What has happened to Lindsey???

[cincymike1]

This truly pains me more then any other thread I have ever posted, but last night's national show on Craig Fisher (?) was the last straw!!! It is time for us to admit the new cd is a failure and if Lindsey wants to remain able to put out cds on a popular label such as Warner Reprise, he had better snap out of his middle age/old married I am happy type of boring songs (not too late, shut us down, juniper way, I am waiting, etc.) and start putting out the original exciting stuff we experienced on the so-called gift of screws cd. His new set of songs are decent by other artists standards, but Lindsey is waaaaay above that level....so much so that I have often considered him the modern age Beethoven/Bach of rock and roll.

I understand that he is nearing the age of 60 and all good things in life eventually come to an end, but deep down I believe he still has better material then we are seeing. It is sad that this is all we get after 14 years of patience and false releases. Some people say Yoko Ono brought down John Lennon's music quality and I am honestly wondering if wife and kids have brought down Lindsey's quality. It is great that Lindsey is married and finally happy in life (and nobody deserves this more than LB), but reality says his music has suffered from contentment and age/maturity.

Let the bashing begin.......but any real LB fan deep down knows that this cd does not fit in the same catagory as Law in Order, Go Insane, and Out of the Cradle. I hope (but seriously doubt) that everyone who stayed up late at night to catch "Not to Late" felt the same thrills they felt when watching Lindsey perform "Countdown" and "Soul Drifter" on David Letterman 14 years ago. There has even been a dropoff in quality when comparing the fun "Out of the Cradle" videos to the current batch of boring videos for "Under the Skin".

Here's to hoping this cd was just an aberration.....

[mylittledemon]

This truly pains me more then any other thread I have ever posted, but last night's national show on Craig Fisher (?) was the last straw!!! It is time for us to admit the new cd is a failure and if Lindsey wants to remain able to put out cds on a popular label such as Warner Reprise, he had better snap out of his middle age/old married I am happy type of boring songs (not too late, shut us down, juniper way, I am waiting, etc.) and start putting out the original exciting stuff we experienced on the so-called gift of screws cd. His new set of songs are decent by other artists standards, but Lindsey is waaaaay above that level....so much so that I have often considered him the modern age Beethoven/Bach of rock and roll.

I understand that he is nearing the age of 60 and all good things in life eventually come to an end, but deep down I believe he still has better material then we are seeing. It is sad that this is all we get after 14 years of patience and false releases. Some people say Yoko Ono brought down John Lennon's music quality and I am honestly wondering if wife and kids have brought down Lindsey's quality. It is great that Lindsey is married and finally happy in life (and nobody deserves this more than LB), but reality says his music has suffered from contentment and age/maturity.

Let the bashing begin.......but any real LB fan deep down knows that this cd does not fit in the same catagory as Law in Order, Go Insane, and Out of the Cradle. I hope (but seriously doubt) that everyone who stayed up late at night to catch "Not to Late" felt the same thrills they felt when watching Lindsey perform "Countdown" and "Soul Drifter" on David Letterman 14 years ago. There has even been a dropoff in quality when comparing the fun "Out of the Cradle" videos to the current batch of boring videos for "Under the Skin".

Here's to hoping this cd was just an aberration.....

What are you basing this "failure" of a CD on? Sales? Your own opinion? Lindsey is at a point in his career where "sales" don't mean success. He can sell plenty of records with Fleetwood Mac. If he wants to go out, and release a solo album of more "esoteric" material than the Fleetwood Mac outlet allows him, then so be it. MORE music is better than NO music. I think that you're unwarranted in your seemingly spoiled opinion.

Better material than we're all seeing? Ok...I happen to feel that under the skin is a better album than Law & Order, and Go Insane. For me, it's right behind OOTC. Just my opinion. And sure he has more material. All the press (including Lindsey) say he's putting out a companion album of "rocking" material in summer 2007. So just have a little patience there, grasshopper.

Let the bashing begin. Indeed. Were you looking for an argument, or maybe just a little tiff? I should hope not. But it's all in good fun eh? And in regards to your last statement about the album fitting in with his last 3 albums...well of course it doesn't fit it. It's a completely separate record. He wasn't out to make a trilogy or a series of films. Does "Tango in the Night" fit in with "Mirage" or the "Rumours" album? Nope. They're all different.

So there you have it. My opinion on your thread...better th<I>a</I>n reading some threads here, but not many of them.

[LukeA]

This truly pains me more then any other thread I have ever posted, but last night's national show on Craig Fisher (?) was the last straw!!!

Craig Ferguson.

It is time for us to admit the new cd is a failure and if Lindsey wants to remain able to put out cds on a popular label such as Warner Reprise, he had better snap out of his middle age/old married I am happy type of boring songs (not too late, shut us down, juniper way, I am waiting, etc.) and start putting out the original exciting stuff we experienced on the so-called gift of screws cd.

Lindsey doesn't need to have a "popular label" to release his music. I don't know why (or, more likely, if) he even does, but, believe me, no one's making any real money off of the Under The Skin CD.

I'm not particularly a fan of the new album either, but if this is the album that he wants to release (its clear how proud he is of it if you read any recent interview), he's earned that right. If it's overblown, guitar pawing indulgent six minute rock epics you're after, I'm sure the new "rock" CD next year will be chock full of them. Count on it.

I understand that he is nearing the age of 60 and all good things in life eventually come to an end, but deep down I believe he still has better material then we are seeing. It is sad that this is all we get after 14 years of patience and false releases.

Two albums and (potentially) two tours. What's wrong with that, again? It's not like he's been completely out of sight the last 14 years.

Some people say Yoko Ono brought down John Lennon's music quality and I am honestly wondering if wife and kids have brought down Lindsey's quality. It is great that Lindsey is married and finally happy in life (and nobody deserves this more than LB), but reality says his music has suffered from contentment and age/maturity.

Priorities change. I happen to pinpoint the downfall in the early 90's, with OOTC- talk about a complacent record. The tour, which begat the new versions of "Big Love" and "Go Insane" (I'm not even going to touch "Sardonic World"), enhanced the complacency and the rut that he's been in ever since.

Let the bashing begin.......but any real LB fan deep down knows that this cd does not fit in the same catagory as Law in Order, Go Insane, and Out of the Cradle.

Anything is better than Out of the Cradle.

There has even been a dropoff in quality when comparing the fun "Out of the Cradle" videos to the current batch of boring videos for "Under the Skin".

You *do* realize you're comparing high-six figure budget videos shot on film with home videos shot on the home camcorder, right? After Warners promoted the hell out of OOTC only to have it stiff like the album that it is, you can't expect them to put up the big bucks for a boutique album that will be lucky to sell 50,000 copies.

[dontlookdown]

i love this record + i think its brilliant.
i did not catch the craig fisher show but i really loved the rendition of not too late
on craig ferguson.

nothing has happened to Lindsey.
you just have extremely mainstream expectations for an artist to make music that you want to hear.
artists don't work that way.
forget about Under The Skin. You don't "get it".
he doesn't have any interest in making suburban Top 40 music anymore.
and that's why I love him.

why would he have any interest in signing with a "popular" label?
look at Warner's roster. aside from Neil Young and Fleetwood Mac, it's mostly garbage.
the only reason Lindsey is still with WB/Reprise is because he's had a career-long relationship with them.
he would be a better fit on an indie label.

as much as i love Out of The Cradle, some of it has not stood up over time. the production is a tad late 80's and overwrought. i don't think we'll have that problem with Under The Skin 20 years from now. it's timeless. and i think song for song, it's his strongest collection of songs.
when i first heard Shut Us Down on the Elizabethtown soundtrack, i thought to myself, "wouldn't it be amazing if he did a whole album like that. i think he's done it, almost anyway - with the exception of Down On Rodeo and Cast Away Dreams.
Lindsey has been making this kind of music since Tusk. You just seem to go for his more commercial side, which i find tiresome.
Go Your Own Way - snooze.
Don't Stop - eyeroll.

put on your copy of Rumours or Go Insane and go back to the 70's or 80's or 90's or whatever you think this music should be about.
this rest of us will keep encouraging Lindsey to move forward and make new sounds.
i can't think of anyone else from Lindsey's generation that is still making such vital relevant important music these days. Bob Dylan. Bruce Springsteen. Emmylou Harris. Anyone else? Can't think of anyone right now.
Thankfully he didn't take the easy way out and did cheesey nostalgia.
I say - move forward and open your mind. Look what happened on election day. We finally stopped buying into the mainstream. Now we can move forward.

[natesummers]

Here's my take. As a songwriter/producer, Liddy has made enough money (I would think) to never have to put out a new album again, to tour again, or to do ANYTHING again. I won't count money made from Mac as a singer/guitarist.

I think Liddy puts out what he want's/when he want's to because he can. He puts out what he wants and knows he will sell to his loyal crowd of fans, no matter if it's a song like "Play In The Rain Continued" (one of my favorites) or "It Was You".

