole Smith. People die every day, and most die unrecognized. We should not be inundated with news stories of his death. Get buried and let's move on.

Tug Chamberlin of Fayetteville, West Virginia
My mother went to teach at Liberty Baptist College in 1975 before there was a campus or anything such as the world-class facility that is located in Lynchburg today. I attended school there for a while before moving to West Virginia to become a professional whitewater guide. One day, while back in Lynchburg visiting my mother on campus, we ran into 'Jerry' in the dining hall. He called me by name even though I had not seen him in at least five years and I now had much longer hair -- mid-back length -- and a full beard. Neither of these hair styles were or are permitted at Liberty University. He asked me if I was married and I responded, "no." He told me if I moved and transferred back from Davis & Elkins, where I finished undergrad work, that I could find a nice girl here at LU. I thanked him and respectfully declined his offer.

"Jerry" was a great man both of this world and for God. If he had not done what he accomplished in Lynchburg, that town would be another Southern roadside attraction. He brought the world to Lynchburg, the largest city in the U.S. without a connecting interstate. He never wavered from his conviction, and while all the other tele-evangelists were falling prey to scandal, I always knew Jerry would not get into that situation. I did not always agree with his politics from the pulpit, but I firmly believed in the truth that he spoke from God's word! He will be missed! I don't look forward to telling my mother. Thanks for the forum.

Doug Wilson of Washington
A man has to stand for something or he'll fall for anything. Right or wrong, there you have/had Rev. Jerry Falwell.

Ken Owens of Winter Park, Florida
I will remember Rev. Falwell for his hatred of the lifestyle that I did not choose and for him condemning myself and my gay sisters and brothers and fighting to deny us rights that we feel are our birthrights as Americans. I will remember him making me feel angry and bitter toward the religious right and toward fundamentalists and constructionists who choose to take one perceived sin from the Bible and make it their obsession. I will regret that these people are not at the courthouses protesting murderers, but are, instead, at our small annual Gay Pride celebrations protesting our freedom and openness that in no way infringes upon them, except for their weak little minds that choose not to think independently.

Amber Cross of Lynchburg, Virginia
As a Liberty student, I so appreciate the opportunities that I have had to learn from such a great man. While I differ from some of his political views, I respect his earnestness and sincerity in everything he did. He taught me to dream.

Shannon O'Connor of Atlanta, Georgia
As a committed Christian, I think Falwell's legacy can already be seen in the negative attitudes so many people have toward Christianity. His intolerance and hate-filled rhetoric drove people away from God, rather than drawing them closer. I know that wasn't his intent, but you know what they say about good intentions.

Sylvia Replogle of Denver, Colorado
I will always remember The Rev. Falwell as a man who did not understand the Constitution of our country, e.g., the noble idea of the separation between church and state. Alas, I will remember him as a man that did more harm than good.

Kate Soden of Lynchburg, Virginia
In our first convocation of the 2006-2007 school year, Rev. Falwell stood before us and declared this our year of Jubilee. Now at the close of our school year, our chancellor, leader, pastor and friend has gone on. What a moment of Jubilee for him. Rev. Falwell was never too busy for one of his students. As a college, we are saying goodbye with hope, for we know exactly where our Chancellor is.

Ken Cooke of Palm Desert, California
I remember taking his picture at the NCAA regionals when I worked as a newspaper photographer. A very likeable man. I did not share his politics, but I liked him, because he was sincere in his beliefs. He was great as a debater. We will miss him.

Keith LaLande of New York
He stated that the attacks on September 11, 2001, were the result of God removing a protective barrier from the United States as punishment for the nation's acceptance of homosexuals and feminists and blamed the politicians for "allowing it to happen," a sentiment that show host Pat Robertson readily agreed with. Contrary to popular belief, neither Falwell nor Robertson ever apologized. He will be remembered as a hypocrite. People that live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

Gene Mims of Nashville, Tennessee
As a trustee of Liberty University, I can say that we are saddened by the loss of our great leader. Dr. Falwell will be remembered for his vision, leadership and Christian spirit. Anyone who knew him will remember his friendship, compassion, generosity, humor and focus. He and Liberty University will be forged together inseparably. We mourn his passing but look forward in faith to a great future which he provided.

Adam Taylor of Lynchburg, Virginia
I will remember him as a very kind, personable man. I used to work at Liberty as a network technician and heard stories about how generous he was. Every time I met him, I never felt like I was in the room with someone famous. He was modest, friendly and genuine. He may have said some brash things in his life toward those whose lives went against his beliefs, but that doesn't make him a bad person, it just means he's human and he was a devoted follower of Christ. He will be greatly missed by those of us here in his hometown, any by the millions he's affected in his very active life. God bless him, his family and friends and those whose lives he helped mold.

Don Wiggins of Hoover, Alabama
My first memory of Jerry Falwell was in the early 1970s when my mother would call me in from the other room to see this preacher on TV. It was the Old Time Gospel Hour, and they had good music and then Falwell would preach. He was a very good, genuine, committed Christian preacher. He was a good man and will be missed.

Michael Toguchi of Washington
I had the opportunity to meet and chat with Rev. Falwell on a number of occasions. He was an extremely articulate, passionate man who loved to debate the issues he cared about. He was a gifted speaker, and he used to hold an open Q&A session at Liberty University's annual debate tournament banquet. Most of that community is left-of-center politically, but he loved the verbal jousting and offered a great blend of substantive points with sharp one-liners. And you could always count on him to talk about sports, which he loved.

