Behind the Mask rated better than SYW

[Rainman]

I didn't realize this before, but in 1990 Rolling Stone gave "Behind the Mask" 3.5 stars. I have no beef with this, because I liked the album.

But this is a better rating than they gave SYW. (3 stars)

What do others think about this? Is it justified to rank BTM over SYW? Personally, I think SYW is way stronger.

Opinions? Comments? :confused:

[HollywoodSteve]

I think both albums deserved a better rating...

[sparky]

Rolling Stone reviews are frequently idiotic, and have more to do with fads than substance. Varies with the reviewer, but I consider them suspect more often than not. What they do say is so brief, it is more of a blurb than a review anyway.

[Johnny Stew]

Believe it or not, 'Behind The Mask' and 'Street Angel' were both reviewed pretty favorably in their day. It's only now that fans tend to look at them as "lesser" releases.

I quite like both albums, "flaws" and all. :)

[sparky]

Actually, I like BTM just fine. The title track is one of my all time favorites of CM.

Street Angel's reviews always confounded me. I recall listening to it constantly. But I know now it was just because I finally got an advanced copy of something and I was jonesing so hard for new Stevie music. Fortunately I got a truckload of demos at the same time. I do like about 50% of that record presently. The reviews were truly strange, though.

[gypsygem81]

Well, I thought BTM was pretty pants compared to their other material, but I suppose we have to consider that they would have been reviewed by different people and also the time when they are being reviewed, e.g. what other stuff is in the charts at the time - the albums would have been reviewed in comparison to other albums in the charts at the time as opposed to other FM albums.

Though I do think that SYW is far better than BTM - I think it's the best thing they've done since Tusk. That it should get less stars than BTM might be a bit daft to us, but not everyone at Rolling tone are going to be FM nuts like us!

Love Gem

[macfan 57]

The Rolling Stones reviews for both albums sound about right to me. Both albums have flaws, but in my opinion "Say You Will" has just a few more. I think "Behind the Mask" could have been even better with more Billy & Rick. In my opinion, neither of these albums are as good as the 5 Rumours line up albums, although "Behind the Mask" does come close.

[RobNYC]

I never really liked the BTM songs. Without Lindsey some of the trademark sound was missing as was the vocal sound when they all sang together.

SYW is probably faring different because it's been over 10 years and as someone mentioned different people reviewing the albums, so whoever reviewed BTM, maybe they would give SYM a higher rating but whoever rated it only gave it 3.

And either way, I still think SYW is a good album and worth the wait.

[SmthngOfADreamr]

I can deal with some parts of BTM, and believe it or not, I prefer Street Angel to RAL, but there is NO WAY IN HELL that either one of those are better than SYW. SYW kicks their ass.

[gypsygem81]

Originally posted by SmthngOfADreamr
SYW kicks their ass.

Here here! I couldn't have said it better myself!

Love Gem

[gldstwmn]

Does anyone know how many copies BTM actually sold?

[darklinensuit]

To me the big difference is that Stevie's songs are MUCH better on SYW in every way (though I do like Freedom a lot).

- Jake

[Rainman]

Originally posted by gldstwmn
Does anyone know how many copies BTM actually sold?

angelfire.com says that BTM hit gold status. So we can assume it sold between 500,000 and a million copies. By the way, there are some very positive reviews of BTM out there.

Interesting to speculate where they would have gone if this lineup had stuck together.

[wetcamelfood]

Last I heard BTM sold 800,000 in the US and 2 million worldwide (in other words, the 800,00 is included in that 2 mil figure so, 1,200,000 outside of US). :)

John

[Rainman]

Originally posted by wetcamelfood
Last I heard BTM sold 800,000 in the US and 2 million worldwide (in other words, the 800,00 is included in that 2 mil figure so, 1,200,000 outside of US). :)

John
Thanks for the clarification.

Makes me wonder if SYW will reach the same figures.

[skcin]

I think SYW is a worlds apart from BTM - much better songwriting & performances, IMO. BTW, in a recent Mick interview (I think it's posted on the nicksfix), he said he was pleasantly surprised that SYW is already approaching gold status in the US (that's 500,000, right?)

