Stevie did a Bat Mitzvah [Archive]

Rumour0323

11-29-2005, 01:32 PM

STARS LINE-UP FOR EXTRAVAGANT BAT MITZVAH PARTY

Also see:
50 CENT
TOM PETTY
STEVIE NICKS
AEROSMITH
THE EAGLES
STEVEN TYLER
JOE PERRY
DON HENLEY
FLEETWOOD MAC
CIARA
NICOLE RICHIE

50 CENT, TOM PETTY, STEVIE NICKS and members of AEROSMITH and THE EAGLES joined forces to create one of the year's greatest live line-ups at the weekend (26-27NOV05), when they played a private Bat Mitzvah celebration gig.

Multi-millionaire DAVID H BROOKS paid a reported $10 million (GBP5.6 million) to hire the artists to perform at his daughter ELIZABETH's party at New York City venue The Rainbow Room.

Brooks is said to have chartered his company jet to pick up Aerosmith rockers STEVEN TYLER and JOE PERRY from their Saturday (26NOV05) concert in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania.

He reportedly paid the WALK THIS WAY stars $2 million (GBP1.1 million) to play a 45-minute set, while 50 Cent is thought to have received $500,000 (GBP278,000).

Petty wowed the gathering with an acoustic performance, while The Eagles stars JOE WALSH and DON HENLEY played alongside FLEETWOOD MAC singer Nicks.

Other acts to perform at the extravagant event included CIARA, NICOLE RICHIE's fiance DJ AM and saxophonist KENNY G.

However, Brooks has denied the reported cost of the event. He told the New York Daily News, "All dollar figures vastly exaggerated. This was a private event and we do not wish to comment on details of the party."

dissention

11-29-2005, 01:36 PM

That is sickening. :laugh:

jannieC

11-29-2005, 01:40 PM

Oh my god, that is INSANE! Words escape me. :lol:

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 01:41 PM

That is sickening. :laugh:

I certainly hope Stevie and the rest of that motley crew gave their paychecks to their favorite charities.

Ridiculous.

Rickypt

11-29-2005, 01:46 PM

Hey, Stevie needs the money, she's buying that bigger house next door.

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 01:50 PM

That is sickening. :laugh:

Ah the line drawing again. What if he paid $5,000 for the party? What about $500? If he has the money, I say more power to him. But, people are loathe to let others do as they please and instead want to bash them for doing so :wavey:

MacMan

11-29-2005, 02:04 PM

jannieC

11-29-2005, 02:13 PM

I will say it's a pretty good line-up for a 13 year old's party. Rich girl has some good taste in music!

Rickypt

11-29-2005, 02:15 PM

I don't knock the rich guy for buying his daughter a party (although I agree with JYGM below about priorities and values), but I question why people with good politics like Tom Petty were willing to be bought by a defense contractor with a history of labor disputes. A quick google search brings up a lot of interesting info on Brooks, here's just one item:

http://http://www.laborresearch.org/story.php?id=227 (http://www.laborresearch.org/story.php?id=227)

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 02:17 PM

Ah the line drawing again. What if he paid $5,000 for the party? What about $500? If he has the money, I say more power to him. But, people are loathe to let others do as they please and instead want to bash them for doing so :wavey:

I'm sorry that you find it so disheartening that others find such over-the-top conspicuous consumption in a world where so many people live in abject poverty to be a little disgusting.

And I'm sorry you believe that the values people should be teaching their children are, "We have lots of money, so you can have whatever you want!"

But, hey, as you said, they do have the money! So more power to them! That is how it works. Maybe if we're lucky, one day just a handful of people will have the money. Then it will really be more power to them! Think of all the great parties they'll have then! I sure hope I get invited!

Where should that line be drawn? I don't know man, but here's a thought: If your choices for spending your budget include either throwing a party for your daughter or paying for housing for every homeless Katrina victim for over three days (http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/11/22/hurricanes.evacuees.ap/index.html), maybe that's a good place to start drawing.

DavidMn

11-29-2005, 02:17 PM

DavidMn

11-29-2005, 02:18 PM

Ah the line drawing again. What if he paid $5,000 for the party? What about $500? If he has the money, I say more power to him. But, people are loathe to let others do as they please and instead want to bash them for doing so :wavey:You know, I'm not in the habit of bashing people for having money either, I just hope that each individual can look at themselves in the mirror and be comfortable with what theyre doing.

skcin

11-29-2005, 02:32 PM

Omigosh! Like, maybe it will be on MTV's rad new show "My Super Sweet Bat Mitzvah!" :blob1:

barfgagpuke

SapphireSister

11-29-2005, 02:43 PM

That would be cool if 50 Cent and Stevie had done a duet - "Landslide In Da Club" :lol:.

DavidMn

11-29-2005, 02:45 PM

That would be cool if 50 Cent and Stevie had done a duet - "Landslide In Da Club" :lol:.INFORMATION OVERLOAD!!!!:lol: :eek:

ontheEdgeof17

11-29-2005, 02:47 PM

That would be cool if 50 Cent and Stevie had done a duet - "Landslide In Da Club" :lol:.

Loves it!

Too bad Kayne wasn't there. Gold(Dust)Digger would have rocked!

AliceLover

11-29-2005, 02:49 PM

That is so cool! I would die if I ever saw Stevie on a stage at a party with all my friends. Ive been to 2 bar mitzfahs and they have been fun.

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 02:59 PM

I'm sorry that you find it so disheartening that others find such over-the-top conspicuous consumption in a world where so many people live in abject poverty to be a little disgusting.

And I'm sorry you believe that the values people should be teaching their children are, "We have lots of money, so you can have whatever you want!"

But, hey, as you said, they do have the money! So more power to them! That is how it works. Maybe if we're lucky, one day just a handful of people will have the money. Then it will really be more power to them! Think of all the great parties they'll have then! I sure hope I get invited!

Where should that line be drawn? I don't know man, but here's a thought: If your choices for spending your budget include either throwing a party for your daughter or paying for housing for every homeless Katrina victim for over three days (http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/11/22/hurricanes.evacuees.ap/index.html), maybe that's a good place to start drawing.

As I have said many times, the minute I judge someone for how they live their life, then I open myself up for that same judgement.

I am sure that some people would be horrified that we are able to afford computers to spend our time in this relatively meaningless chat room when there are starving children in the world and we could be working that extra hour for them. I mean I could give $20 or so right now and feed some kid in a poor nation for a month. How many times do I do that until I can feel better about spending $50 on a steak dinner for myself?

Another example, what if I spent $250 on a birthday party for my dog, which I have done before. I am sure somewhere someone who knows nothing about me would be horrified by that, but it is my money and I can assure you I give far more than that to charity every year. Should I listen to some random person though who randomly hears about my excess and cancel that party and give that $250 to charity as well? I think most people would not do that and would tell that random person to piss off.

So, I say, live and let live.

Sadly, with really rich people that cannot happen as people love to judge them, yet do not want that judgement on them as well.

Of course, I will be seen as mindlessly defending the really rich, which is not what I am doing. I am simply saying we all ought to clean up our own houses and worry about that instead of some party thrown by someone we know nothing about and jumping to the very conclusions we would not like applied to ourselves.

Again, if everyone is so adamant on judging others, the next time someone sees an outfit, CD, concert ticket, etc. - please post here for permission to spend your own money and be prepared for the lectures on the starving children of the world because after all, a $100 outfit or concert ticket is probably relatively of the same consequence to this really rich give blowing a few million on a party.

sparky

11-29-2005, 03:23 PM

SapphireSister

11-29-2005, 03:23 PM

I wonder if I could hire Stevie to perform at my 30th Birthday party? I'm dead serious. I may look into this and call her management company and ask about pricing. That would rock!

She may not be too happy though when I tell her she has to sing The Nightmare and is under no circumstances permitted to wear Frankenbocks or any uniforms she has previously performed in. In fact, I'll be picking out her wardrobe prior to the envent. Oh yeah, and she must twirl a minimum of 25 times and do at least 10 high kicks. And I get a kiss at the end like the pic we saw from the races.

Livia

11-29-2005, 03:30 PM

*thud*

I'm just curious - where was this published? I'm just saying, it's good netiquette to include the source when posting stuff like this. :p

Edit: Never mind, I just found it - contactmusic.com

dissention

11-29-2005, 03:31 PM

Of course I am being judgemental. I live to judge. And my judgement is that this is stupid and kind of sickening.

Amen. Always the voice of reason. I bow down to you, wise one.

skcin

11-29-2005, 03:34 PM

Livia

11-29-2005, 03:36 PM

I say if he's gonna offer it... Then grab it... Good for them.

Did I read somewhere recently where this guy tried to get FM as a band to play?? Stevie looks like the only one that took him up on the offer.

Yeah, I had posted about that on the Rumours board awhile ago:

New York Daily News - http://www.nydailynews.com
Bat mitzvah dad aiming for the stars

Sunday, November 6th, 2005

I hear that music-biz folks are joking that they'll need bulletproof vests after dealing with Long Island body-armor mogul David H. Brooks and his relentless quest to book major-name rock bands for his daughter's Nov. 26 bat mitzvah.

The 50-year-old Brooks, chairman of the Westbury-based defense contractor DHB Industries Inc., has let it be known he's willing to spend millions of dollars - virtually an unlimited budget - on a party so lavish it will require two floors of the Rainbow Room.

But so far - despite flashing cash at Billy Joel, Rod Stewart, Don Henley, Neil Young and Fleetwood Mac (acts that might appeal more to a middle-aged man than to a 13-year-old girl) - I'm told that Brooks has managed to nail down only hip-hop diva Ciara.

One source close to the situation told me Brooks also has booked an unidentified "A-level act." I'm told Henley is considering the gig, as long as his seven-figure fee is paid directly to his Walden Woods Foundation. Presumably, some of the bigger-name artists will eventually come around - that is, if Brooks can keep the big checks coming and his hot temper in check.

I hear that Brooks - who in 2004 made $72.6 million in salary and exercised stock options, the highest pay of any exec on Long Island - has been given to angry rants and colorful threats in his dealings with agents, promoters and other rock-group functionaries.

In one widely circulated story, I'm told that Brooks - who, according to published reports, is being investigated by the Securities and Exchange Commission regarding his compensation and stock sales - is said to have threatened a William Morris agent with career-ending trouble from his "friend," Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice.

But I hear the agent claimed ignorance about the alleged incident, describing Brooks as "a perfect gentleman."

Brooks, whose company boasts multimillion-dollar contracts with the U.S. military and has also supplied the New York Police Department, didn't respond to my detailed messages.

SapphireSister

11-29-2005, 03:37 PM

Well if Stevie is indeed "for sale" for special events why don't all of us Ledgies chip in and have her perform for us? I know it will never happen but one can dream.

David

11-29-2005, 03:37 PM

When I saw the thread title, I thought for a second that Stevie had been called to the Torah, led the Shabbat service, & received hundreds of engraved fountain pens.

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 03:43 PM

As I have said many times, the minute I judge someone for how they live their life, then I open myself up for that same judgement.

Agreed. Judge away if you like. I certainly don't mind.

Sadly, with really rich people that cannot happen as people love to judge them, yet do not want that judgement on them as well.

Those poor, poor bastards.

Again, if everyone is so adamant on judging others, the next time someone sees an outfit, CD, concert ticket, etc. - please post here for permission to spend your own money and be prepared for the lectures on the starving children of the world because after all, a $100 outfit or concert ticket is probably relatively of the same consequence to this really rich give blowing a few million on a party.

"Relatively of the same consequence" to whom? The people doing the spending? Perhaps. But that's not really the comparison that matters. I don't give a **** if, percentagewise, rich Jewish dad spending $10,000,000 on a party is the same as me spending $1,000 on a computer or something. There's a finite amount of money in the world at any given time, and in real terms, $10,000,000 is a ****load of money, and it's 10,000 more than that $1,000 that you or I might spend on whatever.

Your drawing the line at these tiny little sums (and regardless of whether some incredibly impoverished people would view $100 as a vast sum of riches, it's a tiny little sum in the context of worldwide wealth) as a comparison of percentages misses the point. If you want to talk percentages, the wealthiest 1% of the people in the world has an absolutely mind-boggling percentage of the wealth. Those are real sums of millions and billions of dollars which are insanely extravagant by even the most generous definition of luxury. You're god damn right I'm going to judge those people for trading around those incredible piles of money among themselves rather than using more to help create a more egalitarian society.

SapphireSister

11-29-2005, 03:43 PM

When I saw the thread title, I thought for a second that Stevie had been called to the Torah, led the Shabbat service, & received hundreds of engraved fountain pens.

Don't forget being lifted up in a chair while all her friends and family dance around her in a circle singing Havah Nagilla.

Karlie

11-29-2005, 03:46 PM

When I saw the thread title, I thought for a second that Stevie had been called to the Torah, led the Shabbat service, & received hundreds of engraved fountain pens.

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

skcin

11-29-2005, 03:52 PM

When I saw the thread title, I thought for a second that Stevie had been called to the Torah, led the Shabbat service, & received hundreds of engraved fountain pens.

David you're on a roll today. LOL! :laugh:

Livia

11-29-2005, 04:08 PM

Here's another article, with more dirt:

New York Daily News - http://www.nydailynews.com
Not-so-Petty cash
to rock bat mitzvah

Tuesday, November 29th, 2005

History will forever record Elizabeth Brooks' bat mitzvah as "Mitzvahpalooza."

For his daughter's coming-of-age celebration last weekend, multimillionaire Long Island defense contractor David H. Brooks booked two floors of the Rainbow Room, hauled in concert-ready equipment, built a stage, installed special carpeting, outfitted the space with Jumbotrons and arranged command performances by everyone from 50 Cent to Tom Petty to Aerosmith.

I hear it was garish display of rock 'n' roll idol worship for which the famously irascible CEO of DHB Industries, a Westbury-based manufacturer of bulletproof vests, sent his company jet to retrieve Aerosmith's Steven Tyler and Joe Perry from their Saturday gig in Pittsburgh.

I'm also told that in honor of Aerosmith (and the $2 million fee I hear he paid for their appearance), the 50-year-old Brooks changed from a black-leather, metal-studded suit - accessorized with biker-chic necklace chains and diamonds from Chrome Hearts jewelers - into a hot-pink suede version of the same lovely outfit.

The party cost an estimated $10 million, including the price of corporate jets to ferry the performers to and from. Also on the bill were The Eagles' Don Henley and Joe Walsh performing with Fleetwood Mac's Stevie Nicks; DJ AM (Nicole Richie's fiance); rap diva Ciara and, sadly perhaps (except that he received an estimated $250,000 for the job), Kenny G blowing on his soprano sax as more than 300 guests strolled and chatted into their pre-dinner cocktails.

"Hey, that guy looks like Kenny G," a disbelieving grownup was overheard remarking - though the 150 kids in attendance seemed more impressed by their $1,000 gift bags, complete with digital cameras and the latest video iPod.

