Fleetwood Mac: Going long with Lindsey Buckingham

[bombaysaffires]

Originally Posted by elle

talk to people who have been to Mick's m&gs. he gets asked that question straight up every time, apparently.

his answer, the last time 2 days ago in Austin, was that Stevie is not on board and apparently he didn't give an impression she will ever even be. they are looking at their options (i.e., as LB says in this interview "we will sit down and try to formulate some kind of a plan"). somebody who was there can correct me since i was not, this is just what i've heard from several people.

in interviews, it makes sense that they are more diplomatic and leave the door open for it to truly be "a beautiful last act" instead of just further continuation of not all band members wanting the same thing at the same and it being "a little more disparate now than it was back in the day, because everyone sort of wended through their particular journey".

this new LB interview is actually pretty clear if you read just a tiny bit between the lines.

yup.

Makes me wonder how things are going on the tour then.. I mean, if she's so clearly not going to get involved, and the others really want an album… there's got to be some sense of resentment or irritation at the very least. Maybe it just blends in with the normal level of friction between certain of them so it's no different than usual.

I wonder if there have been discussions between the other members about whether they can or should put an album out as "Fleetwood Mac" without Stevie. We don't know what their business partnership agreement is… if it requires all current members to support a decision then we're screwed. Did Lindsey and Chris have to relinquish some of that kind of control when they left and did they get full status back when they returned or….? I know people will say "of course they did!!" but they're big business with lots of managers and lawyers to handle the dirty fights and there's no guarantee of anything.

If they do put out an album w/out Stevie and call it FM you know she will talk to the press with a vengeance about how the band refused to wait for her, and after all she's sacrificed to support the band and gave up solo tours and always put the band first and on and on and on. Whether she is exaggerating or not, it sure makes for great headlines and scandal for the press to gobble up, and gobble they will. Then THAT'S the legacy you're left with. I'm sure that's not the legacy they want to leave behind.. certainly not LB. The drama will win out over the music yet again, his big annoyance.

And Stevie knows this. She knows she's got the upper hand. And the recent "no one has the balls to tell me what to do" makes that super clear. She knows she can make them wait, and she will. And they will wait.

[jbrownsjr]

Originally Posted by bombaysaffires

yup.

Makes me wonder how things are going on the tour then.. I mean, if she's so clearly not going to get involved, and the others really want an album… there's got to be some sense of resentment or irritation at the very least. Maybe it just blends in with the normal level of friction between certain of them so it's no different than usual.

I wonder if there have been discussions between the other members about whether they can or should put an album out as "Fleetwood Mac" without Stevie. We don't know what their business partnership agreement is… if it requires all current members to support a decision then we're screwed. Did Lindsey and Chris have to relinquish some of that kind of control when they left and did they get full status back when they returned or….? I know people will say "of course they did!!" but they're big business with lots of managers and lawyers to handle the dirty fights and there's no guarantee of anything.

If they do put out an album w/out Stevie and call it FM you know she will talk to the press with a vengeance about how the band refused to wait for her, and after all she's sacrificed to support the band and gave up solo tours and always put the band first and on and on and on. Whether she is exaggerating or not, it sure makes for great headlines and scandal for the press to gobble up, and gobble they will. Then THAT'S the legacy you're left with. I'm sure that's not the legacy they want to leave behind.. certainly not LB. The drama will win out over the music yet again, his big annoyance.

And Stevie knows this. She knows she's got the upper hand. And the recent "no one has the balls to tell me what to do" makes that super clear. She knows she can make them wait, and she will. And they will wait.

It's not that they don't have balls, it's more along the lines that everyone is grown up and nobody is going to force you.

[FuzzyPlum]

Originally Posted by bombaysaffires

Makes me wonder how things are going on the tour then.. I mean, if she's so clearly not going to get involved, and the others really want an album… there's got to be some sense of resentment or irritation at the very least. Maybe it just blends in with the normal level of friction between certain of them so it's no different than usual.

It sounds like they barely speak on tour now anyway. I'd imagine MJCL are often in discussion about the future, but I reckon Stevie pretty much keeps to herself.

Originally Posted by bombaysaffires

I wonder if there have been discussions between the other members about whether they can or should put an album out as "Fleetwood Mac" without Stevie. We don't know what their business partnership agreement is… if it requires all current members to support a decision then we're screwed.

I cant imagine there's any clause that would stop them putting out an album without her. She's free to contribute if she wishes but if she was holding them back then that would be some sort of restriction of trade. Record albums is what bands do together!

Originally Posted by bombaysaffires

If they do put out an album w/out Stevie and call it FM you know she will talk to the press with a vengeance about how the band refused to wait for her, and after all she's sacrificed to support the band and gave up solo tours and always put the band first and on and on and on.

I wouldn't be so sure. I can envisage a scenario where she'd welcome a clean break at the end of this tour. Despite what she's said in the past I have a feeling she'd be happy to put FM behind her once and for all in order to focus on what really makes her happy. If she did then I think she'd genuinely wish the rest of them luck as a 4 (depends on what is said over the next few months though).

