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  #1  
Old 12-25-2009, 10:40 PM
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Default Does Stevie Nicks dislike Billy Burnette?

One of the reasons Stevie gave for quitting FM in 1990 was, "Mick keeps trying to recreate FM in its heyday and it's simply not going to work." However she never publicly said anything bad about Billy and she hired Rick to perform as lead guitar player on the SA Tour. So really then, what was her real issue for quitting?
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  #2  
Old 12-26-2009, 02:38 AM
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One of the reasons Stevie gave for quitting FM in 1990 was, "Mick keeps trying to recreate FM in its heyday and it's simply not going to work." However she never publicly said anything bad about Billy and she hired Rick to perform as lead guitar player on the SA Tour. So really then, what was her real issue for quitting?
From everything I've heard, Stevie and Billy are still on good terms.

I don't think her comments represent anything personal. In fact, Billy made a similar comment specifically regarding Bekka Bramlett. The problem with the post-1987 bands is that the band DID try to recreate the Big Mac instead of letting the new people bring their true personalities into the music, like they did with Welch, Nicks, and Buckingham. Behind The Mask could've been a monster album, but the band caved in to label pressure to focus more squarely on the girls. Billy and especially Rick had better material that got ****canned. I think that rubbed Stevie the wrong way. Even the Tango tour set lists could've been a better showcase for the new guys as well as revisiting the classics.
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Old 12-26-2009, 03:15 AM
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I don't think her comments represent anything personal. In fact, Billy made a similar comment specifically regarding Bekka Bramlett. The problem with the post-1987 bands is that the band DID try to recreate the Big Mac instead of letting the new people bring their true personalities into the music, like they did with Welch, Nicks, and Buckingham. Behind The Mask could've been a monster album, but the band caved in to label pressure to focus more squarely on the girls. Billy and especially Rick had better material that got ****canned. I think that rubbed Stevie the wrong way. Even the Tango tour set lists could've been a better showcase for the new guys as well as revisiting the classics.
I definitely agree with everything you said. In addition, Stevie said publicly she should have quit when Lindsey did. 1988-1995 Fleetwood Mac was just a caricature of itself. That's not because the members had changed, but because the band was trying to pretend like it hadn't even happened.

While I'm partial to the Rumours lineup, I think given the chance, the band could have really made some cool music with Rick Vito. In my eyes, Billy Burnette was what made the whole thing cheesy. They didn't need another guitarist. I don't think Billy's style complemented the Mac's at that point either. His presence muddled what possibly could have been an interesting transition. I think Rick's solo song "Intuition" is a good example of how his distinct style could have been exploited within the Mac.
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Old 12-26-2009, 03:25 AM
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In my eyes, Billy Burnette was what made the whole thing cheesy.
It is a good thing that Christmas is over or you'd be off my Christmas card list

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Old 12-26-2009, 03:41 AM
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It is a good thing that Christmas is over or you'd be off my Christmas card list

Like Lindsey himself said... the fact Lindsey was replaced with not one, but TWO guitarists speaks volumes about the quality of the incoming stock. The fact 2 guitarists replaced one could have actually been used to the band's advantage... it could have shown how serious the band was about mixing up it's formula, thus signaling a new beginning in the band's history. But both Rick and Billy were relegated as sort of a background sideshow, while the band was trying to pretend a major personnel change had NOT just happened.

Again, my whole problem with the '88-'95 era was simply the way everything was done. Some really interesting, cool music could have been made. I don't know though... Billy Burnette's rockabilly style really just didn't have a place within the band, and that's the way I feel. I do however think a big opportunity was missed with Rick, but that's ancient history now.
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Old 12-26-2009, 07:17 AM
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Like Lindsey himself said... the fact Lindsey was replaced with not one, but TWO guitarists speaks volumes about the quality of the incoming stock. The fact 2 guitarists replaced one could have actually been used to the band's advantage... it could have shown how serious the band was about mixing up it's formula, thus signaling a new beginning in the band's history. But both Rick and Billy were relegated as sort of a background sideshow, while the band was trying to pretend a major personnel change had NOT just happened.

Again, my whole problem with the '88-'95 era was simply the way everything was done. Some really interesting, cool music could have been made. I don't know though... Billy Burnette's rockabilly style really just didn't have a place within the band, and that's the way I feel. I do however think a big opportunity was missed with Rick, but that's ancient history now.
It could be argued that Lindsey actually replaced two guitarists in Weston and Welch given that Weston had not been replaced previously. The band were looking to bring in another guitarist before Welch left, so when Lindsey left they were merely finally getting around to replacing Weston/Welch.

