The Ledge

Go Back   The Ledge > Main Forums > The Early Years
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read


Make the Ads Go Away! Click here.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-18-2022, 12:10 AM
Street_Dreamer's Avatar
Street_Dreamer Street_Dreamer is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Eureka, CA
Posts: 779
Default I Miss Bob Welch

I was just thinking about Bob and realized it's been just over 10 years since his passing. It still hurts to think about how he passed and the reasons why it happened. I wish he had been able to live a longer life, free from the pain that took him from this world.

He truly seemed like a good, down-to-earth person who didn't know or comprehend just how big of an impact he made in the lives of so many. So many of us who are fans of Fleetwood Mac are in debt to him because he was the one who fought so hard not only to ensure the band kept its name and identity but also fought to bring the band to the States which ended up being the difference in continuing. It's still an outrage that he wasn't and still hasn't been recognized by the R&RHoF for his importance to the legacy of Fleetwood Mac but many of us on here know how important Bob Welch was and is to the band after his tenure.

He mattered and still matters. His music still matters. Hopefully wherever he's at, he's in a place where he's able to know how much he's still loved and missed.
Reply With Quote
.
  #2  
Old 06-18-2022, 12:18 AM
HomerMcvie's Avatar
HomerMcvie HomerMcvie is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Indiana/Tennessee
Posts: 14,175
Default

Bob was great, and FM should be ashamed that they've ignored his legacy.

I was just reading a couple of his posts I'd saved, literally an hour ago, after reading the publishing thread in the other forum. He was responding to questions that I'd asked him. So approachable, and so nice.

I left Nashville(where he lived) the morning he committed suicide. When I got to my other place, I checked in here, and saw that he'd died. My heart sank. I'd always dreamed of inviting him and Wendy out to dinner, and I'm reasonable sure they might have accepted. I was just too afraid of rejection. Regrets, I've got a few...
__________________
I will CRUSH YOU!!!! KAREN BRING ME MY FLIP PHONE!
And I'm David, not Homer!(we all should be able to change our name, at least once)
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-18-2022, 03:17 AM
Macfan4life's Avatar
Macfan4life Macfan4life is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Somewhere near Key Biscayne, nothing there so I came back
Posts: 4,657
Default

It really was a sad ending to such a brilliant performer. The way the Mac treated him was horrible. I believe Bob's wife since she would have no reason to lie that it was Chris and Mick that prevented him from the RRHOF.
One of my biggest regrets in life was not emailing him, buying something, or posting something on this website in the late 90s early 2000. I remember going and reading stuff there and was like "oh cool" but it took me a few more years to really appreciate Bob's work even more. It gets forgotten or not told but it was Bob that brought the band to the States. Without Bob who knows if the Mac ever would have taken the plunge to come to the states. Bob took the band on a more mystical and magical path and adding harmony. Without Bob there would have never been Stevie and Lindsey. Without Bob the band would have never been the super group they turned into.
__________________
Christine on Stevie 1984: "10 years ago she really had her feet on the ground but she seems to have developed her own fantasy world, somehow, which I’m not part of. We don’t socialize much."
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 06-18-2022, 09:58 AM
HomerMcvie's Avatar
HomerMcvie HomerMcvie is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Indiana/Tennessee
Posts: 14,175
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Macfan4life View Post
It really was a sad ending to such a brilliant performer. The way the Mac treated him was horrible. I believe Bob's wife since she would have no reason to lie that it was Chris and Mick that prevented him from the RRHOF.
I don't think it was Mick. He's not the grudge holding type. It was Chris. She IS the grudge holding type.
__________________
I will CRUSH YOU!!!! KAREN BRING ME MY FLIP PHONE!
And I'm David, not Homer!(we all should be able to change our name, at least once)
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 06-18-2022, 01:05 PM
aleuzzi's Avatar
aleuzzi aleuzzi is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 5,229
Default

Bob was a very good, inventive guitar player and a unique singer. But his true legacy, I think, is in songwriting. Most of the songs from the Welch-years Mac albums and at least a half-dozen tunes from various solo albums (even beyond his three or four solo singles) are ripe for reinterpretation by an artist who can reach a wider audience. Some of the best candidates for this are his less-celebrated tunes. Miles Away, The Ghost, Watch the Animals, Emerald Eyes, and Angel—to name just a few.

