should FM release the album without SN's songs?

[MikeVielhaber]

Originally Posted by WildHearted

. Lindsey (as a member of Fleetwood Mac) got credit for the production of all of the songs on Rumours, did he not?

The band is listed as co-producer, but not a Lindsey himself. I don't know how accurate that is or if he gets enough credit that way. I'm guessing he had more to do with the production than the others, but maybe other people here know more about that. I know on Tusk they gave him "special thanks."

[Bandon]

Originally Posted by BlueDenimLamp

There was new product either FM or solo out almost every year from 1975 through 1987...Can we go back to that...

And as far as solo goes... Stevie's guest appearances were always nice surprises in between FM and other solo recordings (i.e, Whenever I Call You Friend, Gold, Midnight Wind, the Insider, Needles and Pins, etc.)

[elle]

Originally Posted by The Catdancer

I was thinking about that the other day and why he never got credit for that. Look at Dreams for instance. When she gave it to the band even Christine was like:"What the heck is this? It only has 3 chords". Lindsey worked his magic and it became their only no. 1 in the US but he never got any credit whatsoever.

Originally Posted by shackin'up

Yes, That's what I simply don't understand. Your whole band wants to crawl for you to please you as you wish, and still you can't conquer the possible tension that COULD lead to something electrifying.

Not for sales, not for avoiding pain, not for selfesteem, just for the love of chemistry that you once had with the five of you.

Last time was 86-87 and you were in deep shyt, and not there. Now you all are coming of age and are willing to respect eachothers feelings more than ever. Do it one more time, WHY the friggin' hell NOT?

Originally Posted by MikeVielhaber

The band is listed as co-producer, but not a Lindsey himself. I don't know how accurate that is or if he gets enough credit that way. I'm guessing he had more to do with the production than the others, but maybe other people here know more about that. I know on Tusk they gave him "special thanks."

interesting posts, and i think you all are onto something.

for all we know, and judging by the Tusk doc, Lindsey did much more than just arranging and producing on many of the songs. remember "if we keep your melody on there"? and actually WMYTYTO, TL lyrics project a lot of that frustration. yet he never received or asked for the songwriting credit and unlike with the producing where he gripes about it (and then people slam him when he's asking for producing credit , of course! - isn't he a whiny diva, right? ). he never says what exactly he did on many of Stevie's songs in the past. neither does Stevie, i don't think.

but i think self-esteem that you mentioned in passing Gerald has a lot to do with it. that's the reason Stevie doesn't want to go back to the band and work with Lindsey in particular anymore. he offered he can give her some melodies, remember? she feels she found other people she can work with when she's out of inspiration for chords and melodies (and doesn't mind giving them the credit for work they do, there's no historical baggage and co-dependency there for her). she doesn't want to go back to being dependent on LB. we won't see any SN/LB so-writes but seems very likely we'll see plenty more of SN/DS ones.

[elle]

Originally Posted by Bandon

And as far as solo goes... Stevie's guest appearances were always nice surprises in between FM and other solo recordings (i.e, Whenever I Call You Friend, Gold, Midnight Wind, the Insider, Needles and Pins, etc.)

and she's been doing plenty of solo appearances now, no? she's also doing a solo album.

she's happier solo, even i can see that! so why not let her do what she wants to, why would you want her to go back to recording with Mac that she so obviously doesn't want to do?

why would you want FM to wait till she's done with solo and coax her into finishing their album?

[vivfox]

Originally Posted by elle

why would you want FM to wait till she's done with solo and coax her into finishing their album?

If you were a Fleetwood Mac fan and not just a Lindsey Buckingham fan you would automatically know the answer to this question.

[RockawayBlind]

Originally Posted by CreepingDeath

Laugh all you want, but it is clear now more than ever how much more integral to the band Lindsey was, is and will continue to be than Stevie. She was just a pretty face with a couple of good lines that other people turned into listenable songs. She is still a pretty face...

[vivfox]

Originally Posted by RockawayBlind

Stevie. She was just a pretty face with a couple of good lines that other people turned into listenable songs. She is still a pretty face...

Is there any room in your statement for Stevie having the most distinct voice in rock and roll? Nobody sounds like her. Her songs may have had help in their creations but in the end it is her name on them and most of them are such timeless classics that I have thanked God for a million and one times. Stevie Nicks has enhanced my life and the life of millions.

I will always love Lindsey and Christine too.

Based on your screen name it is obvious you are an LB fan but I find it sad that you find the need to cut down Stevie while trying to place Lindsey on a pedestal.

[elle]

Originally Posted by vivfox

Is there any room in your statement for Stevie having the most distinct voice in rock and roll? Nobody sounds like her. Her songs may have had help in their creations but in the end it is her name on them and most of them are such timeless classics that I have thanked God for a million and one times. Stevie Nicks has enhanced my life and the life of millions.

it is, isn't it?

regardless of whether or not she deserves the sole credit for them, as was discussed in several threads for the last few days.

but yes i was thinking the same though - pretty front and sexy voice, not just pretty front.

[elle]

Originally Posted by vivfox

If you were a Fleetwood Mac fan and not just a Lindsey Buckingham fan you would automatically know the answer to this question.

enlighten me, please!

[WildHearted]

Originally Posted by elle

enlighten me, please!