For his estimated $500,000, I hear that 50 Cent performed only four or five songs - and badly - though he did manage to work in the lyric, "Go shorty, it's your bat miztvah, we gonna party like it's your bat mitzvah."

At one point, I'm told, one of Fitty's beefy bodyguards blocked shots of his boss performing and batted down the kids' cameras, shouting "No pictures! No pictures!" - even preventing Brooks' personal videographers and photographers from capturing 50 Cent's bat-miztvah moment.

"Fitty and his posse smelled like an open bottle of Hennessy," a witness told told me, adding that when the departing rapper prepared to enter his limo in the loading dock, a naked woman was spotted inside.

I'm told that Petty's performance - on acoustic guitar - was fabulous, as was the 45-minute set by Perry and Tyler, who was virtuosic on drums when they took the stage at 2:45 a.m. Sunday.

Henley, I hear, was grumpy at the realization that he'd agreed to play a kids' party.

I'm told that at one point Brooks leapt on the stage with Tyler and Perry, who responded with good grace when their paymaster demanded that his teenage nephew be permitted to sit in on drums. At another point, I'm told, Tyler theatrically wiped sweat off Brooks' forehead - and then dried his hand with a flourish.

Yesterday, Brooks disputed many details provided to me by Lowdown spies at the affair and by other informed sources, scrawling on a fax to me: "All dollar figures vastly exaggerated."

He added: "This was a private event and we do not wish to comment on details of the party."

Rumour0323

11-29-2005, 04:13 PM

*thud*

I'm just curious - where was this published? I'm just saying, it's good netiquette to include the source when posting stuff like this. :p

Edit: Never mind, I just found it - contactmusic.com

Also here:

http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/369994p-314735c.html

AliceLover

11-29-2005, 04:19 PM

Also here:

http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/369994p-314735c.html

This kid really doesn't know how lucky he is. Im sad for some reason. :(

ELIUD

11-29-2005, 04:26 PM

I see nothing wrong with the bands accepting money for their performances at this function. However I do believe people do more harm than good to their kids and society when they treat them like this. Just for the mere fact that they're creating more rich assholes.

Nicksluvver

11-29-2005, 04:29 PM

Kenny G blowing on his soprano sax as more than 300 guests strolled and chatted into their pre-dinner cocktails.

"Hey, that guy looks like Kenny G," a disbelieving grownup was overheard remarking - though the 150 kids in attendance seemed more impressed by their $1,000 gift bags, complete with digital cameras and the latest video iPod.

For his estimated $500,000, I hear that 50 Cent performed only four or five songs - and badly - though he did manage to work in the lyric, "Go shorty, it's your bat miztvah, we gonna party like it's your bat mitzvah."

At one point, I'm told, one of Fitty's beefy bodyguards blocked shots of his boss performing and batted down the kids' cameras, shouting "No pictures! No pictures!" - even preventing Brooks' personal videographers and photographers from capturing 50 Cent's bat-miztvah moment.

"Fitty and his posse smelled like an open bottle of Hennessy," a witness told told me, adding that when the departing rapper prepared to enter his limo in the loading dock, a naked woman was spotted inside.

Henley, I hear, was grumpy at the realization that he'd agreed to play a kids' party.

[B]OH MY GOD THIS STUFF IS HILARIOUS!! RAOFLMAO :lol: :lol: :lol: :laugh: :laugh:

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 04:30 PM

Amen. Always the voice of reason. I bow down to you, wise one.

Oh I agree everyone judges. But, I try not to because I hate when people comment on how I live my life and I think in some way I lose the right to be pissed about that if I do the same thing and judge other people.

Note - I am in no way condoning this party or anything like that. I am just pointing out the hypocrisy in us all.

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 04:31 PM

. . . There's a finite amount of money in the world at any given time . . . .

Say who and by which standard are you defining money?

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 04:33 PM

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 04:34 PM

. . . You're god damn right I'm going to judge those people for trading around those incredible piles of money among themselves rather than using more to help create a more egalitarian society.

Please stop your selfish typing and start using that time to feed the poor :wavey:

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 04:36 PM

Say who and by which standard are you defining money?

Sorry, let me change that to "wealth." There is a finite amount of wealth - whether it be in the form of legal tender, stock, property, other investments, whatever - in the world at any given time.

Says who? Umm... the entire concept of capitalism?

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 04:38 PM

Please stop your selfish typing and start using that time to feed the poor :wavey:

Thank you, I was feeling kind of bad pre-judging you by assuming you would completely ignore/misread the point of my post.

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 04:39 PM

. . . and all rich people are assholes, which is the implication of your statement :shrug:

Ooh, not quite, but you're kinda close! Read that statement again and give it another try!

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 04:41 PM

Thank you, I was feeling kind of bad pre-judging you by assuming you would completely ignore/misread the point of my post.

I got it and was being a smart ass, a reflection you should be used to :wavey:

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 04:44 PM

Sorry, let me change that to "wealth." There is a finite amount of wealth - whether it be in the form of legal tender, stock, property, other investments, whatever - in the world at any given time.

Says who? Umm... the entire concept of capitalism?

Well, under that theory, the entire Earth and, for that matter, universe is wealth. But, I suppose those are finite in some degree.

But, I was specifically referring to the standard measurements of wealth like M1, M2, M3, etc. - which get more loosely defined as they get higher.

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 04:45 PM

Ooh, not quite, but you're kinda close! Read that statement again and give it another try!

I think "Just for the mere fact that they're creating more rich assholes" implies all rich people are assholes. But, he may have not meant it that way and if so great.

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 04:46 PM

I got it and was being a smart ass

Yes, that would be where the "ignore" part comes in.

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 04:52 PM

I think "Just for the mere fact that they're creating more rich assholes" implies all rich people are assholes. But, he may have not meant it that way and if so great.

Again, not quite. Go back and read the whole thing, including the sentence before it which provides the context for that subordinate clause. He's talking about people raising spoiled bratty kids who are taught to expect the world to be handed to them on a silver platter. Of course, being rich is something of a prerequisite for raising that kind of spoiled brat; it's a bit difficult for poor parents to raise children who expect luxuries to be lavished upon them at their every beck and call.

Rich people = rectangles
Rich assholes = squares

Have you ever seen an episode of MTV's "My Super Sweet Sixteen"?

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 04:52 PM

Yes, that would be where the "ignore" part comes in.

Bless your heart - you are obviously not using that function now :wavey:

dissention

11-29-2005, 04:53 PM

Have you ever seen an episode of MTV's "My Super Sweet Sixteen"?

Don't judge!!

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 04:54 PM

Well, under that theory, the entire Earth and, for that matter, universe is wealth.

All right, I'll simplify the definition a little more for you: "Things that people own." Wealth is things that people own. There is a finite amount of things that people own in the world at any given time.

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 04:56 PM

Again, not quite. Go back and read the whole thing, including the sentence before it which provides the context for that subordinate clause. He's talking about people raising spoiled bratty kids who are taught to expect the world to be handed to them on a silver platter. Of course, being rich is something of a prerequisite for raising that kind of spoiled brat; it's a bit difficult for poor parents to raise children who expect luxuries to be lavished upon them at their every beck and call.

Rich people = rectangles
Rich assholes = squares

Again, to me that presumes (perhaps in a rebuttable manner) that rich people are assholes in that there will me more of them. That is the way I read it. So sue me.

Have you ever seen an episode of MTV's "My Super Sweet Sixteen"?

I have not.

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 05:05 PM

Again, to me that presumes (perhaps in a rebuttable manner) that rich people are assholes in that there will me more of them. That is the way I read it. So sue me.

How are you possibly misunderstanding it that way? He is not saying, "Rich people are assholes." He is saying, "Rich people who raise their children to be spoiled brats who expect to have every luxury handed to them are assholes, as are those children."

I have not.

Do yourself a favor and tune in sometime. These people are, quite frankly, bad human beings.

Livia

11-29-2005, 05:06 PM

I wonder if Stevie, Tom, Joe and Don all shared a private plane to fly into NYC? Can you imagine? :lol:

bikerchic

11-29-2005, 05:09 PM

I can't wait for the bootleg :laugh:

Rickypt

11-29-2005, 05:20 PM

ELIUD

11-29-2005, 05:23 PM

How are you possibly misunderstanding it that way? He is not saying, "Rich people are assholes." He is saying, "Rich people who raise their children to be spoiled brats who expect to have every luxury handed to them are assholes, as are those children."
Do yourself a favor and tune in sometime. These people are, quite frankly, bad human beings.
Thanks for trying to explain my point Jyqm. But for someone who doesn't want to defend the rich, Strand sure seems to jump at their every mention.

dissention

11-29-2005, 05:27 PM

I'm embarrassed for all the performers.

Truly. They went straight from ampitheaters, completely skipped over Six Flags, and landed at a ****ing bat mitzvah. Those poor people.

jkmaletic

11-29-2005, 05:29 PM

Is there any chance that the report of this is simply untrue? :shrug:

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 05:30 PM

Thanks for trying to explain my point Jyqm. But for someone who doesn't want to defend the rich, Strand sure seems to jump at their every mention.

I would do the same if someone said all black people steal. Surely some do, but not all do, which is the stereotype. I hate stereotypes. That is what I am doing, not defending, etc.

Also - I am glad you do not think all rich people are assholes.

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 05:32 PM

Is there any chance that the report of this is simply untrue? :shrug:

No? Perhaps certain details and dollar amounts are exaggerated, as Brooks claims, but the event clearly happened.

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 05:32 PM

How are you possibly misunderstanding it that way? He is not saying, "Rich people are assholes." He is saying, "Rich people who raise their children to be spoiled brats who expect to have every luxury handed to them are assholes, as are those children. . . .

It was his use of the word "another" - which indicates there are more, etc. That is where I was getting it from.

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 05:34 PM

I would do the same if someone said all black people steal. Surely some do, but not all do, which is the stereotype. I hate stereotypes. That is what I am doing, not defending, etc.

But he never said that all rich people were assholes...

Nor did he imply it. You simply misread the sentence.

dissention

11-29-2005, 05:35 PM

It was his use of the word "another" - which indicates there are more, etc.

There's not more than one rich asshole?

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 05:36 PM

There's not more than one rich asshole?

I am sure there are (is?) . I was just adding more on that than he meant. So sue me.

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 05:36 PM

It was his use of the word "another" - which indicates there are more, etc. That is where I was getting it from.

Do you mean his use of the word "more"? "Creating more rich assholes?"

There are more. There are lots of rich assholes out there who raise rich asshole children. Again, tune into an episode of "My Super Sweet Sixteen."

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 05:38 PM

Do you mean his use of the word "more"? "Creating more rich assholes?"

There are more. There are lots of rich assholes out there who raise rich asshole children. Again, tune into an episode of "My Super Sweet Sixteen."

I know that. But, it is the presumption that all rich people are sort of presumed to be jerks that is underlying that. Maybe that is not what you are saying though.

Also, I took the "more" to mean all rich people are assholes. In other words, one more of an exclusive group.

dissention

11-29-2005, 05:40 PM

I know that. But, it is the presumption that all rich people are sort of presumed to be jerks that is underlying that. Maybe that is not what you are saying though.

Also, I took the "more" to mean all rich people are assholes. In other words, one more of an exclusive group.

Are you seriously arguing that in his post, he presumed that all rich people are assholes? That defies common sense, Jason, and I don't think anyone would be stupid enough to argue that. Good christ.

I'll tell you, though, I can only imagine the piece of work that would spend millions like that on a bat mitzvah. And I shudder to think of what a spoiled brat the kid must be.

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 05:41 PM

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 05:43 PM

I'll tell you, though, I can only imagine the piece of work that would spend millions like that on a bat mitzvah. And I shudder to think of what a spoiled brat the kid must be.

DON'T JUDGE!!!

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 05:44 PM

Okay. But he wasn't making that presumption.

What's the deal, why all the justification? A simple, "Oh, okay, oops, I misread what he was saying," would suffice.

I was trying to explain myself and why I thought that. I still think the underlying presumption is all rich people are assholes or some variation of that.

WelshWitchPMD

11-29-2005, 05:45 PM

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 05:46 PM

Are you seriously arguing that in his post, he presumed that all rich people are assholes? That defies common sense, Jason, and I don't think anyone would be stupid enough to argue that. Good christ . . . .

It came across that way when I read it :shrug:

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 05:47 PM

DON'T JUDGE!!!

Actually, it is judge all you want, but get ready to be judged when you do :wavey:

BTW - instead of typing, aren't you supposed to be working extra time to feed more of the poor?

dissention

11-29-2005, 05:48 PM

It came across that way when I read it :shrug:

You obviously misread it.

JazmenFlowers

11-29-2005, 05:51 PM

I don't have the time or energy to read through all this, but I will say that it's awesome that Stevie was asked and got a little pocket change. In my opinion, it's no one's business how anyone chooses to spend his or her money, as hard as it is for me to say that. Yeah, I loathe those biotches on "My Sweet Sixteen" and yeah, most of the people like that I know are asses and aren't worth 2 squirts of ducksh*t (copyright Diss) and in a perfect world the father would've thought more about shelling $10M on a freaking bat mitzvah, but this ain't OZ...in sum, who gives a fug? It amazes me how some on this board take a post and with one little reply twist it and the thread takes on another life. So the "rich" kid got an extravagant bday party and Stevie performed and got paid and the father could've have done a lot of really great stuff with that money, but he didn't...

you may begin...

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 05:52 PM

I don't have the time or energy to read through all this ...

Yet you had the time and energy to craft a response :wavey:

JazmenFlowers

11-29-2005, 05:54 PM

Yet you had the time and energy to craft a response :wavey:
you bet! now thank me in the way a goddess should be thanked. :wink:

btw, I knew someone was gonna say that; notice I said ALL, meaning I hadn't read every single post - you guys are getting awfully predictable

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 06:01 PM

Actually, it is judge all you want, but get ready to be judged when you do :wavey:

Knock yourself out, though I tend not to indulge in such conspicuous consumption that it's picked up by all the papers.

BTW - instead of typing, aren't you supposed to be working extra time to feed more of the poor?

I do my part, but sure, I could always do more. You can be damn sure that if I were a multi-millionaire, the vast majority of my fabulous wealth would be going to better causes than private rock concerts. I wouldn't be able to live with myself.

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 06:03 PM

I don't have the time or energy to read through all this, but I will say that it's awesome that Stevie was asked and got a little pocket change. In my opinion, it's no one's business how anyone chooses to spend his or her money, as hard as it is for me to say that. Yeah, I loathe those biotches on "My Sweet Sixteen" and yeah, most of the people like that I know are asses and aren't worth 2 squirts of ducksh*t (copyright Diss) and in a perfect world the father would've thought more about shelling $10M on a freaking bat mitzvah, but this ain't OZ...in sum, who gives a fug?

Well, you do, for one, since you admittedly loathe the girls on "My Super Sweet Sixteen."

