Piano on "Oh Well Part II"

[BklynBlue]

Been listening to "Oh Well Part II" - really fascinating piece - and it struck me as ironic that while most writers site Hendrix's influence on "Underway" (I have to say I can not hear it - either in it's original form as released on "Then Play On", or the full length version from "The Vaudeville Years") I do sense some of the feel of "Little Wing" in the second melody line, which the piano picks up about six minutes into the combined nine minute version -
Which actually brings me, in an admittedly circuitous manner to my question - does anyone remember having read anything as to who is playing the piano?
There is not much to be heard - probably no more than a minute all told, and in two separate sections at that - in the middle, and then again at the very end.
The notes to the CD edition say it was Christine Perfect, and the playing certainly flows more than what I associate with Spencer's style, but I was just wondering if anyone had secondary source of verification.
From experience, I have a lot more confidence in the knowledge of the Ledge members than I do in those who write the liner notes.

[sharksfan2000]

I recall reading that all the instruments on Part 2 except the recorder were played by Peter Green, and that the recorder was played by his girlfriend Sandra. Not sure off the top of my head where I read that, possibly in the "Rumours 'N Fax" book?

The main connection I hear between "Underway" and Hendrix is that I think the main melody line bears some resemblence to "Third Stone From The Sun". Whether Green was actually influenced by that, either consciously or subconsciously, I have no idea. I don't believe I've ever read anything he's said in interviews or elsewhere that would indicate he was influenced by Hendrix.

[chiliD]

Been listening to "Oh Well Part II" - really fascinating piece - and it struck me as ironic that while most writers site Hendrix's influence on "Underway" (I have to say I can not hear it - either in it's original form as released on "Then Play On", or the full length version from "The Vaudeville Years") I do sense some of the feel of "Little Wing" in the second melody line, which the piano picks up about six minutes into the combined nine minute version -
Which actually brings me, in an admittedly circuitous manner to my question - does anyone remember having read anything as to who is playing the piano?
There is not much to be heard - probably no more than a minute all told, and in two separate sections at that - in the middle, and then again at the very end.
The notes to the CD edition say it was Christine Perfect, and the playing certainly flows more than what I associate with Spencer's style, but I was just wondering if anyone had secondary source of verification.
From experience, I have a lot more confidence in the knowledge of the Ledge members than I do in those who write the liner notes.

Considering that Jeremy himself says that he's not involved in ANY of Then Play On; and, that Christine has been quoted as saying that she only appears vocally, singing backgrounds on "When You Say", the identity of the piano player IS quite mysterious. I've read one place (but I can't remember where...Jet Celmins' bio of Peter maybe?) that said that Peter had learned both recorder and cello so he could play the parts on "Oh Well, part 2". I wonder if it is Peter himself playing the piano...?

Actually, I don't hear so much of Hendrix's influence on Peter, but Peter's influence on Jimi. Listen to "Pali Gap" from the Rainbow Bridge soundtrack (I think it has now been re-released on either First Rays Of The New Rising Sun, South Saturn Delta or Voodoo Soup albums). That has "Underway", "Albatross" & "World In Harmony" all over it.

[macfan 57]

I believe it was Jeremy who played that piano part. I have an interview CD from late 1976 in which Mick says that Jeremy's only contribution to Then Play On was some piano. I assume he was referring to the piano on "Oh Well". There is an inteview with Christine in a 1992 Goldmine Magazine. She said that the only thing she did on Then Play On was some backing vocals, probably "When You Say", although I think it sounds more like Danny harmonizing with himself on that song.

BklynBlue, what CD liner notes are you referring to?:confused: My CD booklet only says that Christine sat in on some studio sessions for the album.

[BklynBlue]

BklynBlue, what CD liner notes are you referring to?:confused: My CD booklet only says that Christine sat in on some studio sessions for the album.

I was referring to that same comment in the liner notes, and as I do not hear any keyboards (save the lone organ note briefly heard during fade of "Closing My Eyes"), anywhere else on the album, I assumed that they were speaking of the piano on "Oh Well Part II".