I'm sure plenty of the coverage will emphasize his "controversial" political advocacy, but he really was an extremely nice person who genuinely believed in the good works that he did.

Fred Miller of Campbellsville, Kentucky
I am a Baptist minister who has followed the work of Rev. Falwell for over 30 years. He was a man of vision and obedience to the teachings of Scripture. He made mistakes, most of which were magnified by the media, but he did a lot of good for a lot of people by leading them to a relationship with Jesus Christ and teaching them to live according to the standards of the Bible, albeit from a very conservative perspective.

The church has lost a great ambassador for impacting the culture at a grassroots level. His legacy will be lived out in the lives of the students of Liberty University (where I took two graduate courses years ago) who know well how to integrate their faith with their vocation. His journey ends. His reward begins.

Ashlie Tilley of Lynchburg, Virginia
He was a Godly man of God. God blessed him so much, and it's so sad to know that he is not with us anymore. But I know that he is in heaven with His father and is dancing on the streets of gold, and he is watching over his university and family and friends.

Find this article at:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/05/15/falwell.feedback/index.html

[sparky]

I do think, though, that Falwell was a far cry from Hitler and the countless tens of millions slaughtered as a direct result of Hitler's insanity.

In action, but not intention. He offered up homos as scapegoats in order to appeal to people's irrational fears, and all in the name of gaining political power and the acquisition of wealth. The human damage was never an issue to him. He knew he was inciting violence and creating an environment where it was more likely.

Interestingly, Falwell equally condemned people who did violence toward gay people. I get that he knew his words could incite violence, but he did preach against it.

He only started preaching against it after he got a truckload of bad press. He didn't start out that way, and at best it was wink and a nod lip service.

I just have problems relishing in someone's death.

I don't. Not the deaths of those who perpetrated evil against innocent people. He was especially bad as he twisted a spiritual text and used it as a weapon against people. And he was a solidly behind Reagan while that man
let the early AIDS crisis explode while it was wiping out only the "undesirables."

To me, that is the same as them relishing the death of gay people.

Not to me. For one, people like him would never admit thier relief at the passage of a monster. They would lie and cloak it in religious imagery.
He'd cackle and say something foul like, "The lord works in mysterious ways!" to a cheering crowd.

And as far implying I am a hypocrite, let me paint this picture for you:

Imagine if you will, that I, Sparky, have a vendetta against a group of innocent people. Let's say...people who are celibate. Or perhaps heterosexual.
Then imagine that I spend my spare time, and indeed significant portions my career drumming up people to rally against this group, raising money to attack them, using the writings of others to vilify them, and essentially doing anything in my power to scapegoat them and deny them them a happy life. And I do it on a television show and around the country. And I use my money and influence to attempt to enact laws against them. Laws that deny them basic civil rights and protection.

Now, if I did that, and then hooted about Jerry Falwell being an amoral scumbag and a scourge to society, I would be a hypocrite.

As it is, I am talking about why he was an awful person and expressing my relief that one less rotten human being walks the face of the earth. I am saying the world is a better place with him gone. He would never have done such a thing. He didn't possess that much integrity.

Am I a touch vengeful ? Yup.
Tingling with schadenfreude? Shivering with it.

A hypocrite? I don't think so.

The one thing I have in common with Jerry Falwell is that I do believe, though for different reasons, that people reap what they sow.

[JazmenFlowers]

I read that already, and it fails to support why people have such a strong hatred for him.
oh, well, sorry. I didn't know that. you gave the impression you hadn't read anything.

try fallwell.com

EDIT: it seems they've taken the page down out of respect. maybe once it's back up you can read the intelligent writings there.

[JazmenFlowers]

and for the record, I think I was reacting on impulse earlier. I wouldn't really wish death or pain for anyone; I was more or less making a joke of treating him as he treated many others. the man made me sick. he would deserve whatever fate handed him for the pain and misery and horrible things he did and said. the hatred he spewed probably emotionally damaged more people and caused many to commit suicide or not every fully realize who they are.

I do agree that I don't agree with an eye for an eye mentality, but then I think it's human nature to feel those emotions at the height of something like this. in the end, I guess I'd want him to be forced to recognize how much negativity and destruction he brought to the world he thought he was enlightening and saving. further than that, I'd have to do some soul searching before deciding how I feel.

foxyluva/Michael - one of the worst things I can think of is Jerry's followers parading around after Matthew Shepard's death holding signs saying Matthew was in hell...his mother, family and friends had to see and hear such things at a time they were trying to mourn the loss of their son in such a brutal, inhumane way.

[carrie721]

I read that already, and it fails to support why people have such a strong hatred for him.

i respect your feelings on the matter but i am surprised that after reading that and some of the **** he's said that you don't understand why people have so much anger towards him. maybe it's because you live in nz that you can't fully appreciate how vile he is. he's not just a talking head - he has had incredible influence and sway over american policy, directly affecting the quality of life of gay people. so it's not the same thing as some asshole standing on a street corner screaming about fags. i'm not saying you should hate him or wish him harm, just trying to give you some insight as to why others would.

[strandinthewind]

^^^

I am unsure if Falwell supprted the Mathew S. picketing. I think that was Barry Lynn's freaks.

Interestingly, I just read that people are planning to have large meeting to celebrate his death. To me, that is kind of sick. I get where they are coming from though.

[AliceLover]

In action, but not intention. He offered up homos as scapegoats in order to appeal to people's irrational fears, and all in the name of gaining political power and the acquisition of wealth. The human damage was never an issue to him. He knew he was inciting violence and creating an environment where it was more likely.



