National Evangelical Leader Resigns Amid Gay Hooker Allegations

[Nixxxed]

Have you heard about this one? ???????? AMERICAblog had much more: calling him "THE most important evangelical in the U.S., who has weekly conference calls with the Bush administration and direct access to George W. Bush himself."

http://www.denverpost.com/ci_4588998

Haggard steps down amid gay affair inquiry
By Eric Gorski, Felisa Cardona and Manny Gonzales
Denver Post Staff Writers
Article Last Updated:11/02/2006 05:15:40 PM MST


Ted Haggard, one of the most prominent evangelical pastors in the nation, resigned today as president of the National Association of Evangelicals amid allegations that he carried on a three-year sexual relationship with a male prostitute.

Haggard, founder of the 14,000-member New Life Church, has denied the accusations but said in a statement released by the church today that he could "not continue to minister under the cloud created by accusations made on Denver talk radio this morning."

He has placed himself on administrative leave pending investigation, spiritual counsel and a decision by the church's board of overseers, the church's legal counsel said. Haggard founded the church in 1985.

"I am voluntarialy stepping aside from leadership so that the overseer process can be allowed to proceed with integrity. I hope to be able to discuss this matter in more detail at a later date," Haggard's statement said.

The former prostitute, Mike Jones, 49, of Denver, went public with the accusations on Tuesday, saying he felt compelled to do so because he believes Haggard, a strong opponent of same-sex unions, has been hypocritical. Haggard is married with five children.

"I made myself cry and I made myself sick," Jones said about his decision to come forward. "I felt I owed this to the community. What he is saying is we are not worthy, but he is."

Jones says he was contacted three years ago by Haggard for sex - he thinks through a gay newspaper advertisement or an online ad he posted on rentboy.com.

Today, Jones showed the Denver Post an envelope addressed to him from "Art," a name Jones says Haggard used - sent from an address in Colorado Springs. Jones said the envelope came to him with two $100 bills inside.

Jones also played a recording of a voicemail left for Jones from "Art." Jones refused to reveal what the topic of the voicemail was about because there could be legal problems and he wants to consult with an attorney.

"They want to protect the sanctity of marriage and I am trying to figure out what that means because they are not doing a good job," Jones said of anti-gay marriage proponents. "To have someone in such a high profile position preaching against them and doing opposite behind other people's backs is hypocritical."

Jones said he would take a lie detector test to validate his claims.

The church's lawyer, Martin Nussbaum, said Haggard's resignation is in no way an admission of guilt. He's already denied Jones' accusations, but feels that when an allegation like this is made, he needs to take this step, Nussbaum said.

Nussbaum, paraphrased: The bylaws state that when an allegation of immorality is made, this process is triggered, where he puts himself on leave. The outside board makes the final decision.

In the interim, the church's associate senior pastor, the Rev. Ross Parsley, will serve as acting senior pastor of the church.

Staff writer Manny Gonzales can be reached at 303-954-1537 or [email protected]

[BlackWidow]

..not surprised.....

[irishgrl]

thus the GOP/Moral (HAH!) Majority (double HAH!) HYPOCRICY shows its ugly face.

[BlackWidow]

thus the GOP/Moral (HAH!) Majority (double HAH!) HYPOCRICY shows its ugly face.

God save us all from these M****R F*****S!

[irishgrl]

say, Ive got an idea: maybe if you read your Bible ONE MORE TIME, he will :p

ps: you know Im just givin' ya sh*t !!!

[BlackWidow]

say, Ive got an idea: maybe if you read your Bible ONE MORE TIME, he will :p

ps: you know Im just givin' ya sh*t !!!

**reaches for my bible***
10 Hail May's for Irishgrl...
***Prays*****

[irishgrl]

**snicker** you forgot the "r" in Mary! silly boy!:xoxo:

[BlackWidow]

**snicker** you forgot the "r" in Mary! silly boy!:xoxo:

**crickets**

[irishgrl]

uh oh, not nice to diss the Mother of Jesus...for that you get FROGS. A freakin PLAGUE of them. Good JOB Andre :mad:

[BlackWidow]

uh oh, not nice to diss the Mother of Jesus...for that you get FROGS. A freakin PLAGUE of them. Good JOB Andre :mad:

BRING IT ON!!!!:lol:

[gldstwmn]

I laughed out loud when I heard this come over CNN.