Johnny Stew

11-29-2005, 06:07 PM

I'm just happy that Tom Petty, who is always held aloft as the prime example of how a dignified rock veteran artist should conduct themselves, played the gig, too. :laugh:

David

11-29-2005, 06:26 PM

I'm just happy that Tom Petty, who is always held aloft as the prime example of how a dignified rock veteran artist should conduct themselves, played the gig, too. :laugh:Yeah! What's up wit dat?

dissention

11-29-2005, 06:32 PM

I'm just happy that Tom Petty, who is always held aloft as the prime example of how a dignified rock veteran artist should conduct themselves, played the gig, too. :laugh:

No ****. I was very surprised at that one. A bat mitzvah. How embarrassing.

Rickypt

11-29-2005, 06:37 PM

I'm just happy that Tom Petty, who is always held aloft as the prime example of how a dignified rock veteran artist should conduct themselves, played the gig, too. :laugh:

That's what disappoints me the most, especially as I learn more about this Brooks guy.

Of course, the guy can spend money on whatever he wants, and of course the artists have every right to play whatever show they want, but there are legitimate issues around values and the disparity between what this kid got for a party and what most children around the world have. Those issues make for good discussion, otherwise this thread would just be, oh cool, wonder what the setlist was, hope Stevie wore boots this time.

It also would have been a lot more fun, and I would have thought a lot better of Stevie, if this article was about how she decided to play a surprise show at the House of Blues over the weekend as a gift for her fans instead of grabbing a bunch of cash to sing with grumpy Don Henley at an exclusive event.

JazmenFlowers

11-29-2005, 06:50 PM

Well, you do, for one, since you admittedly loathe the girls on "My Super Sweet Sixteen."
whatever. you know what I mean.

hey, I know, let's try to pick each other's post apart and craft witty comments to make ourselves and our points more valid...

would it be different if it were for a wedding or some other "party"?

Serrart

11-29-2005, 06:53 PM

This is just odd. A few million dollars on a silly party ? Whatever. I don't generally give two ****s about what people do with their money, but this seems in bad taste and vulgar to me. What is this guy going to give his kid for her 21st birthday? A country ? Of course I am being judgemental. I live to judge. And my judgement is that this is stupid and kind of sickening.

Why is it sickening? If rich people want to waste their money this way it's their right. Don't you ever waste money to spoil yourself? Or buy useless things that make you happy for three minutes? They're rockstars and are on sale from the moment they debuted. We just buy them in smaller pieces and under different conditions.

Romy

JazmenFlowers

11-29-2005, 06:55 PM

Why is it sickening? If rich people want to waste their money this way it's their right. Don't you ever waste money to spoil yourself? Or buy useless things that make you happy for three minutes? They're rockstars and are on sale from the moment they debuted. We just buy them in smaller pieces and under different conditions.

Romy
good point. this topic has, imo, gotten way out of control, but why am I surprised?

Serrart

11-29-2005, 07:00 PM

That's what disappoints me the most, especially as I learn more about this Brooks guy.

Of course, the guy can spend money on whatever he wants, and of course the artists have every right to play whatever show they want, but there are legitimate issues around values and the disparity between what this kid got for a party and what most children around the world have. Those issues make for good discussion, otherwise this thread would just be, oh cool, wonder what the setlist was, hope Stevie wore boots this time.

It also would have been a lot more fun, and I would have thought a lot better of Stevie, if this article was about how she decided to play a surprise show at the House of Blues over the weekend as a gift for her fans instead of grabbing a bunch of cash to sing with grumpy Don Henley at an exclusive event.

Of course because fans are the only customers who have the right to be satisfied.

Romy

Rickypt

11-29-2005, 07:04 PM

Of course because fans are the only customers who have the right to be satisfied.

Romy

Well that's not what I said. I think I was pretty clear that everyone has the right to everything.

Serrart

11-29-2005, 07:07 PM

Well that's not what I said. I think I was pretty clear that everyone has the right to everything.

Well, no because they got moral reproach for accepting to do a private party.

Romy

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 07:09 PM

you bet! now thank me in the way a goddess should be thanked. :wink:

btw, I knew someone was gonna say that; notice I said ALL, meaning I hadn't read every single post - you guys are getting awfully predictable

HOOKER :p :p :p

dissention

11-29-2005, 07:13 PM

Well, no because they got moral reproach for accepting to do a private party.

Romy

It's a ****ty example since Petty played this thing, but did you ever hear the song "Money Becomes King"?

David

11-29-2005, 07:13 PM

No ****. I was very surprised at that one. A bat mitzvah. How embarrassing.I heard Stevie, Joe & Don used the young lady's Bat Mitzvah as an opportunity to stretch out a little with their set lists -- you know, to run through some Yiddish numbers that they don't get to play very often when they're booked into the Garden or Irvine Meadows.

Stevie kicked it off with a stirring rendition of Hirsh Glik's famed "Shtil de Nacht" ("Still of the Night"):

Shtil, di nacht iz oysgeshternt,
Un der frost - er hot gebrent;
Tsi gedenkstu vi ich hob dich gelernt
Haltn a shpayer in di hent.

A moyd, a peltsl un a beret,
Un halt in hant fest a nagan,
A moyd mit a sametenem ponim
Hit op dem soynes karavan.

Getsilt, geshosn un getrofn
Hot ir kleyninker pistoyl,
An oto a fulinkn mit vofn
Farhaltn hot zi mit eyn koyl.

Next, Joe Walsh joined Stevie for a duet on "Papirosn" ("Cigarettes"), with words by Herman Yablokoff, the poignant tale of an orphaned cigarette peddler freezing in the rain on a street corner. Stevie & Joe performed the first verse in Rumanian-Yiddish style, but carried home the remaining verses in a rollicking dance-band Klezmer style:

A kalte nakht, a nebldike finster unetum
Sheyt a yingele fartroiert un kuht, zikh arum
Fun regn shtist im hor a vant,
A koshikl trogt er in hant
Un zaine oygn betn yedn shtum:
"Ikh hob shoyn nit keyn koyekh mer
Arumstu geyn in gas,
Hungerik un opgerisn, funem regn nas,
Ikh shllep arum zikh fun bagi nen,
Keyner git nit tsu fardinen,
Ale lakhn, makhn fun mir shpas."

Finally, Mr. Grouchy Don Henley himself joined Stevie for an especially apt a cappella treatment of "A Brivele der Mamen" ("A Letter to Mama"), with music & lyrics by Solomon Shmulewitz:

Mayn kind, mayn treyst, du forst avek
Ze zay a zun a guter
Dikh bet mit trern un mit shrek
Dayn traye libe muter
Du forst, mayn kind, mayn eyntsik kind,
Ariber vayte yamen.
Akh kum ahin nor frish gezunt
Un nit farges dayn mamen.
Yo! For gezunt un kum mit glik,
Ze yede vokh a brivele shik,
Dayn mames harts, mayn kind, derkvik

According to eyewitnesses (Bawba Needle, Aunt Tessya & her two unmarried daughters Fozel & Yoichel), a grand time was had by all!

Mazel tov, Stevie!!

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 07:16 PM

It's a ****ty example since Petty played this thing, but did you ever hear the song "Money Becomes King"?

But is it that it was for so much money. A very rich older lady paid me $500 a few weeks ago to sing like five songs at her birthday party. I do not sing that well anymore and would have done it for free. But, she offered and I took it. I had a blast and made her happy. What is the harm in that? What if she paid me $5,000, $50,000, $500,0000 - and I took it.How is that a bad thing or a sell out. I would have performed the same for all of it.

I am just being curious not antagonistic.

Serrart

11-29-2005, 07:17 PM

It's a ****ty example since Petty played this thing, but did you ever hear the song "Money Becomes King"?

No, but every history book testifies it, I think.

Romy

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 07:17 PM

Mazel tov, DAVID!!

that was brilliant!!!!!!

dissention

11-29-2005, 07:18 PM

sparky

11-29-2005, 07:21 PM

Why is it sickening?

Romy

It is sickening to me because it is over the top, conspicuous consumption that is purely done for show. I don't think some 13 year old girl is a big Petty, Nicks, Henley, or Aerosmith fan. This looks to me like a big budget pissing contest, and it makes me kind of sick. It represents a part of our culture that is embarrassing, self indulgent and undignified. It is bad taste because it is completely out of scale.

This kind of party would actually be appropriate for Sheryl Crow's wedding. Or Stevie's 60th birthday party. They both know a lot of the performers. It would make sense. I can only imagine the tens of thousands of dollars worth of food that is in the trash. That goes without saying and goes perfectly with the scene. It is the concept of doing ludicrous, extravagant things just because you can that I find distasteful. The scale of it all drives it into sickening territory for me.

And the performers ? :lol: Everyone's a whore folks. Some of us can just ask for more money than others. Everyone is a whore.

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 07:22 PM

So I take it you haven't heard the song or else you would have understood why I find this bat mitzvah rocking to be so cheesy.

My bad - I was not referring to that song. I referred to doing this in general. I mean my performace was not on some big stage that apparently lends some sort of credibility. It was in this lady's music room in front of like 50 people. I was there to entertain her, which I did. How is that wrong or really any different (except on the energy level) from Madison Sq. Garden?

Rickypt

11-29-2005, 07:23 PM

Well, no because they got moral reproach for accepting to do a private party.

Romy

Absolutely, because it says something to me about their values, and values are important to me. And until today, I had nothing but the highest esteem for Petty's values. As for Stevie--I'm not totally surprised, but I still have an opinion about it. It's not just that it was a private party, but who they played for.

You can disagree with my opinion, but please make your arguments based on what I said. The guy has the right to buy whomever he wants, and the artists have every right to be bought. It just smells, in my opinion.

Serrart

11-29-2005, 07:23 PM

So I take it you haven't heard the song or else you would have understood why I find this bat mitzvah rocking to be so cheesy.

I have read the lyrics but he clearly doesn't know much about Renaissance.

Romy

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 07:24 PM

. . . And the performers ? :lol: Everyone's a whore folks. Some of us can just ask for more money than others. Everyone is a whore.

My point exactly and Amen my dear - Amen :)

Serrart

11-29-2005, 07:25 PM

Absolutely, because it says something to me about their values, and values are important to me. And until today, I had nothing but the highest esteem for Petty's values. As for Stevie--I'm not totally surprised, but I still have an opinion about it. It's not just that it was a private party, but who they played for.

You can disagree with my opinion, but please make your arguments based on what I said. The guy has the right to buy whomever he wants, and the artists have every right to be bought. It just smells, in my opinion.

Do you know where and how your clothes and shoes are made? Does it smell too?

Romy

danax6

11-29-2005, 07:26 PM

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 07:27 PM

whatever. you know what I mean.

Not really. I mean, how was your post different from anybody else's who was complaining that we find this kind of lavish spending abhorrent?

would it be different if it were for a wedding or some other "party"?

Not to me, no.

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 07:28 PM

Why is it sickening? If rich people want to waste their money this way it's their right.

It's also our right to be sickened by their extravagnace.

dissention

11-29-2005, 07:29 PM

It is sickening to me because it is over the top, conspicuous consumption that is purely done for show. I don't think some 13 year old girl is a big Petty, Nicks, Henlel, Aerosmith fan. This looks to me like a big budget pissing contest, and it makes me kind of sick. It represents a part of culture that is embarrassing, self indulgent, and undignified. It is bad taste because it is completely out of scale.

This kind of party would actually be appropriate for Sheryl Crow's wedding. Ir Stevie's 60th birthday party. They both know a lot of the performers, it would make sense. I can only imagine the tens of thousands of dollars worth of food that is in the trash. It is the concept of doing ludicrous, extravagant things just because you can that I find distasteful. The scale of it all drives it into sickening territory for me.

And the performers ? :lol: Everyone's a whore folks. Some of us just can ask for more money than others. Everyone is a whore.

But who are you to judge? :rolleyes:

You've actually managed to cut through numerous pages of bull**** with one bloody post. It's the whole idea of people with millions of dollars hiring out other millionaires for extravagant sums of money to perform for an audience of more millionaires that I find rather icky. Why? Because, as you said, it's just for show. It somehow gratifies them to show what a big fat dick they have in the form of a checkbook. It makes me sick to my stomach. Everything is about money; those who have it feel the need to show it off, and rich rock stars give into such bull**** because they're going to be rewarded with lots of money. Talk about tacky.

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 07:30 PM

It's also our right to be sickened by their extravagnace.

Yes, but in that right is hypocrisy of some form (maybe that is not the right word) because somewhere someone would be sickened by the way you spend money no matter how wisely you do it.

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 07:32 PM

But who are you to judge? :rolleyes:

You've actually managed to cut through numerous pages of bull**** with one bloody post. It's the whole idea of people with millions of dollars hiring out other millionaires for extravagant sums of money to perform for an audience of more millionaires that I find rather icky. Why? Because, as you said, it's just for show. It somehow gratifies them to show what a big fat dick they have in the form of a checkbook. It makes me sick to my stomach. Everything is about money; those who have it feel the need to show it off, and rich rock stars give into such bull**** because they're going to be rewarded with lots of money. Talk about tacky.

But, his point was everyone does this. I do it everyday and so do you. I think that is the point. Though admittedly they do it on a far larger level than we do.

Livia

11-29-2005, 07:32 PM

Where is Perez Hilton on this topic? I want DETAILS! I wanna know the set list, I need to know if Stevie and Tom did I Need to Know!

(Veruca Salt voice) DON'T CARE HOW, I WANT IT NOOOOOOOOOOOW!!!!!!

David

11-29-2005, 07:34 PM

As I already mentioned in the other thread regarding this subject, I didn't think Stevie would lend herself for stuff like this. I get benefits, tours, tv performances (where she surely gets paid a fukc of a lot of money also), but a 13 year old stranger's bar mitzvah? It doesn't even sound like anything fun or worthwhile. :shrug:Don't forget, too, that over the past six or eight years, Stevie played about a dozen private parties for large corporations. Fans kind of wondered about that, too, because it was the first they had ever heard of Stevie being hired by various corporations to perform privately (for employees).

Personally, I have no problem with it because I don't like Stevie in concert any more. :angel: so if she wants to play the Poultry Farmers' Convention in Lower Possomtrot, I say go for it!

Serrart

11-29-2005, 07:39 PM

It's also our right to be sickened by their extravagnace.

Extravagance is good, is creative, that's not extravagance: that's normality. The kind where some people sell themselves for a moment of popularity in reality shows ,and some others are willing to pay to see why Jane wouldn't betray Jim with Brad... or would. It's always a matter of spoiled children in a rich and bored Empire.

Romy

dissention

11-29-2005, 07:39 PM

Don't forget, too, that over the past six or eight years, Stevie played about a dozen private parties for large corporations. Fans kind of wondered about that, too, because it was the first they had ever heard of Stevie being hired by various corporations to perform privately (for employees).

