Tusk - looking back 25 years later

[dontlookdown]

I love this review of Tusk - copied from Amazon's reviews





one of our greatest examples of American studio pop, October 13, 1999
Reviewer: M.I. from california After 20 years, this studio masterpiece stands the test of time right up there with Pet Sounds and The White Album. It is Fleetwood Mac at it's creative peak with some of the most beautiful three part harmonies ever recorded on tape. Rumours was great, but Tusk has so many golden moments it's frustrating to think that the band didn't continue in this vein. The fact that it was not a commerical blockbuster only makes it better; none of us are sick of these tracks from overplay on the radio. Buckingham and Nicks have never recorded at this level since - a requirement for anyone who's serious about collecting the greatest folk/rock/pop albums of our time.

[darklinensuit]

Originally posted by dontlookdown
I love this review of Tusk - copied from Amazon's reviews

Buckingham and Nicks have never recorded at this level since -

Thanks for sharing, but I disagree with this claim.

- Jake

[CarneVaca]

Originally posted by darklinensuit
Thanks for sharing, but I disagree with this claim.

- Jake

You're right. Out of the Cradle is on par.

[strandinthewind]

Originally posted by CarneVaca
You're right. Out of the Cradle is on par.

As was Bella Donna for La Nicks.

But even those two stellar efforts pale in Tusk's shadow. Tusk was just on another level and still is IMO :cool:

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by strandinthewind
As was Bella Donna for La Nicks.

But even those two stellar efforts pale in Tusk's shadow. Tusk was just on another level and still is IMO :cool:

Strand, you're absolutely right. They'll never top Tusk. Impossible.

:wavey:

[diamondsnake]

I like SYW much better then Tusk. Maybe only time will tell which one holds up better, but I only recently (a couple years ago) purchased Tusk, so to me they are the same age. I don't know- I just love SYW I guess.

[sorcerer0078]

I only just discovered 4 years ago that my parents had the Tusk album on LP since i was 2!!

Tusk would have to be my all time favourite album, 3 singer/songwriters, and a collection of songs that couldn't be more different than eachother!!

Songs like Sara, i have known & heard since i was 5 or 6 and the first time i ever heard Sisters of the moon was when watching the Mirage Video (thank u ebay!!!). When i heard it on Tusk for the first time, i loved it :)

On another note, i remember reading somewhere that alot of people thought that Tusk on LP, sounded very different to the CD version (maybe in depth, different instruments etc). Anyone care to agree or disagree?

I hope they release Tusk in 5.1!!!!!

:D

[Carolina Girl]

The fact that it was not a commerical blockbuster only makes it better; none of us are sick of these tracks from overplay on the radio.

I completely agree with the intent of this statement. I'm not "sick" of the overplayed songs, but I definitely don't listen to them by choice, even on The Dance. This is also why Tusk is currently my favorite. I usually end up overplaying my favorites until I'm almost sick of them...but nothing like what radio can do to a song!!

[Cammie]

:wavey: We agree 370%...TUSK is just a great work of
art! What an LP...so much richer and melodious
than any cd! Analog tape for me please!:blob1: Sky:)

[AgainLindsey]

thumbs up for lindsey's "the ledge" "not that funny" "that's enough for me" and "tusk." stark madness.

christine's tracks on "tusk?" ...ZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzz too, too easy-listening, IMHO.

"say you will" rocks more.

[Vianna]

They have never topped Tusk. I was just listening to it this morning again for probably the millionth time. I don't think they ever will top Tusk:)

[Siri Ruane]

Me neither. If there's one thing I love more than demos, its non-commercials albums. I'll be listening to Tusk, and Merle Haggard's new one for ages to come. :cool:

[CarneVaca]

Tusk is still No. 1 for me as well.

Cradle is a close second, and sometimes, it becomes No. 1. But Tusk is greatness, even with Christine's sleepers and the yawner that is Beautiful Child.

[4Buck]

>>>>TUSK is timeless with it's bevy of ballads and rock ravers. I love it! My calendar is marked for it's reissue date......

[Johnny Stew]

Actually, with 'Say You Will,' I think they've easily bested 'Tusk,' because they've found a way to marry the experimental, edgy side with the commercial, glossy side, in a way that draws you in and takes you on a journey from song to song. Rather than being totally off-balanced and somewhat alienating to the average listener, musically.

I think that's also the quality in 'Out Of The Cradle' that so many of us respond to... it's the perfecting of all of the best aspects of both approaches.

Having said that, 'Tusk' is a fabulous album with a lot of spirit and great music, and definitely deserves a lot of praise. :nod:

[strandinthewind]

Originally posted by Johnny Stew
Actually, with 'Say You Will,' I think they've easily bested 'Tusk,' because they've found a way to marry the experimental, edgy side with the commercial, glossy side, in a way that draws you in and takes you on a journey from song to song. Rather than being totally off-balanced and somewhat alienating to the average listener, musically.

I think that's also the quality in 'Out Of The Cradle' that so many of us respond to... it's the perfecting of all of the best aspects of both approaches.

Having said that, 'Tusk' is a fabulous album with a lot of spirit and great music, and definitely deserves a lot of praise. :nod:

While I agree that SYW is a nice marriage of that, I think LB just went too far with that computerized gimmicky voice stuff. Conversely, on Tusk, it is all emotion and raw at that. But - to each their own :cool:

[Johnny Stew]

Originally posted by strandinthewind
While I agree that SYW is a nice marriage of that, I think LB just went too far with that computerized gimmicky voice stuff.*lol*
Having lived thru 'Go Insane' and 'Tango In The Night,' I feel that the couple instances of VSOd voices on 'SYW' are actually quite tasteful, and while the choice was initially shocking in "Illume," I've actually grown to like it.
It's all part of that "edginess" we talked about.

But I see your point about a raw sound being preferable to a forceably created sound, because it's more emotional and real.
I guess it's just all about textures and where they're used.

[dissention]

I think that Stevie's stuff on Tusk is infinitely better than her SYW material, but I think Lindsey's stuff on both are equally amazing (although Save Me A Place, The Ledge, and Say Goodbye are the biggest masterpieces). :D

[dissention]

Originally posted by CarneVaca
Tusk is still No. 1 for me as well.

Cradle is a close second, and sometimes, it becomes No. 1. But Tusk is greatness, even with Christine's sleepers and the yawner that is Beautiful Child.

Christine's songs aren't very good, IMO, but I think every track of Stevie's is a classic. They are all amazing; the best she's ever put out. :nod:

[Johnny Stew]

Originally posted by dissention
I think Lindsey's stuff on both are equally amazing (although Save Me A Place, The Ledge, and Say Goodbye are the biggest masterpieces). :D It's funny, because I see a lot of people list "Save Me A Place" as one of Lindsey's best... whereas, for me, it's near the bottom of the list.

I like it a little better than I used to, but still... the song just seems to plod along with nowhere to go.
The harmonies are beautiful, but that molasses-rolling-up-a-hill-in-June tempo kills it for me.

Of course, as I've said before, it's all a matter of opinion, and no song is write-off, as long as it means something to someone. :)

[Mageboy25]

As much as I LOVE Tusk, I HATE Not That Funny. I think its the most annoying worst Lindsey song ever. I jumped for joy when I learned I wouldnt have to cringe through it on the SYW tour!

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by CarneVaca
and the yawner that is Beautiful Child.

you don't mean that. SAY YOU DON"T MEAN THAT!

:eek: :eek:

[ShamHy89]

Christine's songs aren't very good, IMO

I feel the exact opposite here. I have grown to absolutely love the vocals on Honey Hi, Over and Over is great, Never Make Me Cry is quite heartfelt (and sounds like The Way I Feel from MTM), and Never Forget is one of the biggest overlooked songs to me. The ending with Stevie singing "never forget" is just classic. Christine, did a nice job on the album in my opinion. Again though, to each his own :nod:

Shamus:)

[marc402]

The first time i heard tusk must have been around the dance period, about 2 years before i became a die hard fan.
I already had tango and rumours on cd, (and greatest hits,'88 european version and behind the mask on tape) so songs i knew were the title song and sara, but none of the other songs.
My uncle (of whom i borowed the Tusk cd at the time) told me "it is not anything like rumours i doubt you'll like it".
Well at that time he was right. I did not care for it at all and returned it to him after one listen.
When i became a diehard fan in '99 and i collected al my remaining mac albums on cd i ofcourse also bought Tusk.
With each listen i liked it beter and beter and beter.
Now it is even in my favorite cd list.
It has happend to me before that an album i don't like in the beginning (or don't much care for) i fall in love with later (supossed former infatuation junkie by alanis morissette and post by bjork come to mind)
I'm glad tusk was among them.
"Sisters of the moon" has even become my favorite altime song.
About the Christine tracks on Tusk, i can agree some may not be that memorable, but still some great gems in there "brown eyes" (hey i have brown eyes myself) and i love "never make me cry".
My favorite lindsey's include: "the ledge and "i know i'm not wrong"
So do i think it stood the test of time ?

It's way above time (no pun intended);)

greetings marc

[GypsySorcerer]

Originally posted by dissention
Christine's songs aren't very good, IMO, but I think every track of Stevie's is a classic. They are all amazing; the best she's ever put out. :nod:


Completely, totally agree about Stevie's tracks. Her best ever. Period.

As for Christine, I think her material here is weak, definitely the weakest of the three. However, I don't *hate* any of her songs on the album. And I think that Brown Eyes and Never Forget are two of the best songs she's recorded.

[wondergirl9847]

When I first became a fan of FM (back in March 2001), I bought Tango and Mirage first, knowing that I loved 80's music. Fell instantly in love with the band and it's sound. Then, I came online, read not very good stuff about Tusk being nothing like Rumours and I got scared. :laugh: I decided to wait to get Tusk after I got Rumours and the white album.

When I finally did get Tusk, I listened to it and went "Okay, some hit me right off the bat, some will take some getting use to." When I heard Beautiful Child, I fell in love with that song, it's my favorite off Tusk. Think About Me was another fave, it was so fun and upbeat. Lindsey's songs were crazy, nutty and at first, it was "Hmm...this is like Time Bomb Town Lindsey...I need to listen over and over (no pun intended. LOL) to fall in love with them."

