Thrown Down: What Makes the Song

[Johnny Stew]

The first thing I thought when I heard the demo for "Thrown Down," was that it would make a great single for Fleetwood Mac.
In my opinion, the lyrics walk the fine line between the more straightforward aspects of Christine's lyrical style, and the typically more ponderable style of Stevie's work.
The chorus is catchy, and sticks with you after the song has finished... which always bodes well for repeated radio play.
I think the third-person nature of Stevie's lyrics here, works well, as it leaves the listener to ponder exactly *who* is being sung about.
She's not coming right out and saying, "this is about me and someone"... but she's being coy enough, that one wouldn't feel wrong in making that assumption.

I'm in love with the Fleetwood Mac version, and I think Lindsey did a terrific job on the production. It's not a major departure from Stevie's original demo, but it has enough changes to give it a nice new twist.
And... as always... those two voices just sound amazing together.
I'm a fan of Stevie's voice, and all its quirks, so I imagine it goes without saying that I think she sounds terrific here. And Lindsey sounds particulary committed on his backing vocals, and gives the track a nice edginess.
(To answer your question, CarneVaca... Stevie's vocals are new. Her voice is a little "softer" here than on her demo.)

Overall, the finished product (if this *is* the finished product) might be slightly predictable, as far as Fleetwood Mac's music goes... but it's still heads above 90% of the music being made today.
And quite honestly, i welcome "The Mac Sound" with open arms, so it doesn't bother me if it's slightly reminiscent of their previous work.

I'm happy as a clam!


Johnny Stew

[jwd]

Well I think its what makes most of Fleetwood Mac's songs sound great.....the guitar and production work of Lindsey, the vocals of Stevie and her harmonies with Lindsey, and the rhythm section of John and Mick... to put it simply.

I like the song but I don't think it's their best, or one that just blows you away. I love hearing that Fleetwood Mac sound and never really get tired of hearing it.

"Thrown Down" as a single wouldn't appeal to me, but within the context of their forthcoming album it COULD find its' niche.

As a post script I think that Stevie's voice sounds very tonally appealing on this song. ...and I think the additional vocals of Lori and Sharon are a plus ala Christine.


Joe

[seteca]

Originally posted by David
I think the work the band did on "Thrown Down" is elegant but too straightforward.......... All the little elements that the band pulls together with utmost craft in this track just ultimately seem so calculated to me, with that radio hit blueprint behind it all. The sad thing is that, even when it is engineered to do so, the song typically doesn't chart anyway.

I agree with this. While Lindsey has indeed turned the song from quite a boring (IMHO, and not surprising as it was only a demo) demo into a very listenable, radio-friendly "FM sounding" track, I do think that it is too "straightforward", at least if it's going to be released as a single; while it IS radio-friendly, I hope that it isn't released as a single because at best it will do "ok" in the charts, at worst it won't even chart.

In answer to the actual topic of the thread, for me it really has to be LB's guitar work on the track...the verses in particular with the arpeggios and muted notes in verses 1 and 2 respectively are really awesome.

Originally posted by chiliD
He uses some OLD things (the solos...sound like his "Isn't It Midnight" tone)

Ah thank you!! I was dying trying to figure out why the song reminded me of the TITN album.....for some reason I'd gone blank and didn't remember the Isn't It Midnight solo tone....yes, the two tones are practically identical...in fact I wouldn't be surprised if he used the same guitar going through the same FX.

so i think we all agree that you take a little "Planets of the Universe", "Twisted", "Big Love", and "Isn't is Midnight" and voila! you've got "Thrown Down"!

[estranged4life]

waiting for my copy of "Thrown Down" to arrive...If it sounds like the description that joe gave as a combination of "Planets of the Universe", "Twisted", "Big Love", and "Isn't is Midnight", Then it should be very interesting...Brian J.

[FiercestCalmSea]

I sent it out way earlier this week so you should have it soon

[estranged4life]

Sarah...My mail is way behind, But so is everyone elses...lol...Brian J.

[Sorcerer386]

What about Stevie's tendency to write in third person? Is that one of the attractions to a lot of people? Does it help draw you in to the story?

My friend always laughs at me because I tell him how I like "story songs." Writing in the third person contributes more to telling a story in a song. The second person version of this song would be like she's saying something to someone, which she WAS doing in Dreams, but I don't think she's doing that here. The first person is also direct, though not AS direct. So, I think Stevie was just telling a story, and I like it this way.

I'm uncomfortably surprised about non-Stevie fans not liking the lyrics. Most say that her lyrics are too abstract or too choppy, whereas in this song they are more prose-ish. I thought it was interesting that someone mentioned it reminded them of Christine's writing, because I thought that it did too. And, I definitely hear a slice of Big Love in the background of the first verse.

