The Skeleton Pic

[Rumour0323]

Ok Kids...here it is...I have one more of it. These pics are giving me a fit, so it may be tomorrow before I have the rest of them up, but I wanted to see if we could get started with this one.



http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a56/Scurry0829/IMG_0254.jpg


Ok I got the second one loaded so here it is as well:

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a56/Scurry0829/IMG_0258.jpg

Last one:

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a56/Scurry0829/IMG_0256.jpg

[MacMan]

Oh cool! But yeah - very bizarre... But I like it!

[DeeGeMe]

Can I just say that this thing freaked me out at the Charlotte show? I'm sure it has some meaning to Stevie but damn, it's creepy!

[Songbird4]

That picture gives me nightmares. And it is freaky how it gets closer and closer on the video screen. Gives me the chills just looking at it. :(

~Kim

[Nightbirdjel]

That's it? That's what ya'll are freaking out on?? :laugh: The first thing I thought of when I saw it was Grandpa Simpson saying, "DEATH...stalks you at every turn!" :sorry:

[gldstwmn]

It almost looks like a Tarot card.

[David]

It looks like something by Sulamith Wulfing.

Does anyone know that artist's work very well? Can you identify it?

[CreepingDeath]

It almost looks like a Tarot card.

That's what I was thinking.

Hmmm. I'm going to have give this one some thought before posting an interpretation.

[storms2]

Good pic, but very creepy! :eek: Does anyone know who the artist is? I looked at Sulamith's work and could not find this particular picture..ummm

[Stephanie]

oh my--I was so focused on stevie i didn't even notice that!

[Mokona]

Me too - I was watching her the whole time and missed it. Asleep at the wheel again...

Sometimes I think I'll never catch up on all of this Stevie stuff!

[jkmaletic]

IMO and from some quotes I have read from Stevie...The song is about a drug dealer (Skeleton) that supplies the angelic saint-like woman (Young Stevie) with all her dillusions. In the picture the skeleton is obviously scary to us...but to the infected Angel...he is her lover, her master, her Sorcerer.

[Livia]

IMO and from some quotes I have read from Stevie...The song is about a drug dealer (Skeleton) that supplies the angelic saint-like woman (Young Stevie) with all her dillusions. In the picture the skeleton is obviously scary to us...but to the infected Angel...he is her lover, her master, her Sorcerer.

I'll go w/ that! :nod: My first impression was similar - a beautiful woman w/ death looming over her shoulder...man and woman on a star stream...in the middle of a snow dream...

Not that the skeleton is the "man," that would be LB...but that lyric is important in the grand scheme of the song...two innocents who could have easily chosen the wrong path or ended up dead.

[darklinensuit]

Are we sure it's not just another of Stevie's exes? Looks the part. :shrug:

- Jake

[Livia]

Did she date the Crypt Keeper?

[glitter_fades]

At first glance it appears kinda creepy, especially the skeleton.

So that's what you'll look like after 40 years on ice? :]

After studying it a few minutes it's quite beautiful. I like it. :nod:

[stars]

I think it is beautiful too. Someone please tell me who the artist is, or the name of the picture. Something.....

[paperflowers]

IMO and from some quotes I have read from Stevie...The song is about a drug dealer (Skeleton) that supplies the angelic saint-like woman (Young Stevie) with all her dillusions. In the picture the skeleton is obviously scary to us...but to the infected Angel...he is her lover, her master, her Sorcerer.

ITA... Stevie said something like "figure it out" when introducing this song later during her performance she pantomimed cocaine lines with her hands.

IMO the sorcerer is either cocaine itself or a drug dealer. Sorcerer, who is the master could be taken like she is asking if she is indeed in control of her life or does cocaine control her. Sorcerer, who is the master? Or Sorcerer, who is the master. As if she is acknowledging the power cocaine holds over her, or identifying Sorcerer as the master.

man and woman on a star stream=Stevie and Lindsey heading to stardom

In the middle of a snow dream= cocaine


I think the skeletal figure in the picture represents (to her) either the dealer or cocaine.

It's a beautiful picture do you think Stevie herself maybe the artist?

[GarboSpeaks!]

Ummm, yea, isn't his real name Mick Fleetwood? Tall, lanky, boney? Fits the bill. =0p

[darklinensuit]

I think it is beautiful too. Someone please tell me who the artist is, or the name of the picture. Something.....

Just wanted to welcome you. :wavey: (Welcome Wagon Smilie)

- Jake

[LiquidBlue5000]

IMO and from some quotes I have read from Stevie...The song is about a drug dealer (Skeleton) that supplies the angelic saint-like woman (Young Stevie) with all her dillusions. In the picture the skeleton is obviously scary to us...but to the infected Angel...he is her lover, her master, her Sorcerer.

totally... but i think the skeleton represents the drug or drugs themselves... not so much the dealer... i think it's symbolic... either way, it's an evil force over the young impressionable Stevie....

[Kelly]

Good pic, but very creepy! :eek: Does anyone know who the artist is? I looked at Sulamith's work and could not find this particular picture..ummm

Ok, I spit my coffee out from the sig line. : > )

I thought of Sulamith weeks ago and searched her. I could not find any creepy skeleton paintings that SHE did.

Suz..you rock Sweetie. Uh, upon closer inspection it looks like the woman is digging the skeleton. She is holding his hand too. Oh my.

[Kelly]

At first glance it appears kinda creepy, especially the skeleton.

So that's what you'll look like after 40 years on ice? :]

After studying it a few minutes it's quite beautiful. I like it. :nod:

Bwhhhhaaaaaaaa! Yup.
The idea that the song Sorcerer is about cocaine is crazy to me. She wrote the song in 74, she said in Vegas she wrote it at the same time she wrote Rhiannon and Landslide. (oh, yea that someone had just reminded her of that fact the nihgt before). The cocaine problem and certainly the freaking dealer himself did not become a problem in her life until she joined FM and needed the energy.
The "master" in Sorcerer is not a drug dealer..she said "think about it" in Vegas and was very sexual during the song. Stevie is the lady from the mountain...who thought she was talented? Who moved to LA with her and uh, became her master?

