Which one is the best lyricist ? - Page 6

CarneVaca · #76 05-04-2004, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dissention

I consider Say Goodbye the best song on the album, so you'll hear no arguments from me.

Besides, Strandman already admitted months ago he likes Lindsey's SYW stuff better.

strandinthewind · #77 05-04-2004, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CarneVaca

Besides, Strandman already admitted months ago he likes Lindsey's SYW stuff better.

Yes, LB writes a great song and his songs are better on SYW than Stevie's in general, although Stevie's songs certainly are great. However and to be fair, as I noted above and in the post you refer to, LB's songs on SYW reflect 9 songs from the last 10 or so years during which Stevie has released two solo records, a boxed set, a new song on The Dance, and the nine songs and many, many submitted but unused demos for SYW. So, yes, LB writes a great song - I am in no way saying he does not. I am just saying Stevie's songs are better written from my point of view and in general. Moreover, if you took nine of Stevie's best from 1987 to this day - I think Stevie would win. But, everyone has different tastes, etc.

Carolina Girl · #78 05-04-2004, 01:26 PM

Looks like a landslide victory for Stevie

David · #79 05-04-2004, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by snwriter

Please. Every lyricist, even Dylan and Joni Mitchell (the best), play around with grammar rules. Hello--"The Skie's the Limit"!!!!????!!!!

Stevie isn't any worse than the others.

Looking for solecisms in rock songs is just silly. The casual grammar in rock lyrics is frequently preferable to the traditional forms because of tone. We don't need no education packs a stronger punch than the bloodless verbal alternative of avoiding the double negative.

One of Stevie's most hypnotic & powerful phrases (& one that's repeated probably fifty times in the song) is a double solecism: Just like the white-winged dove sings a song/Sounds like she's singing

We all remember from our high school grammars that "like" isn't a conjunction, but in this situation, who cares? It's the song, man.

(And it's actually a masterly use of hard consonants or alliteratives.)

CarneVaca · #80 05-04-2004, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Yes, LB writes a great song and his songs are better on SYW than Stevie's in general, although Stevie's songs certainly are great. However and to be fair, as I noted above and in the post you refer to, LB's songs on SYW reflect 9 songs from the last 10 or so years during which Stevie has released two solo records, a boxed set, a new song on The Dance, and the nine songs and many, many submitted but unused demos for SYW. So, yes, LB writes a great song - I am in no way saying he does not. I am just saying Stevie's songs are better written from my point of view and in general. Moreover, if you took nine of Stevie's best from 1987 to this day - I think Stevie would win. But, everyone has different tastes, etc.

Quality over quantity, my Southern-fried friend. Quality.

wondergirl9847 · #81 05-04-2004, 01:51 PM

Exactly. Who the frick wants to sing "We do not need any education..." WTH?! LOL

Not I, said the fly.

dissention · #82 05-04-2004, 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sodascouts

I hadn't noticed any uniquely Poe references in POTU. I must be slipping. Perhaps I was too distracted by the blatant TISL demo / dirge "Annabel Lee."

Annabel Lee drives me bonkers. If that ever makes it onto an album, I'll die.

I'm a Poe fanatic, so I noticed the rip-offs in Planets immediately. She's a slick one, though, because she steals from quite a few of his poems in just that one song.

The poems that I pinpointed right away were Dream Land, Serenade, and Eulalie. I'm sure there are more.

I've noticed that she likes to steal from Oscar Wilde, too. Have you? Read some of his work and you'll be shocked at her blatant use of it.

dissention · #83 05-04-2004, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CarneVaca

Besides, Strandman already admitted months ago he likes Lindsey's SYW stuff better.

We'll get him to the darkside eventually.

strandinthewind · #84 05-04-2004, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CarneVaca

Quality over quantity, my Southern-fried friend. Quality.

Well, I certainly was not implying that

I was saying Stevie has released more great work than LB in the same time span.

CarneVaca · #85 05-04-2004, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandinthewind

Well, I certainly was not implying that

I was saying Stevie has released more great work than LB in the same time span.

Well, friend, you have been mislead.

Johnny Stew · #86 05-04-2004, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CarneVaca

Quality over quantity, my Southern-fried friend. Quality.

We've had this argument before, too (imagine that!).