We, Liddy's fans, have accepted him as he is ... eccentric and a bit ... odd. But that's why (for me anyway) we love his music. I will step right up and take one for the team when I tell you I am NOT a huge FM fan. Nicks gets on my nerves, to be quite honest. I'm a Liddy fan. I like his oddball way of doing things and if he decided to put out a new cd with just Bosnian Folk Songs, guess who will be first in line to buy it? Me!

Let's let Liddy be the same character he always has been. Sure, I would LOVE to hear some rocking electric guitar and drums and overdubs and all that good **** we got on OOTC, GI, LAO and even GOS. But, I can wait for him to get it done. If I need rocking Liddy, I will toss in OOC. Weird Liddy and I drop in GI. Goofy Liddy, it's LAO. It's not like we dont have a lot to choose form.

I would love more, but until that time, I can't sit back and complain about him getting older. I for one am glad he has finally gotten his life to a point where he is happy. Maybe now all the new stuff, if there ever is anything, won't all be about Nicks ...

As far as the videos go, it just shows me Liddy wants it done his way. Look at that POS video for Countdown. Being from Cincinnati, I know you will get this joke, but it looks like he did it at that make a video place in Kings Island, lol.

As far as UTS goes, I truly love it. It's a different album and THAT'S why I like it, and it's replaced OOTC as my fav. Liddy cd.

[Sahara]

The happy contented Lindsey music for me can sit along quite happily beside the rocking stuff.
I enjoy this record because it's quite different to what we've had up till now -- and we have the rock record still to come, please God.

Lindsey's doing what he wants and seems very happy musically and personally. While that doesn't really impact all that much on my life I am happy to see it and I'm enjoying the music that's come out of it.

Must say though, I can't wait for this next one .... it's going to be good!

[gldstwmn]

Let the bashing begin....

I think you already started it.:o Hey, even Picasso had his blue period. :shrug:
I like what Lindsey is doing now. I don't really care if the record is a commercial success. I don't think he cares either. This record isn't Out Of The Cradle by any means but I don't think it's supposed to be. It reflects where he is as a person and artist right now. I mean isn't that what it's all about?

[DrummerDeanna]

^^

And had he released something that sounded like OOTC or Law and Order people would be bitching that he never does anything new...doesn't take chances, etc....not everyone can be pleased - but thankfully a vast majority of us are...I really love UTS, I think it's a fantastic album.

[Für Elise]

I have often considered him the modern age Beethoven/Bach of rock and roll. :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

I understand that he is nearing the age of 60 and all good things in life eventually come to an end, but deep down I believe he still has better material then we are seeing. It is sad that this is all we get after 14 years of patience and false releases. Some people say Yoko Ono brought down John Lennon's music quality and I am honestly wondering if wife and kids have brought down Lindsey's quality. It is great that Lindsey is married and finally happy in life (and nobody deserves this more than LB), but reality says his music has suffered from contentment and age/maturity.whatever happened to lennon is completely irrelevant to lindsey. do you want lindsey to be unhappy so you might get an album thats more your style.

et the bashing begin.......but any real LB fan deep down knows that this cd does not fit in the same catagory as Law in Order, Go Insane, and Out of the Cradle. I'm a real LB fan and can't listen to out of the cradle. this album is so much better. someone's gotta change your mind has become my favorite song of his ever. it's stunning and countdown and soul drifter hurt my ears they don't even compare for me.

why don't you just create your own lonely misery and produce a rocking album that suites your style and leave lindsey to make what he wants to. you don't have to buy it but but theres thousands of albums I'll never listen to cause I don't like the style. it doesn't make me pissed off at them because they made their own music though.

[ragandbone]

Let the bashing begin.......but any real LB fan deep down knows that this cd does not fit in the same catagory as Law in Order, Go Insane, and Out of the Cradle. I hope (but seriously doubt) that everyone who stayed up late at night to catch "Not to Late" felt the same thrills they felt when watching Lindsey perform "Countdown" and "Soul Drifter" on David Letterman 14 years ago. There has even been a dropoff in quality when comparing the fun "Out of the Cradle" videos to the current batch of boring videos for "Under the Skin".

Here's to hoping this cd was just an aberration.....
I might have agreed with you a bit, until you used "Countdown" and "Soul Drifter" as examples. Those are nice, fairly conventional soft rock/pop songs, but they certainly aren't edgy, or even thrilling, to me.

[Nico]

Some people say Yoko Ono brought down John Lennon's music quality and I am honestly wondering if wife and kids have brought down Lindsey's quality.

The only thing is, Yoko Ono did not bring down John's musical quality. In fact, she gave him a new perspective on the world and on reality to gain inspiration from and live on with. Some may not have liked it, but I believe he evolved as an artist (and a person) after meeting her. I think Under the Skin is a beautiful record. I just lent it to a friend who has no clue about Lindsey's solo stuff other than Holiday Road and she said, after repeated listenings, that it is one of the most wonderful albums she has ever heard. Different strokes for different folks.

I personally think it is beyond great that Lindsey seems to be in a really good place in his life. I think his new music reflects a lot of "contentedness" but also has a glint of sadness and other stuff that makes him still so endearing. And I love the new album. His concerts have been awesome, he's enjoying himself, and no one who has gone to one of his shows can honestly say they didn't have a fantastic time. I love where Lindsey is and I want him to continue to make music.

And yes I agree UTS isn't in the same category as his other albums...only because each of those albums is really in it's own little domain anyway. They're all pretty different from one another, but I think the last two stand out the most to me. And of course that is different for everyone else, I know. But I just can't agree with the jest of what you're saying, sorry. Lindsey rocks now and I'm more than proud, and feel extremely lucky, to be a fan of his right now. :nod:

[nix4life]

I think you already started it.:o Hey, even Picasso had his blue period. :shrug:
I like what Lindsey is doing now. I don't really care if the record is a commercial success. I don't think he cares either. This record isn't Out Of The Cradle by any means but I don't think it's supposed to be. It reflects where he is as a person and artist right now. I mean isn't that what it's all about?


:nod: :nod:
can i get an amen. . . .
is there an "amen" smile face somewhere around here ??


the original question -
what is happening to lindsey buckingham??
IMO he got EXACTLY what he always wanted and has been stomping his feet about for years - artistic freedom - no one said to him "where is the 'go your own way?'" -
and he got support for his music even when he is experimenting and trying something new that is far out of the mainstream-
and it will always alienate some faction of the fans -


and hasn't he told us himself what is "happening to lindsey buckingham" ??-
he made a chill record reflecting a new and intersting part of his life(family/love/aging) while out on tour with his past life - and he is workin on anothr more rocking album to be released next year - he has said "ill see you next year " at many of the shows so he is planning anothr tour -
big mac is supposedly gearing up for anothr cross country romp as well -

so - i think that is pretty much "horse's mouth" as far as a literal answer to your question-
looks like lindsey will:
finish this tour
finish the ROCK album
tour in support of that album
and then out with big mac

that sounds more ambitious and creative than he has been in years to me -
(14 years since out of cradle)
so i think you are judging before the new picture completely emerges -

uts took two listens for me - (first listen was in all honesty - "oh my god - he is only gonna sell 5 of these " but i knew it was a haunting piece that would slowly reveal itself - and it has - at least to me - ) he has stepped outside of the conventional "hook" oriented song and has created lush landscapes of sound that require more than a three second judgement -

it's cool to second guess him but id let him play out his next couple cards before you throw in yours

[nix4life]

And yes I agree UTS isn't in the same category as his other albums...only because each of those albums is really in it's own little domain anyway. They're all pretty different from one another, :nod:

he gave me exactly what i expected - something unexpected !!!
everyone of his albums has charted new territory and thats what keeps me coming back - tounge a waggin' :sorry:

^^

And had he released something that sounded like OOTC or Law and Order people would be bitching that he never does anything new...doesn't take chances, etc....not everyone can be pleased - but thankfully a vast majority of us are...I really love UTS, I think it's a fantastic album.

still looking for those "AMEN!!!" smiley faces . . . :blob1:

[strandinthewind]

I am not in love with the new CD's direction, but it is a work of art from a true artist. As for success, while LB certainly craves it, I think he has never been that commercially successful on his own :shrug: So, that point is relatively moot regarding the new CD, though its sales are lackluster to say the least.

[markolas]

You know, I really get honked off when people tell me what I should and shouldn't like. Go take a flying leap. :rolleyes:

[markolas]

I am not in love with the new CD's direction, but it is a work of art from a true artist. As for success, while LB certainly craves it, I think he has never been that commercially successful on his own :shrug: So, that point is relatively moot regarding the new CD, though its sales are lackluster to say the least.

I'm sure Jana Anderson will go to #1 with that piece of crap she's hawking, so if I were Lindsey, I wouldn't be too concerned about sales.

[BTFLCHLD]

Lindsey is maturing as an artist. I can appreciate that.

[goldustsongbird]

It is time for us to admit the new cd is a failure

Thank you so much for making everyone's mind up for them. Mine included! Saves me the trouble of thinking for myself. Whew. *wipes sweat off brow*

[dontlookdown]

2 kinds of people in this world

winners


losers.