[lbfan]

They can just request Stevie provide backup vocals and call it an FM album. The general public won't know whether Stevie actually provided any new songs. As much as an egomaniac/controlling person that Lindsey is perceived to be, he has a track record of contributing some of his best songs, when asked, to the band. Stevie seems to view her songs as her "children" with the associated drama of "Sophie's Choice."

[SteveMacD]

Originally Posted by lbfan

They can just request Stevie provide backup vocals and call it an FM album. The general public won't know whether Stevie actually provided any new songs. As much as an egomaniac/controlling person that Lindsey is perceived to be, he has a track record of contributing some of his best songs, when asked, to the band. Stevie seems to view her songs as her "children" with the associated drama of "Sophie's Choice."

Or Mommy Dearest with the last few she's been on.

[jbrownsjr]

Originally Posted by SteveMacD

Or Mommy Dearest with the last few she's been on.

More like, All About EVE (ie). lol!!!!

[louielouie2000]

Originally Posted by elle

talk to people who have been to Mick's m&gs. he gets asked that question straight up every time, apparently.

his answer, the last time 2 days ago in Austin, was that Stevie is not on board and apparently he didn't give an impression she will ever even be. they are looking at their options (i.e., as LB says in this interview "we will sit down and try to formulate some kind of a plan"). somebody who was there can correct me since i was not, this is just what i've heard from several people.

I don't know- this all smacks of Mick's flair for drama. We all know how he told the world several years back that Stevie was preventing the band from ever touring again! And they've been touring the world nonstop ever since.

Stevie has gotten everything she has demanded for this new Mac album- Christine's return, her request for an outside producer seems to not be an issue, and it seems like Lindsey has ceased using FM as a playground for sound experimentation.

What I think is going on here is classic Stevie Nicks. She only ever promotes one project at a time. Right now she's promoting this giant FM tour. She doesn't promote future projects; she never has. When the time comes she'll be on board with this last FM album. If for no other reason, than to close the book once & for all.

[MikeVielhaber]

Originally Posted by louielouie2000

I don't know- this all smacks of Mick's flair for drama. We all know how he told the world several years back that Stevie was preventing the band from ever touring again! And they've been touring the world nonstop ever since.

Stevie has gotten everything she has demanded for this new Mac album- Christine's return, her request for an outside producer seems to not be an issue, and it seems like Lindsey has ceased using FM as a playground for sound experimentation.

What I think is going on here is classic Stevie Nicks. She only ever promotes one project at a time. Right now she's promoting this giant FM tour. She doesn't promote future projects; she never has. When the time comes she'll be on board with this last FM album. If for no other reason, than to close the book once & for all.

In the destiny rules film they show her on stage in a solo show saying Fleetwood Mac is in the studio recording a new album. Classic.

Agreeing to do an album is not promoting it. Just like in the above example, she agreed to do an album long before she announced it to her fans at a concert. The band is saying she's not on board.

[michelej1]

Originally Posted by MikeVielhaber

In the destiny rules film they show her on stage in a solo show saying Fleetwood Mac is in the studio recording a new album. Classic.

Agreeing to do an album is not promoting it.

Right. She was talking about the upcoming Mac album and the boys in the studio without her, while she was still touring and promoting TISL.

Michele

[louielouie2000]

Originally Posted by MikeVielhaber

In the destiny rules film they show her on stage in a solo show saying Fleetwood Mac is in the studio recording a new album. Classic.

Agreeing to do an album is not promoting it. Just like in the above example, she agreed to do an album long before she announced it to her fans at a concert. The band is saying she's not on board.

I actually thought of that as I was writing my post. IIRC, that footage was taken from her Arizona Heart Institute benefit show- a show that was a full 2 months after the TISL tour had wrapped. Not only that, the AHI shows were always a different animal from her solo tours- she had different setlists and artists joining her onstage. So for all intents and purposes, TISL promotion was complete when Stevie announced the new FM album. She was ready to shift into FM mode at that point.

I have a feeling we will hear from Stevie regarding this new FM album around the time the current Mac tour ends. In her mind, she's still selling the current tour, and doesn't want to leapfrog that by talking about future endeavors. Especially when it's very likely the specifics and legalities of a new FM album have not been hammered out yet. And she probably doesn't want to get into all that until she gets closer to the end of this tour, and knows how she feels about the whole thing. There is still undoubtedly a lot of wrangling that will go on regarding Stevie's involvement. Her cut of royalties, the number of songs she is expected to contribute, her cut of future tours, which record labels will be pursued, Stevie's choice of producer(s) and how they will be paid, the length of time Stevie will commit to the project; I could go on and on.

[MikeVielhaber]

Originally Posted by louielouie2000

I actually thought of that as I was writing my post. IIRC, that footage was taken from her Arizona Heart Institute benefit show- a show that was a full 2 months after the TISL tour had wrapped. Not only that, the AHI shows were always a different animal from her solo tours- she had different setlists and artists joining her onstage. So for all intents and purposes, TISL promotion was complete when Stevie announced the new FM album. She was ready to shift into FM mode at that point.