[ontheEdgeof17]

Did she date the Crypt Keeper?


I think around '88. They wrote "Skeleton Angel" together but it never made the cut. :cool:

[gldstwmn]

IMO and from some quotes I have read from Stevie...The song is about a drug dealer (Skeleton) that supplies the angelic saint-like woman (Young Stevie) with all her dillusions. In the picture the skeleton is obviously scary to us...but to the infected Angel...he is her lover, her master, her Sorcerer.

Interesting. So this is what is on the screen when she is singing Sorcerer? I would dare say maybe it's something she had drawn but the style is definitely not hers.

[gldstwmn]

So that's what you'll look like after 40 years on ice? :]



Insert bad Walt Disney joke here. :laugh:

[wondergirl9847]

I'm with you, but maybe she was writing about people she knew who were on it? :shrug: I don't see how it pertained to her because I didn't think she started using drugs until they joined FM, like you said.

[pattymarkle]

I think that it is by Sulamith Wülfing. I followed some links through the Nicks Fix and found that in addition to her art, cards, calendars and other stuff, they have issued "Wisdom Cards", which is just a nicer name for Tarot cards. They have "Mother's Wisdom", "Lovers Oracle Wisdom", "Fairy Oracle Wisdom", and "Angel Oracle Wisdom".

Try not to be creeped out.

Patty

[catinthedark]

Bwhhhhaaaaaaaa! Yup.
The idea that the song Sorcerer is about cocaine is crazy to me. She wrote the song in 74, she said in Vegas she wrote it at the same time she wrote Rhiannon and Landslide. (oh, yea that someone had just reminded her of that fact the nihgt before). The cocaine problem and certainly the freaking dealer himself did not become a problem in her life until she joined FM and needed the energy.
The "master" in Sorcerer is not a drug dealer..she said "think about it" in Vegas and was very sexual during the song. Stevie is the lady from the mountain...who thought she was talented? Who moved to LA with her and uh, became her master?

I'm with Kelly on this one. Though the coke theory is a good one, and lots of the words work, the timeline doesn't add up. I also think the master is likely Lindsey (and no, I don't think every song she ever wrote is about him :) ), but I think the master could also be the desire to be a star. Their quest to make it as singers made them poor and hungry and tired. She has spoken in the past about how exhausting it was, how she became sick; it's why her parents wanted her to quit and go back to school. Just a thought. Not sure about this one myself.

But, man, that skeleton is plenty weird. Oh, and just out of curiosity, how does someone pantomime coke lines with their hands? I was trying to envision this - was she using a little imaginary razor? Pretending to snort? I'm sorry I missed this - can someone describe? :laugh:

[pattymarkle]

But, man, that skeleton is plenty weird. Oh, and just out of curiosity, how does someone pantomime coke lines with their hands? I was trying to envision this - was she using a little imaginary razor? Pretending to snort? I'm sorry I missed this - can someone describe? :laugh:

In Vegas it looked like she was cutting coke with her hands. Maybe this is more the imagination of those watching than her actual actions, but it looked like she was using one hand to hold the coke and then her other hand to cut it, like chopping it up and then drawing out lines, chopping it up a little more, drawing the line again with a little imaginary razor blade. This was during the song Sorcerer.

"I'm tired"
"I'm thirsty"
"I'm wild eyed -
in my misery"

"In the middle of a snow dream"

Yep - that sounds like coke. Just based on what I've heard from others of course. :nod:

Patty

[Ghosty]

I think that it is by Sulamith Wülfing. I followed some links through the Nicks Fix and found that in addition to her art, cards, calendars and other stuff, they have issued "Wisdom Cards", which is just a nicer name for Tarot cards. They have "Mother's Wisdom", "Lovers Oracle Wisdom", "Fairy Oracle Wisdom", and "Angel Oracle Wisdom".

Try not to be creeped out.

Patty


I have the Mother's Wisdom cards and they are not like tarot at all. They have a Sulamith pic on one side, and then on the other side have an inspiring quote or saying pertaining to motherhood. They are really nice, but nothing like tarot.

I have the Faery cards too and they are beautiful. Same kind of thing - a pic on one side and a saying on the other. I had gotten a calendar when I was in high school that had the most beautiful pictures on it I had ever seen.....come to find out, it was Sulamith...and come to find out, Stevie likes her too. Now it's so cool they have been coming out with a lot of her artwork again. There was quite a dry spell for a while.

These cards are ones you could give to anyone for a gift. I mean, even if they are very anti-tarot, very Christian or whatever....these card packs are just lovely artwork with inspirational sayings. If no one has gotten any, go for it. They are beautiful.

[Ghosty]

Skeletons represent mortality and immortality at the same time. That could be a heavy meaning pertaining to fame, becoming a living legend, etc.

Death represents change. Often one part of your life ending, but at the same time, a new rebirth will be emerging.

But this picture also reminded me of the saying "dancing with death".

Oh, so multi-layered.....that Stevie! ;)

Now knowing it was shown during Sorcerer, that is pretty neat too, and brings up even more thoughts....the coke, the things you have to go through and give up to become famous, etc. etc. It could mean so many things. I wonder if Stevie had just one thought in mind, or like all of us, has a few about the pic.

