Brett Tuggle Dishes the details to Rolling Stone

[BigAl84]

Originally Posted by John Run

BW is right on the Buckingham McVie interviews. Both Lindsey and Christine stated it was always a duo album. I do think that is a little bit different than openly lying about why someone was terminated from employment after forty years. One did not cause anyone loss of income or emotional trauma, the other did. One was about inclusion, one was about exclusion.

I do believe that was said to allow the Buckingham McVie album to stand on its own merits and to not put Stevie in a position where she would have to answer questions about her lack of participation and protect FM as an on-going concern, thinking the five would be on Tour in less than 12 months.

Just so you know that is partially incorrect. The initial press for quite a while was "we've started making new music and we hope stevie will join us" It wasn't until the album had an announced release date that Lindsey and Christine GRACIOUSLY changed their tune and said it had always been a duo album. They were trying to be kind to Stevie. Why, I dont know.

There was several months of press and interviews that stated it was hopefully, a fleetwood mac album in the works.

[HomerMcvie]

Originally Posted by BigAl84

Just so you know that is partially incorrect. The initial press for quite a while was "we've started making new music and we hope stevie will join us" It wasn't until the album had an announced release date that Lindsey and Christine GRACIOUSLY changed their tune and said it had always been a duo album. They were trying to be kind to Stevie. Why, I dont know.

I suppose everybody(not just Mick) liked the bigger paycheck.

And by keeping her from quitting, they were keeping the Rumours 5 alive. I guess that was important to them. Just not her. $he couldn't do her happy dance with that horrible man in the band.

[Justin Reach]

I wonder if all of Stevie's insecurities all go back to when she first joined Fleetwood Mac. Maybe she still thinks that she's only in Fleetwood Mac because Mick wanted Lindsey in the band and she was only invited in because of Lindsey.

[BigAl84]

As I've always said, the other 4 broke the unspoken rule of Fleetwood Mac that apparently they didn't realize, even though I think it was painfully obvious to fans.

That rule was: you can start all the albums you want and you can court Stevie for her participation all you want. HOWEVER, it is not permitted to continue said project(s) after she bows out. All Fleetwood Mac projects are shelved indefinitely without the blessing of Stevie. Renaming a Fleetwood Mac album as not a Fleetwood Mac album does not count, because it still makes Stevie look bad. Everyone and their mother saw she was the odd one out.

To this day I wonder what would of happened had they chose to re-record Mick and John's part with other musicians so even on paper it couldn't be argued a Fleetwood Mac album sans-stevie.

The rub was always the fact that they had the balls to release a Fleetwood Mac album without her by simplying changing the name. The media, everyone picked up on that and she knew it too. It goes against her entire narrative of there only being one troublemaker in Fleetwood Mac, Lindsey Buckingham. This project painted her out to be the issue.

[elle]

Originally Posted by bwboy

Lindsey said in virtually every interview he gave when BuckVie came out that it wasn't a Fleetwood Mac album and was never meant to be. So why all the talk about Stevie being the one who lied? I mean, it's funny now to re-read those interviews where Lindsey denied it was ever meant to be a FM album, especially the one where he acted confused as to why the interviewer would even think it was ever meant to be a FM album. So really, these interviews should be taken with a grain of salt and enjoyed for what they are- a snapshot of a certain time when people feel or think a certain way. And subject to change.

and every Lindsey fan was saying he is lying. you can go into those threads and check for yourself, how much we hated that he's covering up for Stevie. didn't help him in the end, did it? when Lindsey lies, we call him on that.

when Stevie lies, many of her fans go back to whataboutism and say - but but but - lindsey lied too. just like you did here. without admitting the obvious, that Stevie or Mick were lying.

[BigAl84]

It's not even a case of Lindsey covering for anyone. There were early interviews where he mentioned he was making music with the other 3 and they were hoping Stevie would come around. The initial spin was a hopeful Fleetwood Mac album.

[BigAl84]

One example of many:

OCTOBER 2014
https://ultimateclassicrock.com/lind...fleetwood-mac/

"We never envisioned finishing the album in the short term," he pointed out. "We set it aside. Stevie will come in and participate. I have material I had been working on. There’s no danger that it will slip between the tracks. It’s too profound to."

In the meantime, fans can only wonder what the next Fleetwood Mac record will sound like. But while Buckingham hinted that he took "massive liberties" with McVie's piano-vocal demos, he also seemed to signal that the end result won't be all that dissimilar from the group's classic sound. "It’s a very interesting thing when someone who helped to define the interaction leaves for that amount of time," he mused of McVie's return. "You don’t know how it’s going to play out. But this something that feels really good. It feels really circular."

[jbrownsjr]

Originally Posted by jmn3

This exactly. Is Lindsey was so abusive toward Stevie, why wasn't he fired long before '87? Why did they invite him to the Oakland and LA shows at the end of 1990? Why did Stevie stand on stage for Landslide with him saying she hoped he would find it in his heart to make music with her again some day? Why did he play on Behind the Mask? The box set? Why did Mick work with him in '96? Why did Stevie work with him on Twisted? The Dance? Her career resurged after The Dance. Why did she go back and record Say You Will? Why tour for 18 months? Why do Soundstage with him? Why do Unleashed or the 2013 tour? Why bring him in for Soldier's Angel? Why do the stupid Sara dance thing or the Landslide hug for years?