[CarterNix]

I don't entirely agree with cincymike either - I'm very happy with Under the Skin. Having said that, I don't think his post warrants personal abuse. After all, he's just expressing his opinion.

-Tom
www.myspace.com/thomasmarron

[markolas]

After all, he's just expressing his opinion.

No, that's isn't all he's doing. He's telling other people what their preferences should be. "It's time for us all to admit..." and "no true LB fan can like this," etc.

That's what ticks me off. I have no problem with somebody not liking something. But don't sit up there and tell me I can't like it, and I'm "not a true fan" if I do.

[strandinthewind]

I think it is so funny that people are so quick to say or imply that success = crap. I mean who here would not be THRILLED is SYW or this new solo record sold ten million :shrug:

[markolas]

I think it is so funny that people are so quick to say or imply that success = crap. I mean who here would not be THRILLED is SYW or this new solo record sold ten million :shrug:

No, I'm not saying success = crap, I'm saying that most people have ****ty taste.

[nix4life]

No, I'm not saying success = crap, I'm saying that most people have ****ty taste.


ohhhhh - we have a smart ass in the group -

Pssst - can i sit next to you??:thumbsup:

[DrummerDeanna]

No, I'm not saying success = crap, I'm saying that most people have ****ty taste.

:laugh:

First off..."honked off" LOVE that...think I'll start using that one...and I'm going to quote you on the above as well because it's just a hilariously funny (and true) statement :lol:

[Little Nicki]

I mean who here would not be THRILLED is SYW or this new solo record sold ten million :shrug:
Would you want all the teeny boppers going around spouting how big a fan of Lindsey's they are and all the radio stations playing his songs twice an hour and commercials for Abercrombie and Fitch using his songs, etc. Personally, when huge success happens to my favorite artists, it makes me like them far less than I did back when they were my own little best kept secret. When I didn't have them shoved down my throat all day. So to answer your question, me.

[ontheEdgeof17]

We need to realize that the majority CD buying public ranges from preteens-teens-to early 20s. They like the dance, rap, bubblegum stuff. Lindsey/Stevie/FM are not that....nor are the other artists this board enjoys. So we wont see them at the top of the charts....unless you want them to have a duet with Snoop Dogg. :rolleyes:

Lindsey is making great music. He's very successful at the moment, in the mist of a assembly line music world.

[SortaSavageLike]

Would you want all the teeny boppers going around spouting how big a fan of Lindsey's they are and all the radio stations playing his songs twice an hour and commercials for Abercrombie and Fitch using his songs, etc.

But Lindsey's sooooo hip and dreamy! He's so dreamy Stevie even offered to buy his dreams from him! I also think he's hot. Does he sing and write his own songs too?

http://www.sevenwondersonline.net/Smileys/classic/boff.gif

[strandinthewind]

Would you want all the teeny boppers going around spouting how big a fan of Lindsey's they are and all the radio stations playing his songs twice an hour and commercials for Abercrombie and Fitch using his songs, etc. Personally, when huge success happens to my favorite artists, it makes me like them far less than I did back when they were my own little best kept secret. When I didn't have them shoved down my throat all day. So to answer your question, me.

You mean like when he sold out by allowing "Go Your Own Way" to be used for a car rental company commercial :shrug: So, of course, LB would love to have a commercially successful record and I do not blame him one bit.

Also, essentially since 1975, LB has been a huge mega selling artist by being in FM and his first two solo records were relatively successful in that I believe they were platinum or multi platinum.

In any event, while I am all for anyone's success, success does not necessarily equate to good work as there are lots of relatively unsuccessful but talented artists out there.

[BTFLCHLD]

In any event, while I am all for anyone's success, success does not necessarily equate to good work as there are lots of relatively unsuccessful but talented artists out there. really? :lol: That makes sense as there are a lot of successful artists out there with bad work.

[Für Elise]

really? :lol: That makes sense as there are a lot of successful artists out there with bad work.stevie nicks you mean? just teasing I'm just more of a lindsey/christine/peter green fan.

sorry to strandinthewind but what your saying doesn't make much sense to me. I don't think people think successful music is crap cause rumours was incredibly successful and most of us love it. you said he hasn't been successful on his own but just now said that his first 2 solo were relatively successful. sorry, don't mean to be rude at all I just not sure what your point is at all

[BTFLCHLD]

stevie nicks you mean? to be fair, she hasn't put out solo since TISL...it'd be hard to speculate...especially since Lindsey worked his magic on SYW. :eek: :lol:

[Gazza]

I don't know.... Looks and feels like the same guy to me.

Criticism of Lindsey is fine, and helpful, but comments like this...

It is time for us to admit the new cd is a failure

Really are just smug and useless.

[dontlookdown]

I love how all these young people (or uninformed/uneducated old people) equate artistic success with sales.

$$$ does not equal success.


it says a lot about this post-Bush era we have just entered.



__________________________________________________________________
The only winner in the Iraq war has been Haliburton. And that's what Bush was referring to with his "Mission Accomplished" banner.

[strandinthewind]

stevie nicks you mean? just teasing I'm just more of a lindsey/christine/peter green fan.

sorry to strandinthewind but what your saying doesn't make much sense to me. I don't think people think successful music is crap cause rumours was incredibly successful and most of us love it. you said he hasn't been successful on his own but just now said that his first 2 solo were relatively successful. sorry, don't mean to be rude at all I just not sure what your point is at all

I was responding to the implication that successful = crap.

LB has enjoyed mega success with FM and I think the product of that mega success has been great. His solo career has not been nearly as successful. I think his first two sold like a million, which is successful, but it has been 20 years since then and he has had no such solo commercial success, though the product has been artistic, etc.

[estranged4life]

Sales never equates to success, I have plenty of albums that never sold in the 100,000 range that sound far superior to 'artists' who have sold millions of albums (I consider 'success' as being able to leave an imprint in my mind with a release that will make me listen to the said release on a regular basis-Fame & fortune to me NEVER equates success!)

As for Mr.Buckingham, he should be able to please himself at this point in his musical career, instead of pleasing (Or is it 'catering') either the record label or fans.

[Little Nicki]

I consider 'success' as being able to leave an imprint in my mind with a release that will make me listen to the said release on a regular basis

So you are the judge of an artist's success? Rather egotistical of you.:laugh:

[xxxmx]

this is the first time i've been to the ledge in over a month and my head already hurts...

i think the new album is anything but a failure. a local DJ bitched for a week about not having a tour date in florida. the crowd at the one show i went to (nashville) went crazy for the new songs. the book stores around here have been promoting it; playing it in the store, placing it on the front racks and such. i've personally watched two non-fans purchase the album after inquiring about what disc was on the stereo. that's "success" to me. reaching out to people and making a connection. the resulting sale is (or should be) icing on the cake.

not everyone is going to feel that connection. don't tell me i shouldn't.

[estranged4life]

So you are the judge of an artist's success? Rather egotistical of you.:laugh:

each person needs to decide what is success to themselves, so yeah it is egotistical.

[gldstwmn]

:nod: :nod:
can i get an amen. . . .
is there an "amen" smile face somewhere around here ??


I've been asking for more emoticons for a while now. Maybe Santa will bring them for Christmas. :laugh:

and hasn't he told us himself what is "happening to lindsey buckingham" ??-
Amen back at you. I think Not Too Late is probably the bluntest piece he's ever done. It pretty much says it all in terms of where he's at right now.

[gldstwmn]

We need to realize that the majority CD buying public ranges from preteens-teens-to early 20s. They like the dance, rap, bubblegum stuff. Lindsey/Stevie/FM are not that.

Damn straight. They are REAL musicians who can write, sing and play, no Pro Tools necessary. But in the preteen-20 demographic, that doesn't matter. Some things are an acquired taste. And to a percentage of our youth, I guess real music by musicians who can write, sing and play is something they may acquire a taste for down the line.

[gldstwmn]

But Lindsey's sooooo hip and dreamy! He's so dreamy Stevie even offered to buy his dreams from him!

That was in 1976, dear. :p

[nix4life]

I think Not Too Late is probably the bluntest piece he's ever done. It pretty much says it all in terms of where he's at right now.

exactly :

"i finally have the freedom i have always wanted - but is it to late? - will it matter?"

it matters to me and it is not to late for me at all lindsey - keep up the good work!!:nod:

[gldstwmn]

You mean like when he sold out by allowing "Go Your Own Way" to be used for a car rental company commercial.

I think you're forgetting that ultimately Mick Fleetwood owns the rights to that song as well.

[gldstwmn]

it says a lot about this post-Bush era we have just entered.

Too soon to tell. I think it's a product of the Reagan era money gorge and the subliminal slant toward fascism that people are bombarded with on a daily basis since the coup d'etat installed the "CEO president" in January 2001.

[shackin'up]

It is time for us to admit the new cd is a failure and if Lindsey wants to remain able to put out cds on a popular label such as Warner Reprise, he had better snap out of his middle age/old married I am happy type of boring songs (not too late, shut us down, juniper way, I am waiting, etc.) and start putting out the original exciting stuff we experienced on the so-called gift of screws cd.
Here's to hoping this cd was just an aberration.....