And then there are the stunners—Future Games, Lay It All Down, Hypnotized, Night Watch....

He gave a lot.

Ultimately, the academy is responsible for his being overlooked for the RRHOF honor, but none of the core trio, Christine in particular, would advocate for him. If you watch The Dance rehearsal interview with the Rumours lineup, her anger is evident even at Mick’s mention of Bob’s name.

The snub from RRHOF should have been corrected years later, once all the animosity had passed. But again, no one in the band would step forward to advocate. Bob died feeling undervalued and forgotten. He wasn’t. He isn’t.

Last edited by aleuzzi; 06-18-2022 at 01:07 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 06-18-2022, 02:37 PM
HomerMcvie's Avatar
HomerMcvie HomerMcvie is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Indiana/Tennessee
Posts: 14,175
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aleuzzi View Post
Bob was a very good, inventive guitar player and a unique singer. But his true legacy, I think, is in songwriting. Most of the songs from the Welch-years Mac albums and at least a half-dozen tunes from various solo albums (even beyond his three or four solo singles) are ripe for reinterpretation by an artist who can reach a wider audience. Some of the best candidates for this are his less-celebrated tunes. Miles Away, The Ghost, Watch the Animals, Emerald Eyes, and Angel—to name just a few.

And then there are the stunners—Future Games, Lay It All Down, Hypnotized, Night Watch....

He gave a lot.

Ultimately, the academy is responsible for his being overlooked for the RRHOF honor, but none of the core trio, Christine in particular, would advocate for him. If you watch The Dance rehearsal interview with the Rumours lineup, her anger is evident even at Mick’s mention of Bob’s name.

The snub from RRHOF should have been corrected years later, once all the animosity had passed. But again, no one in the band would step forward to advocate. Bob died feeling undervalued and forgotten. He wasn’t. He isn’t.
It's kind of sad how much stock he and Wendy both put into his exclusion. I mean, I get it. But there are MANY glaring omissions from the HOF.
__________________
I will CRUSH YOU!!!! KAREN BRING ME MY FLIP PHONE!
And I'm David, not Homer!(we all should be able to change our name, at least once)
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 06-18-2022, 03:07 PM
Macfan4life's Avatar
Macfan4life Macfan4life is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Somewhere near Key Biscayne, nothing there so I came back
Posts: 4,657
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HomerMcvie View Post
It's kind of sad how much stock he and Wendy both put into his exclusion. I mean, I get it. But there are MANY glaring omissions from the HOF.
Apples and oranges my dear friend or in your case should I say corn and hay. True dat! There are MANY glaring omissions from the HOF. 100% Correct. However Bob's exclusion was the band's creation. Pat Benatar not in the HOF is a glaring omission. Its not the same when the band cock blocks you from admission. And this has happened before too. Deborah Harry blocked Blondie's original drummer from admission and playing at the HOF. The HOF let in EVERY member of the Grateful Dead's countless line ups yet would not allow all members of Kiss in and only inducted the current line up. This led to Kiss boycotting the event. However both these scenarios are not a comparison to Fleetwood Mac. Did they not induct earlier members too like Peter Green? Yet the band took issue with one of the most pivotal members in the band's history. Long story short, the Bob exclusion does not quite fit in other examples of HOF dramas.