[Rumour0323]

Bwhhhhaaaaaaaa! Yup.
The idea that the song Sorcerer is about cocaine is crazy to me. She wrote the song in 74, she said in Vegas she wrote it at the same time she wrote Rhiannon and Landslide. (oh, yea that someone had just reminded her of that fact the nihgt before). The cocaine problem and certainly the freaking dealer himself did not become a problem in her life until she joined FM and needed the energy.
The "master" in Sorcerer is not a drug dealer..she said "think about it" in Vegas and was very sexual during the song. Stevie is the lady from the mountain...who thought she was talented? Who moved to LA with her and uh, became her master?


I agree I don't think the song is about cocaine at all....and I agree with glitter, that upon further inspection the picture is quite beautiful. I would love to see it closer to see more of the detail. The thing that strikes me the most is that the young woman is not afraid, she accomodates him, supports him even, and reaches back with her hand to emphasis this. The images are striking in their contrasting nature and the fact that she leaves it up there for the entire length of the song, harkens back to her missive in Vegas to..."Take from these words what you will...but ah....think about it!"

Some have said this is the new sex song....sounds logical to me. It could be about the time when they first came to LA. She talks about that time as being, crazy and scary and SEXY. Young women didn't live with their boyfriends in 1971, not ones from upper class families anyway, OR young men for that matter. I can just imagine that coversation....so to be young and in love and living together....must have been pretty heady stuff. Not to say either of them were virgins or anything but, .....all of that, coupled with the pursuit of fame..."Man and Woman on a star stream..." The "I'm tired, thirsty, I need you badly" lines always make me think of when she talked about coming home from work exhausted and having to step over bodies...and Bob Aguirre mentions that Lindsey would fall asleep with his guitar in his hands, his fingers still in the position of the last chord he was playing, only to wake back up and continue playing....talk about intense...I don't think Stevie was ...well let's just say....she needed him badly :p As for the motion she makes with her hands....it looks to me like she is making an X in her hand, which to me meant that he has me in the palm of his hand....he is the master.....the sorcerer. :nod:

[Kelly]

I agree I don't think the song is about cocaine at all....and I agree with glitter, that upon further inspection the picture is quite beautiful. I would love to see it closer to see more of the detail. The thing that strikes me the most is that the young woman is not afraid, she accomodates him, supports him even, and reaches back with her hand to emphasis this. The images are striking in their contrasting nature and the fact that she leaves it up there for the entire length of the song, harkens back to her missive in Vegas to..."Take from these words what you will...but ah....think about it!"

Some have said this is the new sex song....sounds logical to me. It could be about the time when they first came to LA. She talks about that time as being, crazy and scary and SEXY. Young women didn't live with their boyfriends in 1971, not ones from upper class families anyway, OR young men for that matter. I can just imagine that coversation....so to be young and in love and living together....must have been pretty heady stuff. Not to say either of them were virgins or anything but, .....all of that, coupled with the pursuit of fame..."Man and Woman on a star stream..." The "I'm tired, thirsty, I need you badly" lines always make me think of when she talked about coming home from work exhausted and having to step over bodies...and Bob Aguirre mentions that Lindsey would fall asleep with his guitar in his hands, his fingers still in the position of the last chord he was playing, only to wake back up and continue playing....talk about intense...I don't think Stevie was ...well let's just say....she needed him badly :p As for the motion she makes with her hands....it looks to me like she is making an X in her hand, which to me meant that he has me in the palm of his hand....he is the master.....the sorcerer. :nod:

Or he is the "Ayatollah".

: > )

For those that think it is a SW...search her. I have not found this to be one of her works.

The words to Sorcerer are powerful, meaningful and sexy...yea Coke is powerful, it could even be sexy but Stevie would not romanticize cocaine addiction like the song suggests. I seriously do not think the allure of cocaine is the message Stevie is trying to send while performing Sorcerer. She is being pretty blatant...I guess she needs to just spit it out.

[jwd]

I agree the picture is creepy, but what's scarier to me is the meaning behind it. I do think it represents cocaine or drug addiction. The beautiful woman flirting with disaster/death. She has an almost euphoric look on her face but blinded that these "highs" could ultimatley lead to her demise.

On a sidenote, I really have to give credit to Stevie and Waddy for making this show one of her best, if not THE BEST. Her vocals and the bands' outstanding playing, interwoven with the imageries, capture the songs perfectly. :cool:

[glitter_fades]

The song has nothing to do with drugs. Why would the image? I doubt it.

I agree this is an interesting notion.

The beautiful woman flirting with disaster/death.

[Rumour0323]

Or he is the "Ayatollah".


Oh Kel....you crack me up :laugh:

Ok.... well then, how about this .....maybe the woman flirting with disaster/death is trying to get a message thru to the Sorcerer :shrug:

[jwd]

The song has nothing to do with drugs.

I disagree. I do agree the song is not about drugs per se, but they were an integral part of the "high life" Stevie was writing about in the song. "Sorcerer" is a song Stevie wrote about when she and Lindsey first moved to L.A. While they were not into the scene at the time, they were witnessing those around them that were(in the middle of a star stream). Although Stevie believed it was a magical, fun, and beautiful place, she had enough foresight to understand where that road could lead(the black ink darkness). The "master" refers to who or what is controlling your life. Is it you or you think it's you, or some other force taking over. "Sorcerer" is an expressive song about the glitz, the glamour, and the GLOOM of the "Hollywood" lifestyle. That's what the song represents to me. Of course it's open to interpretation, as so many of Stevie's songs are.

[glitter_fades]

I disagree. I do agree the song is not about drugs per se, but they were an integral part of the "high life" Stevie was writing about in the song. "Sorcerer" is a song Stevie wrote about when she and Lindsey first moved to L.A. While they were not into the scene at the time, they were witnessing those around them that were(in the middle of a star stream). Although Stevie believed it was a magical, fun, and beautiful place, she had enough foresight to understand where that road could lead(the black ink darkness). The "master" refers to who or what is controlling your life. Is it you or you think it's you, or some other force taking over. "Sorcerer" is an expressive song about the glitz, the glamour, and the GLOOM of the "Hollywood" lifestyle. That's what the song represents to me. Of course it's open to interpretation, as so many of Stevie's songs are.