[SuzeQuze]

This is insane. I wish this would prove to them that repression doesn't work but I don't see that kind of enlightenment coming anytime soon. :rolleyes:

Otherwise. . . :lol: :dances:

[BlackWidow]

I laughed out loud when I heard this come over CNN.

The fun just doesn't end!:rolleyes: :shrug:

[BombaySapphire3]

As usual the hypocrisy of the "Christian ' right in this country knows no bounds.

[BlackWidow]

As usual the hypocrisy of the "Christian ' right in this country knows no bounds.

..the loving do-gooders..the moral majority!:shrug:

[gldstwmn]

The fun just doesn't end!:rolleyes: :shrug:

Mike Malloy is talking about it now.

http://www.novamradio.com/

[DrummerDeanna]

And it reinforces the theory that the gayer you are deep down the more you denounce it publicly...this dude preached about the sin of homosexuality and is a huge opponent of a domestic partner initiative that's on Colorado's ballot.

Hopefully this will take some of the focus off of John Kerry's stupid flap.

[BlackWidow]

And it reinforces the theory that the gayer you are deep down the more you denounce it publicly...this dude preached about the sin of homosexuality and is a huge opponent of a domestic partner initiative that's on Colorado's ballot.

Hopefully this will take some of the focus off of John Kerry's stupid flap.

unbelievable....**** runs downhill...

[SuzeQuze]

And it reinforces the theory that the gayer you are deep down the more you denounce it publicly...this dude preached about the sin of homosexuality and is a huge opponent of a domestic partner initiative that's on Colorado's ballot.

Hopefully this will take some of the focus off of John Kerry's stupid flap.

Oh yeah, the Kerry story is now done. :nod: These people don't even see how sick they are.

[BlackWidow]

Oh yeah, the Kerry story is now done. :nod: These people don't even see how sick they are.

^^^^^5....

[gldstwmn]

The **** is hitting the fan so fast lately that it's hard to keep up. I'm quite enjoying it. :laugh:

[BlackWidow]

The **** is hitting the fan so fast lately that it's hard to keep up. I'm quite enjoying it. :laugh:

me too....;)

[Nixxxed]

And it reinforces the theory that the gayer you are deep down the more you denounce it publicly...this dude preached about the sin of homosexuality and is a huge opponent of a domestic partner initiative that's on Colorado's ballot.

Hopefully this will take some of the focus off of John Kerry's stupid flap.
Ranting is more like it. ;) You can watch clips of him from that "Jesus Camp" movie here (couldn't find it on YouTube directly):

http://americablog.blogspot.com/2006/11/disgraced-evangelical-leader-accused.html

[DrummerDeanna]

Ranting is more like it. ;) You can watch clips of him from that "Jesus Camp" movie here (couldn't find it on YouTube directly):

http://americablog.blogspot.com/2006/11/disgraced-evangelical-leader-accused.html

He's so gay :laugh: Seriously - when people are THAT homophobic I immediately peg them as clost gay to the utmost degree. I've been there - I know the self-loathing and projecting that comes from denying who you are :nod:

And yeah - the **** hitting the fan lately has brought me great amusement as of late...I just fear it still won't be enough to affect any real change come Tuesday - I'm actually nervous about the election.

On a horrible and sad note - I have to go cover the president in Greeley on Saturday :mad:

[Nixxxed]

On a horrible and sad note - I have to go
cover the president in Greeley on Saturday :mad:

:( :( :(

I hope you'll be able to get the sulfur smell out of your clothes.

[Rickypt]

I'm loving the exposure of this hypocrite as much as everyone, but I also find that these kinds of stories are told in a slightly (and sometimes not slightly) homophobic light.

