i have a question about tusk........

[tyshiria]

i know you're all die hard lindsey fans......so i would just like to know if any of you know y tusk didn't do well? i know the tour did and well, cause this is FLEETWOOD MAC we're talking about. but y didn't that album do well? i just can't find anyone who can tell me. so i figured, come to the lindsey board and ask the lindsfans y tusk didn't do well! i mean, you are his fans and you would know y tusk didn't do well. right? i don't have any documentaries about tusk, just the quick photoshoot (funny stuff too!) but no one has ever told me y tusk didn't do well. so, do any of you know y tusk didn't do well? i've heard it's great, i've heard it sucks. i've also heard it was lindsey's album and that's y it sucks but that's only what i've heard. so.............y didn't tusk do well?

mimi

[BellaDonnaGypsy]

I would think it was basically because the general public wanted a Rumours clone, and they didn't get one.

Laura.

[tyshiria]

they wanted rumours and they got lindsey instead. ok, but y wouldn't that do well?

mimi

[chiliD]

"Didn't do well" is relative.

Rumours sold what? 20 million or something, right? How is ANYONE supposed to follow that? ANYTHING they would've released wouldn't have come close, so as Lindsey said, "why try?". "Tusk" sold a decent 4 million copies...of a DOUBLE ALBUM. Just because it didn't come close to Rumours numbers doesn't make it a "failure". Granted it cost a million dollars to make the album, it DID make a profit for both the band AND the record company so I don't understand this perception that "Tusk" "tanked".

BUT, one thing that DID hurt sales wasn't the music itself, but that the night before it was released to the public, Westwood One radio played the ENTIRE ALBUM IN ORDER WITH NO COMMERCIAL BREAKS (per side) People just taped it, they didn't have to BUY it. That lack of judgement probably cost a couple of million units in sales...people copying their tapes for friends, etc.

Just from seeing some of the polls and reading the posts here on the Ledge(s) over the years, most folks say that "Tusk" is their favorite Fleetwood Mac album. MICK & LINDSEY both say "Tusk" was their favorite album of theirs. (Of course, LINDSEY would say that! )

[CarneVaca]

Originally posted by tyshiria
...so i would just like to know if any of you know y tusk didn't do well? ... but y didn't that album do well? ... so i figured, come to the lindsey board and ask the lindsfans y tusk didn't do well! i mean, you are his fans and you would know y tusk didn't do well. right? ... but no one has ever told me y tusk didn't do well. so, do any of you know y tusk didn't do well? ... so.............y didn't tusk do well?

mimi

So, what was that question again?

Chili, is 4 million copies still a current figure? I seem to recall reading somewhere that it was about 6 million.

[Barbara]

Originally posted by CarneVaca


So, what was that question again?

In case you didn't get it the first six times . . .

Barbara

Another factor was the cost - as a double album, Tusk was expensive at a time when the economy was going into decline and record sales were already suffering.

[jeffles]

Supposedly, when Tusk came out, the record company put a $13 price tag on it (i think it was $13), whatever the number was, it was the highest price for a record at that time. That was one part.
Another, as ChiliD mentioned, was the radio station playing the entire album, in sequence, without commercials just before the release.
The most important factor was the music. To all of us, as well as many other music listeners, it was great. But to the masses, it just didn't appeal. The album was simply to challenging to most people who listened to mainstream radio (as Rumours was). The single "Tusk" was the wrong choice for first single, which should have been "Sara". To me, "Sara" is the quintessential Fleetwood Mac song. They probably had "Tusk" as the first single to give the public a taste of what the majority of the album was going to be like. It was almost as if the band, especially LB, INTENDED to be different.
Tusk, in all its supposed failures, still has moved 4 million units. Not bad for a double album...
By the way, the Tusk tour was a financial disaster, Mick managed it himself and incurred such tremendous overhead (coke and alcohol included), that there was almost no profit. Thus, the band canned him as manager.

[CarneVaca]

Jeffles, I have to agree that the choice of first single was misguided. Come to think of it, there is not one Lindsey song in Tusk that would have made a proper single, considering the times. "Sara" would have been my choice too. It is a great, lush song with a wonderful arrangement. I shudder to think of what it would have become in the hands of a different producer.

On the other hand, releasing "Tusk" as a single, though not commercially wise, did show some integrity. It was pretty representative of the innovative nature of the record. I remember buying the Blind Melon album with the song "No Rain" some nine years ago only to learn that nothing else in the album sounded like that song. And that, as Mick would say, was "majorly disappointing."

[David]

Originally posted by CarneVaca
So, what was that question again?

I think tyshiria is enjoying her time here on the Lindsey ledge playing devil's advocate. Very subtle tweaking going on, & no one seems to have picked up on it.

Releasing "Tusk" as the first single was a great ballsy move, & it paid off. The single got widespread airplay, did well on the singles charts, gained a certain notoriety thanks to its marching band theme (even my parents knew the song) & was a critical eye-opener (the Rolling Stone critics voted "Tusk" the best single of 1979 in the magazine's year-end issue). The weirdness of "Tusk" paved the way for the off-kilter qualities of "Sara." I think the public was ready for a little weirdness, just not a lot. Oddly enough, the more conventional sounding "Think About Me" & "Sisters of the Moon" didn't get anywhere near the airplay that "Tusk" & "Sara" got. What does that tell us? Maybe nothing.

Initial public interest in "Tusk" was very high (as it was with "Trouble in Shangri-La") but waned by the beginning of 1980. Radio, after an initial enthusiasm, reverted to the older hits from "Fleetwood Mac" & "Rumours."