Yes. Let us not forget the show she played for the National Association of Chain Drug Stores. Or was it the North American Clinical Dermatologic Society?

Personally, I have no problem with it because I don't like Stevie in concert any more. :angel: so if she wants to play the Poultry Farmers' Convention in Lower Possomtrot, I say go for it!

Hahaha.

danax6

11-29-2005, 07:44 PM

Don't forget, too, that over the past six or eight years, Stevie played about a dozen private parties for large corporations. Fans kind of wondered about that, too, because it was the first they had ever heard of Stevie being hired by various corporations to perform privately (for employees).
I know, it just seems strange to me. I think that if she didn't work another minute of her life anymore, starting right now, she would still have enough money until the day she dies. Why the extra pocket money? Sure, if it was something that I would enjoy doing, or as a 'favor', or for a good cause...but this?

DashingDan

11-29-2005, 07:48 PM

Howard Stern's youngest daughter went.

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 07:52 PM

Extravagance is good, is creative, that's not extravagance: that's normality. The kind where some people sell themselves for a moment of popularity in reality shows ,and some others are willing to pay to see why Jane wouldn't betray Jim with Brad... or would. It's always a matter of spoiled children in a rich and bored Empire.

Romy

I agree. In fact, almost all of the what is considered as the world's greatest art came and still comes from this type of spending. I readily agree it was on the backs of the poor for most of it (Great Pyramids, Louvre, etc. ) - which sucks.

strandinthewind

11-29-2005, 07:54 PM

I know, it just seems strange to me. I think that if she didn't work another minute of her life anymore, starting right now, she would still have enough money until the day she dies. Why the extra pocket money? Sure, if it was something that I would enjoy doing, or as a 'favor', or for a good cause...but this?

Maybe she did it as a favor to Don, Joe, Tom, Jimmy Iovine, etc. Maybe she will donate all the money she got, if she got any. I mean if she went with Don or Tom as a favor, she got paid nothing or very little.

Interestingly, my mother and I were to be at the Waldorf Towers last week and weekend (which is when I think this was) - I would have never left the elevator and they probably would have moved us out of her suite :laugh:

Rickypt

11-29-2005, 07:54 PM

Do you know where and how your clothes and shoes are made? Does it smell too?
Romy

Yep I do, but I don't go around building a reputation as someone who only wears clothes that aren't made by exploited workers, yet suddenly turn around and sign a contract to be a Gap model.

My issue is with Tom Petty. Have a read at this interview with Tom Petty, who has been relentless about his views on greed. Note #2 and #8 in particular. It doesn't jive, it says something about his values, and it changes my esteem for him.

As for Stevie, I said I was embarrassed for her by playing this silly party and I would rather she put that energy into something special and intimate for her fans instead of for the fantasy of a guy who could simply afford it.

http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/_/id/5933643

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 07:56 PM

But is it that it was for so much money. A very rich older lady paid me $500 a few weeks ago to sing like five songs at her birthday party. I do not sing that well anymore and would have done it for free. But, she offered and I took it. I had a blast and made her happy. What is the harm in that? What if she paid me $5,000, $50,000, $500,0000 - and I took it.How is that a bad thing or a sell out. I would have performed the same for all of it.

I am just being curious not antagonistic.

I'm not as disgusted by the performers agreeing to do something like this as I am by the fact that this guy hired all of them, but for me, the problem I have with Stevie & pals is not the money but the fact that it's a private party for which they were hired. To me, that's something that cheapens the art (and the artist) a little bit.

You asked in another post how it's different from selling out a concert at Madison Square Garden. Well, in that case, Stevie announces that she's doing a show at Madison Square Garden at a certain time and place, and I go and pay to allow her to present her art to me on stage; it's her show, she's in control, and hopefully it's her ideal presentation of her art on that night. In the other case, if i hire Stevie for my party, it's not Stevie's show; it's me who tells her where and when and what I want her to do. At that point, she's just an employee and a puppet, and for me, that cheapens the art a little bit.

It's not a huge deal to me, but I do find it a little disappointing, and I do have more respect on this front for someone like Bruce Springsteen, who once he became famous declared, "I don't play no private parties no more."

Now of course, you go back a few centuries, and many of the classical masterpieces we know today were commissioned by aristocratic families for specific purposes, and the same is true of many wonderful paintings and portraits, but both cases are somewhat different animals, and I don't think I've got the strength to parse all that out tonight. Maybe in the morning...

dissention

11-29-2005, 07:58 PM

Yep I do, but I don't go around building a reputation as someone who only wears clothes that aren't made by exploited workers, yet suddenly turn around and sign a contract to be a Gap model.

My issue is with Tom Petty. Have a read at this interview with Tom Petty, who has been relentless about his views on greed. Note #2 and #8 in particular. It doesn't jive, it says something about his values, and it changes my esteem for him.

As for Stevie, I said I was embarrassed for her by playing this silly party and I would rather she put that energy into something special and intimate for her fans instead of for the fantasy of a guy who could simply afford it.

http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/_/id/5933643

"Money Becomes King" by Tom Petty

If you reach back in your memory
A little bell might ring
About a time that once existed
When money wasn't king
If you stretch your imagination
I'll tell you all a tale
About a time when everything
Wasn't up for sale

There was this cat named Johnny
Who loved to play and sing
When money wasn't king.

We'd all get so excited
When John would give a show
We'd raise the cash between us
And down the road we'd go
To hear him play that music
It spoke right to my soul
Every verse a diamond
And every chorus gold

The sound was my salvation
It was only everything
Before money became king.

Well I ain't sure how it happened
And I don't know exactly when
But everything got bigger
And the rules began to bend
And the TV taught the people
How to get their hair to shine
And how sweet life can be
If you keep a tight behind

And they raised the cost of living
And how could we have known
They'd double the price of tickets
To go see Johnny's show?

So we hocked all our possessions
And we sold a little dope
And went off to rock 'n' roll.

We arrived there early
In time to see rehearsal
And John came out and lip-synched
His new lite-beer commercial
And as the crowd arrived
As far as I could see
The faces were all different
There was no one there like me

They sat in golden circles
And waiters served them wine
And talked through all the music
And to John paid little mind
And way up in the nosebleeds
We watched upon the screen
They hung between the billboards
So cheaper seats could see

Johnny, rocked that golden circle
And all those VIPs
And that music that had freed us
Became a tired routine
And I saw his face in close-up
Tryin' to give it all he had
And sometimes his eyes betrayed him
You could see that he was sad

And I tried to rock on with him
But I slowly became bored
Could that man on stage with everything
Somehow need some more?

There was no use in pretending
No magic left to hear
All the music gave me
Was a craving for lite-beer
As I walked out of the arena
My ears began to ring
And money became king

Rickypt

11-29-2005, 08:05 PM

Personally, I have no problem with it because I don't like Stevie in concert any more. :angel: so if she wants to play the Poultry Farmers' Convention in Lower Possomtrot, I say go for it!

:lol: I think she already played that convention in '96, right before performing at that fair in Ohio.

Serrart

11-29-2005, 08:05 PM

JazmenFlowers

11-29-2005, 08:07 PM

Not really. I mean, how was your post different from anybody else's who was complaining that we find this kind of lavish spending abhorrent?
for one, I wasn't complaining - I could give a **** what you think

perhaps I didn't word it as eloquently as you are able to, but I was, in a way, agreeing with you

I was simply saying, yeah it is stupid to spend that amount of money, but that's the way of the world and it's retarded to attack Stevie, et al. for participating or the father for paying for it. I agree with the root of your thoughts, but I think it's just going too far. I don't think it cheapens or lessens the "art" at all - like someone said, money is money and if you think that Tom Petty or whoever else hasn't sold out, you're wrong...everyone sells out - look at Green Day.

bitch bitch bitch - that's what I get tired of; like you are somehow so in tune with what's moral or ethical or this or that (not necessarily you personally). I swear. Some of you are worse than the 80yr old ladies sitting on the front row of a Baptist church on Sunday morning criticizing one for wearing Gucci and one for wearing Prada. It just amazes me.

JazmenFlowers

11-29-2005, 08:10 PM

As for Stevie, I said I was embarrassed for her by playing this silly party and I would rather she put that energy into something special and intimate for her fans instead of for the fantasy of a guy who could simply afford it.

and why is this a silly party? yeah, I don't like it but I mean, so what...

I, like you, would love to see the same thing, but this doesn't make me upset IN THE LEAST.

why isn't this person's function any more special or intimate than the next?

DashingDan

11-29-2005, 08:14 PM

Old man Nicks, may he rest in peace, and old man Mick taught the little lady well...always make sure you have cash coming in! Wise words, especially if you wear boots all summer long.

Stevie spends like a sailor, by her own admission. So, let's say she made 15 - 25K for a 20 minute set and 1 hour of schmoozing...nice work if you can get it. I'd sing Landslide for the 12,418th time with all the depth, humor and pathos I could friggin' muster for that scratch.

dissention

11-29-2005, 08:16 PM

sailor, by her own admission. So, let's say she made 15 - 25K for a 20 minute set and 1 hour of schmoozing...nice work if you can get it. I'd sing Landslide for the 12,418th time with all the depth, humor and pathos I could friggin' muster for that scratch.

Ha! Homegirl wouldn't get out of bed for less than $500,000 to play at something like that, I bet. Kenny G got a quarter of a million to play background music.

Johnny Stew

11-29-2005, 08:17 PM

It's not a huge deal to me, but I do find it a little disappointing, and I do have more respect on this front for someone like Bruce Springsteen, who once he became famous declared, "I don't play no private parties no more."Is the moral there that it's only acceptable to be a sellout if you're broke? :laugh:

Mind you, I'm not arguing with anything you said, so don't get me wrong... but I tend to think that all rock stars, Springsteen included, become "employees/puppets" the minute they sign a record contract to produce X amount of material in X amount of time for X amount of money.

Hopefully they'll be able to maintain as much artistic integrity as possible in the process, but they're still employees who must meet contractual obligations so they can earn the almighty dollar (which they obviously desired in the first place, or they never would have signed on the dotted line).

The only ones truly deserving of our respect for their values, are the artists who refuse to sign their creativity over to "the man."
Of course, they usually die poor and unknown... so you're damned if you do/damned if you don't.

Johnny Stew

11-29-2005, 08:20 PM

Kenny G got a quarter of a million to play background music.Kind of like he did for 'The Other Side Of The Mirror'! :laugh:

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 08:20 PM

Yes, but in that right is hypocrisy of some form (maybe that is not the right word) because somewhere someone would be sickened by the way you spend money no matter how wisely you do it.

Yeah, that ain't hypocrisy, I'm not sure if there's a proper word for that.

But as I said earlier, such comparisons (well, how dare some poor homeless Katrina victim be sickened that I'm so relatively well-off, when there are people in Africa who are even poorer, etc., etc.) miss the point somewhat. Because in real terms, the sums of money being thrown around here are so much vaster than those examples can even comprehend.

You want to claim that it's all relative, but it's not. This spectrum has an end point, and Mr. Brooks is right there at the top of it. Only an incredibly miniscule number of people are richer than he is. And in real terms, taking into account things like the amount of wealth that exists in the world, the amount that average people are able live on comfortably, etc., there's simply no possible way to claim that spending $10,000,000 on a small private party is not over-the-top obscene.

Rickypt

11-29-2005, 08:26 PM

and why is this a silly party? yeah, I don't like it but I mean, so what...

I, like you, would love to see the same thing, but this doesn't make me upset IN THE LEAST.

why isn't this person's function any more special or intimate than the next?

Well, I'm not really very upset. At least not with Stevie--but definitely with Petty because I respect him for his consistent views and actions and this didn't jive.

I think the party is silly based on the reports--the dad getting on stage, having the nephew sit on the drums with Aerosmith, etc.

I'm sure the party was very special for the family, and you're right--who am I to judge what is special or not. I just think "okay, with the same energy, Stevie could have done something thrilling like play a surprise club show and instead she chooses this."

If she ever did things like the former, perhaps I wouldn't feel so strongly. I don't know what her reasons were for doing this show, but the message I get is that Stevie's only willing to do an intimate performance (by intimate, I mean a show where there aren't thousands of people in the audience) for a certain price or if the right person asks. It disappoints me, not upsets.

Rickypt

11-29-2005, 08:27 PM

I guess it's only a matter of point of view.

Yeah, we just have different perspectives on this. And you're right, the money could have been donated. I'm hoping some more info comes out about this.

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 08:32 PM

for one, I wasn't complaining - I could give a **** what you think

perhaps I didn't word it as eloquently as you are able to, but I was, in a way, agreeing with you

Gotcha. That's what I thought, it just seemed as though you were being antagonistic towards the other complaining, but perhaps I misread what you wrote.

I was simply saying, yeah it is stupid to spend that amount of money, but that's the way of the world and it's retarded to attack Stevie, et al. for participating or the father for paying for it. I agree with the root of your thoughts, but I think it's just going too far. I don't think it cheapens or lessens the "art" at all - like someone said, money is money and if you think that Tom Petty or whoever else hasn't sold out, you're wrong...everyone sells out - look at Green Day.

This I disagree with. I think it's a horrible fallacy not to complain about something simply because "that's the way of the world."

And no, everyone does not "sell out," and those who do "sell out" do so to widely varying degrees - this type of private party generally being considered to be at the further end of that spectrum. So it's a worthwhile distinction to make.

bitch bitch bitch - that's what I get tired of; like you are somehow so in tune with what's moral or ethical or this or that (not necessarily you personally). I swear. Some of you are worse than the 80yr old ladies sitting on the front row of a Baptist church on Sunday morning criticizing one for wearing Gucci and one for wearing Prada. It just amazes me.

I have always enjoyed these types of discussions on message boards and newsgroups. I find them really interesting and stimulating, and I like debating these sorts of things with other people who enjoy doing so as well. (And I certainly hope everyone here feels that they are in tune with what they believe is moral and ethical.) So I think this is a great thread. If you don't care for it or you're tired of this type of thing, okay, well, don't read it. It's really that simple.

There are plenty of things on the Ledge that I don't really care for. The various "Survivor" threads, for example, or the "What's your favorite song?" type stuff, just seem stupid and pointless to me, but obviously other people enjoy them. No sweat of my ass, I just don't read those threads.

UnwindedDreams

11-29-2005, 08:41 PM

What do we think leather and lace, dreams, stand back, landslide, Nightbird?:laugh:

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 08:48 PM

Is the moral there that it's only acceptable to be a sellout if you're broke? :laugh:

Depends on what you're claiming about yourself and about your art.

Mind you, I'm not arguing with anything you said, so don't get me wrong... but I tend to think that all rock stars, Springsteen included, become "employees/puppets" the minute they sign a record contract to produce X amount of material in X amount of time for X amount of money.

To some extent, yes, you're right. That's generally the trade-off that one has to make: between maintaining artistic integrity, sustaining oneself financially, and having the means to get your art out to as many people as you hope to. And that's a complex and delicate balance, which is why I don't think it's as simple as saying, "Oh, well, everyone's a sell-out."