[Wouter Vuijk]

Considering that Jeremy himself says that he's not involved in ANY of Then Play On;
Although I know that the album in other countries does include Oh Well, the original Dutch Then Play On album does not include Oh Well. This could mean that it has been recorded at another time with Jeremy, possibly playing the piano.
:confused:

[chiliD]

Although I know that the album in other countries does include Oh Well, the original Dutch Then Play On album does not include Oh Well. This could mean that it has been recorded at another time with Jeremy, possibly playing the piano.
:confused:

True. Both the original pressings in the US & UK didn't have "Oh Well" either. But, they added it on later ones. (the US version dropped "When You Say" & "My Dream"; the UK version dropped those two AND Danny's "One Sunny Day" & "Without You")

[jbrownsjr]

well let me ask you this? does it sound like CP?

[BklynBlue]

well let me ask you this? does it sound like CP?

I would have to be honest here and say that I would defer to those who are more familiar with Christine's work -
I am really only comfortable discussing her work on the recordings that she made with the Green led configuration.
It does have a "softer" touch, but she pounded those keys pretty hard on the studio versions of "Stop Messin' Round" and "Lazy Poker Blues" -
Spencer I am used to hearing with more of a "boogie woogie" roll in his playing - be an interesting side, not seen before, if it is Spencer on the piano -
It also seems possible that it is Green himself -many musicians best known as guitarists compose on piano, and what is being played is not that complex - so I leave that open

[bretonbanquet]

According to Peter, the piano on "Oh Well Pt 2" was Jeremy. In the interview with Mike Vernon in the booklet for the Complete Blue Horizon sessions, Peter says:

"Jeremy wouldn't learn any of my songs... He did do when we recorded "Oh Well", he played piano on the B-side of that. But I was never sure if the reason why he didn't join in more was that he wouldn't or he couldn't."

I knew I'd read it somewhere, but it took me a while to find out where... :laugh: I think Jeremy is a much better pianist than people seem to give him credit for.

The booklet also says where Christine played piano, as far as the Blue Horizon period is concerned - Stop Messin' Round, Worried Dream, Need Your Love So Bad, and the "Mr Wonderful" session that produced Rollin' Man, Love That Burns, If You Be My Baby and Lazy Poker Blues. All the other piano parts were Jeremy's. I never recall reading that Peter played piano at all, though I suspect he probably could play a bit if he wanted to.

As for "Then Play On", I don't really know where Chris played. I agree with Mary Anne in that I don't hear her vocal on When You Say, though.

[sharksfan2000]

Good find on that interview with Mike Vernon, bretonbanquet. :thumbsup:

I found the reference I remembered about Peter playing all the instruments except the recorder, in Bob Brunning's book Fleetwood Mac: The First 30 Years. "Peter played every instrument on the record apart from one. His lovely girlfriend Sandra contributed a pretty recorder solo." It's not clear from the book whether that statement refers to both parts of "Oh Well" or just Part 2, but it seems safe to say Peter doesn't play every instrument on Part 1. Unfortunately, the accuracy of Brunning's book has often come into question, so I don't know how much faith to place in this statement.

ChiliD - I found a mention of Peter learning to play cello for "Oh Well, Part 2" in Rikky Rooksby's book, The Complete Guide to the Music of Fleetwood Mac. "Being utterly uncompromising in his presentation, Green insisted on buying himself a cello and teaching himself how to play it in order to get exactly the cello sound which he wanted on this track. The flute (actually recorder) was played by his girlfriend Sandra Elsdon."

[BklynBlue]

According to Peter, the piano on "Oh Well Pt 2" was Jeremy. In the interview with Mike Vernon in the booklet for the Complete Blue Horizon sessions, Peter says:

"Jeremy wouldn't learn any of my songs... He did do when we recorded "Oh Well", he played piano on the B-side of that. But I was never sure if the reason why he didn't join in more was that he wouldn't or he couldn't."

I knew I'd read it somewhere, but it took me a while to find out where... :laugh: I think Jeremy is a much better pianist than people seem to give him credit for.



Thank you for finding that! I knew I had read that somewhere but I just could not find it !
As I said in my first post, I have much more confidence in the list members on the Ledge than I do in the so called professionals :eek:

I also agree that Jeremy could play piano, sing (see "Hang On To A Dream" from the BBC sessions) and play guitar ("I've Lost My Baby" on Mr. Wonderful) with much greater subtlety than he ever cared to show - a shame he did not push himself harder (or that no one else could push him further)

[jbrownsjr]

I would have to be honest here and say that I would defer to those who are more familiar with Christine's work -
I am really only comfortable discussing her work on the recordings that she made with the Green led configuration.
It does have a "softer" touch, but she pounded those keys pretty hard on the studio versions of "Stop Messin' Round" and "Lazy Poker Blues" -
Spencer I am used to hearing with more of a "boogie woogie" roll in his playing - be an interesting side, not seen before, if it is Spencer on the piano -
It also seems possible that it is Green himself -many musicians best known as guitarists compose on piano, and what is being played is not that complex - so I leave that open

thanks... i know what u mean about jeremy's playing too... well good luck on ur quest.

