Something I never understood

[GretaRhiannon]

Ok, I've had people tell me their a huge Fleetwood Mac fan, and yeah I get excited cause I dont meet that many who are my age heh, but then I ask them if they like this song or that song, and they werent ever released as singles, so only true fans know them. And they tell me they've never heard them, and that they only like the band for their hits....so, if you only like an artist for their hits, then how are you a fan???? A fan is someone who sticks by the artist, like their hits and their normal music, etc...?

[CarneVaca]

Ok, I've had people tell me their a huge Fleetwood Mac fan, and yeah I get excited cause I dont meet that many who are my age heh, but then I ask them if they like this song or that song, and they werent ever released as singles, so only true fans know them. And they tell me they've never heard them, and that they only like the band for their hits....so, if you only like an artist for their hits, then how are you a fan???? A fan is someone who sticks by the artist, like their hits and their normal music, etc...?

Dude, I could barely focus on your message. What is the dude doing to the woman in your avatar? Once in a while there's a jerky forward motion. Is this appropriate for a family site? ;)

[strandinthewind]

Is this appropriate for a family site? ;)

This is a family site and we haven't been kicked out YET :lol: :lol: :wavey: :woohoo:

Seriously, I think being a fan does not compel someone to like all of the work. I certainly am a HUGE FM fan (in all versions of the band) - but I do not like all of their work :shrug:

[Lala]

I don't think you have to like all of their work to be a fan. I mean who here like absolutely everything?!

I'd say most of us here are pretty hardcore fans though.

[HomerMcvie]

there's a jerky forward motion. Is this appropriate for a family site?
It looks like he's doing it sideways though. :lol: :lol:

[shackin'up]

hmmm. is it the heat or did I leave my tools in my pocket?

[GretaRhiannon]

Ok, first off, where do you see a guy in my 'tar???? Second of all, yeah, I dont like ALL their music, but I like more than just their hits, heh, even I dont like most of their hits. But to just say ya just like em for this hits, to me doesnt really make you a fan of them, it just your a fan of their kind of music.

[jbrownsjr]

People that don't like Welcome to the Room Sara are not fans! :lol:

[Alexbt]

It's a looped GIF file, and they moved very slightly since it starts playing, so of course it's going to jerk back to the beginning... what do you expect?
(Personally, I don't see why it's an AniGIF at all, since it barely moves...)

It doesn't matter if people like or even know all the singles... in fact, most of the hits were singles anyways. That's one of the great things about this band--that a good portion of their music was popular among listeners, especially Rumours.

[CarneVaca]

Ok, first off, where do you see a guy in my 'tar???? .

Uh, dude, maybe you should look closer. The bombshell in the red dress is being molested from behind by what I presume is a dude, judging from the build.

[GateandGarden]

Ok, first off, where do you see a guy in my 'tar???? Second of all, yeah, I dont like ALL their music, but I like more than just their hits, heh, even I dont like most of their hits. But to just say ya just like em for this hits, to me doesnt really make you a fan of them, it just your a fan of their kind of music.
I agree with you. I have a hard time considering myself a U2 fan, for example, because I only like their hits. When people wear t-shirts hailing a certain band, I'm always hesitant to tell that person I'm a fan too, unless I can say that I own at least one CD and therefore know at least a few songs that weren't played on the radio nonstop. I love Modern English's "Melt With You" to death, but I'm not about to tell someone I'm a fan because the next question would be "What other songs by them do you like?" I learned my lesson when I told this guy I was a Turtles fan when, in actuality, I only know "Happy Together." I guess y'all get my point by now.

Hillary

[strandinthewind]

Uh, dude, maybe you should look closer. The bombshell in the red dress is being molested from behind by what I presume is a dude, judging from the build.

I think that is part of her dress?

[CarneVaca]

It's a looped GIF file, and they moved very slightly since it starts playing, so of course it's going to jerk back to the beginning... what do you expect?

The fact you felt the need to explain this to me makes it even funnier...

[CarneVaca]

I think that is part of her dress?

That is one strange dress. I like what my mind sees better. It's funnier that way. :laugh:

[Violet]

I guess I can't consider myself a HUGE fan, because I don't know a lot of the stuff that you all do. I never even knew who becca was until last year some time. :distress: Sorry....And I don't have enough time to read all there is on this site and others to become as knowledgeable as most of you. But I do enjoy learning more through posts here mostly, I guess. That's why I don't post to most threads. I do like more than just FM hits, but certainly not all their songs.

And the avatar thing? Looks like a woman in a big poofy red dress to me...

Carol

[Villavic]

Would be good if you guys open another thread for discussing about the avatar. I'm getting confused.

About being a fan, I think a fan should know (not necessarily like) more about the works beyond the singles. Not necessarily own every album, but maybe a few.

Im my opinion, What does make you a fan? I guess when you...

- Like most of the hits
- know the name of the members
- like several more songs (not necessarily singles)
- try to own some merchandise, and wear it or use it on your bedroom (posters, cups, etc)
- try to go to their concerts
- look for a radio or videos special

and a radical fan...
- read their biography
- sing their songs in the shower, or in your bedroom (using the brush as microphone)
- find a song on the radio, and listen to it, even when you already got it in cd, tape, mp3, etc..
- wait for the next album
- wait for remastered or new releases
- tell your friends you are a fan (and annoy them repeating it to death)

[GretaRhiannon]

Uh, dude, maybe you should look closer. The bombshell in the red dress is being molested from behind by what I presume is a dude, judging from the build.


Um, "dude" maybe you should look closer and see that the only person in that avatar is Shania, and that what you "see" is in fact her hair, maybe you should watch the video and you'll see. So don't assume you know everything.

[GretaRhiannon]

And the avatar thing? Looks like a woman in a big poofy red dress to me...



That's what is it.

[GretaRhiannon]

Would be good if you guys open another thread for discussing about the avatar. I'm getting confused.