For example, the media keeps calling it a "gay sex scandal". Making the story the fact that he had gay sex and is somehow immoral because of that. How come they never say "straight sex scandal"? The issue isn't that he had gay sex, it is that he uses his pulpit as an evangelical leader to keep gays from achieving full civil rights.

That story will get lost, though, and everyone will focus on this juicy "gay sex" scandal. People who hate gays will think of it as one more example of drug-using sex crazed queers and people who like gays already like gays. In a couple of weeks everyone will have forgotten and nothing will be different.

[gldstwmn]

On a horrible and sad note - I have to go cover the president in Greeley on Saturday :mad:

Bring your cross and holy water.

[gldstwmn]

:( :( :(

I hope you'll be able to get the sulfur smell out of your clothes.

:laugh: Hugo Chavez's quote will be remembered long after Bush has left the White House.

[SuzeQuze]

I'm loving the exposure of this hypocrite as much as everyone, but I also find that these kinds of stories are told in a slightly (and sometimes not slightly) homophobic light.

For example, the media keeps calling it a "gay sex scandal". Making the story the fact that he had gay sex and is somehow immoral because of that. The issue isn't that he had gay sex, it is that he uses his pulpit as an evangelical leader to keep gays from achieving full civil rights.

That story will get lost, though, and everyone will focus on this juicy "gay sex" scandal. People who hate gays will think of it as one more example of drug-using sex crazed queers and people who like gays already like gays. In a couple of weeks everyone will have forgotten and nothing will be different.

Well, "gay sex scandal" is a quick headline/soundbyte which will grab attention. Whereas getting into distinctions like "hypocritical evangelical leader used pulpit to deny gay rights while secretly paying for gay sex" is more complex. The major news outlets have really dumbed themselves down.

I'm not sure anything is going to be different either. But it is going to make people think, at least momentarily, that people who preach too loudly have a hidden agenda.

One thing though, I heard this guy has 5 kids and a wife, those are the people who really suffer when things like this break. :distress:

[SuzeQuze]

:laugh: Hugo Chavez's quote will be remembered long after Bush has left the White House.

:lol: I heard the tape of it and the translator was holding back laughter, it really was too much!

[Nixxxed]

So Haggard has admitted "some" of the allegations were true. That's a new strategy. But the male prostitute didn't exactly pass his lie detector test this morning. How very strange, especially with the meth aspect. Wonder how long until he runs to rehab.

[DrummerDeanna]

Bring your cross and holy water.

:laugh: I intend to...he's speaking right by a church, perhaps I'll go in and get blessed before hand so his evil doesn't penetrate my pure soul :p

Seriously I'm way bitter about having to see him in person (again).

And Haggard...haven't heard the latest today - but we're sure to carry it on our station, NPR didn't even mention it yesterday - it was all local on our part...I wonder if they'll get on this story today...

[sparky]

Typical. Nothing new here. But I love it just the same.

[Rickypt]

But it is going to make people think, at least momentarily, that people who preach too loudly have a hidden agenda.

One thing though, I heard this guy has 5 kids and a wife, those are the people who really suffer when things like this break. :distress:

I don't think people "think" that much or in that kind of depth. Most will be a little interested in the story because everyone loves a sex scandal, and this one is a GAY sex scandal that involves a male prostitute and drugs. A sliver of the population might take the time to ponder the only newsworthy aspect of the story; i.e., hypocrisy. A larger percentage will use the story to reinforce their own prejudices against gay people and gay sex.

And you're right about the family. This is why the more this story gets attention, the more I am bothered that it has become such a public thing.

[Rickypt]

But the male prostitute didn't exactly pass his lie detector test this morning.

I'm still trying to understand the motives behind the male escort. He takes money from the guy for 3 years for sex and then suddenly goes to the press because Haagard is against same sex marriage. Going public with this isn't going to change the outcome of the vote on gay marriage in Colorado (in fact, it will probably result in more people voting against gay marriage because what will be on their mind on Tuesday is gay escorts and closeted married dudes snorting meth and having sex).

[Rickypt]

I'll add that I'm watching cable news coverage of this issue all morning and almost none of the discussion is about hypocrisy. It is all about the "tawdry" situation and everyone loves saying GAY prostitute.

