...Cruel Summer for Touring Musicians

[Phoenix]

Originally Posted by crystal baller

Look at the OUTRAGEOUS prices the scalpers are trying to get on ebay
http://desc.shop.ebay.com/items/__fl...Q_sopZ3QQ_scZ1
I have never seen anything like this, with the times as hard as they are right now, are they out of their minds?!

There should be Laws against those prices!!!!!!!

[PoetofRhiannon]

Those are ridiculous prices! I can't believe anyone would pay that!?

[LukeA]

Scalpers can ask whatever they want for tickets... doesn't mean they're going to get it (as Fleetwood Mac/Live Nation are also finding out... lol)

[Ulpian]

I just cannot believe that they think they can get away with charging so much.

Lindsey, of all people, in that interview posted on here a few days back, said "Hopefully we'll make a ton of money". Good god. Is noone else appalled? We're in a recession the likes of which has not been seen since before he and Stevie joined Mick, John and Chris in the first place. (I expected Stevie to make the sort of remark she did about life being "a gazillion times more expensive" now, as she seems perenially out of touch.)

It will serve them right if the stadiums are half empty. The press conference and interviews so far just serve to convey the fact that they're only in it for the money and that they seem to have no clue how difficult life has become for ordinary people out there.

I am losing a bit of faith in this band, whom I have loved for such a long time, and that upsets me.

[Nikolaj]

It's all so bizarre, as it unfolds and i wish i could make heads or tails of it better- But this Irving Azoff- who is either a manager or lawyer (both?) for Fleetwood Mac, is part owner of 'TicketsNow' and possibly involved with 'I Love All Access' and 'Platinum Packages', all THREE of which have direct links on the TicketMaster site-- so it seems that Azoff (on behalf of the band, it would seem, as their representative) has purchased "a gazillion" of the best seats, and hey, scalpers and eBay never charged so much for what 'ticketsnow' wants for 2 seats to the MoheganSun show- prime seats, section 2,row B-- $1800!!! So, is it that one of his companies paid the $350 to TicketMaster (MoSun seats are $175 each) and if somehow the $1800 seats get sold, the $1450 profit would go to Mac and Azoff? Tell me i'm wrong, because it sure SEEMS that way. -and if this overselling of the best seats is achieved 100 times or so at each venue, which seems to be the attempt, that's another $145,000 in sales, per venue in somebody's pockets above the already high (but not ridiculously so*, actually) top ticket price! * compared to other bands, such as The Eagles...
As for me, i can't even get TicketMaster seats for any shows i try to pull up tickets for, i get a message of the ilk 'there's a problem with your request, please try again'--- So, thats when i checked out 'tickets now', 'i love all access' and the 'platinum packages'--
If Fleetwood Mac wants to play for their fans and have it not be completely about the money, they should cut the bullsh** with 'i love all access' and the 2 other linked ticketmaster sites and just get on with selling tickets to the show at the actual cost- $150 for best floor seats in most markets (slightly higher, i guess, for the casinos)-- You'd "think" in this economy they'd be doing well to get the $150 per seat, but $1800 for 2 seats--- dream on, silly dreamer
I'm not sure if Lindsey is 59 or 60 at this point, but (humor me)-- they are ALL in their 60s, have no new material, and the element of Christine (missing) does not add up to a band at its peak able to charge top dollar and then massacre with overkill packages. I think this Azoff (who i first became more than vaguely familiar with in the news article largely circulated lasted week- the teleconference interviews--) is really trying to milk (bilk) every last dollar possible out of this tour- perhaps, yes, that would be his job. But, perhaps, if he continues, the possible half-or-less-empty arenas will make this be remembered as the VERY unofficial Fleetwood Mac Farewell Tour....

[melodicrocker]

I definitely wouldn't be surprised if the St. Paul show is half empty...I've been checking TM every day and there's never a shortage of good seats still available.

[wheart]

Originally Posted by PoetofRhiannon

Those are ridiculous prices! I can't believe anyone would pay that!?

yeah, but look, free shipping!! What a deal!!

[michelej1]

Fleetwood Mac could only dream of getting as much publicity as Irving Azoff. The Wall Street Journal did a cover story on him this weekend, wondering if he could save rock and roll.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123517105948436743.html

It said that the Eagles made about $50 million by selling their CD through WalMart. Azoff said that if they had gone the traditional route, they would only have made pennies per CD. Could he do something similar for FM if they had a new album? I don't care whether it's muse or money that forces them into the studio, as long as they get there.