[dino]

thanks... i know what u mean about jeremy's playing too... well good luck on ur quest.
So to summarize it would be safe to say that Peter plays all the instruments on PT.2 except the recorder (Sandra) and piano (Jeremy)?

Hendrix was a major Greeny fan. I've never though about "Pali gap" being inspired by Peter.
Interesting...I think you're right. He did jam on the riff from "Oh Well (part 1) in concert, an example is during (I think) "Voodoo Child" from his last concert at Fehmarn, germany.
I've read something about "Underway" being a tribute to Hank Marvin.

BTW, from recorded evidence it seems that Jeremy is a quite good piano player, it was probably just that he didn't WANT to back Peter up during the blues numbers. A stubborn guy...

[dansven]

Isn't it an organ played on "Closing My Eyes"? (at the end)
Who played that then? ......

[aleuzzi]

And for that matter, who's playing the piano at the end of "Coming Your Way"? It sounds a lot like Chris's playing. I know she says she sang on TPO, but aural evidence suggests otherwise. She never said she didn't play piano on the record.

[macfan 57]

I just listened to my interview CD again & Mick did say that Jeremy wasn't on Then Play One, except for "one or two piano things". I believe any piano on the record is most likely Jeremy. Now the organ at the end of "Closing My Eyes"....I don't know, maybe Christine. I don't know if Jeremy ever played organ on any Fleetwood Mac record.

[chiliD]

Are we sure it is "organ" and not a guitar going through a Leslie speaker?

[sharksfan2000]

I think we need to get Martin Birch in for a Penguin Q&A session!

[chiliD]

I think we need to get Martin Birch in for a Penguin Q&A session!

Is he still alive? I thought I read where he passed away a couple of years ago. If I'm mistaken, my apologies to Martin & the entire Birch family.

[ThePenguin]

Is he still alive? I thought I read where he passed away a couple of years ago. If I'm mistaken, my apologies to Martin & the entire Birch family.


I'm pretty sure he passed away as well. He could have been an interesting guest. :(

-Lis

[BklynBlue]

Are we sure it is "organ" and not a guitar going through a Leslie speaker?

I have to admit, I had not considered that possibility. Seems more likely.
I was going to say that it is just a single note that is "sounded" rather than a piece that is "played".
Interesting to think that his contemporary Eric Clapton was in the Morgan and Olympic studios in London (the Blind Faith LP sessions) at the very same time recording a whole album using a similar set-up!

[sharksfan2000]

I'm pretty sure he passed away as well. He could have been an interesting guest. :(

-Lis
I didn't know about that. I did a Google search but came up with very little info on him other than his production and engineering credits.

[bretonbanquet]

I did a big search for Martin Birch and I couldn't find any evidence of his passing. He is a big big name in Iron Maiden circles, having produced many of their albums, and I found nothing about Martin having died on the huge Iron Maiden forum - if he had died I'm certain that they would have known - that place is quite Ledge-like in its members' knowledge.

Also Martin's Wikipedia entry is regularly edited, and just this month a paragraph was added to say that Martin retired in 1993. Hopefully he is still alive and in the best of health :)

[macfan 57]

Also Martin's Wikipedia entry is regularly edited, and just this month a paragraph was added to say that Martin retired in 1993. Hopefully he is still alive and in the best of health :)

I did a Google search too & saw this. He would have been(and would be, if hopefully he's still alive), a great Q & A subject. For those who heard that he'd passed away, where did you hear this? Also, does anyone know how old he would be if he were still alive?

[macfan 57]

I think someone posted this picture of Martin Birch a year or two ago. I don't know when this is from, but he did facially resemble Danny Kirwan a bit.

[ThePenguin]

I did a Google search too & saw this. He would have been(and would be, if hopefully he's still alive), a great Q & A subject. For those who heard that he'd passed away, where did you hear this? Also, does anyone know how old he would be if he were still alive?

I thought someone posted it here awhile back! maybe not. Hopefully he is still with us! :)

and yes he does resemble danny.

-Lis