He only started preaching against it after he got a truckload of bad press. He didn't start out that way, and at best it was wink and a nod lip service.



I don't. Not the deaths of those who perpetrated evil against innocent people. He was especially bad as he twisted a spiritual text and used it as a weapon against people. And he was a solidly behind Reagan while that man
let the early AIDS crisis explode while it was wiping out only the "undesirables."



Not to me. For one, people like him would never admit thier relief at the passage of a monster. They would lie and cloak it in religious imagery.
He'd cackle and say something foul like, "The lord works in mysterious ways!" to a cheering crowd.

And as far implying I am a hypocrite, let me paint this picture for you:

Imagine if you will, that I, Sparky, have a vendetta against a group of innocent people. Let's say...people who are celibate. Or perhaps heterosexual.
Then imagine that I spend my spare time, and indeed significant portions my career drumming up people to rally against this group, raising money to attack them, using the writings of others to vilify them, and essentially doing anything in my power to scapegoat them and deny them them a happy life. And I do it on a television show and around the country. And I use my money and influence to attempt to enact laws against them. Laws that deny them basic civil rights and protection.

Now, if I did that, and then hooted about Jerry Falwell being an amoral scumbag and a scourge to society, I would be a hypocrite.

As it is, I am talking about why he was an awful person and expressing my relief that one less rotten human being walks the face of the earth. I am saying the world is a better place with him gone. He would never have done such a thing. He didn't possess that much integrity.

Am I a touch vengeful ? Yup.
Tingling with schadenfreude? Shivering with it.

A hypocrite? I don't think so.

The one thing I have in common with Jerry Falwell is that I do believe, though for different reasons, that people reap what they sow.

+10

This guy was before my time, and I certainly did not know much about him until I came to this thread. His comments about homosexuality make me sick. "The gays are responsible for 9-11"...will someone send this to Matt Stone and Trey Parker of South Park please.

[foxyluva]

i respect your feelings on the matter but i am surprised that after reading that and some of the **** he's said that you don't understand why people have so much anger towards him. maybe it's because you live in nz that you can't fully appreciate how vile he is. he's not just a talking head - he has had incredible influence and sway over american policy, directly affecting the quality of life of gay people. so it's not the same thing as some asshole standing on a street corner screaming about fags. i'm not saying you should hate him or wish him harm, just trying to give you some insight as to why others would.

Oh, I can understand the anger. What I can't understand is people saying that they wish him harm and suffering. And for the record, we have people similar to this in NZ. Brian Tamaki of the Destiny Church is our biggest concern, and has done things that make me angry, but would I wish him harm - never.

[JazmenFlowers]

^^^

I am unsure if Falwell supprted the Mathew S. picketing. I think that was Barry Lynn's freaks.

Interestingly, I just read that people are planning to have large meeting to celebrate his death. To me, that is kind of sick. I get where they are coming from though.
you know what? we're both wrong. it was Fred Phelps. my bad.

as for a celebration of his death, I gotta agree that I think that's sick.

[Rickypt]

For me, it's all about not being the person that you despise. In other words, if I hate, how am I different than Falwell.

Now, do not get me wrong, I did not like Falwell - in fact, I loathed, despised, and disagreed with him. I would even go so far as to say that I am glad that his breed seems to be thinning out by whatever means.

But, I am never happy that another human being suffers. To me, that makes me a hypocrite.

Having said that, I am a hypocrite because if someone murdered my kid, I'd likely personally torture and then kill them. Yet, I mostly oppose the death penalty. Such is life.

He didn't suffer. He had a nice long life, unlike the gay men that he was so vile about.

[strandinthewind]

you know what? we're both wrong. it was Fred Phelps. my bad.

as for a celebration of his death, I gotta agree that I think that's sick.

Oh Fred - he, like Falwell, is a self-righteous a$$hole.

I do, though, get why people want to celebrate his death. It just creeps me out.

[strandinthewind]

He didn't suffer. He had a nice long life, unlike the gay men that he was so vile about.

I know he did not suffer, at least not anymore than anyone else with heart conditions.

I was more talking about people saying they hoped he suffered, etc.

Interestingly, many gay men live very long lives :shrug: Or, are you talking about the ones with AIDS who died young?

On edit - I keep waiting for Towie to chime in and acuse me of being sympothizer to JF. I most certainly am not. I loathed the man and pretty much everything he stood for. We are all in agreement on that.

[carrie721]

Oh, I can understand the anger. What I can't understand is people saying that they wish him harm and suffering. And for the record, we have people similar to this in NZ. Brian Tamaki of the Destiny Church is our biggest concern, and has done things that make me angry, but would I wish him harm - never.

i'm sure a lot of people are saying things out of shock & relief that they probably wouldn't under normal conditions.

have the members of the destiny church ever had influence over the nz government? i believe that nz is more liberal towards the lgbt community than the us, right?

[JazmenFlowers]

Ryan's point about Falwell living a nice, long life is spot on. he lived a very privileged life spewing his hate. that's another thing that pisses me off. his organization made like $128M/year in its height. it just upsets me that he made so much money and lived so well by doing such harm to so many people.

[foxyluva]

have the members of the destiny church ever had influence over the nz government? i believe that nz is more liberal towards the lgbt community than the us, right?

The church has zilch to do with the Government. Which is why Civil Unions and Prostitution is legal here. Destiny Church have gone into politics though with the Destiny Party, thankfully though, they are an extremist group and did not even get enough votes for one seat in parliament. They were the main group against the civil union legislation though, and staged a massive protest in Auckland's Queen Street. Thousands of members attended. It was the most scary thing I have ever seen.

http://www.kiwiblog.co.nz/images/Enough%20012e.JPG

[Rickypt]

Or, are you talking about the ones with AIDS who died young?



