This was likely a Business Decision

[jkmaletic]

According to Elle's post (On the Mick's Social Media thread) of the Facebook conversation with Rick Turner, this sounds like it was a business decision, plain and simple.

I'm no business expert, but clearly it would not make good business sense for them to allow Lindsey to solo tour in between the Mac shows. If Stevie or Christine asked to do that, they would be shot down too. Let's say Don Henley asked to do the same thing during an Eagles tour - do you think the rest of the band members would allow that? Uh, NO. How about the Police? - If Sting asked the other members if he could do solo shows in between Police tour dates, I also doubt they would allow that. So if Lindsey indeed came to them and asked them about doing the in between solo shows and they wouldn't allow it, Lindsey must have insisted, which caused Mick/the rest of them to dismiss him.

Yes, there might be more to it than this, but this is probably the biggest reason for Lindsey's ousting.

I'm no tour manager, but as far as Lindsey's solo career goes, doesn't he have a solo album coming out this month? If so, I'm wondering why he couldn't tour it BEFORE Fleetwood Mac starts (allegedly) in the Fall? If he did that, he probably would have been able to stay with Fleetwood Mac.


Jamie

[jkmaletic]

For convenience purposes, here is the Rick Turner Facebook conversation:


the whole convo -

Rick Turner At one point, Lindsey had proposed that both FM and he with his band tour at the same time with the LB band filling in dates between the FM shows. The report was that Stevie wanted at least a day between gigs; Lindsey wanted to play as much as possible. That's what I heard from a most reliable source at the NAMM show in January.

Elle Llewi heard the same. thanks so much for filling this in Rick!

Elle Llew Rick Turner is it ok if i quote this on The Ledge? it's a google-able place and people sometimes check there.

Rick Turner Elle Llew Sure. I think it just points out one point of contention. Maybe it looked to some as though LB was going to do really well touring hard; perhaps not doubling his money on the tour, but certainly getting in nearly twice the audience face tim...See More

Elle Llew Rick Turner 😪 this makes me sad even more. what a f**king shame!

Elle Llew (excuse my language)

Rick Turner The whole thing is a mess, and I'm sorry for them all. I've had some memorable moments with that crew!

Haley Clark So then tensions were already high at Musicares. Because NAMM and Musicares were the same weekend. Which is probably what led to Stevie and Lindsey having their fight. And the rest is history.

Felix Le Chat Rick this is the most disgusting thing to hear: all could have been avoided.
Give Stevie 2, 3 or even 4 days between shows. I wouldn’t mind to visit consecutive LB gigs 😜
...See More

Pattie D I know for a fact that LB wanted to do a solo tour in between the FM tour. He did say that it was complicated and I guess he wasn't kidding.
I hope he gets to do the solo tour after all. I will not support Fleetwood Mac anymore.

Rick Turner Felix Le Chat Lindsey would have gotten more press than Stevie if they'd done a double tour like that.

Pattie D I really couldn't see Fleetwood Mac going along with his plans. What if people couldn't afford to see FM and went to see LB instead as it was more economical? Big problem.

Rick Turner Pattie D Would have to have been planned for different cities.

Pattie D I could see where that would get costly. Not to mention would the crew get any rest?

Elle Llew but that makes complete sense:

FM plays arena in downtown DC. LB solo plays the Fillmore in Silver Spring, MD.

FM plays MSG . LB solo plays Red Bank, NJ.

easy peasy!

Felix Le Chat Rick Turner : a logistical nightmare (aside from costs) 😝 to have it in different cities.
Most cities do have multiple venues. Although in this group the LB fan ship reels highly I do believe Lindsey would have been ok to play smaller venues than FM.

And I’m sure he got enough guitars 🎸 for 2 sets (if not you could probably help on that &#128540


Rick Turner Pattie D Well, it would just be two interlaced tours with some of the folks working practically every night. But that's what they do in musical theater...Broadway and off-Broadway actors do eight shows a week...six nights and two matinees. That's what professionals are capable of. At one point the Beach Boys were often enough doing two gigs on the same day, and on at least one day, they did three...in three different cities. Lot's of alimony to pay for those guys!

Pattie D Don't forget Providence after FM plays Boston, Elle. LOL

Elle LlewYPattie D i'm self serving

Rick Turner It would have been doable. It just needed everyone's buy-in.

Pattie D Well sadly it's never going to happen now.