These days, though, things are getting very interesting. The widespread availability of the Internet coupled with the increasing affordability of recording equipment is leveling the playing field in a lot of ways, and bands are able to get their music heard on their own terms without joining a major label. And of course, there are a lot of small labels these days that work much harder to foster their artists' creativity as opposed to only looking at the bottom line.

Sidenote, since you mentioned the acceptability of selling out when you need the money: I'm sure you've heard the Cure's "Pictures of You" in those HP commercials, and I believe they sold another song of theirs a couple years ago as well. Robert Smith mentioned in a couple of interviews that the reason they did was because they needed the money to present up-front to their label to be able to afford recording their new album. His justification of the songs chosen was that he hoped they were from far enough in the past that people already had solid relationship with them, and the commercials wouldn't corrupt that. You can take or leave that justification, but I think that's fairly respectable, and not a terribly egregious example of "selling out." Robert admitted that it's not somethign they especially wanted to do, but they needed the money if they wanted to keep making their music the way they wanted to. That's the trade-off, and he was up-front about it, so I can respect something like that, even though I'm sure they could have found some other way to come up with the cash.

wondergirl9847

11-29-2005, 08:58 PM

And they could have even donated what they earned we don't know.

Romy

I figure since most of the familiar (and familial sorta) names like Petty, Nicks, Henley, etc...went in on this, they donated their "earnings" to Henley's Walden Woods thingy or whatever.

But we have no idea.

DashingDan

11-29-2005, 09:04 PM

Maybe she did this show so that her band could all fly business class to Australia in February, making her happy, her band very happy, her agent happy (15%) and getting Karen, her accountant and her business manager off her damn back for five ****ing minutes.

Johnny Stew

11-29-2005, 09:20 PM

Jyqm

11-29-2005, 09:28 PM

Mind you, I'm not arguing with anything you said, so don't get me wrong... but I tend to think that all rock stars, Springsteen included, become "employees/puppets" the minute they sign a record contract to produce X amount of material in X amount of time for X amount of money.

A brief Springsteen-specific addendum to this post: Bruce may have a contract with Sony, but he is anything but an employee/puppet in any way, shape or form. Since his lawsuit against his former manager in the mid-70s, Springsteen has kept an iron grip on his control of his music. Sony gives him advances, and they release his CDs, but they don't call any of the shots. Guy ain't called the Boss for nothing (even if it Jon Landau pulling most of those strings).

The Tower

11-29-2005, 09:34 PM

Hopefully they'll be able to maintain as much artistic integrity as possible in the process, but they're still employees who must meet contractual obligations so they can earn the almighty dollar (which they obviously desired in the first place, or they never would have signed on the dotted line).
Um, I don't think so. I think the majority of musicians out there really did the music because it was in their blood and they really enjoyed it. The whole record contract thing was just a way to be able to do what you loved without starving to death. The money and excess was icing on the cake. And, after all, we're all human and humans love luxury- so once the money's there it becomes a lifestyle.

Of course, that all changed in time and is no longer true. Now the attainment is the bling.

The only ones truly deserving of our respect for their values, are the artists who refuse to sign their creativity over to "the man."
Oh, whatever.... That's such crap. I respect people for the ability to pull off being a successful working musician much more than some gomer who just sits back and writes music/performs. It is fukcing hard work to break in the music business without connections- practically impossible.

Anyways.... back on topic. Is it pathetic that Stevie and all the rest of those yahoos whored themselves for some spolied teeny-bopper's party? Yes.

The really sad thing is that with all the time and money that Stevie has (and no one forcing her to do a damn thing) that she could have actually pulled off something special. But, I guess in the end, money is money is money is money.

If I had $10,000,000.00 to blow, I'd charter a custom 747, buy tickets to the entire Aussie/Zealand tour, pay for limo pickup and plane tickets to LA for all the Ledgies who were interested and make it a REAL month long party- all expenses paid. But, that's just me.

sparky

11-29-2005, 09:46 PM

I just want to mention now that my 35th birthday will be coming up in 20 months & 8 days... so if anyone would like to, there's plenty of time to save up enough money to hire Stevie to play at my party.
I haven't seen her live since 1990, and I've been a good little boy. ;) :laugh:

I suggest circulating in the A gay crowd of NY or perhaps getting invited to one of Geffen or Diller's parties here in LA. You might be able to wrangle a sugar daddy who could pop that party for ya.

jkmaletic

11-29-2005, 09:58 PM

Howard Stern's youngest daughter went.

Yeah- I read that on his site today. (I missed it on the show) He evidently even mentioned Stevie too.
As far as the whole morality of this thing goes, I don't know. All of your opinions have made a lot of sense, but I'm not sure how I feel about it. Maybe all these artists are under the same management and it was a thing where one artist heard another artist agreed to it, so they agreed to it and so on and so on, but that really doesn't make it "right" either. :shrug: This whole thing is definitley WIERD though, that's for sure. :confused:

Johnny Stew

11-29-2005, 10:30 PM

Um, I don't think so. I think the majority of musicians out there really did the music because it was in their blood and they really enjoyed it. The whole record contract thing was just a way to be able to do what you loved without starving to death.I never once said that every artist who has signed a record contract did it solely for the money... but if making music is purely a matter of doing what's in your blood, you can do that on your own without a recording contract. Sure, you're going to have to find another job to support yourself, but it will allow you total freedom to create on your own terms and in your own time.

Oh, whatever.... That's such crap. I respect people for the ability to pull off being a successful working musician much more than some gomer who just sits back and writes music/performs.The question was whether or not these artists showed a lack of values for accepting money to perform at this kid's Bat Mitzvah. I was just pointing out that if an artist is seriously concerned about compromising their values, then they probably should have never signed a recording contract.
I'm not making a judgement call on it, I'm just saying that if you sign a record contract, your art becomes a product to be marketed and purchased.
There's a reason it's called the music business... and it's always been a business.

Most certainly there are songwriters and musicians with more integrity than others, but they're all getting paid to keep the suits happy, one way or another.

ka10

11-29-2005, 10:30 PM

One of the articles posted said that Henley was pissed when he found out it was a "kid's party"... maybe the guy booking the musicians wasn't exactly forthcoming in what the event was and they were all duped...? :shrug:

~Kat

jkmaletic

11-29-2005, 10:32 PM

Johnny Stew

11-29-2005, 10:35 PM

You might be able to wrangle a sugar daddy who could pop that party for ya.Believe it or not, I've been offered the "Sugar Daddy" setup a few times over the years. Never could think of any material possession that I truly wanted enough that would be worth it though.
And these days, I'm a little long in the tooth to win the attentions of a Sugar Daddy, even if I wanted one! :eek: :laugh:

So you guys are just going to have to raise money some other way to get Stevie to perform at my party. :p

Johnny Stew

11-29-2005, 10:36 PM

Maybe, but doesn't Henley always seem to be pissed about something? :rolleyes:Don isn't exactly Mr. Happy-Go-Lucky! :laugh:

gldstwmn

11-29-2005, 10:42 PM

Omigosh! Like, maybe it will be on MTV's rad new show "My Super Sweet Bat Mitzvah!" :blob1:

barfgagpuke

It would be worth it to see Stevie fronting the Henley/Walsh band. :laugh:

gldstwmn

11-29-2005, 10:51 PM

Say who and by which standard are you defining money?

I've never thought of money as a finite resource. That's probably why I spend so much. :laugh:

gldstwmn

11-29-2005, 10:55 PM

I wonder if Stevie, Tom, Joe and Don all shared a private plane to fly into NYC? Can you imagine? :lol:

I would've coaxed Kenny G to blow a few notes of Dial The Number. :laugh:

catinthedark

11-29-2005, 10:55 PM

Well, I've just read through this loooong thread. Everything I was thinking has been said. I'm not going to jump into the extravagance debate.

However, is anyone else a little surprised that this guy was able to assemble this kind of talent on this given night and clearly provide adequate lighting, rehearsal time, etc etc etc? I am. I mean, wasn't it Stevie who couldn't even commit to that hurricane benefit because there was the possibility she'd have to play with someone other than her band???

And to get all these artists to be available on the same day?? With all their schedules? It seems amazing. This guy clearly has some sort of crazy power. With music companies, it would appear. I wonder - and I'm just thinking out loud at the keyboard - if all these artists weren't given much of a choice by their record companies and/or management? Who knows? Just a theory. May be worth crap.

gldstwmn

11-29-2005, 10:56 PM

I'm embarrassed for all the performers.

I have to agree. How could Henley not know what gig he was playing? And I'm really, really surprised that Petty would agree to something like this.

SapphireSister

11-29-2005, 10:57 PM

So who wants to find out how much it'll cost to have Stevie at a private event? I'm curious what her going rate is.

gldstwmn

11-29-2005, 11:02 PM

All that I have to add is this: Just today I was thinking that it would be wild for Stevie or Fleetwood Mac to do a benefit show at The Rainbow Room in NYC. Isn't that weird?:laugh: Of course a kid's party is not what I had in mind.

And in that other thread, I said I'd like to see Stevie perform with Joe Walsh. We're psychic. :lol:

gldstwmn

11-29-2005, 11:07 PM

I heard Stevie, Joe & Don used the young lady's Bat Mitzvah as an opportunity to stretch out a little with their set lists -- you know, to run through some Yiddish numbers that they don't get to play very often when they're booked into the Garden or Irvine Meadows.

Stevie kicked it off with a stirring rendition of Hirsh Glik's famed "Shtil de Nacht" ("Still of the Night"):

Shtil, di nacht iz oysgeshternt,
Un der frost - er hot gebrent;
Tsi gedenkstu vi ich hob dich gelernt
Haltn a shpayer in di hent.

A moyd, a peltsl un a beret,
Un halt in hant fest a nagan,
A moyd mit a sametenem ponim
Hit op dem soynes karavan.

Getsilt, geshosn un getrofn
Hot ir kleyninker pistoyl,
An oto a fulinkn mit vofn
Farhaltn hot zi mit eyn koyl.

Next, Joe Walsh joined Stevie for a duet on "Papirosn" ("Cigarettes"), with words by Herman Yablokoff, the poignant tale of an orphaned cigarette peddler freezing in the rain on a street corner. Stevie & Joe performed the first verse in Rumanian-Yiddish style, but carried home the remaining verses in a rollicking dance-band Klezmer style:

A kalte nakht, a nebldike finster unetum
Sheyt a yingele fartroiert un kuht, zikh arum
Fun regn shtist im hor a vant,
A koshikl trogt er in hant
Un zaine oygn betn yedn shtum:
"Ikh hob shoyn nit keyn koyekh mer
Arumstu geyn in gas,
Hungerik un opgerisn, funem regn nas,
Ikh shllep arum zikh fun bagi nen,
Keyner git nit tsu fardinen,
Ale lakhn, makhn fun mir shpas."

Finally, Mr. Grouchy Don Henley himself joined Stevie for an especially apt a cappella treatment of "A Brivele der Mamen" ("A Letter to Mama"), with music & lyrics by Solomon Shmulewitz:

Mayn kind, mayn treyst, du forst avek
Ze zay a zun a guter
Dikh bet mit trern un mit shrek
Dayn traye libe muter
Du forst, mayn kind, mayn eyntsik kind,
Ariber vayte yamen.
Akh kum ahin nor frish gezunt
Un nit farges dayn mamen.
Yo! For gezunt un kum mit glik,
Ze yede vokh a brivele shik,
Dayn mames harts, mayn kind, derkvik

According to eyewitnesses (Bawba Needle, Aunt Tessya & her two unmarried daughters Fozel & Yoichel), a grand time was had by all!

Mazel tov, Stevie!!

Dude, that **** is funny. :lol:

GardenStateGirlie

11-29-2005, 11:08 PM

Maybe it was recorded for MTV...you know how much they love their programming! My Super Sweet Bat Mitzvah ...I can see it now.

gldstwmn

11-29-2005, 11:09 PM

Everyone is a whore.

There's a whole lot of (ugly) truth in that statement.

JazmenFlowers

11-29-2005, 11:11 PM

Gotcha. That's what I thought, it just seemed as though you were being antagonistic towards the other complaining, but perhaps I misread what you wrote.
good deal

This I disagree with. I think it's a horrible fallacy not to complain about something simply because "that's the way of the world."
by all means complain til you're blue in the face, I was just putting in my 2 cents that I see you're point and agree that it is strange, not wrong in any way, just strange (the girl has to make money and I'd do the same thing and not twist my chiffon over the fact of what people think), but at the end of the day this argument of Stevie playing at a freaking bat mitzvah versus an intimate House of Blues show or some other show deemed "acceptable" is ridiculous (to me)

And no, everyone does not "sell out," and those who do "sell out" do so to widely varying degrees - this type of private party generally being considered to be at the further end of that spectrum. So it's a worthwhile distinction to make.
I'll have to disagree. Everyone or at least 98% (I'll give you that) sell(s) out in some way, shape or form for money - showbiz is all about the money, plain and simple. Again, in my opinion.

I have always enjoyed these types of discussions on message boards and newsgroups. I find them really interesting and stimulating, and I like debating these sorts of things with other people who enjoy doing so as well. (And I certainly hope everyone here feels that they are in tune with what they believe is moral and ethical.) So I think this is a great thread. If you don't care for it or you're tired of this type of thing, okay, well, don't read it. It's really that simple.
I too enjoy these discussions, but find that more often than not, people jump to opinions and are not willing to give or see things in a different way, especially since we only have a small percentage of factual information. With respect to the moral and ethical issue, my point was not that people here don't know what they believe is moral or ethical, but rather other people making moral or ethical calls for other people. And as far as tired of this or some other thread, you're right, I don't have to read it. You're absolutely right. Thanks for reminding me.

There are plenty of things on the Ledge that I don't really care for. The various "Survivor" threads, for example, or the "What's your favorite song?" type stuff, just seem stupid and pointless to me, but obviously other people enjoy them. No sweat of my ass, I just don't read those threads.
True. True. I can see your point. However, one distinction of note is that the "Survivor" and "What's your favorite song?" are much more trivial, imo, than threads such as this and as my sig says, I'm a Chiffonhead/SOTB/Proud Street Angel/Mindless Lemming/Nicksian To The Core and have to back it up or at least try to.

:wavey:

GardenStateGirlie

11-29-2005, 11:14 PM

Maybe, but doesn't Henley always seem to be pissed about something? :rolleyes:

I can see him grimacing at all the Bubbie's with their cameras out while he was performing. You know Don loves photographs!

wondergirl9847

11-29-2005, 11:18 PM

Everyone is a whore

What did you just call my mama? :mad:

:lol:

Johnny Stew

11-29-2005, 11:22 PM

Uh oh, Christy's gonna throw down!

Karlie

11-29-2005, 11:37 PM

Mazel tov, Stevie!!