Tusk is a journey. First, you go walking in the forest of mystic (Stevie's songs), then, you encounter the wild jungle and have adventures (Lindsey's songs) and lastly, you have the nice quiet walk in the woods (Christine's songs) towards home.

[Cristian]

I do believe that Tusk was possibly not Christine's best albums. Her songs sound a little repeated in lyrics, but they serve the purpose of slowing down the tempo and the mood (a pause from Lindsey) and giving the record some light, after the darkness of Stevie's songs (like the very sad "Storms"). Perhaps as individual songs they wouldn't work so well, but in the context of the album, I think they are perfect.

Plus, "Brown Eyes" might as well be one of the best things she's ever recorded; "Over & Over" and "Never Forget" are two great forgotten classics and "Think About Me" was even a small hit, and deserving so. :nod:

Oh... the album as a whole. Yes, I think Lindsey was the dominating force, his songs are crazy and I love them all except that he didn't need to write "Not That Funny" twice ("I Know I'm Not Wrong"); and I don't like "That's All For Everyone" either. Stevie presents some songs that would build her style as a solo artist in the future, being "Sara" the most brilliant in my opinion, although she has no low point in this album. Her five songs are great.

It's a fantastic listening experience. :)


Song of the moment - Love That Burns

[macfan 57]

I love Tusk. It used to be my favorite Fleetwood Mac album until I heard Mystery To Me. All 3 writers were in top form. "Brown Eyes" & "Storms" are my favorites. I think that Christine provided the needed balance between the Buckingham/Nicks songs. "Never Make Me Cry", "Think About Me" & "Over And Over" are especially terrific, in addition to "Brown Eyes", which is my favorite song on the album. I'm not normally a big Stevie Nicks fan, but this is probably her best batch of songs on any Fleetwood Mac album. "Storms" is my all time favorite song of hers and "Beautiful Child" is nearly as good. I think "Sara" is a bit tedious, but still OK. I really like most of Lindsey's songs here. "The Ledge", "Save Me A PLace" & "I Know I'm Not Wrong" are my favorites of his. "That's All For Everyone" meanders a bit, but is still OK. "I like "Not That Funny" on the album, but I HATE it live. It's too long & boring. I like Tusk better too when they played it live with Christine playing accordian. Tusk is a great album and it has aged very well over the years.

[diamondsnake]

Originally posted by strandinthewind
While I agree that SYW is a nice marriage of that, I think LB just went too far with that computerized gimmicky voice stuff. Conversely, on Tusk, it is all emotion and raw at that. But - to each their own :cool:

Oh I love that stuff, especially on Illume when Lindsey sings (in a woman's voice) "It's just like a river", then Stevie echoes that phrase in a computerized monotone voice. It is just too good for words!

[diamondsnake]

Does anyone else not care for Lindsey's stuff on this album? It is like he is too focused on being weird and being the exact opposite of Rumours that he forgets to make his songs listenable. I agree with Johnny Stew that SYW combines experimental with having mass appeal. Although SYW doesn't have that much mass appeal, it is still strange, you know?

Anyways, Tusk is one of my least favorites. SYW is better, imho, and at the moment is my favorite album.

[goldustboi]

Ironically Tusk is one of the last albums I bought and took me ages to get into but now its an absolute masterpiece - although for me its purely a phase album, when I love it I LOVE it but get tired of it easy. As for Christine, on the one hand, Brown Eyes and Honey Hi are 2 of my fave Christine songs, on the other hand, Never make Me cry is possibly the worst.

I know Im not wrong is the most underrated song on the album, and is also my 2nd favourite Lindsey song (after GYOW.Miranda and Cant go Back are close contenders!)

:nod: :nod:

[HomerMcvie]

Lindsey's songs are my favorite on Tusk. Chris has Think About Me, and Over and Over, and Stevie has Sara and Angel, but most else by the ladies is toooo lethargic. Good, but still sleepytime.......zzzzzzzz
Lindsey's have a very raw energy to them.

[dontlookdown]

i think one of the things that drew me into Tusk was because I was fifteen when it was released. I was too young to go to any of the Rumours shows so this was my first big FM album and Tour.
The Clash were just breaking in the states and I loved them along with Patti Smith and Springsteen.
Tusk almost felt "punk" after Rumours. I thought it was so adventurous of Lindsey to make the album and give it to the record company as a finished work after Rumours. Very brave and for me, Tusk is what made Fleetwood Mac rise to a level that the Eagles were never able to. They had a hard time breaking out of that "Eagles mold". Tusk and most of Lindsey's work proved that he had more in him than what casual fans expected.

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by dontlookdown
i think one of the things that drew me into Tusk was because I was fifteen when it was released. I was too young to go to any of the Rumours shows so this was my first big FM album and Tour.
The Clash were just breaking in the states and I loved them along with Patti Smith and Springsteen.
Tusk almost felt "punk" after Rumours. I thought it was so adventurous of Lindsey to make the album and give it to the record company as a finished work after Rumours. Very brave and for me, Tusk is what made Fleetwood Mac rise to a level that the Eagles were never able to. They had a hard time breaking out of that "Eagles mold". Tusk and most of Lindsey's work proved that he had more in him than what casual fans expected.

I second every word of your post, don't look down! I was just 14 and had the same experience. For me Tusk still has it totally. Also chris'songs! They add so much warmth and spirituality to the album!

And the risk of commercial suicide is so bravely taken by this band!

gerald

[cliffdweller]

Originally posted by strandinthewind
As was Bella Donna for La Nicks.

But even those two stellar efforts pale in Tusk's shadow. Tusk was just on another level and still is IMO :cool:

"Oooh, pale... shadow of an album"...

[cliffdweller]

Originally posted by ShamHy89
I feel the exact opposite here. I have grown to absolutely love the vocals on Honey Hi, Over and Over is great, Never Make Me Cry is quite heartfelt (and sounds like The Way I Feel from MTM), and Never Forget is one of the biggest overlooked songs to me. The ending with Stevie singing "never forget" is just classic. Christine, did a nice job on the album in my opinion. Again though, to each his own :nod:

Shamus:)

Agreed. Chris shines here, her best songs are on Tusk IMHO.

I love Tusk, mainly for its non-commercial appeal. I mean, we're not all sick of Tusk because it's played over and over (no pun intended) on the radio like Rumours was/is, so it's always fresh and interesting. It's my favorite Mac album by far.

[David]

Originally posted by diamondsnake
Does anyone else not care for Lindsey's stuff on this album? It is like he is too focused on being weird and being the exact opposite of Rumours that he forgets to make his songs listenable. Yes, he's very weird -- not just with the songs themselves (short, choppy bursts of lyrical & chordal ideas) but with the presentation (an element of "found sounds" & the use of conventional instrumentation unconventionally). Much of the appeal of "Tusk" for me & others is in our frame of reference. We were relatively intelligent teens at the time "Tusk" hit the market & we were sick of the sameness & blandness of radio. A lot of the artists who were making important strides in new directions, like Elvis Costello & the Clash, weren't getting any airplay on most stations. Pop music had got so dull & so tired that a lot of us were really suffering with slurpy crap like Randy Van Warmer's "Just When I Needed You Most," Robert John's "Sad Eyes," David Naughton's "Makin' It," Melissa Manchester's "Don't Cry Out Loud," empty, addleheaded cock rock like Pat Benatar's "Heartbreaker," disco with all the R&B juice squeezed out of it like Leif Garrett's "I Was Made for Dancin'" or Rod Stewart's "Do Ya Think I'm Sexy" & lots of crap by once-decent artists (Neil Diamond) & nonentities (Olivia Newton-John).

When all that sludge is being thrown at you day & night on the radio, your brain screams for something different. "Tusk" came along -- many of us were already big Mac fans -- & threw us for quite a loop. It was engaging & charming & even very funny, & it avoided many of the tired old conventions of track production. Our fans' pride in the band really grew at that point because it was so refreshing to hear the biggest rock group in the world produce tracks that used chair cushions as kick drums -- not just for the sake of novelty (anyone could have done that) but out of an expressive need for that sort of innovation. I would even go so far as to say that "Tusk" helped some of us hear differently.

[David]

Originally posted by dontlookdown
iVery brave and for me, Tusk is what made Fleetwood Mac rise to a level that the Eagles were never able to. They had a hard time breaking out of that "Eagles mold". Definitely. This was a prevalent view at the time, too. When the Eagles put out their 1979 "Long Run" album, it took just one quick listen & you knew that this was the sort of glossy, conventional "perfection" that Fleetwood Mac was reacting against.

[snwriter]

Stevie's stuff on "Tusk" is perfection; her best ever.
Christine's stuff on "Tusk" is excellent.
Lindsey could have used some editing on "Tusk" in my opinion:
The title track is a masterpiece, while "Walk a Thin Line" and "I Know I'm Not Wrong," and "The Ledge," are very very enjoyable.

"That's All for Everyone," "What Makes You Think You're The One," and "That's Enough for Me" are nice but are really song fragments, IMO.

"Save Me a Place" has some terrible vocals and would have benefited from the rest of the band's participation and
"Not That Funny" is just a bad song exhibiting Lindsey's most neurotic tendencies.

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by snwriter
Stevie's stuff on "Tusk" is perfection; her best ever.
Christine's stuff on "Tusk" is excellent.
Lindsey could have used some editing on "Tusk" in my opinion:
The title track is a masterpiece, while "Walk a Thin Line" and "I Know I'm Not Wrong," and "The Ledge," are very very enjoyable.

"That's All for Everyone," "What Makes You Think You're The One," and "That's Enough for Me" are nice but are really song fragments, IMO.

"Save Me a Place" has some terrible vocals and would have benefited from the rest of the band's participation and
"Not That Funny" is just a bad song exhibiting Lindsey's most neurotic tendencies.

*trying to bite his tongue off but not succeeding*

STOP!!

