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  #46  
Old 12-20-2019, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Macfan4life View Post
Journey's worst song played backwards is still better than anything on Rock A Little

Hehhehehhe.... poor Stevie ... she just can’t make good records.

Stevie in theory is better than Stevie in practice. Dare we say it?
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  #47  
Old 12-20-2019, 09:08 PM
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Hehhehehhe.... poor Stevie ... she just can’t make good records.

Stevie in theory is better than Stevie in practice. Dare we say it?
Well, at least since “The Wild Heart.”

However, she still sells a lot of tickets and is somehow the only woman in the HoF twice (weirdly before Tina Turner or Grace Slick), hence her power within the band.

Ken might have said it best:

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Smashing Interviews Magazine: What is your relationship with the rest of Fleetwood Mac?

Ken Caillat: Well, I have a relationship with Mick. The band was not really high tech, so they don’t keep their same phone numbers and emails, and I don’t have any way of connecting with Stevie. Stevie’s got a big entourage of people that are paid to protect her from strangers, and I would be considered a stranger in their eyes. The last time I talked to Christine, we were good. I produced a record for her in 2005. But I talk to John. I talk to Mick. I wish John a happy birthday every year, so I think I’m fine with everybody.

I’d probably be fine with Lindsey if I ever saw him. But he’s just got so much hatred now with the band for firing him when he’s the one that brought it on himself. He again demanded that they would delay their world tour for a year or a year and a half while he finished his solo record, and his solo records never sell anything. He gave them the ultimatum that he would quit, so the band talked and said, “You know what? Why don’t we just fire you? You’ve pulled that trick one too many times. We don’t care.”

Smashing Interviews Magazine: And along came Neil Finn.

Ken Caillat: Right, and he was the solution.

Smashing Interviews Magazine: So no one thinks Lindsey may rejoin the band in the future after a reconciliation?

Ken Caillat: Well, Lindsey had a heart attack, and they apparently damaged his vocal chords. I don’t know anything, but people I know who are very close to him don’t know whether he’s able to sing anymore. It’s too bad. Lindsey was a very angry man, and I believe he still is. Most of my comments about Lindsey are based on when I knew him.
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  #48  
Old 12-20-2019, 09:52 PM
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demanding and angry are two different things. I have no doubt LB is demanding; he's a perfectionist and I'm sure gets short-tempered when things go wrong. Demanding is situational. Angry is a permanent character trait. I don't think he is angry as a permanent trait. I am sure like everyone he can get angry, probably super angry, when the situation warrants it, like, I dunno, your band firing you and lying about it. Maybe that even played a role in his heart attack, WTF knows.

Listen we've heard from many people at the time that LB was not like super-fun party animal guy during the making of Tusk. He was on a mission to make a statement and not everyone was in the same headspace. Kudos to them for letting him take the ball and run with it.

But geez that was literally 40 effing years ago. Nearly HALF A CENTURY AGO. FFS no one is the same exact person they were 40 years ago. It's like Ken's memory is set in amber, frozen in time...... get.over.it.
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  #49  
Old 12-21-2019, 01:46 AM
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Originally Posted by bombaysaffires View Post
demanding and angry are two different things. I have no doubt LB is demanding; he's a perfectionist and I'm sure gets short-tempered when things go wrong. Demanding is situational. Angry is a permanent character trait. I don't think he is angry as a permanent trait. I am sure like everyone he can get angry, probably super angry, when the situation warrants it, like, I dunno, your band firing you and lying about it. Maybe that even played a role in his heart attack, WTF knows.

Listen we've heard from many people at the time that LB was not like super-fun party animal guy during the making of Tusk. He was on a mission to make a statement and not everyone was in the same headspace. Kudos to them for letting him take the ball and run with it.

But geez that was literally 40 effing years ago. Nearly HALF A CENTURY AGO. FFS no one is the same exact person they were 40 years ago. It's like Ken's memory is set in amber, frozen in time...... get.over.it.
Two things: Ken knew Lindsey and was actually there during the making of those records AND he’s still in contact with members of the band or people still involved with the band. He has an insight none of us have, meet ‘n greets and post-show drinks aside.
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  #50  
Old 12-21-2019, 09:06 AM
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Two things: Ken knew Lindsey and was actually there during the making of those records AND he’s still in contact with members of the band or people still involved with the band. He has an insight none of us have, meet ‘n greets and post-show drinks aside.
you bought it, apparently!

yes, Ken knew Lindsey in 1979. that was 40 years ago. by his own admission, he doesn't know Lindsey now. and yet, he has no qualms about extrapolating the character of somebody now from how they were 40+ years ago, in their 20s, high and out of their minds on drugs, fame, pressure, and intra-band relationship turmoils.