I don't think it's much of a mystery. Some people prefer FM as a group over any of their solo endeavors. Naturally those people would be most interested in hearing a full Mac album, above a new solo album or a partial FM effort.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by MikeVielhaber

The band is listed as co-producer, but not a Lindsey himself. I don't know how accurate that is or if he gets enough credit that way. I'm guessing he had more to do with the production than the others, but maybe other people here know more about that. I know on Tusk they gave him "special thanks."

Yes, he has said that in retrospect he would be listed as a producer on that.

Michele

[WildHearted]

Originally Posted by elle

interesting posts, and i think you all are onto something.

for all we know, and judging by the Tusk doc, Lindsey did much more than just arranging and producing on many of the songs. remember "if we keep your melody on there"? and actually WMYTYTO, TL lyrics project a lot of that frustration. yet he never received or asked for the songwriting credit and unlike with the producing where he gripes about it (and then people slam him when he's asking for producing credit , of course! - isn't he a whiny diva, right? ). he never says what exactly he did on many of Stevie's songs in the past. neither does Stevie, i don't think.

Actually, they've both talked about it quite a bit. Stevie would write lyrics and a melody and a chord progression and record a demo of it accompanying herself either on piano or before she taught herself piano, guitar. Then she'd hand it over to Lindsey and he would figure out what parts to add to it, possibly some structural things, basically flesh it out instrumentally, or even suggest a tweak hear and there etc. But fleshing something out structurally/instrumentally is not the same thing as writing a song. It's arranging. I could take a song of Stevie's and completely change everything but the lyrics and melody and that doesn't mean I now can claim to have written my version of her song. I just made a new arrangement of it.

[MikeVielhaber]

Originally Posted by WildHearted

I don't think it's much of a mystery. Some people prefer FM as a group over any of their solo endeavors. Naturally those people would be most interested in hearing a full Mac album, above a new solo album or a partial FM effort.

Well what one would prefer is one thing. Ideally most of us would prefer an album with all 5. But as a fan of the band above solo careers, many of us would would be fine not waiting on Stevie because who knows when that'll be. They've been waiting on her for years. An album of Lindsey and Christine songs would be very enjoyable and I'd rather have that album soon then to wait on a hypothetical album with Stevie that may be a long time coming or may not happen.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by WildHearted

I don't think it's much of a mystery. Some people prefer FM as a group over any of their solo endeavors. Naturally those people would be most interested in hearing a full Mac album, above a new solo album or a partial FM effort.

I prefer FM as a group, but I'd prefer an album with the four of them rather than have them wait for Stevie, when she doesn't want to be there. I don't see anything good coming out of that collaboration. Just a lot of bitterness and blame. And it's because I like the group better than any of the solo artists that Stevie's loss just doesn't seem that insurmountable to me. It would when they were selling records, but not any more. Two songwriters is not the best option, but I'm happy with 2nd best.

It's like after The Dance. They said that a lot of reason for the delay is that they were waiting for Christine to change her mind. I missed Christine and wanted her back and I've been hoping (and actually predicting) that she would change her mind all along. But I didn't want the other 4 to do nothing in all of that time. I think waiting until 2003 for her to change her mind was too long. Of course, I also think not letting her just record and not tour was the wrong choice and that could have ended the gridlock, if they'd just not insisted on her touring.

But today, it seems like we have the reverse situation where Stevie wants to tour and not record and I say that's fine. Really, if she was happy it would be different. But she hasn't seemed particularly happy with FM to me since the tour ended. She didn't want to do the EP really. I was sure having Christine back would change her mind about being in the studio. I was wrong. It seems like her involvement in recording would be under duress and I think that is just going to turn out badly, from the inception. It's like John said of Christine back then, if she was going to be there, but sad like she was during The Dance, then it was good she was gone.

Same thing, if Stevie is going to record, but only grudgingly, then she should not be in the studio with them, but the result is going to be bad.

Michele

[WildHearted]

Originally Posted by michelej1

I prefer FM as a group, but I'd prefer an album with the four of them rather than have them wait for Stevie, when she doesn't want to be there. I don't see anything good coming out of that collaboration. Just a lot of bitterness and blame. And it's because I like the group better than any of the solo artists that Stevie's loss just doesn't seem that insurmountable to me. It would when they were selling records, but not any more. Two songwriters is not the best option, but I'm happy with 2nd best.

It's like after The Dance. They said that a lot of reason for the delay is that they were waiting for Christine to change her mind. I missed Christine and wanted her back and I've been hoping (and actually predicting) that she would change her mind all along. But I didn't want the other 4 to do nothing in all of that time. I think waiting until 2003 for her to change her mind was too long. Of course, I also think not letting her just record and not tour was the wrong choice and that could have ended the gridlock, if they'd just not insisted on her touring.

But today, it seems like we have the reverse situation where Stevie wants to tour and not record and I say that's fine. Really, if she was happy it would be different. But she hasn't seemed particularly happy with FM to me since the tour ended. She didn't want to do the EP really. I was sure having Christine back would change her mind about being in the studio. I was wrong. It seems like her involvement in recording would be under duress and I think that is just going to turn out badly, from the inception. It's like John said of Christine back then, if she was going to be there, but sad like she was during The Dance, then it was good she was gone.

Same thing, if Stevie is going to record, but only grudgingly, then she should not be in the studio with them, but the result is going to be bad.

Michele

Well, I personally agree with you. I just want new music period. But I can certainly understand where others might want all 5 or nothing. If Stevie is in fact wanting to record with them and it's just a timing issue, then I'd want them to wait so long as it wasn't going to take 5 years or something. Otherwise I'm down for a Chris/Lindsey penned FM record.