Anyone who devides the Album in three is not listening! This album is not to be portionalised!! Lindsey's work is EVERYWHERE on this album. He chose do be experimental in his own songs, as it comes to songwriting, but he is VERY experimental in the arrangements in Stevies songs, and in the way all the threeway-harmonies are recorded. i think that in Chris' songs Lindsey focussed on the "esoteric" -like he mentions a lot in interviews nowadays. i am convinced he had a big part in her songs, too on Tusk. The whole darkness on this album is his work, soundwise, in terms of vision on atmosphere etcetera.

If you listen to this album without preoccupation on the three songwriters you hear an album that is very coherent, in every song is an experimental touch. Sometimes in composition, sometimes in atmosphere, sometims in rythm or pace. And sometimes on everything at the same time.

And Not that funny is that one. You may not like it, It's the only song that hits it off diffently on all levels, and therefore is a
(maybe The) keysong on Tusk.

gerald.

PS: I understand people who say that IKINW and NTF are very alike, and that's the reason they don't like it. I'm not agreeing on that but OK. But if you think that IKINW is "very very enjoyable" (it's frickin brilliant!) and you despise Not that Funny, I am just going:eek: :eek: :eek:


did i mention that this is only an opinion?:wavey:

[snwriter]

This is all just my opinion too.

I broke down the songs among the songwriters since others in this thread did so also.

I think that the women's songs on Tusk are primarily their own and that Lindsey just added his touches.

I don't hear a strong Lindsey influence on "Think about Me," "Angel," "Beautiful Child," "Never Forget," "Over and Over" or "Brown Eyes."

And I still say (and many others agree) that "Not That Funny" is just a bad song and therefore not the linchpin of "Tusk," but rather its worst song. It also was the nadir of the "Tusk" shows.

[David]

Originally posted by snwriter
I don't hear a strong Lindsey influence on "Think about Me," "Angel," "Beautiful Child," "Never Forget," "Over and Over" or "Brown Eyes." "Angel" & "Think About Me"? Are you kidding?! Those two have Buckingham's arrangement, production & presentation ideas all over them.

And I still say (and many others agree) that "Not That Funny" is just a bad song and therefore not the linchpin of "Tusk," but rather its worst song. It also was the nadir of the "Tusk" shows. I've discovered over the years that the fans who love the old performances of "Not That Funny" are either musicians themselves or LB ladies: in the case of the former, they loved hearing the band open up & jam in that off-kilter way of theirs, & in the case of the latter, they loved watching Lindsey's pants jiggle while he moaned & groaned at the mic.

My opinion is that late 1980 performances of "Not That Funny" constitute the high point of that incarnation's live shows. In a typical "Not That Funny" jam, you could hear each of the four member's strengths & idiosyncrasies as a musician more clearly & forcefully than in virtually any other single number.

[snwriter]

Boy, I guess we each love FM for very different reasons.

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by snwriter
Boy, I guess we each love FM for very different reasons.

Definately.

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by David
"Angel" & "Think About Me"? Are you kidding?! Those two have Buckingham's arrangement, production & presentation ideas all over them.


Thank you for hearing the same as I do:laugh:
Also In a lot of songs the harmonies must have been arranged by him, to GREAT succes...like in honey hi and never forget...

I've discovered over the years that the fans who love the old performances of "Not That Funny" are either musicians themselves or LB ladies: in the case of the former, they loved hearing the band open up & jam in that off-kilter way of theirs, & in the case of the latter, they loved watching Lindsey's pants jiggle while he moaned & groaned at the mic.

Well....I'm not a musician and a "straight" male (maybe i like LB-ladies:laugh: ;) ) but I just love plain, pure belted out rock and roll....and that what he did...in a very raw way.

[wondergirl9847]

Although it's a bottom lister for me, I do love NTF live, especially watching him sing it on the Mirage video!! That song is kin to Rhiannon in that he has a sort of "exorcism" during it. :laugh:

[Johnny Stew]

Originally posted by snwriter
Boy, I guess we each love FM for very different reasons. Exactly :nod:
And that's why I've always said that, from their earliest recordings in 1967 to this very day, Fleetwood Mac really has something for everyone.
Folks just need to get past preconceived notions of what "Fleetwood Mac" is. :)

[littlelies7]

To this day, the album still kicks butt!!

"I Know I'm Not Wrong", "Never Make Me Cry", and "Angel"!! :thumbsup:

I like it tons better than SYW.

[HomerMcvie]

I've discovered over the years that the fans who love the old performances of "Not That Funny" are either musicians themselves or LB ladies
I could stand it if it weren't for the screaming at the end. It's absolutely gawd-awful. An embarrassment, not IMO, but fact.:eek: He had to be on something.

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by HomerMcvie
I could stand it if it weren't for the screaming at the end. It's absolutely gawd-awful. An embarrassment, not IMO, but fact.:eek: He had to be on something.

If this band ONLY was in "control-mode" they would have never appealed to me this much. I actually think I got overexcited when I heard 1980-live-album. Not only in the studio (on Tusk) but also live they gave the band the edge that made me a fan for life. Lindseys screaming on Come, NTF, the end of the chain-with stevie (mirage video) sometimes GYOW, Tusk, etc just adds the rock-and-roll animal-feel that made FM a pop-ROCK-band.

If you are embarrassed by that, think about getting loose sometime....or, if you can't, get on something.

And that's probably not a fact, either.:D

PS When lindsey "lets it go" (WMYTYTO-live, Go insane-live, even Big love-live, Come, etcetera he does not need anything. It's a given thing. You just have to dare to let it out. That's not embarrassing, it's honest, cool and vulnerable at the same time.

Fact?:laugh:

[HomerMcvie]

If you are embarrassed by that, think about getting loose sometime....or, if you can't, get on something.
Whatever, I'm loose. :laugh: I know most of the negative remarks I've read about the Mirage video are about NTF. For the record, I LOVE the album version! Unfortunately, I was around when the video came out, and, my casual FM fan friends were freaking out about getting me to fast forward through NTF. I know Lindsey was on his punk kick, but this screaming did NOT belong of a FM concert tape. I enjoy it until the ooh ooh arrrrrrrrrrgghhhhhh, ooh ooh arrrrrrrrrrrghghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh part.
"Taste stepped out the door"

[shackin'up]

For the record, I LOVE the album version!

Wow! that makes two of us on this board, Homer!! :laugh:

I enjoy it until the ooh ooh arrrrrrrrrrgghhhhhh, ooh ooh arrrrrrrrrrrghghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh part.

Okay, got ya. When you pronounce it so perfectly, you must have a karaokemachine. Admit it: you practise when nobody watches!:cool:

"Taste stepped out the door"

Well...I then I think it stepped out of me when I stepped into life

:eek:

G.:wavey:

[David]

Originally posted by HomerMcvie
I could stand it if it weren't for the screaming at the end. It's absolutely gawd-awful. I loved it because I thought it was funny! Plus, I loved hearing the band break it down & then vamp it up. You often got to hear some of Mick's best, most solid drumming on "Not That Funny" in those days.

[David]

Originally posted by shackin'up
Wow! that makes two of us on this board, Homer!! :laugh: I'm on record as saying that I think it's the best thing Fleetwood Mac ever recorded. People just thought I was nuts, but I did say it.

[David]

Originally posted by HomerMcvie
Whatever, I'm loose. :laugh: I know most of the negative remarks I've read about the Mirage video are about NTF. For the record, I LOVE the album version! Unfortunately, I was around when the video came out, and, my casual FM fan friends were freaking out about getting me to fast forward through NTF. I know Lindsey was on his punk kick, but this screaming did NOT belong of a FM concert tape. I enjoy it until the ooh ooh arrrrrrrrrrgghhhhhh, ooh ooh arrrrrrrrrrrghghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh part. Did you ever hear any of the performances from Japan in early 1980? I've never heard anything so funny from a rock band -- it's even funnier than Zappa. Rather than the simulated orgasm effect, it was more of a head-pops-out-from-behind-a-tombstone effect in the Haunted Mansion.

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by David
I'm on record as saying that I think it's the best thing Fleetwood Mac ever recorded. People just thought I was nuts, but I did say it.

sorry I missed it. But for now: I embrace your taste. maybe you are nuts. would you welcome me to your club?:laugh:


gerald

[wondergirl9847]

David, I think I downloaded a NTF not too long ago and I was rollin' laughing at the screams!!

You hit the nail...Haunted Mansion-like screaming, indeed. :lol:

Ooh, I wanna join the nutty club too!! :D

LOL

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by David
Did you ever hear any of the performances from Japan in early 1980?

Well, I haven't. your description totally attract me. Who in the world can be funnier than Zappa? The MAC??? I would love to hear it. If anyone has it and is prepared to share:

[email protected]

I've never heard anything so funny from a rock band -- it's even funnier than Zappa. Rather than the simulated orgasm effect, it was more of a head-pops-out-from-behind-a-tombstone effect in the Haunted Mansion.

sounds like heaven....:laugh:

gerald:wavey:

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by wondergirl9847
David, I think I downloaded a NTF not too long ago and I was rollin' laughing at the screams!!

You hit the nail...Haunted Mansion-like screaming, indeed. :lol:

Ooh, I wanna join the nutty club too!! :D

LOL

If I'm allowed and may invite one....you're on!!:laugh: :wavey:

[face of glass]

Originally posted by David
I'm on record as saying that I think it's the best thing Fleetwood Mac ever recorded. People just thought I was nuts, but I did say it.

I'd like to join the club too. As a showcase for the rhythm section and LB "NTF" was pretty much flawless. My musician friends have described the duel between Lindsey and John in the Mirage concert video as "spastic". I think that's an understatement. ;)

I am haunted by those vocal noises too. I guess when the arrangement got expanded they started out as a Talking Heads-type scarefest and then later turned into this horny moaning.

If anyone thought Lindsey was being completely serious there then I would disagree. It is so over the top and so utterly idiotic and macho-like that it can't be but another parody, like "Come" but with a totally different approach.