About being a fan, I think a fan should know (not necessarily like) more about the works beyond the singles. Not necessarily own every album, but maybe a few.

Im my opinion, What does make you a fan? I guess when you...

- Like most of the hits
- know the name of the members
- like several more songs (not necessarily singles)
- try to own some merchandise, and wear it or use it on your bedroom (posters, cups, etc)
- try to go to their concerts
- look for a radio or videos special

and a radical fan...
- read their biography
- sing their songs in the shower, or in your bedroom (using the brush as microphone)
- find a song on the radio, and listen to it, even when you already got it in cd, tape, mp3, etc..
- wait for the next album
- wait for remastered or new releases
- tell your friends you are a fan (and annoy them repeating it to death)

I'm a radical fan! *stands proud*

[Violet]

the only person in that avatar is Shania

I thought that's who it was, but I wasn't quite sure.

Carol

[Violet]

Would be good if you guys open another thread for discussing about the avatar. I'm getting confused.

About being a fan, I think a fan should know (not necessarily like) more about the works beyond the singles. Not necessarily own every album, but maybe a few.

Im my opinion, What does make you a fan? I guess when you...

- Like most of the hits
- know the name of the members
- like several more songs (not necessarily singles)
- try to own some merchandise, and wear it or use it on your bedroom (posters, cups, etc)
- try to go to their concerts
- look for a radio or videos special

and a radical fan...
- read their biography
- sing their songs in the shower, or in your bedroom (using the brush as microphone)
- find a song on the radio, and listen to it, even when you already got it in cd, tape, mp3, etc..
- wait for the next album
- wait for remastered or new releases
- tell your friends you are a fan (and annoy them repeating it to death)


Hmm...guess I'm somewhere in the middle of the two.

Carol

[amber]

Well, I don't have any of Stevie's solo albums from the 80's (or Lindsey's), I haven't seen/heard all the videos, live performances most people have.
However, I submit that maybe i am even MORE of a fan, because I spent oh, 8-10 years never getting tired of the same songs! I mean, i've gotten a lot more stuff recently, but i started out w/Timespace, FM Greatest Hits, and Street Angel, and those kept me for like, 2-3 years or so...and I still listen to Timespace quite a bit. I am pretty obsessed, and i hardly listen to too much other music, compared to most people. So i definitely consider myself a super fan, because of the level of how much I like FM and Stevie, not because of how much I have, or have heard... :wavey:
AMber

[MirrorInTheSky]

About being a fan, I think a fan should know (not necessarily like) more about the works beyond the singles. Not necessarily own every album, but maybe a few.

Im my opinion, What does make you a fan? I guess when you...

and a radical fan...


-if you throw your tassled chenille blanket over your shoulders and spin around the apartment

(*looks around* Not ME of course, but...uuhhhhhh.....I'm sure some other radical fans...*gulp*)

[Violet]

-if you throw your tassled chenille blanket over your shoulders and spin around the apartment

(*looks around* Not ME of course, but...uuhhhhhh.....I'm sure some other radical fans...*gulp*)

OMG, you just reminded me of something funny. My 5 year old had friends over for movie night. They were all in their jammies, and Rachel's is a flowing princess type nightgown. We had music on before the movie (classic disco), and she starts holding out the sides of her nightgown, twirls around and tells all her friends proudly "This is how Stevie Nicks dances!" What a crack-up. It was so funny....
So does that make her a radical fan?
Carol

[GretaRhiannon]

-if you throw your tassled chenille blanket over your shoulders and spin around the apartment

(*looks around* Not ME of course, but...uuhhhhhh.....I'm sure some other radical fans...*gulp*)

Hehe I do that. :nod: *yet again stands proud* I even put on my blonde wig that I bought cause I was Stevie one year for halloween...

[CarneVaca]

Um, "dude" maybe you should look closer and see that the only person in that avatar is Shania, and that what you "see" is in fact her hair, maybe you should watch the video and you'll see.

Watch a Shania video!? There ain't enough gingerale in the world to contain that nausea. Not that she isn't pleasant to look at; it's just that her music is vomit-inducing, not to mention her crappy stuporstar attitude.

So don't assume you know everything.

Assume? How silly of you. I assume nothing. I know. Socrates was wrong.

[GretaRhiannon]

Watch a Shania video!? There ain't enough gingerale in the world to contain that nausea. Not that she isn't pleasant to look at; it's just that her music is vomit-inducing, not to mention her crappy stuporstar attitude.



Assume? How silly of you. I assume nothing. I know. Socrates was wrong.

Assume? yes, you just assumed that there was a guy "molesting" her, when in fact there isnt. Typical male, only like women for their bodies :rolleyes: ...oh yes and it's SupErstar not SupOrstar, and how is her attitude crappy, she is very nice, and isnt a bitch like some others out there, and she's real, what you see is what you get, which is way more than I can say for Britney and Christina, and Avril Lafckingveign. Anyways, a sophisticated rhetorician, inebriated with her exuberance of her own verbosity...

[marc402]

I'm a radical fan! *stands proud*

yes going by those standarts i guess i'm one too ;)

[MirrorInTheSky]

OMG, you just reminded me of something funny. My 5 year old had friends over for movie night. They were all in their jammies, and Rachel's is a flowing princess type nightgown. We had music on before the movie (classic disco), and she starts holding out the sides of her nightgown, twirls around and tells all her friends proudly "This is how Stevie Nicks dances!" What a crack-up. It was so funny....
So does that make her a radical fan?
Carol

That is tooooo cute! I'd pay to see that. :thumbsup:

I'm glad to see that you're training the next generation of FM devotees.

[CarneVaca]

Assume? yes, you just assumed that there was a guy "molesting" her, when in fact there isnt.

The only assumption made here so far was by you -- assuming that I was serious to start with. Humor is not for everyone, clearly.