It is very eye-opening for me when stuff like this pops up because it reminds me just how much homophobia still exists out there. Imagine if the issue was around a faith leader who supported racist policies getting caught seeing an African-American female prostitute. The discussion would not be the same.

[DrummerDeanna]

^^

You make excellent points, and you know, I have never thought about these issues like this - but you're so right! Many a homophobe have this notion about "gay lifestyles" and this sort of cements their thought and fear...and further vilifies gays rather than the true loser in this - the preacher man who's a major hypocrite :distress:

[Nixxxed]

I'll add that I'm watching cable news coverage of this issue all morning and almost none of the discussion is about hypocrisy. It is all about the "tawdry" situation and everyone loves saying GAY prostitute.

It is very eye-opening for me when stuff like this pops up because it reminds me just how much homophobia still exists out there. Imagine if the issue was around a faith leader who supported racist policies getting caught seeing an African-American female prostitute. The discussion would not be the same.

I see what you're saying, but I want the record to show that I went for the even more tawdry gay HOOKER description in the thread headline. ;) :laugh:

I agree it won't change the vote, but I think every chink in the evangelical armor makes them less likely to push their agenda on us (at the same time they claim we're the ones with the agenda).

As for Jones' motives (and the seeming delay in his actions), I read that he only learned who Haggard was about 6 months ago and had been weighing his actions. And finally saw him on TV a few weeks ago being very anti-gay and decided he had to do something. But, all the details of this are all over the place, and I'm having trouble keeping up.

[Rickypt]

I'm somewhat impressed...MSNBC has a spiritual leader talking right now who said that this story is a disservice to the gay and lesbian community because it helps reinforce stereotypes. He did say something like "there are millions of upright gays and lesbians who don't use prostitute or pick up people in gay bars". Like picking up someone in a gay bar is immoral or something? Bizarre.

Then they cut away to Hagaard being interviewed this morning. All the of questions are around the meth, the hotel, etc. and no one asked about his hypocrisy.

[Rickypt]

I see what you're saying, but I want the record to show that I went for the even more tawdry gay HOOKER description in the thread headline. ;) :laugh:
.

:D and it got me to look. ;)

So I'm clear, my comments aren't directed at anyone here. They are specific to the media reaction.

For now, I'm suspect of Jones. I believe him, but I'm just not sure about the motives. I'm not convinced that destroying Haggard's family is the best way to address the anti-gay actions. I think I would have just cut off the "business" relationship and left it at that.

Wonder how long until Jones' book comes out?

[SuzeQuze]

...
Then they cut away to Hagaard being interviewed this morning. All the of questions are around the meth, the hotel, etc. and no one asked about his hypocrisy.

Idiots. :rolleyes:

[sparky]

I think hypocrisy is just a given with religious leaders. Like the fact that they breathe. And the whole deal is they can just repent and beg forgiveness and the idiots who gave them money before just keep on giving them money.
Jim Bakker anyone ?
These people never change, and neither do the sheep who follow them.

[Rickypt]

Idiots. :rolleyes:

I do have to say his answers are ludicrous. Like he bought meth but he decided it was wrong so he threw it away before trying it. What would have compelled him to buy meth in the first place? Oh, here I am getting all caught up in the scandal.....:laugh:

[DavidMn]

I had to laugh. People, from experience I can tell you there are plenty of men out there with wives and Gf's that want some man action on the side.:nod:

[macfanken]

I wonder if Haggard has met James Guckert/Jeff Gannon, the White House hooker? :shrug:

[SuzeQuze]

I wonder if Haggard has met James Guckert/Jeff Gannon, the White House hooker? :shrug:

Jeff is with BlackWidow who is working on getting him to talk.

[Rickypt]

I never thought I'd find myself agreeing with Bay Buchanan on anything, but nodded my head when she said the last thing supporters of the gay marriage issue in Colorado needed a few days before the election was a meth-selling escort as their poster child.