[CarneVaca]

Originally posted by shackin'up
you don't mean that. SAY YOU DON"T MEAN THAT!

:eek: :eek:

I do. Sorry. That song never did anything for me. Stevie sounds great and the arrangement is gold, but I can't listen to it. I find it utterly dull.

[CarneVaca]

Originally posted by snwriter
I think that the women's songs on Tusk are primarily their own and that Lindsey just added his touches.

I don't hear a strong Lindsey influence on "Think about Me," "Angel," "Beautiful Child," "Never Forget," "Over and Over" or "Brown Eyes."

And I still say (and many others agree) that "Not That Funny" is just a bad song and therefore not the linchpin of "Tusk," but rather its worst song. It also was the nadir of the "Tusk" shows.

:laugh: :laugh: I see, you're a joker. Can you honestly even imagine Christine bringing a song to Fleetwood Mac strictly based on the acoustic guitar, as in "Never Forget?" Please, if you can think of any other instance before Tusk, share with us. "Beautiful Child" has no strong Lindsey influence!? So you think that all those guitar parts and harmonies were thought up by Stevie? Not that she couldn't mind you; it's just that the whole treatment of the song is very Lindseyesque. Or "Angel." Did you watch the Making of Tusk video?

About the only song on your list that does not sound very Lindseyesque is "Brown Eyes." But guess what, do you think Christine would have brought it to the studio and have it produced that way if not for Lindsey? That minimalism has Lindsey all over it; even though the song doesn't sound very Lindsey, it still has his fingerprints.

Nothing on Tusk doesn't have a lot of Lindsey, even when a lot is just a little by design.

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by face of glass
I'd like to join the club too. As a showcase for the rhythm section and LB "NTF" was pretty much flawless. My musician friends have described the duel between Lindsey and John in the Mirage concert video as "spastic". I think that's an understatement. ;)

I am haunted by those vocal noises too. I guess when the arrangement got expanded they started out as a Talking Heads-type scarefest and then later turned into this horny moaning.

If anyone thought Lindsey was being completely serious there then I would disagree. It is so over the top and so utterly idiotic and macho-like that it can't be but another parody, like "Come" but with a totally different approach.

well of course it's going well with the lyrics, and i don't think he's serious on the content here, but he definately sound and looks deadserious in the delivery here. It's not that he's taking much distance ....

gerald

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by CarneVaca
I do. Sorry. That song never did anything for me. Stevie sounds great and the arrangement is gold, but I can't listen to it. I find it utterly dull.

amazing...for me that song has- like you can read in the marchnumber of uncut- a Gram and Emmylou with a popsheen-quality.

(Nice review of earls court in uncut: it's on burnish.net

Thea rocks. she typed it up.)

gerald

[snwriter]

CarneVaca:

I resent you calling me a joker. You have every right to believe that Lindsey is the chief architect of all FM songs, as you seem to do.

I choose to believe the reality that Christine and Stevie are great songwriters, often better than Lindsey, and that they have a major say in what THEIR songs sound (ed) like.

Yeah, the Tusk documentary shows Stevie and Lindsey working on "Angel" vocals together. So what? When (if ever) has Lindsey ever recorded a song as funky and as un-soupped up as "Angel?" Surely, Stevie's initial vision of the song had to be its main ingredient.

Lindsey's handprints are all over his songs on "Tusk." The brilliance of Stevie and Christine come out on THEIR songs on the "Tusk" album, and they were both in better than usual form. WIth the exception of the title track, it's the women's songs on "Tusk" that have stood the test of time.

[CarneVaca]

Originally posted by snwriter
CarneVaca:

I resent you calling me a joker. You have every right to believe that Lindsey is the chief architect of all FM songs, as you seem to do.

Forgive me. I thought you were being funny. I didn't make any statements about Lindsey being the "chief architect of all FM songs," but it's well documented that Tusk was primarily a Lindsey project. It was Lindsey, and to some extent Mick, against the rest of the band. So much so that when the album was perceived as a commercial flop, Lindsey suffered recriminations from the rest of the band. Surely that reaction would not have happened if he hadn't been the primary architect of the Tusk sound, don't you think?

The songs sound the way they do because of Lindsey. There's no way around that. As I said, even "Brown Eyes," the song that would seem to have the least Lindsey in it, betrays Lindsey's influence in its minimalist production. No way would Christine have done that on her own or with another producer. And no way would she have done Honey Hi and Never Forget as acoustic folk numbers.

As for Stevie's songs, she herself has said many times that Lindsey shaped the songs into the way we know and love them. Again, it's all well documented.

[snwriter]

"Brown Eyes" is highly reminiscent of the Peter Green-era of FM, it sounds very much like "Sun King" off the Beatles' Abbey Road, which John Lennon said was very influenced by the then current Fleetwood Mac. It also sounds more like a Bob Welch song than a Lindsey song. And Christine was a bandmember of both Green and Welch. Lindsey was not.

It's also well-documented that both Christine and Stevie resented the "credit" Lindsey kept taking for their songs during his interviews of the late '80s and early '90s.

[CarneVaca]

It also sounds more like a Bob Welch song than a Lindsey song. And Christine was a bandmember of both Green and Welch. Lindsey was not.

Lindsey was not a member of the band when Bob and Peter were. And they were not members when Lindsey was, which is when the song was produced and released. So what's your point?

[snwriter]

My point is that Christine could very well have been influenced by her past FM work with those other guys.

[CarneVaca]

Originally posted by snwriter
My point is that Christine could very well have been influenced by her past FM work with those other guys.

Granted, but that doesn't change the fact that the album sounds the way it does because of Lindsey. Neither Bob nor Peter were there in the studio telling Christine, "Let's record a song with just you and the keyboard." Ken Caillat himself said that the band had done all these elaborate arrangements and that Lindsey pulled down the sliders and said this is how he wanted the tunes.

[face of glass]

Originally posted by shackin'up
well of course it's going well with the lyrics, and i don't think he's serious on the content here, but he definately sound and looks deadserious in the delivery here. It's not that he's taking much distance ....

True. I believe he has a very strong male aggression/dominance side in him and that’s why he looks dead serious in there. But it’s not like he could not be intentionally exaggerating or smirking at himself in there just a little. :)

Originally posted by snwriter
I choose to believe the reality that Christine and Stevie are great songwriters, often better than Lindsey.

But LB isn’t necessarily often focusing on the songwriting itself. For the record: I think that in terms of “classic” songwriting (the school of Tin Pan Alley and the Beatles etc.) Chris beats Stevie and Lindsey easily. But then again SN and LB need not be as great in that area because Stevie covers her weaknesses up in performance while Lindsey puts his focus on the overall arrangement. He isn’t just speaking through the songwriting in there, he’s speaking to us through his guitars and every little bit of music he puts to the track.

Originally posted by snwriter
and that they have a major say in what THEIR songs sound (ed) like.

That I agree with. But I certainly don’t think that neither of them suggested Lindsey what to play because they are unable to imitate his playing skills. It’s Buckingham’s interpretation that seeps through in the end and he said a lot in all of the Tusk songs.

Originally posted by snwriter
"Brown Eyes" is highly reminiscent of the Peter Green-era of FM, it sounds very much like "Sun King" off the Beatles' Abbey Road, which John Lennon said was very influenced by the then current Fleetwood Mac.

Really? I don’t hear that; all I hear is the similarity between “Albatross” and “Sun King”. And Chris wasn’t a band member yet during the first success run of “Albatross”. That song (which is supposedly Shadows-influenced) sounds almost like an anomaly in the FM catalogue.

For me the main focus in the arrangement of “Brown Eyes” are Lindsey’s guitar parts and the vocal harmonies. Those harmonies have gone through Buckingham’s hands in the mixing board. You could state that Ken Caillat and Richard Dashut helped there too, but the overall vision to me seems to be Lindsey’s. There’s this quote from the sessions. I’m paraphrasing Sodascouts but here goes:

Originally posted by sodascouts
I remember Richard Dashut saying that for Tusk, they would get the song to something that sounded terrific and then Lindsey would say "Great, now let's turn all the knobs the other way and do the exact opposite." He wasn't going for what sounded terrific, he was going for what sounded different.

Now of course I partially disagree with what she wrote but you get the point, I hope. ;)

It’s Buckingham’s show all along. If you feel the repetitive piano riff of “Sara” or “Beautiful Child” represents a unique artistic vision then fine. For me it sounds like Stevie’s demos, although a bit more polished. The magic comes in when those guitars and the voice treatments enter the track. It isn’t just Stevie’s and Chris’ personality expressed in there, it’s Lindsey’s too. His guitar speaks through these and offers other points of view to the topic. He supports the ladies all the way on Tusk.

Originally posted by snwriter
It's also well-documented that both Christine and Stevie resented the "credit" Lindsey kept taking for their songs during his interviews of the late '80s and early '90s.

That I believe is just the band members’ unwillingness to attest much weight to Lindsey’s contributions. They still had a band to run and they still wanted to be successful; they didn’t want to admit that a large part of it may have come from a member who left them under bitter circumstances. It wasn’t yet the time to speak what they might have felt, it was time to colour it a little.

[shackin'up]

Hey snwriter,

why so defensive? i think Carne is right and saying-much better articulated-what I said before today. I also think that Chris and Stevie wrote the best material they ever did on Tusk. As a songwriter, they maybe even overrule lindsey on this album. But: to make an outstanding, businesswrecking, f*cking great and daring album: you just must have a vision. Lindsey had the vision. he worked it through like a real jerk and butthead but with a tremendous amount of taste and respect towards the compositions of the ladies. And on his own songs he went all the way: sometimes against the edge, sometimes on the edge and sometimes over the edge, but constantly on the ledge.:eek: Just give him the credit for that and admit that you can't fikkin name a few songs that you don't like on the album and then say: his contributions are overrated. Because in THAT case: I think you are missing the point.
:wavey:
gerald

okay, this post was written at the same time as Faces'....

man those fins write fast....

:laugh:

[snwriter]

I see the point of all those who give Lindsey the bulk of the credit for the "Tusk" album. What a lot of Lindsey-philes (who think he is "it" when it comes to FM records of the Rumours lineup) miss is that he had great basic songs to work with--often from Christine and Stevie.