That's exactly whom I'm talking about. They are the ones whom JF was so callous about.

Strand, I know you aren't a JF sympathizer. And I also don't think there was a lot of cheering of JF suffering on this thread. The man didn't even suffer.

There was a lot of "I don't give a **** that this asshole died", and I am perfectly fine being part of that gang. This prick lived a nice relatively long life and did a lot of harm while he was alive. I am disgusted that he had a day of cable news spending the entire day giving him nonstop coverage, mostly positive.

I'm actually stunned that there is any debate over how people are responding to his death on this board. He was a man in a tremendous leadership position who caused severe pain and harm in a very specific time of history. I will never forget his role and I will never forgive. People can wring their hands over this old fat ****'s death all they want.

[Sarah]

There was a lot of "I don't give a **** that this asshole died", and I am perfectly fine being part of that gang. This prick lived a nice relatively long life and did a lot of harm while he was alive. I am disgusted that he had a day of cable news spending the entire day giving him nonstop coverage, mostly positive.

I'm actually stunned that there is any debate over how people are responding to his death on this board. He was a man in a tremendous leadership position who caused severe pain and harm in a very specific time of history. I will never forget his role and I will never forgive. People can wring their hands over this old fat ****'s death all they want.

No ****. I'm with you on this. I didn't even mention it on my newscast tonight. Quite frankly, I didn't want to hear what any callers had to say. One of the old bitches I work with was all, "oh Lord, brother Falwell has died" and got all sad. It made me feel like puking in my mouth a little, but I bit my tongue because she's like, 80. I actually said "mhm. pity." and popped my gum. :laugh:

[Rickypt]

No ****. I'm with you on this. I didn't even mention it on my newscast tonight. Quite frankly, I didn't want to hear what any callers had to say. One of the old bitches I work with was all, "oh Lord, brother Falwell has died" and got all sad. It made me feel like puking in my mouth a little, but I bit my tongue because she's like, 80. I actually said "mhm. pity." and popped my gum. :laugh:

Good for you. :wavey:

[BlackWidow]

In action, but not intention. He offered up homos as scapegoats in order to appeal to people's irrational fears, and all in the name of gaining political power and the acquisition of wealth. The human damage was never an issue to him. He knew he was inciting violence and creating an environment where it was more likely.



He only started preaching against it after he got a truckload of bad press. He didn't start out that way, and at best it was wink and a nod lip service.



I don't. Not the deaths of those who perpetrated evil against innocent people. He was especially bad as he twisted a spiritual text and used it as a weapon against people. And he was a solidly behind Reagan while that man
let the early AIDS crisis explode while it was wiping out only the "undesirables."



Not to me. For one, people like him would never admit thier relief at the passage of a monster. They would lie and cloak it in religious imagery.
He'd cackle and say something foul like, "The lord works in mysterious ways!" to a cheering crowd.

And as far implying I am a hypocrite, let me paint this picture for you:

Imagine if you will, that I, Sparky, have a vendetta against a group of innocent people. Let's say...people who are celibate. Or perhaps heterosexual.
Then imagine that I spend my spare time, and indeed significant portions my career drumming up people to rally against this group, raising money to attack them, using the writings of others to vilify them, and essentially doing anything in my power to scapegoat them and deny them them a happy life. And I do it on a television show and around the country. And I use my money and influence to attempt to enact laws against them. Laws that deny them basic civil rights and protection.

Now, if I did that, and then hooted about Jerry Falwell being an amoral scumbag and a scourge to society, I would be a hypocrite.

As it is, I am talking about why he was an awful person and expressing my relief that one less rotten human being walks the face of the earth. I am saying the world is a better place with him gone. He would never have done such a thing. He didn't possess that much integrity.

Am I a touch vengeful ? Yup.
Tingling with schadenfreude? Shivering with it.

A hypocrite? I don't think so.

The one thing I have in common with Jerry Falwell is that I do believe, though for different reasons, that people reap what they sow.

^^^^^^
ALL OF THE ABOVE!!!!

[BlackWidow]

i respect your feelings on the matter but i am surprised that after reading that and some of the **** he's said that you don't understand why people have so much anger towards him. maybe it's because you live in nz that you can't fully appreciate how vile he is. he's not just a talking head - he has had incredible influence and sway over american policy, directly affecting the quality of life of gay people. so it's not the same thing as some asshole standing on a street corner screaming about fags. i'm not saying you should hate him or wish him harm, just trying to give you some insight as to why others would.

great post. as a younger gay man..he needs to know about the world.

[strandinthewind]

. . . There was a lot of "I don't give a **** that this asshole died", and I am perfectly fine being part of that gang . . . .

Me too! :cool:

On edit - I guess, though, that we do give a **** because we are all talking about how it matters :D

[Rickypt]

Me too! :cool:

On edit - I guess, though, that we do give a **** because we are all talking about how it matters :D

You got a point there. :cool:

[strandinthewind]

You got a point there. :cool:

Don't I always - puff puff :)

[BlackWidow]

Don't I always - puff puff :)

puff puff...:lol:

[AliceLover]

On the View this morning:

Rosie: Martin Luther King Jr.'s daughter has died which is very sad. Jerry Falwell had died as well...not so sad. :laugh: :xoxo:

[carrie721]

On the View this morning:

Rosie: Martin Luther King Jr.'s daughter has died which is very sad. Jerry Falwell had died as well...not so sad. :laugh: :xoxo:

:laugh: i love rosie!