I have a feeling we will hear from Stevie regarding this new FM album around the time the current Mac tour ends. In her mind, she's still selling the current tour, and doesn't want to leapfrog that by talking about future endeavors. Especially when it's very likely the specifics and legalities of a new FM album have not been hammered out yet. And she probably doesn't want to get into all that until she gets closer to the end of this tour, and knows how she feels about the whole thing. There is still undoubtedly a lot of wrangling that will go on regarding Stevie's involvement. Her cut of royalties, the number of songs she is expected to contribute, her cut of future tours, which record labels will be pursued, Stevie's choice of producer(s) and how they will be paid, the length of time Stevie will commit to the project; I could go on and on.

As I said before, she had to have agreed to a Fleetwood Mac album long before she announced it to a concert audience. It didn't just happen the night before. In fact they worked on her music while she was out on tour. She was definitely committed to multiple things at the same time.

I don't think you're saying anything here that others aren't except you're more certain than some that it'll all happen. I think definitely she's not signed on because she has hang ups that need to be ironed out. She's already said she'll see how she feels when the tour is over but I don't think it's because she'll only focus on one thing at a time. That seems to be something you've made up. In fact, during this very tour she did promotion for her solo album. Rather, having committed to Fleetwood Mac for nearly 3 years at the expense of her solo career she doesn't know if she wants to commit to more. But I think that's one of the points here. She's the only one who has such hang ups. Everyone else is 100% committed to the band and to this reunion that it fulfills all the possibilities it can. I doubt they've all signed any contract related to new music. They're just creating.

[Neal]

Originally Posted by elle

“Mirage,” which had some beautiful songs on it,

Can someone kindly remind him that most of those beautiful songs are deteriorating, and in dire need of remastering??

[PenguinHead]

Originally Posted by bombaysaffires

y

I wonder if there have been discussions between the other members about whether they can or should put an album out as "Fleetwood Mac" without Stevie. did!!" but they're big business with lots of managers and lawyers to handle the dirty fights and there's no guarantee of anything.
If they do put out an album w/out Stevie and call it FM you know she will talk to the press with a vengeance about how the band refused to wait for her, and after all she's sacrificed to support the band and gave up solo tours and always put the band first and on and on and on. Whether she is exaggerating or not, it sure makes for great headlines and scandal for the press to gobble up, and gobble they will. Then THAT'S the legacy you're left with. I'm sure that's not the legacy they want to leave behind.. certainly not LB. The drama will win out over the music yet again, his big annoyance.

And Stevie knows this. She knows she's got the upper hand. And the recent "no one has the balls to tell me what to do" makes that super clear. She knows she can make them wait, and she will. And they will wait.

If Stevie decides to opt out, why would she hold any resentment and anger? That's her decision. Of course they can put out a Fleetwood Mac album without Stevie. It's Mick's and John's brand name. Stevie holds no rights to it.

As history shows, they never let the loss of a pivotal member stop them from moving forward. (For example: Peter Green and Bob Welch). And as far as the focus/worry goes on how the sales of a Fleetwood Mac album sans Stevie will do will do on the charts? It just doesn't matter as much the quality of the music.

There's no desperate need for them to appeal to popular culture. They are far beyond that in terms of their longevity and established status. Their swan song album is not going to have any impact on their legacy. They have always maintained a high standard and integrity regardless of their configuration. How it this album is received is only a matter of personal expectations.

Stevie should consider the implications. If she is not on the album, will a 'Where is Stevie?" narrative dominate the press? Will the album be over shadowed by her absence? Will public opinion turn on her? She might come off as being selfish and disrespectful for bailing on the band and fans just before the finish line. (Hey,that sounds like a good title for the last album: THE FINISH LINE.)

[pauls90]

Originally Posted by PenguinHead

Stevie should consider the implications. If she is not on the album, will a 'Where is Stevie?" narrative dominate the press? Will the album be over shadowed by her absence? Will public opinion turn on her? She might come off as being selfish and disrespectful for bailing on the band and fans just before the finish line. (Hey,that sounds like a good title for the last album: THE FINISH LINE.)

This is what I worry about. I've said a few times that I don't want her to do anything she doesn't want to do...but there WILL be consequences of some kind. It's not going to just fly under the radar that Fleetwood Mac is making an album without her.

(By the way..I still love "Red Sun" as an album title)

[elle]

Originally Posted by PenguinHead

There's no desperate need for them to appeal to popular culture. They are far beyond that in terms of their longevity and established status. Their swan song album is not going to have any impact on their legacy. They have always maintained a high standard and integrity regardless of their configuration. How it this album is received is only a matter of personal expectations.

this, exactly!

they are only recording to fulfill their creative needs as a band, as still prolific artists. who all is or is not on their new album and whether or not it sells will have no impact on long ago established FM status and legacy.


just look at the other legendary bands and their various recording and touring configurations. look at Beach Boys, or Guns n' Roses. do most people even know which configuration is touring nowadays and who is recording under the band name? it doesn't matter. their legacy and name was established long time ago.