Ken seems to be the bitter and angry one towards the band and its members. and yes various band members may have been bitter, high, angry and driven back in the 70s when they were all in their late 20s or even 30s. that doesn't mean that band members are bitter and angry and whatever else Ken makes up because - by his own admission - he has no contact with them now and no clue how they are now.

actually, Ken replied to me on social media back in April 2018 when he was first spreading band's now debunked 'he didn't want to tour for a year" story that he heard that from someone who works for the band, who was told by Mick. by then, many fans already knew for 3 months what actually happened - and what was later proven as the truth that even the band had to half-cough-up to by the end of their last year's tour. so Ken was told band's PR story while there were a good number of fans that had inside info.

seems pretty certain that fans have way better insider sources than Ken has these days. or fans care to know what the truth is, while Ken is just trying to sell his book by attempting to answer questions thrown at him by trying to pretend that he's still in the know and in contact with the band.

after huge backlash on social media for spreading untruths, Ken has now a facebook post stating that's the trouble with interviews, questions come at you too fast - or something like that.
the thing is, Ken - however fast questions may come at you, making up answers about real people - and in fact making up the whole conversations that never happened - is not the right answer.
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  #51  
Old 12-21-2019, 09:18 AM
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half-back on topic of the thread.

reading the lawsuit from last year, it became clear that FM doesn't seem to exist as a legal entity between projects. they come together and sign contracts for specific projects - be that a tour, a gig, or in the past various albums and releases.

which means that at this moment, Fleetwood Mac as a band doesn't legally exist in any formation.

when talking about Fleetwood Mac, you can talk about Peter Green's band, various in-between incarnations, or the most well known Classic Fleetwood Mac - which is what masses are referring to when saying FM. but at present time, there is no present band. Lindsey is not really ex-FM member - or they all are.
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  #52  
Old 12-21-2019, 03:46 PM
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half-back on topic of the thread.

reading the lawsuit from last year, it became clear that FM doesn't seem to exist as a legal entity between projects. they come together and sign contracts for specific projects - be that a tour, a gig, or in the past various albums and releases.

which means that at this moment, Fleetwood Mac as a band doesn't legally exist in any formation.

when talking about Fleetwood Mac, you can talk about Peter Green's band, various in-between incarnations, or the most well known Classic Fleetwood Mac - which is what masses are referring to when saying FM. but at present time, there is no present band. Lindsey is not really ex-FM member - or they all are.
which makes it more interesting that they didn't call the BuckVie album FM....

Entangling Stevie's personal management as band management as well is a disastrous arrangement for the band. Great for Stevie though! And then for LB to sign on Azoff as his own personal manager
I can only imagine that the strategy behind that was that having him as your manager he has to consider the impact of band business on you as a solo act. But that's an awfully risky strategy considering Azoff's management style of focusing on the bigger $$$ or higher profile clients (i.e., Stevie). Or maybe he though Irving could make them more like the Eagles, i.e. the way LB always says "those other bands who know what they want and want it at the same time" and can come together to make money whether they like each other or not.

The only other logic I can imagine is that LB indeed wanted to boost his ticket sales, marketing, profile in a more mainstream way (seems out of character, but who knows). The two just seem like a bad mix to me either way.
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  #53  
Old 12-23-2019, 06:55 PM
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which makes it more interesting that they didn't call the BuckVie album FM....
As someone who was pissed off about that at the time, I get it now. They’re not going to ever play as Fleetwood Mac again without Stevie (so long as she and Mick are alive), with the possible exception of Peter Green miraculously returning. Even then, it would be called “Peter Green’s…” to avoid confusion.

I don’t think it’s right, but I at least understand the logic behind it.

Quote:
And then for LB to sign on Azoff as his own personal manager
It worked so well for Bob Welch, too.

Quote:
The only other logic I can imagine is that LB indeed wanted to boost his ticket sales, marketing, profile in a more mainstream way (seems out of character, but who knows). The two just seem like a bad mix to me either way.
And then to talk down two festival shows Azoff was heavily invested in and actively promoting...

Irving’s motivation to be the Stevie whisper went out the window, replaced by his instinct to put in well known, popular musicians in already popular bands…

Lindsey wanted Fleetwood Mac to be more like the Eagles. Wish granted!
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  #54  
Old 01-02-2020, 04:21 AM
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I NEVER buy into these breakups. I think Lindsey was aware of his heart condition and they all knew he could not do the tour. The 'estrangement' was staged for the press and social, to keep the cash flowing, and Lindsey will be back in the fold.
Just as he did Twister with her in 96 *when they were supposed to be at odds* and he played on IYD *after she was so 'miserable' after the no Christine tours*. It's all PR.
They'll do a farewell tour with the Rumours 5.
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  #55  
Old 01-02-2020, 09:24 PM
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I NEVER buy into these breakups. I think Lindsey was aware of his heart condition and they all knew he could not do the tour. The 'estrangement' was staged for the press and social, to keep the cash flowing, and Lindsey will be back in the fold.
Just as he did Twister with her in 96 *when they were supposed to be at odds* and he played on IYD *after she was so 'miserable' after the no Christine tours*. It's all PR.
They'll do a farewell tour with the Rumours 5.
I get why you are saying that - but I just can't agree. Not this time. Lindsey toured solo after he was fired for months. There's no way he knew of his heart condition and still did a tour. I get that a LB solo tour of small theaters isn't going to be as hectic as a full on Fleetwood Mac tour, but a solo tour also comes without all of the expenses (fancy planes and best hotels) that a Mac tour does.