Maybe "nothing" was too strong a word. Sorcerer might touch a bit on drugs, like any aspect of the lifestyle at that time. I should have said, I don't think the ravages of cocaine is the point of the song, nor is it the point of the imagery projected by the background picture. JMHO.

:wavey:

[Serrart]

I like it, a bit didascalic maybe but nice.

Romy

[Serrart]

ITA... Stevie said something like "figure it out" when introducing this song later during her performance she pantomimed cocaine lines with her hands.

IMO the sorcerer is either cocaine itself or a drug dealer. Sorcerer, who is the master could be taken like she is asking if she is indeed in control of her life or does cocaine control her. Sorcerer, who is the master? Or Sorcerer, who is the master. As if she is acknowledging the power cocaine holds over her, or identifying Sorcerer as the master.

man and woman on a star stream=Stevie and Lindsey heading to stardom

In the middle of a snow dream= cocaine


I think the skeletal figure in the picture represents (to her) either the dealer or cocaine.

It's a beautiful picture do you think Stevie herself maybe the artist?

I don't think Sorcerer is centered on cocaine or that the skeleton is linked to drugs. I just see it as the other part of us we don't see reflected in the mirror.

Romy

[gldstwmn]

Bwhhhhaaaaaaaa! Yup.
The idea that the song Sorcerer is about cocaine is crazy to me. She wrote the song in 74, she said in Vegas she wrote it at the same time she wrote Rhiannon and Landslide. (oh, yea that someone had just reminded her of that fact the nihgt before). The cocaine problem and certainly the freaking dealer himself did not become a problem in her life until she joined FM and needed the energy.


Are you kidding me? You don't really believe that, do you? Do you think there wasn't a huge amount of cocaine floating around in Aspen, CO in 1974? Snow covered hills, indeed. :nod: I never believed that Stevie was this drug virgin until Fleetwood Mac came along and corrupted her. It sure makes good copy and is probably a plausible explanation for her family's sake. :shrug:

EDIT: Didn't mean for this to sound as confrontational as it did.

[gldstwmn]

I think that it is by Sulamith Wülfing. I followed some links through the Nicks Fix and found that in addition to her art, cards, calendars and other stuff, they have issued "Wisdom Cards", which is just a nicer name for Tarot cards. They have "Mother's Wisdom", "Lovers Oracle Wisdom", "Fairy Oracle Wisdom", and "Angel Oracle Wisdom".

Try not to be creeped out.

Patty

It doesn't creep me out at all. :)

[David]

I disagree. I do agree the song is not about drugs per se, but they were an integral part of the "high life" Stevie was writing about in the song. "Sorcerer" is a song Stevie wrote about when she and Lindsey first moved to L.A.Plus, Stevie went to Arcadia High School in the mid 1960s -- that's L.A. & lemme tell ya ... I went to Arcadia High School & that campus was always Drug City.

[catinthedark]

Are you kidding me? You don't really believe that, do you? Do you think there wasn't a huge amount of cocaine floating around in Aspen, CO in 1974? Snow covered hills, indeed. :nod: I never believed that Stevie was this drug virgin until Fleetwood Mac came along and corrupted her.

Call me ignorant, but I always believed that. About both her and Lindsey. I'm sure they smoked pot, like everybody and their brother. But they hardly had money for food - where would they have gotten money for coke? They were struggling, their friends whose houses they were sleeping in were struggling. I don't think they got into the whole coke scene until they hit it big with FM. JMO.

[gldstwmn]

Call me ignorant, but I always believed that. About both her and Lindsey. I'm sure they smoked pot, like everybody and their brother. But they hardly had money for food - where would they have gotten money for coke? They were struggling, their friends whose houses they were sleeping in were struggling. I don't think they got into the whole coke scene until they hit it big with FM. JMO.
Well, they smoked plenty of hash. Where'd they get the money for that?
I don't think you're ignorant for your point of view. I don't know how old you are. But if you were old enough to remember the 70's coke was considered a very hip thing to do. Stevie was a hot chic staying at someone's house in Aspen while Lindsey was on tour. You didn't necessarily have to buy it. And in a town like Aspen or LA, it was everywhere, just as common as aspirin.

[paperflowers]

In Vegas it looked like she was cutting coke with her hands. Maybe this is more the imagination of those watching than her actual actions, but it looked like she was using one hand to hold the coke and then her other hand to cut it, like chopping it up and then drawing out lines, chopping it up a little more, drawing the line again with a little imaginary razor blade. This was during the song Sorcerer.

"I'm tired"
"I'm thirsty"
"I'm wild eyed -
in my misery"

"In the middle of a snow dream"

Yep - that sounds like coke. Just based on what I've heard from others of course. :nod:

Patty

Thanks for recounting the cocaine reference for me, Patty :xoxo:
A cocaine habit didn't exist until after she joined FM and she could afford it, nevertheless that does not mean she hadn't been exposed to it at all or hadn't had occasion to try it.


If she was referring to Lindsey as the “master” at the time she wrote the song, I don’t think she would use a skeletal creepy grim reaper seducer to represent him now.
Although I agree that the time line doesn't fit with what she has said, taking the concert image, lyrics and the Vegas thing into consideration, I think she is talking about cocaine and how she was seduced by the sexy lifestyle she associated with it.

[catinthedark]

But if you were old enough to remember the 70's coke was considered a very hip thing to do. Stevie was a hot chic staying at someone's house in Aspen while Lindsey was on tour. You didn't necessarily have to buy it. And in a town like Aspen or LA, it was everywhere, just as common as aspirin.