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: I love this thread.

Livia

11-29-2005, 11:40 PM

David, your Hebrew is impressive! All I know is Yiddish -and that's iffy - where's Tommer???

Oy, this thread is giving me shpilkis in my ganektagazoint...did the guests get all verklempt when they saw Stevie walk onstage?

wondergirl9847

11-29-2005, 11:44 PM

He called her mom a whore, she watched it happen...
Reading the thread, post by post
But more important, word by word
She read it all and took offense
He made her mad and it made sense...

Throw Down....like a wrestlin' match
Maybe Sparky could apologize
Then she could wipe tears from her eyes
And they could be friend Ledgies....

nicksnut

11-29-2005, 11:51 PM

I certainly hope Stevie and the rest of that motley crew gave their paychecks to their favorite charities.

Ridiculous.

i agree the money is ridiculous to spend on a kid. but if i take a job working christmas hours at a department store, it is to earn some extra cash. for whatever. whether it is to buy myself a car, pay the rent, keep my 13 person 'posse' happy and traveling with me at all times, to keep my stash of weed full and my guitars polished. the expenses are all relative to the lifestyle the person is used to , isnt it? i certainly wouldnt be expected to donate it to charity, even though i have a roof, wheels, and lots of things i dont need. everyone on this board who has shared their revulsion at the 'selling out' and the wasteful spending can be compared to someone with less 'stuff'. Myself included, of course. i expect more of some of those people too, and in lots of ways they all can be admired, etc. for charity work, talent, but they are people, with flaws, and jobs and suits they have to network with, even if they dont want to , dont they?
what is the diff in making 500,000 bucks to sing for 6000 or for 600 or for 60 people? still singing, still making some $$, still people listening.....i understand the uproar, but i dont. if i could , i would hire stevie too. it's too damn hard to meet her otherwise.

sparky

11-30-2005, 12:07 AM

David

11-30-2005, 12:16 AM

If I had $10,000,000.00 to blow, I'd charter a custom 747, buy tickets to the entire Aussie/Zealand tour, pay for limo pickup and plane tickets to LA for all the Ledgies who were interested and make it a REAL month long party- all expenses paid. But, that's just me.Thank you!! I'd go, & I don't even like Fleetwood Mac any more! :nod: :( :o

sasja

11-30-2005, 12:20 AM

I am so completely disgusted by these kinds of extravagance!! HOW many people could eat, HOW many humanitarian projects funded, environmental projects funded, with that kind of now wasted wealth...

But then, I am also one who thinks NOT one single soul in the world should be allowed to earn more than $100,000 a year (and that's for important jobs, like teachers and counsellors and healthcare providers and environmentalists, not ceo's :P) as you will NEVER convince me any one person needs more money than that to exist on. No way, no how.
If you need to spend those exorbitant amounts of wealth on an afternoon of entertainment, something is SERIOUSLY wrong with your brain, your psyche , your soul and your heart, in the needy world we live in.
HOW many Katrina victims are having their hotel allowances suspended?

As long as there are people living in the streets and dying from lack of getting their basic needs met, disgusting displays like these cannot be justified by ANY argument.

Yup. Not one.

Sasja

Nicksluvver

11-30-2005, 12:22 AM

Well Tom isn't raising ticket prices , but hes doin Bat Mitvahs! Quote from Tom Petty.com

"Like with the tickets, you know, it's been brought to our attention again and again and again: "You could be making twice the money you're making." We turn it down, I don't think with an eye toward being Robin Hood, I just think with an eye of, I want this trip to go on. I don't want to come through, burn everybody for $200 a ticket and then they can't afford to come see me again. Plus, I just don't think it's right. I don't think we need that much money. "

He also talks about not giving his songs for use in commercials.

David

11-30-2005, 12:36 AM

ragandbone

11-30-2005, 01:15 AM

and at the Rainbow Room

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d165/ragandbone/rainbow-roomBatMitzvah.jpg

sasja

11-30-2005, 01:35 AM

nope, not even liberty.
specially not if this is what people do with their liberty ..... :p

And David, loved your spiel on the bat mitzvah songs! :laugh:
I hope our son's bar mitzvah will be a nice low-key one.... If I have lost my mind enough in 13 years to have joined the family bubbies and shell out thousands for a party someone here please come kick me in the shins! :blob2:

Sasja

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 03:09 AM

. . . You want to claim that it's all relative, but it's not. . . . .

Of course it is :shrug:

I went to Vegas twice this year to see La Nicks. I spent thousands to do so. I paid for many Ledgies who could not live to my lifestyle and I have not one regret. Then again, many are hungry in the world and many in my home town of NOLA have no homes. Do I feel guilty - No. And why - well because I and they and they had a blast. I have no guilt. It is, as Sparky alluded to, the same thing on a smaller scale :shrug:

Of course, I gave far more to charity as I suspect this father did as well :shrug:

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 03:11 AM

. . . Anyways.... back on topic. Is it pathetic that Stevie and all the rest of those yahoos whored themselves for some spolied teeny-bopper's party? Yes . . . .

and if someone offered you $10,000 or whatever to sing for that, you would not have with glee accepted it :shrug:

brisharry

11-30-2005, 04:03 AM

my invite must have been lost in the mail dam , oh well , i bet the food sucked anyway:laugh:

BombaySapphire3

11-30-2005, 05:46 AM

I'm just happy that Tom Petty, who is always held aloft as the prime example of how a dignified rock veteran artist should conduct themselves, played the gig, too. :laugh:
Petty is the one to me that didn't belong in this picture.I don't know much about 50 cents or is it cent? But alll the other parties involved have long since sold their soul to this kind of thing.I can't picture Joni Mitchell ,Kate Bush or even Bob Dylan at this gig .

Jyqm

11-30-2005, 07:52 AM

Yeah- I read that on his site today. (I missed it on the show) He evidently even mentioned Stevie too.
As far as the whole morality of this thing goes, I don't know. All of your opinions have made a lot of sense, but I'm not sure how I feel about it. Maybe all these artists are under the same management and it was a thing where one artist heard another artist agreed to it, so they agreed to it and so on and so on, but that really doesn't make it "right" either. :shrug: This whole thing is definitley WIERD though, that's for sure. :confused:

Just to clarify: I don't know about anybody else, but I don't think this is really a "moral" issue, or that there's a "right" or "wrong" here. Mr. Brooks has every right to spend his money however he wishes, and Stevie and the rest have every right to perform at whatever events they want to. I think the extravagance of the spending is a little disgusting and wish Mr. Brooks would to do more worthwhile things with his money than in indulging in such over-the-top luxury, and I think it's a little cheap and disappointing that the musicians chose to participate - but I don't think anything about it was immoral.

Jyqm

11-30-2005, 07:57 AM

And to get all these artists to be available on the same day?? With all their schedules? It seems amazing. This guy clearly has some sort of crazy power. With music companies, it would appear. I wonder - and I'm just thinking out loud at the keyboard - if all these artists weren't given much of a choice by their record companies and/or management? Who knows? Just a theory. May be worth crap.

Oh lordy. I know it's popular around here to think of these poor rock stars as under the iron grip of their record labels, and while something like that might be true for certain up-and-coming, newer artists, we're talking about Steven Tyler, Don Henley and Stevie Nicks here. These people are major players who bring in lots of money and have the potential to bring in lots more. Their record companies do not walk up to them and say, "Play this man's party or you're fired."

Jyqm

11-30-2005, 08:03 AM

by all means complain til you're blue in the face, I was just putting in my 2 cents that I see you're point and agree that it is strange, not wrong in any way, just strange (the girl has to make money and I'd do the same thing and not twist my chiffon over the fact of what people think), but at the end of the day this argument of Stevie playing at a freaking bat mitzvah versus an intimate House of Blues show or some other show deemed "acceptable" is ridiculous (to me)

I agree with this much - I'm far more disgusted by Mr. Brooks' extravagance than I am about the artists agreeing to play the party. As I mentioned in another post, I think it cheapens their music ot some extent, but it's not a huge deal to me. The exception being Tom Petty, since his previously stated attitudes toward greed in the music industry would seem to contradict his presence at something like this. But maybe he did it as a favor or is giving the money to charity or who knows. I can't judge the artists too harshly without knowing all of the facts. And I agree that the "Well, she could have done this type of show instead" comparison is a little weak.

Jyqm

11-30-2005, 08:09 AM

Of course it is :shrug:

Sorry, dude, I'm not responding to anymore of your posts in this thread. I'm not in the business of repeating myself ad infinitum if you're going to repeatedly ignore the points I make in my post and pick out half-sentence blurbs to respond to.

No wonder you've got reading comprehension problems.

Rumour0323

11-30-2005, 09:25 AM

Don't see Petty but everyone else is there.

http://tabloidbaby.blogspot.com/2005/11/exclusive-photos-mitzvahpalooza.html

jannieC

11-30-2005, 09:44 AM

Amazing. Amaaaaaaazing! :rolleyes:

I don't fault the musicians- I mean really, maybe they think they're doing something good for this girl, or whatever. I think it's INSANE of the father to pay all that money for a 13 year old girl's bat mitzvah. But you know, these parties have gotten so out of control. I used to work as a F&B manager at The Marriott, and it amazed me how intent the parents were on outdoing each other with their kid's bat mitzvah's. I mean, how far can you go?

I grew up on Long Island, and went to quite a few in my day. They were such big deals to us, but by today's standards they were so lame. I think this whole thing says a lot more about our society than it does about the musicians themselves. And we really do have no idea if those figures are correct or how the artists handled the money. :shrug:

danax6

11-30-2005, 10:15 AM

http://photos1.blogger.com/blogger/6686/1849/1600/stevie%20and%20don8.0.jpg

Gold Dust Woman? :shrug:

dissention

11-30-2005, 10:16 AM

I find that disappointing too I must admit.
Very strange Petty took part.

Exactly. It's like Patti Smith doing a private show for Kellogg Brown & Root.

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 10:31 AM

I've never thought of money as a finite resource. That's probably why I spend so much. :laugh:

Lord Child - and I am exactly the same as you know!!!!!

I mean I never knew you had to pay Visa back :eek:

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 10:40 AM

. . . But then, I am also one who thinks NOT one single soul in the world should be allowed to earn more than $100,000 a year (and that's for important jobs, like teachers and counsellors and healthcare providers and environmentalists, not ceo's :P) as you will NEVER convince me any one person needs more money than that to exist on. No way, no how.
If you need to spend those exorbitant amounts of wealth on an afternoon of entertainment, something is SERIOUSLY wrong with your brain, your psyche , your soul and your heart, in the needy world we live in.
HOW many Katrina victims are having their hotel allowances suspended?

As long as there are people living in the streets and dying from lack of getting their basic needs met, disgusting displays like these cannot be justified by ANY argument.

Yup. Not one.

Sasja

Bullshiitte - it is their money. If you want to give your's away - by all means do so. But, the minute you or anyone else tells me what the hell to do with mine is the minute you cross the line. Again, please list your expenses and let us sit in judgement on you. I mean if you get down to it, we all should have one outfit that we wash once a month and we should all live in a 15x15 room with only a cot. I mean why should one person live any better than the other :rolleyes:

GardenStateGirlie

11-30-2005, 11:40 AM

Gold Dust Woman? :shrug:
Why do I have a feeling that all of the artists were there for the crowd and not the kid? She seems less than enthused with everyone.

The Tower

11-30-2005, 11:45 AM

and if someone offered you $10,000 or whatever to sing for that, you would not have with glee accepted it :shrug:
Nope.

I have no interest in playing for a 13 year old JAP's. Contrary to Sparky's statement, I am not a whore.

GardenStateGirlie

11-30-2005, 11:47 AM

Exactly. It's like Patti Smith doing a private show for Kellogg Brown & Root.

Then again, if we criticize her for this, it's no different than her performance at a private show for the National Association of Chain Drug Stores a few years back -- or for The World Shoe Association -- or for the NBA Allstars -- all of which like the Bat Mitzvah, i'm sure she received substantial compensation for. It's just another paycheck :shrug:

dissention

11-30-2005, 11:49 AM

Then again, if we criticize her for this, it's no different than her performance at a private show for the National Association of Chain Drug Stores a few years back -- or for The World Shoe Association -- or for the NBA Allstars -- all of which like the Bat Mitzvah, i'm sure she received substantial compensation for. It's just another paycheck :shrug:

One step ahead of ya, babe. :xoxo:

http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showpost.php?p=466812&postcount=112

(And I was talking about Petty in that post you quoted, not Stevie. She's a known whore. :laugh: )

SteveMacD

11-30-2005, 11:49 AM

As I said on another thread:

This is the Queen that Rocks Stevie's world:

http://www.xiangtan.co.uk/fiver.jpg
http://www.xiangtan.co.uk/GBP_10_new.jpg
http://www.xiangtan.co.uk/GBP_20_new.jpg
http://www.xiangtan.co.uk/fiftypounds.jpg
http://www.west-coast-visitors-guide.com.au/discover/images/currency1.jpg
http://www.users.bigpond.com/cruzi/Coins/Gold/2002o.jpg
http://www.monarchyfreecanada.org/images/canada-20dollars-front.gif
http://www.monarchyfreecanada.org/images/coin_elizabeth2_bluenose2.jpg

GardenStateGirlie

11-30-2005, 11:51 AM

One step ahead of ya, babe. :xoxo:

http://ledge.fleetwoodmac.net/showpost.php?p=466812&postcount=112

(And I was tlaking about Petty in that post you quoted, not Stevie. She's a known whore. :laugh: )

Ahhh great minds :xoxo:

dissention

11-30-2005, 11:53 AM

Ahhh great minds :xoxo:

I really think she should just embrace this second source of income all the way and do a show for the North American Clinical Dermatologic Society. I'd get such a kick out of labeling that bootleg CD.

The Tower

11-30-2005, 11:57 AM

Bullshiitte - it is their money. If you want to give your's away - by all means do so. But, the minute you or anyone else tells me what the hell to do with mine is the minute you cross the line. Again, please list your expenses and let us sit in judgement on you. I mean if you get down to it, we all should have one outfit that we wash once a month and we should all live in a 15x15 room with only a cot. I mean why should one person live any better than the other :rolleyes:
I agree with you here.

However, Jason- even you must admit that this whole thing was just a colossal waste of money. No moral judgements or whether or not it was "right" or "wrong", just a simple "wow, that's a lot of money to spend on a party for a 13 year old". If that's what that dude wants to do with the cash he earned, fine- but it's still a colossal waste.

dissention

11-30-2005, 12:00 PM

why should one person live any better than the other :rolleyes:

Good question. Why should they? I'd love to hear your answer to this. Why should others have millions & millions of dollars to waste while others are starving, without homes, and living in abject poverty? That's what capitalism and greed creates, of course, the ability for one to live better than another (even if the poor bastard works harder than the millionaire), but entitlement is a subjective thing and not something that should be argued in a discussion about a rich man spending millions to entertain his child for one night.

cliffdweller

11-30-2005, 12:07 PM

I would do the same if someone said all black people steal. Surely some do, but not all do, which is the stereotype. I hate stereotypes.