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by snwriter
I see the point of all those who give Lindsey the bulk of the credit for the "Tusk" album. What a lot of Lindsey-philes (who think he is "it" when it comes to FM records of the Rumours lineup) miss is that he had great basic songs to work with--often from Christine and Stevie.

That's what I said...



And i am a Fleetwood Mac Fan. I was in the USA this year to see two shows. I saw one in Germany and one in London. Everywhere the same: 70% is coming for Stevie. I acknowledge that. So we Lindsey-philes are a minority.

But when it comes to Tusk: That is his album. Everyone of the band wanted a rumours 2, commercially speaking. He resented that and fought the battle. Now, for the last time I ask friendly:

don't overlook or ridicule that...it hurts me:laugh:

gerald

[snwriter]

I don't want to hurt you....okay:)

[Cammie]

:cool: Lindsey Never... took The Credit where it
was not DUE!!! Christine and Lindsey were
Musical Soulmates!He could play guitar around
her piano and altho' he wasn't a professional
musician as Christine was...they liked to work
to-gether!!! Stevie did chose to be the twirling
dervish/ look at me/ center stage Star!;) She
definitely did succeed! Christine is gone and
only the "boys" remain who she knows how to
manipulate! She said something like: I Listen to
the ppl in charge...then DO MY OWN thing!:eek:
That sounds like The SYW cd to me!!! The three
part harmony and Chris's elegance are missed!
SYW sounds flat and contrived!Give us TUSK!!!:cool::)

IOHO: Agreement with David and CarneVaca &
shakin' up...if your a Musician you "Get IT!"!!!:laugh:
We won't scream at you if you return the FAVOUR!Sky;)

[CarneVaca]

A few words about Christine:

I unfairly dismissed her Tusk songs as "yawners." I didn't mean all her songs in the album are that, but I see it came across that way. "Think About Me" and "Over and Over" are pretty good tunes. "Honey Hi" and "Never Forget" are really catchy folk numbers. I like "Brown Eyes" well enough but I have to be in the right mood for it. "Never Make Me Cry" is just plain dull to me. Sometimes I get "Never Make Me Cry" and "Brown Eyes" confused.

"Never Forget" has what I consider Christine's best lines ever: "What a wonderful night to be/The stars must be my friends to shine for me," which unfortunately are counterbalanced by the "cold/gold" lines. Still, there's an easy optimism in that song and "Honey Hi" that I find irrepressibly attractive. In general, Christine's songs in Tusk have an understated quality that now strike me as somewhat dull, now comforting. It really depends on my mood.

Before Tusk she had some real gems, including "Over My Head," probably my favorite song by her, and "Don't Stop," "Songbird" and "You Make Loving Fun." Before the Lindsey/Christine era, a lot of her songs feel like to me they are missing something, with a couple of exceptions, including "Why." What that something is may have to do with Lindsey's production, but I'm not sure. Maybe she just hadn't come into her own as a songwriter back then.

Christine doesn't inspire me all that much. A handful of her songs are excellent, but for the most part they strike me as OK or less. Her contributions to "Tango," however, were pretty damn good.

[chiliD]

Originally posted by shackin'up
man those fins write fast....

:laugh:


And they keep going, and going, and going, and going...and, going...and going........and going....

:laugh:

[chiliD]

Originally posted by CarneVaca
Before the Lindsey/Christine era, a lot of her songs feel like to me they are missing something, with a couple of exceptions, including "Why." What that something is may have to do with Lindsey's production, but I'm not sure. Maybe she just hadn't come into her own as a songwriter back then.

I don't think it really is a "production" issue. One of the things that Christine herself mentioned about her songs is that she used to sing in her lower vocal register. If you listen to her older songs ("Homeward Bound" & "Morning Rain" especially) she's singing really low. Around the Penguin album, she starts singing a bit higher, but it isn't until "Over My Head" & "Say You Love Me" until she starts using that upper register of her voice...and by Tango she's pretty much lost that lower register altogether. Although, that probably came due to Lindsey's influence...but, the trend had already started BEFORE Lindsey joined.

[Cristian]

Originally posted by CarneVaca
I unfairly dismissed her Tusk songs as "yawners."

And I was about to kick your butt because of that!!! :laugh:

Anyway it's good that you come to those conclusions after an analysis and don't just throw the conclusions to the table before even remembering what those tunes sound like. In matters of tastes we can all have some differences, but there are some points in which we can't lose objectivity. :)


Song of the moment - The Ledge

[CarneVaca]

Originally posted by chiliD
I don't think it really is a "production" issue. One of the things that Christine herself mentioned about her songs is that she used to sing in her lower vocal register. If you listen to her older songs ("Homeward Bound" & "Morning Rain" especially) she's singing really low. Around the Penguin album, she starts singing a bit higher, but it isn't until "Over My Head" & "Say You Love Me" until she starts using that upper register of her voice...and by Tango she's pretty much lost that lower register altogether. Although, that probably came due to Lindsey's influence...but, the trend had already started BEFORE Lindsey joined.

Interesting observation, Chili. Now I will listen to those songs and see if that is what I subconsciously detected.

[CarneVaca]

Originally posted by Cristian
And I was about to kick your butt because of that!!! :laugh:


I figured you would certainly appreciate my clarification. :laugh:

[Cristian]

Originally posted by chiliD
I don't think it really is a "production" issue. One of the things that Christine herself mentioned about her songs is that she used to sing in her lower vocal register.
Good point! "Morning Rain" is a great example of that way of singing. Perhaps for that very same reason, and although featuring fantastic lyrics, "Homeward Bound" must be her worst recorded vocal... even though it's kind of attractive because of that too!

You can easily notice the difference between those songs, and, say "Remember Me" from Penguin. I had never thought that it was just a register problem. I would, like Carne, have given credit to the production. But you made a great observation.


Song of the moment - The Ledge

[Johnny Stew]

Originally posted by Cammie
Stevie did chose to be the twirling
dervish/ look at me/ center stage Star!;) She
definitely did succeed! Christine is gone and
only the "boys" remain who she knows how to
manipulate! She said something like: I Listen to
the ppl in charge...then DO YOUR OWN thing!:eek:
That sounds like The SYW cd to me!!! The three
part harmony and Chris's elegance are missed!
SYW sounds flat and contrived!Give us TUSK!!!Hmm... I don't think Stevie in any way "manipulates" Lindsey, Mick & John, to get her way.
That line of thinking isn't at all fair to "the boys," who definitely have minds of their own.

And is there really anything wrong with listening to the "powers that be," and then doing your own thing anyway?
After all, Lindsey's been doing that very thing for decades.

Both Lindsey & Stevie are very strong personalities, and they're both extremely individualistic... and that's one of the most fascinating qualities about them as people. :)

(By the way, that particular comment was actually made by Stevie in regards to how she handles her solo career, not about Fleetwood Mac.)

I still say that, despite some of the songs being recorded six years apart, 'Say You Will' is remarkably cohesive, and covers several styles and approaches very ably and skillfully.
To me, it sounds like the culmination of all of the albums that preceded it. :)

[Johnny Stew]

As much as I love the album version of "Why," I have to say that I was pretty blown away the first time I ever heard a live recording of the band doing it after Lindsey & Stevie joined.

It was a minor change... extending the coda as a showcase for their three-part harmonies... but, for me at least, it made all the difference in the world.

If there were one pre-1975 Mac song that I would have wanted them to re-record with Lindsey & Stevie, it would easily be "Why."

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by Johnny Stew
As much as I love the album version of "Why," I have to say that I was pretty blown away the first time I ever heard a live recording of the band doing it after Lindsey & Stevie joined.

It was a minor change... extending the coda as a showcase for their three-part harmonies... but, for me at least, it made all the difference in the world.

If there were one pre-1975 Mac song that I would have wanted them to re-record with Lindsey & Stevie, it would easily be "Why."

Oh yes, agreed. Cause it's the best thing she's ever written...imo

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by CarneVaca

Christine doesn't inspire me all that much. A handful of her songs are excellent, but for the most part they strike me as OK or less. Her contributions to "Tango," however, were pretty damn good.

Oh i don't care for her contributions to tango! except isnt it midnight.

But- talking about tusk- she adds so much atmosphere and warmth to the album. I think it is great that she was not going for another dont stop or say you love me. these songs have more spirituality to them and are a great contrast to lindsey's songs. The darkness of the album was definately anchored by her, too.

For me, there are no weak points in tusk. maybe some weaker songs, but they have function towards the songs before and after. This is an album and not only a collection of songs, more than on any other popalbum.

[strandinthewind]

Originally posted by trackaghost
Yep, I agree. I do think Tusk is Lindsey's masterpiece for sure, but let's give the girls some credit please! They were all at the height of their powers on that record. If Stevie and Chris hadn't contributed such great songs (along with Lindsey's) the record may not be the classic it is now.

I had an old piano demo of "Sara" where the melody, chord structure, etc. are exactly the same. The same for "Storms." So, I think yes, the structure of the songs and the words are all from Stevie. I think where LB shines is the final majesty of Sara, which for me is in the subtle rolling guitar at the end right before the "all I ever wanted was to know . . . . " line. So, that song to me is a prime example of Stevie giving LB something great and he then turns it into a masterpeice. Interestingly, I think he runied SOTM - the piano demo was haunting and clever. IMO his, and we assume it is his, rocking version leaves me flat on the record. Live however is another beast altogether :laugh:

[David]

Originally posted by trackaghost
Yep, I agree. I do think Tusk is Lindsey's masterpiece for sure, but let's give the girls some credit please! They were all at the height of their powers on that record. If Stevie and Chris hadn't contributed such great songs (along with Lindsey's) the record may not be the classic it is now. I think that in the case of both Christine & Stevie, it's more than a simple case of bringing in a song: Stevie also contributes her lead & harmony vocal style (a single "ooh" or "aah" from her goes further in creating a mood or igniting excitement than whole stanzas sung by most other singers.