Right On!

This CD has just lackluster and mediocre tracks. The guitarplaying is soso, and the singing could have been done by anybody. Nothing special at all here. This is a failure of an album. All tracks could have been done by anybody. I don't hear anything of an own style or character. This is a 13 in a dozen type of record that doesn't appeal to anybody. If you're liking this album you're not honest to yourself. I wanna hear a LB-solo-album that sounds exact as the albums he did before that I love. We all know that he always does the same **** every album and this style-break doesn't fit at all. No, it's painful, but this man is just a cheap sell-out nowadays. You can hear it on tour too: no risks, all FM-songs sound the same as always, the energylevel is that of a 60-year old fart. Bye Bye Buckingham.

[markolas]

Right On!

This CD has just lackluster and mediocre tracks. The guitarplaying is soso, and the singing could have been done by anybody. Nothing special at all here. This is a failure of an album. All tracks could have been done by anybody. I don't hear anything of an own style or character. This is a 13 in a dozen type of record that doesn't appeal to anybody. If you're liking this album you're not honest to yourself. I wanna hear a LB-solo-album that sounds exact as the albums he did before that I love. We all know that he always does the same **** every album and this style-break doesn't fit at all. No, it's painful, but this man is just a cheap sell-out nowadays. You can hear it on tour too: no risks, all FM-songs sound the same as always, the energylevel is that of a 60-year old fart. Bye Bye Buckingham.

You're kidding, right? I just want to make sure before I go ballistic on you for not only telling me what I should or shouldn't like, but also that I also can't make decisions for myself.

[Johnny Stew]

You're kidding, right?Gerald's being sarcastic, Mark. :nod:

Myself, I'm not crazy about this album. I've never been a big fan of the live versions of "Big Love" and "Go Insane," and this is basically an entire album full of songs in that style. There are definite standouts, don't get me wrong... but, overall, it's not my thing.

Still, I can't fault Lindsey for pursuing the style that interests him right now. He recorded and released this album on his terms, and that's to be commended.

I'm bummed that I don't like it more, but hopefully he'll win me back with next year's "electric" album.

[markolas]

Gerald's being sarcastic, Mark. :nod:

I thought he might be, but I couldn't tell. :)

Myself, I'm not crazy about this album. I've never been a big fan of the live versions of "Big Love" and "Go Insane," and this is basically an entire album full of songs in that style. There are definite standouts, don't get me wrong... but, overall, it's not my thing.

I think this is a brilliant album, maybe even my favorite of his. And I have no problem with people not liking it...we all have different tastes. I mean, I can't stand 90% of the groups the people on this board love to go on and on about (Led Zeppelin, The Beatles, etc.). Where I get pissed is when people tell me what I should and shouldn't like.

I'm perfectly capable of thinking for myself and making up my own mind, and I don't appreciate other people second-guessing my preferences.

[DavidMn]

No, that's isn't all he's doing. He's telling other people what their preferences should be. "It's time for us all to admit..." and "no true LB fan can like this," etc.

That's what ticks me off. I have no problem with somebody not liking something. But don't sit up there and tell me I can't like it, and I'm "not a true fan" if I do.You hit that right on the head.

[strandinthewind]

. . . I'm perfectly capable of thinking for myself and making up my own mind, and I don't appreciate other people second-guessing my preferences.

Oh piss off :mad: :mad: :mad:

:wavey: :wavey: :wavey:

[markolas]

Oh piss off :mad: :mad: :mad:

:wavey: :wavey: :wavey:

Welcome to my ignore list. :rolleyes:

[nix4life]

Let the bashing begin.......but any real LB fan deep down knows that . . .


when does the club get together and decide exactly what we all like??
ill bring the absolute or stohlis? any preferences??
is jaz bringing his red box>??
i think i missed last weeks meeting so im not real sure of the ettiquette - (or most of my spelling)-

oh - and having a different opinion isn't bashing - it's just not agreeing -
(maybe there was a slight witty bonk here or there but bash??)

[strandinthewind]

Welcome to my ignore list. :rolleyes:

I was joking you twit :p :p :p

[cincymike1]

With the exception of MarcoLas and his juvenile comments (along with a very stupid signature), everyone on this board seems to have mature rationale on why they like or dislike LB's latest work. Many valid points have been made and quite honestly my view has been changed a bit towards the new cd. LB certainly has earned the opportunity to put out whatever he personally enjoys and when it comes down to it I guess that is all that really matters.

Unfortunately, the price that we pay as fans is that we are likely to never hear the much anticipated electric "rocking" cd that LB claims is coming out next year. The lack of sales for UTS probably will likely turn that project into the next "Gift of Screws". If we are lucky a few songs may make it on the next Mac cd. Record studios are all about sales and my educated guess is that Reprise is NOT pressuring LB to hurry up and finish his second cd in 12 months so they can hurriedly release it to the public. That was the whole point of my message....after 14 years of false release dates and hopes for a kick##@ cd, UTS was IMO a bit of a letdown. It's a decent cd and will likely stand the test of time, however due to it's general lack of sales appeal you can likely forget about another solo release next year.

[MacMan]

With the exception of MarcoLas and his juvenile comments (along with a very stupid signature), everyone on this board seems to have mature rationale on why they like or dislike LB's latest work. Many valid points have been made and quite honestly my view has been changed a bit towards the new cd. LB certainly has earned the opportunity to put out whatever he personally enjoys and when it comes down to it I guess that is all that really matters.

Unfortunately, the price that we pay as fans is that we are likely to never hear the much anticipated electric "rocking" cd that LB claims is coming out next year. The lack of sales for UTS probably will likely turn that project into the next "Gift of Screws". If we are lucky a few songs may make it on the next Mac cd. Record studios are all about sales and my educated guess is that Reprise is NOT pressuring LB to hurry up and finish his second cd in 12 months so they can hurriedly release it to the public. That was the whole point of my message....after 14 years of false release dates and hopes for a kick##@ cd, UTS was IMO a bit of a letdown. It's a decent cd and will likely stand the test of time, however due to it's general lack of sales appeal you can likely forget about another solo release next year.


Personally, I think if the record company was so concerned with shifting a ton of UTS cd's, they would have started the promotion for this cd months before it's actual release, upping his visibility and putting him back into the the minds of the buying public. AND... If they were all that concerned... they would have forced him to mix the cd with the rocking tracks that he said are finished and not given him the option. For all we know, he has paid for the everything out of his own pocket to produce this and to get it released... leaving the record company only responsible for distributing it... The more the record company puts out in promotion, the more the cd needs to sell to repay the label for those costs... Obviously they didn't expect much from sales, otherwise you would have seen a bigger push behind it.

I love the cd... I think it's a departure from his norm, but it's a welcome departure for me... It gets better with each listen.

[Little Nicki]

With the exception of MarcoLas and his juvenile comments (along with a very stupid signature)
I see you're far more mature than him.

It's a decent cd and will likely stand the test of time, however due to it's general lack of sales appeal you can likely forget about another solo release next year.
You're delusional enough to think people expected him to sell anything?

[markolas]

I was joking you twit :p :p :p

Sorry, I was a little on edge.

[dontlookdown]

Here's what happened to Lindsey:
(about 27 years ago)

He became the most creative, adventurous, interesting member of Fleetwood Mac. And he still is today.

[strandinthewind]

Sorry, I was a little on edge.

:xoxo: :xoxo: :xoxo: :xoxo: :xoxo: :xoxo:

This has been an interesting thread.

Personally, I think this new CD is what LB wanted to do and while, like anyone regarding their work, he would have liked it to be a huge success, the reality is it was not. I think that speaks to LB not really being that commercially viable on his own. That relative non-viability in no way, however, speaks to his musical talent, which is immense.

[dontlookdown]

i have to disagree.
i think i read about 25 reviews of this record - in all the major newspapers across the country along with respected music magazines. All but one, gave it a stellar review.

i think Under The Skin has been a huge success and it's only been out for less than two months.

if you glance at the Billboard Top 40 you will see very little rock on there.
and what is on there, barely passes for music with integrity or artistic merit.
and this has been the case for quite some time. i can't believe there are still Lindsey fans out there that equate sales with success.
Bob Dylan's record peaked at No. 1. But this is the rare exception.


Here's a review copy and pasted from Amazon that says it all pretty perfectly:

If Lindsey Buckingham went out of his way to try every production trick in the book for his previous three records (and the last three Fleetwood Mac studio albums), Under The Skin offers a refreshing breather with nothing more then an old delay pedal to dirty up the vocals. The result is an often astonishingly raw cycle of songs that dig a little deeper than normal into the tug of war between making art and keeping family relationships intact.
With the vocals pushed slightly back into the mix and acoustic guitar brought up front with little or almost no percussion, at times John Lennon's Plastic Ono era comes to mind; but melodies not far removed from Joni Mitchell's "Blue" pop up here and there. Buckingham has always been a unique singular talent, but he's also never been afraid to pay homage to such obvious influences as Brian Wilson and Elvis Presley. Those same influences are still with him, but they're presented in such a way that Thom Yorke of Radiohead could easily find a kindered spirit in the overall sound. Under The Skin isn't music that will conjure up your mother's Fleetwood Mac. But it is one of the most challenging and engaging and cohesive records we've heard in quite some time. If continuing to inspire some thirty odd years after producing your first work defines a true artist, then Lindsey Buckingham need not worry about his legacy. Fans of Tusk take notice, this is not something you want to miss out on.