Jeffles, you're right about the tour not making a profit -- but that apparently was due to mismanagement & extravagance. The tour itself was a critical & financial success (Billboard magazine rated it as the top moneymaking tour for arena-sized venues for the year in the 1980 year-end issue). But the band members themselves just didn't take home a lot of money with them from it because of the high overhead. When you say the tour was a financial disaster, it makes people think that ticket sales were low & public interest was minimal, which is certainly not the case with that tour.

[tyshiria]

Originally posted by David

I think tyshiria is enjoying her time here on the Lindsey ledge playing devil's advocate. Very subtle tweaking going on, & no one seems to have picked up on it.

no david not at all, i was just repeating myself, because for some reason, i NEED to make myself extra clear on these boards. and instead of having to reply to numerous posts saying the same damn thing over and over again, i did it all in ONE shot! so that's y i did it like that. just making myself clear. now, i get the feeling that i i should do a copy and paste on this post, but i'll let it go until i hear anything further. hopefully i won't NEED to.

mimi

[Les]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by David
Very subtle tweaking going on, & no one seems to have picked up on it.

Hehe...oh, it's not so terribly subtle.

[tyshiria]

and he was telling me that tusk didn't sell cause the album was too lindsey. his words, not mine. again, his words, not mine. ONE MORE TIME, his words, not mine. he also said that the reason y lindsey's albums don't sell is because he's too weird with them. they're all about him, and death and suffering and no one wants to hear that sh*t. his words, not mine. again, his words, not mine. ONE MORE TIME, his words, not mine. i personally haven't heard one single lindsey album. one reason, i can't find one single lindsey album. i was supposed to get the bootlegs of his albums from someone, but since that person won't even talk to me i can't! (and to that person, "hi i miss talking to you. please talk to me. you were like my best friend! i'll always love you!") anyhoo, back to the linds......the other reason is i'm not paying shipping and handling for it so i'm not gonna order it online. but anyhoo, he has told me that he got his first album cause he did like lindsey, but when he heard the first one, he threw it away. i couldn't believe that cause i've heard raves about it from you all, but i have heard garbage about it from others! and let me tell u, it's real GARBAGE! they were hating on linds like those ppl on the ledge that bash stevie!

oh well i'm just like totally shocked about all this. i couldn't believe that frank, that's the guy here at work, said that about linds, but hey, it's not like i've never heard it before.

ok bye,

mimi

[jeffles]

Ahh, I stand corrected. Yes, the tour brought in much revenue and was a huge success. But, b/c of Mick's (mis)management, it wasn't profitable.
The reality is that if Tusk didn't come right AFTER Rumours, it would've sold a few hundred thousand copies or so, but following the biggest album of all time, it sold plenty more. People were so anxious to hear new FM music, that they coulda released they're own version of Mary had a Little Lamb and it would have been a hit. So the notion that "Tusk" (the single) was a hit simply because its such a great song it misguided. I do happen to like the song a lot, though LB's live version during his solo tour was better. Somehow, his 8 or 9 piece band generated more power than that huge USC Marching Band.
As far as Rolling Stone, that magazine shouldn't be taken all that seriously for its rock journalism. They gave little attention the LB, who was responsible for Tusk more than anyone, when the decided to put Mick and Stevie on the cover in early '80.

[Les]

i couldn't believe that cause i've heard raves about it from you all, but i have heard garbage about it from others! and let me tell u, it's real GARBAGE! they were hating on linds like those ppl on the ledge that bash stevie!

Ah, and there we get to the heart of matter.

We all know the discussions of the last few days crossed a lot of lines and pissed off a lot of people. All of the fans of one artist are not defined by the behavior of an individual.

We can continue in an openly aggressive or passively aggressive Stevie vs. Lindsey manner for the next few days, like we have for the last few days...or we can decide not to.

As for the albums... I'm sure you know that Lindsey fans like them and talk about them all the time. There are a lot of people out there who aren't Lindsey fans and there are certainly some fans out there who even actively hate Lindsey for whatever reasons. The only way you'll really know if his material or Tusk is bad - "too weird," full of "death" and "suffering" and "sh*t" and "garbage" - is for you to listen to them and decide for yourself. They may or may not be your cup of tea.

[tyshiria]

Originally posted by Les
i couldn't believe that cause i've heard raves about it from you all, but i have heard garbage about it from others! and let me tell u, it's real GARBAGE! they were hating on linds like those ppl on the ledge that bash stevie!

Ah, and there we get to the heart of matter.

We all know the discussions of the last few days crossed a lot of lines and pissed off a lot of people. All of the fans of one artist are not defined by the behavior of an individual.

We can continue in an openly aggressive or passively aggressive Stevie vs. Lindsey manner for the next few days, like we have for the last few days...or we can decide not to.

As for the albums... I'm sure you know that Lindsey fans like them and talk about them all the time. There are a lot of people out there who aren't Lindsey fans and there are certainly some fans out there who even actively hate Lindsey for whatever reasons. The only way you'll really know if his material or Tusk is bad - "too weird," full of "death" and "suffering" and "sh*t" and "garbage" - is for you to listen to them and decide for yourself. They may or may not be your cup of tea.

i totally come in peace. as you can see, i have not taken any part of those "i hate stevie nicks, i hate lindsey buchinhem" discussions. i've been a total good girl i started this thread to ask y tusk didn't do well, that's all. i didn't mean to bother anyone or piss anyone off here. i like lindsey like the next......well i like lindsey too here so, sorry about that.

mimi