Paula

PS - nice to be here

[macfan 57]

Originally posted by wetcamelfood
Last I heard BTM sold 800,000 in the US and 2 million worldwide (in other words, the 800,00 is included in that 2 mil figure so, 1,200,000 outside of US). :)

John

I know that BTM hit #1 in the U.K. and that the Billy/Rick lineup seemed to be more accepted in the U.K./Europe than here in the U.S. But, I'm still surprised that it actually sold more overseas than in the U.S. I think those sales figures are actually pretty good considering that Warner/Reprise did very little to promote it.

[wetcamelfood]

Originally posted by macfan 57
I know that BTM hit #1 in the U.K. and that the Billy/Rick lineup seemed to be more accepted in the U.K./Europe than here in the U.S. But, I'm still surprised that it actually sold more overseas than in the U.S. I think those sales figures are actually pretty good considering that Warner/Reprise did very little to promote it.

Yeah, technically I think TITN actually sold more outside the US than in the US itself (like you say, particularly in the UK) and, I mean, "I" don't think it's right that things like this are said but I've often heard the American marketing stigma: "once you sell more "overseas", it's over for you". However, sales figures like this (BTM, TITN, etc.) just goes to show that there is many non US FM fans but for whatever reason they (Mick?) are choosing to ignore them. I guess it's another way it proves that there is "more money to be had" (at least more than they seem to think there is anyways) but Mick's oh so great business sense doesn't tell him this...but who am I to say? :)

John

[tothegypsy]

I don't think it would make sense to focus on touring and promotion overseas just because sales outside of the U.S. added up to more than the U.S. sales.

Obviously, when you add up the sales in every single country other than the USA they might add up to more than the US sales.

If we say that BTM sold 800,000 in the US, and 1,200,000 total in all the other countries in the world combined, that still shows that the US is the main source of sales for BTM.

[Rainman]

If we say that BTM sold 800,000 in the US, and 1,200,000 total in all the other countries in the world combined, that still shows that the US is the main source of sales for BTM.
That's pretty good logic.

And really, touring in the U.S. has to be cheaper and a lot less hassle. I think I read that they're staying in "hub" cities while they hit several concerts in a region. I guess you can do things like that when you have your own 727 and you make hundreds of thousands a show.

I wish I had their retirement plan . . .

[wetcamelfood]

Originally posted by tothegypsy
I don't think it would make sense to focus on touring and promotion overseas just because sales outside of the U.S. added up to more than the U.S. sales.

Obviously, when you add up the sales in every single country other than the USA they might add up to more than the US sales.

If we say that BTM sold 800,000 in the US, and 1,200,000 total in all the other countries in the world combined, that still shows that the US is the main source of sales for BTM.

What I meant was, FM DID tour overseas for both TITN & BTM and DUE to that promotion they got more sales added up outside the US then they got inside the US so with Mick knowing there is "money out there to get" (which adds up to more than what he gets of (for the most part) "only US sales" (& yes I know there are non US fans here that have bought copies of SYW, I just mean if they would just tour outside the US then think what sales could be had if they were to do so) then it's a (usual) bad business decision on his part to pass up the "easy money" but like I say with my "usual" remark, what else is new when it comes to Mick? :) ) I guess the old British pound that used to feed him (whether he wants to remember it or not) is no good to him anymore. Anyways, it'll be interesting to see what the outside US sales are like for SYW after it all dies down assuming they have blown off the rest of the world (again) on touring. As I say though, "I" don't care about sales amounts on records at all I just mean if money is so important to him/them then they are passing up "money waiting for them" (so to speak) but whatever. :)

John

[Rainman]

John:

As I say though, "I" don't care about sales amounts on records at all I just mean if money is so important to him/them then they are passing up "money waiting for them" (so to speak) but whatever.
You've probably seen the new thread about the extended tour dates and the rumour that they will go overseas eventually. So you might be right. And, as you say, making those nice fat British pounds surely wouldn't hurt the bottom line when they go back to the good ol' USA.

Terry

[wetcamelfood]

Originally posted by Rainman
John:


You've probably seen the new thread about the extended tour dates and the rumour that they will go overseas eventually. So you might be right. And, as you say, making those nice fat British pounds surely wouldn't hurt the bottom line when they go back to the good ol' USA.

Terry

No I hadn't gone in to that thread yet (when I typed that reply as I've been off and on the ledge all day with the busy server deal, but I just checked it out now), thanks for the heads up Terry. :)

Oh well OK fair enough and good for them then (IF it turns out they actually do the overseas shows for our non US ledgies). :)

John