[Nixxxed]

I never thought I'd find myself agreeing with Bay Buchanan on anything, but nodded my head when she said the last thing supporters of the gay marriage issue in Colorado needed a few days before the election was a meth-selling escort as their poster child.
Weird. I actually agreed with her when she had her mini-breakdown on CNN over the Foley scandal a month back. Of course, she said the same thing about Republican supporters then (with Foley being the poster child)...

Another little tidbit - the TV station Jones went to decided on the timing. He went to them almost 3 months ago - they decided to wait until yesterday (late Wednesday?) to air the report.

[irishgrl]

I wonder what the advantages/disadvantages would be for this timing....

[Rickypt]

I wonder what the advantages/disadvantages would be for this timing....

Biggest advantage: Releasing a story a few days before an election will ensure massive coverage and good ratings for the TV station

Biggest political advantage: Those who oppose gay marriage make sure that the last thing people from Colorado have on their mind when going into the voting booth is gay people are drug-using, sex fiends.

Possible political advantage, but doubtful: People will consider this to be one more strike against a corrupt and morally bankrupt right-wing and will vote Democrat. Very doubtful, though.

[foxyluva]

Only in America... :rolleyes:

[The Tower]

I never thought I'd find myself agreeing with Bay Buchanan on anything, but nodded my head when she said the last thing supporters of the gay marriage issue in Colorado needed a few days before the election was a meth-selling escort as their poster child.
See, I have a problem with that. I don't put a divide between "marriage = good" "prostitution = bad" "drug use = bad". That kind of judgement that Bay Buchanan is peddling is the whole root of the problem. Gay marriage is somehow more acceptable with two doctors who have adopted kids? Wheras if it were a Bear and a Cub who are leather oficiandos who fist each other shouldn't be allowed to marry? I don't see the difference.

The whole issue here is that Haggarty is an unbelievable hypocrite. Everything else is moral semantics.

[Rickypt]

See, I have a problem with that. I don't put a divide between "marriage = good" "prostitution = bad" "drug use = bad". That kind of judgement that Bay Buchanan is peddling is the whole root of the problem. Gay marriage is somehow more acceptable with two doctors who have adopted kids? Wheras if it were a Bear and a Cub who are leather oficiandos who fist each other shouldn't be allowed to marry? I don't see the difference.

The whole issue here is that Haggarty is an unbelievable hypocrite. Everything else is moral semantics.

I'm only talking from the narrow lens of political strategy around the gay marriage ballot issue. It is reality that none of this helps the pro-gay marriage movement in the next few days before the election. I actually share your opinion on the whole marriage/morality issue though.l

I completely agree with you about what the "whole issue" is...unfortunately, almost no one in the media seems to want to talk about the whole issue (which is why I've made a zillion posts on this thread expressing my frustration).

[Nixxxed]

So Haggard was forced out today.

But I found an interesting tidbit on the Huffington Post, a comment from another evangelical pastor on how other pastors (and their wives) can avoid the same situation Haggard fell into:

Most pastors I know do not have satisfying, free, sexual conversations and liberties with their wives. At the risk of being even more widely despised than I currently am, I will lean over the plate and take one for the team on this. It is not uncommon to meet pastors’ wives who really let themselves go; they sometimes feel that because their husband is a pastor, he is therefore trapped into fidelity, which gives them cause for laziness. A wife who lets herself go and is not sexually available to her husband in the ways that the Song of Songs is so frank about is not responsible for her husband’s sin, but she may not be helping him either.

His other recommendations are equally insane: http://theresurgence.com/md_blog_2006-11-03_evangelical_leader_quits

[irishgrl]

So Haggard was forced out today.

But I found an interesting tidbit on the Huffington Post, a comment from another evangelical pastor on how other pastors (and their wives) can avoid the same situation Haggard fell into:



His other recommendations are equally insane: http://theresurgence.com/md_blog_2006-11-03_evangelical_leader_quits
aside from the fact that he's managed to blame the woman, I really have a problem with that whole "wives must be submissive" part.

your link takes us to an interview with Haggard. and that bit you quoted is Haggard as well........