Typical male, only like women for their bodies :rolleyes:

Another assumption. You assume from what I said that I only like women for their bodies. But you have little, if any evidence, to prove anything beyond my stating a belief that the woman is attractive.

...oh yes and it's SupErstar not SupOrstar,

Well, and if you read it again, you will see that what I actually wrote was sTuporstar. And it was intentional. Another joke you missed.

and how is her attitude crappy, she is very nice, and isnt a bitch like some others out there, and she's real, what you see is what you get

You must know her really well to be so sure that "she's real" and "what you see is what you get." What, does she invite you for tea on a regular basis? Or... you wouldn't be making more assumptions, now would you?

[dissention]

Assume? How silly of you. I assume nothing. I know. Socrates was wrong.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

[CarneVaca]

:lol: :lol: :lol:

;) ;) ;)

[Johnny Stew]

You must know her really well to be so sure that "she's real" and "what you see is what you get." What, does she invite you for tea on a regular basis? Or... you wouldn't be making more assumptions, now would you?

Now, now, Carne... you know Lindsey about as well as GretaRhiannon knows Shania Twain, and yet you still feel strongly that he's a good guy, and a "better person" than Stevie. Which are assumptions.

So let's not have kettles calling pots black, my friend. ;)

[dissention]

Now, now, Carne... you know Lindsey about as well as GretaRhiannon knows Shania Twain, and yet you still feel strongly that he's a good guy, and a "better person" than Stevie. Which are assumptions.

So let's not have kettles calling pots black, my friend. ;)

Just after you get done posting that you're sick of the Lindsey vs. Stevie arguments, you start one up. ;)

Proceed! :wavey:

[CarneVaca]

Now, now, Carne... you know Lindsey about as well as GretaRhiannon knows Shania Twain, and yet you still feel strongly that he's a good guy, and a "better person" than Stevie. Which are assumptions.

How do you know that she knows Shania as well as I know Lindsey? And how do you know that I know Lindsey as well as she knows Shania? And how do you know that Lindsey isn't the better person? How do we know that he is a good guy or a bad guy? And if you do know all there is to know about all this, how do I know that you know? Or that you know I know that you know? How do I know that you know that GreatRhiannon knows what I know that she knows? But is what she knows that I know what you know that I know she knows?

Let's not bring up pots and kettles before these questions are addressed, shall we?

Hmmm... maybe Socrates was right, after all.

[CarneVaca]

Just after you get done posting that you're sick of the Lindsey vs. Stevie arguments, you start one up. ;)

So what was that about a pot and a kettle? ;)

[dissention]

How do you know that she knows Shania as well as I know Lindsey? And how do you know that I know Lindsey as well as she knows Shania? And how do you know that Lindsey isn't the better person? How do we know that he is a good guy or a bad guy? And if you do know all there is to know about all this, how do I know that you know? Or that you know I know that you know? How do I know that you know that GreatRhiannon knows what I know that she knows? But is what she knows that I know what you know that I know she knows?

Let's not bring up pots and kettles before these questions are addressed, shall we?

Hmmm... maybe Socrates was right, after all.

I don't know what anyone knows after reading about what everyone supposedly knows and doesn't know. Good lawd.

[CarneVaca]

I don't know what anyone knows after reading about what everyone supposedly knows and doesn't know. Good lawd.

Which really raises the question, "Just what is there to know?"

You know?

[Johnny Stew]

Just after you get done posting that you're sick of the Lindsey vs. Stevie arguments, you start one up. ;)

Proceed! :wavey:


You're just being contrary now. There is absolutely nothing in what I said, that implies I was starting... intentionally, or otherwise... a Lindsey vs. Stevie argument.

Carne HAS said that Lindsey is a "better person than Stevie," which is an assumption. Just as it would be an assumption to say that the opposite is true. And assumptions are what he was chastizing GretaRhiannon for making.

I was merely calling him on the inherent hypocrisy of stating that one person is "better" than another, and then turning around and telling someone else they shouldn't make assumptions.

But hey, if you two want to remain blissfully ignorant to your own hypocrisies while pointing them out in others, I can't stop you. ;) :laugh:

[GateandGarden]

You must know her really well to be so sure that "she's real" and "what you see is what you get." What, does she invite you for tea on a regular basis? Or... you wouldn't be making more assumptions, now would you?
I suppose it is an assumption, but if you watch interviews and read magazine articles, you can get a pretty good idea of how a person is. Shania seems to be pretty down-to-earth and she's not full of herself, from what I've seen. I'm sure nearly everyone here feels certain that he or she knows how Stevie, Lindsey, and/or some other members of the Mac are. We can't really know them, but I think we can get a pretty good idea of what they're like.

And why start dissing Shania for no reason, knowing that someone here is a fan? What's the point? Did you derive pleasure from that? :wavey:

Hillary

[dissention]

You're just being contrary now. There is absolutely nothing in what I said, that implies I was starting... intentionally, or otherwise... a Lindsey vs. Stevie argument.

Carne HAS said that Lindsey is a "better person than Stevie," which is an assumption. Just as it would be an assumption to say that the opposite is true. And assumptions are what he was chastizing GretaRhiannon for making.

I was merely calling him on the inherent hypocrisy of stating that one person is "better" than another, and then turning around and telling someone else they shouldn't make assumptions.

But hey, if you two want to remain blissfully ignorant to your own hypocrisies while pointing them out in others, I can't stop you. ;) :laugh:

I'll respectfully disagree. You're not ignorant, Johnny, you know what a post like yours above can start. We've all been around here long enough to know that, regardless of the fancy words used to dispel it. You just got finished berating me for my "snide" and "jeering" remarks, yet you're making the same kind. Talk about hypocrisy. :wavey:

[GateandGarden]

I see I was late and everything I said in my last post was futile. :rolleyes:

Hillary

[CarneVaca]

Carne HAS said that Lindsey is a "better person than Stevie," which is an assumption.

