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  #1  
Old 04-23-2018, 04:10 PM
Murrow Murrow is offline
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Default 21 years of wasted time

Hope this is in the right forum. As it's pretty critical of activities from 1997 until recent developments I'd like to think so.

So here we are again.

Once again a certain guitarist ahs left Fleetwood Mac under a cloud.

Once again Mick (presumably) is saying that the band has always been about the variety that different musicians bring.

It's like 1988-90 all over again. I was like a kid on Christmas Day when Behind the Mask came out and was gutted when I heard that the line-up had collapsed a few months later.

Then five years of not quite knowing who was in or out (a photo without Billy, a World Cup gig without Chris) before the rather insubstantial Time album hit the shelves.

Then woo-hoo Rumours line-up reformed and happy days are here again.

Then Chris quits.

Then Say You Will - which to my mind is second only to BTM in terms of their post-Rumours output.

Then Lindsey wants to do two solo albums, one acoustic one electric (fair enough, get that off his bucket list).

Then Stevie won't make an album without another woman in the band (and Lindsey vetoes the Sheryl Crow idea).

Then a pointless tour with neither Chris nor new material to make me want to part with cash.

Then Stevie wants to make an album with Dave Stewart and Mick, who plays drums on most of it, expresses his frustration (and Lindsey has no choice but to cut Seeds We Sow).

Then a glorified EP which was 75% Lindsey and one track of which only featured him.

Then woo-hoo Chris is back and happy days are here again... again!

Then Stevie says she's already committed to recording her 24 Karat project.

Then a tour which basically just proves there'd be too many classics in the set to fit anything new in even if they'd recorded any.

Then what was meant to be the new album gets credited to Buckingham McVie cos Stevie didn't want to do it even with Chris back in the band.

And now they finally give Lindsey the boot and get two other guys in (one of whom happens to be one of my favourite songwriters).

All this really proves is that for the most part, reforming the Rumours line-up, and certainly trying to keep the band going as a creative unit with both Buckingham AND Nicks present was little more than A COLOSSAL WASTE OF TIME!!!!!

And now they're all in their seventies apart from the new boys so it's probably not reasonable to expect anything new.

Deep Purple had their post-reunion dramas too but at least they could usually supply us with an album every three years or so and could work out when two people just weren't going to be able to work together anymore.
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  #2  
Old 01-05-2020, 01:21 AM
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Exactly! Iím so disappointed at this point, the only thing Mac-related Iím ever going to buy again are the tell-allís and maybe not even all of those, because Iíve read almost all of them so far and itís like everything else, nothing has felt truly new for way too long. Iím burnt out. Itís too much ridiculous drama.
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Old 01-05-2020, 05:21 PM
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I agree about everything related to new material and studio albums. However I'm not sure about them "trying to keep the band going as a creative unit". Really? I don't find any evidence or clue about it. That EP was kind a casual product, not a true effort, my feeling. The main motivation of Fleetwood Mac are the tours, since several years.

But about the tours, well I saw them twice this last decade. The "part with cash" argument would be far more true for me, since I live in Peru and had to travel to see them. But I took advantage of a business trip to see them during the Unleashed tour, cause I wouldn't travel specially to see them if Chris wasn't there, I did enjoyed the show. As I also enjoyed the OWTS gig in 2014, with the 5 members. A dream came true when Chris was on stage again. And that was a trip just to see them.

And I always check the setlist before buying a concert ticket, so I know what I am paying for. And since I enjoyed both concerts, it wasn't a waste of time to me. Not my time at least
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Old 01-05-2020, 06:15 PM
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elle elle is offline
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Originally Posted by Murrow View Post
Hope this is in the right forum. As it's pretty critical of activities from 1997 until recent developments I'd like to think so.

So here we are again.
.
this is almost completely referring to Rumours-era lineup so should probably be in Rumours forum.

i cannot agree more with your assessment that the time from 1997 reunion on was completely wasted. they made tons of money, but creatively it was unbelievable waste. Lindsey was not even 50 yet, then. now he's 70. he should have quit once Christine did and never go back unless he had a firm, contractually signed commitment that they'll record / tour a new album within certain time frame. we could have had so much new music from him.

people keep wanting the classic 5 to reunite. i really hope that never happens - except maybe a one-off show or 2. but not an album and not a tour. both things are a waste of time as the last 23 years has shown us.