Having said all this there is something disturbing about Bob's case that annoys the hell out of me. Because the drama of the Fleetwood Mac induction came on the heals of The Dance and a huge reunion, it could have been interpreted that Bob was being greedy and trying to cash in on the band's new success. Nothing could be further from the truth. Bob's lawsuit we assume was about royalties and it was filed during the Mac's darkest days. The band's Time album went cardboard and even everyone's solo career had run out of steam. The Dance led to huge album sales of all Mac's albums including those that Bob was a part of. However in the mid 90s not many people were running out to buy Mac albums. Fleetwood Mac was playing night clubs around the country. When Bob filed Mick probably freaked out since he needed those nickels and dimes to stay afloat. What could be the most Bob was asking for. Those early Mac albums were not platinum (or at least not some of them yet). He probably shot for the moon and asked for $500k and hoped for a settlement for $250k. The Mac probably spent more on legal bills than any small royalty pay out. For Bob $200K would have been a huge pay day. It was so greedy and stupid to argue over peanuts on early Mac albums. So yes, I am bitter still to this day over all of this. But lets not forget. Chris had just bought a house and was in the midst of remodeling it. I think we heard this excuse before.
The Bob Welch and friends concert is one of the greatest concerts ever. They clearly got along until one day things looked bleak and threw him overboard. $$$$$$$$
__________________
Christine on Stevie 1984: "10 years ago she really had her feet on the ground but she seems to have developed her own fantasy world, somehow, which I’m not part of. We don’t socialize much."

Last edited by Macfan4life; 06-18-2022 at 04:14 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 06-18-2022, 03:57 PM
HomerMcvie's Avatar
HomerMcvie HomerMcvie is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Indiana/Tennessee
Posts: 14,175
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Macfan4life View Post
Apples and oranges my dear friend or in your case should I say corn and hay. True dat! There are MANY glaring omissions from the HOF. 100% Correct. However Bob's exclusion was the band's creation. Pat Benatar not in the HOF is a glaring omission. Its not the same when the band cock blocks you from admission. And this has happened before too. Deborah Harry blocked Blondie's original drummer from admission and playing at the HOF. The HOF let in EVERY member of the Grateful Dead's countless line ups yet would not allow all members of Kiss in and only inducted the current line up. This led to Kiss boycotting the event. However both these scenarios are not a comparison to Fleetwood Mac. Did they not induct earlier members too like Peter Green? Yet the band took issue with one of the most pivotal members in the band's history. Long story short, the Bob exclusion does not quite fit in other examples of HOF dramas.

Having said all this there is something disturbing about Bob's case that annoys the hell out of me. Because the drama of the Fleetwood Mac induction came on the heals of The Dance and a huge reunion, it could have been interpreted that Bob was being greedy and trying to cash in on the band's new success. Nothing could be further from the truth. Bob's lawsuit we assume was about royalties and it was filed during the Mac's darkest days. The band's Time album went cardboard and even everyone's solo career had run out of steam. The Dance led to huge album sales of all Mac's albums including those that Bob was a part of. However in the mid 90s not many people were running out to buy Mac albums. Fleetwood Mac was playing night clubs around the country. When Bob filed Mick probably freaked out since he needed those nickels and dimes to stay afloat. What could be the most Bob was asking for. Those early Mac albums were not platinum (or at least not some of them yet). He probably shot for the moon and asked for $500k and hoped for a settlement for $250k. The Mac probably spent more on legal bills than any small royalty pay out. For Bob $200K would have been a huge pay day. It was so greedy and stupid to argue over peanuts on early Mac albums. So yes, I am bitter still to this day over all of this. But lets not forget. Chris had just bought a house and was in the midst of remodeling it. I think we heard this excuse before.
The Bob Welch and friends concert is one of the greatest concerts ever. They clearly got along until one day things looked bleak and threw him overboard.
I'm convinced it was all Christine that kept him out. Lesson is that you don't f*ck with Christine. And yes, Mick is always 50 cents away from his next bankruptcy. Because Mick is a loser.
Christine will always be my favorite(although Lindsey is almost a tie these days, since he's mellowed out), but I've never felt about her the same, after finding out she was the one who kept Bob out.
__________________
I will CRUSH YOU!!!! KAREN BRING ME MY FLIP PHONE!
And I'm David, not Homer!(we all should be able to change our name, at least once)
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 06-19-2022, 01:56 AM
aleuzzi's Avatar
aleuzzi aleuzzi is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 5,229
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HomerMcvie View Post
It's kind of sad how much stock he and Wendy both put into his exclusion. I mean, I get it. But there are MANY glaring omissions from the HOF.
Yes—he did place too much importance on that honor, which is really muddled with industry politics. His not being inducted, however, is especially galling in light of Jeremy and Danny’s inductions. As excellent as their Mac work is, Bob’s influence had a more far-reaching influence upon the band’s sound.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 06-19-2022, 05:31 AM
Macfan4life's Avatar
Macfan4life Macfan4life is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Somewhere near Key Biscayne, nothing there so I came back
Posts: 4,657
Default