As for Vanessa Carlton? Sit down lady. Why did you have Lindsey play on one of your songs? Why would you engage with a man like that at all?

ah ah ah, Don't forget Soldier's Angel. When shippers had them getting married because he guested on that song.

[elle]

Originally Posted by jmn3

Because they all lied about BuckVie's original intent to placate Stevie. It's pretty obvious, they all toed the line to keep peace within the band of five. It was a Fleetwood Mac album in every sense of the word, just as much as Behind the Mask or Say You Will are. Does anyone really think that if not for fear of pissing Stevie off and having her officially quit (and thus, retiring their cash cow, touring as the Rumours 5), they would have not wanted to release BuckVie as a Fleetwood Mac album? Buckingham McVie is a completely unknown entity that never released anything before under that name. Say what you want about the songs or how Stevie's lack of involvement hurt the album, a release under the Fleetwood Mac moniker, even in 2017, would sell a hell of a lot more than Buckingham McVie. Of course they wanted it to be a Fleetwood Mac album. As BuckVie, it's a good album that had nice songs on it. But it will fade into obscurity much more than any album that has the Fleetwood Mac brand attached to it. The irony, and to Lindsey, most likely the true punch to the throat, was that he lied and contorted his words to adapt to the BuckVie narrative to placate Stevie - and then not a year later, she engineered his ousting from the band he went against his original wishes to try and keep together.

Face it, Buckingham McVie was the last straw for Stevie. Her ego couldn't handle that they went and did that despite her carrying on about how it was dumb to make new music and release it. In her ever growing bag of ridiculously stupid shoulder chips, this was the last chip in. Musicares just exploded the bag (enough with that metaphor ).

ha - you said it way more eloquent than i did.

and also, we know it was all set in motion before Musicares. Musicares was just used as an excuse. Mike C got the call practically the same day that Lindsey got the call he was out. they just needed to figure out how to rewrite the contracts they all signed. that's what probably took them all those months and ending in the tour delay.

[elle]

Originally Posted by BigAl84

It's not even a case of Lindsey covering for anyone. There were early interviews where he mentioned he was making music with the other 3 and they were hoping Stevie would come around. The initial spin was a hopeful Fleetwood Mac album.

yes, but when BuckVie came out Lindsey and Christine were both toeing that idiotic line about "it was always meant to be a duet album." even though for years before that, and then again in 2018, Lindsey was very clear it was gonna be FM album. as was Mick. in 2017, they were all appeasing Stevie, so that she would still do cashgrab with them in 2018. and then in the fall of 2017, Mick was appeasing Stevie completely separately when she was probably trying to pull out of FM tour. probably Mick and management both. and set it all up in motion to do whatever she wanted by Musicares, so that they can all have their big cashgrab tour.

except Lindsey didn't go down quietly like they hoped for. he sued them and didn't mind telling the world what they did. and now Brett added in a few missing pieces.

[BigAl84]

Originally Posted by elle

yes, but when BuckVie came out Lindsey and Christine were both toeing that idiotic line about "it was always meant to be a duet album." even though for years before that, and then again in 2018, Lindsey was very clear it was gonna be FM album. as was Mick. in 2017, they were all appeasing Stevie, so that she would still do cashgrab with them in 2018. and then in the fall of 2017, Mick was appeasing Stevie completely separately when she was probably trying to pull out of FM tour. probably Mick and management both. and set it all up in motion to do whatever she wanted by Musicares, so that they can all have their big cashgrab tour.

except Lindsey didn't go down quietly like they hoped for. he sued them and didn't mind telling the world what they did. and now Brett added in a few missing pieces.

Oh...yes, exactly. In that case he was clearly changing his tune to keep people happy and then they shat all over him.

It was completely idiotic at that point, I agree. My point was, from day 1 it wasn't "Christine and I are going make a duo album". It evolved and stories changed, exactly how you stated it.

[elle]

Originally Posted by soul_drifter333

The band lied for Stevie and Mick and just to be able to promote the tour that they had already signed off on. I wouldn't be surprised to hear that their management (Irvin Azoff) played a HUGE part in the lies and convincing them it could work without Lindsey and the financial trouble they would be in if they cancelled the tour, but at this point they were in too deep.

yes. management was definitely in on all this early. remember when the news first broke, there was that info about management going to 7 (i think, cant remember the exact number) different promoters to ask which tour would make more money - FM without Stevie or without Lindsey - and 6 out of 7 said without Lindsey. (btw whoever said without Stevie should not be in that business lol). so while Mick is a weasel, this may have been Stevie-management arrangement before he was even asked. but, he and the rest of the band should have said NO.

[BigAl84]

40 years later, more relevant than ever

[jbrownsjr]

$he becomes more and more of a lying piece of garbage as times go on. More and more truth comes out and exposes what $he did. BuckVie was certainly the final straw for the jealous, petty, dishonest, egomaniac.

[John Run]

Sorry Al - I could have been more clear. I only intended to state that once the promotional run started for Buckingham McVie, both Lindsey and Christine consistently stated that it was intended to be a duo album (Lindsey would hint at maybe some early thought was given to it being a Mac project)

As I also wrote, it was all an attempt to let Buckingham McVie be seen as its own project and of course protect Stevie and the brand name.

But this is all a Red Herring to distract away from the crux of the discussion, which is Brett confirmed most all that we have known.

The band's story has evolved since the dissolution of the five occurred. Lindsey's story has remained consistent within that same timeframe.

And despite all that happened during the last 2 and one half years, Lindsey's heart seems very open to being one with Fleetwood Mac again.