[PsychCat]

Personally, I have no patience for guys like this.
I also never looked at it as a "political thing".... sounds more like a morals issue, ie. these types are what give "religion" a bad name.
(beware of flying stones....)

I repeat... it's no wonder there is so much hate in the world.... we can't even get along in our own space. :distress:

[estranged4life]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15536263/

Evangelical leader contrite after dismissal from Colorado megachurch

COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. - Less than 24 hours after he was fired from the pulpit of the evangelical megachurch he founded, the Rev Ted Haggard confessed to his followers Sunday that he was guilty of sexual immorality.

In a letter that was read to the congregation of the New Life Church by another clergyman, Haggard apologized for his acts and requested forgiveness.

"I am so sorry for the circumstances that have caused shame and embarrassment for all of you," he said, adding that he had confused the situation by giving inconsistent remarks to reporters denying the scandal.

"The fact is I am guilty of sexual immorality. And I take responsibility for the entire problem. I am a deceiver and a liar. There's a part of my life that is so repulsive and dark that I have been warring against it for all of my adult life," he said.

Haggard resigned last week as president of the National Association of Evangelicals, where he held sway in Washington and condemned homosexuality, after a man claimed to have had drug-fueled homosexual trysts with him. Haggard also placed himself on administrative leave from the New Life Church, which has 14,000 members, but its independent Overseer Board fired him on Saturday.

In his letter, Haggard said "the accusations made against me are not all true but enough of them are that I was appropriately removed from his church leadership position."

He did not give detail details on which accusations were true.

Board finds fault
Haggard was dismissed Saturday as New Life's leader after a board determined the influential evangelist had committed "sexually immoral conduct," the church said.

Haggard had resigned two days earlier as president of the National Association of Evangelicals, where he held sway in Washington and condemned homosexuality, after a Denver man named Mike Jones claimed to have had drug-fueled trysts with him.

He also had placed himself on administrative leave from the New Life Church, but its Overseer Board took the stronger action Saturday.

"Our investigation and Pastor Haggard's public statements have proven without a doubt that he has committed sexually immoral conduct," the independent board said in a Saturday statement.

Haggard was "informed of this decision," the statement said, and he "agreed as well that he should be dismissed."

Haggard, 50, on Friday acknowledged paying Jones for a massage and for methamphetamine, but said he did not have sex with him and did not take the drug.

The statement from the 14,000-member church said the investigation would continue to determine the extent of the misconduct. The Rev. Mike Ware of Victory Church in Westminster, a member of the board, declined to characterize what investigators found but said the board did not talk to Jones.

'We stand by him'
Haggard did not answer his home or mobile phones Saturday, and neither was accepting messages. The Rev. Rob Brendle, an associate pastor at New Life, said Haggard was out of town.

"We are fully confident in the board's judgment and decision," Brendle said. "Everyone supports Ted and his family. We stand by him."

Jones said in a telephone interview Sunday: "I am sad for him and his family. I know this is a tough day for him also. I wish him well. I wish his family well. My intent was never to destroy his family. My intent was to expose a hypocrite.

"I hope the healing process can start. I welcome his request for forgiveness for me."

Interim pastor named
The Rev. Ross Parsley will lead the church until a permanent replacement for Haggard is chosen by the end of the year, the statement said.

Haggard's situation is a disappointment to Christian conservatives, whom President Bush and other Republicans are courting heavily in the run-up to Tuesday's election.

Many were already disheartened with the president and the Republican-controlled Congress over their failure to deliver big gains on social issues even before the congressional page scandal involving former Rep. Mark Foley.

A political force
Haggard, who had been president of the evangelical association since 2003, has participated in conference calls with White House staffers and lobbied Congress last year on Supreme Court nominees.

Haggard visited the White House once or twice, Deputy Press Secretary Tony Fratto said Friday.

Richard Cizik, the evangelical association's vice president for governmental affairs, called Haggard's ouster "heartbreaking and unfortunate."

"He is a man who has done a lot of good and who hopefully after a period of repentance and counsel and spiritual restoration will have a future ministry at some point," Cizik said.