Michele

[LukeA]

Originally Posted by michelej1

Fleetwood Mac could only dream of getting as much publicity as Irving Azoff. The Wall Street Journal did a cover story on him this weekend, wondering if he could save rock and roll.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123517105948436743.html

It said that the Eagles made about $50 million by selling their CD through WalMart. Azoff said that if they had gone the traditional route, they would only have made pennies per CD. Could he do something similar for FM if they had a new album? I don't care whether it's muse or money that forces them into the studio, as long as they get there.

Michele

Its a virtual certainty that if Fleetwood Mac were to release a new studio CD, it would be a retailer exclusive (most likely Walmart). Would it be anywhere near as successful as the Eagles studio release? No way... but would it make the band more money than if it was released through Warners? Absolutely.

[Nikolaj]

Originally Posted by michelej1

Fleetwood Mac could only dream of getting as much publicity as Irving Azoff. The Wall Street Journal did a cover story on him this weekend, wondering if he could save rock and roll.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123517105948436743.html

It said that the Eagles made about $50 million by selling their CD through WalMart. Azoff said that if they had gone the traditional route, they would only have made pennies per CD. Could he do something similar for FM if they had a new album? I don't care whether it's muse or money that forces them into the studio, as long as they get there.

Michele

Totally agree with your sentiments that Mr. Azoff is a force and did brilliantly by the Eagles with their cd and would only hope for him to do the same with Fleetwood Mac. But, the unanswered question had only to do with the tour-- is it "ethical" for an Azoff-owned entity to purchase up the premium $150 seats and resell them on the band's behalf at prices greatly inflated through TicketsNow, I Love All Access, and PlatinumPackages? Is it even in the tour's best interest that the best seats cost $700 per seat for this tour, and that the "bad guys" aren't scalpers, but a representative of Fleetwood Mac who is scapling on behalf of the band? Come on, HUGE difference between brilliantly marketing a cd to get new music bought by vintage bands who can't get radio play for new material, and essentially defrauding the public by having the floor seats listed on TicketMaster for $150 and then finding that is a fraction of the actual cost being charged by three companies Azoff and Fleetwood Mac have formed to greatly inflate the ticket prices. I can tell you are intelligent enough to know the difference, and I mean no disrespect to you, personally. But i think if $150 is the 'top price' for the ticket and you can't get it unless you pay nearly $2000 for a pair of tickets for the best seats through these 3 companies, call it what it is: To see Fleetwood Mac in the first rows of floor seats, it will cost far, far more than what is being represented, and Azoff and Fleetwood Mac know all about it.
If $150 top price per seat in 10,000 seat venues, with tier pricing for the 45 dates insuring the band well over a $50 million gross for a short tour is not enough money for what is 4/5 of Fleetwood Mac's 'greatest hits unleashed tour' for Mr. Azoff and Fleetwood Mac to earn for a night of oldies, so be it. But to illicitly hide behind companies set up to try to ensure that the $45 million gross be snarkily inflated to $55 or $60 million (not including swag) is making the old-school scalpers look like saints! Through Mr. Azoff, Fleetwood Mac are now their OWN scalpers and by approving his tacticts, they essentially say 'yes we will gladly charge close to ten times or more than the actual ticket prices to make our holy buck rehashing the old songs once more, we're worth it, why not' - it's amazing how disgusting what is going on is only very slowly being recognized. So, while i commend Mr. Azoff on his business acumen for successfully marketing the Eagles newest cd-- that's awesome--- this tour is nothing that promotes new music and the ethics are-- what they are.
If able to find a pair of $150 seats through Ticketmaster that's satisfactory, I expect to attend. But Mr. Azoff's "publicity" and Wall Street coverage has nothing to do with dishonesty or greed, and the ticket selling of this tour is flat out deceptive, and seems to be born out of dishonesty and greed, so why cover for Azoff? The cd industry for 'classic rock' artists DID need saving-- the tour receipts of 'Say You Will' were excellent- 3 legs-- so, maybe the point for 'Unleashed' is for Azoff and Mac to make in 45 dates the same money in way, way, less time, and the only ones who get hurt are everyone wanting a good ticket at the claimed advertised price of $150 top-- except if the public rejects Azoff and Fleetwood Mac's deceit. Time will tell.

