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  #91  
Old 11-05-2019, 10:46 PM
John Run John Run is offline
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I am late to this - but I think Sara is one of the greatest production jobs ever. (I for one have always believed Lindsey generally made better production choices on songs he did not write.) The 2 intertwined acoustics a steel string and nylon mimicking each other and mixed to sound as one. The tele yearning to be heard within the layers of harmonies, while the cradle rocking rhythm arrangement simultaneously anchors the song and hinges each section together. Then my absolute favorite part - the two electric pianos - Christine playing Stevie’s two finger part into a self contained orchestra of chords while Lindsey counters it with a second piano part played slightly off time as only he would.

Just a perfectly produced song.
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  #92  
Old 11-06-2019, 01:06 AM
michelej1 michelej1 is offline
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But what about those acts who acknowledge they have dedicated fans who see them over and over and over again and play accordingly. Springsteen does this. There are always people there to see him for the first time, but he plays to those people who know everything he’s done and will embrace the deep tracks.

Unfortunately, Prince thought people still needed to see him in high heels. If he’d switched to Reeboks, he might still be alive. But he wasn’t as misguided with his set list. He often liked to play as if he was in his own living room. He would pull old songs out of the mothballs and play them. He would switch up every concert and just choose songs to perform spontaneously and he would expect his band to follow along and to know all of them

How do you finally transform into that performer? When you’ve been around for 40 years and you have sold a record-breaking number of albums, why do you keep playing for those who are seeing you for the first time. You’re almost 80 years old. Stop creating your set list for new people.
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  #93  
Old 11-06-2019, 01:12 AM
bombaysaffires bombaysaffires is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Run View Post
I am late to this - but I think Sara is one of the greatest production jobs ever. (I for one have always believed Lindsey generally made better production choices on songs he did not write.) The 2 intertwined acoustics a steel string and nylon mimicking each other and mixed to sound as one. The tele yearning to be heard within the layers of harmonies, while the cradle rocking rhythm arrangement simultaneously anchors the song and hinges each section together. Then my absolute favorite part - the two electric pianos - Christine playing Stevie’s two finger part into a self contained orchestra of chords while Lindsey counters it with a second piano part played slightly off time as only he would.

Just a perfectly produced song.
the ebbing and swelling of the background vocals are signature Lindsey production and give a momentum to the song her demo doesn't have. Without it the song would drone. He does the same on Gypsy. He puts the hills and valleys into her otherwise flat musical landscape.
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  #94  
Old 11-06-2019, 08:17 AM
jbrownsjr jbrownsjr is offline
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Originally Posted by michelej1 View Post
But what about those acts who acknowledge they have dedicated fans who see them over and over and over again and play accordingly. Springsteen does this. There are always people there to see him for the first time, but he plays to those people who know everything he’s done and will embrace the deep tracks.

Unfortunately, Prince thought people still needed to see him in high heels. If he’d switched to Reeboks, he might still be alive. But he wasn’t as misguided with his set list. He often liked to play as if he was in his own living room. He would pull old songs out of the mothballs and play them. He would switch up every concert and just choose songs to perform spontaneously and he would expect his band to follow along and to know all of them

How do you finally transform into that performer? When you’ve been around for 40 years and you have sold a record-breaking number of albums, why do you keep playing for those who are seeing you for the first time. You’re almost 80 years old. Stop creating your set list for new people.
It's what happens when the people paying you 100 mil dictate the show.
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  #95  
Old 11-06-2019, 09:48 AM
jbrownsjr jbrownsjr is offline
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Originally Posted by bombaysaffires View Post
the ebbing and swelling of the background vocals are signature Lindsey production and give a momentum to the song her demo doesn't have. Without it the song would drone. He does the same on Gypsy. He puts the hills and valleys into her otherwise flat musical landscape.
I love what Christine and Lindsey do for Sara live. It's fantastic on the Tusk Tour.
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  #96  
Old 11-06-2019, 04:47 PM
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HomerMcvie HomerMcvie is offline
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It's what happens when the people paying you 100 mil dictate the show.
Exactly. They're too afraid they won't sell out the venues if they don't stick to the routine.