Christine also contributes her savvy little rhythmic piano parts (try listening to "Brown Eyes" without the Fender Rhodes, or "Angel" without the CP30).

Mick & John contribute their "feel" style of rhythm ("What Makes You Think You're the One" would be a lot less intense & singular without Mick's unique pounding attack).

All these Fleetwood Mac tracks would sound different (less interesting, to my ears) without these contributions to the sonic overall, regardless of which producer or band member was engineering & establishing track direction & tone.

[chiliD]

Originally posted by David


Mick & John contribute their "feel" style of rhythm ("What Makes You Think You're the One" would be a lot less intense & singular without Mick's unique pounding attack).



Are you sure that Mick is playing on "WMYTYTO"?? I always thought that was Lindsey's banging away on tincans or kleenex boxes or something. The sound is just TOO "un-Mick".

[Cristian]

I think I've read somewhere else that Lindsey spoke about this song in terms of being 'just him and Mick' in the studio... him playing the piano and singing and Mick playing the drums. Quite simple, and that the drumming was 'one of those great moments in music' and that it reminded him somehow of the "Instant Karma (We All Shine On)" Lennon track.

Of course now I'm not able to find the exact quote... :rolleyes: .



Song of the moment - Trouble

[strandinthewind]

Originally posted by David
. . . Stevie also contributes her lead & harmony vocal style (a single "ooh" or "aah" from her goes further in creating a mood or igniting excitement than whole stanzas sung by most other singers.

You knw that is so true. Look at her harmony on Gypsy, Little Lies, etc. Interestingly, when her voice lowered, these harmonies became porhaps a little more "forced" for want of a better word. IMO her probouinced and solo "ahhhhhhh's" in "Behind the Mask" (a great song) are flat. But, the rest of her in that song just make it better. Same for her harmonies is "Sky is the Limit." I have always said La Nicks was just born to sing harmony, which is far more difficult than singing lead.

Also, in the chorus of Dreams, Stevie sings the lead and the harmony with LB and CM singing with her on the lead and that song has some of her best oohhs and ahhhs ever :cool:

[CarneVaca]

Cristian, you are correct. That was something Lindsey said in one of the recent interviews. That is Mick on What Makes You Think You're the One. It sounds like Lindsey had to get Mick to "unlearn" what he knew about drumming to get that sound. Of course, there were similar experiences with Tusk and, I believe, Go Your Own Way.

David, you are quite right that Stevie and Christine didn't just drop songs and the magic happened in spite of them. To be sure, Stevie contributes some of her best stuff ever to this album and Christine's songs, though not terribly exciting to me, have a wonderful charm about them.

Since I am feeling generous today, I will even say this: I can take Beautiful Child when I'm in the right mood, but usually I skip it. Actually, Tusk is the only Fleetwood Mac album these days that I can play beginning to end without skipping songs. I can't even do that on Out of the Cradle as I tend to skip Doing What I Can.

[wondergirl9847]

Originally posted by CarneVaca
I can't even do that on Out of the Cradle as I tend to skip Doing What I Can.

I'll quote Strand and Chilid..."HERETIC!!"

:lol::lol:

Kidding. I friggin LOVE that song to death!!

[Johnny Stew]

That's actually one of my favorite songs, too, Christy... so you're definitely not alone. :)

"When the darkness comes, you've got to fly into the light... and what will be, will be."

[face of glass]

Originally posted by chiliD
And they keep going, and going, and going, and going...and, going...and going........and going....

:laugh:

As long as this band keeps on repeating itself on stage then fans should have the right to repeat themselves, no matter how redundantly. It's all direct influence! ;)

[Johnny Stew]

Originally posted by face of glass
As long as this band keeps on repeating itself on stage then fans should have the right to repeat themselves, no matter how redundantly. It's all direct influence! ;) Gaius, we don't repeat ourselves around here.
Not sure where you go that.

Now, as far as why I think "When I See You Again" is so brilliant, let me just say that....
;) :laugh: :laugh:

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by chiliD
Are you sure that Mick is playing on "WMYTYTO"?? I always thought that was Lindsey's banging away on tincans or kleenex boxes or something. The sound is just TOO "un-Mick".

Insteresting...the first couple of years after I bought Tusk I thought that, too. But on the other hand: the drumtrack is so frickin'brilliant that I also thought: this MUST be Mick, because lindsey can't do this! Okay, he can pound away on everything that is in his room at the moment, but he does not have ability of giving every hit " feel". And Mick was a master at that. (WAS, on say you will I only hear it on Come...Okay and on miranda, when you peel all layers off.....).

And, Chili, now you know it, maybe you should listen to it again and, with that perception in mind, maybe you hear it the same way as I do: very MICKISH!

[CarneVaca]

I was listening to What Makes You Think You're the One this morning and it struck me that the guitar tracks were too low. I want to hear more guitar.

[Carolina Girl]

Originally posted by CarneVaca
Actually, Tusk is the only Fleetwood Mac album these days that I can play beginning to end without skipping songs. I can't even do that on Out of the Cradle as I tend to skip Doing What I Can.

On Tusk, I skip Tusk! I like the song, but I played it to death when I was hooked on the Greatest Hits cd, so I never listen to it now. Maybe when the reissues come out, I'll go back to it.

On OOTC, I skip Turn It On. Something about that one...the way he pronounces the words just doesn't do anything for me.

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by CarneVaca
I was listening to What Makes You Think You're the One this morning and it struck me that the guitar tracks were too low. I want to hear more guitar.

That's partially the guilt of the transformation to CD. I'm expecting a lot here on the remaster......but I agree, it's a bit pulled back...

[face of glass]

Originally posted by Johnny Stew
Gaius, we don't repeat ourselves around here.
Not sure where you go that.
It’s just me I’m talking about; I’m repeating myself like Lindsey is recycling “Big Love”. And since it’s so long it’s a double sin. :)

[wondergirl9847]

Originally posted by Johnny Stew
Gaius, we don't repeat ourselves around here.
Not sure where you go that.;) :laugh: :laugh:

I don't believe I've ever mentioned that Lindsey rules and my favorite song is I'm So Afraid.

Just thought I'd let ya'll know that. ;)

:laugh:

[stefan]

Originally posted by CarneVaca

To be sure, Stevie contributes some of her best stuff ever to this album and Christine's songs, though not terribly exciting to me, have a wonderful charm about them.

Since I am feeling generous today, I will even say this: I can take Beautiful Child when I'm in the right mood, but usually I skip it. Actually, Tusk is the only Fleetwood Mac album these days that I can play beginning to end without skipping songs. I can't even do that on Out of the Cradle as I tend to skip Doing What I Can.
O.K. I`ll be the bad guy to disagree concerning Christine :laugh: Although TUSK is my favourite FM album I skip a lot of songs. A contradiction? Yes and no. I simply can`t stand Christines contributions and always felt that they were misplaced on the album. Of course I have to admit that she is not my favourite band member. But I still like a lot of her songs from the 80's and from the pre Rumours era so it`s not a general point. But the "Yawners" are clearly on her side imo. I only used TABM for my private copy because I think it`s a fine example for a good LB/Christine collaboration. Now after a long long time, I listened to her tracks again because of the discussions we had during the last weeks. I can tolerate "Never forget" as an O.K. song. But Brown eyes, Honey Hi, and Never make me cry makes me either shiver or fall asleep at once. For me Tusk is a great balance between Lindseys strange tunes and Stevies epics. Christines songs don`t fit in the concept of the album- I don't see a connection between say WMYTYTO or NTF and Honey hi... And interestingly some friends who discoverd FM and Tusk at the same time I did, felt the same way. I suppose people who love her tracks first, are not too fond of the strangies from LB vice versa...?
As for Beautiful child, I`m not that euphoric about the song as some of the others here but I do like it. No Stevie song on Tusk is weak- I just like Storms, SOTM and Sara better. At the moment I would pick Storms as my fav from Stevie Tusk but that may change on a regular basis :laugh: Dito with LB`s songs.

[stefan]

Originally posted by Carolina Girl
On Tusk, I skip Tusk! I like the song, but I played it to death when I was hooked on the Greatest Hits cd, so I never listen to it now. Maybe when the reissues come out, I'll go back to it.

On OOTC, I skip Turn It On. Something about that one...the way he pronounces the words just doesn't do anything for me.
Yeah, what kind of accent is he trying to copy there? "you can reach for the skooy" "You can live you can doooy" "you don`t even know whoooy" Arictocrat-like or what? :laugh:
But musically I like it a lot-it`s one of my favs, probably because english is not my first language and the music comes first.
Another one is "Toooime, this it the tooooim" :laugh:

[wondergirl9847]

Ya'll are crackin' me up!! I agree, when I first heard Turn It On, I was :confused: because of his accent. It just seemed weird and out of place compared to the rest of the album.

I've always thought he was lying about being from California, he sometimes sounds more from Texas or at least, the South. :laugh:

Screwball. LOL

[Vianna]

I heard that Peter Green plays on some of the Tusk songs. Anyone know which ones?

[CarneVaca]

Originally posted by stefan
I simply can`t stand Christines contributions and always felt that they were misplaced on the album.

Disagree. I believe the songs fit because of the mix of musical styles present in this album. Even Lindsey's contributions, from song to song, don't quite go together stylistically. I mean, what does That's All for Everyone have to do with Tusk the song, for instance? Or Save Me a Place and The Ledge.

But there is an organic feel to just about all the tunes, probably owing to Lindsey's half-finished illusion and Christine's folk forays, that somehow glues them all together. Even where you find more evidently elaborate production, as in Sara and Not That Funny, there is a raw edge to the songs. In Not That Funny, the thing that's always appealed to me, besides the halting beat, is the three lead guitars at the end. It's a beautiful mess.

[Cristian]

Originally posted by stefan
I simply can`t stand Christines contributions and always felt that they were misplaced on the album.

Misplaced? No, I'm not with you at all on that one! This album is sort of a collage, I always see it as a collection of pictures or something. And in that context, of course Christine's contributions can be called "yawners" or "sleepers" because they tend to keep the tempo and the feel of the album a little laid back, a little slowed down, but I believe it's necessary.