So says you. But you're wrong. I know. I could make the case for it again, but it will bore me to tears to have to rehash that crap. So I shan't.

I was merely calling him on the inherent hypocrisy of stating that one person is "better" than another, and then turning around and telling someone else they shouldn't make assumptions.

Johnny, let's take a deep breath before we start throwing around terms like "hypocrisy." I suspect if I start hurling that around, next thing you know, I get strike three.

Aside from that, I was harping on assumptions strictly as a reaction to GretaRhiannon's accusing me of making an assumption when I was making a joke that she missed. You are completely ignoring the context and instead choose to bring up something from long ago that has no bearing on the discussion at hand. I think you should know better. We've gotten into trouble before for harping on subjects that should have been buried.

[CarneVaca]

[COLOR=Olive]And why start dissing Shania for no reason, knowing that someone here is a fan? What's the point? Did you derive pleasure from that? :wavey:

Hillary

I dissed her because she forced the organizers of some charity show to pay for a chartered flight from Switzerland for her and some 30 people in her entourage. It was charity. Don't wanna do it? Stay home. But asking to have 30 people flown for free in a charter flight seems arrogant, spoiled and misguided.

[Johnny Stew]

I'll respectfully disagree. You're not ignorant, Johnny, you know what a post like yours above can start. We've all been around here long enough to know that, regardless of the fancy words used to dispel it. You just got finished berating me for my "snide" and "jeering" remarks, yet you're making the same kind. Talk about hypocrisy. :wavey:


dissention... you know full well that if I had called Carne on hypocrisy without citing an example of said hypocrisy, he would have been crying "foul" louder than Jason ever could.

So I cited an example of him making assumptions about two celebrities he's never met, when he was chastizing GretaRhiannon for making an assumption about a celebrity she's (apparently) never met.

My comment... no matter how you may have taken it... was NOT meant to imply that either Stevie or Lindsey are better people than each other. If one reads the tone of my post, as well as the wording, I'd think that should be obvious. I was reiterating what CarneVaca has said in the not-so-distant past, and pointing out that it's merely an assumption on his part.

The only way it can be construed as me making a snide jab at Lindsey, or me making an attempt to start some cockamamie Stevie vs. Lindsey thread, is by someone looking to dodge the true point of my post.

[GateandGarden]

I dissed her because she forced the organizers of some charity show to pay for a chartered flight from Switzerland for her and some 30 people in her entourage. It was charity. Don't wanna do it? Stay home. But asking to have 30 people flown for free in a charter flight seems arrogant, spoiled and misguided.Well, I still don't agree that it was necessary to say that, but that incident you pointed out
does sound like it was "arrogant, spoiled, and misguided." I have to give you that. Of course, I have yet to find a celebrity who's ideal to look up to, since there isn't one, so it's not all that surprising. And we all know that members of the Mac have done things they shouldn't be proud of as well.

Hillary

[dissention]

My comment... no matter how you may have taken it... was NOT meant to imply that either Stevie or Lindsey are better people than each other.

The only way it can be construed as me making a snide jab at Lindsey, or me making an attempt to start some cockamamie Stevie vs. Lindsey thread, is by someone looking to dodge the true point of my post.

:shrug: I know that and never interpreted it to mean that and never attempted to turn it into one those "cockamamie Stevie vs. Lindsey threads."

My point is that you cannot say you're sick and tired of hearing about the Stevie vs. Lindsey arguments in one breath, then bringing up one of those very same arguments in the next. You've been around here long enough to know that if you bring something like that up, fans on both sides are going to jump up and declare war. Thankfully, that hasn't happened here, but it doesn't negate the fact that a post like yours that dredges up one of those arguments (no matter if it's done in reference or not) has the possibility to start one of the very arguments you claim to despise.

[dissention]

Aside from that, I was harping on assumptions strictly as a reaction to GretaRhiannon's accusing me of making an assumption when I was making a joke that she missed. You are completely ignoring the context and instead choose to bring up something from long ago that has no bearing on the discussion at hand. I think you should know better. We've gotten into trouble before for harping on subjects that should have been buried.

Exactly. You said it much better than I could have, darling.

[Johnny Stew]

So says you. But you're wrong. I know. I could make the case for it again, but it will bore me to tears to have to rehash that crap. So I shan't.

I'm wrong, and you're right... because you "know."
I like that. :laugh:

I could ask how you "know" better than anyone else, but I won't bother. I could also ask how you're so sure that someone else doesn't "know" better than you, but I won't bother with that either. ;)

I'll just let the comment stand for what it is. :)


Johnny, let's take a deep breath before we start throwing around terms like "hypocrisy." I suspect if I start hurling that around, next thing you know, I get strike three.

If you haven't seen by now that the two of us can disagree without you getting a strike for it, then I can't help you.

And as I've told you in the past... I'm not the person who gives out strikes. They're voted on. And only in extreme cases.

Aside from that, I was harping on assumptions strictly as a reaction to GretaRhiannon's accusing me of making an assumption when I was making a joke that she missed. You are completely ignoring the context and instead choose to bring up something from long ago that has no bearing on the discussion at hand. I think you should know better. We've gotten into trouble before for harping on subjects that should have been buried.

I'm not sitting here and telling you that you're wrong for defending your joke. But I am honestly surprised that you don't see anything iffy with just flat-out accusing someone of certain behaviour that everyone is guilty of.
You told the woman that you know better than she, that she's wrong in her opinion of Shania Twain.
Perhaps if you had told her that neither of you can really know for sure what kind of person Shania Twain is, but that you have your suspicions, then it would have come across differently than it did.