Speaking of sell outs....
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  #97  
Old 11-06-2019, 06:22 PM
sue sue is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Run View Post
I am late to this - but I think Sara is one of the greatest production jobs ever. (I for one have always believed Lindsey generally made better production choices on songs he did not write.) The 2 intertwined acoustics a steel string and nylon mimicking each other and mixed to sound as one. The tele yearning to be heard within the layers of harmonies, while the cradle rocking rhythm arrangement simultaneously anchors the song and hinges each section together. Then my absolute favorite part - the two electric pianos - Christine playing Stevie’s two finger part into a self contained orchestra of chords while Lindsey counters it with a second piano part played slightly off time as only he would.

Just a perfectly produced song.
Wow, thanks John.
I’m going to put on and listen again(and again) to Sara.
I love it when people with musical knowledge explain and breakdown a song.
Thanks
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  #98  
Old 11-07-2019, 01:30 PM
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aleuzzi aleuzzi is offline
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Originally Posted by bombaysaffires View Post
the ebbing and swelling of the background vocals are signature Lindsey production and give a momentum to the song her demo doesn't have. Without it the song would drone. He does the same on Gypsy. He puts the hills and valleys into her otherwise flat musical landscape.
Amen to that. Without the production, Sara is pretty skeletal. The RS reviewer at the time noted that "Brown Eyes" was a mere scrap of a song that the production made into a magnificent castle in the air. I don't dispute this. The difference is "Brown Eyes" would still sound compelling with just Christine singing to her electric piano. The verses have a tuneful shape and the chorus of sha la las is irresistible. Meanwhile, "Sara" without the gorgeous orchestration, killer bottom-end, and lush vocal harmonies is tedious and unremarkable. The production MAKES the song--excepting the opening piano and vocal section ("Wait a minute baby...) which is catchy on its own.

"Storms" and "Beautiful Child" and "Angel" could stand on their own without elaborate production, .
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  #99  
Old 11-07-2019, 02:24 PM
bombaysaffires bombaysaffires is offline
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Originally Posted by aleuzzi View Post
Amen to that. Without the production, Sara is pretty skeletal. The RS reviewer at the time noted that "Brown Eyes" was a mere scrap of a song that the production made into a magnificent castle in the air. I don't dispute this. The difference is "Brown Eyes" would still sound compelling with just Christine singing to her electric piano. The verses have a tuneful shape and the chorus of sha la las is irresistible. Meanwhile, "Sara" without the gorgeous orchestration, killer bottom-end, and lush vocal harmonies is tedious and unremarkable. The production MAKES the song--excepting the opening piano and vocal section ("Wait a minute baby...) which is catchy on its own.

"Storms" and "Beautiful Child" and "Angel" could stand on their own without elaborate production, .
actually Lindsey explained in a long interview where he went through many songs and how he produced them that Storms was kind of a basic country song [and from what he said it sounds like it might have been a more twangy or even a bit more upbeat the way she had it] and anyone else would have kept it that way but he wanted it to be more meaningful. I think it was a British interview. I have it recorded somewhere. That's a great example of his production where it sounds really simple like oh that's just Stevie and Lindsey and his one acoustic guitar and it's not. There's many layers of guitar made to sound simple and there's a piano line that runs through it that really adds to it.