[TheScoop]

Originally Posted by Nikolaj

It's all so bizarre, as it unfolds and i wish i could make heads or tails of it better- But this Irving Azoff- who is either a manager or lawyer (both?) for Fleetwood Mac, is part owner of 'TicketsNow' and possibly involved with 'I Love All Access' and 'Platinum Packages', all THREE of which have direct links on the TicketMaster site-- so it seems that Azoff (on behalf of the band, it would seem, as their representative) has purchased "a gazillion" of the best seats, and hey, scalpers and eBay never charged so much for what 'ticketsnow' wants for 2 seats to the MoheganSun show- prime seats, section 2,row B-- $1800!!! So, is it that one of his companies paid the $350 to TicketMaster (MoSun seats are $175 each) and if somehow the $1800 seats get sold, the $1450 profit would go to Mac and Azoff? Tell me i'm wrong, because it sure SEEMS that way. -and if this overselling of the best seats is achieved 100 times or so at each venue, which seems to be the attempt, that's another $145,000 in sales, per venue in somebody's pockets above the already high (but not ridiculously so*, actually) top ticket price! * compared to other bands, such as The Eagles...
As for me, i can't even get TicketMaster seats for any shows i try to pull up tickets for, i get a message of the ilk 'there's a problem with your request, please try again'--- So, thats when i checked out 'tickets now', 'i love all access' and the 'platinum packages'--
If Fleetwood Mac wants to play for their fans and have it not be completely about the money, they should cut the bullsh** with 'i love all access' and the 2 other linked ticketmaster sites and just get on with selling tickets to the show at the actual cost- $150 for best floor seats in most markets (slightly higher, i guess, for the casinos)-- You'd "think" in this economy they'd be doing well to get the $150 per seat, but $1800 for 2 seats--- dream on, silly dreamer
I'm not sure if Lindsey is 59 or 60 at this point, but (humor me)-- they are ALL in their 60s, have no new material, and the element of Christine (missing) does not add up to a band at its peak able to charge top dollar and then massacre with overkill packages. I think this Azoff (who i first became more than vaguely familiar with in the news article largely circulated lasted week- the teleconference interviews--) is really trying to milk (bilk) every last dollar possible out of this tour- perhaps, yes, that would be his job. But, perhaps, if he continues, the possible half-or-less-empty arenas will make this be remembered as the VERY unofficial Fleetwood Mac Farewell Tour....

These inside deals have been going on for years and Ticketmaster is right there in the middle of it all. It is no coincidence that hours (sometimes days) before an event goes on sale, there are already premium tickets available from brokers listed on various broker sites. How is this possible if tickets have not officially gone on sale yet? Ticketsnow.com (who run their own independent broker site outside of Stubhub/Ebay and Ticket Network Direct) just posted recently how they are no longer allowing postings of tickets before the initial sale date anymore. You can read the announcement here: http://www.ticketsnow.com/TicketsNow...l_Message.html. The industry is getting scared right now because they realize people are starting to find out about this (finally).

These illegal practices have been going on for a long time and an investigation of Ticketmaster and its affiliates is long overdue. The only time (and I mean the only time) nowadays you can get premium seats at face value through Ticketmaster or at the venue is when tickets for that market have not sold for their extorted asking price and those involved in the sale get desperate enough to sell those tickets for their supposed "face value". From what I've been hearing, every FM show thus far outside of a major market is selling very very poorly. If you're attending one of these shows this year, do not be surprised to see half (or more than half) empty venues. If they get desperate enough, they may even drop their face value to avoid cancellation in some markets. This can and will happen if things continue (it's happened before with other artists). Do not, I repeat, do not pay these extorted broker prices for any shows you plan on attending. If anyone has been checking these broker/scalper sites lately, you will see that prices keep dropping and have already fallen to face value in certain areas. They realize there is no demand right now for these tickets at those high prices and they are adjusting them accordingly. If you can hold out until the last few days before the scheduled date of the show, you should be able to score excellent seats at face value or less.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by Nikolaj

Totally agree with your sentiments that Mr. Azoff is a force and did brilliantly by the Eagles with their cd and would only hope for him to do the same with Fleetwood Mac.

You're not posing an unanswered question. Azoff's self-dealing game has been clear since I started reading about him in the nineties, when he sold Eagles tickets for a (then) unheard of $200 a pop.