[DavidMn]

Opinions are like assholes. Everybody's got one.:lol:

[Johnny Stew]

Opinions are like assholes. Everybody's got one.... and most of them stink. :nod:

[DavidMn]

... and most of them stink. :nod:I'm not going there......;) :lol:

[estranged4life]

... and most of them stink. :nod:

who 'sarcastically' ends that ol' opinion are like a-holes cliche with those exacts words...Wanna guess his name??? :lol:

[Johnny Stew]

I know someone who 'sarcastically' ends that ol' opinion are like a-holes cliche with those exacts words...Wanna guess his name??? :lol:I'll bet that his name is my name, too. ;)

Crap, now I'm singing that "John Jacob Jingleheimer-Schmitt" song! :laugh:

[Little Nicki]

i can't believe there are still Lindsey fans out there that equate sales with success.


You're equating success with good music. By your logic that unpopular music can be successful, you can also say that popular music isn't successful. And if you can't say that Britney Spears was a successful pop star, you have quite the oddball view of the word "success."

I don't see general success as this abstract idea, and the only real concrete way to measure success is sales. I think the success you all are talking about is a more specific form of success. Artistic, musical success. As in, did he stay true to himself and make an album he wanted to make. So you aren't necessarily wrong in saying that sales do not equal success, but if you are talking about the most basic kind of success, sales is pretty much the definition.

[Peestie]

but if you are talking about the most basic kind of success, sales is pretty much the definition.

Gotta disagree. When we say UTS was a success, you are right, we mean an artistic one. But where you say the most basic kind of success you mean what I consider a "more specific form of success" - commercial success. Commercial success being measure in sales etc. There is no strict definition of success, it all depends on what you view it to be.

[jbrownsjr]

if i can put my 2 cents here...

1. i don't think anything lindsey has done is crap... i wish i had an ounce of his success as a musician...

2. the new album is finally starting to grow on me... it doesn't measure it up to his other three yet... but for me his solo work has always been a process of getting used to... (and i'm insane.... haha)

3. i don't like his personality as of late.. but then again... every member of fmac has put their respective foots in their mouths as far as the media goes... stevie and christine included.... and mick... well umm....

4. i wish this album would have sold more... i'm sort of sick of the people with half his talent getting millions of dollars with half the effort... (those dance tracks on the radio are getting old).

5. i have some problems with his vocals, but none with his guitars... even if he speeds the tracks up...

6. what's growing on me?... (show ya show ya show ya..) i'm starting to love it... you almost think of eyes eyes eyes eyes... (for those of you that love that song)...

anyway at least he is out there and i can't wait to hear the rockin album.. .i think that will be more of what i want to hear...

having said all that... whether i like it or not doesn't mean it's crap... that goes for Rock a Little and In the Mean time... etc...

[jbrownsjr]

I'll bet that his name is my name, too. ;)

Crap, now I'm singing that "John Jacob Jingleheimer-Schmitt" song! :laugh:

you would sing that! ;)

[dontlookdown]

Britney Spears is a succesful pop star?


Not in my book.
I don't see any sign of musicianship or quality singing or songwriting so how can I call her successful?
Is she successful at being famous? Sure. But I don't know of any true artists who's success is measured by fame.

Some people are confused. But that was the goal of Karl Rove. He saw a country full of mostly uneducated people and he knew they could easily drink the kool aid. The same thing applies to spoon-fed "music".

[strandinthewind]

^^^^

With all due respect, the term "success" is defined as:

Main Entry: suc·cess

Pronunciation: s&k-'ses

Function: noun
Etymology: Latin successus, from succedere

1 obsolete : OUTCOME, RESULT

2 a : degree or measure of succeeding b : favorable or desired outcome; also : the attainment of wealth, favor, or eminence

3 : one that succeeds
_______________________________________________

So, the eminence and wealth aspects are accurate measures of success.

In the end, LB is successful in his artistic output in that UTS ostensibly was to his favor and was the desired outcome.

He, however, did not succeed in any significant or relative way in this solo commercial venture, which is what this is. If it were not a commercial venture, he would have done it for free :shrug:

Of course, I think it is possible to be an artist (subjective term) and desire commercial success. LB certainly agrees with me there, though he may publicly protest too much about it :laugh:

[BTFLCHLD]

He has become a musical genius. :D

[Johnny Stew]

In my opinion, a truly "successful" artist is one who can walk that thin line between art and commerce... creating something personal and emotionally compelling while still appealling to a broad range of people.

[shackin'up]

^^^^

With all due respect, the term "success" is defined as:

Main Entry: suc·cess

Pronunciation: s&k-'ses

Function: noun
Etymology: Latin successus, from succedere

1 obsolete : OUTCOME, RESULT

2 a : degree or measure of succeeding b : favorable or desired outcome; also : the attainment of wealth, favor, or eminence

3 : one that succeeds
_______________________________________________

So, the eminence and wealth aspects are accurate measures of success.

In the end, LB is successful in his artistic output in that UTS ostensibly was to his favor and was the desired outcome.

He, however, did not succeed in any significant or relative way in this solo commercial venture, which is what this is. If it were not a commercial venture, he would have done it for free :shrug:

Of course, I think it is possible to be an artist (subjective term) and desire commercial success. LB certainly agrees with me there, though he may publicly protest too much about it :laugh:

well teacher, I really only put worth to the following words:

it's all about growing on your own terms. Eventually that brings success in the long term, as defined by yourself as opposed to success in the short term as defined by others. , like strandie.

[strandinthewind]

well teacher, I really only put worth to the following words:

it's all about growing on your own terms. Eventually that brings success in the long term, as defined by yourself as opposed to success in the short term as defined by others. , like strandie.

Hooker :p :p :p :p :p

[shackin'up]

Hooker :p :p :p :p :p

Well, YOU can't pay enough for me, you capitalist american dreamslave. :eek: :angel: :thumbsup:


BTW: I really think that quote I used fits in the way he stands in the business now. The prove is in what he's doing now. Do you see a tortured artist that hates the fact that there are onle 800 people in these venues? No he LOVES the scale of it: it loosens him up. Musically, too.

[strandinthewind]

Well, YOU can't pay enough for me, you capitalist american dreamslave. :eek: :angel: :thumbsup:


BTW: I really think that quote I used fits in the way he stands in the business now. The prove is in what he's doing now. Do you see a tortured artist that hates the fact that there are onle 800 people in these venues? No he LOVES the scale of it: it loosens him up. Musically, too.

I think he likes the small venues. But, he also loved the huge arenas on SYW. So, I guess he has both. But, I would still bet he would love for this record to have been a commercial success with sales over a million. As of now, it has sold less than 100,000 I think - though I could be wrong - which is commercial flop. I think with someone with his ego and history of huge commercial success, that has got to hurt on some level. I mean wouldn't we all feel that way even if just a little?

Note - this is not saying he is not happy doing what he doing. I just think he would have on some level rathered the additional commercial success.

[dontlookdown]

i don't make a million dollars a year, but I LOVE what I do for a living so therefore, I consider myself to be hugely successful.


I can't believe Britney Spears is mentioned on the Ledge.


Ewwwwwwgh.

[BTFLCHLD]

As of now, it has sold less than 100,000 I think - though I could be wrong - which is commercial flop. GAWD...STFU! I mean SMAP...isn't SMAP great? :lol: :p

Seriously, where do you get the numbers? :wavey:

[MacMan]

I think he likes the small venues. But, he also loved the huge arenas on SYW. So, I guess he has both. But, I would still bet he would love for this record to have been a commercial success with sales over a million. As of now, it has sold less than 100,000 I think - though I could be wrong - which is commercial flop. I think with someone with his ego and history of huge commercial success, that has got to hurt on some level. I mean wouldn't we all feel that way even if just a little?

Note - this is not saying he is not happy doing what he doing. I just think he would have on some level rathered the additional commercial success.

Commercial Success is all relative. It all depends on what it cost to make, which is something we could go on debating forever, but we'll never know. Not all records need to be certified gold or platinum to be considered a success or profitable. Only 5% (approx) of all releases reach the gold and platinum level - which is pretty low.

[chiliD]

As of now, it has sold less than 100,000 I think - though I could be wrong - which is commercial flop..

Sure, it has only sold in the ballpark of 100,000, but then how many people have either copied it or illegally downloaded it? :shrug:

He'd probably be knocking on "gold record" status if the numbers were calculated on "Number of people who own a copy of the album" and not CD sales alone.

