Making Rumours by Ken Caillat

[CADreaming]

I don't think going on a television show is "selling out". Marketing strategies have changed a bit and they're just promoting their product. Now, if anyone shows up as a contestant on DWTS then that's a whole other ball of wax...

[iamnotafraid]

Originally Posted by MikeInNV

Whether it's harsh or not, Stevie and Lindsey are on equal footing here. Stevie made no money visiting the set....she went to encourage the kids and, I'm sure, to see how Gwyneth's version of Landslide turned out. When Glee decided to write an episode based on Rumours, Lindsey and Stevie both had to okay it, and both of them cashed in big-time on the royalties and the album's subsequent resurgence (No. 11 or 12 on the following week's Billboard chart as I recall).

Are you guys baiting me into slamming Stevie?

She didn't appear on Glee because they didn't ask
her to. She hung around a studio backstage to
encourage kids, and that's a nice thing to do. But
you can't tell me she didn't want something for it.
Like maybe a guest appearance on the actual show.
And that's what I meant by not knowing whether it
was worse to be on the show (sell out). Or to not
be on (not invited). Almost groveling. Which is worse?

"Cashing in big-time", I'm not so sure about that either.
While I have no idea what the show had to pay to use
their songs, the "resurgence on the Billboard Chart" would
probably a paltry amount to notice in their bank accounts.
It doesn't take much to appear in the Top 20 anymore.

[PenguinHead]

Originally Posted by iamnotafraid

Are you guys baiting me into slamming Stevie?

She didn't appear on Glee because they didn't ask
her to. She hung around a studio backstage to
encourage kids, and that's a nice thing to do. But
you can't tell me she didn't want something for it.
Like maybe a guess appearance on the actual show.
And that's what I meant by not knowing whether it
was worse to be on the show (sell out). Or to not
be on (not invited). Almost groveling. Which is worse?

"Cashing in big-time", I'm not so sure about that either.
While I have no idea what the show had to pay to use
their songs, the "resurgence on the Billboard Chart" would
probably a paltry amount to notice in their bank accounts.
It doesn't take much to appear in the Top 20 anymore.

The tone of those thoughts
seem so cynical and
overwraught.
Why?

[CADreaming]

Originally Posted by iamnotafraid

Are you guys baiting me into slamming Stevie?

She didn't appear on Glee because they didn't ask
her to. She hung around a studio backstage to
encourage kids, and that's a nice thing to do. But
you can't tell me she didn't want something for it.
Like maybe a guess appearance on the actual show.
And that's what I meant by not knowing whether it
was worse to be on the show (sell out). Or to not
be on (not invited). Almost groveling. Which is worse?

They were working on a deal to do the Rumours episode, so I'm sure she was there for a purpose other than watching Gwyneth sing her song (but didn't Gwyneth visit Stevie in the studio when she was doing TISL?), not necessarily an ulterior motive.

"Cashing in big-time", I'm not so sure about that either.
While I have no idea what the show had to pay to use
their songs, the "resurgence on the Billboard Chart" would
probably a paltry amount to notice in their bank accounts.
It doesn't take much to appear in the Top 20 anymore.

Downloads. It's all about the downloads and I think the appearances have garnered a lot. I don't think anyone's kidding themselves into thinking a repeat of '77 is gonna happen for them at this point, but to earn some pocket change? Well, it's better than not being on tv and not getting any downloads this week.

[windbecame]

Originally Posted by mezzoforte

Man, I can't believe anyone missed me! Thanks, you made my day.

And I love "Wide Sargasso Sea" always and forever. I think I'll die if we ever get a live version (Karen, if you're reading this...)

YES Mezzoforte!! i NOTICED you weren't around AND missed you!! Between you and Viv... you BOTH post the things i was going to say!! !!!!! XOXO

[iamnotafraid]

Originally Posted by PenguinHead

The tone of those thoughts
seem so cynical and
overwraught.
Why?

I'd agree, they do seem that way.
I should stick to my jokes.


CAD,
Like I said, I think appearing on these
recent shows make business sense. I
imagine the kids watching the show
would rather have the actor/singers mp3
than the original versions. I don't keep up
with the charts like I used to. So I'm not
sure how their downloads did after the
show.