Elle Llew Felix Le Chat nope, wouldn't be. see above. FM plays cities, LB solo suburbs. works!



here's the link to these posts: https://www.facebook.com/groups/8972...5412200239934/

[button-lip]

Originally Posted by jkmaletic

Rick Turner The whole thing is a mess, and I'm sorry for them all. I've had some memorable moments with that crew!

Love that part of the convo! There was nothing amicable here.

[elle]

Originally Posted by jkmaletic

According to Elle's post (On the Mick's Social Media thread) of the Facebook conversation with Rick Turner, this sounds like it was a business decision, plain and simple.

I'm no business expert, but clearly it would not make good business sense for them to allow Lindsey to solo tour in between the Mac shows. If Stevie or Christine asked to do that, they would be shot down too. Let's say Don Henley asked to do the same thing during an Eagles tour - do you think the rest of the band members would allow that? Uh, NO. How about the Police? - If Sting asked the other members if he could do solo shows in between Police tour dates, I also doubt they would allow that. So if Lindsey indeed came to them and asked them about doing the in between solo shows and they wouldn't allow it, Lindsey must have insisted, which caused Mick/the rest of them to dismiss him.

Yes, there might be more to it than this, but this is probably the biggest reason for Lindsey's ousting.

I'm no tour manager, but as far as Lindsey's solo career goes, doesn't he have a solo album coming out this month? If so, I'm wondering why he couldn't tour it BEFORE Fleetwood Mac starts (allegedly) in the Fall? If he did that, he probably would have been able to stay with Fleetwood Mac.


Jamie

and yet, Stevie had no problem whatsoever with the Pretenders doing it.

it's interesting view to ponder, for sure, but doesn't make sense when you take into account Stevie's last year's tour with the Pretenders.

[SisterNightroad]

Originally Posted by elle

and yet, Stevie had no problem whatsoever with the Pretenders doing it.

it's interesting view to ponder, for sure, but doesn't make sense when you take into account Stevie's last year's tour with the Pretenders.

But the Pretenders weren't part of her own solo band, just the opening act, nor did they use her staff/crew. If Waddy or Al were to ask her if they could join another tour during 24K Gold I think she'd surely deny.

[elle]

Originally Posted by SisterNightroad

But the Pretenders weren't part of her own solo band, just the opening act, nor did they use her staff/crew. If Waddy or Al were to ask her if they could join another tour during 24K Gold I think she'd surely deny.

the pretenders were a big part of the draw for her tour. and same people were playing in the pretenders opening for her and at their solo gigs.

[SisterNightroad]

Of course, the point is that they are a separate band with a separate entourage.

[jbrownsjr]

Originally Posted by elle

and yet, Stevie had no problem whatsoever with the Pretenders doing it.

it's interesting view to ponder, for sure, but doesn't make sense when you take into account Stevie's last year's tour with the Pretenders.

Great point!!

[Tango]

Originally Posted by jbrownsjr

Great point!!

There is a comparison, I agree. Here's the difference. The Pretenders are a totally different band. Lindsey is an integral member of Fleetwood Mac (or was, until this insanity began). If Chrissy Hind goes off and exhausts herself doing a solo gig, no problem- it reflects only on her. If Lindsey goes off with his solo plans and then is unable to do the PR crap that goes along with either gig, there will be some friction. Fleetwood Mac demands all. Does it matter? Well, if The Big Machine is financing the travel, hoteling, etc, I suspect The Big Machine has great expectations of it's members. For Lindsey doing this mingled tour is win-win. He gets critical PR exposure. His traveling and lodging is largely helped out by The Big Machine. Maybe Lindsey's solo outing with the intermingling could have been somewhat beneficial for Fleetwood Mac, but it chiefly benefitted Lindsey. (So what? Does it matter that Lindsey got the win win?) I do agree with the premise of the opening thread, that it is likely (and maybe largely) a business decision:

But I am suspecting the wish of The Big Machine was for Lindsey to have done his solo work in completion before or after Fleetwood Mac's outing. AGAIN, this is ALL a bunch of IFs. If Stevie was willing to accommodate Chrissy (and Chrissy, like Lindsey tours on a TINY scale compared to Fleetwood Mac), that was her choice. The PR for Stevie's small scale outing coupled with The Pretenders PR was tiny. Fleetwood Mac is the big machine. The FM Machine is not willing to compromise, and neither was Lindsey.