[danax6]

Sure, it has only sold in the ballpark of 100,000, but then how many people have either copied it or illegally downloaded it? :shrug:

He'd probably be knocking on "gold record" status if the numbers were calculated on "Number of people who own a copy of the album" and not CD sales alone.Exactemundo.

If the past 30 years have learned Lindsey anything it's that you should never calculate your success in terms of record sales. And that's especially the case in this time and day, with the Pirates of the Internet. I think Lindsey went into this project with a very realistic view. Would he have liked to have sold a million copies? Sure! Did he expect to? Not in a million years. So I don't think he thinks it's been a flop. If anything, he has received raving reviews, both for his album and his tour, the latter being a fairly successful one. With Tom Whalley telling Lindsey to let Fleetwood Mac knock for a while longer I doubt this is costing Warner Brothers -to use Lindsey's words- a f*ck of a lot of money, so MacMan is right when he says that commercial success is relative. Besides, I think at this point Lindsey aims more towards personal success, and in that regard he can be pretty proud.

[strandinthewind]

Commercial Success is all relative. It all depends on what it cost to make, which is something we could go on debating forever, but we'll never know. Not all records need to be certified gold or platinum to be considered a success or profitable. Only 5% (approx) of all releases reach the gold and platinum level - which is pretty low.

I know - - but I am comparing his commercial solo success to his commercial FM success. When Tusk tanked compared to Rumors and IMO FMFM - LB was said to have taken it personally because his vision, which Tusk is, did not provide the commercial success that it had in the past when he was more mainstream. So, that is all I am saying.

Is he happier now without it - who can say for sure, but I tend to doubt it.

[strandinthewind]

Sure, it has only sold in the ballpark of 100,000, but then how many people have either copied it or illegally downloaded it? :shrug:

He'd probably be knocking on "gold record" status if the numbers were calculated on "Number of people who own a copy of the album" and not CD sales alone.

Probably, but other records go gold and platinum and cerainly people download them :shrug:

But, I guess the question is "did 400,000 or so download the album illegally?" IMO I doubt it because if that were so and he knew about it, he'd be playing larger venues. But that is supposition I know.

[ontheEdgeof17]

GAWD...STFU! I mean SMAP...isn't SMAP great? :lol: :p

Seriously, where do you get the numbers? :wavey:

...out of his ass....like all his other posts. :D

[strandinthewind]

...out of his ass....like all his other posts. :D

I just took the number that have been in your's - kiss it hookah :p :xoxo:

[jbrownsjr]

In my opinion, a truly "successful" artist is one who can walk that thin line between art and commerce... creating something personal and emotionally compelling while still appealling to a broad range of people.

you just wanted to say "walk a thin line" :wavey:

[jbrownsjr]

you just wanted to say "walk a thin line" :wavey:

before you know it, you're gonna start workin in "alice" in your sentences.... :woohoo: :lol: :lol:

[strandinthewind]

before you know it, you're gonna start workin in "alice" in your sentences.... :woohoo: :lol: :lol:

Oh Lord Child - let's hope not :laugh:

[jbrownsjr]

Oh Lord Child - let's hope not :laugh:

she used to know who she was....:p

(wow i am a thread killer eh?)

[strandinthewind]

she used to know who she was....:p

(wow i am a thread killer eh?)

It's your warm ways :wavey:

[jbrownsjr]

It's your warm ways :wavey:

It's Not That Funny:shocked:

[BTFLCHLD]

I know - - but I am comparing his commercial solo success to his commercial FM success. why? :rolleyes:

You have made reference to LB/SN...FM sales in various posts. I have asked that you produce your source for review but yet you haven't. Why? :confused:

[strandinthewind]

why? :rolleyes:

You have made reference to LB/SN...FM sales in various posts. I have asked that you produce your source for review but yet you haven't. Why? :confused:

Lord Child - are you stoned or just dense :p :p

I am saying that while LB covets artistic merit and needs accolades for it, he also loves the commercial success side of it. However, he wants the success on his own terms a la UTS and sadly, the commercial success has not come from that -- it has come from being in FM. I think that is sad really, because LB is a true artist who deserves commercial success for his maverick style.

As for my source -- I think no source needs to be cited to prove the commonly known fact that LB's solo career has not been commerically successful, esp. when compared to La Nicks' and FM - which is 10 + times larger than both of their solo careers combined and based on Rumors alone.

[BTFLCHLD]

Lord Child - are you stoned or just dense both :]
As for my source -- I think no source needs to be cited I disagree.

[strandinthewind]

both :]

thank goodness someonw is LOL

I disagree.

here's a clue - www.google.com :xoxo:

[BTFLCHLD]

www.google.com As I suspected...you have no source for numbers. Generally when people spew numbers that they deem factual I like to look at charts...spreadsheets...the whole sh'bang. I'd love a side-by-side of all FM...group and solo. I thought surely you were the numbersguy...but you can't produce. :shrug:

I'd say I am disappointed with your lack of source but wow...imtoostoned to give a rats. I know I purchased Lindsey's CD and couldn't be happier. I hope, with what he has earned from me, he can put that towards something he will enjoy. :angel:

[jbrownsjr]

As I suspected...you have no source for numbers. Generally when people spew numbers that they deem factual I like to look at charts...spreadsheets...the whole sh'bang. I'd love a side-by-side of all FM...group and solo. I thought surely you were the numbersguy...but you can't produce. :shrug:

I'd say I am disappointed with your lack of source but wow...imtoostoned to give a rats. I know I purchased Lindsey's CD and couldn't be happier. I hope, with what he has earned from me, he can put that towards something he will enjoy. :angel:


he's probably gettin stoned

[BTFLCHLD]

he's probably gettin stoned that would please me :cool:

[Johnny Stew]

He'd probably be knocking on "gold record" status if the numbers were calculated on "Number of people who own a copy of the album" and not CD sales alone.Oh, I don't know about that.
'Out Of The Cradle' was every bit as critically acclaimed as 'Under The Skin' has been, and Lindsey promoted the **** out of it with appearances on Letterman, Leno, Regis & Kathie Lee, ABC In Concert, PBS and VH1. He also filmed videos for the four singles and toured (both solo and as the opener for Tina Turner). Yet the album still didn't go gold... and I believe its total sales are somewhere around 60,000.

So even accounting for illegal downloads, I don't think 'UTS' would be close to gold status if 'OotC' isn't.

[Little Nicki]

And Out of the Cradle is a bit more commercially accessible than Under the Skin.

[wondergirl9847]

I sat next to a girl from Alabama on the bus from Vancouver to Seattle (SUPER nice gal) and when I told her I followed Lindsey around on this tour, she went "If I had known he was touring, I would gone to see him!" She didn't even know he had a new album out. She is an FM/Lindsey fan and she followed her favorite indie band from Manchester around Europe a few years ago, so she didn't think I was wierd for going to all my LB shows. :)

[wondergirl9847]

I think this is a brilliant album, maybe even my favorite of his. And I have no problem with people not liking it...we all have different tastes. I mean, I can't stand 90% of the groups the people on this board love to go on and on about (Led Zeppelin, The Beatles, etc.). Where I get pissed is when people tell me what I should and shouldn't like.

You and I need to get together and talk. LOL I'm the same way...don't tell me what's good or what I should or shouldn't like. I have a brain...and I, ya know...kinda like to use it.

I wouldn't give two craps if Lindsey sold 50 albums outta the back of an old beat up pick-up truck....he's THE MAN.

[MacMan]

Lord Child - are you stoned or just dense :p :p

I am saying that while LB covets artistic merit and needs accolades for it, he also loves the commercial success side of it. However, he wants the success on his own terms a la UTS and sadly, the commercial success has not come from that -- it has come from being in FM. I think that is sad really, because LB is a true artist who deserves commercial success for his maverick style.

As for my source -- I think no source needs to be cited to prove the commonly known fact that LB's solo career has not been commerically successful, esp. when compared to La Nicks' and FM - which is 10 + times larger than both of their solo careers combined and based on Rumors alone.

Most artists are failures if you compare them to Rumours... Hell even Stevie would be considered a failure if you compare her sales against Fleetwood Mac's. Even just against Rumours, one album. She's put out 6 studio albums plus and all combined they don't even touch Rumours in the US alone. Is that a failure? No... because they aren't on the same level. Is she successful? Yep. If Lindsey had the same sort of profile as a solo artist that she has - and he pulled in these sales numbers with each album time after time, then you could comparitively say he wasn't successful.

Again.. Successful is all relative to the situation. It's like an indie movie made with a budget of 2 million bucks and it goes on to gross 15 million. HUGE success! But compared to a movie more mainstream with big time movie stars like say Tom Cruise or Denzel... 15 million? THAT would be a commercial bomb. It's all relative.

[strandinthewind]

Most artists are failures if you compare them to Rumours... Hell even Stevie would be considered a failure if you compare her sales against Fleetwood Mac's. Even just against Rumours, one album. She's put out 6 studio albums plus and all combined they don't even touch Rumours in the US alone. Is that a failure? No... because they aren't on the same level. Is she successful? Yep. If Lindsey had the same sort of profile as a solo artist that she has - and he pulled in these sales numbers with each album time after time, then you could comparitively say he wasn't successful.