But hey, Stevie's appearance on Up All Night
was the only thing that made the show watchable.
I'd comment more but I think PenguinHead was
right.

[MikeInNV]

Originally Posted by iamnotafraid

Are you guys baiting me into slamming Stevie?

She didn't appear on Glee because they didn't ask
her to. She hung around a studio backstage to
encourage kids, and that's a nice thing to do. But
you can't tell me she didn't want something for it.
Like maybe a guest appearance on the actual show.
And that's what I meant by not knowing whether it
was worse to be on the show (sell out). Or to not
be on (not invited). Almost groveling. Which is worse?

"Cashing in big-time", I'm not so sure about that either.
While I have no idea what the show had to pay to use
their songs, the "resurgence on the Billboard Chart" would
probably a paltry amount to notice in their bank accounts.
It doesn't take much to appear in the Top 20 anymore.

I'm certainly not baiting you. There's enough Stevie bashing without that. While your scenario about her involvement may very well be true, I do think you are speculating a bit. But given that Lindsey was contacted by the producers and thought it was a great idea and gave his approval and reaped the same benefits as she did, I don't get why she is more of a sell-out just because she went down there. If anything, showing some interest in what they are doing with your music seems a little more admirable than saying "Just send me the check." I'm sure the cast and crew would love to have more visits like that (in fact I think one of the cast members even said something to that effect).

[Nathan]

Originally Posted by iamnotafraid

I'd agree, they do seem that way.
I should stick to my jokes.


CAD,
Like I said, I think appearing on these
recent shows make business sense. I
imagine the kids watching the show
would rather have the actor/singers mp3
than the original versions. I don't keep up
with the charts like I used to. So I'm not
sure how their downloads did after the
show.

But hey, Stevie's appearance on Up All Night
was the only thing that made the show watchable.
I'd comment more but I think PenguinHead was
right.

Stick to speaking your mind please!
It is appreciated!

[louielouie2000]

While I detest Glee, American Idol, televised award shows, Dancing With The Stars, and have never even heard of Up All Night, these venues are how artists market themselves these days. It's not the 1970s anymore- there is no Midnight Special, MTV has absolutely nothing to do with music, and the music periodicals that are left have become irrelevant due to the internet. Being showcased on any of the above shows today is a sign you're a big star, and people still care about you. I may not watch any of these shows (even when the band is showcased on them), but I still think it's pretty fantastic Fleetwood Mac is still generating enough interest to make the latest crazed tv shows.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by CADreaming

None of us have any true idea where they stand with that.

I don't know where they stand now, but a few years ago it was pretty clear from their comments that each of them blamed the other for nothing going forward. Certainly, it's evolved form Stevie saying that Lindsey won't act and him ruefully saying that she has the masters in her closet vault (or her manager does). I think they've come to some sort of understanding since then, but the reason fans initially thought that they were in discord over BN is because they both pointed fingers at the other.

Michele

[bombaysaffires]

You get on popular current shows to seem still relevant. Even if you don't get on an actual episode, your management and publicist know they can get you coverage on all the entertainment news shows and magazines visiting the set and having photos taken with the new generation of stars. It's all about keeping your name in the news. Liz Rosenberg is a master at this and that's why Stevie hired her.

Stevie has always been suuuuuuperr competitive with Lindsey and vice versa, so I'm not surprised when one of them mentions something and suddenly the other one is somehow doing something similar. Neither will ever let the other get a leg up if at all possible. Interesting that after SYW LB went with feistier management (Irving Azoff and co) to even out the power Howard Kaufman has.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by Nico

Really? What makes you think Lindsey would involve himself so happily in a book if Christine didn't want it? Has he ever been much of a kiss-and-tell type anyway? Or has he really been that interested in disclosing private details about the recording process of said album and the various members and their escapades and etc. during said time period?

It's funny. Stevie has spoken often of writing a book and Christine has joked about it and mentioned that her brother knows all of her secrets anyway, so maybe he could help her. Lindsey has never even mentioned writing a book of any kind.