[strandinthewind]

I do not get the venerating of Yolanda King. I get that she was the daughter of MLK, but that is about where her laurels end. I am sad she is dead, but her celebrity was not really her own, at least from what I have seen/read.

[mylittledemon]

Im really saddened by some of the comments I have read on here :(

I am too. Everything I read after the first 2-3 pages made me wince and I refuse to read the rest. Everyone one here ought to be ashamed of themselves. Regardless of the man's personal beliefs. In my view, the scoffing and mocking is just as bad as you all say Falwell was.

[mikeschmike]

I am too. Everything I read after the first 2-3 pages made me wince and I refuse to read the rest. Everyone one here ought to be ashamed of themselves. Regardless of the man's personal beliefs. In my view, the scoffing and mocking is just as bad as you all say Falwell was.

You should have read the rest of it. Most people said that they reacted on impulse and really didn't wish harm on him. Don't misunderstand, they're still glad he's not around to spew hate and fear. They're just saying that their first reaction might not have been the best. Something Mr. Falwell would have never done.

[GateandGarden]

I am too. Everything I read after the first 2-3 pages made me wince and I refuse to read the rest. Everyone one here ought to be ashamed of themselves. Regardless of the man's personal beliefs. In my view, the scoffing and mocking is just as bad as you all say Falwell was.Pfft. It's all nothing compared to some things that have been expressed on this board. My new favorite example is the idea that people who allegedly commit murder somehow aren't human and so we can kill them.

I'm not ashamed and I don't think anyone else in this thread should be. If I had the ability to orchestrate the deaths of people like Falwell, I wouldn't do so (I only joke about it), but that doesn't mean I'm saddened, and it doesn't mean that I'm not glad the world won't have to listen to more of his drivel.

And I don't see how anything here can approach being as harmful as much of what Falwell said.

[sparky]

And I don't see how anything here can approach being as harmful as much of what Falwell said.

Evidently not mourning the death of a villian is equivalent to doing epic damage to entire groups of innocent human beings. How dare anyone be relieved and glad when someone evil is gone. What monsters.

:rolleyes:

Some of the responses on this thread have shocked the hell out of me too, honestly. I wouldn't be surprised if there are people who have posted in this thread who wouldn't even defend their own lives for fear of seeming as mean or as bad as their attackers. I am picturing people whimpering at the feet of their own murderers, telling the murderers they are forgiven as their lives are being beaten out of them. The meek shall inherit the ****, and at the very least, a boot in the face.

It is extremely easy to whistle dixie about peace and love and forgiveness when you haven't been under attack by people like this. People who haven't been in a battle know nothing about war. And war is exactly what men like this bastard were waging, and will continue to wage.

I'm not going to weep and be sorry over the death of someone like this. One more threat to human decency and freedom gone. Hip hip hooray.

[JazmenFlowers]

The meek shall inherit the ****, and at the very least, a boot in the face.
you are ****ing full of soundbytes. :xoxo:

[sparky]

you are ****ing full of soundbytes. :xoxo:

It is a consequence of experience.:wavey:

[BTFLCHLD]

I'm not going to weep and be sorry over the death of someone like this. I haven't noticed anyone doing that. I would imagine the only ones doing that are his family and followers. Am I missing some posts?

This guy had no direct impact on my life but I know he did with others and for that I am sad.

A death I am sad about? Doug Blasdell. :angel:

[strandinthewind]

. . . I'm not going to weep and be sorry over the death of someone like this. One more threat to human decency and freedom gone. Hip hip hooray.

For the record, I was never arguing what you said was argued in general. I, too, am not unhappy that his hate is not longer in the world; I agree with you there. I despised this man and everything he did to destroy others' faith all in the name of making a buck.

I was just taken aback at people wishing him pain, wanting to torture him, etc. Remember, this thread started before we knew he was dead.

I see a difference there :shrug:

[DavidMn]

I wonder if Heart Attack by Olivia Newton John was playing on his office Boom Box when he keeled over?:lol:

[carrie721]

I am too. Everything I read after the first 2-3 pages made me wince and I refuse to read the rest. Everyone one here ought to be ashamed of themselves. Regardless of the man's personal beliefs. In my view, the scoffing and mocking is just as bad as you all say Falwell was.

ashamed? please. honestly. i don't think someone who's had his kibbles and bits plastered all over the internet can be telling others about shame :rolleyes: :laugh:

and considering how often you state around here that you're not gay and that you have a gf, it's clear you couldn't fully appreciate how vile JF was.

[Michelle Daya]

i disagree with falwell's opinions, i'm not a republican & i have no prob with gay rights. but i do think contempt or hatred has to stop somewhere.

feel sorry for falwell. imo, he was incredibly ignorant & lived his whole life that way never being enlightened or even having his mind opened to tolerance for things he never understood. a life like that might be worse than death. don't spit on his grave. mourn his ignorance. i know i do :distress:

[carrie721]

i disagree with falwell's opinions, i'm not a republican & i have no prob with gay rights. but i do think contempt or hatred has to stop somewhere.

feel sorry for falwell. imo, he was incredibly ignorant & lived his whole life that way never being enlightened or even having his mind opened to tolerance for things he never understood. a life like that might be worse than death. don't spit on his grave. mourn his ignorance. i know i do :distress:

he was pathetic, no doubt. but i'm not going to waste time mourning his ignorance. the beliefs he espoused went so far beyond ignorance - they were hatred and filth. he used them to exploit others' fears and prey on gays in order to gain power and money. i'm only sad for the lives he helped ruin.