people who cannot learn from history will keep repeating it. i really hope Lindsey has finally learned - these people are not worth his wasting the time of new beginnings. he kept trying and trying and just got pushback for decades. other than Christine, the rest of them want money, adulation and limelight, but creativity is of no interest to them.
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Old 01-05-2020, 10:26 PM
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I was listening to Rumours DVD-A today. The portion called The Making Of... with band member commentary on each song, left me wondering if Stevie signed back on in 1997, the ¬ďorganic¬Ē experience, with stipulations. Each member went on and on about the leaving off of Silver Springs from the Rumours album... it was borderline pathetic, such groveling! It really is an angry song, seems like the angriest one from that album. Like maybe too angry. If Stevie has been carrying this as a grudge and Lindsey only ever just wanted to be the band leader, because every band needs a leader for cohesiveness, then I can see how things have been slowly crumbling since 1997. Stevie and Lindsey having their own solo careers wasn¬ít enough for the two of them to not squabble over control when they were in Fleetwood Mac. I feel for Mick and John and it¬ís no wonder Chris quit. And anyway, Stevie doesn¬ít have what it takes to be a band leader, so I don¬ít get it. I¬íve worked for people like Lindsey, you find a way to get along or quit. Mick and John know this as I¬ím sure Chris does, but to work in a team where one member is constantly fighting the leader is draining. Just thinking out loud. Frankly, I don¬ít know how these people lasted so long as a band after all is said and done.
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Old 01-06-2020, 01:23 AM
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people keep wanting the classic 5 to reunite. i really hope that never happens - except maybe a one-off show or 2. but not an album and not a tour. both things are a waste of time as the last 23 years has shown us.

people who cannot learn from history will keep repeating it. i really hope Lindsey has finally learned - these people are not worth his wasting the time of new beginnings. he kept trying and trying and just got pushback for decades. other than Christine, the rest of them want money, adulation and limelight, but creativity is of no interest to them.
I truly hope this reunification NEVER happens. If they think they can come back from this debacle, they are wrong. They screwed the pooch on this, and I hope the old goat is held accountable throughout history.

Lindsey will look equally as bad, if he would go back. He'd look like a pussy, begging to be let back in, under the queen's graces.

They KILLED the band of my life.

Stupid old goat.
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Old 01-06-2020, 05:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Murrow View Post
Then a tour which basically just proves there'd be too many classics in the set to fit anything new in even if they'd recorded any.
This made me laugh. Itís too true.


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Originally Posted by Murrow View Post
It's like 1988-90 all over again.
Itís like deja vu all over again. For anyone whoís been following the band closely over the past thirty years, it feels like erectile dysfunction. You get all excited about some prospect or other, but the excitement fizzles out when reality is thrown at you like a bucket of ice water.
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Old 01-07-2020, 10:42 AM
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This made me laugh. It’s too true. .
oh you know way better! they can't tour new songs because they have too many past hits? yeah right. they have a good number of hits but most bands their stature have way more and yet have no problem not doing every single hit they had at every live show. Bowie used to tour his new albums and adding just couple of his hits at the end. Rolling Stones, U2, Springsteen and so many others rotate setlists or some of the songs in setlists. for example, U2 just toured their new album in 2016. they didn't do nearly all their past hits, and they rotated some of their first successful songs from date to date. it's not that hard when the band is not lazy and/or completely dysfunctional and stunted by the worry that audience won't love every single thing they play on first listen!

plus just look at the setlist of Buckingham McVie tour in 2017 - they did 8 new songs plus tons of their old hits plus some deep cuts and still skipped some of their biggest hits.
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Old 01-07-2020, 10:57 AM
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oh you know way better! they can't tour new songs because they have too many past hits? yeah right. they have a good number of hits but most bands their stature have way more and yet have no problem not doing every single hit they had at every live show. Bowie used to tour his new albums and adding just couple of his hits at the end. Rolling Stones, U2, Springsteen and so many others rotate setlists or some of the songs in setlists. for example, U2 just toured their new album in 2016. they didn't do nearly all their past hits, and they rotated some of their first successful songs from date to date. it's not that hard when the band is not lazy and/or completely dysfunctional and stunted by the worry that audience won't love every single thing they play on first listen!

plus just look at the setlist of Buckingham McVie tour in 2017 - they did 8 new songs plus tons of their old hits plus some deep cuts and still skipped some of their biggest hits.
And we've been mocking Boston and Journey in Chit Chat, for being "all about the money"...
If Dick and $tevie are in the band, it's ALL about filling every seat in the house. Dick needs the money, and $tevie needs the attention.
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Old 01-08-2020, 10:41 AM
jbrownsjr jbrownsjr is offline
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Originally Posted by elle View Post
oh you know way better! they can't tour new songs because they have too many past hits? yeah right. they have a good number of hits but most bands their stature have way more and yet have no problem not doing every single hit they had at every live show. Bowie used to tour his new albums and adding just couple of his hits at the end. Rolling Stones, U2, Springsteen and so many others rotate setlists or some of the songs in setlists. for example, U2 just toured their new album in 2016. they didn't do nearly all their past hits, and they rotated some of their first successful songs from date to date. it's not that hard when the band is not lazy and/or completely dysfunctional and stunted by the worry that audience won't love every single thing they play on first listen!