Good point. I wasn't old enough in the 70s to be aware, and so I'm not familiar with what the scene in Aspen would have been like. True enough that they could have been exposed to it. I guess her crazy huge habit wouldn't have begun until the FM years, though. Hmm.. maybe the song is actually about... wait for it... more than one person and one event! :laugh: A combination of Lindsey, and the whole music scene, and their intro to coke. A Stevie song? About a few different things all merged together? No waaaaay!! :)

[paperflowers]

Good point. I wasn't old enough in the 70s to be aware, and so I'm not familiar with what the scene in Aspen would have been like. True enough that they could have been exposed to it. I guess her crazy huge habit wouldn't have begun until the FM years, though. Hmm.. maybe the song is actually about... wait for it... more than one person and one event! :laugh: A combination of Lindsey, and the whole music scene, and their intro to coke. A Stevie song? About a few different things all merged together? No waaaaay!! :)
;) right on

[lagringader&r]

Cool pic! Not creepy to me. I like that it commands your attention.

[Kelly]

Lori, I never said that STEVIE used a skeleton image to represent Lindsey. Stevie did not draw that photo.

As for the coke...now when she looks back on the situation, yes, cocaine played a part in the destruction of their relationship. The things they sacrificed for fame are more her point I think. How could cocaine possibly be the "master" in the song when she said she first tried coke on the Today show in 1975?

[Johnny Stew]

How could cocaine possibly be the "master" in the song when she said she first tried coke on the Today show in 1975?She also hadn't given up love for fame and fortune when she wrote "Rose Garden" at 16 years old.
And she hadn't yet experienced a downturn in her fame when she wrote "After The Glitter Fades." Heck, she wasn't even famous yet when she wrote it (1973).

I think some of those songs had more to do with Stevie imagining what life might be like down the road if she followed certain paths, rather than being directly connected to something she was experiencing at that very moment in time.

[darklinensuit]

She also hadn't given up love for fame and fortune when she wrote "Rose Garden" at 16 years old.
And she hadn't yet experienced a downturn in her fame when she wrote "After The Glitter Fades." Heck, she wasn't even famous yet when she wrote it (1973).

I think some of those songs had more to do with Stevie imagining what life might be like down the road if she followed certain paths, rather than being directly connected to something she was experiencing at that very moment in time.

As usual, I agree.

BTW, earlier Saturday I tried to search out the source of the pic but came up empty. I kept searching under Death & The maiden - a common enough theme in art with plenty on the net - but didn't find this one.

- Jake

[tynan88]

Is it possible that this is a Stevie's own artwork?

[paperflowers]

Lori, I never said that STEVIE used a skeleton image to represent Lindsey. Stevie did not draw that photo.

As for the coke...now when she looks back on the situation, yes, cocaine played a part in the destruction of their relationship. The things they sacrificed for fame are more her point I think. How could cocaine possibly be the "master" in the song when she said she first tried coke on the Today show in 1975?

Kelly, I'm not saying you did. What I'm saying is how does this picture fit with your theory of Lindsey being the "master" or “sorcerer”? I understand and agree with you that Lindsey is a part of the song. I think though that he is also an innocent caught up in the snow dream/star stream. Now, I’m not saying that Lindsey had a drug issue anywhere near Stevie’s (his drug of choice in my opinion were not the same as her. His addictions were never the monkey on his back, like her) but he was also involved to the same crazy sexy glamorous lifestyle when she wrote the song. IMO she was enamored and involved (if only on the periphery) with the cocaine lifestyle of the 70’s prior to joining FM. I don’t think she is trying to glamorize cocaine now, but at the time it was glamour to her.
With everything taken into consideration the picture, the lyrics and her own statements it all adds up to cocaine more than with anything else.
I also think JohnnyStew is right when he says she put herself into other people shoes or imagine what it would be like to be in certain situations. Maybe she saw the writting on the wall all those many years ago, we all know about Stevie and crystal visions.

[darklinensuit]

Is it possible that this is a Stevie's own artwork?

I really don't think it fits the style of her other creations, at least the ones she has made public. Usually she uses long flowing colors radiating, huge eyes, etc.

- Jake

[paperflowers]

I really don't think it fits the style of her other creations, at least the ones she has made public. Usually she uses long flowing colors radiating, huge eyes, etc.

- Jake
Ur prolly right :) I wonder this also. The girl reminds me of Stevie's Rhiannon http://inherownwords.com/paintrh.htm

[darklinensuit]

Ur prolly right :) I wonder this also. The girl reminds me of Stevie's Rhiannon http://inherownwords.com/paintrh.htm

That's certainly the most famous Stevie painting, but I don't see a similarity of style at all between it & the Death & The Maiden one. :shrug: Like I said, the use of color, the proportions, the clothes, the eyes, the lines...not to mention I don't recall any themes as dark as the Death Spectre in any of Stevie's drawings or paintings. I'm sure somebody will correct me if I've forgotten or missed some dark creative visual of Stevie's.

- Jake

[GardenStateGirlie]

I don't think the painting is by an artist that's well known. At first, I thought it was reminescent of a painting I remembered in art history (and it may be) -- the woman is slumped over with a skeleton on her back, whispering in her ear (I thought it was Gustav Klimt but I can't remember). I don't think this is by anyone famous in the art world -- JMO.

[Ghosty]

She also hadn't given up love for fame and fortune when she wrote "Rose Garden" at 16 years old.
And she hadn't yet experienced a downturn in her fame when she wrote "After The Glitter Fades." Heck, she wasn't even famous yet when she wrote it (1973).

I think some of those songs had more to do with Stevie imagining what life might be like down the road if she followed certain paths, rather than being directly connected to something she was experiencing at that very moment in time.


I think so too.

When did she write Sorcerer? I thought I heard her say she wrote it after posing for the BuckinghamNicks album cover, and being in that atmosphere with the photographer and coked-out skinny models, and her having to pose nude even though she didn't want to. But yet if she sang Sorcerer with Fritz, then it must have been written before that...?? But I do recall her saying she wrote a song or two after the Buckingham Nicks photo session....anyone else rememeber that?