As far as it being the first single, well, the song IS catchy, and I think that's what you need with the first single. Then the second single should be edgier, more uptempo, etc. Slow it down with the third single, then if you get to a fourth single, another catchy, midtempo song. I love this song more each time I hear it. BUT, another thing we have to remember is that we don't even know what songs are gonna be on this album. There's obviously some Stevie songs we don't know yet, and maybe even some newer Lindsey songs not from Gift of Screws. So I think we would really need to wait to hear everything before deciding what should be singles. Enough ranting, I'm tired.

[sodascouts]

Hmm, a lot to talk about here.

First, I have to say I'm surprised about how many people are talking about the vast differences between the demo and the leaked version. Obviously you have the additions of Lindsey's trademark guitar, the extra background vocals, but the rest of the variations seem pretty slight to me. I was actually surprised that it wasn't changed more, but then again, maybe that's the problem - it doesn't seem very changed to me because I was expecting it to be MORE changed. lol But as just a regular old listener, I didn't really notice that big of a difference (besides what I said above).

Second:

To begin, there have been way too many songs written about failed relationships, and this song is rather bland lyrically. It is very hard anymore to say something fresh about this topic.

What, so no one should do songs about failed relationships anymore? Come on! Relationships are a fundamental part of the human emotional experience, which is precisely why there are so many songs about them! But perhaps you're right. Let's make 2003 the cutoff year. "Want to hear a song about heartbreak? Let me refer you to some of our classics. We don't sing about such things anymore."

And while you're at it, cut off the love songs. Tons of songs about that. Cut off the songs about sex. Surely there's only so many ways to say "I want you." Cut off the songs about pain, hate, joy, sorrow, anger, jealousy, resentment, passion - people have written songs about all these emotions since the beginning of time! So passee!

Life experiences don't suddenly become irrelevant because others have lived them before, and neither do songs about them.



At any rate, about the lyrics:

There is nothing more subjective than lyric analysis. Everybody gets something different out of them. What sounds insipid to one person might touch another deeply. What one person can't make heads or tails out of, another sees a meaning as clear as crystal (no pun intended). It reminds me of when I took a postmodernism seminar. I'm being handed these postmodern texts, told they're oh so significant works of genius, half the time I'm like "What the...?! This is bizarre, rambling, pointess crap!"

So, in that vein, what makes a "good" lyric? I feel it's indefinable. Some people fault Lindsey for having lyrics that are too simplisitc, some fault Steive for having lyrics that are too vague....but what's "good" is what speaks to you, isn't it? And that's mighty hard to guage. In relation to that, as Rick Nelson would say, "You can't please everyone, so you gotta please yourself." ;-)

[CarneVaca]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by sodascouts
What, so no one should do songs about failed relationships anymore? Come on! Relationships are a fundamental part of the human emotional experience, which is precisely why there are so many songs about them!

I want to hear songs about relationships that bring a fresh perspective, or fresh images, not simply a retread of ideas that have been featured ad nauseum in pop songs. With Ms. Nicks' credentials as a songwriter, you would hope that she could come up with better. The lyrics are bland, and that was my point. I didn't call for a ban on any type of song.

[CarneVaca]

Originally posted by thewhitewingedd
Songs about HAPPY stuff are lifeless for the most part...

So that would make "Mystified," "You Make Loving Fun," "Leather and Lace," "Countdown," "Turn It On," and "Rhiannon," to name a few, lifeless songs?

[xhector]

>I also like the Hammond organ in the background. I only wish
> Lindsey had thought of adding the Hammond to his sound long
> ago because I love that instrument.

Where's that hammond organ? I cannot hear it on this song.

Héctor

[seteca]

Originally posted by xhector
>I also like the Hammond organ in the background. I only wish
> Lindsey had thought of adding the Hammond to his sound long
> ago because I love that instrument.

Where's that hammond organ? I cannot hear it on this song.

Héctor

Yea good point...I can't hear it either...

Where is it, CV? Can you give me a time location? Or is it throughout the entire song?

[Vianna]

I just heard TD-not sure what I think yet. I feel like it's a continuation of TISL on Stevie's part and I definitely see the resemblance to Planets of the Universe.

I like Stevie's voice with Lindsey's.

I like Lindsey's guitar solo in there and I like the ending.

I wonder if this is the first single??Do you guys think this will attract enough attention and radio play to promote the album? I'm kinda doubtful myself...

Originally posted by xhector
>I also like the Hammond organ in the background. I only wish
> Lindsey had thought of adding the Hammond to his sound long
> ago because I love that instrument.

Where's that hammond organ? I cannot hear it on this song.

Héctor

You can hear the low notes as soon as the first verse starts...it's very low but i can hear it. after about :30 with the line "but more important..." it get's a little louder...then, in the chorus after about 1:20 before the line "but they should be together..." it's more evident in volume and also the notes are higher with some vibrato going on...it's not a blaring organ. as a matter of fact, it could be a bit louder but whatever....we don't know if this is even the final mix. hope this helps.