[strandinthewind]

i disagree with falwell's opinions, i'm not a republican & i have no prob with gay rights. but i do think contempt or hatred has to stop somewhere.

feel sorry for falwell. imo, he was incredibly ignorant & lived his whole life that way never being enlightened or even having his mind opened to tolerance for things he never understood. a life like that might be worse than death. don't spit on his grave. mourn his ignorance. i know i do :distress:

I think people have a hard time seeing past hatred to take this higher road. For me, I truly hope that this misguided and IMO bad and conflicted man will find peace in death. In that peace, my hope is that God shows JF that he was wrong to conduct himself so in life and that JF's peace is to stop his hating. I get that few are able to have this hope, but I do. And, I think if many more people thought like this, there would be less hatred in the world, which IMO would lead to less people like JF having so much power. As I have said before, there have been many times when I wished JF was dead. But, I am ashamed to think that way because I think that whether you are straight, gay, or like sheep - you can recognize someone filled with hate, in whatever public guise, and try to rise above that hate. All of this is just my opinion though and many prefer just to hate.

[sparky]

I think people have a hard time seeing past hatred to take this higher road.

Ok, Mother Theresa Sausage Patty.

For me, I truly hope that this misguided and IMO bad and conflicted man will find peace in death. In that peace, my hope is that God shows JF that he was wrong to conduct himself so in life and that JF's peace is to stop his hating.

You hope God is teaching John Wayne Gacy this is well?

[strandinthewind]

Ok, Mother Theresa Sausage Patty.

:D :D :D

You hope God is teaching John Wayne Gacy this is well?

Yes, I do. I also hope He taught it to Hitler, Nero, and all the other bigoted mean people in history. I guess I do not want people to burn in Hell. I'd rather they find peace.

Then again, I am a soft touch ;)

But and to the larger point, when will all the hating lessen if all parties just hate. Maybe hatred is just an inescapable part of human nature. I know it is hard for me not to hate to the degree that I wish pain on people.

[SuzeQuze]

:D :D :D



Yes, I do. I also hope He taught it to Hitler, Nero, and all the other bigoted mean people in history. I guess I do not want people to burn in Hell. I'd rather they find peace.

Then again, I am a soft touch ;)

But and to the larger point, when will all the hating lessen if all parties just hate. Maybe hatred is just an inescapable part of human nature. I know it is hard for me not to hate to the degree that I wish pain on people.

I also like to believe that they are taught that on the other side and have a forehead slapping moment. Still, I let my lower nature bask a bit before I take the high road and forgive and let go.

I was going to make a joke about this and say baloney you've taken the high road, I've seen your JF dart board with "Die Bitch" written over his face and thousands of dart holes in it. :lol: But I took the high road on that. Okay not really.

[strandinthewind]

^^^

WHO TOLD YOU ABOUT THAT DART BOARD :laugh:

and, if it had been his fat a$$ instead of of his hog jowled face, 2,000 dart holes could have fit :wavey:

[Michelle Daya]

I think people have a hard time seeing past hatred to take this higher road. For me, I truly hope that this misguided and IMO bad and conflicted man will find peace in death. In that peace, my hope is that God shows JF that he was wrong to conduct himself so in life and that JF's peace is to stop his hating. I get that few are able to have this hope, but I do. And, I think if many more people thought like this, there would be less hatred in the world, which IMO would lead to less people like JF having so much power. As I have said before, there have been many times when I wished JF was dead. But, I am ashamed to think that way because I think that whether you are straight, gay, or like sheep - you can recognize someone filled with hate, in whatever public guise, and try to rise above that hate. All of this is just my opinion though and many prefer just to hate.

agree with you on everything :nod:

[sparky]

Yes, I do. I also hope He taught it to Hitler, Nero, and all the other bigoted mean people in history. I guess I do not want people to burn in Hell. I'd rather they find peace.


I was gonna make a joke about that soft touch thing, but it is too obvious.

About the above point, I believe in none of any of that, so you and I could never possibly be on the same page with it.:shrug:

[strandinthewind]

. . . About the above point, I believe in none of any of that, so you and I could never possibly be on the same page with it.:shrug:

Oh well, opposites attract :D

[HollywoodSteve]

"he has a history of heart challenges"

Like, not having one?

[DrummerDeanna]

"he has a history of heart challenges"

Like, not having one?

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

Oh my God. Wasn't expecting that one....good catch. :p

[stevierocks87]

I was curious to get my nana's, a very Southern-baptist conservative republican type, opinion about good ol' Reverend Falwell's death. I know my nana to be a genuinely loving, compassionate person. The conversation:

"Did you hear that JF died?"

"Yes- I was very sad to hear that"

"Really? I wasn't. I thought he was an extremely mean-spirited, hateful person."

"Well, a lot of people think that. He was a good Christian man standing up for what he believes in".

So it goes. JF types make me absolutely sick, using the message of a loving, compassionate radical- Jesus- to spew hatred and divide people for his own personal gain.

Sparky? Right on man. I'm all about forgiveness, but people have a right to be mad about this man. The takeover of Christianity by the Religious Right makes me furious. These people DO NOT have a monopoly on God, and if anything have TURNED PEOPLE AGAINST any kind of belief in God, which I find incredibly unfortunate.

I really want to sit down with my Nana and a list of Falwell quotes. How could anyone supposedly supporting social justice also support this man? I suppose she comes from an era where you are not allowed to question anything for fear of being "wrong" or offending God.