[gldstwmn]

Thanks for recounting the cocaine reference for me, Patty :xoxo:
A cocaine habit didn't exist until after she joined FM and she could afford it, nevertheless that does not mean she hadn't been exposed to it at all or hadn't had occasion to try it.


Hence the lyric, Come over, let me put you on ice. ;)

[gldstwmn]

Lori, I never said that STEVIE used a skeleton image to represent Lindsey. Stevie did not draw that photo.

As for the coke...now when she looks back on the situation, yes, cocaine played a part in the destruction of their relationship. The things they sacrificed for fame are more her point I think. How could cocaine possibly be the "master" in the song when she said she first tried coke on the Today show in 1975?

She also said she stopped using it after the Red Rocks show and said she went into Betty Ford for alcohol abuse. :shrug:

[gldstwmn]

Is it possible that this is a Stevie's own artwork?

It's not her style of drawing, IMO. But I don't know for certain.

[Johnny Stew]

When did she write Sorcerer? I thought I heard her say she wrote it after posing for the BuckinghamNicks album cover, and being in that atmosphere with the photographer and coked-out skinny models, and her having to pose nude even though she didn't want to. But yet if she sang Sorcerer with Fritz, then it must have been written before that...?? But I do recall her saying she wrote a song or two after the Buckingham Nicks photo session....anyone else rememeber that?I believe it's "Garbo" you're thinking of. When she'd perform it on the 'Enchanted' tour, she'd often tell the story (or maybe she told it everytime) that she wrote it right after the 'Buckingham Nicks' photo shoot, as she imagined how all of the Old Hollywood actresses must have felt when they had to compromise their standards in order to play the game. (I'm paraphrasing.)

[Arhiann]

Hello - new to the board -- I missed the skeleton pictures at the shows - when I saw them posted here my first thought was Rhiannon and the Dark Lord of Death... from Walton's Mabinogion. Then I saw that the pic was up during "Sorcerer." I don't know when "Sorcerer" was written exactly, and it might have been too early to form this tie.(?)

[amber]

Hello - new to the board -- I missed the skeleton pictures at the shows - when I saw them posted here my first thought was Rhiannon and the Dark Lord of Death... from Walton's Mabinogion. Then I saw that the pic was up during "Sorcerer." I don't know when "Sorcerer" was written exactly, and it might have been too early to form this tie.(?)
Welcome!! :wavey: Like your name. Hope you have fun. :)

[SapphireSister]

Just because she has the skeleton pic in the background during Sorcerer it doesn't mean there is a direct link to her interpretation of the picture and what Sorcerer is about. Stevie is an artists and she has always had an interesting way with the juxtaposition of different themes and concepts in her expressions. I do not believe Sorcerer is about drugs in any way but that's neither here nor there. I think it was pre-addiction and not something she was in the habit of writing about during that period of her life. Besides, art is all about interpretation. We really have no idea what this pic means to Stevie and everything that we are saying here is purely conjecture. Just my 2 cents.

[lagringader&r]

Just because she has the skeleton pic in the background during Sorcerer it doesn't mean there is a direct link to her interpretation of the picture and what Sorcerer is about. Stevie is an artists and she has always had an interesting way with the juxtaposition of different themes and concepts in her expressions. I do not believe Sorcerer is about drugs in any way but that's neither here nor there. I think it was pre-addiction and not something she was in the habit of writing about during that period of her life. Besides, art is all about interpretation. We really have no idea what this pic means to Stevie and everything that we are saying here is purely conjecture. Just my 2 cents.

I agree with your 2 cents. I don't think Stevie was into drugs at that time. I definitely don't think Sorcerer is about coke or any reference to it. If there was some *indirect* reference at all, it would be to what she was seeing around her in terms of drugs, but I don't think she indulged at that time.

As for the skeleton pic, Stevie likes dramatic imagery. Like she was inspired to write BATB from the imagery and the concept of the movie. BATB wasn't about the movie, but was inspired partially by it. So, I agree that when Stevie was looking, she liked the imagery and it made her feel a certain way but has nothing to do with what Sorcerer is about.

[darklinensuit]

I don't think the painting is by an artist that's well known. At first, I thought it was reminescent of a painting I remembered in art history (and it may be) -- .

Actually, several.

- Jake

[darklinensuit]

But I do recall her saying she wrote a song or two after the Buckingham Nicks photo session....anyone else rememeber that?

Yeah, and Garbo.
Really, the woman should be going around topless more often. Her freebirds are effective songwriting muses.

- Jake

[darklinensuit]

She also said she stopped using it after the Red Rocks show and said she went into Betty Ford for alcohol abuse. :shrug:

I thought she said she stopped using it for performances after the RR show, that RR was the last time she was coked onstage. (ABC Downtown interview.)Due to her careful wording I've never thought she stopped cold turkey after that show.

- Jake

[darklinensuit]

I agree with your 2 cents. I don't think Stevie was into drugs at that time. I definitely don't think Sorcerer is about coke or any reference to it. If there was some *indirect* reference at all, it would be to what she was seeing around her in terms of drugs, but I don't think she indulged at that time.

As for the skeleton pic, Stevie likes dramatic imagery. Like she was inspired to write BATB from the imagery and the concept of the movie. BATB wasn't about the movie, but was inspired partially by it. So, I agree that when Stevie was looking, she liked the imagery and it made her feel a certain way but has nothing to do with what Sorcerer is about.

Yeah, it might be a connection she made recently.
Death is often portrayed as a commanding & persuasive lover, dance partner, even sex partner - and I think the analogy to cocaine being a major relationship in her life for years is probably powerful to her.

