Do we really want a new Fleetwood Mac album?

[Christopher]

Stevie has written new songs, she dropped bits & pieces about recent songwriting during her Q&A's throughout late 2012-2013 at select IYD documentary screenings. She mentioned one called "Mothers Rings" and a couple others which had been sent off to Dave Stewart. She just didn't want to hand them over to FM, unless she could be convinced that they would be produced objectively. Hence her trepidation about recording any new FM record with just Lindsey unless certain conditions (producers, etc.) were agreed upon.

And besides all that, I believe Stevie still has a fire inside her, something to prove, especially within Fleetwood Mac, Not only did she up her game with what arguably could be her most consistent & well constructed record - "In Your Dreams." This candid reveal she made in a interview (circa 2007-2009) is most telling, that during her Klonopin era, in her opinion, she didn't write anything "memorable." So Stevie is well aware she wasn't at her best during "Tango" juxtaposed with providing FM with some of her best material ever for SYW, and being unhappy with the creative outcome. Stevie will show up, standing tall, if there is any FM record with Christine to be made.

As far as her older material goes, Stevie has always contributed something new/alongside something old from "the vault" to practically every release. Of which many are great compositions, not just cast-offs from previous releases as Karma Contestant already posted. Many fans would love to see more than a few of these gems released if the production and tone fit the project.

[Matt Lucas]

Hello all---

Originally Posted by chiliD

I've read in various places that he DOESN'T use the Turner Model 1 all that much in the studio (He used a National Reso-Lectric quite a bit on the SYW album). For the acoustic based tunes he seems to use the Turner Renaissance guitars more in the studio, but also Martins & Taylors.

I was mainly talking about the electric parts, but thanks for setting me straight on the Turner use in the studio. If you’ve got links to interviews since SYW where he talks about using other electric guitars, please share them. I'm genuinely interested. I honestly didn’t think he used anything but the Turners for 90+ percent of the electric parts in the studio for most of his recordings over the last 20 years.

For me, part of the reason for wanting him to play other guitars is that different instruments seem to bring out different aspects of a guitarist’s style. Lindsey’s solos from the mid-‘70s sound different than his ones from the last 15 years, and I can’t help thinking that having the Les Paul in his hands influenced that in some way.

Originally Posted by Christopher

As far as her older material goes, Stevie has always contributed something new/alongside something old from "the vault" to practically every release. Of which many are great compositions, not just cast-offs from previous releases as Karma Contestant already posted. Many fans would love to see more than a few of these gems released if the production and tone fit the project.

Ideally, I’d love to hear new material. But I also have no problem with any of them bringing in older unreleased material…as long as it’s good. Because Fleetwood Mac can take a good song and make it great.

Originally Posted by Christopher

Stevie has written new songs, she dropped bits & pieces about recent songwriting during her Q&A's throughout late 2012-2013 at select IYD documentary screenings. She mentioned one called "Mothers Rings" and a couple others which had been sent off to Dave Stewart. She just didn't want to hand them over to FM, unless she could be convinced that they would be produced objectively. Hence her trepidation about recording any new FM record with just Lindsey unless certain conditions (producers, etc.) were agreed upon.

And besides all that, I believe Stevie still has a fire inside her, something to prove, especially within Fleetwood Mac, Not only did she up her game with what arguably could be her most consistent & well constructed record - "In Your Dreams." This candid reveal she made in a interview (circa 2007-2009) is most telling, that during her Klonopin era, in her opinion, she didn't write anything "memorable." So Stevie is well aware she wasn't at her best during "Tango" juxtaposed with providing FM with some of her best material ever for SYW, and being unhappy with the creative outcome. Stevie will show up, standing tall, if there is any FM record with Christine to be made.

I appreciate you sharing those comments. I have not seen IN YOUR DREAMS, so I wasn’t aware that Stevie was so candid about the past. That gives me a lot of hope that she will bring some great songs to the table. And honestly, I don’t even care if she gets Dave to help her write them. Lindsey and Christine have brought in songs that were co-written by non-FM folks. But I hope Dave’s involvement ends there. He’s just not a great producer, and he’s certainly not the producer they deserve or need.

I have to admit that I dislike Jack White. I respect what he does, and he seems to have a rock ‘n roller’s heart, but he’s also arrogant and not nearly as good of a songwriter or singer as he seems to think he is. But I’ll take him over Dave Stewart any day as a producer.

It kinda cracks me up that some of the same people who complain about Lindsey’s production style---particularly the way he often slaps a lot of effects on vocals---are also saying that the THIS IS 40 songs sound unfinished. The thing I like most about those recordings is that they sound so intimate…it’s the best Lindsey’s voice has sounded in years. I pulled out the last few studio solo albums and also listened to some of his old stuff, and as much of a fan as I am, I think he ruined some very good songs with poor production on his vocals. “Cast Away Dreams” is a recent example.

Now, in the case of the THIS IS 40 songs, I like them all, but I think they sound undercooked from a songwriting point of view. For instance, “She Acts Like You” is a very good song…till it gets to the bridge section. Instead of going in a new direction, which is essentially the purpose for a bridge, he just sings a bunch of “ahhhhhhhs.” Opportunity lost.