plus just look at the setlist of Buckingham McVie tour in 2017 - they did 8 new songs plus tons of their old hits plus some deep cuts and still skipped some of their biggest hits.
It was amazing to hear 8 songs from the new album. And, add in Wish You Were Here!
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Old 01-08-2020, 09:41 PM
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It was amazing to hear 8 songs from the new album. And, add in Wish You Were Here!
WYWH was heavenly - and it was never performed live before right? and they brought back Hold Me, too, that somehow Mac could never perform for years before.

but they didn't play Don't Stop or Second Hand News, their huge hits and staples of Mac live shows.

and yet it was all great, audience found the show rocking and high energy even though there were so many new songs they haven't heard before.
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Old 01-09-2020, 09:40 AM
jbrownsjr jbrownsjr is offline
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WYWH was heavenly - and it was never performed live before right? and they brought back Hold Me, too, that somehow Mac could never perform for years before.

but they didn't play Don't Stop or Second Hand News, their huge hits and staples of Mac live shows.

and yet it was all great, audience found the show rocking and high energy even though there were so many new songs they haven't heard before.
I have to say that the Greek, Los Angeles Buckvie show had so much energy and surprises. The sold out crowd was electric. It was like the old days of seeing FMac.
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Old 01-09-2020, 03:37 PM
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It would have been interesting to see how the band would have worked if Lindsey, Christine and Billy had got together. Obviously Lindsey and Christine's chemistry has been well documented over the years. Christine and Billy I felt had really good chemistry the times they worked together. I would have loved to hear Lindsey put his touch on Billy's work. I think the two really would have got along seeing as Billy has always been willing to play "second fiddle". Mixing Bekka in would have been REALLY cool seeing as she is a completely different type of singer/vocalist than Christine or Stevie. Considering how many different artists Bekka has worked with over the years, I really think she would have found a place in the group and given Fleetwood Mac a new and unique element the band never had before or ever.
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Old 01-09-2020, 03:48 PM
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It would have been interesting to see how the band would have worked if Lindsey, Christine and Billy had got together. Obviously Lindsey and Christine's chemistry has been well documented over the years. Christine and Billy I felt had really good chemistry the times they worked together. I would have loved to hear Lindsey put his touch on Billy's work. I think the two really would have got along seeing as Billy has always been willing to play "second fiddle". Mixing Bekka in would have been REALLY cool seeing as she is a completely different type of singer/vocalist than Christine or Stevie. Considering how many different artists Bekka has worked with over the years, I really think she would have found a place in the group and given Fleetwood Mac a new and unique element the band never had before or ever.
If $tevie had just left the band for her solo career, a much better band might happened on it's own. Replace $tevie with Bekka, and I'm happy.

Bekka is technically the best singer FM has ever had. My god she's got some amazing pipes on her!

FM doesn't need two male vocalists, though. Especially considering their catalog. And Lindsey would have never allowed that, either.
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Old 01-10-2020, 10:57 AM
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Let's be real. There was never a chance of a different configuration of Fleetwood Mac members moving forward as a band without slapping the label of Fleetwood Mac on it. Whenever it has been more than 2 Fleetwood Mac members in a group setting, it has been labeled Fleetwood Mac.

John McVie would never agree to leave his boat for a potentially smaller cash haul to do a smaller tour with a band minus Stevie.

Mick has clearly always been motivated by the big money of FM tours and still is.

This is why neither John or Mick participated in the BuckVie tour....and what a lame back-peddling move to do. Have a great time recording the album and then not go out on the road with it for fear of band politics...aka Stevie. They never fully supported Lindsey or Christine in that project. It's the same spineless behavior that occurred when Lindsey was fired.

Would it have been amazing to see them form a group minus Stevie? Heck yeah but the distorted and warped sense of loyalty has and always would have prevented it from happening no matter how you slice it.

It also would have been way too much work and risk for either Mick or John. It's far easier to find a few folks who can cover some guitar parts and "kinda" sound like Fleetwood Mac, reboot the Fleetwood Mac touring show and make a boatload of cash.

Heck, has Jonn McVie EVER played with Micks Blues Band? And they BOTH have homes in Hawaii where Mick and his band play.
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