Again.. Successful is all relative to the situation. It's like an indie movie made with a budget of 2 million bucks and it goes on to gross 15 million. HUGE success! But compared to a movie more mainstream with big time movie stars like say Tom Cruise or Denzel... 15 million? THAT would be a commercial bomb. It's all relative.

I was using Rumors as a glaring example.

In the end, I think people get what I mean, which is while LB is a great artist, he not a commercially successful one or at least has not been one in like 20 years and even then, his commercial success was moderate at best.

I also think he cares hreatly about commercial success in that he would have loved for this record, SYW, and the upcoming one to have been multi platinum. If he did not, then why would he keep going back to FM, which is way more populat than he is solo.

I am usure if he has ever sold 2 million records combined solo sales - someone feel free to correct me on that as it is a guess not a factual statement.

[BTFLCHLD]

I also think he cares hreatly about commercial success in that he would have loved for this record, SYW, and the upcoming one to have been multi platinum. omg you reach for crystal balls now?

why would he keep going back to FM Maybe he actually likes FM! :shocked:

[jbrownsjr]

Maybe he actually likes FM! :shocked:


ok that's just crazy talk

[strandinthewind]

ok that's just crazy talk

I know - I mean he has been bitchin about them since Tusk - Bless His Heart :laugh:

[gypsysoul]

I think by any definition of 'success' LB is an enormously successful artist:

With FM all his albums have sold in the millions, with one being in the top ten biggest selling records of all time.

Six of these albums made number one in numerous countries.

He is a Grammy award winner, An American music award winner, and has won awards as a guitarist. He has had numerous nominations in different categories in major award ceremonies.

He is an inductee of the Hall of Fame

He holds a Brit outstanding achievement award.

He was specially invited by the President to both open and close a Presidency.

He has played sellout concerts in the biggest stadiums in the world.

He has the respect of many of his musical peers and is cited as an influence by younger musicians.

He has had critical acclaim throughout his career.

He has made it on to the cover of the most prestigious music magazines in the world.

He has had the opportunity to work with some of his musical idols.

He has been able to pursue the solo career he has wanted.

He has the adoration of fans who have stood by him over a 30 + year period.


I bet he didn't expect half of these things when he first picked up a guitar and decided a music career was for him.

[BTFLCHLD]

. i love you :xoxo:

[jbrownsjr]

I know - I mean he has been bitchin about them since Tusk - Bless His Heart :laugh:

he bitched about FM right after he joined.. he hated doing welch and green tunes...

[jbrownsjr]

I think by any definition of 'success' LB is an enormously successful artist:

With FM all his albums have sold in the millions, with one being in the top ten biggest selling records of all time.

Six of these albums made number one in numerous countries.

He is a Grammy award winner, An American music award winner, and has won awards as a guitarist. He has had numerous nominations in different categories in major award ceremonies.

He is an inductee of the Hall of Fame

He holds a Brit outstanding achievement award.

He was specially invited by the President to both open and close a Presidency.

He has played sellout concerts in the biggest stadiums in the world.

He has the respect of many of his musical peers and is cited as an influence by younger musicians.

He has had critical acclaim throughout his career.

He has made it on to the cover of the most prestigious music magazines in the world.

He has had the opportunity to work with some of his musical idols.

He has been able to pursue the solo career he has wanted.

He has the adoration of fans who have stood by him over a 30 + year period.


I bet he didn't expect half of these things when he first picked up a guitar and decided a music career was for him.


well when u put it like that.... lol

[gypsysoul]

i love you :xoxo:

Of-course Lindsey's greatest accomplishment is having the undying love of BTFLCHLD:)



Also re his solo career: it's hasn't been as commercially successful as his FM career but then even Mick Jagger couldn't make it solo and he has a much higher public profile than LB. I can't see Jagger bothering to make an album he didn't think would sell well and playing small venues to promote it. So I agree with those who have said artistic integrity is part of success too.

(Incidentally -'Trouble' was number one in Australia for about 8 weeks)

[BTFLCHLD]

BTFLCHLD :) If it is your desire to send me to the moon... <img src="http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a152/BTFLCHLD/8.gif">
the bigpie in the sky...you have been successful!
<img src="http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a152/BTFLCHLD/plicks.gif">

[billwebster]

Well, to some ears, the UTS album might sound a little lean, for several reasons, like for example that it's mainly an acoustic record. I like this approach, though, and still, I'm looking forward to the 'electric guitar' record that he announced as forthcoming, because still so many great songs from the GOS sessions deserve to be heard in good quality.
It was Lindsey's choice that he wanted his new songs out first, and I respect that. Thanks to him, 3 of my favourites from the GOS sessions have made the cut to UTS.
I feel the album UTS has something of a diary character to it, like in a song like Never Too Late, where he adresses music critics, or the development of his family in It Was You. With these very personal matters in his lyrics, they can be kind of hard to relate to for a mere bystander like me. But the celebrity culture, which has developed over the last half of the century, to which the Rumors album has added its 50 cents, tries to help bridge that gap, so his core audience should be happy.
And I'm happy with this disc, too, because of Lindsey's incredible vocal arrangements.
Faves are: Show You How, It Was You, To Try For the Sun, Castaway Dreams, Down On Rodeo (alltime classic), Someone's Gotta Change Your Mind (alltime classic too).

Now let's rock next time around with the rest of the GOS tracks. Just who can tell him what Steve's Riff is so he can put it on the next album? ;-)

[cincymike1]

Just heard that there is going to be a movie out late next year starring Lindsey Lohen as Stevie Nicks. It is going to be about Stevie and Lindsey and their relationship through the years. Once again, Lindsey Lohen has been cast as Stevie and officially signed on to the project. They are currently looking for a big name actor to play Lindsey's part.

Exciting news and that very well may explain why LB put the publicly less appealing cd out first. It also explains his confidence that Time Warner would release another cd within a year after the general lack of sales on UTS. He has likely saved his best material for the release to coincide with the movie.

LB also stated that it is official now that he will be touring with Fleetwood Mac in 2008 and says that he has confirmed it with the band. The tour will be different from past ones in that they will each play solo material with the rest of the band backing them up.

Gotta go.....but lots of good news coming out about the upcoming year!!!

CincyMike

[wondergirl9847]

LB also stated that it is official now that he will be touring with Fleetwood Mac in 2008 and says that he has confirmed it with the band. The tour will be different from past ones in that they will each play solo material with the rest of the band backing them up.

Where is this info?! :shocked:

[BTFLCHLD]

Once again, Lindsey Lohen has been cast as Stevie and officially signed on to the project. They are currently looking for a big name actor to play Lindsey's part. Lohan is enough for me not to want to see it.

[cincymike1]

Wondergirl9847,

I received this from a VERY reliable source and I am sure that you will be hearing more information from the general media confirming this in the near future.

It is true and actually helps me to feel better about the timing of his current project.

[nix4life]

Exciting news and that very well may explain why LB put the publicly less appealing cd out first. It also explains his confidence that Time Warner would release another cd within a year after the general lack of sales on UTS. He has likely saved his best material for the release to coincide with the movie.



exciting news??? :distress:
ugh!!
just my opinion but the thought of this kinda turns my stomach - and what is this about him saving his best material to coincide with a movie. . . . ugh again !!(ok no vocabulary tonight ) - i know you don't like UTS but it is an AWESOME album - you back hand slap it by implying he put out something less than his best cos he was saving his best stuff to coincide with something . . . which i don't think is the case . . . and i don't think he thinks this work is as sub-par as you
- i think he is very proud of it. . . and should be . . .
defining moment . . . fresh sounds . . . not just riding on formulas . . .

and it just seems way to fast for this movie thing to come about - or at least im beggin that they are just spreading crazy rumours . . .

the rumour that stevie doesn't want to put out more cd length music and the thought of stevie signing off on what sounds like a horrible hollywood treatment of her life starring someone with questionable credentials -
can i please use ugh!!! just one more time
:distress:


LB also stated that it is official now that he will be touring with Fleetwood Mac in 2008 and says that he has confirmed it with the band. The tour will be different from past ones in that they will each play solo material with the rest of the band backing them up.


CincyMike

well this is more exciting to me :rolleyes: :]
- i dream of the tour where they just bone - up on all their tunes and do grateful dead like shows - no real set list until it happens - lindsey calls out for frozen love to meld right into So Afraid followed by a snippet of stevie singing the first verse and chorus of christine's sugar daddy which slips convincingly into a monday morning/rhiannon/blue letter combo-
and they close the show with "without you" -
just stevie/lindsey/guitar :] :] :]

- which will make for some uneven shows with some spectacular moments - and every third show or so they will just be dazzling
different yet memorable

[BTFLCHLD]

VERY reliable source
did you happen to receive a google alert?

[cincymike1]

Nix4Life,

Good points you made! You may be right about the fact that we should not be too excited about a movie with Lindsey Lohen in it, but the thought of seeing their story on the Big Screen is very cool.