When you get the brainstorm of Lindsey tracks like "Not That Funny" or "What Makes You Think You're The One" and the extremely dark references and hard-to-handle-at-first Stevie lyrics, this album is simply not a 'light' thing to listen to. Then you get Christine to sort of ballance it all, to give you a calmer view on things and put sort of a rest into the whole thing. Like a hard moment in life... you always need that rest. Christine provides that, in my humble opinion, and those much needed 'breaks' a-la "Honey Hi" or "Never Make Me Cry" are the one and only reason why I don't skip tracks on this album.

That, and the fact that I think that "Brown Eyes" has to be the best track on it.



Song of the moment - Fire Burning

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by CarneVaca
Disagree. I believe the songs fit because of the mix of musical styles present in this album. Even Lindsey's contributions, from song to song, don't quite go together stylistically. I mean, what does That's All for Everyone have to do with Tusk the song, for instance? Or Save Me a Place and The Ledge.

But there is an organic feel to just about all the tunes, probably owing to Lindsey's half-finished illusion and Christine's folk forays, that somehow glues them all together. Even where you find more evidently elaborate production, as in Sara and Not That Funny, there is a raw edge to the songs. In Not That Funny, the thing that's always appealed to me, besides the halting beat, is the three lead guitars at the end. It's a beautiful mess.


TADAAA!!!!

Thank you for saving me type-work.

word for word, syllable by syllable. It's scary. I'm almost glad that I disagree with you on the perception of beautiful child.:laugh:

It's a beautiful mess.

Now THAT's why I totally love the studioversion. It's on so many fans' bottomlisters that it feels really good that yr' with me ( and SOME others ) on this one...

gerald

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by wondergirl9847
I don't believe I've ever mentioned that Lindsey rules and my favorite song is I'm So Afraid.

Just thought I'd let ya'll know that. ;)

:laugh:

Oh, shocking!:eek:

Gerald.

ps: I'd like you all to know that I think that Tusk is The Best Album Ever Recorded By Anyone.

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by Cristian
Misplaced? No, I'm not with you at all on that one! This album is sort of a collage, I always see it as a collection of pictures or something. And in that context, of course Christine's contributions can be called "yawners" or "sleepers" because they tend to keep the tempo and the feel of the album a little laid back, a little slowed down, but I believe it's necessary.

When you get the brainstorm of Lindsey tracks like "Not That Funny" or "What Makes You Think You're The One" and the extremely dark references and hard-to-handle-at-first Stevie lyrics, this album is simply not a 'light' thing to listen to. Then you get Christine to sort of ballance it all, to give you a calmer view on things and put sort of a rest into the whole thing. Like a hard moment in life... you always need that rest. Christine provides that, in my humble opinion, and those much needed 'breaks' a-la "Honey Hi" or "Never Make Me Cry" are the one and only reason why I don't skip tracks on this album.

That, and the fact that I think that "Brown Eyes" has to be the best track on it.



I never skip, and have never skipped a song...for 25 years in october. I only disagree on your favorite track but hey peanuts...

Yes Tusk is an organic whole: about going nuts: lindsey (Neurotic schizotype), searching for meaning: stevie (depressed hysterical type) and searching for peace: christine. (the monitor, searching for balance).

Ooh, there's the home, garden and kitchen-psychologist again.....

*Note to self: ask help* :laugh:

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by wondergirl9847
Ya'll are crackin' me up!! I agree, when I first heard Turn It On, I was :confused: because of his accent. It just seemed weird and out of place compared to the rest of the album.

I've always thought he was lying about being from California, he sometimes sounds more from Texas or at least, the South. :laugh:

Screwball. LOL

I still love Turn it on a lot. I like the play with the accent. I only wish he'd recorded it with a rockin' rythmsession. Oh I'd Love to scream that one into a mic. If I could only sing....:D

[chiliD]

Originally posted by Vianna
I heard that Peter Green plays on some of the Tusk songs. Anyone know which ones?


Just one. "Brown Eyes"...even then only the guitar solo right as the song fades out.

[Johnny Stew]

Originally posted by face of glass
It’s just me I’m talking about; I’m repeating myself like Lindsey is recycling “Big Love”. And since it’s so long it’s a double sin. :) Oh no, no, no... I hope you didn't misunderstand what I was saying in my post!

I was being tongue-in-cheek... that's why I brought up "When I See You Again"... since, as you know, it seems I'm always defending that song! Repeating myself, and all.

I hope you didn't misunderstand, Gaius. :)

[Johnny Stew]

Originally posted by Carolina Girl
On OOTC, I skip Turn It On. Something about that one...the way he pronounces the words just doesn't do anything for me. I love that song, but I do agree with you about his misguided choice of pronunciation.

Of all of Lindsey's idiosyncrasies, that's really about the only one that I can't find an appreciation for.
Thankfully he doesn't do it too often... and "Turn It On" is probably the worst offender.

[chiliD]

Originally posted by CarneVaca
Actually, Tusk is the only Fleetwood Mac album these days that I can play beginning to end without skipping songs. I can't even do that on Out of the Cradle as I tend to skip Doing What I Can.

I skip a LOT of songs on Tusk...only because I have it programmed in my player as basically a single album length album.

My running order:

Honey Hi
Angel
What Makes You Think You're The One
Think About Me
Save Me A Place
Sara
Never Forget
I Know I'm Not Wrong
Brown Eyes
Sisters Of The Moon
Tusk
Over & Over

Occasionally, I'll swap "Walk A Thin Line" for "Save Me A Place" and/or "Storms" for "Sara".

With Out Of The Cradle, I usually will get through the whole thing...but, if I DO skip something, its "Street Of Dreams".

[Johnny Stew]

Originally posted by chiliD
With Out Of The Cradle, I usually will get through the whole thing...but, if I DO skip something, its "Street Of Dreams". :nod: :nod: :nod:

Sorry, Christy! *ducks*

[wondergirl9847]

Don't apologize, we all skip something, right?

I know WHY Chilid skips SOD...we had a discussion on the LB forum.

I don't skip FM songs that much, and even my bottom listers get listened to. The only song I NEVER EVER listen to...Sugar Daddy. I just CANNOT do it. I've tried many times. :shrug:

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by wondergirl9847
Don't apologize, we all skip something, right?

I know WHY Chilid skips SOD...we had a discussion on the LB forum.

I don't skip FM songs that much, and even my bottom listers get listened to. The only song I NEVER EVER listen to...Sugar Daddy. I just CANNOT do it. I've tried many times. :shrug:


:nod: :laugh:
I'm so glad it's not on Tusk. Otherwise I had to skip a song. :)

[sparky]

This thread inspired me to listen to the whole record all the way through for the first time in forever. While some of LB's songs still annoy me, I like them much more than I used to. NTF has really grown on me. The live version still seems like a seizure but I love the studio version.
CM's songs ground the record for me. They are better than I remember. NMMC was never a fave and still isn't, but the others are all well crafted and some make me feel all fuzzy and happy inside. Pretty cool, after all these years.
Stevie did contribute some of her best material ever to this record. But, the best thing about her songs is her delivery. She hasn't used her voice with such finesse and grace since. I had forgotten how much power she could have when she used her voice so softly and gently. Evidently she has too. "Goodbye Baby" is the only return to that style since. Her vocal on "Sara" is transcendent. Damn that edit version though !

[snwriter]

The only song that I can't listen to (but do sometimes) is "Not That Funny," especially live and especially on the video.

The only BN era songs I don't enjoy besides that are "Love Shines," especially the "on and on it will always be rhythmn rhyme and harmony" part, the live "Stand Back" on the 25 years box set, "Empire State," "You and I," and sometimes "Family Man."

From, BTM I sometimes skip "Stand on the Rock."

On Time, I skip Dave Mason's songs and I find Chris' songs very bland except for "Nights in Estoril."

Pre BN--There are a few Bob Welch songs I don't love, but I listen to------the Chris songs are generally very good if not optimally produced.

Green era--I don't skip anything but I play the standout cuts like "Green Manalishi," "Another Woman" and "Man of the World" a lot more than some others.

The only Kirwan song I skip is "Dust"--It reminds me of "Dust in the Wind," that old Kansas hit that I hate. And I don't always play "Thoughts on a Grey Day."

[chiliD]

Originally posted by Johnny Stew
:nod: :nod: :nod:

Sorry, Christy! *ducks*

Originally posted by wondergirl9847
Don't apologize, we all skip something, right?

I know WHY Chilid skips SOD...we had a discussion on the LB forum.

Yeah, it's been discussed, dealt with...along with admonished & repentant.

{sorry, can't hold the laughter back any longer}
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

[David]

Originally posted by sparky
NMMC was never a fave and still isn't Sparky, have you heard the acoustic piano studio take of NMMC? You might like that much (or a little) better than the "Tusk" take. If you haven't heard it, you can download it from Tiff's excellent site Blue White Fire (www.bluewhitefire.com/downloads.htm). It's got an unidentified string & flute patch (very natural woodwindy-sounding) during the short instrumental bridge. Anyone know what that is? Unless it's actually acoustic, it's probably some sort of analog synth, like the ARP 2500/2600 or the Yamaha CS family (5/40/80). I guess it could have been something like the CS-80, which had string & flute voicings & which was real cutting edge during the years 1977 to 1980. A bunch of famous guys used it -- mostly for studio work -- including David Edelstein of Bob Welch's band, Steve Winwood, Tony Banks of Genesis, Kate Bush, Brian Eno, Peter Frampton, Peter Gabriel, Daniel Lanois, Paul McCartney, Billy Payne, Stevie Wonder & Rick Wakeman.