Sure, we all do. Only thing is, you're talking about the haves vs. the have nots. I'm more inclined to defend the have nots as opposed to the haves. The haves have it all, they don't need defending. Someone being disparaged because of their race has much more serious consequences than someone being stereotyped because of their extreme wealth. Doesn't this make sense in the most pragmatic of terms? I'm a relativist, I can't make across the board judgements about things that, to me, are like apples and oranges. I don't understand your position at all.

cliffdweller

11-30-2005, 12:22 PM

Absolutely, because it says something to me about their values, and values are important to me. And until today, I had nothing but the highest esteem for Petty's values. As for Stevie--I'm not totally surprised, but I still have an opinion about it. It's not just that it was a private party, but who they played for.

All this talk of values got me to thinking about all the "houses and cars" Stevie sniffed up her nose a la cocaine. Talk about your conspicuous consumption...but that's the rock star life. We don't judge them for it, only rich families who throw exhorbanent (sp?) bat mitzvahs for their daughters :laugh:.

cliffdweller

11-30-2005, 12:48 PM

bitch bitch bitch - that's what I get tired of; like you are somehow so in tune with what's moral or ethical or this or that (not necessarily you personally). I swear. Some of you are worse than the 80yr old ladies sitting on the front row of a Baptist church on Sunday morning criticizing one for wearing Gucci and one for wearing Prada. It just amazes me.

There's nothing wrong with morals and ethics, those who criticize others for having them are usually too lazy to uphold them. I'm not attacking you personally, it's just that I don't think voicing one's ethical opinion is the same as "bitching" about something. The term "bitching" is too dismissive and i don't think that's what the people you are referring to are doing. I think it's good to use ethical judgement, otherwise we would live in a pretty ****ed up world (or at least more of one) wouldn't you agree?

sparky

11-30-2005, 12:48 PM

Contrary to Sparky's statement, I am not a whore.

I am thinking you have a job, right ? And I am thinking you'd probably ditch it in a second for another one that paid twice as much ?:shrug:

dissention

11-30-2005, 12:54 PM

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rj-eskow/set-lists-for-that-rockin_b_11437.html

Set Lists for That Rockin', Rollin', Defense-Contractin' Bat Mitzvah

If I hadn't read it in Lloyd Grove (courtesy the HuffPo) I wouldn't have believed it: We're overpaying our defense contractors so much that David H. Brooks spent $10 million on his daughter's Bat Mitzvah, including performances by Tom Petty, Aerosmith, assorted Eagles, 50 Cent, and Stevie Nicks - despite quality problems with his product.

Col. Ted Westhusing couldn't "grasp the idea that profit is an important goal for people in the private sector," and eventually ended his life. But at the Brooks residence, they're partying on.

In my day, in the frozen wilds of upstate New York, the same broken-down old schlemiel played every Bar and Bat Mitzvah in town. He had an accordion, little bows on his shoes, and a standard line of patter: "And now the Bar Mitzvah boy will dance with his best girl: His Mom." Things change, eh, Mr. Brooks?

But then, we didn't have any defense contractors around - the closest thing we had was this guy named Murray from our Temple, who sold Philco TV sets at his furniture store.

Before we get to my set list recommendations (now sadly late), a few words on where Brooks got his money - two words, in fact: from us. He just got a $30 million order for body armor (better late than never, huh, Mr. Rumsfeld?) [http://www.forbes.com/prnewswire/feeds/prnewswire/2005/11/15/prnewswire200511150730PR_NEWS_B_MAT_NY_NYTU064.html]. Here are his third-quarter results [http://www.forbes.com/prnewswire/feeds/prnewswire/2005/11/03/prnewswire200511031603PR_NEWS_B_MAT_NY_NYTH213.html], and - for further background - here's some info on the class action suit being filed against him by investors who allege he made "false and misleading statements causing artificial inflation in the Company's stock price." [http://www.forbes.com/prnewswire/feeds/prnewswire/2005/11/03/prnewswire200511030927PR_NEWS_B_NET_NE_NETH020.html] We report, you decide.

An update: Tipped off by eagle-eyed commenters (see below), we discovered that Brooks' vests don't provide as much buyer satisfaction as the clothes the 50-year-old mogul wore to his daughter's event - which included, to quote the irrepressible Mr. Grove, "a black-leather, metal-studded suit, accessorized with biker-chic necklace chains and diamonds from Chrome Hearts jewelers, (followed by) a hot-pink suede version of the same lovely outfit."

The Southern States Police Benevolent Association might have appreciated Mr. Brooks' fashion sense, had he been present in Chrome Hearts couture as they settled their lawsuit [http://www.newtimesbpb.com/issues/2005-09-29/news/feature_2.html] with Brooks' company over the inferior quality of the bulletproofing on his vests. In addition, the Army and Marine Corps have recalled more than 18,000 of the vests [http://www.newsday.com/business/ny-bztop4518850nov19,0,5668224.story?coll=ny-business-headlines] -- which didn't stop his $30 million order from proceeding as planned.

Now, as for those set lists. You really should've called us first, Dave. We will rock you. Then, when we're done with that, we will commence to roll you - at no additional cost! We understand where this Bat Mitzvah money came from, as well as how to spend it. So here now, our suggestions. Somebody else might need 'em. Maybe you even have some business associates who plan to hire the same entertainers - you know, like they did in my town with the accordion man?

Aerosmith could kick it off with "Shame on You," seguing into "Shame, Shame, Shame." Once the crowd is on their feet, they could leap into "Jaded," building into "Something's Gotta Give" and climaxing their set with - of course - "Eat the Rich." Stevie Nicks and Tom Petty could do their duet on "Insider," followed by Tom's renditions of "Breakdown," "American Girl," and "Refugee." He could then play these songs, in this order, as a kind of David Brooks rock opera:

- Too Much Ain't Enough
- Fooled Again (I Don't Like It)
- Don't Do Me Like That
- Don't Come Around Here No More
- I Need to Know
- Finding Out
- The Stories We Could Tell
- You and I Will Meet Again

Whattya think, Dave? I'm hoping we can make the rounds of the defense contractor party circuit with this set of bands. On second thought, I'd rather be upstate with the guy who sold TVs. The music might not be as good, but I'd feel a whole lot cleaner.

cliffdweller

11-30-2005, 12:56 PM

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 12:59 PM

Nope.

I have no interest in playing for a 13 year old JAP's. Contrary to Sparky's statement, I am not a whore.

How about $100,000 or a million? At some point you'd do it. If not, then more power to ya, but you would be in a small group of people who could refuse it. I mean if they offered a million, why not. You'd be singing and your life would be way easier an hour later.

Jyqm

11-30-2005, 01:00 PM

All this talk of values got me to thinking about all the "houses and cars" Stevie sniffed up her nose a la cocaine. Talk about your conspicuous consumption...but that's the rock star life. We don't judge them for it, only rich families who throw exhorbanent (sp?) bat mitzvahs for their daughters :laugh:.

I'll gladly judge them for it if you want me to.

Although really, far worse than any rock stars or Mr. Brookses is the culture that glorifies and worships such obscene wealth and the conspicuous spending of it. Those "The Fabulous Life of..." shows on VH1 are just disgusting. It's difficult for me to come up with a lower form of life than the US Weekly and InStyle magazine employees they interview for those types of shows.

sparky

11-30-2005, 01:02 PM

Of course it is :shrug:

I went to Vegas twice this year to see La Nicks. I spent thousands to do so. I paid for many Ledgies who could not live to my lifestyle and I have not one regret. Then again, many are hungry in the world and many in my home town of NOLA have no homes. Do I feel guilty - No. And why - well because I and they and they had a blast. I have no guilt. It is, as Sparky alluded to, the same thing on a smaller scale :shrug:

Of course, I gave far more to charity as I suspect this father did as well :shrug:

Scale, frankly, is everything in this bat mitzvah situation. I know you love to play the devil's advocate, sweet pea, and many people, yourself included are stating or agreeing that the concept of no one needing more than a cot and a hovel puts no one above reproach. That's a bull**** reductive argument and you know it. What I, and most people, find so repugnant about this is the sheer scale and ridiculousness of this event. It illustrates a number of disturbing things about our culture, and the lack of a value system among many people out there. The whole thing is garish and in poor taste. It's not like it's a limo to a prom or an expensive cotillion gown we are talking about.
This thing is a nouveau riche pissing contest that daddy put on to impress his friends (you know old money would never be this gauche:lol: ). I suspect the little princess was bored and giggling with her friends during the sets of everyone except 50 Bulletholes and Ciara. Some rival business partner of this guy must have booked The Who for his kid's bat mitzvah, and Brooks wanted to outdo him. It's all trashy, flashy, and stinky.

cliffdweller

11-30-2005, 01:03 PM

Those "The Fabulous Life of..." shows on VH1 are just disgusting.

I f'ing hate that show. And I also hated that show Cribs on MTV. Those little baby bitches and their bling bling made me want to puke puke :laugh:.

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 01:03 PM

Good question. Why should they? I'd love to hear your answer to this. Why should others have millions & millions of dollars to waste while others are starving, without homes, and living in abject poverty? That's what capitalism and greed creates, of course, the ability for one to live better than another (even if the poor bastard works harder than the millionaire), but entitlement is a subjective thing and not something that should be argued in a discussion about a rich man spending millions to entertain his child for one night.

That is the way the world works and worked since the dawn of civilization :shrug: I think it sucks, but I did not invent it and I try to do my best to help those less fortunate than me. But, at some point, I have to take care of me and I am the only person who can determine that point. I mean I went to like six shows on the last FM tour - it cost me thousands of dollars. Clearly that was that excess that could have fed many a person. Should I have not done that?

BTW - here are some pics from the event

http://tabloidbaby.blogspot.com/2005/11/exclusive-photos-mitzvahpalooza.html

http://tabloidbaby.blogspot.com/2005/11/exclusive-photos-mitzvahpalooza.html

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 01:05 PM

Scale, frankly, is everything in this bat mitzvah situation. I know you love to play the devil's advocate, sweet pea, and many people, yourself included are stating or agreeing that the concept of no one needing more than a cot and a hovel puts no one above reproach. That's a bull**** reductive argument and you know it. What I, and most people, find so repugnant about this is the sheer scale and ridiculousness of this event. It illustrates a number of disturbing things about our culture, and the lack of a value system among many people out there. The whole thing is garish and in poor taste. It's not like it's a limo to a prom or an expensive cotillion gown we are talking about.
This thing is a nouveau riche pissing contest that daddy put on to impress his friends (you know old money would never be this gauche:lol: ). I suspect the little princess was bored and giggling with her friends during the sets of everyone except 50 Bulletholes and Ciara. Some rival business partner of this guy must have booked The Who for his kid's bat mitzvah, and Brooks wanted to outdo him. It's all trashy, flashy, and stinky.

I would never have done an event like this. So, I am not disagreeing with you. I am just noting that we all do stuff like this in our own way. I mean 10 million to this guy is probably like 100 to me.

dissention

11-30-2005, 01:06 PM

That is the way the world works and worked since the dawn of civilization :shrug: I think it sucks, but I did not invent it and I try to do my best to help those less fortunate than me. But, at some point, I have to take care of me and I am the only person who can determine that point. I mean I went to like six shows on the last FM tour - it cost me thousands of dollars. Clearlt that was that excess that could have fed many a person. Should I have not done that?

Blah. Answer my question first.

BTW - here are some pics from the event

http://tabloidbaby.blogspot.com/2005/11/exclusive-photos-mitzvahpalooza.html

http://tabloidbaby.blogspot.com/2005/11/exclusive-photos-mitzvahpalooza.html

No thanks. I'm trying to hold down my wheat bagel.

David

11-30-2005, 01:07 PM

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rj-eskow/set-lists-for-that-rockin_b_11437.html

An update: Tipped off by eagle-eyed commenters (see below), we discovered that Brooks' vests don't provide as much buyer satisfaction as the clothes the 50-year-old mogul wore to his daughter's event - which included, to quote the irrepressible Mr. Grove, "a black-leather, metal-studded suit, accessorized with biker-chic necklace chains and diamonds from Chrome Hearts jewelers, (followed by) a hot-pink suede version of the same lovely outfit."The crime here isn't so much one of reprobate morality as it is bad taste.

dissention

11-30-2005, 01:08 PM

The crime here isn't so much one of reprobate morality as it is bad taste.

He wanted to fit in with the rest of the proceedings, David.

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 01:10 PM

Sure, we all do. Only thing is, you're talking about the haves vs. the have nots. I'm more inclined to defend the have nots as opposed to the haves. The haves have it all, they don't need defending. Someone being disparaged because of their race has much more serious consequences than someone being stereotyped because of their extreme wealth. Doesn't this make sense in the most pragmatic of terms? I'm a relativist, I can't make across the board judgements about things that, to me, are like apples and oranges. I don't understand your position at all.

My position is this - automatic assumptions about anyone based on one factor are just wrong to do and I will not do them. In this case, it is almost like you want to punish or automatically have a negative opinion of someone just because they are rich. How can that be right?

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 01:11 PM

I agree with you here.

However, Jason- even you must admit that this whole thing was just a colossal waste of money. No moral judgements or whether or not it was "right" or "wrong", just a simple "wow, that's a lot of money to spend on a party for a 13 year old". If that's what that dude wants to do with the cash he earned, fine- but it's still a colossal waste.

I would never have thrown this kind of party.

sparky

11-30-2005, 01:11 PM

An update: Tipped off by eagle-eyed commenters (see below), we discovered that Brooks' vests don't provide as much buyer satisfaction as the clothes the 50-year-old mogul wore to his daughter's event - which included, to quote the irrepressible Mr. Grove, "a black-leather, metal-studded suit, accessorized with biker-chic necklace chains and diamonds from Chrome Hearts jewelers, (followed by) a hot-pink suede version of the same lovely outfit."

Didn't the estate of Malcolm Forbes toss out all his old clothes ?

David

11-30-2005, 01:13 PM

Although really, far worse than any rock stars or Mr. Brookses is the culture that glorifies and worships such obscene wealth and the conspicuous spending of it.All the ledgies get very excited & ooh & aah over the latest photo spreads of Stevie's multimillion-dollar mansion. They don't ask in disgust: "Why does a single woman need forty rooms in her manor?"

People do love this & they gape at it.

Imagine the wedding this young person is going to be given! Kowabunga!

dissention

11-30-2005, 01:13 PM

I f'ing hate that show. And I also hated that show Cribs on MTV. Those little baby bitches and their bling bling made me want to puke puke :laugh:.

Just think. Stevie wouldn't perform at the Katrina benefit because she didn't care much for the time limitations, but wave some cash in front of her and she'll fly across the country to sing for a 13 year old girl's glorified party.

