Going Their Own Way (Sunday Times, 24th May)

[MikeInNV]

Originally Posted by secondhandchain

Ya could have said NO to those extra shows. Stop your whining.

If she really wanted to make a power move and/or hold the band hostage as people here are fond of saying (I can't tell you how much I hate those words), that would have been the thing to do. If they had skipped the second leg of US shows, they could have finished Europe and Australia by now. As it is, FM spent 2013 on the road without Christine. On With The Show will end up being nearly a year and a half long. After finishing this album, who knows what kind of tour they would want to launch to support it. This is adding up to be several years of work, most of it on the road. I'm pretty much a die-hard, but even I think that's too much Fleetwood Mac!

[PenguinHead]

Originally Posted by HomerMcvie

Who the hell is she to hold them hostage(which she's trying to do!)?

To hell with her. They should go in without her. Either she shows up, or she doesn't. I'd prefer the latter.

Stevie sounds like a spoiled child - poor little rich girl! But I can't fault her for being a little peeved that this long tour has gone on longer than expected, due to demand, as well as greed. I worried the demands of this epic world tour were going to burn them out, and they apparently have.

Her comments are raw and candid. She seems really pissed off. Mick's comments about wishing that Lindsey and Stevie could get along, similar to Christine and John. I wish that too! Unfortunately, the two uppity Americans in the group can't get beyond their past and their egos. Though Lindsey can be exacting in manner, he seems much more amiable than Stevie. I understand her frustrations, but why does she always portay the band as her nemesis?

She mentions how tiresome it is to relive the past over and over. Yet she is entirely guilty of incessantly pandering to it. She spends more time in the past than the present or the future. That choice is hers. She is the only one in the band that doesn't play an instrument, thus she is absolved of the demands the rest of the band face when recording an album. To honor the band (as well as the fans), the least she could do is give them three or four songs to work on, spend a few days in the studio cutting the solos and backgrounds, and be on her way.

This is near the end of the road for Fleetwood Mac. Stevie, show some respect and consideration for the band and the fans. A little sympathy? You need a little sympathy. I hate the prospect that she might end her rein in Fleetwood Mac on such caustic terms. I'd rather have her on the album than not. But if not, I hope that won't stop Lindsey and Christine from finishing and releasing a Stevie Free album. Surely it will be a super fine Buckingham McVie album.

[Andy Man]

I think the underlying issue that really comes through with the article is that Fleetwood Mac is in a position that very, very few bands have ever been in. Let me explain...

There is no question that, on the surface, Fleetwood Mac has been a "nostalgia" act for the last 6-7 years or so (the 2009 tour through to now). However, unlike The Stones, or other "classic" bands that continue to blast out the hits to essentially the same crowd, Fleetwood Mac has actually been gaining popularity and respect all through the last decade. I think that this is something quite unique considering the last time a studio record with all 5 was released was in 1987. Yet, despite the time frame, a massive new audience of indie rock artists and fans have been driven to the band because of their body of work (which, compared to most "big bands" is relatively small). So while the set lists have pretty much been the same (except, of course, now with Christine's material back in the fold) the demand for tickets has skyrocketed due to a huge influx in fans; I can't think of another band in FM's rock category that has gained the amount of relevance with such a distance between their most creative time period.

Because of this sudden resurgence of interest in the band, the question is how to best deal with a new round of fame? It seems as if the bands management (and members) are in a "go-go-go" frame of mind; run this new interest in the band to the ground, doing all that can be done to maintain it. Lindsey and Christine seem to have been given artistic inspiration from the band's current status and I truly do believe each of them when they state that they are making great music and are excited about releasing it. And while I'm sure Mick has a vested interest in new music, I think his approach to the band's current status has been to "sell-sell-sell" out arenas worldwide. In retrospect, I think the extension of this tour (while it did allow me to see them!) will be viewed as a mistake (it has taken a toll on their energy for sure).

Stevie seems uncertain about what to make of this new relevancy. She's a very smart individual who knows the music business in a way that none of us on this board will ever know. I'm sure she realizes that if she gives into the band with everything they are wanting of her, the FM train could go on and on and on. As a fan, I want her to be a part of whatever the band is doing. However, I can see her point about needing to get away; If you're tired, you're tired. Knowing that there is a massive audience available to the band now has probably created much debate within the band: how to deal with this 'event'? For Stevie, it seems she wants to acknowledge all the new interest in FM but at the same time to be able to keep her sanity. Whatever you think of the band, one thing is certain: the chaos and turmoil they have always spoken of is real. This is a band of individuals who even until now, when most bands would be basking in the success FM has been having recently, seem to have fundamental differences on how they view life and their creative output.