Rick could have held his own quite nicely as a replacement for Mr Buckingham, and while Billy wasn't in the same league as a guitarist, he certainly brought a fresh new sound and feel to the Mac, something that Rick on his own probably wouldn't have achieved.

I guess it could be argued that Buckingham's style really didn't have a place in the band in 1975 either, but that didn't seem to work out too badly for them.

I think that Rick, Billy and later Bekka Bramlett were under-utilised in the band, were not given the freedom to create their own sound. Nicks and Buckingham had it easy in 1975, they weren't expected to write hits, but Rick, Billy and Bekka had a lot of pressure simply because of the history of the band.

Sure, they should have been allowed to do their own thing, create their own music, and be true to themselves. That they didn't really get that opportunity wasn't really their fault.

Honestly though, give me Rick and Billy over Lindsey any day...
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Old 12-26-2009, 01:09 PM
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In my eyes, Billy Burnette was what made the whole thing cheesy. They didn't need another guitarist. I don't think Billy's style complemented the Mac's at that point either.
I definitely completely disagree with you on this. I think In The Back Of My Mind, Talkin' To My Heart, and Do You Know rank as highpoints in Fleetwood Mac's history. I even love When The Sun Goes Down. And, while not a Fleetwood Mac song, his song It Ain't Over, which featured Mick and Christine, should've been a concert staple. I wish they would've let him do a few "Psychobilly" songs. Again, it was a matter of what was chosen. He had other great songs. But, they focused more on the "accessible" songss.
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Old 12-26-2009, 01:58 PM
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Like Lindsey himself said... the fact Lindsey was replaced with not one, but TWO guitarists speaks volumes about the quality of the incoming stock.
Preposterous. Billy was nothing more than a rhythm guitarist -- the instrumental equivalent of Ray Lindsey.

Rick was the lead on guitar. So instead of getting Lindsey & Ray on "Second Hand News," "Gypsy," & "Go Your Own Way," we got Rick & Billy on most of the set. In terms of guitar numbers, it was the same setup*.

The thing the band lacked during those years (before Richard Dashut came aboard again in 1995) was a studio engineer who knew what the hell he was doing. With Buckingham, Dashut, & Caillat gone, the band suffered as a studio band of former crispness & vitality. As evidence, their concerts continued to sell; it was only their albums that nobody (except the British) was interested in.


*I didn't bring up the presence of workstation hardware because that's a whole nuther subject, & a very unfortunate one.
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Old 12-26-2009, 02:37 PM
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On the Tango in the Night Tour I think it was a smart idea to feature the music of Christine and Stevie, which they did. Lindsey pulled out of the Tour and the band at the last minute so it was also a smart idea to have the new members play some of the old FM classics. When Stevie and Lindsey first joined FM, they too performed many of FM's classics.
I never cared for Billy's guitar playing. His song In The Back Of My Mind is one of the best FM songs ever, IMO. But that was the ONLY contribution of his that held any worth with me.
Rick Vito should have been the only guitarist hired. It was one thing back in 1987 to except the fact that Lindsey was permanently gone and another thing to try and accept two new replacements. Sorry to say this but Billy was not good looking enough for FM. Rick was.
I enjoyed the Behind The Mask album. It simply wasn't promoted properly. Like I mentioned in another thread I always felt Love Is Dangerous would have made a great lead off single. FM fans have always wished the band would release the most rockin' songs from their records but they or the record companies keep wanting to present them as MOR . They have enough slow songs, so I say keep the radio songs fast and loud.
Time was doomed though because without Stevie Nicks no one(myself included) really gives a damn about FM anymore. I did go see them on the 1995 Tour and Bekka sounded good singing GDW in concert but overall Mick was trying too hard to recreate Stevies' prescence and it really just wasn't gonna work.

Last edited by vivfox; 12-26-2009 at 02:39 PM..
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Old 12-26-2009, 02:47 PM
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Time was doomed though because without Stevie Nicks no one(myself included) really gives a damn about FM anymore.
Speak for yourself.

The same thing was said when Peter Green left the band. And y'all would've never gotten your twirling ditz queen, had the public taken the view you're putting forward.

While I don't care for Dave Mason, the Time band SHOULD HAVE completely revamped FM, from the ground up. Really pushed Billy and Bekka's songs, reinvented itself, as they had, so many times before.
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Old 12-26-2009, 03:02 PM
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Preposterous. Billy was nothing more than a rhythm guitarist -- the instrumental equivalent of Ray Lindsey.
And Billy could have gone on the road with them anyway, even if Lindsey had stayed. Lindsey knew that 2 guitarists didn't replace him when he said it. He just likes to be mischievous.