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 01:14 PM

Blah. Answer my question first . . . .

I did. There is no justification for it other than it seems to be our nature to have this kind of society. Humans like differences that will cause people to strive to be different which will eventually lead to one thing being perceived as better than another. It has been that way for thousands of years and in every civilization I know about.

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 01:15 PM

Just think. Stevie wouldn't perform at the Katrina benefit because she didn't care much for the time limitations, but wave some cash in front of her and she'll fly across the country to sing for a 13 year old girl's glorified party.

Maybe she had the time then. I mean you know her schedule :shrug:

Also, I thought she did not do the Katrina benefit because it was unknown how the concert would be done, etc.

dissention

11-30-2005, 01:18 PM

Maybe she had the time then. I mean you know her schedule :shrug:

One assumes that she had the time to perform at a benefit if she signed up for it in the first place.

Also, I thought she did not do the Katrina benefit because it was unknown how the concert would be done, etc.

She didn't perform because there was uncertainty about the format and she didn't like having to possibly "wing it" or come up with something a couple of days beforehand. I.e. she didn't like the time restraints. Which is positively absurd.

sparky

11-30-2005, 01:20 PM

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 01:20 PM

One assumes that she had the time to perform at a benefit if she signed up for it in the first place.

Well, no. When she signed up for it, she could have been told, it will be this date and you need to be here on this date. That could have changed, which leads to

She didn't perform because there was uncertainty about the format and she didn't like having to possibly "wing it" or come up with something a couple of days beforehand. I.e. she didn't like the time restraints. Which is positively absurd.

No again. If she wanted or they asked her to have her band there, you are talking about tens of thousands of dollars up front for a whole lot of uncertainty. In the end, I think she thought it was a good idea, but it became to messy for her and she backed out. What's the big deal? You make it sound like she killed Bambi :laugh:

dissention

11-30-2005, 01:21 PM

All this debate and exchange of ideas is fab, but what I am really waiting for is a post from Miss Vicky. I am dying to know if she has ever gone competely hog wild as a pet owner and staged an extravagant, star studded, over the top Rat Mitzvah.

I'm sure she's still recovering from the shock that one of her favorites, Mr. Tom Petty, participated in this tacky event. Give her some time to grieve.

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 01:22 PM

All this debate and exchange of ideas is fab, but what I am really waiting for is a post from Miss Vicky. I am dying to know if she has ever gone competely hog wild as a pet owner and staged an extravagant, star studded, over the top Rat Mitzvah.

BBWWAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!

I have Scottie birthday parties. We all wear tartan (I have a tam) and have cake and ice cream!!!!!!

dissention

11-30-2005, 01:25 PM

Well, no. When she signed up for it, she could have been told, it will be this date and you need to be here on this date. That could have changed, which leads to

The date of the show never changed. None of the other performers had the problems that she did.

No again. If she wanted or they asked her to have her band there, you are talking about tens of thousands of dollars up front for a whole lot of uncertainty. In the end, I think she thought it was a good idea, but it became to messy for her and she backed out. What's the big deal? You make it sound like she killed Bambi :laugh:

I'm simply mystified over the fact that she drops out of a benefit for the victims of Katrina because it may have involved some actual effort, while later jetting off across the country to perform at a party where she's getting the moolah. I'm not surprised because she has as much integrity as Bob Woodward these days, but it's still interesting to me.

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 01:30 PM

. . . I'm simply mystified over the fact that she drops out of a benefit for the victims of Katrina because it may have involved some actual effort, while later jetting off across the country to perform at a party where she's getting the moolah. I'm not surprised because she has as much integrity as Bob Woodward these days, but it's still interesting to me.

Actually, it is more like you cannot resist the need to cut her at every opportunity :wavey:

dissention

11-30-2005, 01:32 PM

All this debate and exchange of ideas is fab, but what I am really waiting for is a post from Miss Vicky. I am dying to know if she has ever gone completely hog wild as a pet owner and staged an extravagant, star studded, over the top Rat Mitzvah.

Ack, I just noticed your new sig. How fitting. ;) I've had that album on repeat ever since I got in my car this morning. "Two Grey Rooms" is my favorite.

dissention

11-30-2005, 01:33 PM

Actually, it is more like you cannot resist the need to cut her at every opportunity :wavey:

Just as you cannot resist the need to defend the wealthy at every opportunity :wavey:

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 01:34 PM

Just as you cannot resist the need to defend the wealthy at every opportunity :wavey:

and when exactly did I defend the wealthy Ms. Spinster?

dissention

11-30-2005, 01:35 PM

and when exactly did I defend the wealthy Ms. Spinster?

:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

The Tower

11-30-2005, 01:41 PM

I am thinking you have a job, right ? And I am thinking you'd probably ditch it in a second for another one that paid twice as much ?:shrug:
Actually, no.

I quit my last job and I was making almost twice as much from that job than my current job. I decided that my personal happiness was much more important than the money. Besides, the job was stressing me out so much that I didn't have time to spend the extra money I was making.

Happiness is always more important than money.

Jyqm

11-30-2005, 01:41 PM

Just as you cannot resist the need to defend the wealthy at every opportunity :wavey:

Well somebody ought to cut them a break, the poor things.

sparky

11-30-2005, 01:42 PM

BBWWAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!

I have Scottie birthday parties. We all wear tartan (I have a tam) and have cake and ice cream!!!!!!

I am picturing a cadre of rats, sporting teeny tiny yarmulkes.

sparky

11-30-2005, 01:46 PM

Actually, no.

I quit my last job and I was making almost twice as much from that job than my current job. I decided that my personal happiness was much more important than the money. Besides, the job was stressing me out so much that I didn't have time to spend the extra money I was making.

Happiness is always more important than money.

Oh, I knew that about your job, just because you had told me before.
All things being equal, I think you'd probably go for the bigger paycheck.
Regardless, my point is that pretty much everyone is for sale. Especially entertainers, and most of the rest of us too, under the right circumstances.

sasja

11-30-2005, 01:47 PM

Bullshiitte - it is their money. If you want to give your's away - by all means do so. But, the minute you or anyone else tells me what the hell to do with mine is the minute you cross the line. Again, please list your expenses and let us sit in judgement on you. I mean if you get down to it, we all should have one outfit that we wash once a month and we should all live in a 15x15 room with only a cot. I mean why should one person live any better than the other :rolleyes:

Yes, indeed, why SHOULD a person live any better than another? Especially ten million times better than another? Or rather: ten million times better than ten million others?

Think about it: If we did spread all the wealth, besides everyone having just the one outfit and one room with a cot, we'd probably all have 20 more outfits in addition, as well as a small house with nice furniture and maybe even a car! :D

Sasja

amber

11-30-2005, 01:51 PM

Oh, I knew that about your job, just because you had told me before.
All things being equal, I think you'd probably go for the bigger paycheck.
Regardless, my point is that pretty much everyone is for sale. Especially entertainers, and most of the rest of us too, under the right circumstances.
I'm for sale right this second. Tell your friends. I need a root canal, and my copay is heinous. :wavey:

ontheEdgeof17

11-30-2005, 01:53 PM

I'm for sale right this second. Tell your friends. I need a root canal, and my copay is heinous. :wavey:

Hrmmm....I do need a belly dancer for New Years.

amber

11-30-2005, 01:55 PM

Hrmmm....I do need a belly dancer for New Years.
:laugh:
I do have a belly....I don't charge as much as stevie, either. :D But, I want a naked girl waiting in the car when i'm done, please. And all the hennessy I can drink. Cause that's how I roll. :laugh:

Rickypt

11-30-2005, 01:56 PM

Rickypt

11-30-2005, 01:58 PM

Also, I thought she did not do the Katrina benefit because it was unknown how the concert would be done, etc.

But she went ahead with playing a party for kids where her opening act was a puppet show? :lol:

To be fair, though, Stevie does a lot of benefits.

The Tower

11-30-2005, 02:02 PM

Ack, I just noticed your new sig. How fitting. ;) I've had that album on repeat ever since I got in my car this morning. "Two Grey Rooms" is my favorite.
"Passion Play" and the title track give me shivergasms...

"Oh, all around the marketplace
The buzzing of the flies
The buzzing and the stinging
Divinely barren
And wickedly wise
The killer nails are ringing

Enter the multitudes
In Exxon blue
In radiation rose
Tragedy...
Now you tell me-
Who you gonna get to do the dirty work
When all the slaves are free?"

I just fukcing love Joni. Just love.

Oh, I knew that about your job, just because you had told me before.
All things being equal, I think you'd probably go for the bigger paycheck.
Regardless, my point is that pretty much everyone is for sale. Especially entertainers, and most of the rest of us too, under the right circumstances.
Yes, all things being equal I would take the money. Alas, situations like that rarely, if ever, have that kind of parity.

Unfortunately, being able to be a working musician with a liveable income is another rare thing. If I could, I would- but it didn't work out. I guess if everyone is for sale I would rather be considered a high class call girl than a whore. In other words, I'm a snob with discriminating tastes.....

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 02:12 PM

. . . To be fair, though, Stevie does a lot of benefits.

she sure does, but Diss can harp only on the bad :rolleyes:

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 02:13 PM

. . . I guess if everyone is for sale I would rather be considered a high class call girl than a whore. In other words, I'm a snob with discriminating tastes.....

Need some pointers :wavey:

cliffdweller

11-30-2005, 02:15 PM

My position is this - automatic assumptions about anyone based on one factor are just wrong to do and I will not do them. In this case, it is almost like you want to punish or automatically have a negative opinion of someone just because they are rich. How can that be right?

No not at all, and that is not what I said. What I'm saying is that I would rather champion someone who, because of an unlevel playing field, is unfairly discriminated against rather than championing someone who OWNS the playing field and for whom descrimination doesn't even really apply, not in the practical sense anyway. Clear as mud? :laugh:

dissention

11-30-2005, 02:16 PM

"Passion Play" and the title track give me shivergasms...

"Oh, all around the marketplace
The buzzing of the flies
The buzzing and the stinging
Divinely barren
And wickedly wise
The killer nails are ringing

Enter the multitudes
In Exxon blue
In radiation rose
Tragedy...
Now you tell me-
Who you gonna get to do the dirty work
When all the slaves are free?"

I just fukcing love Joni. Just love.

Sparks just turned me onto her and she is pretty fantastic. An absolutely stunning voice. I've only got her stuff from Night Ride Home and onward, though. All of which I pilfered from other people.

The Tower

11-30-2005, 02:17 PM

Need some pointers :wavey:
Jeezus, Jason- read my fukcing post!!! I said I wanted to be considered a high class call girl- not a whore....

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 02:17 PM

No not at all, and that is not what I said. What I'm saying is that I would rather champion someone who, because of an unlevel playing field, is unfairly discriminated against rather than championing someone who OWNS the playing field and for whom descrimination doesn't even really apply, not in the practical sense anyway. Clear as mud? :laugh:

Do you think all rich people are bad? Or, can rich people be good?

dissention

11-30-2005, 02:18 PM

rather than championing someone who OWNS the playing field and for whom descrimination doesn't even really apply

Pffft. I take it you did not hear about Oprah's incident at Hermes. :rolleyes: :p

strandinthewind

11-30-2005, 02:19 PM

Jeezus, Jason- read my fukcing post!!! I said I wanted to be considered a high class call girl- not a whore....

Listen Ms. Mazeppa - you better go to Burlesque because you aint high enough for Vaudeville.

You can pull all the stops out
Till they call the cops out
Grind your behind till you're bend.
But you gotta get a gimmick
If you wanna get a hand.
You can sacrifice your sacharo
Working in the back row.
Bump in a dump till you're dead.
Kid you gotta have a gimmick
If you wanna get ahead.
You can uh...You can uh...
You can uh...uh...uh...
That's how Burlesque was born.
So I uh...and I uh...
And I uh...uh...uh...
But I do it with a horn...
Once I was a Schleppa,
Now I'm Miss Mazzeppa,
With my revolution in dance.
You gotta have a gimmick
If you wanna have a chance!

cliffdweller

11-30-2005, 02:22 PM

I'm sure she's still recovering from the shock that one of her favorites, Mr. Tom Petty, participated in this tacky event. Give her some time to grieve.

He's one of my faves too. I can't help but think, though, that he's donating his proceeds to charity or something. But who knows? Also, does anyone else find it a bit odd that Stevie Nicks, Tom Petty, and Don Henley (was Joe Walsh there too? I don't remember, this thread has gotten so long) were all invited? They are all linked to one another musically, personally, etc...makes me wonder if this guy, while he may not be a direct friend of theirs, has some sort of connection to someone who IS a friend of theirs. Because really, who out of the blue invites those particular musicians for his 13 year old daughter? Makes me think that this "little soiree" was really for the dad not the daughter.

wondergirl9847

11-30-2005, 02:25 PM

"Why does a single woman need forty rooms in her manor?"

40 rooms? Who need 40 rooms? I would love to have a home with like...3 maybe 4 at the very most. My bedroom, a media room and an extra guest room or 2.

Stuff...can't take it witcha.

The Tower

11-30-2005, 02:30 PM

Do you think all rich people are bad? Or, can rich people be good?
I think you are mixing apples and oranges, Jason.

I don't think anyone is saying "rich people are bad". The whole point of this tirade is that dude is tacky and gross. You said to me earlier, "I would never throw this kind of party". So, I know that you know the score. I don't see why you cannot just admit that this guy was way over the top and just leave it at that instead of trying to twist people's disgust into some kind of class warfare.

Kelly

11-30-2005, 02:32 PM

I think mostly all of the artists who played this gig are signed with Howard Kauffman. I saw some photos of the party...but none of Tom Petty. Has it been confirmed that he actually played? They showed Aerosmith, 50 Cent, Ciara, Stevie and Don, Kenny G...hmm, maybe some others but I didnt see Petty. I bet big, bad Howard put together this deal with Brooks.

ragandbone

11-30-2005, 02:33 PM

Sparks just turned me onto her and she is pretty fantastic. An absolutely stunning voice. I've only got her stuff from Night Ride Home and onward, though. All of which I pilfered from other people. More Joni, although the "velvet curtain calls" she was talking about were not children's parties:

I slept last night in a good hotel
I went shopping today for jewels
The wind rushed around in the dirty town
And the children let out from the schools
I was standing on a noisy corner
Waiting for the walking green
Across the street he stood
And he played real good
On his clarinet, for free.

Now me I play for fortune
And those velvet curtain calls
I've got a black limousine
And two gentlemen
Escorting me to the halls
And I play if you have the money
Or if you're a friend to me
But the one man band
By the quick lunch stand
He was playing real good, for free.

Nobody stopped to hear him
Though he played so sweet and high
They knew he had never
Been on their T.V.
So they passed his music by
I meant to go over and ask for a song
Maybe put on a harmony...
I heard his refrain
As the signal changed
He was playing real good, for free.

REAL GOOD FOR FREE
Joni Mitchell