In the end, I think they are all damaged by this whole thing.

[bwboy]

Originally Posted by jbrownsjr

Great point!!

This just seems biased, and I'll say why:

Using that argument, that Stevie didn't mind the Pretenders performing solo gigs during the 24 Karat Gold tour, it stands to reason Stevie wouldn't have minded Lindsey doing it during the upcoming tour, too. But the simple fact is, it's not an accurate comparison. Now, if Waddy or her backup singers or someone else in her band had performed with the Pretenders on their solo gigs, she probably would have had an issue with that, because she's paying her band for their time, including hotels, etc.

Furthermore, some people seem to forget that there are two other members of FM that might have had concerns about the two tours. But Lindsey fans are focused on Stevie and Mick, Stevie and Mick, Stevie and Mick. They think that Christine is bound by some sort of iron-clad contract that forces her to go along with FM. Christine can't possibly be in agreement with this decision to let Lindsey go. Perhaps they think Christine is at home crying in her pillow, because she's so devastated that Stevie and Mick have betrayed Lindsey this way, and there's. nothing. she. can. do. about. it. Well, maybe that makes them feel better.

Clearly, John and Christine have just as much a say as anyone else in the band. They could have demanded Lindsey be allowed any provisions he needed to be able to stay in FM, or they could have said they would walk. Or tour with Lindsey instead. Or they could have claimed they were not up to touring. They could have passed on letting Mike Campbell or Neil Finn join. They are not innocent bystanders here. Yet somehow, people direct their anger on Mick and Stevie only. Or they might respond "well I'm angry at them too!" but then go right back to Mick and Stevie.

[FuzzyPlum]

I can't speak for anyone else but I for one am pi$$ed off with all 4 of them.
I think you (bwboy) made a comment in another forum about people showing allegiances to their favourite members... well I can honestly say I've lost respect for Christine. I'm big enough and mature enough to appreciate Lindsey has been wronged and I'm not going to speak up for Christine just for the sake of it. I'm too much of a grown up for those sort of games.

[bwboy]

Originally Posted by FuzzyPlum

I can't speak for anyone else but I for one am pi$$ed off with all 4 of them.
I think you (bwboy) made a comment in another forum about people showing allegiances to their favourite members... well I can honestly say I've lost respect for Christine. I'm big enough and mature enough to appreciate Lindsey has been wronged and I'm not going to speak up for Christine just for the sake of it. I'm too much of a grown up for those sort of games.

It probably was me, and while that may not apply to everyone, just look back at a number of these threads and you'll see "Stevie and Mick, Stevie and Mick" and no mention for Christine or John, except for the occasional "Christine is probably contracted to do this tour." It's important to remember there are, or were, 5 people in this band and a decision like this should reflect on all of them.

[pattyfan]

I guess I don't totally understand the situation, because it seems to me that if it was purely a business decision, it would have been much better not to fire him. Now they are risking selling far fewer tickets at shows. I think if they did a tour and LB did solo shows on off days, it would have little or no impact on ticket sales for Mac shows. I think that a vast, vast majority of people would either go to both shows or only the Mac show in their area, whereas with the new lineup, far more people will just stay away from the Mac show. So it being a business decision makes no sense to me.

The other thing I'll add is that I'm seriously astounded that money could even come into this. If any of them are not already set for life, then it just speaks to horrible greed and a complete and utter lack of ability to live within an extraordinarily huge means. Very sad.

Kevin

[TrueFaith77]

I’d rather they all had broken up. Lindsey and Stevie could focus on their solo careers which have only reached new heights of artistry. Christine could have worked with Lindsey again or recorded Blues albums with Mick in Hawaii u til they die.Now they are just bastardizing their legacy. Except Lindsey who will marshal this into creativity, I pray.

[BLY]

Originally Posted by TrueFaith77

I’d rather they all had broken up. Lindsey and Stevie could focus on their solo careers which have only reached new heights of artistry. Christine could have worked with Lindsey again or recorded Blues albums with Mick in Hawaii u til they die.Now they are just bastardizing their legacy. Except Lindsey who will marshal this into creativity, I pray.

I'm with you on this. I have been a fan since 1976 and loved all versions of the band. I'm a huge Petty and Crowded House fan but this is just wrong on many fronts. The last tour would have been a great end with the return of Christine.