- Jake

[GardenStateGirlie]

Actually, several.

- Jake

I know there are several but there's one in particular that i'm thinking of that is incredibly reminiscent of this -- almost like the person whose painting Stevie is using was mimicing it. I cannot for the life of me remember the painting or the artist but I remember being incredibly creeped out by said painting.

[lbelle1214]

ITA... Stevie said something like "figure it out" when introducing this song later during her performance she pantomimed cocaine lines with her hands.

IMO the sorcerer is either cocaine itself or a drug dealer. Sorcerer, who is the master could be taken like she is asking if she is indeed in control of her life or does cocaine control her. Sorcerer, who is the master? Or Sorcerer, who is the master. As if she is acknowledging the power cocaine holds over her, or identifying Sorcerer as the master.

man and woman on a star stream=Stevie and Lindsey heading to stardom

In the middle of a snow dream= cocaine


I think the skeletal figure in the picture represents (to her) either the dealer or cocaine.

It's a beautiful picture do you think Stevie herself maybe the artist?
I tend to agree with you. Looks like the grim reaper to me.

[lbelle1214]

Forgot something....In the 70's cocaine was not expensive, easily and readily available. At least it was here and I was a lowly office worker. And I do believe that the creepy creature on her back was indicative of cocaine. The snow queen is a bitch, and once she has hold of you, she rarely lets go (without intervention). Snow dream...endless days and nights blended one on top of the other until you rarely know peace, hence the "wild eyed in my misery". Just an "old" 70's persons opinion! ;)

[catinthedark]

Hence the lyric, Come over, let me put you on ice. ;)

Here's a stupid question: has cocaine always been called "ice?" I always thought that was a term that sort of cropped up in the 80s. But I admit to knowing nothing about coke. Just curious.

[pattymarkle]

Here's a stupid question: has cocaine always been called "ice?" I always thought that was a term that sort of cropped up in the 80s. But I admit to knowing nothing about coke. Just curious.

I think ice is speed, that crystal type speed because it does look like ice. I know more about coke than ice as I too lived through the 70's & 80's. Coke was cheap back then and it was everywhere. Didn't they thank their coke dealer on the Rumours album? Plus I remember an interview with Annie Leibovitz who took that Rolling Stone photo with all of them in bed and she said she brought a ton of coke to the shoot. Stevie said she didn't remember that, but whatever.

I saw the show tonight and was watching closely during Sorcerer. She did a mini cutting the coke deal with her hands and seeing that image behind her really made me think it was not only about coke, but the whole lifestyle she was living. The woman in the image seems to not realize that the grim reaper is behind her, even holding her. To me it seem like she was dancing with death and didn't even know it. That is the message that I am getting from the song and the image.

A couple of other observations about this - in the Sorcerer video when she says, "Won't you tell me who found - the lady from the mountain" you see Waddy behind a drape of fabric playing his guitar. Almost every single time she says that line, you see Waddy. That has always made me curious if he was who found the lady from the mountain.

Also, back in the 80's Stevie was part owner of a club in Dallas called the Starck Club. This was the cocaine mecca in Dallas. I never went there because I'm really not a club type person, but that was the hottest spot in Dallas and my friends told me you would go in the bathroom, and coke was everywhere. One night the police came in, the locked the door and pretty much told everyone to get up against the wall. They searched every single person in the club and I believe over 100 people were arrested that night for possession. The club closed after that night. Again, Stevie was a part owner of that club. I just always thought that was an interesting story.

Patty

[Dark Angel]

She wrote the song in 74, she said in Vegas she wrote it at the same time she wrote Rhiannon and Landslide. (oh, yea that someone had just reminded her of that fact the nihgt before).

Of course, if you check copyright records, Sorcerer was written in 1972, the same year as Lady From The Mountains, and Garbo. I'm not sure anymore that Stevie remembers when she wrote half of her songs. :lol:

[SapphireSister]

Here's a stupid question: has cocaine always been called "ice?" I always thought that was a term that sort of cropped up in the 80s. But I admit to knowing nothing about coke. Just curious.

Ice is not cocaine. It's used to refer to crystal meth that looks like ice (which I don't believe was around in 1972 but I could be wrong) so I'm not buying that "come on over, let me put you on ice" is a coke reference.

[Serendipity]

Not that its important, but from reading the Aerosmith book, there was apparently crystal meth in 1972. Also I read somewhere that Stevie said she tried cocaine for the first time in 1973 after finding it hidden in a house she was cleaning. Who knows?!

To me, the song seems like it could be about drugs, but I dont know tbh. I just enjoy the song.

One question, I have heard several comments about Stevie stopping the drugs and drinking and not being as honest as she might have been. Someone said that Stevie actually continued to drink after 1985? I'm merely curious about it, is all.

~Nicki xxx

[gldstwmn]

Here's a stupid question: has cocaine always been called "ice?" I always thought that was a term that sort of cropped up in the 80s. But I admit to knowing nothing about coke. Just curious.

I've never heard it called ice. :shrug: I was thinking maybe it was a reference to someone saying "Come over and we'll party." In my neck of the woods 30 years ago the code saying was "Let's get blown out." :lol:

[gldstwmn]

One question, I have heard several comments about Stevie stopping the drugs and drinking and not being as honest as she might have been. Someone said that Stevie actually continued to drink after 1985? I'm merely curious about it, is all.

~Nicki xxx

She still imbibes.

[DeeGeMe]

Also I read somewhere that Stevie said she tried cocaine for the first time in 1973 after finding it hidden in a house she was cleaning. Who knows?!
~Nicki xxx

Okay--can we talk about this? You're cleaning up a house and you find a hidden cocaine stash. And what's your first instinct? Hey, let me snort that up my nose! Okay. . . . uhm. . . . interesting choice there. LOL!!!