I highly doubt that Christine declined to talk to Ken because Lindsey plans on writing a book.

Michele

[David]

Originally Posted by iamnotafraid

What if this were a different time? Would Lindsey and Stevie be lining up to do an episode of Fantasy Island
and The Love Boat?

It's funny you bring up that era because this discussion got me thinking about the reputation Fleetwood Mac used to have at that time. Probably not a lot of you even know or remember this, but in the mid and late 1970s, despite the overwhelming commercial success of Rumours, the band was widely known as having a great deal of business integrity. It wasn't just a confidence trick played on the press, either. Mac was by far the biggest band in the world that was self-managed (Mick & Seedy Mgmt), and it regularly turned down and successfully avoided the crass marketing ploys that all the other big rock bands like the Eagles and Van Halen and albums like Saturday Night Fever and Grease all trucked in. Music journalists used to ask Mick about the band's self-management and he always was very honest about all five of them wanting to maintain integrity: He didn't want record buyers to open a Fleetwood Mac album and find coupons for products and marketing tie-ins, like the Peter Frampton albums. (There's one little address for a fan club on the lyric insert for Rumours, but it's totally harmless, and there was nothing on Tusk.)

Not to say that Fleetwood Mac never gave an interview to a mass-market magazine, because we know that isn't true. But they didn't accept any offers to go from one dumb TV show to another (you can bet your life that Stevie Nicks was asked to go on Love Boat and Fantasy Island and all that crap), and their concerts were run like old-fashioned rock concerts (beer, pot, and tourbooks), and they didn't put their names on lines of clothing.

That reputation of the band back then was palpable and gave a lot of us fans a pleasurable buzz. The next two albums (Tusk and Live) were quirky and personal and maintained the band's reputation for doing exactly what it wanted to do. It was only with Mirage that Fleetwood Mac began to seem corporate in the bad sense of capitulating to commercial considerations.

[windbecame]

Originally Posted by louielouie2000

While I detest Glee, American Idol, televised award shows, Dancing With The Stars, and have never even heard of Up All Night, these venues are how artists market themselves these days. It's not the 1970s anymore- there is no Midnight Special, MTV has absolutely nothing to do with music, and the music periodicals that are left have become irrelevant due to the internet. Being showcased on any of the above shows today is a sign you're a big star, and people still care about you. I may not watch any of these shows (even when the band is showcased on them), but I still think it's pretty fantastic Fleetwood Mac is still generating enough interest to make the latest crazed tv shows.

LOUIE... i just don't know if i love you more for your post or NOT loving icky ANGEL (like me)...either way ....sometimes i have to remind myself that 3/4 of the ledgies have no clue that MTV actually used to mean MUSIC TELEVSION... or have NO idea that "love boat" or "fantasy island" was a t.v. show....not to even mention the "WONDER TWINS" reference before... these are MANY of the reasons i don't even BOTHER to weigh in....

[CADreaming]

Originally Posted by michelej1

I don't know where they stand now, but a few years ago it was pretty clear from their comments that each of them blamed the other for nothing going forward. Certainly, it's evolved form Stevie saying that Lindsey won't act and him ruefully saying that she has the masters in her closet vault (or her manager does). I think they've come to some sort of understanding since then, but the reason fans initially thought that they were in discord over BN is because they both pointed fingers at the other.

Michele

Oh, I know what they said. I think a lot of that is part of the game though because it keeps us talking...

Originally Posted by bombaysaffires

Stevie has always been suuuuuuperr competitive with Lindsey and vice versa, so I'm not surprised when one of them mentions something and suddenly the other one is somehow doing something similar. Neither will ever let the other get a leg up if at all possible. Interesting that after SYW LB went with feistier management (Irving Azoff and co) to even out the power Howard Kaufman has.

I'm not sure I buy that at this point. When you reach their age some of that changes and doesn't become as important. And, why now? Why would Lindsey's solo career need "feistier" management now than in 1981? And, given the fact that Kaufman and Azoff reformed Front Line and are FM's management then that actually puts them more under the same umbrella, as Michele pointed out earlier.