[PenguinHead]

Originally Posted by MikeInNV

After finishing this album, who knows what kind of tour they would want to launch to support it. This is adding up to be several years of work, most of it on the road. I'm pretty much a die-hard, but even I think that's too much Fleetwood Mac!

It may sound crazy, but I don't want to see them embark on another tour, especially if Stevie isn't on board. They don't need the money, and the physical demands become more demanding at their age. The tours are just cash grabbers.

I hope they schedule just a few key shows, featuring a good portion of their new songs, and broadcast a filmed show much like The Dance. Find other promotional tactics, like a webcast, and other creative ways to market the album and connect with their fans. Their tours sell nostalgia, not new music. Tours have a shelf life. Albums live forever. At this point it shouldn't be about selling out shows or chart success, it's about putting the exclamation mark on their creativity and musical legacy.

[PenguinHead]

Originally Posted by Andy Man

I think the underlying issue that really comes through with the article is that Fleetwood Mac is in a position that very, very few bands have ever been in. Let me explain...
Stevie seems uncertain about what to make of this new relevancy.

Fantastic post Andy Man!
A great read, full of deep insight and thoughtful perspective.
The Andy Man can! (in my head I'm hearing the song The Candy Man).

[sue]

24 Karat Gold was recorded in 3 weeks, she doesn't have to spend months in the studio.....providing she has some new material. (if not rob the vault)
However, she has a valid point, she sounds exhausted and deserves a long break...
Go to Malibu, have fun furnishing your house.
Don't see or even speak to any of FM, then in 6 months time come back and do your 3 weeks in the studio...
I agree with other contributors, she sounds totally pissed off with the whole FM thing ....the girl needs a break.

[aleuzzi]

None of their positions surprise me. What surprises me is how openly they admitted their frustrations. Christine sounds largely positive but she HAS had 16 years of rest and regret to make her come running back with open arms. Mick, Lindsey, and Stevie sound fed up with one another.

Yes, the tour should have been much shorter (around 40 American dates, period.) Then they should have continued work on the album.

I'm sure that Stevie will eventually hand in a few songs and dutifully perform but I'm sensing all of this seems so remote to her because right now she doesn't have a single song in her. She's worn out. She has not recorded new material for the band since 2003. David Stewart coaxed the old self out but that is a different Stevie. The Mac Stevie might never come back. There's a good chance the songs she contributes to the new album will sound like parodies of the woman who wrote Landslide.

[SpyNote]

Before pointing fingers, should any of this be surprising? The only album session where they didn't fight was during the making of the White Album (as far as we know). Extroverts and introverts often work well together. But Stevie (extrovert) and Lindsey (introvert) just irritate each other to no end. It's admirable that they are still recording together, but, really, they should not be together in a band.

[KenshiMaster16]

I mean, is there even a reason to call this "pointing fingers" anymore? We all know who wants an album and who doesn't. They know and they pretty much all just admitted it, even Stevie herself. Sure, they can change their minds, they have a million times before in the past. But at this present time, this is what we're faced with as a fan base and it's clear where the blame lies.

At this rate I'd wager Stevie was simply talking out of her ass about wanting Christine back in the band at this point, given I think she was just about ready to call it a day and now suddenly she can't without looking like the wicked witch of the west who put an abrupt end to the Holy Five-Piece reunion. She just simply never, ever thought it would happen where Christine would change her mind. Now things are different. The band is fully whole again and she's now faced with more demand for the Mac than ever, something that can't sit well with her so the band was faced with; A) Pocket off the sudden demand for the Rumours era of the Mac or B) Take an extended hiatus from tour exhaustion and watch the demand slowly fade away. With the momentum they received upon Christine's return, they would've been extremely foolish to not make their move then and there with how fickle the industry is in times like these.