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Old 12-26-2009, 03:18 PM
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Time was doomed though because without Stevie Nicks no one(myself included) really gives a damn about FM anymore.
As with your meet and greet comment in Rumours, I suspect you must only have phrased this in such broad, absolute terms to provoke dissent.

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Old 12-26-2009, 03:58 PM
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And Billy could have gone on the road with them anyway, even if Lindsey had stayed. Lindsey knew that 2 guitarists didn't replace him when he said it. He just likes to be mischievous.
THAT REMINDS ME...Billy Burnette WAS going to be on the tour even if Lindsey had stayed. During the interviews at the time, Mick stated that Lindsey wanted another guitarist. Which was especially easy for me to believe a few years later, when I saw him with four other guitarists, three percussionists, a keyboardist, and a bassist backing him up. (Sadly, that's not an exaggeration.) Lindsey can make that snotty comment all he wants. Fleetwood Mac went on with six musicians in 1995 and ten musicians in 1997. and in 2003. Using his logic, the band was better in 1995.
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Old 12-26-2009, 04:33 PM
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THAT REMINDS ME...Billy Burnette WAS going to be on the tour even if Lindsey had stayed. During the interviews at the time, Mick stated that Lindsey wanted another guitarist. Which was especially easy for me to believe a few years later, when I saw him with four other guitarists, three percussionists, a keyboardist, and a bassist backing him up. (Sadly, that's not an exaggeration.) Lindsey can make that snotty comment all he wants. Fleetwood Mac went on with six musicians in 1995 and ten musicians in 1997. and in 2003. Using his logic, the band was better in 1995.
Exactly. The addition of Rick was more of a late occurance. It's possible that if not for Billy being considered to join Fleetwood Mac that Rick may not have been added. I've always felt that the addition of two new members to the band instead of just one was a great decision. Billy's a fantastic guitarist, but having someone like Rick Vito who provides a completely different element was very important and it would have worked out too. In terms of Billy's style fitting into the band, I think he fit in just fine. If you go through his solo catalogue, Billy has performed a wide variety of music from rockabilly to country to pop, so fitting his unique style within the "confines" of Fleetwood Mac didn't seem to be a problem whatsoever. What might have been just as important as their abilities as arists and musicians is that Rick and Billy lack egos. Of all the members of Fleetwood Mac, they're the two that have the least ego of anyone in the band.

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Old 12-26-2009, 04:35 PM
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Speak for yourself.

The same thing was said when Peter Green left the band. And y'all would've never gotten your twirling ditz queen, had the public taken the view you're putting forward.

While I don't care for Dave Mason, the Time band SHOULD HAVE completely revamped FM, from the ground up. Really pushed Billy and Bekka's songs, reinvented itself, as they had, so many times before.
Why do fans of Green's always relegate to taking cheap shots at Stevie Nicks when others voice their opinions of the band without her? Nicks fans don't hit below the belt calling Green a washed up, ape****-crazy, cheesy-haired flash in the pan . His music may not be our personal taste... but we don't degrade the man personally. Nobody was even talking about Peter Green for God's sake... we're in the POST Rumours forum discussing Billy freaking Burnette! We get it... there are a small contingency of guys here who think Stevie was the WORST thing to ever happen to the band. But concert ticket sales will tell you otherwise... they are up sharply when she's with the band, and completely fall off a cliff when she's not. The same could probably have been said about the Green era. He was the original Fleetwood Mac's star. There were a huge chunk of fans who didn't give a **** about the band when he left too. That's the reality of the fickle record and concert ticket buying public... they've gotta have a star to latch on to.

The (unpleasant to some) reality is, by '95 the image of FM was cemented... and it's face was Stevie Nicks. Any deviation from that wouldn't be accepted by the general public. The same could be said of '70 Fleetwood Mac with Peter Green. I honestly have no idea how 5 years later the band was able to rise to fame again and totally reinvent itself. You would have thought the band's legacy would have been cemented at that point as well. Perhaps it was because the success of the Peter Green era was so short lived... and the subsequent bands were pretty obscure and anonymous (before I am jumped on for this, I ADORE Bob Welch, and think he was one of the best things to ever happen to our band). Come '95 though, I think the band was out of reinventions. The Rumours era fame was huge... eclipsing any other lineups before or after it. The general public just wouldn't swallow any other form of the band after that. That may be good, that may be bad, but that's the way it is!
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