[Johnny Stew]

My point is that you cannot say you're sick and tired of hearing about the Stevie vs. Lindsey arguments in one breath, then bringing up one of those very same arguments in the next. You've been around here long enough to know that if you bring something like that up, fans on both sides are going to jump up and declare war. Thankfully, that hasn't happened here, but it doesn't negate the fact that a post like yours that dredges up one of those arguments (no matter if it's done in reference or not) has the possibility to start one of the very arguments you claim to despise.

You win, dissention... next time I won't say anything that could even remotely be construed as the first shot fired in a Stevie vs. Lindsey war, and I'll just leave myself open for someone to call me on a statement made without any evidence or examples to support it. :p :laugh:

Better yet, I think I should just let you guys all fight amongst yourselves and be nasty to each other, without ever trying to intervene. That way, if things do get out of control to such a degree that strikes have to be given out, then I can't be accused of anything (well, of course, excepting all the people who email and accuse you for not intervening before it got out of hand).

[sodascouts]

So says you [that stating Lindsey is better than Stevie is just an assumption]. But you're wrong. I know.
Oh MAN! :rolleyes:: Still, I'm impressed you're refraining from starting an SnL war with specific recriminations. It seems those type of wars always seem to happen when the board gets a little slow and someone deems it in need of another 45 page thread. I applaud your restraint.


Johnny, let's take a deep breath before we start throwing around terms like "hypocrisy." I suspect if I start hurling that around, next thing you know, I get strike three.
Dang! When was your last strike - 2002? My advice to you: GET OVER IT already. But I see from that sig of yours you can't let go of the past. A shame, but if you want to dwell on that for the rest of your Ledge-life, you're free to do so. :shrug:

My point is that you cannot say you're sick and tired of hearing about the Stevie vs. Lindsey arguments in one breath, then bringing up one of those very same arguments in the next. You've been around here long enough to know that if you bring something like that up, fans on both sides are going to jump up and declare war. Thankfully, that hasn't happened here, but it doesn't negate the fact that a post like yours that dredges up one of those arguments (no matter if it's done in reference or not) has the possibility to start one of the very arguments you claim to despise.
I see what you're saying here, but I think it's clear Johnny Stew's intent wasn't to start any war. His statement can only start a war if people choose to use it as an excuse for one. I think it's good that so far, people haven't. I was being completely serious when I commended CarneVaca above. Yay Ledgies! :thumbsup:

[Nightbirdjel]

Ok, I've had people tell me their a huge Fleetwood Mac fan, and yeah I get excited cause I dont meet that many who are my age heh, but then I ask them if they like this song or that song, and they werent ever released as singles, so only true fans know them. And they tell me they've never heard them, and that they only like the band for their hits....so, if you only like an artist for their hits, then how are you a fan???? A fan is someone who sticks by the artist, like their hits and their normal music, etc...?
OKAY-getting back to the original question....first of all, know that I am a total weirdo so feel free to roll eyes and laugh derisively. I think perhaps there are 3 categories of fans: 1) Casual fan-just listens on the radio/watches videos if they happen to come on. 2) Hardcore fan-most of you folks here. 3) Complete Psychofan like myself.
I know I'm a psychofan because:
1. I have only 2 categories of Stevie music
A. Favorites B. Lesser favorites
2. Any and every time I see Stevie I see her only as
A. Stunningly gorgeous B. Merely beautiful
3. I took up sewing specifically to make clothes like hers to wear whenever I feel like it, which is most of the time.
4. I've tried many times to pose like her in my own photos.
5. I've been collecting "Stevie stuff" since I was 13 (in 1982) and now have 6 huge overstuffed scrapbooks devoted entirely to her.
6. I have and will again pay $600 for a single concert ticket to see Stevie/Mac
....I could go on and on, but I think you get it by now! :lol:

[Violet]

That is tooooo cute! I'd pay to see that. :thumbsup:

I'm glad to see that you're training the next generation of FM devotees.

It was cute. To try to lighten the mood a little on this thread, here's some other Rachel/FM tidbits:

She named a stuffed cat from Build-A-Bear "Miranda", yes, after the song. Not that she understands the lyrics, of course, but she likes the music.

She knows every word to Landslide, because I sang it to her almost every night from when she was 9 months to two years old.

She knows all the bandmembers' names, but does get stuck on John's name sometimes.

She does the little lasso/dance thing during Say You Will.

On a down note, my neighbor drove her to cheerleading practice one night and they listend to Usher in the car. She said she liked it. Ugh... :distress:

Carol

[CarneVaca]

I'll just let the comment stand for what it is. :)

You're beginning to get it.

If you haven't seen by now that the two of us can disagree without you getting a strike for it, then I can't help you.

I know it's possible to disagree without strikes. But I think it's irresponsible to call someone hypocritical gratuitously, especially when it comes from someone who has the power to vote on strikes. You know "hypocrisy" is an incendiary word, so don't play coy or innocent on this.

I'm not sitting here and telling you that you're wrong for defending your joke. But I am honestly surprised that you don't see anything iffy with just flat-out accusing someone of certain behaviour that everyone is guilty of.
You told the woman that you know better than she, that she's wrong in her opinion of Shania Twain.

Wrong again, Johnny. I'm telling you you're wrong about this, but I never told GretaRhiannon she was wrong about anything. Quote it back to me if you can find it. You know, it's kind of funny that you're lobbing around terms like "hypocrisy," argue with Dissention about context, but continue to completely ignore the context in which I made my "assumption" comments.

Perhaps if you had told her that neither of you can really know for sure what kind of person Shania Twain is, but that you have your suspicions, then it would have come across differently than it did.

Well, I'm not terribly concerned how it comes across. I didn't insult Greta, nor was it my intent to. I was engaging in a bit of fun repartee. You come in with the "hypocrisy" charges and the game changes. I think you honestly need to consider what would happen if I started calling people hypocrites around here. Be honest.