The piano on Beautiful Child does sound a lot like they took her original plonky piano thing she does on her demos and polished it a bit. I've never heard her demo of Angel, but given how she's done it solo that's another one that wouldn't have been as good without his influence. Having John's baseline so prominent really makes it pop. And LB tweaked her melody which you can see part of on the Tusk doc. then later in the doc she tells Christine how it was all her idea.
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  #100  
Old 11-07-2019, 06:15 PM
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aleuzzi aleuzzi is offline
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Originally Posted by bombaysaffires View Post
actually Lindsey explained in a long interview where he went through many songs and how he produced them that Storms was kind of a basic country song [and from what he said it sounds like it might have been a more twangy or even a bit more upbeat the way she had it] and anyone else would have kept it that way but he wanted it to be more meaningful. I think it was a British interview. I have it recorded somewhere. That's a great example of his production where it sounds really simple like oh that's just Stevie and Lindsey and his one acoustic guitar and it's not. There's many layers of guitar made to sound simple and there's a piano line that runs through it that really adds to it.

The piano on Beautiful Child does sound a lot like they took her original plonky piano thing she does on her demos and polished it a bit. I've never heard her demo of Angel, but given how she's done it solo that's another one that wouldn't have been as good without his influence. Having John's baseline so prominent really makes it pop. And LB tweaked her melody which you can see part of on the Tusk doc. then later in the doc she tells Christine how it was all her idea.
Those three songs may sound different and improved from their demos but the song structures themselves are sound and can stand on their own, which was my original point.
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  #101  
Old 11-07-2019, 11:44 PM
Kyle Kyle is offline
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I've always thought Christine's songs got short changed on this album. Lindsey's songs came out the way he wanted. Certainly, a lot of work was put into Sara.

The Peter Green version of Brown Eyes would have been, for me, the highlight of the album. Think About Me is a great song, but it sounds like a run through. I could do without the grunge guitar. Stevie's voice could have been more prominent in the mix.
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  #102  
Old 11-08-2019, 09:01 AM
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aleuzzi aleuzzi is offline
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I've always thought Christine's songs got short changed on this album. Lindsey's songs came out the way he wanted. Certainly, a lot of work was put into Sara.

The Peter Green version of Brown Eyes would have been, for me, the highlight of the album. Think About Me is a great song, but it sounds like a run through. I could do without the grunge guitar. Stevie's voice could have been more prominent in the mix.
I agree. As fine as Brown Eyes is, I prefer the Green version. And I also prefer the Think About Me version (sans Lindsey on vocal) from the deluxe. Had TAB been given a little bit more attention and had it been arranged more imaginatively, it could have been a HUGE hit. The final version we have has its charms and works as solid, crunching pub rock. But I’m one of the few who feel Lindsey’s presence on this one overwhelms the song, as opposed to serving the song—as he did so beautifully with Hold Me.
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  #103  
Old 11-09-2019, 02:38 AM
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HomerMcvie HomerMcvie is offline
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Think About Me is a great song, but it sounds like a run through. I could do without the grunge guitar. Stevie's voice could have been more prominent in the mix.
Noooo! I absolutley LOVE it just as it is! I wouldn't change a note of it!

$tevie who? I'll bet she's your favorite?
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  #104  
Old 11-09-2019, 02:41 AM
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HomerMcvie HomerMcvie is offline
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Originally Posted by aleuzzi View Post
I agree. As fine as Brown Eyes is, I prefer the Green version. And I also prefer the Think About Me version (sans Lindsey on vocal) from the deluxe. Had TAB been given a little bit more attention and had it been arranged more imaginatively, it could have been a HUGE hit. The final version we have has its charms and works as solid, crunching pub rock. But I’m one of the few who feel Lindsey’s presence on this one overwhelms the song, as opposed to serving the song—as he did so beautifully with Hold Me.
Lindsey's presence is what makes it work for me. The grungy guitars and his punky "EVERY EVERY ONCE IN A WHILE! "

TAB might be my favorite FM song of all time.
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  #105  
Old 11-09-2019, 06:27 AM
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I just read on november 10, 1979 (a day like tomorrow), Fleetwood Mac came for the second time to the first place in the English rankings with Tusk. On the other side of the Atlantic, in the United States, it reached fourth place.
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