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by David
Sparky, have you heard the acoustic piano studio take of NMMC? You might like that much (or a little) better than the "Tusk" take. If you haven't heard it, you can download it from Tiff's excellent site Blue White Fire (www.bluewhitefire.com/downloads.htm). It's got an unidentified string & flute patch (very natural woodwindy-sounding) during the short instrumental bridge. Anyone know what that is? Unless it's actually acoustic, it's probably some sort of analog synth, like the ARP 2500/2600 or the Yamaha CS family (5/40/80). I guess it could have been something like the CS-80, which had string & flute voicings & which was real cutting edge during the years 1977 to 1980. A bunch of famous guys used it -- mostly for studio work -- including David Edelstein of Bob Welch's band, Steve Winwood, Tony Banks of Genesis, Kate Bush, Brian Eno, Peter Frampton, Peter Gabriel, Daniel Lanois, Paul McCartney, Billy Payne, Stevie Wonder & Rick Wakeman.

HOLY FRICKIN COW! That's an unbelievable version. so pure.
Come on Go there and listen! I've never heard this. Thanks for the link!!!

[sparky]

Originally posted by David
Sparky, have you heard the acoustic piano studio take of NMMC? You might like that much (or a little) better than the "Tusk" take.

No, I haven't. But I will in the next few minutes. The thing that kills it for me is that underwater vibrato quality to the keys. It always had a tinge of David Gates to me - blech !
All over the download. Thanks for the info.

[strandinthewind]

Originally posted by shackin'up
HOLY FRICKIN COW! That's an unbelievable version. so pure.
Come on Go there and listen! I've never heard this. Thanks for the link!!! I LOVE her :(

[Cristian]

Originally posted by wondergirl9847
Don't apologize, we all skip something, right? Not in Tusk! :laugh:

Well... of course "Family Man" is always a skipper for me when I hear Tango; and "Caroline" too... and the album often ends up with "When I See You Again". And I often find myself not listening to "Oh Diane" or "Empire State"... or "Hard Feelings" on Behind The Mask; or "I Got It In For You" in Time; or any of Mick's spoken tracks ("These Strange Times", "Lizard People"). The Mrs. Scarrot poem... well I can handle it. But not that much.

And that would be about it, with Fleetwood Mac. Excluding solo carrers, that is. Another huge difference.


Song of the moment - Somebody


P.S. OMG, that version of "Never Make Me Cry" is astonishing. Thanks to Tiff for posting and to David for the link! :)

[sparky]

WOW. Kudos to Tiff and thanks David for the link. That blows the album version all the way to the moon. It almost sounds like there are some extra transitional chords in there, and beautiful ones at that.

[golden braid]

Originally posted by sparky
WOW. Kudos to Tiff and thanks David for the link. That blows the album version all the way to the moon. It almost sounds like there are some extra transitional chords in there, and beautiful ones at that.

I agree. This version is beautiful. I don't understand why they didn't pick it for the album.

[David]

Speaking of Christine, occasionally you can find a Yamaha CP-30 on eBay that's in great condition. The CP-30 is the electronic piano that Chris played on the Tusk, Mirage & '84 solo tours, as well as on the "Tusk" & "Mirage" albums (on tracks like "Over & Over," "Think About Me," "Sisters of the Moon," "Angel," "Honey Hi," "Never Forget" & "Straight Back"). For you demo collectors, she also played it on the Mac demos for "Beauty & the Beast" & "If You Were My Love." The CP-30 is a heavy mother, but any of you keyboardists out there who want to emulate Christine's sound on those classic Mac tracks may want to check out the CP-30 auctions on ebay, including this one: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3702709681&category=38091

$295 is a little steep -- you can still find them for around $150 or $200 -- but isn't bad for this baby. Beware of the instrument's weight, however. It's about 125 pounds. It's a fantastic piece of gear -- I own two of them myself! I don't move them around much, but nothing else beats them when you want to play something like "Angel."

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by golden braid
I agree. This version is beautiful. I don't understand why they didn't pick it for the album.

It's a friggin' anthem. I never gave this song songbird-quality. But in this version it has. I'm really impressed and yes, this one should have been on the album.

gerald

[strandinthewind]

Originally posted by shackin'up
It's a friggin' anthem. I never gave this song songbird-quality. But in this version it has. I'm really impressed and yes, this one should have been on the album.

gerald As much as I love LB, this alt take is an example of his over production quality!!!! :D SOTM is another IMO. Having said that, CM must have been satisfied with the album cut because she allowed it. So, LB is just one factor in the equation, etc. :cool:

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by strandinthewind
As much as I love LB, this alt take is an example of his over production quality!!!! :D SOTM is another IMO. Having said that, CM must have been satisfied with the album cut because she allowed it. So, LB is just one factor in the equation, etc. :cool:

Don't know strand, çause this "stripped downversion" sounds very lindsey-tuskera to me. I can imagine they did both because they wanted some pop-productions on it, too. Would be a nice question to chris and lindsey: which one did you want on the album, and which one do you prefer? (not necessarily the same answer.)

:wavey:

gerald

[strandinthewind]

Originally posted by shackin'up
Don't know strand, çause this "stripped downversion" sounds very lindsey-tuskera to me. I can imagine they did both because they wanted some pop-productions on it, too. Would be a nice question to chris and lindsey: which one did you want on the album, and which one do you prefer? (not necessarily the same answer.)

:wavey:

gerald

I reread my post and I think I was unclear :eek: I meant to say this alt take is much better to me than the album cut. The album cut, while good if not great as well, is just too produced for me when compared to this alt take. :cool:

[CarneVaca]

Originally posted by shackin'up
It's a friggin' anthem. I never gave this song songbird-quality. But in this version it has.

And that's why it didn't make the album. Lindsey told me that as pretty as this version is, it harkened back too much to the Rumours sound and was antithetical to what he was trying to achieve with Tusk.*









*imagined conversation

[shackin'up]

*imagined conversation [/B]

Oh, explaining your humour, that's strong...:laugh:

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by strandinthewind
I reread my post and I think I was unclear :eek: I meant to say this alt take is much better to me than the album cut. The album cut, while good if not great as well, is just too produced for me when compared to this alt take. :cool:

maybe you can express yourself better in french...

tu ne me pas pleurer...

pardon my french:)

[CarneVaca]

Originally posted by shackin'up
Oh, explaining your humour, that's strong...:laugh:

Well, we were talking about Tusk, Fleetwood Mac's other albums and the general state of today's music over bowls of chili con carne.*







*This too is a fabrication.

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by strandinthewind
The album cut, while good if not great as well, is just too produced for me when compared to this alt take. :cool:

Yes i agree. I just compared them, and the pureness of this alt.take is unbeatable. She sounds so much more vulnerable. The ONLY thing that this version lacks compared to the albumcut is that fact that I know i'm not wrong is not immediately starting afterwards.


gerald

[strandinthewind]

Originally posted by shackin'up
maybe you can express yourself better in french...

tu ne me pas pleurer...

pardon my french:)

d'accord mon amis!!!!

[strandinthewind]

Originally posted by CarneVaca
Well, we were talking about Tusk, Fleetwood Mac's other albums and the general state of today's music over bowls of chili con carne.*







*This too is a fabrication.

becuase chili is never with carne :cool:

:laugh:

[face of glass]

Originally posted by CarneVaca
And that's why it didn't make the album. Lindsey told me that as pretty as this version is, it harkened back too much to the Rumours sound

I concur. It is essentially a repetition of “Songbird” atmosphere-wise, it has the same sense of bitterness in there. Still great of course.

I just like the album version more. In between the erotic dream of “Brown Eyes” and the life-affirming naivety of “I Know I’m Not Wrong” the alternate one just doesn’t fit.

Originally posted by strandinthewind
The album cut, while good if not great as well, is just too produced for me when compared to this alt take.

Opinion appreciated. I think the album version doesn’t really have that much production in it. The accompaniment sounds like it’s coming from a transistor radio from the other side of the room and Chris is right there in front of you singing and staring into nothingness through blank eyes. That’s more heart-breaking for me, especially when you consider the first verse. It’s like nothing can hurt the woman. She’s surrounded by this self-made wall that she’s built up for her protection. The backing track of that one has almost an ambient-like hum to it. It’s a sea of huge emptiness that only emphasizes the vulnerability of the vocal.

Ah, preferences, schreferences. :)

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by CarneVaca
Well, we were talking about Tusk, Fleetwood Mac's other albums and the general state of today's music over bowls of chili con carne.*

*This too is a fabrication.

:laugh: :laugh:

wouldn't it be nice to do that once for real?


Well, we were talking about Tusk (...) over bowls of chili con carne.

...just to gather arguments for promoting and defending Fleetwood Mac towards the major part of our friends and collegues who like Eels, Masters of Reality, At the Drive In, Muse and White Stripes. On the Ledge we feel strong, but outside everybody thinks I dance around all day on "little lies". :eek:

[secondhandchain]

The album version of "Never make me cry" is great. It's got a other worldly quality that is so cool. Totally disagree.

[shackin'up]

I just downloaded a tusk-rehearsal-live version of I know I'm not wrong, which is quite a nice tune,:D , It's very unfinished but nice to hear ( could have been an Undertones-tune in this version). Did they put it in the set Back then? Never heard a live version before, and I was thrilled to hear this one. What do you all think about it? ( the guitarmess in the end could have been better. But I like the drive of the song...)


gerald

PS: it's on buckinghamnicks.net
Thanks a lot for posting it !

[face of glass]

Originally posted by shackin'up
What do you all think about it? ( the buitarmess in the end could have been better. But I like the drive of the song...)


The ending solo sounds like a sloppy mess but I guess he wasn't trying to polish it up yet. It's worth a listen though, if only to hear the funny LB & SN vocals replacing the original harp riff. LB's the naive one and SN is the cynical one here. :laugh:

[shackin'up]

Originally posted by face of glass
The ending solo sounds like a sloppy mess but I guess he wasn't trying to polish it up yet. It's worth a listen though, if only to hear the funny LB & SN vocals replacing the original harp riff. LB's the naive one and SN is the cynical one here. :laugh:

About the vocals: they're great, I agree on that! But the cynical/naive thing, isn't that projection? Yes I can "hear"that too, because I think in the content of this song: stevie could have voted this one out of the set:laugh: This song could have given her the "go your own way-rejection-feel".

gerald