I don't think anyone here or in the media has praised Irving Azoff, Ticketmaster or Live Nation for being ethical. I never said that he did "brilliantly" by the Eagles or anyone else. I think the corruption aspect of his manipulations has been addressed nicely and much more extensively elsewhere, most recently in that WSJ article I just linked. And everyone has been talking about the ticket price travesty since the minute this tour was announced. So, I didn't see a need to comment on that. I think that's been answered many times over.

That's why my comment was not directed at concerts at all, but only to wonder whether moolah would entice FM back into the recording studio, even if the need to express themselves creatively would not.

Michele

[Nikolaj]

Thank You, Scoop and Michelle for the interesting and informative replies. Actually, i do think Azoff, in terms of marketing the Eagles cd 'Long Road Out of Eden' was amazing, since it sold $50 million worth of copies. I recall the SoundScan totals for Fleetwood Mac's 'Live In Boston' were significantly below 100,000 copies for the dvd-cd combo.
Thanks for the link to the Wall Street Journal piece, I will re-read it now. I just was commenting because while there has been some 'general malaise' here on The Ledge, um, generally, about the tour, I'd seen little, if any, mention of how Fleetwood Mac and Azoff had formed 3 companies to scalp their own tickets. I'd never known it to happen with a Mac tour before, thanks again for the information- and still, somehow I wish the band well and can only dream for a 'Frozen Love' opener with 'The Chain' and "Dreams" left for encores! Ha!
"Never before sung in this order"-- it could be a whole new marketing strategy for the tour! "see if Stevie can possibly survive without 'Dreams' being the second song!" --- "will Lindsey "go your own way" then "go insane"...."will Landslide fall off the face of the earth til the next Stevie Nicks solo tour??"
I digress (as usual)--
Scoop's information about the actual sales is eye-opening ( I did notice last week their PollStar.com ranking was low-ish, but didn't know for sure if it meant a lot.)
Thanks

[LukeA]

Originally Posted by TheScoop

Ticketsnow.com (who run their own independent broker site outside of Stubhub/Ebay and Ticket Network Direct) just posted recently how they are no longer allowing postings of tickets before the initial sale date anymore. You can read the announcement here: http://www.ticketsnow.com/TicketsNow...l_Message.html. The industry is getting scared right now because they realize people are starting to find out about this (finally).

Its my understanding that this rule pertains to people who purchase tickets to concerts via pre-sales, and tickets to sporting events that are re-sold by season ticket holders. There's nothing to "find out".

Originally Posted by TheScoop

The only time (and I mean the only time) nowadays you can get premium seats at face value through Ticketmaster or at the venue is when tickets for that market have not sold for their extorted asking price and those involved in the sale get desperate enough to sell those tickets for their supposed "face value".

Not true at all. I've gotten front & 2nd row for in-demand shows via public on-sale, and I know I'm not the only one.

Originally Posted by TheScoop

From what I've been hearing, every FM show thus far outside of a major market is selling very very poorly. If you're attending one of these shows this year, do not be surprised to see half (or more than half) empty venues. If they get desperate enough, they may even drop their face value to avoid cancellation in some markets. This can and will happen if things continue (it's happened before with other artists).

Everyone knows the tour is tanking- duh. Yes, we'll be seeing 2 for 1 deals and heavily papered venues in pretty much every market outside LA, the Bay Area, and NYC.

[TheScoop]

Originally Posted by LukeA

Its my understanding that this rule pertains to people who purchase tickets to concerts via pre-sales, and tickets to sporting events that are re-sold by season ticket holders. There's nothing to "find out".

It pertains to anyone attempting to sell tickets before the initial on sale date:

A Special Message from TicketsNow
Posted on February 6, 2009

At TicketsNow, we're always striving to create for fans the most fair and transparent buying experience. To help achieve our goal, we have decided to only allow postings on our marketplace after the initial onsale. By taking this action, we are the first and only resale marketplace to prevent the posting of speculative tickets before the actual onsale.

Originally Posted by LukeA

Not true at all. I've gotten front & 2nd row for in-demand shows via public on-sale, and I know I'm not the only one.

They will on occasion release a limited number of premium tickets in select markets for face value, but 90% of the time, those tickets can only be had a week or two before the event. There's a science behind all of this. It's virtually impossible to go to ticketmaster.com right when tickets for a show go on sale and pull up a pair of 1st or 2nd row seats. It just doesn't happen.