The assocation has named President Leith Anderson, senior pastor of Wooddale Church in Eden Prairie, Minn., as its interim president.

Accuser feels vindicated
The board's decision cuts Haggard off from the massive church he founded in the mid-1980s. He held New Life's first services in the unfinished basement of his Colorado Springs home.

Jones, who said he is gay, said he was upset when he discovered who Haggard was and found out that the New Life Church had publicly opposed same-sex marriage - a key issue in Colorado, with a pair of issues on Tuesday's ballot.

"It made me angry that here's someone preaching about gay marriage and going behind the scenes having gay sex," Jones said.

Jones also said Haggard snorted methamphetamine before their sexual encounters to heighten his experience but has denied selling drugs. He agreed to take a lie-detector test Friday; the administrator of the test said the answers about his sex allegations "indicated deception."

But Jones said Saturday: "Obviously they determined there was sexual indiscretions, so I think that vindicates my claim."

Haggard denies sexual claims
Haggard told reporters he bought meth but never used it; he said he received a massage from Jones after being referred to him by a Denver hotel. Jones said that no hotel referred Haggard and that he advertises only in gay publications.

In a TV interview this week, Haggard said: "Never had a gay relationship with anybody, and I'm steady with my wife, I'm faithful to my wife."

Church member Christine Rayes, 47, said the congregation had hoped the allegations "were all lies."

"We all have to move forward now," she said. "This doesn't make what Ted accomplished here any less. The farther up you are, the more you are a target for Satan."

[foxyluva]

^^^ Obviously even the most devout man cannot repress his natural desires - how much more evidence do these people need :rolleyes:

[sparky]

spiritual restoration

What exactly would that be ?

Does it involve power tools, dry wall, and fresh paint?

At the very least, for this guy, it's gonna involve a man in a tool belt.

[estranged4life]

^^^ Obviously even the most devout man cannot repress his natural desires - how much more evidence do these people need :rolleyes:

statement from that article I posted, Sounds like someone needs to get a clue...I can sell her one for $.01

"This doesn't make what Ted accomplished here any less. The farther up you are, the more you are a target for Satan."

Let's see, Can we all say good ol' Satan will get the blame for this? It'll be easy for Rev.F-tard to pass the blame onto something/someone that can easily take the blame off of himself when he needs to look in the mirror to see who is really to blame.

[estranged4life]

What exactly would that be ?

Does it involve power tools, dry wall, and fresh paint?

At the very least, for this guy, it's gonna involve a man in a tool belt.

has something to do with that Jewish King-of-King carpenter guy with the Mexican sounding name, I think it's Je-sus or something...Maybe he'll come down and bring some extra 'spiritual restoration' in his tool belt.

Hell, they can invite Bob Villa and make a 'restoration' show for cable...Hell, They can come to our house and perform some 'spiritual restoration' on our bathroom floor so I can save some $$$$ :thumbsup:

[sparky]

"This doesn't make what Ted accomplished here any less. The farther up you are, the more you are a target for Satan."


Such a riotously funny statement. I really did LOL at this one. I hear the word Satan and think of the Easter Bunny and the Tooth Fairy, so that is the level on which it hits me. She might as well be talking about the Heat Miser, Mr. Freeze, or The Riddler. What a big pile of douchebags and primitives.

[sparky]

has something to do with that Jewish King-of-King carpenter guy with the Mexican sounding name, I think it's Je-sus or something...Maybe he'll come down and bring some extra 'spiritual restoration' in his tool belt.

Hell, they can invite Bob Villa and make a 'restoration' show for cable...Hell, They can come to our house and perform some 'spiritual restoration' on our bathroom floor so I can save some $$$$ :thumbsup:

Totally ! I am picturing Keith Urban in a robe. His tool belt has vials of holy water, some smoking incense purse, a few snakes, candles, and a vibrator for the special cases. "Extreme Makeover: Spiritual Edition"

[foxyluva]

Such a riotously funny statement. I really did LOL at this one. I hear the word Satan and think of the Easter Bunny and the Tooth Fairy, so that is the level on which it hits me. She might as well be talking about the Heat Miser, Mr. Freeze, or The Riddler. What a big pile of douchebags and primitives.