[cincymike1]

BtflChld

Canadian source....not a google alert.

[nix4life]

and hey cincymike - im not jumpin your case
- hell i don't even know what your case looks like
- and i just reread what you said earlier in this thread - that uts has grown on you - but you are just worried that you won't see the side of lindsey that you really like - the rock-out one -
but i really think he has changed - as he says in his songs -
he casted away his dreams of only releasing his stuff when he was ready to let it go in a "PERFECT TO HIS EARS STATE"- now he seems busier than ever workin on adding to his incredible catalogue of jams and between syw and uts and the new album next year - three albums in under five years -
- cranking new stuff out or touring or fathering children - our boy is really on stride -

i know you will get your rock-out lindsey album
- it's a side of him that has to come out-
and we will both love that album i am sure:blob1: :laugh: :blob2:

[nix4life]

Nix4Life,

Good points you made! You may be right about the fact that we should not be too excited about a movie with Lindsey Lohen in it, but the thought of seeing their story on the Big Screen is very cool.


yah man - no kidding
done right it could be an amazing story -
but with tabloid lohan involved i worry it will get a tabloid treatment -

i want the story treated with the respect/drama/and intensity that it really deserves:thumbsup:

[cincymike1]

Here is the link verifying the Lohan portion of my e-mail:

http://www.rte.ie/arts/2006/1129/lohanl.html

CincyMike

[carrie721]

Just heard that there is going to be a movie out late next year starring Lindsey Lohen as Stevie Nicks. It is going to be about Stevie and Lindsey and their relationship through the years. Once again, Lindsey Lohen has been cast as Stevie and officially signed on to the project. They are currently looking for a big name actor to play Lindsey's part.

your logical leaps are astounding ... she has not been cast, she has not been signed on! as far as we know, there isn't even a script. the only person expressing interest in this is lohan. please do not spread rumors.

[BTFLCHLD]

i want the story treated with the respect/drama/and intensity that it really deserves:thumbsup: The reason they should 'play' themselves.
Couldn't you just see Lindsey as a youngbuck!? :laugh:

[cincymike1]

Last bit of fun info is that Lindsey Lohan has asked ex-boyfriend Jerat Ledo to play the part of Lindsey Buckingham.

Never heard of the guy, but he should have no problem winning his first Acadamy Award playing the part of LB.

[BTFLCHLD]

Jerat Ledo oh.hell.no.

[cincymike1]

Don't kill the messenger....just shipping out the news as fast as I get it. Have no idea who Jeret Ledo is but he certainly has a weird name.

[BTFLCHLD]

Don't kill the messenger... The hell.no was for Jared Leto. Sorry if you felt struck. This topic would/will probably be discussed in depth if kept to one thread...meet@ BIG 07.08 for a shoot-out. :lol:

[DrummerDeanna]

The hell.no was for Jared Leto. Sorry if you felt struck. This topic would/will probably be discussed in depth if kept to one thread...meet@ BIG 07.08 for a shoot-out. :lol:

It already HAS been discussed to death in the Stevie forum...there are a couple...actually three I think...threads about this very thing...of course if you read them you'll find out that I don't mind seeing Lohan in this role :D

[BTFLCHLD]

It already HAS been discussed to death in the Stevie forum...there are a couple...actually three I think...threads about this very thing...of course if you read them you'll find out that I don't mind seeing Lohan in this role :D I haven't been spending time in stevie's forum :sorry: I only just read catindark's thread. Within that I recall you posted your like of LL. Nothing wrong with that, I say. If they had to have anyone play Stevie other than herself my choice would be Shakira with a voice-over. :lol:

[shackin'up]

Exciting news and that very well may explain why LB put the publicly less appealing cd out first. It also explains his confidence that Time Warner would release another cd within a year after the general lack of sales on UTS. He has likely saved his best material for the release to coincide with the movie.
CincyMike

this whole quote makes the post totally irrelevant. you just post what you want to hear. So the messenger in this case is not a messenger but a MESSenger. lindsey already said that he wanted to tour with FM in 08, Mick also has said before that they could mix FM and LB/SN material for next tour.

There's only ONE fact:
Lindsey is VERY proud of UTS, and therefore, he postponed the next recordingsessions to tour extra for UTS and he's having a blast, while he gets tons of critical acclaim.

So stop posting rubbishnonnews. That film is just bull too. I'm sure lindsey DOESN'T want to put more oil on the FM-soapdrama-fire. It's just very unexciting, if true at all.

[natesummers]

According to IMDB, I find nothing about a movie on Nicks. Leto's current ONLY upcoming film is:

Chapter 27 (2007) (post-production) .... Mark David Chapman

Lohans:

The Loss of a Teardrop Diamond (2008) (pre-production) .... Fisher Willow
I Know Who Killed Me (2008) (pre-production) .... Aubrey
The Best Time of Our Lives (2008) (pre-production) (rumored) .... Caitlin
Speechless (2007) (pre-production) .... Sara
A Woman of No Importance (2007) (pre-production)
Chapter 27 (2007) (post-production) .... Jude
Georgia Rule (2007) (completed) .... Rachel

So they are both in Chapter 27, but there is nothing about a Nicks Flick. :shrug:

[Sahara]

a Nicks Flick.

Oh God! Let this word not enter the Ledge vocabulary! :shocked:

[carrie721]

Oh God! Let this word not enter the Ledge vocabulary! :shocked:

oh lord, i think it's too late! :eek:

[natesummers]

OH NO! WHAT HAVE I DONE! :laugh: :sorry:

[dontlookdown]

and cincy mike seems to be the purveyor of all things fine and in good taste



snooze


eyeroll

[Rickypt]

I am not thrilled about the prospect of a FM tour with a lot of LB/SN solo songs. This after extensive solo touring by both of them since SYW? I'd rather they dust off some great FM tunes and do some BN songs.

[nix4life]

I am not thrilled about the prospect of a FM tour with a lot of LB/SN solo songs. This after extensive solo touring by both of them since SYW? I'd rather they dust off some great FM tunes and do some BN songs.

just my guess here -
but im thinking they will release buckingham/nicks on cd and then do a fleetwood mac tour - and sure dust off a few solo gems too -

[bikerchic]

Canadian source....not a google alert.

Ugh? Yeah, that's definately the place to go to get your L.A. entertainment news, is Canada :laugh:

[Little Nicki]

I am not thrilled about the prospect of a FM tour with a lot of LB/SN solo songs. This after extensive solo touring by both of them since SYW? I'd rather they dust off some great FM tunes and do some BN songs.
If they don't so solo songs, we're not going to get anything but The Dance #3. Lindsey at least has chosen some solo rarities on this tour, so his solo songs are probably our only chance at Fleetwood Mac playing anything dusty.

[sodascouts]

Just heard that there is going to be a movie out late next year starring Lindsey Lohen as Stevie Nicks. It is going to be about Stevie and Lindsey and their relationship through the years. Once again, Lindsey Lohen has been cast as Stevie and officially signed on to the project. They are currently looking for a big name actor to play Lindsey's part.

What the hell?! Lindsey Lohan?!!!!

Please tell me this is a sick joke!

Edited to add: Sorry, I didn't know this was already being talked about in the Stevie forum - I visited Lindsey's first. I'll go post more about it over there.

As for cincymike's original post - I disagree, but I didn't feel like I was being told what to think when I read it. Yes, it was strongly stated, but I didn't find it so offensive as some seem to. I understand a visceral response to a trashing of LB, though, and I think that prompted personal reactions more than a couple poorly worded sentences.

I think UTS is inferior to Out of the Cradle because of what sounds to me like amateurish vocals that make me wince and melodies that aren't as memorable, but that's JMHO. I do like it better than Go Insane and Law and Order in spite of that, because I feel the melodies ARE stronger than the majority of those (with the exception of a few standouts on those albums) even if the vocals are not. I'm glad Lindsey's happy with it.

[estranged4life]

What the hell?! Lindsey Lohan?!!!!

Please tell me this is a sick joke!

don't it Nancy??

[Ghost_Tracker]

What are you basing this "failure" of a CD on? Sales? Your own opinion? Lindsey is at a point in his career where "sales" don't mean success. .


Yes, he'd be willing to live out of a two-bedroom apartment in West Pacoyma or something, you know!? :D :laugh:

[shackin'up]

It's so typical american to misunderstand that twobedroom quote and keep holding it against him as a joke. Boring.

[mylittledemon]

I received this from a VERY reliable source

When people say this in reference to stuff about upcoming Fleetwood Mac projects, I just laugh.

[nix4life]

When people say this in reference to stuff about upcoming Fleetwood Mac projects, I just laugh.

unless u are hangin with one of the big four (or five) that are in the band - wait - scratch that -
unless you are hangin with the managers of the big four (or five) that are in the band then it's not reliable
:D:o

[ELIUD]

Aside from the fact that I can't understand his vocalization in every song, I think the album is quite beautiful. Except for the first song. I truly hate it.