I think the RRHOF is total crap. I admire bands like Kiss who bash the hall even though they get inducted. There are no standards and fantastic acts get over looked while acts that are not rock and have a pop hit get inducted first.
Having said that I understand Bob's frustration. He was just in the midst of battling the forces of the band. The band suddenly was #1 again and being honored. Back in 1997, the RRHOF meant something. Today its a joke and no one takes them serious anymore. Bob knew the impact he had on the band. He brought them to the states and transformed the band with the seeds of growth in the USA that led to Stevie and Lindsey joining. Bob knew they would never be on that stage without him. When you realize the mindset Bob was in at the time (feeling being cheated) and then the insult of the band excluding him from the honor, I understand he and his wife's anger. In addition when bands are inducted, they get publicity and their older albums sell. Bob was at the stage in his life that it meant his career meant something. Yet the forces in the band robbed him yet again. Worse still is how the band erased him from the VH1 series "Behind the Music." That took a lot of work to do. The segment says the band left England for the States and hired Lindsey and Stevie. Even worse when they show the back cover of Heroes are Hard to Find, Bob is edited off the back cover. Its as like Bob's era never existed. Its almost like what Van Halen did to Michael Anthony. They tried to scrub him off the band's website. When you combine all 3 factors (royalties, HOF snub, and being erased), how could you not get angry. Oh yeah all this happened when the band reunited and made a fortune. Long story short, I completely understand Bob and his wife's anger. I tip my hat to Stevie for always being so kind to Bob. The next year on the Enchanted tour, Stevie visited him at this house in Nashville. I would have chopped off my left foot to have been a fly on the wall during that get together.
__________________
Christine on Stevie 1984: "10 years ago she really had her feet on the ground but she seems to have developed her own fantasy world, somehow, which I’m not part of. We don’t socialize much."

Last edited by Macfan4life; 06-19-2022 at 08:48 AM..
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 06-19-2022, 09:43 AM
HomerMcvie's Avatar
HomerMcvie HomerMcvie is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Indiana/Tennessee
Posts: 14,175
Default

Let's face it, our band is mostly SCUM. They're not good people. Self centered, self absorbed scum.

New Lindsey is probably the best of them(NOT to be confused with old Lindsey).

NONE of the huge success they had would have happened if not for the Bob era. Which was FIVE albums! It's not like they released an EP and he moved on. Five albums!
__________________
I will CRUSH YOU!!!! KAREN BRING ME MY FLIP PHONE!
And I'm David, not Homer!(we all should be able to change our name, at least once)
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 06-19-2022, 09:38 PM
aleuzzi's Avatar
aleuzzi aleuzzi is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 5,229
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HomerMcvie View Post
Let's face it, our band is mostly SCUM. They're not good people. Self centered, self absorbed scum.

New Lindsey is probably the best of them(NOT to be confused with old Lindsey).