:laugh: I really do agree. It reminds me of the book "The Satan Seller" in which it was supposed to be a real life account of a satan high-priest who found God. Thousands of people believed it, and joined his cult - it was later found that everything in his book was a big fat lie :laugh:

[foxyluva]

Go here and read about it. ****ing hilarious (but an excellent book)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Warnke

[PsychCat]

Totally ! I am picturing Keith Urban in a robe. His tool belt has vials of holy water, some smoking incense purse, a few snakes, candles, and a vibrator for the special cases. "Extreme Makeover: Spiritual Edition"

LMAO!! :lol:
Except we don't need to be giving TBN any new ideas..... ;)

[estranged4life]

Go here and read about it. ****ing hilarious (but an excellent book)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Warnke

a remember his bogus BS when I lived in Tulsa, Oklahoma. Sadly people believed everything he said.

If ya want a few good laughs about some relig-a-tards try reading the following links:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Tilton

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oral_Roberts

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Swaggart

Hey, Haggard rhymes with Swaggart - imagine that, basically both were caught with their pants down (Jimmy Swaggart's BS led to the great Ozzy Osbourne song "Miracle Man" which has the great line "Now Jimmy he got busted, caught with his pants down...Repent ye wicked sinner, self-righteous clown")

[foxyluva]

a remember his bogus BS when I lived in Tulsa, Oklahoma. Sadly people believed everything he said.

If ya want a few good laughs about some relig-a-tards try reading the following links:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Tilton

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oral_Roberts

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Swaggart

Hey, Haggard rhymes with Swaggart - imagine that, basically both were caught with their pants down (Jimmy Swaggart's BS led to the great Ozzy Osbourne song "Miracle Man" which has the great line "Now Jimmy he got busted, caught with his pants down...Repent ye wicked sinner, self-righteous clown")

That is funny :laugh: Especially that "Oral Roberts" one - sadly, people will believe anything...

[estranged4life]

That is funny :laugh: Especially that "Oral Roberts" one - sadly, people will believe anything...

about Oral was the following statement he made back in the late 80's: "I saw a 60 foot tall Jesus at the Ivory Tower telling me I need to raise money for my university."

****, we sent him a dollar in exchange that he would seek psychological help...Sadly they kept that dollar :shrug:

[DrummerDeanna]

Well as my sister said today - at least this wasn't a Catholic priest...this should take some heat off us for a bit ;)

And darn...I was waiting for the "you mean a massage isn't supposed to end with a blow job!?!" excuse. So much for that.

[carrie721]

Totally ! I am picturing Keith Urban in a robe. His tool belt has vials of holy water, some smoking incense purse, a few snakes, candles, and a vibrator for the special cases. "Extreme Makeover: Spiritual Edition"

OMG sparky ... marry me! :laugh:

[sparky]

Was Anal Roberts involved in some kind of sex scandal too ?

Might as well have been.

[vermicious knid]

I am predicting that in two years, this guy will announce himself "free of homosexuality" through prayer and faith in God. And then Christians will use him as an example of how people can be straight if they just choose to be.

[DrummerDeanna]

I am predicting that in two years, this guy will announce himself "free of homosexuality" through prayer and faith in God. And then Christians will use him as an example of how people can be straight if they just choose to be.

Very real possibility - Fresh Air just did a whole show on the Christian ex-gay movement...

And I actually have a friend from high school (who I still keep in contact with) who identifies himself as an ex-gay. He swears that he's "free of homosexuality" I guess only time will tell :distress:

[estranged4life]

Was Anal Roberts involved in some kind of sex scandal too ?

Might as well have been.

just the "If I dont raise 6 million for my university God will call me home" comment.

He didn't raise 6 million and God didnt call him home, "yet another con hiding behind the collar whose only God is the Almighty dollar".

[irishgrl]

I hear the word Satan and think of the Easter Bunny and the Tooth Fairy
:shocked: :shocked:

ya know, you may have something there....