[CarneVaca]

Well, I still don't agree that it was necessary to say that, but that incident you pointed out does sound like it was "arrogant, spoiled, and misguided." I have to give you that. Of course, I have yet to find a celebrity who's ideal to look up to, since there isn't one, so it's not all that surprising. And we all know that members of the Mac have done things they shouldn't be proud of as well.

Hillary

It's not necessary to say anything, when you think about it. But we say lots of things. We agree, disagree, half-agree, remain indifferent, whatever. Such is the nature of the forum.

[CarneVaca]

Dang! When was your last strike - 2002? My advice to you: GET OVER IT already. But I see from that sig of yours you can't let go of the past. A shame, but if you want to dwell on that for the rest of your Ledge-life, you're free to do so. :shrug:

Let it go? Are you nuts!? Methinks you've missed the point, Nancy. I ain't complaining about the strike. I am merely making the point that if I'd had the temerity to call someone here a hypocrite, I probably would get one.

[sodascouts]

Let it go? Are you nuts!? Methinks you've missed the point, Nancy. I ain't complaining about the strike. I am merely making the point that if I'd had the temerity to call someone here a hypocrite, I probably would get one.

True, but I thought you probably didn't really believe that calling someone a hypocrite would garner you a strike, since that premise is so ludicrous in view of how often that term is used around here by many strike-less people. If you were given a strike for that, and only that, it would be unfair. Therefore, I thought your statement was designed to cast the strike-givers as unfair. Now, why would one do this? Answer: because one was still stewing about the unfairness of the strike-givers in one's own case. It sounds complicated written out, but the connection itself is not a outrageous one to make.

[Johnny Stew]

I know it's possible to disagree without strikes. But I think it's irresponsible to call someone hypocritical gratuitously, especially when it comes from someone who has the power to vote on strikes. You know "hypocrisy" is an incendiary word, so don't play coy or innocent on this.

I take it back then... you weren't being hypocritical. My apologies.

Maybe I can just say, "I was only joking." That seems to be the cure-all. :) ;)

Hopefully GretaRhiannon also felt that she was engaging in "fun repartée" and wasn't being insulted.

[dissention]

You win, dissention... next time I won't say anything that could even remotely be construed as the first shot fired in a Stevie vs. Lindsey war, and I'll just leave myself open for someone to call me on a statement made without any evidence or examples to support it. :p :laugh:

Better yet, I think I should just let you guys all fight amongst yourselves and be nasty to each other, without ever trying to intervene. That way, if things do get out of control to such a degree that strikes have to be given out, then I can't be accused of anything (well, of course, excepting all the people who email and accuse you for not intervening before it got out of hand).

Sounds good to me. :p :D

You're still missing the point, but I'll let it go. :wavey:

[dissention]

Hopefully GretaRhiannon also felt that she was engaging in "fun repartée" and wasn't being insulted.

Hopefully people are intelligent enough to not take comments made about celebrities and their crappy behavior personally. :)

[CarneVaca]

Now, why would one do this? Answer: because one was still stewing about the unfairness of the strike-givers in one's own case. It sounds complicated written out, but the connection itself is not a outrageous one to make.

Well, Nancy, an injustice does not over time turn into an act of fairness in some miraculous way.

[CarneVaca]

I take it back then... you weren't being hypocritical. My apologies.

Thank you, Johnny.

Hopefully GretaRhiannon also felt that she was engaging in "fun repartée" and wasn't being insulted.

Then she should let us know.

[cliffdweller]

Would be good if you guys open another thread for discussing about the avatar. I'm getting confused.

About being a fan, I think a fan should know (not necessarily like) more about the works beyond the singles. Not necessarily own every album, but maybe a few.

Im my opinion, What does make you a fan? I guess when you...

- Like most of the hits
- know the name of the members
- like several more songs (not necessarily singles)
- try to own some merchandise, and wear it or use it on your bedroom (posters, cups, etc)
- try to go to their concerts
- look for a radio or videos special

and a radical fan...
- read their biography
- sing their songs in the shower, or in your bedroom (using the brush as microphone)
- find a song on the radio, and listen to it, even when you already got it in cd, tape, mp3, etc..
- wait for the next album
- wait for remastered or new releases
- tell your friends you are a fan (and annoy them repeating it to death)


:wavey: radical fan here.

[skcin]

I think the original issue was not that people shouldn't be casual fans. It's that GretaRhiannon get perturbed when someone claims to be a HUGE fan & they don't even have the basic stuff.

I have a friend that considers himself a HUGE Mac & Stevie fan, yet he only owns a few albums. Ummm...no, sorry. Sure, you like them, but you're not their "biggest fan." I love all kinds of music, but I'm not about to claim that a band is my all-time favorite group, hands down, unless I have all of their albums, at the very least. I'm not talking about boots or rare imports, either.

I don't fault anyone for not knowing EVERYTHING about Mac, I'm sure I don't either. But don't claim that you do - how many of us have heard someone say "yeah, S&L used to be married" or "I saw them when they toured in 1984" etc, etc.

Paula
*just realized she defended that fact that she's slightly obsessed* :sorry:

[cliffdweller]

I think the original issue was not that people shouldn't be casual fans. It's that GretaRhiannon get perturbed when someone claims to be a HUGE fan & they don't even have the basic stuff.

I have a friend that considers himself a HUGE Mac & Stevie fan, yet he only owns a few albums. Ummm...no, sorry. Sure, you like them, but you're not their "biggest fan." I love all kinds of music, but I'm not about to claim that a band is my all-time favorite group, hands down, unless I have all of their albums, at the very least. I'm not talking about boots or rare imports, either.

I don't fault anyone for not knowing EVERYTHING about Mac, I'm sure I don't either. But don't claim that you do - how many of us have heard someone say "yeah, S&L used to be married" or "I saw them when they toured in 1984" etc, etc.

Paula
*just realized she defended that fact that she's slightly obsessed* :sorry:

I tend to agree with you Paula. I think being a superfan means at least listening to everything the band has to offer, whether or not you like what you hear is up to you.