All very unfortunate :( I would love to see a mobilized force to combat the Religious Right's takeover of Christianity and politics. A new message: "That's not what Jesus meant! He loves you! We are sorry for being self-righteous, judemental assholes!"

:wavey: Adam

p.s. Anyone who hasn't done so, I HIGHLY recommend the Sundance series "One Punk Under God" about Jay Baker. I LOVE him. I believe you will all find it very refreshing :nod:

[carrie721]

p.s. Anyone who hasn't done so, I HIGHLY recommend the Sundance series "One Punk Under God" about Jay Baker. I LOVE him. I believe you will all find it very refreshing :nod:

cool post. i think i get the sundance channel - i'll have to check that show out. thanks for recommending it. :woohoo: :wavey:

[BlackWidow]

I am too. Everything I read after the first 2-3 pages made me wince and I refuse to read the rest. Everyone one here ought to be ashamed of themselves. Regardless of the man's personal beliefs. In my view, the scoffing and mocking is just as bad as you all say Falwell was.

You should be ashamed for sending people your nude photos...:laugh:

[strandinthewind]

Poor Sean Hannity - what a fukcing idiot :rolleyes:

And - I think Christopher Hitchens was not really over tht e top here. I mean allowing FOx to parade only the good qualities of Falwell and simultaneously implying if not stating that his devotion to his faith excused his hate is ridiculous. When you are a public figure and you die, your legacy is your legacy :shrug:

Anyway:
________________________________________

Christopher Hitchens and Ralph Reed Square Off over Late Leader's Influence; the Christian Right

Thursday , May 17, 2007

____________________________

This is a partial transcript from "Hannity & Colmes," May 16, 2007, that has been edited for clarity.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JERRY FALWELL: Throwing God off successfully with the help of the federal court system, throwing God out of the public square, out of the schools. The abortionists have got to bear some burden for this, because God will not be mocked. And when we destroy 40 million little innocent babies, we make God mad.

I really believe that the pagans and the abortionists and the feminists and the gays and the lesbians who are actively trying to make an alternative lifestyle — the ACLU, People for the American Way, all of them who tried to secularize America — I point the finger in their face and say you helped this happen.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ALAN COLMES, CO-HOST: That was Reverend Jerry Falwell on "Hannity & Colmes" back in 2004. The controversial televangelist was a polarizing figure emboldening conservative Christians while alienating many liberals. But there's no question about the impacting legacy Falwell leaves behind.

Joining us now is Republican strategist Ralph Reed and author of "God is Not Great", columnist Christopher Hitchens, who made news last night with his harsh critique of the reverend. Christopher, let me start with you here and talk about the things you've said which — obviously, we know where you stand on religion. We know where you stand on Reverend Falwell. By being so angry about what his legacy was and is, are you not hurting his family and others who may have no dog in that hunt, but who would just like a few moments to celebrate his life and have some peace?

CHRISTOPHER HITCHENS, AUTHOR, "GOD IS NOT GREAT": Well, I don't care whether his family's feelings are hurt or not. But if they are, they can take comfort from the extraordinary piety and stupidity, and generally speaking, uniformity of the coverage of the man's death.

It is, after all, said — was said by the supposed Jesus of Nazareth to his followers that they must expect to be mocked for their beliefs, because their beliefs will appear to many people to be ridiculous, if not worse than that. And that they are to take it for granted that they will be ridiculed.

That's true of, I think, of the most devout and serious and thoughtful Christian. But for a vulgar fraud and crook like the Reverend Falwell, it's an obligation to say what one thinks about him, or be left off the air and have people like yourselves broadcasting only piety.

COLMES: I'm not broadcasting only piety. I've got my radio show. And now we're having you on here to talk about your view. What else is being said?

HITCHENS: You're having me on and then arguing that maybe it's bad taste to have me on. I don't think...

COLMES: I thought it was a legitimate question, because I think people are worried...

HITCHENS: I've answered the question. What's the next one?

COLMES: Now we will move on to Ralph Reed now that you have answered that question. Ralph, does Christopher Hitchens have a point? It is a free speech issue. He was a polarizing figure, Reverend Falwell was. And there are many people, maybe not all of them feeling as strongly as Christopher Hitchens, but who feel that Reverend Falwell was, indeed, a polarizing figure. He said things that offended many Americans.

RALPH REED, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Well you know, look, any time Alan, that you are an agent of change, the way Dr. Falwell was, who had the kind of impact that he had on American religion, on our culture, and on our politics — he was one of the most important historical figures of the last 50 years in each of those areas, ending the self-imposed exile of evangelicals from civic and cultural engagement.

And I think transforming them into one of the most important and vibrant and energetic constituencies in the entire electorate. No one does that, liberal or conservative, Republican, Democrat, of any faith, and not stir controversy. It's just my belief, as an American, not as a conservative, not as somebody of any particular denominational background or faith, but just as an American in terms of elevating our civility of our discourse, that when somebody dies that we ought to show a measure of respect and appreciation for their family and for their loved ones and for those who are grieving right now. And our thoughts and prayers ought to be with them, regardless of whether we agreed with Dr. Falwell or not.

SEAN HANNITY, CO-HOST: Christopher Hitchens...

HITCHENS: Oh, come on, play the world's smallest violin. Listen, he established a business, a racket, in my opinion. He was a religious businessman in the same way as Mr. Ralph Reed is a religious entrepreneur. He's left the business to his children. It's a hereditary job. Let that console them. You can't have me on and say that I have to say I'm terribly sorry he's dead.

HANNITY: Hey, Christopher.