Sure, there has always been this kind of diva/childish/holier-than-thou behavior from at least somebody in the band but given the circumstances; Christine's return, their ages, John's cancer, you'd think they'd have (excuse my language) grown the **** up and just get on with it before someone drops dead from natural or unnatural causes. Let's face it; nobody wants to see a fragile Mick, Lindsey or wheelchair bound Stevie barely keeping rhythm and holding notes anymore for 2 and a half hours. They need to keep trucking until the sun sets because let's face it, it's setting pretty fast at this rate and they're simply running out of time. They are not youngsters anymore who can spend a decade toying about with solo projects while treating each other like pieces of crap and bickering back and forth about the future of the band. They need to work out the finality of this band before it's too late. However, if they want to go out looking like idiots who can't get along for more than 2 months to finish a studio album and would rather 'play pretend' on stage for the rest of their lives, that's on them. They should at least have the dignity of going out like a class act instead of a bunch of emotionally fragile individuals.

Rant over. Just sick of this drama. What was once entertaining has grown very tiresome and annoying.

[BlueLight]

The article actually gives me a twinge of nostalgia, as it very easily could have been written in 1982 or 1987. Each band member is playing the same role they've been playing for over 30 years. They're nothing if not consistent.

All that said, they sound exhausted. The extended tour may be profitable, but it also apparently comes at a high cost, on many fronts.

[nicepace]

At this point, I think the band should sit down with Stevie and just say to her in the nicest way possible [snip] "We want to make it easy for you, so all four of us have made the decision to move ahead with a new album once this tour is done. We're excited about the material and don't want it to go to waste sitting in some vault somewhere. We don't want you to participate, and we're not asking you to contribute. We're also freeing you up from any touring obligations that may follow. "

This is an even better approach than my suggestion. My suggestion was basically an effort to bluff Stevie into making the album. Sometimes I try too hard to placate the strong pro-Stevie element on this board. Give her a graceful exit from this next project, while leaving the door open to more FM projects for her in the future.

The Four have a bunch of songs partially done. It really doesn't need to take a long time for them to finish them up. I want to hear those songs, and I am not in the slightest bit interested in hearing songs from Stevie when she's in a bad mood and feeling like she's being forced to do something she doesn't want to do.

[vivfox]

Originally Posted by michelej1

I want an album with all five of them, but knowing that Stevie is against it makes me think nothing good will come of it. We may get a couple of good songs from her, but if she was there under duress, all we will get is a lot of bad vibes and complaints about the process of making those songs.

This would be a good time to remake I Don't Want to Know. Then we'd be able to hear it in concert.

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by Macfan4life

Stevie touring with 24 Carat Gold would get her probably 1/25 of the revenue she is getting for On With The Show.
In defense of her though, the Mac toured like dogs in 2013 thinking it would be their last tour for awhile. Then out of the blue they tour 2014 and 2015 like its Rumours all over again. Being tired after a long tour in 2013 to tour the insane On With The Show tour will have its breaking point. They have toured the world for 2 years in a row. There is going to be wear and tear for sure.
But I am sure she will come around and want to be part of the Mac's last album. If not, more songs for Christine is not a bad thing

I think of it this way: The five of them have not toured extensively like this together since Tusk! Think about that for a minute.

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by sleepless child

I too am sad after reading this article. What the hell is wrong with Stevie and Lindsey? She says they are great friends and hashed all the past out. They act all lovey dovey on stage and then Chris says it's all an act? And Lindsey tell Dan Rather in The Big Interview that there are still issues with them? What is the problem? You guys are too old for this. If you don't get along, don't be in each others lives! If you want to still be in Fleetwood Mac, then you are in Fleetwood Mac and you commit to the record. I love Stevie, but it frustrates me when she is quoted saying those things.

This is the nature of their relationship. It always has been and always will be. Now imagine having to go to work with that person from your past that you loved so much, had a horrible break up with. Not to mention the livelihood of others depended on that work. You'd leave the band, have a breakdown, do too many drugs, drink too much, etc. It makes perfect sense to me at nearly 67 Stevie is over it.

[gldstwmn]

Originally Posted by Andy Man

However, unlike The Stones, or other "classic" bands that continue to blast out the hits to essentially the same crowd, Fleetwood Mac has actually been gaining popularity and respect all through the last decade.

The Stones have a much larger catalogue. They tweak the arrangements and are known for their massive stage set up. They also will go out and play small venues. And like Fleetwood Mac, they still sound good. So that is the draw with the Stones.