But I think the production on those songs is great.

Originally Posted by RockawayBlind

T-Bone Burnett would be a fantastic choice.

Wow, that’s maybe the best option anyone has mentioned. As much as I like Rubin or Brion, Burnett would probably be a better fit. And Lord knows he's worked with plenty of egos over the years.

The more I think about all this discussion about Stevie recording separately or using a different producer and Lindsey being too inflexible in the studio, the more frustrated I get with both Lindsey and Stevie. Lindsey is a control freak, and Stevie is a prima donna. I’d hope that they could both compromise just enough to make this project [an album?] the best it can be. I really hope Christine, Mick, and John can prevail over both Lindsey AND Stevie to set aside their pettiness and make some great music again.

And it has absolutely nothing to do with this discussion, but I started playing a bunch of FM songs on my phone the other day, and I heard several of them that I hadn’t heard in quite a while. “Hold Me” remains one of my favorite FM songs, and can I just say that I could listen to “Sara” all day? They groove so well on that simple chord progression.

I hope that Stevie truly does still have a creative spark that will help her write more songs like that. Not rewrites or rip-offs, but new songs that are different but equally good as the classics like “Sara.” Because that is a great song and a perfect recording.

matt

[elle]

Originally Posted by Matt Lucas

It kinda cracks me up that some of the same people who complain about Lindsey’s production style---particularly the way he often slaps a lot of effects on vocals---are also saying that the THIS IS 40 songs sound unfinished. The thing I like most about those recordings is that they sound so intimate…it’s the best Lindsey’s voice has sounded in years. I pulled out the last few studio solo albums and also listened to some of his old stuff, and as much of a fan as I am, I think he ruined some very good songs with poor production on his vocals. “Cast Away Dreams” is a recent example.

Now, in the case of the THIS IS 40 songs, I like them all, but I think they sound undercooked from a songwriting point of view. For instance, “She Acts Like You” is a very good song…till it gets to the bridge section. Instead of going in a new direction, which is essentially the purpose for a bridge, he just sings a bunch of “ahhhhhhhs.” Opportunity lost.

But I think the production on those songs is great.

i am one of the people who absolutely hate what Lindsey does to his vocals in the studio (many of SWS songs, particularly SWS and TTWLG are some of the good examples).

my problem with This is 40 songs is not his vocals - they are intimate and natural, like he's talking to you. my problem is that the songs seem to be slapped together in 5 minutes without too much thought put into them. the songs can be just a voice and the guitar and still sound great and finished. i would love if WATL was recorded like that, for example. but as you pointed out (and She Acts Like You is actually the warmest and my favorite of This is 40 songs), there are barely any bridges and a lot (lot lot lot) of repetition in these songs. Brother and Sister would be great if it was cut in half... instead it goes on repetitively forever.

the other thing that i find interesting is that some of the people who complain about uneven production on GOS or SYW like it's the worst crime in the universe have no problem with very unevenly sounding songs on This is 40, if one actually listens to the whole soundtrack and not just LB's songs.

yes, SWS is very evenly produced and very finished. but i'd 1000 times rather have the original She Smiled Sweetly than the evenly produced one that ended up on the album... because i skip the album one so many times since it's nowhere near as sublime as the original GOS version.

[elle]

talking about uneven production and mixing... that seems to be the main complaint about EP songs too (from people who have actually heard the EP ).

that's another thing that confuses me - do the same people who love This is 40 songs so much really dislike an EP song like It Takes Time, which is just as sparse (but to me actually sounds much less lazy)? i guess they'd like LB to stick with his guitar and not try something new like a piano-based song?

songs on the EP are so different from each other with SA vs ITT vs WY being on such different parts of the spectrum, that other than uneven production (i'm guessing that happened because the EP idea came in at the last moment, since originally just SA and MF were going to be released as separate tracks for dl), i just don't get how one can put them all in the same basket.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by elle

that's another thing that confuses me - do the same people who love This is 40 songs so much really dislike an EP song like It Takes Time, which is just as sparse (but to me actually sounds much less lazy)?

I think It Takes Time is a much more intricate song than any of the This is 40 contributions. I mean, even aside from the production, if you strip all four songs down to the core, I think It Takes Time would be more thoughtful and complete than the other three and it has more variation and, I think, development, from one segment to the other.

Now, I can see Lindsey taking the This is 40 songs and making them into something quite different from what they are on the record if he did them live acoustic. I would look forward to that. In fact, I thought that's what was going to happen when he appeared at the Roxy. I thought he'd do the This is 40 tracks, but I was mistaken.

Michele

[RockawayBlind]

Originally Posted by elle

that's another thing that confuses me - do the same people who love This is 40 songs so much really dislike an EP song like It Takes Time, which is just as sparse (but to me actually sounds much less lazy)? i guess they'd like LB to stick with his guitar and not try something new like a piano-based song?