The problem with Fleetwood Mac, however, is that they have spanned from the 60's to now---that means a lot of personnel changes, and a lot of different kinds of music being made. I don't expect even hard core Fleetwood Mac fans to have listened to everything from Peter Green to current day Mac, it's almost asking too much especially when you consider the popularity of the Rumours line-up which just about obliterated every other Mac formation at least in the general public's eyes. No matter if you like from the inception to current day Mac, one tends to favor a certain era over another and I happen to favor the Rumours line-up and have only heard a few albums of stuff from before B/N joined and a handful of stuff after Lindsey left; call it a matter of taste preferring one genre over the other, plus I've never been a big fan of the blues or heavily blues inspired rock, sorry Pre-Rumours fans.

[skcin]

I tend to agree with you Paula. I think being a superfan means at least listening to everything the band has to offer, whether or not you like what you hear is up to you.

The problem with Fleetwood Mac, however, is that they have spanned from the 60's to now---that means a lot of personnel changes, and a lot of different kinds of music being made. I don't expect even hard core Fleetwood Mac fans to have listened to everything from Peter Green to current day Mac, it's almost asking too much especially when you consider the popularity of the Rumours line-up which just about obliterated every other Mac formation at least in the general public's eyes. No matter if you like from the inception to current day Mac, one tends to favor a certain era over another and I happen to favor the Rumours line-up and have only heard a few albums of stuff from before B/N joined and a handful of stuff after Lindsey left; call it a matter of taste preferring one genre over the other, plus I've never been a big fan of the blues or heavily blues inspired rock, sorry Pre-Rumours fans.


I agree. I tend to let people know that I'm into the BN era of the Mac, pretty much exclusively. It's almost like 2 different bands, their sound is just so much different.

And like you said, you don't have to like EVERYTHING, but at least know what the hell you're talking about.

Paula

Paula

[wondergirl9847]

Not every album from Peter Green's FM to Rumours is blues tho. Danny Kirwan and Bob Welch took the band in a TOTALLY different direction. Bob has that jazzy feel to his music, and Danny, I've always thought is a mixture of Lindsey and Stevie.

Fine if you don't like the blues, I don't particularly care for it myself, but Then Play On is a really great album. I think everyone should at least give the pre SnL albums a listen, if you just don't care for it, cool, but hey, give 'em a try. :)

[cliffdweller]

Bob has that jazzy feel to his music

Fine if you don't like the blues, I don't particularly care for it myself, but Then Play On is a really great album. I think everyone should at least give the pre SnL albums a listen, if you just don't care for it, cool, but hey, give 'em a try. :)

Not into jazzy, sorry.

Since Stevie and Lindsey are the reasons why I love Fleetwood Mac, I've just never been motivated to delve deeply into the non-Rumours line-ups. Like I said, I've heard a handful of the other stuff, I just didn't connect with it. But I'll take your word for it and give "Then Play On" another listen.

[wondergirl9847]

If you love SnL, I think you'll mostly connect with Danny. That's just my opinion tho because I'm that way. My fave pre Rumours albums are Bare Trees, Future Games and Mystery to Me, although I listen to the first two more often, because of Danny. I made a set of CD's of my fave songs and as far as Pre SnL, it's mostly his songs. I would say, since Mystery to Me is ALOT of people's favorite album, listen to that first, then go towards Bare Trees, then Future Games, then Then Play On, etc.

Lindsey is the reason I love FM, but Stevie is rad and I adore Danny. Everyone is different tho. I'm not a huge fan of the Madge songs on Then Play On, but that's just me, lots of people like them.

Happy listening!! :)

[sodascouts]

If you love SnL, I think you'll mostly connect with Danny.

I love SnL, and Danny is my pre-BN favorite. You many be on to something here, Christy!

[skcin]

Not every album from Peter Green's FM to Rumours is blues tho. Danny Kirwan and Bob Welch took the band in a TOTALLY different direction. Bob has that jazzy feel to his music, and Danny, I've always thought is a mixture of Lindsey and Stevie.

Fine if you don't like the blues, I don't particularly care for it myself, but Then Play On is a really great album. I think everyone should at least give the pre SnL albums a listen, if you just don't care for it, cool, but hey, give 'em a try. :)

I'm not against trying out the older stuff, just haven't gotten around to it yet. :shrug:

Paula

[Lala]

I'm not against trying out the older stuff, just haven't gotten around to it yet. :shrug:

Paula

Yeah same here

[Johnny Stew]

Hopefully people are intelligent enough to not take comments made about celebrities and their crappy behavior personally. :)

The problem is not with what is said about Shania Twain, Stevie Nicks, Lindsey Buckingham, etc. The problem is with what is said in regards to the intelligence of other posters.

I haven't yet met a person who appreciates their intelligence being questioned or belittled.

But I'm done with this now. I've figured out something that changes how I view all of this, and I'm finished.

[CarneVaca]

The problem is not with what is said about Shania Twain, Stevie Nicks, Lindsey Buckingham, etc. The problem is with what is said in regards to the intelligence of other posters.

I haven't yet met a person who appreciates their intelligence being questioned or belittled.

I realize you're done with this, Johnny. But I suspect you would be hard-pressed to find where on this thread I insulted anyone's intelligence. Unless that is not what you meant.

[cliffdweller]

If you love SnL, I think you'll mostly connect with Danny. That's just my opinion tho because I'm that way. My fave pre Rumours albums are Bare Trees, Future Games and Mystery to Me, although I listen to the first two more often, because of Danny. I made a set of CD's of my fave songs and as far as Pre SnL, it's mostly his songs. I would say, since Mystery to Me is ALOT of people's favorite album, listen to that first, then go towards Bare Trees, then Future Games, then Then Play On, etc.