Lindsey has released three solo albums over the course of 23 years (starting in 1981), and has contributed to six Fleetwood Mac albums over the course of 29 years.

In contrast, Stevie has released six solo studio albums over the last 23 years, and has contributed to seven Mac studio albums over the last 29.

Each of Stevie's solo albums has had its share of clunkers, as a matter of opinion. But then, also as a matter of opinion, Lindsey's three albums have each had their own share of clunkers, too (roughly two or three per album). Even 'Out Of The Cradle' and his 'Gift Of Screws' material.

If we were to go through and cut Stevie's solo output down to a comparable 33 songs (the number of tracks on Lindsey's albums, totalled without the instrumental/spoken intros on 'Cradle'), and assuming that only the best of Stevie's material over the course of those 23 years would have been included (assuming the fact that, given the length between his releases, LB only used the best of his material)... then I'd say Stevie would be ahead of LB.

And if we're going to compare songs written at roughly the same time... "Trouble In Shangri-La," "Fall From Grace," "Bombay Sapphires" and "Everybody Finds Out," next to "Peacekeeper," "Miranda," "Steal Your Heart Away," and "Murrow," they'd be roughly neck and neck.

When we did that "rank the 'Say You Will' songs" thread, and everyone on these boards had an opportunity to weigh-in, JWD crunched the numbers, and overall it was Stevie's songs that dominated the top 10 out of all the rankings. Discounting older songs like "Goodbye Baby" and "Smile At You," she was still ahead of Lindsey overall.

Most fans tend to feel that 'Out Of The Cradle' is the pinnacle of his work, even when compared to his 'GOS/SYW' material. 'Cradle' was released 12 years ago.
Given that this is popular opinion, has Lindsey therefore also peaked creatively?

You and I would argue that he hasn't peaked creatively, but that would be a matter of opinion on our parts.
Just as it's a matter of opinion that anyone who thinks Stevie hasn't peaked, is merely deluding themselves.

So, overall, I'd be inclined to say that Stevie offers quality AND quantity, when you consider her batting average over the years.

sodascouts · #87 05-04-2004, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny Stew

If we were to go through and cut Stevie's solo output down to a comparable 33 songs (the number of tracks on Lindsey's albums, totalled without the instrumental/spoken intros on 'Cradle'), and assuming that only the best of Stevie's material over the course of those 23 years would have been included (assuming the fact that, given the length between his releases, LB only used the best of his material)... then I'd say Stevie would be ahead of LB.

Gotta love these elaborate hypothetical scenarios!

Quote:

Most fans tend to feel that 'Out Of The Cradle' is the pinnacle of his work, even when compared to his 'GOS/SYW' material. 'Cradle' was released 12 years ago.
Given that this is popular opinion, has Lindsey therefore also peaked creatively?

You and I would argue that he hasn't peaked creatively, but that would be a matter of opinion on our parts.
Just as it's a matter of opinion that anyone who thinks Stevie hasn't peaked, is merely deluding themselves.

Smooth, very smooth! lol Let's hope neither of them have peaked.

David · #88 05-04-2004, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny Stew

If we were to go through and cut Stevie's solo output down to a comparable 33 songs (the number of tracks on Lindsey's albums, totalled without the instrumental/spoken intros on 'Cradle'), and assuming that only the best of Stevie's material over the course of those 23 years would have been included (assuming the fact that, given the length between his releases, LB only used the best of his material)... then I'd say Stevie would be ahead of LB.

Maybe our mistake is in comparing his songwriting output with her songwriting output. Since he himself has said (& I happen to agree with him) that his main contribution to the band isn't as a singer or writer or guitarist but as an arranger, we need to compare his arrangement highs & lows with her songwriting highs & lows (songwriting being her main love & contribution). They're both pretty damn good at their respective strengths.

Quote:

Most fans tend to feel that 'Out Of The Cradle' is the pinnacle of his work, even when compared to his 'GOS/SYW' material. 'Cradle' was released 12 years ago.
Given that this is popular opinion, has Lindsey therefore also peaked creatively?

I hate to sound like The Crank In The Wilderness (or maybe not), but I think the whole lot of 'em peaked creatively about 25 years ago.

At this point, I would like to see scientific experimentation conducted on them at any of the nation's top research institutions.