He sued them. Not threatened. Actually sued. Papers were filed with the courts and a settlement was agreed to.

This isn't 1996. Or 1997. Or 1987. Hell, it's not even 2014. They are OLD. Their contemporaries are dropping like flies on a regular basis. Time is NOT on any of their sides. Planning some elaborate, hidden, stunt, that needs to have 3-4 years to fully play out....it just isn't in the cards at this point.

After how he was treated, I don't even want another Rumours tour. Not even a big final tour. It will be absolute garbage at this point. Fake hugs and warm glances? Give me a break. What else is there to prove? Nicks won't record anything new with the band, so what is there in another tour (other than the obviou$)? They reunited in 1997 and it was absolutely amazing. Then in 2014, out of the middle of nowhere, they unexpectedly reunited yet again and toured the world. It was unexpected, and it gave people like myself who were fans for decades but were 16 years old and not in attendance at The Dance tour a chance to see the five of them together. It was great...but the performances on stage certainly weren't Dance-era level. But at 33/34 years old, I got that chance and even kind of got a Tango in the Night focused concert with the four cuts. But now? For what? After what has gone on for the last two years, anything further with the five of them would just be downright gross.
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  #56  
Old 01-02-2020, 09:45 PM
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I get why you are saying that - but I just can't agree. Not this time. Lindsey toured solo after he was fired for months. There's no way he knew of his heart condition and still did a tour. I get that a LB solo tour of small theaters isn't going to be as hectic as a full on Fleetwood Mac tour, but a solo tour also comes without all of the expenses (fancy planes and best hotels) that a Mac tour does.

He sued them. Not threatened. Actually sued. Papers were filed with the courts and a settlement was agreed to.

This isn't 1996. Or 1997. Or 1987. Hell, it's not even 2014. They are OLD. Their contemporaries are dropping like flies on a regular basis. Time is NOT on any of their sides. Planning some elaborate, hidden, stunt, that needs to have 3-4 years to fully play out....it just isn't in the cards at this point.

After how he was treated, I don't even want another Rumours tour. Not even a big final tour. It will be absolute garbage at this point. Fake hugs and warm glances? Give me a break. What else is there to prove? Nicks won't record anything new with the band, so what is there in another tour (other than the obviou$)? They reunited in 1997 and it was absolutely amazing. Then in 2014, out of the middle of nowhere, they unexpectedly reunited yet again and toured the world. It was unexpected, and it gave people like myself who were fans for decades but were 16 years old and not in attendance at The Dance tour a chance to see the five of them together. It was great...but the performances on stage certainly weren't Dance-era level. But at 33/34 years old, I got that chance and even kind of got a Tango in the Night focused concert with the four cuts. But now? For what? After what has gone on for the last two years, anything further with the five of them would just be downright gross.
and an absolute insult to long-time fans. 'we think you're too stupid to realize we played you suckas"
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  #57  
Old 01-03-2020, 07:29 AM
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I still think we will never have an objective complete info about what happened with those 5. None is telling the complete truth, IMHO.

Smashing Interviews Magazine: And along came Neil Finn.
Ken Caillat: Right, and he was the solution.


Well, it was a practical solution for a tour. But in the end, for the band, that was not a solution at all.
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Old 01-03-2020, 02:28 PM
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After what has gone on for the last two years, anything further with the five of them would just be downright gross.
I wish they would do something that would draw me to attend, but I can’t imagine what that would have to be. Maybe if they starred in a stage production of “Uncle Vanya” at South Coast Rep. Yes, come to think of it, I would go to that.
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Old 01-03-2020, 02:34 PM
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Smashing Interviews Magazine: And along came Neil Finn.
Ken Caillat: Right, and he was the solution.


Well, it was a practical solution for a tour. But in the end, for the band, that was not a solution at all.
The most interesting thing artistically to come out of it was the online fighting here and on YouTube.

I guess the reconfigured tour served its humble (or not so humble) purpose. Nobody will look back on it in 20 years and say anything other than a straightforwardly descriptive “It happened.” It put “money in the bank but no gas in the tank.”
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  #60  
Old 01-13-2020, 12:18 PM
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I hope this version of "Fleetwood Mac" goes away forever and that we never hear from the band again, even if Lindsey were to return.
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