HITCHENS: One reason you can't ask me to do that is because I am not. I think we have been rid of an extremely dangerous demagogue who lived by hatred of others, and prejudice, and who committed treason by saying that the United States deserved the attack upon it and its civil society of September of 2001 by other religious nut cases like himself.

HANNITY: He profoundly and repeatedly apologized. And I'm sure you're perfect.

HITCHENS: No, he did not enough.

HANNITY: I'm sure you're perfect in your life and that you've never made any mistakes.

HITCHENS: I've never committed treason like that. I don't believe in the sincerity of his apology.

HANNITY: Let's look at the thoughtlessness and the mean-spiritedness of your very remarks that you made about Reverend Falwell.

HITCHENS: By all means.

HANNITY: You think it's a pity that there isn't a hell for him to go to, you said.

HITCHENS: Yes, I do.

HANNITY: On his death, you write, "The discovery of the carcass of Reverend Falwell on the floor of his obscure office is, you know, almost zero significance except for perhaps two categories of people," et cetera. You also say the evil he did will live after him.

HITCHENS: Yes.

HANNITY: I knew Reverend Falwell, Christopher. I know the good work that this man has done.

HITCHENS: Tell me about it.

HANNITY: Well...

HITCHENS: Takes a lot to make me cry.

HANNITY: I know you think you're the smartest guy in the room, but you sound like a jackass when you attack his family like this. But I know...

HITCHENS: I didn't attack his family. Excuse me.

HANNITY: ... what he did for unwed mothers. I know what he did for alcoholics. I know what he did for drug addicts.

HITCHENS: Excuse me, sir.

HANNITY: Yes.

HITCHENS: I did not attack his family. And no fair-minded viewer of yours will say it. I'm not going to be conscripted to say that it's my job, when you invite me on to discuss this man, first to say how sorry I am for him and his family. That isn't what I feel. You no doubt, as a Christian or whatever you are, require hypocrisy of people. And so you're asking me...

HANNITY: I'm not asking — no, but I am asking for human decency. And if you don't think it has an impact on his family to use even the phrases tonight that he's vulgar, a fraud and a crook. And then to say that...

HITCHENS: Am I supposed to conceal my — you asked me on.

HANNITY: I think you are incredibly mean, incredibly selfish and thoughtless.

HITCHENS: You invited me, sir, to give my opinion of the departed. I give it to you, and you say, well, might that not upset his family. I said it while he was alive. That might have upset his family, too.

HANNITY: Will you give the opinion about that? You give the opinion about him. And I'm giving you the opinion about you and the thoughtlessness of your remarks here. And I'm really calling for any human decency that you may have in your pseudo-intellectually — mind of yours.

__________________________________________________

B.O's point of view, which is the same "let us say only good things for two weeks while it's newsworthy and then the bad can come in on page 10" :rolleyes: But, I gove B.O. credit for calling Falwell on his intolerance and B.O. did this to Falwell to his face more than once.

Disrespecting Jerry Falwell

Thursday , May 17, 2007

By Bill O'Reilly


Hi, I'm Bill O'Reilly. Thank you for watching us tonight. Sorry I couldn't be here last night, but I had to take care of a medical situation. Everything's fine, but the teacher did mark me absent.

"Talking Points Memo" this evening: disrespecting Jerry Falwell shortly after his death.

"Talking Points" has been reporting for years that the secular-progressive far left movement in the USA is not free speech friendly. If you disagree with those people, many of them will try to hurt you. Far left intolerance is off the chart.

And there is no better example than reaction to the death of Reverend Jerry Falwell. Within hours of his demise, the far left hate machine cranked up:

Now there's no question Jerry Falwell was at times intolerant himself. — Condemning gays and other groups and passing judgments on behavior that earned him the hatred of many.

But even if you dislike Falwell, let his family and friends grieve for a few days, OK? There's no reason to kick his dead body. For example, a far left Minneapolis Star Tribune editorialized, "Falwell urged [Christians] to focus on issues that drove them apart. It's hard to see what's moral about that."

The far left Oregonian newspaper in Portland, "[Falwell] built an effective political organization at least partly by appealing to people's worst instincts."

The far left Baltimore Sun: "Claiming to be morally superior is a dangerous game." Well, isn't that what you do Baltimore Sun, every day? If you don't agree with your liberal positions, you guys label people bigots and fascists or worse. Don't you?

And finally, this revolting statement from former John Edwards employee Amanda Marcotte. "The gates of hell swing open and Satan welcomes his beloved son. Jerry Falwell's dead. Guess god [sic] — notice the small 'g' — liked the ACLU better after all.

Now Ms. Marcotte symbolizes the hateful far left in America. Same people who celebrated when Tony Snow announced he had cancer. This group, ladies and gentlemen, doesn't deserve respect. They are shameful.

As for Jerry Falwell, he was an American who spoke his mind. I disagreed with him on many issues, I told him so to his face, but he had the courage to come in here and debate. I believe the Reverend was wrong in singling out homosexuals for scorn. I believe only God has the power to judge people's personal behavior.

But Jerry Falwell had a right to say what he said. And these awful secular progressives have that same right. But there is such a thing as decency. And when somebody dies, you give it a few days. — Just another example of how out of control the SP far left movement in America is today.

And that's "The Memo."

www.foxnews.com

_____________________________________________________

Note - if Hillary Clinton died - Fox would hire strippers that hour :nod:

[Sarah]

"he has a history of heart challenges"

Like, not having one?

zing. too perfect.. i'm loving it. :laugh:

[BlackWidow]

zing. too perfect.. i'm loving it. :laugh:

I loved it too...:nod: :laugh: