Dissention's boy Kerry starts making sense - Page 2

CarneVaca · #16 01-27-2004, 09:11 AM

As I said, although a little more delicately:

Quote:

16) FORGET THE CONFEDERACY: Conversely, those folks driving around with Confederate flags are going to vote for Bush. The old Slave South (Bush's REAL taproot) is not going to come around. But as Norman Solomon and others have pointed out, the Hispanic southwest (Arizona, New Mexico, Colorado) is in reach and need to be worked on. If, by miracle, Florida or Texas can be got, it's with Hispanic, not racist white votes. How about New Mexico's Hispanic Gov. Bill Richardson for VP?

As for capturing Osama come fall, I think we need to put this into perspective. Let's face it, he's had plenty of time to hand the reins over to an heir apparent or a group of them. That's what we get from squandering resources and wasting our time in Iraq. The terrorism problem will not begin to go away with a capture of Osama. Capturing him two years ago when we had the chance would have been far more effective. It would have put the terrorists on notice that you mess with us, we're going to come get you swiftly and effectively.

dissention · #17 01-27-2004, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by gldstwmn
BTW, Nader was on Politically Incorrect the other night and IMO, he's going to run.

I guess he's going to run as an independent because he's starting to look down on the Green party and it's rules for running as a Greenie.

strandinthewind · #18 01-27-2004, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CarneVaca
. . . That's what we get from squandering resources and wasting our time in Iraq. The terrorism problem will not begin to go away with a capture of Osama. Capturing him two years ago when we had the chance would have been far more effective. It would have put the terrorists on notice that you mess with us, we're going to come get you swiftly and effectively.

If I am not mistaken the hunt for OBL and other Al-Q leaders in Afganistan and other places is still going on despite the Iraq stuff. So, while the removal if SH was a bit of a shell game to divert the US public's eye from the failure to get IBL, the hunt does continue even if the press focuses on Iraq.

Albeit I agree we should have gotten him two years ago when we had the chance. But, in all fairness, we did kill or imprison a significant number of the Al-Q in Afganistan and other places. That counts for something

My favorite quote was from Al Sharpton on Bill Maher's HBO show, it seems as if every video service in the Middle East can find OBL, but the US can't

gldstwmn · #19 01-27-2004, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by dissention
I guess he's going to run as an independent because he's starting to look down on the Green party and it's rules for running as a Greenie.

He broke his ties with the Greens.

gldstwmn · #20 01-27-2004, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by strandinthewind
If I am not mistaken the hunt for OBL and other Al-Q leaders in Afganistan and other places is still going on despite the Iraq stuff. So, while the removal if SH was a bit of a shell game to divert the US public's eye from the failure to get IBL, the hunt does continue even if the press focuses on Iraq.

Albeit I agree we should have gotten him two years ago when we had the chance. But, in all fairness, we did kill or imprison a significant number of the Al-Q in Afganistan and other places. That counts for something

My favorite quote was from Al Sharpton on Bill Maher's HBO show, it seems as if every video service in the Middle East can find OBL, but the US can't

If we don't have enough troops in Iraq, who is actually looking for Bin Laden?

strandinthewind · #21 01-27-2004, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gldstwmn
If we don't have enough troops in Iraq, who is actually looking for Bin Laden?

I am no military expert, but I am unsure if troops are the appropriate person to look for OBL now. I mean there is no more all out military campaign in Afganistan now - nor apparently is one necessary - the region has been rid of the Taliban for the most part. So, I think we will get OBL by intelligence, much like we got SH. Someone will leak something, hopefully.

gldstwmn · #22 01-27-2004, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by strandinthewind
I am no military expert, but I am unsure if troops are the appropriate person to look for OBL now. I mean there is no more all out military campaign in Afganistan now - nor apparently is one necessary - the region has been rid of the Taliban for the most part. So, I think we will get OBL by intelligence, much like we got SH. Someone will leak something, hopefully.

I think he's dead.

CarneVaca · #23 01-27-2004, 03:12 PM

Strand, I wouldn't be so sure that Afghanistan is Taliban-free. Kabul, yes, but the rest of the country is in as much disarray as ever. In some places tribal lords have taken over again and women are being forced to wear the ghost uniforms. Afghanistan is a very sad situation.

So we've got the Afghanistan and Iraq messes, but John Kerry is still stuck in Vietnamn.

I see a disconnect there.

dissention · #24 01-27-2004, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by strandinthewind
I am no military expert, but I am unsure if troops are the appropriate person to look for OBL now. I mean there is no more all out military campaign in Afganistan now - nor apparently is one necessary - the region has been rid of the Taliban for the most part. So, I think we will get OBL by intelligence, much like we got SH. Someone will leak something, hopefully.

Based on the intel we had of Iraq and its supposed weapons, one can conclude that capturing OBL with the use of intel would be quite a stretch.

strandinthewind · #25 01-27-2004, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CarneVaca
Strand, I wouldn't be so sure that Afghanistan is Taliban-free. Kabul, yes, but the rest of the country is in as much disarray as ever. In some places tribal lords have taken over again and women are being forced to wear the ghost uniforms. Afghanistan is a very sad situation.

So we've got the Afghanistan and Iraq messes, but John Kerry is still stuck in Vietnamn.

I see a disconnect there.

I agree - but I thought the Taliban was its own entity, distinct from the tribal lords. Didn't we use the tribal lords to overthrow the Taliban? So, I think it is pretty much Taliban free. Time will tell I guess. You know as much as "we" bitch about the lack of accurate info. from Iraq, there is virtually none from Afganistan. Scary as that is.

Interestingly, as you say, some of the the tribal lords are seemingly as oppressive as the Taliban in many ways. As they say "out of the frying pan . . . . " Much less the poppy trade

I guess I can stomach Afganistan because I really think we are trying to help there and we kind of had no choice but to revoce the Taliban who was hiding OBL. I also think we are trying to help in Iraq, but the facts are just so different there. We had the choice in Iraq, we did not IMO in Afganistan.

But, being the eternal optimist, I think in the end (and that probably will not be in my lifetime) , things will be okay.

strandinthewind · #26 01-27-2004, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by dissention
Based on the intel we had of Iraq and its supposed weapons, one can conclude that capturing OBL with the use of intel would be quite a stretch.

I almost put that in my post!!

dissention · #27 01-27-2004, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CarneVaca
So we've got the Afghanistan and Iraq messes, but John Kerry is still stuck in Vietnamn.

I see a disconnect there.

I kind of wish Kerry would stop harping on his Vietnam experiences; it's getting rather old hat. I think by now we all know that he was a Lt. in Vietnam and that he saved lives and so on. One thing I can say, though, is that his Vietnam experiences alone didn't win him votes; it was a combination of things, whereas Clark's status is the only thing he has (or had, depending on how you look at it

) going for himself.

However, I don't think his disconnect can compare to Shrub's. He still continues to claim that not one child in Texas is impoverished.

dissention · #28 01-27-2004, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by strandinthewind
But, being the eternal optimist, I think in the end...

...it will be your downfall.

Dude, you have so much trust in your government and it's motivations that it's scary.

As for thinking we are trying to help the Iraqi's...

I see a disconnect there.

strandinthewind · #29 01-27-2004, 03:25 PM

Speaking of non-sequitor disconnect

WASHINGTON — President Bush on Tuesday vigorously defended his decision to go to war against Iraq despite chief inspector David Kay's conclusion that Saddam Hussein did not have weapons of mass destruction, as the United States had believed.

from http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,109599,00.html

I mean I think everyone agrees with the proposition that it is a good thing SH is no longer in power. I think what people like me want to hear is "there was a meltdown in our intelligence" Sorry Iraq.

strandinthewind · #30 01-27-2004, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by dissention
...it will be your downfall. Dude, you have so much trust in your government and it's motivations that it's scary.

As for thinking we are trying to help the Iraqi's...

I see a disconnect there.

But - the facts support my belief that America is trying to help the Iraqis by removing SH and rebuilding Iraq. I get that American companies are making tons of $$$$, but they or some other country's companies were before all of this. Moreover, are trying to give them freedom or s reasonable depiction of it. So, I conclude that how what we are doing there is not a good thing?

Sadly, many people had to die for it.