Lindsey is the reason I love FM, but Stevie is rad and I adore Danny. Everyone is different tho. I'm not a huge fan of the Madge songs on Then Play On, but that's just me, lots of people like them.

Happy listening!! :)

I tried Bare Trees and Mystery to Me a while back. I don't remember liking them upon first listen, but I'll give them another shot.

[David]

I don't think you have to like all of their work to be a fan.I should say not. Loving everything isn't love; it may be some sort of emotional hangup or neurochemical pathology. More likely, claiming to love everything is a facile way of patting oneself on the back in full view of an audience.

To me, the issue isn't one of "true fan" versus "bogus fan" but of "interesting fan" versus "big fat bore." People who have strong likes & dislikes & who enjoy talking about them & hearing others talk about them are the interesting fans to me. Alternatively, the fans who make sweeping, irrational generalizations about what other fans should or shouldn't love or the fans who literally never have anything more to say than "cool" or "yeah" or "d'uh" or "hmmm" are bores in my eyes. The Internet is a medium of discourse; you need to say something.

[Johnny Stew]

I realize you're done with this, Johnny. But I suspect you would be hard-pressed to find where on this thread I insulted anyone's intelligence. Unless that is not what you meant.

You were right the second time... that's not what I meant. :)

I came to an interesting realization about all of this last night, after re-reading this thread a couple of times, trying to see exactly where everything "went wrong."
I've figured out that nothing you say should ever be taken seriously. :laugh:

That's not a dig, mind you, but rather something I've gleaned from your various posts in this thread and elsewhere.
If someone gets offended by something you've said, or feels insulted, you always quickly point out that you were just joking around.

I used to think that was just a cop-out, but now I've come to the conclusion that it's all just a big lark for you. You don't take any of it seriously... it's just that you've found a fun way for you to pass some time.

So, from here on out, I'm not taking anything you say seriously. In fact, others may want to do the same... and then hopefully that will forestall the potential for any future ill feelings. :)

Plus, it goes a long way in explaining some of the opinions you post! ;) :laugh:

[CarneVaca]

I've figured out that nothing you say should ever be taken seriously. :laugh:

Dammit!! Did you have to broadcast it!? :lol:

I used to think that was just a cop-out, but now I've come to the conclusion that it's all just a big lark for you. You don't take any of it seriously... it's just that you've found a fun way for you to pass some time.

Don't believe him, people!!! Johnny Stew is just messing with you. He will do that.

Don't believe him!

[shackin'up]

1. I didn't know that was Shania.
2. I did not even see that avatar until someone said something about it that draw my attention.
3. I read the whole thread. You guys sure can fill. But I'm still left with tight pants everytime I see the the presumed misinterpretation move. Its hot dammit.

[teedee]

I take it back then... you weren't being hypocritical. My apologies.

Maybe I can just say, "I was only joking." That seems to be the cure-all. :) ;)

Hopefully GretaRhiannon also felt that she was engaging in "fun repartée" and wasn't being insulted.



Johnny,
That post hit the nail right on the head!

Isn't it funny that she was suppose to see that it was a joke, but then he fails to see that you were using an example to make a point.

Great post Johnny- keep them coming.

[teedee]

Hopefully people are intelligent enough to not take comments made about celebrities and their crappy behavior personally. :)

Does that go for everyone here, lol, or just the people who "know"?

I dont think its taken so much as personally, as it is an automatic defense that a fan has for a celeb that they admire.

[CarneVaca]

Johnny,
That post hit the nail right on the head!

Isn't it funny that she was suppose to see that it was a joke, but then he fails to see that you were using an example to make a point.

Great post Johnny- keep them coming.

The peanut gallery woke up.

[teedee]

I realize you're done with this, Johnny. But I suspect you would be hard-pressed to find where on this thread I insulted anyone's intelligence. Unless that is not what you meant.



Telling someone because "you Know" and basically stating that they dont know. Just go back and read your own posts, instead of asking me to quoted you where you stated that. if something was suppose to be a joke, and you have to go back and state that it was intended as a joke, I guess that means that your supposed joke wasnt taken as funny. Its not lack of sense of humor on the other party, its the tone and manner in which you state your replies and I know that you are fully aware of that, thats why you always say, please quote me where I said that".

[teedee]

The peanut gallery woke up.



Yes I just woke up, as you so put it, while you have obviously been on going and on going. Oh and thanks for the kind words as always. Im sure you meant that in the kindest way right? Johnnys way of thinking about your posts are also right on the money.
You have made a hobby out of getting a rise out of people , everythings a joke, and supposed to be taken funny, yet your words dont send that message, hey what ever makes you happy, but I love johnnys way of thinking, i too will follow his method.

[Hawkeye]

OMG HOLY **** I can't believe it I just figured out what CarneVaca means by Rescind the Strike! You're talking about the strike you got on this board. You people have no idea how badly I've been puzzled buy that and was wondering what Carne was striking for. I thought it was some political thing. But after a freaking year it just clicked. I realize this has nothing to do with this topic and personally I don't care, screw you guys, you have no idea how big this was for me :laugh:

[HomerMcvie]

OMG HOLY **** I can't believe it I just figured out what CarneVaca means by Rescind the Strike! You're talking about the strike you got on this board. You people have no idea how badly I've been puzzled buy that and was wondering what Carne was striking for. I thought it was some political thing. But after a freaking year it just clicked. I realize this has nothing to do with this topic and personally I don't care, screw you guys, you have no idea how big this was for me
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: You're not alone! I, too, have always wondered what the strike comment was about, but was afraid to ask. We finally know! :blob1: :blob1: :blob1:

[Lisa1769]

I realize this has nothing to do with this topic and personally I don't care, screw you guys, you have no idea how big this was for me :laugh:


LMAO..... :laugh: :laugh: Gotta love them lightbulb moments!

[jbrownsjr]

I say we strike Carne! Naw let's just play When I see You Again at a slower RPM around 199,998 times.