NONE of the huge success they had would have happened if not for the Bob era. Which was FIVE albums! It's not like they released an EP and he moved on. Five albums!
Five largely rewarding albums that range from “good” to “great.” All in a four-year span.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 06-19-2022, 10:01 PM
HomerMcvie's Avatar
HomerMcvie HomerMcvie is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Indiana/Tennessee
Posts: 14,175
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aleuzzi View Post
Five largely rewarding albums that range from “good” to “great.” All in a four-year span.
Top notch work! Mystery To Me is right up there with Rumours and Tusk.
__________________
I will CRUSH YOU!!!! KAREN BRING ME MY FLIP PHONE!
And I'm David, not Homer!(we all should be able to change our name, at least once)
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 06-20-2022, 12:06 PM
aleuzzi's Avatar
aleuzzi aleuzzi is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 5,229
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HomerMcvie View Post
Top notch work! Mystery To Me is right up there with Rumours and Tusk.
Interesting thing is Fleetwood Mac’s considerable reputation for tasteful, well-executed music began long before their heyday. All of those albums from ‘71-‘74 are album albums, with a high complement of very good music and few duds. Yes, each of the records is “transitional” as it is evident the band is still searching for its center, but even so the results impress, and are at least a cut or two above most bands of that time.

Take a band like the early Doobie Brothers. They had very cool hits, but their individual albums were comparatively weak. They were the ideal band for a greatest hits compilation. Try doing a “Best of” for FM’s wilderness years. It’d be a mess because each of their albums has its own character and distinction.

I’ve heard “inconsistent” when people talk about Bob Welch. I’d say he was open to trying new things, and if there are inconsistencies (and there were) its because he reached beyond safe, easy formulas.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 06-20-2022, 01:00 PM
Macfan4life's Avatar
Macfan4life Macfan4life is offline
Addicted Ledgie
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Somewhere near Key Biscayne, nothing there so I came back
Posts: 4,657
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by HomerMcvie View Post
Top notch work! Mystery To Me is right up there with Rumours and Tusk.
Agreed. Mystery To Me and I would include Heroes are hard to find are fantastic albums. Its fun to think WHAT IF. What if Sentimental Lady was a hit for the band in the early 70s. Would a bigger success made Bob stay? Or no matter what Bob had enough of Chris's side eye and nothing was going to keep him there.
Bob was on American Bandstand in 1982 and Dick Clark asked him about his relationship with the band. Bob said how they were all such good friends and they work on his solo albums, etc. 10 years later it was war. I think both Bob and the band had their darkest days in the mid 90s and money always tears people apart. Even if Bob was wrong and not entitled to one cent, was it worth it to destroy an early legacy with the band?
Sad.
__________________
Christine on Stevie 1984: "10 years ago she really had her feet on the ground but she seems to have developed her own fantasy world, somehow, which I’m not part of. We don’t socialize much."

Last edited by Macfan4life; 06-20-2022 at 01:29 PM..
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


Mick Fleetwood : The Visitor CD picture

Mick Fleetwood : The Visitor CD

$14.86



Mick Fleetwood - Celebrate The Music Of Peter Green And The Early Years of Fleet picture

Mick Fleetwood - Celebrate The Music Of Peter Green And The Early Years of Fleet

$22.41



Mick Fleetwood & Stevie Nicks (2) Photo's #3 picture

Mick Fleetwood & Stevie Nicks (2) Photo's #3

$3.00



Fleetwood Mac vintage photos clippings rare Mick card, McVie, Stevie card cool picture

Fleetwood Mac vintage photos clippings rare Mick card, McVie, Stevie card cool

$17.50



The Mick Fleetwood Story: Two Sticks And A Drum (DVD, 2002) picture

The Mick Fleetwood Story: Two Sticks And A Drum (DVD, 2002)

$7.19




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:33 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
© 1995-2003 Martin and Lisa Adelson, All Rights Reserved