[amber]

Okay--can we talk about this? You're cleaning up a house and you find a hidden cocaine stash. And what's your first instinct? Hey, let me snort that up my nose! Okay. . . . uhm. . . . interesting choice there. LOL!!!
seems about right to me. And can we assume this was Keith Olsen's house? I will....I bet that cleaning session went a whole lot faster... :lol:

[gldstwmn]

Okay--can we talk about this? You're cleaning up a house and you find a hidden cocaine stash. And what's your first instinct? Hey, let me snort that up my nose! Okay. . . . uhm. . . . interesting choice there. LOL!!!
The Uma Thurman scene from Pulp Fiction comes to mind.

[gldstwmn]

seems about right to me. And can we assume this was Keith Olsen's house? I will....I bet that cleaning session went a whole lot faster... :lol:

I wanna be a star. I don't wanna be a cleaning lady! :lol:

[amber]

I wanna be a star. I don't wanna be a cleaning lady! :lol:
:lol:
yep - now we know when that line originated....I bet that was one twirly-ass cleaning session... :lol:

[SapphireSister]

One question, I have heard several comments about Stevie stopping the drugs and drinking and not being as honest as she might have been. Someone said that Stevie actually continued to drink after 1985? I'm merely curious about it, is all.

~Nicki xxx

Of course she still drinks. Alcohol was never her problem, it was drugs. I've heard her in many interviews talking about drinking wine post 1985 and I've seen her on TV during TISL admitting she downs a shot of tequilla before she goes on stage to curb her stage fright. She's not sober from alcohol (or pot for that matter).

[gldstwmn]

:lol:
yep - now we know when that line originated....I bet that was one twirly-ass cleaning session... :lol:
Bet Keith Olsen had a great stereo. :lol:

[SapphireSister]

Not that its important, but from reading the Aerosmith book, there was apparently crystal meth in 1972. Also I read somewhere that Stevie said she tried cocaine for the first time in 1973 after finding it hidden in a house she was cleaning. Who knows?!

~Nicki xxx

I believe there was crystal meth in 1972 if you read it but I highly doubt she was doing meth in 1973 and incorporating it into her lyrics "on ice". Seems highly unlikely.

[lbelle1214]

I believe there was crystal meth in 1972 if you read it but I highly doubt she was doing meth in 1973 and incorporating it into her lyrics "on ice". Seems highly unlikely.
I'm not exactly sure if the "on ice" is referring to an actual drug (which in my opinion would be meth), or an emotion. Crystal meth was almost as easily accessible, used differently. You could take a "silver spoon's worth" and put it in your morning coffee....and could probably clean the yard, mow the grass, trim the trees...(Don't mean to sound like a druggie here, but it WAS the 70's and I did try a lot of things) :)

[gldstwmn]

I'm not exactly sure if the "on ice" is referring to an actual drug (which in my opinion would be meth), or an emotion. Crystal meth was almost as easily accessible, used differently. You could take a "silver spoon's worth" and put it in your morning coffee....and could probably clean the yard, mow the grass, trim the trees...(Don't mean to sound like a druggie here, but it WAS the 70's and I did try a lot of things) :)

I just think the "put you on ice" line is about hanging out and partying.

[Kelly]

She still imbibes.

LMAO! : > )'

[reebokandlace]

The picture of the woman with the skeleton IS in fact a Sulamith Wulfing painting. Often it is difficult to find some of her artwork online because Sulamith's pictures are not titled in English. Usually German or French.

This picture (I believe) is the Sulamith Wulfing painting that Stevie bought in 1983 for $20,000 (it is now worth well over $150,000) and it hangs in her house in Phoenix to this day.

[gldstwmn]

The picture of the woman with the skeleton IS in fact a Sulamith Wulfing painting. Often it is difficult to find some of her artwork online because Sulamith's pictures are not titled in English. Usually German or French.

This picture (I believe) is the Sulamith Wulfing painting that Stevie bought in 1983 for $20,000 (it is now worth well over $150,000) and it hangs in her house in Phoenix to this day.

Aha! No wonder there are no photos of it anywhere.

[golden braid]

The picture of the woman with the skeleton IS in fact a Sulamith Wulfing painting. Often it is difficult to find some of her artwork online because Sulamith's pictures are not titled in English. Usually German or French.

This picture (I believe) is the Sulamith Wulfing painting that Stevie bought in 1983 for $20,000 (it is now worth well over $150,000) and it hangs in her house in Phoenix to this day.
Thanks for the info! :)

[glitter_fades]

Thanks for the info! :)

Too bad it's not accurate. :sorry:

[SapphireSister]

Too bad it's not accurate. :sorry:

Why is it innacurate?

[reebokandlace]

Too bad it's not accurate. :sorry:

I assure you, it is Sulamith Wulfing. I have been a collector of her artwork for a very long time.

Now as far as it being the the one she purchased in 1983, that I am not 100% about, hence the reason I said "I believe", but I suspect it is.

[jwd]

This picture (I believe) is the Sulamith Wulfing painting that Stevie bought in 1983 for $20,000 (it is now worth well over $150,000) and it hangs in her house in Phoenix to this day.


:shocked: A damn good investment Stevie!



The picture of the woman with the skeleton IS in fact a Sulamith Wulfing painting.


Any information on the meaning behind the painting?

[reebokandlace]

:shocked: A damn good investment Stevie!






Any information on the meaning behind the painting?


Like any artist (be it music or painting), it's meaning is open for interpretation. Because of her background, many of her paintings focus on death (and the freedom of death), lonliness & despair (with hope). If you are familar with her work, you will notice her angels never smile- (looks of contentment, acceptance or peace-yes, smile- no). It is hard go any farther than that without getting into a deep interpretive discussion.

Many of her angels remind me so much of Stevie.

And I believe that is what appeals to Stevie, she can see herself in Sulamith's paintings.