No mystery here. It's no mystery to me, nor should it be to most, that the sound is crap on the EP. That's the big difference from the This Is 40 songs. Granted, the production on This Is 40 is a little low in volume, but the warmth and clarity of the tracks is far better than anything we've gotten from Lindsey since Cradle.

Aside from that, the songs aren't very good. Without You sounds like it was recorded with plastic guitars. Sad Angel is OK, but there's hardly any substance to it. Now that Lindsey has given us Murrow, Peacekeeper and Someone's Gotta Change Your Mind, I expect better lyrics.

[elle]

Originally Posted by michelej1

I think It Takes Time is a much more intricate song than any of the This is 40 contributions. I mean, even aside from the production, if you strip all four songs down to the core, I think It Takes Time would be more thoughtful and complete than the other three and it has more variation and, I think, development, from one segment to the other.

yeah i think i'd agree with that. i think music-wise It Takes Time has more going for it. lyric-wise, as a parent, i love what She Acts Like You brings, it makes so much sense to me. Sick of You just seems lazy both music and lyric-wise. great and promising title, but so little development behind it.

[elle]

Originally Posted by RockawayBlind

No mystery here. It's no mystery to me, nor should it be to most, that the sound is crap on the EP. That's the big difference from the This Is 40 songs. Granted, the production on This Is 40 is a little low in volume, but the warmth and clarity of the tracks is far better than anything we've gotten from Lindsey since Cradle.

Aside from that, the songs aren't very good. Without You sounds like it was recorded with plastic guitars. Sad Angel is OK, but there's hardly any substance to it. Now that Lindsey has given us Murrow, Peacekeeper and Someone's Gotta Change Your Mind, I expect better lyrics.

like Sick of You and Brother and Sister?

This is 40 songs are not ALL low in volume, but LB's songs on that album are.

[RockawayBlind]

Originally Posted by elle

like Sick of You and Brother and Sister?

This is 40 songs are not ALL low in volume, but LB's songs on that album are.

I can only guess that has something to do with the recordings he sent the producer. The volume probably couldn't be raised without distortion.

I've never praised the This Is 40 songs for lyrics. I've always been very clear that I like that they are well crafted, arranged and produced. Sonically, they sound better than anything Lindsey has done since Cradle. Really, this is one of my biggest problems with Lindsey and FM in general. I mean, these people had impeccable production right up to The Dance, and then it all when to doodoo. I don't get it. He can still hear, right?

[TrueFaith77]

Brother and Sister might be my fav Lindsey track of the 21st Century.

[aleuzzi]

Any new work by any of these people should be seen for what it is--a gift. We were lucky to have SYW, the EP, And the solo work. I bitch about the EP a bit, but in truth I am glad it was made.

It is time, however, for these five people to make a new studio album, their first in almost 30 years.

[elle]

Originally Posted by aleuzzi

Any new work by any of these people should be seen for what it is--a gift. We were lucky to have SYW, the EP, And the solo work. I bitch about the EP a bit, but in truth I am glad it was made.

It is time, however, for these five people to make a new studio album, their first in almost 30 years.

well said!

[bluefox4000]

Originally Posted by elle

).

that's another thing that confuses me - do the same people who love This is 40 songs so much really dislike an EP song like It Takes Time, which is just as sparse (but to me actually sounds much less lazy)? i guess they'd like LB to stick with his guitar and not try something new like a piano-based song?

:

It Takes time bores me to tears. I usually like slow dirges, lol but.....MAN. I can't explain what it is. Can't dig it though.

Mick

[Matt Lucas]

Hello all---

Okay, I was wrong. I listened to “She Acts Like You” and the other THIS IS 40 songs this morning, and SALY actually has a very good bridge [“I’d like to set her free/From everything I see/When she acts like me”]. It’s the instrumental/solo section that sounds kinda plain with the “ahhhhhs.” But man…I think that bridge may feature some of the best lyrics Lindsey’s ever written.

The THIS IS 40 tracks are interesting because of another reason that I don’t think anyone has brought up. They are collaborations between several of the artists who appear on the soundtrack. Norah Jones sings backing vocals on the songs, producer Jon Brion sings and plays on them, and Punch Brothers are the backing band, and I’m pretty sure I can hear Punch Brothers singer Chris Thile [who could be described as the Lindsey Buckingham of mandolin players] doing backing vocals, too. My point is that some of the decisions [i.e. the songs going on too long with lots of noodling at the end] might be part of the collaborative process. Anyway, I just think it’s interesting that Lindsey worked with all these artists, because he’s not really known for collaborations in his solo work.

To tie all of this back into the discussion about Christine’s return and the prospect of a new FM record, maybe the collaborations have softened Lindsey just a bit and made him realize that others can contribute to the recording process as well...

...not likely...but maybe?

matt

[elle]

Originally Posted by Matt Lucas

maybe the collaborations have softened Lindsey just a bit and made him realize that others can contribute to the recording process as well...

seems to me the man has no problem collaborating or being a part of the group, especially when given the right people to collaborate with, whether when recording or on stage - http://www.billboard.com/articles/ev...source=twitter